Flying Spaghetti Monster
Footballguy
Has this board not changed any?
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Creation vs. Evolution (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter larry_boy_44
- Start date
proninja
Footballguy
People haven't had much time to evolve since the beginning of this thread
fatness
Footballguy
cstu
Footballguy
New poll on evolution:
35% believe in evolution through natural processes
24% believe in creator guided evolution
31% deny evolution entirely (compared to 2% of scientists)
35% believe in evolution through natural processes
24% believe in creator guided evolution
31% deny evolution entirely (compared to 2% of scientists)
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
msommer
Footballguy
CowboysFromHell
Footballguy
And these people vote. 
DaVinci
FairTaxguy
trogg78
Footballguy
Supported by actual evidence.It's just a theory.The science isn't settled yet.
matuski
Footballguy
Still just a theory.Supported by actual evidence.It's just a theory.The science isn't settled yet.
joffer
Footballguy
Better than I would have guessed.
CowboysFromHell
Footballguy
Researchers may have solved origin-of-life conundrum
http://news.sciencemag.org/biology/2015/03/researchers-may-have-solved-origin-life-conundrum?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=facebook
http://news.sciencemag.org/biology/2015/03/researchers-may-have-solved-origin-life-conundrum?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=facebook
FUBAR
Footballguy
joffer
Footballguy
more likely the Discovery Institute
msommer
Footballguy
http://news.sciencemag.org/biology/2015/03/researchers-may-have-solved-origin-life-conundrum
If so creationism just got a bloody nose...
If so creationism just got a bloody nose...
Frostillicus
Footballguy
Have there ever been any human fossils found Cretaceous rock?
Yes and No.
Cretaceous rock is the layer of rock that many geologists say dinosaurs are found in. But they don't have any accurate way of telling how old a layer of rock is (see my page on Carbon dating). They say it is Cretaceous rock only because dinosaurs are in it.
So if a layer of rock has dinosaurs in it then they say it is 165 million years old.
If humans are in it they say it is about 1 million years old.
The circular reasoning doesn't even cross their minds.
So if humans lived at the same time as dinosaurs, but lived in different places, they would be fossilized in different places as well.
Evolutionists believe that Dinosaurs died millions of years ago. But there is a great amount of evidence that dinosaurs lived only a few thousand years ago.
One of these pieces of evidence is a blood report from a t-rex with intact hemoglobin. Hemoglobin breaks down rapidly and could not last millions of years.
I have had a few people email me trying to disprove this, but a more recent (2005) find shows not only dinosaur blood, but soft, fibrous tissue, and complete blood vessels!
There have also been a few dinosaur like creatures, and numerous other animals thought to be extinct) caught in recent years (please see my page on "living fossils").
These amazing finds have caused the Scientific community to seriously rethink what they believed about the dinosaurs.
If they had read their Bibles, they would have known all along that God created man at the same time as the dinosaurs.
Yes and No.
Cretaceous rock is the layer of rock that many geologists say dinosaurs are found in. But they don't have any accurate way of telling how old a layer of rock is (see my page on Carbon dating). They say it is Cretaceous rock only because dinosaurs are in it.
So if a layer of rock has dinosaurs in it then they say it is 165 million years old.
If humans are in it they say it is about 1 million years old.
The circular reasoning doesn't even cross their minds.
So if humans lived at the same time as dinosaurs, but lived in different places, they would be fossilized in different places as well.
Evolutionists believe that Dinosaurs died millions of years ago. But there is a great amount of evidence that dinosaurs lived only a few thousand years ago.
One of these pieces of evidence is a blood report from a t-rex with intact hemoglobin. Hemoglobin breaks down rapidly and could not last millions of years.
I have had a few people email me trying to disprove this, but a more recent (2005) find shows not only dinosaur blood, but soft, fibrous tissue, and complete blood vessels!
There have also been a few dinosaur like creatures, and numerous other animals thought to be extinct) caught in recent years (please see my page on "living fossils").
These amazing finds have caused the Scientific community to seriously rethink what they believed about the dinosaurs.
If they had read their Bibles, they would have known all along that God created man at the same time as the dinosaurs.
Buck Bradcanon
Footballguy
Beautiful.Have there ever been any human fossils found Cretaceous rock?
Yes and No.
