Farve stinks....Minny should start Tavaris Jackson. (1 Viewer)

[griff321]

My question to you is have you ever seen Webb play?

Nope. But I do know that 3rd string QBs rarely turn into viable starters when they are thrust into the starting lineup their rookie year.But feel free to keep drinking the Kool Aid if that's what keeps you warm after another lost season.

In your condescending snarl you've hit on the point exactly. The season is lost. We know what we have with Favre. We've seen a whole lot of mediocrity out of all of TJacks starts. Favre will not be back next year, and it's highly unlikely that TJack will be back as well since he will be an UFA. So, why not go with the special physical freak in Joe Webb to see what he can do at the helm? Nothing can replace real game snap in helping a player learn, so why not?IMO womens are way warmer then kool-aid in lost seasons.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

So the other 12 would be mediocre as well? Look, Favre's got that nutty smell of fresh from the toaster whole grain goodness about him this year, but last year he was solid.

He had gaudy numbers but the numbers and the wins were because of things going on elsewhere in the team. Bleacher Report did their top QBs this last off-season. They put Favre #5 on their list based on his year in 2009. But realistically, I think pretty much all the guys down to Cutler at 15 (14 if you take out Favre himself) could have had the same type of year Favre did last year if they had played for the Vikings. And if you're in the #13 - #15 range in a 32-man league, you are pretty much the definition of mediocre. As I said, mediocre can be good. Half the teams don't even have that much.But noone should be pretending that Favre was the #1, or even #2, reason that the Vikings were 12-4 and in the NFC Championship last year.

I have no idea where you're going with this. Favre is the only reason they were 12-4 and in the Championship game last year. They're a wildcard team with Peterson running and Jackson behind center. So it's not Peterson. It's certainly not the coaching. What's so great about the Vikings that so many QBs could have had that type of year? Do you remember how amazing that year was? Look, The Vikings enjoyed a magical season last year where a lot of things went their way and Favre had one last hurrah. But really, they're not that good. They're downright awful this year and it's clear they're going nowhere anytime soon. I think Favre is the only reason why the Vikings had a whole season where they were considered contenders. As a fan, you might want to hang on to that. Not sure you'll see that anytime soon.

 

[cvnpoka]

I'm amazed by the anti-Jackson vitriol in this thread. Dude was raw, and shouldn't have been starting when he was...but that was then. He showed more than enough to have hopes for him. I think too many fans have been spoiled by the success of some of the young passers in the NFL. Guys like Ryan, Flacco, Sanchez, and Freeman (not to mention Mccoy and in Saint Louis) have really changed our expectations...unfairly IMO.It's been a golden time foryoung QB's, but historically they are the exceptions, not the rule.It's time to start Jackson and find out how far he's come.

Somewhere between Vince Young and David Garrard. Good luck with mediocrity.

i remember similar sentiments about another favre backup

 

[cvnpoka]

He was not mediocre last year.This year though he is below mediocre.

last year he was one of the best in the league.this year he is the worst disregarding spot and desperation starts such as raiders, cards, and panthers qbs. ppl are sayin that tjax shouldnt start bc he has no future but i think that is irrelevant bc tjax gives them a better chance at winning the next game they play. i guess if this gets them a better draft pick and gets rid of chilly then fine but seems disingenuous.

 

[lazyike]

The Offensive Line stinks more than Favre. He really is still throwing pretty well, but under pressure, he tries to make a play and throws a dumb INT or fumbles. Given how bad the line pass protects, Jackson might be able to use his feet to make some plays and to avoid pressure. THis season Favre is not avoiding the pressure as well and not having Rice hurts too.

This past game Favre was missing his recievers badly even when he had the time. Seems like he was overthrowing everyone or throwing behind the reciever. I now believe that even Jackson who could provide a Vick like run threat would make he would be a better play right now. At the very least it would give them a chance to see if they need to pursue a free agent QB next year or draft a top QB.

 

[snogger]

well, if this story from the 19th is any indication he is done after Sundays loss:

Brett Favre Claims He's One Loss Away From Career-Ending InjuryNovember 19, 2010 | ISSUE 46•46

11.06.08 EDEN PRAIRIE, MN—Though Vikings quarterback Brett Favre confirmed his ailing right shoulder was "no big deal right now" and that the broken bones in his left foot were "uncomfortable but endurable" for the moment, the three-time MVP told reporters Thursday that one more loss could exacerbate his injuries to the point where he would have to retire. "At this level, and at my age, it would take just one game-breaking play—a deep pass, a long run, anything—by the opposing offense to aggravate an injury to the point where I can't go on," said Favre, who later claimed his injuries become more serious with each defeat he suffers. "It's entirely possible for any given team on our schedule to outscore me so badly I can't physically continue my heroic streak of consecutive starts." Favre also added that any victory he led the 3-6 Vikings to this season would be an amazing display of toughness

 

[sho nuff]

So the other 12 would be mediocre as well? Look, Favre's got that nutty smell of fresh from the toaster whole grain goodness about him this year, but last year he was solid.

