Executive order 9066 - Japanese Internent (1 Viewer)

[Christo]

You may recall, however, that around the same time, the US took millions of young males, purely on the basis of their sex and age, deprived them of their liberty, sent them to forced labor camps, often under appalling conditions, where they were subject to death and dismemberment. And threatened to shoot them if they tried to escape.

Wow. This may be the worst analogy I have ever read in this forum.

GTFO. You can't swing a dead cat around here without hitting worse analogies.

 

[timschochet]

In the midst of a terrible act, there were some good things that happened, which we should always remember and honor:

1. The territory of Hawaii, with the second largest Japanese American population outside of California, chose NOT to intern their Nisei. In refusing to do so, the government of Hawaii defied the US Government and the Army. The Governor of Hawaii, a Republican, told FDR he considered it "unAmerican" and refused to participate.

2. The American Civil Liberties Union fought the good fight on behalf of the Nisei, without charge. Their lawyers were subject to ridicule and isolation.

3. Perhaps most inspiring, Japanese Americans insisted on joining the military in large numbers, even while their families were being interned. Eventually they would fight in Europe, and the 442nd "Go For Broke" battalion became the most highly decorated in American history, performing incredible acts of heroism in Italy and France. In the World War II thread I devoted several posts to narrating their story. I still think there should be a modern day movie or miniseries devoted to this story.

 

[rockaction]

It is very easy for us today, sitting safe in our homes and offices, to harshly judge what they did 70+ years ago, having gone through what had happened. th

It is easy, and it's right for us to do so. After 9/11, some people actually called for internment of Arab-Americans. One of them, Michele Malkin, continues to be a respected conservative pundit, often appearing on Fox News. She wrote a book called In Defense of Internment.

You wrongly state this again. Michelle Malkin did not call for internment for Arab-Americans. She used what we did in WWII with the Japanese (and some Europeans too) as a defense for profiling of Arab-Americans.

That's interesting, since the title of her book wasn't "In Defense of Profiling". It was "In Defense of Internment". Pardon me if I got confused by that.

Instead of jumping to conclusions, maybe you should listen to some interviews or read the book. She did defend what the US did in WWII, but she did not suggest we should do that today.

This just sort of reminds me how cynical the political book publishing world is more than anything. No reason for that title unless internment is the main point of the book, which apparently, it isn't.

 

[jon_mx]

Yeah, but you have to admit that Pearl Harbor didn't get bombed again after they were interred.

Why did we not quarantine the Germans too?

We did during both WWi and WWII. The WWII effort was smaller though

At the start of World War II, under the authority of the Alien Enemies Act of 1798, the United States government detained and interned over 11,000 German enemy aliens, as well as a small number of German-American citizens, either naturalized or native-born. Their ranks included immigrants to the U.S. as well as visitors stranded in the U.S. by hostilities. In many cases, the families of the internees were allowed to remain together at internment camps in the U.S. In other cases, families were separated. Limited due process was allowed for those arrested and detained.

The population of German citizens in the United States – not to mention American citizens of German birth – was far too large for a general policy of internment comparable to that used in the case of the Japanese in America.[23] Instead, German citizens were detained and evicted from coastal areas on an individual basis. The War Department considered mass expulsions from coastal areas for reasons of military security, but never executed such plans.[24]

 

[timschochet]

When you write a book called "In Defense of Internment", and on the cover there is a split photo of a Japanese on one side, and a Muslim terrorist on the other, there's a clear message you are trying to send. Yes, Michele Malkin did not directly call for internment of Muslim-Americans...YET. But she stated that it was justified and that we might need to do it in the future. More importantly, the title and the cover of her book were just as important as the content of her book.

I don't understand why you defend her. This is a despicable woman. Ann Coulter is shtick, but Malkin is serious. It's embarrassing that conservatives seem to respect her.

 

[jon_mx]

When you write a book called "In Defense of Internment", and on the cover there is a split photo of a Japanese on one side, and a Muslim terrorist on the other, there's a clear message you are trying to send. Yes, Michele Malkin did not directly call for internment of Muslim-Americans...YET. But she stated that it was justified and that we might need to do it in the future. More importantly, the title and the cover of her book were just as important as the content of her book.

I don't understand why you defend her. This is a despicable woman. Ann Coulter is shtick, but Malkin is serious. It's embarrassing that conservatives seem to respect her.

Something about her I always found particularly hot....but then I love Asians. And she is very articulate, whether you agree with her on a subject or not.

 

[SacramentoBob]

Thank the goodness the internet is preventing this from happening again.

 

[timschochet]

Thank the goodness the internet is preventing this from happening again.

I didn't catch this the first time. Very funny, nice sarcasm. But actually, it happens to be true. Had we had an internet back then I believe it would have been much more difficult to do stuff like this, if not impossible. The internment of the Nisei was carried out in April of 1942, in the dark of night, without knowledge of the public. Such a thing would not have been possible today.

 

[SacramentoBob]

Thank the goodness the internet is preventing this from happening again.

I didn't catch this the first time. Very funny, nice sarcasm. But actually, it happens to be true. Had we had an internet back then I believe it would have been much more difficult to do stuff like this, if not impossible. The internment of the Nisei was carried out in April of 1942, in the dark of night, without knowledge of the public. Such a thing would not have been possible today.