Cretaceous rock is the layer of rock that many geologists say dinosaurs are found in. But they don't have any accurate way of telling how old a layer of rock is (see my page on Carbon dating). They say it is Cretaceous rock only because dinosaurs are in it.
So if a layer of rock has dinosaurs in it then they say it is 165 million years old.
If humans are in it they say it is about 1 million years old.
The circular reasoning doesn't even cross their minds.
So if humans lived at the same time as dinosaurs, but lived in different places, they would be fossilized in different places as well.
Evolutionists believe that Dinosaurs died millions of years ago. But there is a great amount of evidence that dinosaurs lived only a few thousand years ago.
One of these pieces of evidence is a blood report from a t-rex with intact hemoglobin. Hemoglobin breaks down rapidly and could not last millions of years.
I have had a few people email me trying to disprove this, but a more recent (2005) find shows not only dinosaur blood, but soft, fibrous tissue, and complete blood vessels!
There have also been a few dinosaur like creatures, and numerous other animals thought to be extinct) caught in recent years (please see my page on "living fossils").
These amazing finds have caused the Scientific community to seriously rethink what they believed about the dinosaurs.
If they had read their Bibles, they would have known all along that God created man at the same time as the dinosaurs.
Eta: Where's that from? answersingenesis link? Getting server error on that one.
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Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
Take that, Creationism!msommer said:
CowboysFromHell
Footballguy
Thing is, they've taken shot after shot after shot, right to the jaw, but they won't go down. The manager really needs to throw in the towel!
joffer
Footballguy
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/next/evolution/origins-of-complex-life-uncovered-in-the-ocean-deep/
Origins of Complex Life Uncovered in the Ocean Deep
Scientists have just discovered a missing link between two branches on the evolutionary tree of life hiding deep under the sea, one that we’ve been looking for since 1977.
Ever since microbiologist Carl Woese, the greatest scientist you’ve never heard of, added a third branch, archaea, to the existing two of prokaryotes (bacteria) and eukaryotes (which have more complex cells like our own), scientists have searched for the evolutionary connection between archaea and eukaryotes. While the reigning theory is that eukaryotes evolved from the simpler archaea, the ancestral parent of eukaryotes has remained elusive.
Scientists discovered the closest evolutionary relative to eukaryotic cells near a hydrothermal vent.
But just this week, a group of scientists announced that they found that connection buried under the Arctic Ocean near a hydrothermal vent called Loki’s Castle. They named it Lokiarchaeum, and published their findings in the journal Nature.
Here’s Carl Zimmer, reporting for the New York Times:
Analyzing the DNA, the researchers found that Lokiarchaeum is far more closely related to eukaryotes than any other known species of archaea. But even more surprising was that it had genes for many traits only found before in eukaryotes.
Among these genes were many that build special compartments inside eukaryote cells. Inside these compartments, called lysosomes, eukaryote cells can destroy defective proteins.
All eukaryotes also share a cellular skeleton that they constantly build and tear down to change their shape. Dr. Ettema and his colleagues found many genes in Lokiarchaeum that encode the proteins required to build the skeleton.
The scientists are now trying to grow these cells in the lab to understand more about them, but it’s difficult to replicate the conditions of deep ocean hydrothermal vents. In the meantime they’re looking for more archaea that might be even closer relatives of our eukaryotic ancestors, and in turn telling us more about our own origins.
Origins of Complex Life Uncovered in the Ocean Deep
Scientists have just discovered a missing link between two branches on the evolutionary tree of life hiding deep under the sea, one that we’ve been looking for since 1977.
Ever since microbiologist Carl Woese, the greatest scientist you’ve never heard of, added a third branch, archaea, to the existing two of prokaryotes (bacteria) and eukaryotes (which have more complex cells like our own), scientists have searched for the evolutionary connection between archaea and eukaryotes. While the reigning theory is that eukaryotes evolved from the simpler archaea, the ancestral parent of eukaryotes has remained elusive.
Scientists discovered the closest evolutionary relative to eukaryotic cells near a hydrothermal vent.
But just this week, a group of scientists announced that they found that connection buried under the Arctic Ocean near a hydrothermal vent called Loki’s Castle. They named it Lokiarchaeum, and published their findings in the journal Nature.
Here’s Carl Zimmer, reporting for the New York Times:
Analyzing the DNA, the researchers found that Lokiarchaeum is far more closely related to eukaryotes than any other known species of archaea. But even more surprising was that it had genes for many traits only found before in eukaryotes.