He had gaudy numbers but the numbers and the wins were because of things going on elsewhere in the team. Bleacher Report did their top QBs this last off-season. They put Favre #5 on their list based on his year in 2009. But realistically, I think pretty much all the guys down to Cutler at 15 (14 if you take out Favre himself) could have had the same type of year Favre did last year if they had played for the Vikings. And if you're in the #13 - #15 range in a 32-man league, you are pretty much the definition of mediocre. As I said, mediocre can be good. Half the teams don't even have that much.But noone should be pretending that Favre was the #1, or even #2, reason that the Vikings were 12-4 and in the NFC Championship last year.

I have no idea where you're going with this. Favre is the only reason they were 12-4 and in the Championship game last year. They're a wildcard team with Peterson running and Jackson behind center. So it's not Peterson. It's certainly not the coaching. What's so great about the Vikings that so many QBs could have had that type of year? Do you remember how amazing that year was? Look, The Vikings enjoyed a magical season last year where a lot of things went their way and Favre had one last hurrah. But really, they're not that good. They're downright awful this year and it's clear they're going nowhere anytime soon. I think Favre is the only reason why the Vikings had a whole season where they were considered contenders. As a fan, you might want to hang on to that. Not sure you'll see that anytime soon.

While Favre was huge in that last year, I think Allen, Peterson, Harvin, Rice were all pretty big reasons along with Favre in them going as far as they did last year.

 

[eoMMan]

I was right and it feels good.



(please note that Minny does have other problem areas, like the defense, but Farve needs to be out at QB).

 

[Shutout]

As Bill Parcells used to say "You are what your record says you are. If you're 2-4, you're 2-4."

Its over. It doesn't matter how people want to spin how good or bad Favre is, whether he is the savior or the cause, noe of it.

The facts are, this is a team that looks like some other teams in the NFL: a team that is at the point to where they need to start playing other players and evaluating what they have so they can improve their team in order to be better next year than they are now.

The Vikings' window closed and they lost their gamble. The devil now has to be paid his due.

 

[FavreCo]

The sooner they can get T-joke in there, the sooner they can get him out of there and address a major problem.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

At this rate, I'm starting to dream about the Vikes drafting either Luck or Newton.

 

[Da Guru]

Last year Farve was like a 20 year high school reunion that everyone had a great time at. When you try to to it againt the next year it is not quite the same. Farve should have went out while he was ahead. Last night during his interview after the game he looked like he was in his fifties, like he had aged 10 years this season.

 

[eoMMan]

The sooner they can get T-joke in there, the sooner they can get him out of there and address a major problem.

I don't think anyone is saying that TJackson is the long term answer. What we're saying is that he's better than what Farve is right now.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

The sooner they can get T-joke in there, the sooner they can get him out of there and address a major problem.

I don't think anyone is saying that TJackson is the long term answer. What we're saying is that he's better than what Farve is right now.

At least it won't be so damn...sad.

 

[snogger]

The sooner they can get T-joke in there, the sooner they can get him out of there and address a major problem.

I don't think anyone is saying that TJackson is the long term answer. What we're saying is that he's better than what Farve is right now.

The issue is we have no idea if TJ is the "answer" or not.. TJ hasn't played for almost 2 years. Add in the fact that right now the only QB signed for next year is Webb and you HAVE to play TJ. If he isn't the future, it is better to find out now, then sign him to a new contract and find out.

 

[eoMMan]

The sooner they can get T-joke in there, the sooner they can get him out of there and address a major problem.

I don't think anyone is saying that TJackson is the long term answer. What we're saying is that he's better than what Farve is right now.

The issue is we have no idea if TJ is the "answer" or not.. TJ hasn't played for almost 2 years. Add in the fact that right now the only QB signed for next year is Webb and you HAVE to play TJ. If he isn't the future, it is better to find out now, then sign him to a new contract and find out.

I agree. And even if he isn't the answer now and he stays with the team, it's good to your #2 QB have some experience.