It doesn't matter if we have an internet if the people support it. I remember reading about some polling around WW2 that had a significant portion of the US believing that the Jews were partially responsible for what was happening to them in Germany. A quick google search suggests that 60% of Americans were in favor of evacuating Japanese-American citizens. If they had the internet then, there'd be a massive change.org petition to deport them.

 

[timschochet]

Thank the goodness the internet is preventing this from happening again.

I didn't catch this the first time. Very funny, nice sarcasm. But actually, it happens to be true. Had we had an internet back then I believe it would have been much more difficult to do stuff like this, if not impossible. The internment of the Nisei was carried out in April of 1942, in the dark of night, without knowledge of the public. Such a thing would not have been possible today.

It doesn't matter if we have an internet if the people support it. I remember reading about some polling around WW2 that had a significant portion of the US believing that the Jews were partially responsible for what was happening to them in Germany. A quick google search suggests that 60% of Americans were in favor of evacuating Japanese-American citizens. If they had the internet then, there'd be a massive change.org petition to deport them.

Of course. Probably as high as 70% of the public.

But you miss the point. What the internet does is give a voice to the minority. The majority always has a voice. The internet helps political pluralism. In this case, a loud minority would have prevented such an act, IMO.

 

[SacramentoBob]

Thank the goodness the internet is preventing this from happening again.

I didn't catch this the first time. Very funny, nice sarcasm. But actually, it happens to be true. Had we had an internet back then I believe it would have been much more difficult to do stuff like this, if not impossible. The internment of the Nisei was carried out in April of 1942, in the dark of night, without knowledge of the public. Such a thing would not have been possible today.

It doesn't matter if we have an internet if the people support it. I remember reading about some polling around WW2 that had a significant portion of the US believing that the Jews were partially responsible for what was happening to them in Germany. A quick google search suggests that 60% of Americans were in favor of evacuating Japanese-American citizens. If they had the internet then, there'd be a massive change.org petition to deport them.

Of course. Probably as high as 70% of the public.

But you miss the point. What the internet does is give a voice to the minority. The majority always has a voice. The internet helps political pluralism. In this case, a loud minority would have prevented such an act, IMO.

A loud minority would've been in the internment camps without internet access. The rest would've been carrying "We Are the 99%" signs and littering all over the place.

 

[T Bell]

Yeah, but you have to admit that Pearl Harbor didn't get bombed again after they were interred.

Why did we not quarantine the Germans too?

They weren't running any *** plays at the time.

 

[Psychopav]

OK it was bad but Yoda and Obi Wan survived, and after just one generation balance was ultimately restored.

 

[Rove!]

It should be noted that the internment was planned and set forth by well known liberals of the time, such as Earl Warren, John J. McCloy, and FDR. It was opposed by many conservatives, including J. Edgar Hoover, Herbert Hoover, and Robert A. Taft. The irony of this was noted by historian William Manchester when he pointed out that the infringement of civil liberties does not always come from the right.

not ironic at all....

with the notable exceptions of sex and drugs, "conservatives" tend to align more libertarian....

 

[timschochet]

It should be noted that the internment was planned and set forth by well known liberals of the time, such as Earl Warren, John J. McCloy, and FDR. It was opposed by many conservatives, including J. Edgar Hoover, Herbert Hoover, and Robert A. Taft. The irony of this was noted by historian William Manchester when he pointed out that the infringement of civil liberties does not always come from the right.

not ironic at all....

with the notable exceptions of sex and drugs, "conservatives" tend to align more libertarian....

The reason that Manchester felt it was ironic is because other infringements on civil liberties have tended to come from the right- notably the McCarthy era, for example.

 

[Rove!]

It should be noted that the internment was planned and set forth by well known liberals of the time, such as Earl Warren, John J. McCloy, and FDR. It was opposed by many conservatives, including J. Edgar Hoover, Herbert Hoover, and Robert A. Taft. The irony of this was noted by historian William Manchester when he pointed out that the infringement of civil liberties does not always come from the right.

not ironic at all....

with the notable exceptions of sex and drugs, "conservatives" tend to align more libertarian....

The reason that Manchester felt it was ironic is because other infringements on civil liberties have tended to come from the right- notably the McCarthy era, for example.

ironically, the McCarthy era was born out of a fear of an infiltration of totalitarianism. They were not many years removed from many countries turning to this form of government.

 

[B-Deep]

It is very easy for us today, sitting safe in our homes and offices, to harshly judge what they did 70+ years ago, having gone through what had happened.

I think it is our job to judge the actions. We should look at them through the lens of the times they occurred in, but we are free and i would argue obligated to judge the moral implications of seeing hundreds of thousands of American citizens as the enemy simply because they were of Japanese descent.

We can never let something like that happen again.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

It is very easy for us today, sitting safe in our homes and offices, to harshly judge what they did 70+ years ago, having gone through what had happened.

I think it is our job to judge the actions. We should look at them through the lens of the times they occurred in, but we are free and i would argue obligated to judge the moral implications of seeing hundreds of thousands of American citizens as the enemy simply because they were of Japanese descent.

We can never let something like that happen again.

So here we have the NSA violating the 4th Amendment right now, in this very day and age.

What are we doing about it?