Among these genes were many that build special compartments inside eukaryote cells. Inside these compartments, called lysosomes, eukaryote cells can destroy defective proteins.
All eukaryotes also share a cellular skeleton that they constantly build and tear down to change their shape. Dr. Ettema and his colleagues found many genes in Lokiarchaeum that encode the proteins required to build the skeleton.
The scientists are now trying to grow these cells in the lab to understand more about them, but it’s difficult to replicate the conditions of deep ocean hydrothermal vents. In the meantime they’re looking for more archaea that might be even closer relatives of our eukaryotic ancestors, and in turn telling us more about our own origins.
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
The Lord works in mysterious ways.
Scoresman
Footballguy
The creationists are like Pacqiao, trying in vain to attack the rock solid defense of Evolution (Mayweather). Ultimately they lose by unanimous decision and everybody feels incredibly dumb to have participated.
matuski
Footballguy
Jayrok
Footballguy
msommer
Footballguy
To complete the analogy, let's sue Creationists for coming to the fight with an unreported injury
Jack White
Footballguy
I'm not religious, but . . . what if God created evolution?
Cliff Clavin
Footballguy
Henry Ford
Footballguy
I don't know why I read this thread.
proninja
Footballguy
Mister CIA
Footballguy
ScottNorwood
Footballcutie
Until we're able to build hybrid animals like a Monkey-Gator I'm uninterested.
CowboysFromHell
Footballguy
Jayrod
Footballguy
Yeah, I read the articles and still nothing even close to definitive on the origin of life from non-life. Hardly a death blow to those who believe in creation.
There is a theory of how maybe what is generally considered the items needed for self replicating life to be possible (with no idea as to how) could have formed in a similar environment, but couldn't have happened at the same time in the same place and would have had to be washed together into a common pool where some unknown process happens and life starts and somehow continues to replicate and maintain optimal conditions to continue and not die and have enough time to evolve.
Oh, and we still haven't found a shred of evidence of actual extra-terrestrial life. Just evidence of water and what is considered possibly favorable conditions for life to exist.
There is a theory of how maybe what is generally considered the items needed for self replicating life to be possible (with no idea as to how) could have formed in a similar environment, but couldn't have happened at the same time in the same place and would have had to be washed together into a common pool where some unknown process happens and life starts and somehow continues to replicate and maintain optimal conditions to continue and not die and have enough time to evolve.
Oh, and we still haven't found a shred of evidence of actual extra-terrestrial life. Just evidence of water and what is considered possibly favorable conditions for life to exist.
Lutherman2112
Footballguy
Jayrod
Footballguy
Jayrod
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
Do you feel insulted by those jokes, Jayrod?
Mario Kart
Footballguy
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pale_Blue_DotFrom this distant vantage point, the Earth might not seem of any particular interest. But for us, it's different. Consider again that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
The Earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot. Think of the endless cruelties visited by the inhabitants of one corner of this pixel on the scarcely distinguishable inhabitants of some other corner. How frequent their misunderstandings, how eager they are to kill one another, how fervent their hatreds. Our posturings, our imagined self-importance, the delusion that we have some privileged position in the universe, are challenged by this point of pale light. Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity in all this vastness there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves.
The Earth is the only world known, so far, to harbor life. There is nowhere else, at least in the near future, to which our species could migrate. Visit, yes. Settle, not yet. Like it or not, for the moment, the Earth is where we make our stand. It has been said that astronomy is a humbling and character-building experience. There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world. To me, it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've ever known.
Carl Sagan, Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space, 1997 reprint, pp. xvxvi
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Jayrod
Footballguy
In and of themselves? Not really. As a long trend of continuous snide/snarky comments about religious people being stupid and believing in fairy tales? Yes.
Jayrod
Footballguy
I vehemently disagree with the bolded. That supposition at the crux of the argument is a mere personal opinion upon which a man falls one direction or the other. Mr. Sagan believes no God exists while I believe He does. I believe the evidence is not in the stars or in subatomic particles, but in the spiritual world of which Sagan probably doesn't even consider. God chooses the foolish things to shame the wise lest no man should boast. I do not know everything, but I believe this; that life came from God and He exists and that my life is complete in Him. Nothing in science has ever refuted that and nothing in that is at odds with scientific fact.