 

[Raider Nation]

Brian Baldinger (on the NFLN) just matter-of-factly said he expects Frazier to bench Favre as his first order of business.

 

[Donnybrook]

My question to you is have you ever seen Webb play?

Nope. But I do know that 3rd string QBs rarely turn into viable starters when they are thrust into the starting lineup their rookie year.But feel free to keep drinking the Kool Aid if that's what keeps you warm after another lost season.

Colt McCoy is looking pretty good.

 

[az_prof]

So the other 12 would be mediocre as well? Look, Favre's got that nutty smell of fresh from the toaster whole grain goodness about him this year, but last year he was solid.

He had gaudy numbers but the numbers and the wins were because of things going on elsewhere in the team. Bleacher Report did their top QBs this last off-season. They put Favre #5 on their list based on his year in 2009. But realistically, I think pretty much all the guys down to Cutler at 15 (14 if you take out Favre himself) could have had the same type of year Favre did last year if they had played for the Vikings. And if you're in the #13 - #15 range in a 32-man league, you are pretty much the definition of mediocre. As I said, mediocre can be good. Half the teams don't even have that much.But noone should be pretending that Favre was the #1, or even #2, reason that the Vikings were 12-4 and in the NFC Championship last year.

I have no idea where you're going with this. Favre is the only reason they were 12-4 and in the Championship game last year. They're a wildcard team with Peterson running and Jackson behind center. So it's not Peterson. It's certainly not the coaching. What's so great about the Vikings that so many QBs could have had that type of year? Do you remember how amazing that year was?

They would not have been 12-4 last year with Peterson running and Jackson QB'ing. I agree. But Tavaris is not even a mediocre NFL quarterback. Tavaris is, in what he has shown, a bad NFL quarterback. If you had put a legitimately good NFL quarterback with the Vikings last year: Brees, Manning, Brady, I think they win the Super Bowl.In addition to Peterson, they had a good defense, a decent offensive line, a good tight end, and a wide receiver who had a break-out season. Other than Peterson, they weren't necessary elite anywhere (except defense arguably) but they were a team that also didn't have any holes. There was nowhere to exploit them. Those are the reasons they were in the NFC championship. Favre just had to be good enough not to screw it up. And he was. And since teams overplayed the run the first 10 or 11 games he looked a whole lot better than that.

And in retrospect, the idea that Favre was a mediocre quarterback last year who got a year older, lost some protection up front, and no longer can exploit teams overplaying the run fits the story of 2009 and 2010 a whole lot better than the idea that Favre was an elite quarterback last year who turned into dog-crap this past off-season.

I have to push back and ask what evidence there is that Tavaris is a "bad quarterback"? It's not like he has started that many games for a young QB, and his statistical production is not bad by any stretch. He has more TDs than INTs, and he has also run the ball pretty well. He took his team to the playoffs the one year he started. So what is the objective evidence that he is bad or can't develop?

 

[griff321]

So the other 12 would be mediocre as well? Look, Favre's got that nutty smell of fresh from the toaster whole grain goodness about him this year, but last year he was solid.

He had gaudy numbers but the numbers and the wins were because of things going on elsewhere in the team. Bleacher Report did their top QBs this last off-season. They put Favre #5 on their list based on his year in 2009. But realistically, I think pretty much all the guys down to Cutler at 15 (14 if you take out Favre himself) could have had the same type of year Favre did last year if they had played for the Vikings. And if you're in the #13 - #15 range in a 32-man league, you are pretty much the definition of mediocre. As I said, mediocre can be good. Half the teams don't even have that much.But noone should be pretending that Favre was the #1, or even #2, reason that the Vikings were 12-4 and in the NFC Championship last year.

I have no idea where you're going with this. Favre is the only reason they were 12-4 and in the Championship game last year. They're a wildcard team with Peterson running and Jackson behind center. So it's not Peterson. It's certainly not the coaching. What's so great about the Vikings that so many QBs could have had that type of year? Do you remember how amazing that year was?

They would not have been 12-4 last year with Peterson running and Jackson QB'ing. I agree. But Tavaris is not even a mediocre NFL quarterback. Tavaris is, in what he has shown, a bad NFL quarterback. If you had put a legitimately good NFL quarterback with the Vikings last year: Brees, Manning, Brady, I think they win the Super Bowl.In addition to Peterson, they had a good defense, a decent offensive line, a good tight end, and a wide receiver who had a break-out season. Other than Peterson, they weren't necessary elite anywhere (except defense arguably) but they were a team that also didn't have any holes. There was nowhere to exploit them. Those are the reasons they were in the NFC championship. Favre just had to be good enough not to screw it up. And he was. And since teams overplayed the run the first 10 or 11 games he looked a whole lot better than that.