From this distant vantage point, the Earth might not seem of any particular interest. But for us, it's different. Consider again that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
The Earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot. Think of the endless cruelties visited by the inhabitants of one corner of this pixel on the scarcely distinguishable inhabitants of some other corner. How frequent their misunderstandings, how eager they are to kill one another, how fervent their hatreds. Our posturings, our imagined self-importance, the delusion that we have some privileged position in the universe, are challenged by this point of pale light. Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity in all this vastness there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves.
The Earth is the only world known, so far, to harbor life. There is nowhere else, at least in the near future, to which our species could migrate. Visit, yes. Settle, not yet. Like it or not, for the moment, the Earth is where we make our stand. It has been said that astronomy is a humbling and character-building experience. There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world. To me, it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've ever known.
Carl Sagan, Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space, 1997 reprint, pp. xvxvi
So laugh all you want, but I guaranty you no one in this thread has put more effort into this topic than I have. I have wrestled with the questions posed and had to come to conclusions I could be intellectually honest with. I haven't blindly held to my faith despite facts like many seem to think. I have dug deep into it and questioned everything.
So maybe I'm a bit touchy on the subject, and I shouldn't post in serious topics so late, but to me this goes beyond a scientific discussion to the core of who I am. I believe in God because the sum of my knowledge and personal experiences points to that, not because I'm too scared or weak or stupid to not believe.
Lutherman2112
Footballguy
For now, try to focus on spiritual growth, especially yours. You have undertaken a challenge to your beliefs, reflected, proposed your thoughts.I vehemently disagree with the bolded. That supposition at the crux of the argument is a mere personal opinion upon which a man falls one direction or the other. Mr. Sagan believes no God exists while I believe He does. I believe the evidence is not in the stars or in subatomic particles, but in the spiritual world of which Sagan probably doesn't even consider.God chooses the foolish things to shame the wise lest no man should boast. I do not know everything, but I believe this; that life came from God and He exists and that my life is complete in Him. Nothing in science has ever refuted that and nothing in that is at odds with scientific fact.
From this distant vantage point, the Earth might not seem of any particular interest. But for us, it's different. Consider again that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
The Earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot. Think of the endless cruelties visited by the inhabitants of one corner of this pixel on the scarcely distinguishable inhabitants of some other corner. How frequent their misunderstandings, how eager they are to kill one another, how fervent their hatreds. Our posturings, our imagined self-importance, the delusion that we have some privileged position in the universe, are challenged by this point of pale light. Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity in all this vastness there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves.
The Earth is the only world known, so far, to harbor life. There is nowhere else, at least in the near future, to which our species could migrate. Visit, yes. Settle, not yet. Like it or not, for the moment, the Earth is where we make our stand. It has been said that astronomy is a humbling and character-building experience. There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world. To me, it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've ever known.
Carl Sagan, Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space, 1997 reprint, pp. xvxvi
So laugh all you want, but I guaranty you no one in this thread has put more effort into this topic than I have. I have wrestled with the questions posed and had to come to conclusions I could be intellectually honest with. I haven't blindly held to my faith despite facts like many seem to think. I have dug deep into it and questioned everything.
So maybe I'm a bit touchy on the subject, and I shouldn't post in serious topics so late, but to me this goes beyond a scientific discussion to the core of who I am. I believe in God because the sum of my knowledge and personal experiences points to that, not because I'm too scared or weak or stupid to not believe.
I truly appreciate where you are coming from, even though I disagree.
You have the patience of Job, literally.
Jayrod
Footballguy
I cannot read you and I'm not familiar enough to know if you are being serious or not here.1st you indicate I'm being spiritually immature (won't argue that and tend to agree). Then you seem respectful of my position and finally you compare me to Job, a great hero of believers. But calling me patient seems disingenuous considering the fact that I've been snippy in this thread and the beginning part indicating I need spiritual maturity.For now, try to focus on spiritual growth, especially yours. You have undertaken a challenge to your beliefs, reflected, proposed your thoughts.I vehemently disagree with the bolded. That supposition at the crux of the argument is a mere personal opinion upon which a man falls one direction or the other. Mr. Sagan believes no God exists while I believe He does. I believe the evidence is not in the stars or in subatomic particles, but in the spiritual world of which Sagan probably doesn't even consider.God chooses the foolish things to shame the wise lest no man should boast. I do not know everything, but I believe this; that life came from God and He exists and that my life is complete in Him. Nothing in science has ever refuted that and nothing in that is at odds with scientific fact.
From this distant vantage point, the Earth might not seem of any particular interest. But for us, it's different. Consider again that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
The Earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot. Think of the endless cruelties visited by the inhabitants of one corner of this pixel on the scarcely distinguishable inhabitants of some other corner. How frequent their misunderstandings, how eager they are to kill one another, how fervent their hatreds. Our posturings, our imagined self-importance, the delusion that we have some privileged position in the universe, are challenged by this point of pale light. Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity in all this vastness there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves.
The Earth is the only world known, so far, to harbor life. There is nowhere else, at least in the near future, to which our species could migrate. Visit, yes. Settle, not yet. Like it or not, for the moment, the Earth is where we make our stand. It has been said that astronomy is a humbling and character-building experience. There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world. To me, it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've ever known.
Carl Sagan, Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space, 1997 reprint, pp. xvxvi
So laugh all you want, but I guaranty you no one in this thread has put more effort into this topic than I have. I have wrestled with the questions posed and had to come to conclusions I could be intellectually honest with. I haven't blindly held to my faith despite facts like many seem to think. I have dug deep into it and questioned everything.
So maybe I'm a bit touchy on the subject, and I shouldn't post in serious topics so late, but to me this goes beyond a scientific discussion to the core of who I am. I believe in God because the sum of my knowledge and personal experiences points to that, not because I'm too scared or weak or stupid to not believe.
I truly appreciate where you are coming from, even though I disagree.
You have the patience of Job, literally.
Long story short, you confuse me.
Wow, Lutherman goes out of his way to compliment you and this is how you respond? Disgusting.I cannot read you and I'm not familiar enough to know if you are being serious or not here.1st you indicate I'm being spiritually immature (won't argue that and tend to agree). Then you seem respectful of my position and finally you compare me to Job, a great hero of believers. But calling me patient seems disingenuous considering the fact that I've been snippy in this thread and the beginning part indicating I need spiritual maturity.For now, try to focus on spiritual growth, especially yours. You have undertaken a challenge to your beliefs, reflected, proposed your thoughts.I vehemently disagree with the bolded. That supposition at the crux of the argument is a mere personal opinion upon which a man falls one direction or the other. Mr. Sagan believes no God exists while I believe He does. I believe the evidence is not in the stars or in subatomic particles, but in the spiritual world of which Sagan probably doesn't even consider.God chooses the foolish things to shame the wise lest no man should boast. I do not know everything, but I believe this; that life came from God and He exists and that my life is complete in Him. Nothing in science has ever refuted that and nothing in that is at odds with scientific fact.
From this distant vantage point, the Earth might not seem of any particular interest. But for us, it's different. Consider again that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
The Earth is a very small stage in a vast cosmic arena. Think of the rivers of blood spilled by all those generals and emperors so that in glory and triumph they could become the momentary masters of a fraction of a dot. Think of the endless cruelties visited by the inhabitants of one corner of this pixel on the scarcely distinguishable inhabitants of some other corner. How frequent their misunderstandings, how eager they are to kill one another, how fervent their hatreds. Our posturings, our imagined self-importance, the delusion that we have some privileged position in the universe, are challenged by this point of pale light. Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity in all this vastness there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves.
The Earth is the only world known, so far, to harbor life. There is nowhere else, at least in the near future, to which our species could migrate. Visit, yes. Settle, not yet. Like it or not, for the moment, the Earth is where we make our stand. It has been said that astronomy is a humbling and character-building experience. There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world. To me, it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've ever known.
Carl Sagan, Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space, 1997 reprint, pp. xvxvi
So laugh all you want, but I guaranty you no one in this thread has put more effort into this topic than I have. I have wrestled with the questions posed and had to come to conclusions I could be intellectually honest with. I haven't blindly held to my faith despite facts like many seem to think. I have dug deep into it and questioned everything.
So maybe I'm a bit touchy on the subject, and I shouldn't post in serious topics so late, but to me this goes beyond a scientific discussion to the core of who I am. I believe in God because the sum of my knowledge and personal experiences points to that, not because I'm too scared or weak or stupid to not believe.
I truly appreciate where you are coming from, even though I disagree.
You have the patience of Job, literally.
Long story short, you confuse me.