And in retrospect, the idea that Favre was a mediocre quarterback last year who got a year older, lost some protection up front, and no longer can exploit teams overplaying the run fits the story of 2009 and 2010 a whole lot better than the idea that Favre was an elite quarterback last year who turned into dog-crap this past off-season.

I have to push back and ask what evidence there is that Tavaris is a "bad quarterback"? It's not like he has started that many games for a young QB, and his statistical production is not bad by any stretch. He has more TDs than INTs, and he has also run the ball pretty well. He took his team to the playoffs the one year he started. So what is the objective evidence that he is bad or can't develop?

When every player in every interview says that they love TJack, but Brett gives them the best chance to win it says something. Even more so with the season that Favre has had. Other people close to the team, but on the outside like PA feel the exact same way. TJack isn't a terrible QB, but he is a career backup.Since he's an UFA and after how he was handled throughout the Favre circus, it's very likely that he will not be back. Why even waste the time? Lets get Webb some reps and see what he has.

 

[Donnybrook]

So the other 12 would be mediocre as well? Look, Favre's got that nutty smell of fresh from the toaster whole grain goodness about him this year, but last year he was solid.

He had gaudy numbers but the numbers and the wins were because of things going on elsewhere in the team. Bleacher Report did their top QBs this last off-season. They put Favre #5 on their list based on his year in 2009. But realistically, I think pretty much all the guys down to Cutler at 15 (14 if you take out Favre himself) could have had the same type of year Favre did last year if they had played for the Vikings. And if you're in the #13 - #15 range in a 32-man league, you are pretty much the definition of mediocre. As I said, mediocre can be good. Half the teams don't even have that much.But noone should be pretending that Favre was the #1, or even #2, reason that the Vikings were 12-4 and in the NFC Championship last year.

I have no idea where you're going with this. Favre is the only reason they were 12-4 and in the Championship game last year. They're a wildcard team with Peterson running and Jackson behind center. So it's not Peterson. It's certainly not the coaching. What's so great about the Vikings that so many QBs could have had that type of year? Do you remember how amazing that year was? Look, The Vikings enjoyed a magical season last year where a lot of things went their way and Favre had one last hurrah. But really, they're not that good. They're downright awful this year and it's clear they're going nowhere anytime soon. I think Favre is the only reason why the Vikings had a whole season where they were considered contenders. As a fan, you might want to hang on to that. Not sure you'll see that anytime soon.

2009 was a magical season but don't forget that the 2009 schedule was a cake walk compared to the 2010.

Based on their opponents' results in 2008, the Vikings had the second-easiest schedule in the league in 2009, with their opponents having won 42.0% of their games in 2008

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Minnesota_Vikings_season

 

[Doug B]

2009 was a magical season but don't forget that the 2009 schedule was a cake walk compared to the 2010.

Based on their opponents' results in 2008, the Vikings had the second-easiest schedule in the league in 2009, with their opponents having won 42.0% of their games in 2008

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Minnesota_Vikings_season

I always felt that something was up with the 2009 Vikings, but I could never put stats or numbers to it. Thanks for that.

 

[Doug B]

And in retrospect, the idea that Favre was a mediocre quarterback last year who got a year older, lost some protection up front, and no longer can exploit teams overplaying the run fits the story of 2009 and 2010 a whole lot better than the idea that Favre was an elite quarterback last year who turned into dog-crap this past off-season.

Wasn't sure any Vikings fans believed this.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Anyone still think that Jackson is the answer to anything but the question "Which free agent quarterback is a former Viking"?

 

[Jobber]

Anyone still think that Jackson is the answer to anything but the question "Which free agent quarterback is a former Viking"?

Favre should have just played left handed. He'd have had a better game than TJ.

 

[Sudsy]

Anyone still think that Jackson is the answer to anything but the question "Which free agent quarterback is a former Viking"?

Not a believer in one game referendums. Give me a couple of more samples and I may get there.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Anyone still think that Jackson is the answer to anything but the question "Which free agent quarterback is a former Viking"?

Not a believer in one game referendums. Give me a couple of more samples and I may get there.

Shirley, you can't be serious.

 

[FunkyPlutos]

Anyone still think that Jackson is the answer to anything but the question "Which free agent quarterback is a former Viking"?

Not a believer in one game referendums. Give me a couple of more samples and I may get there.

Then maybe you could go back to the last game he started...playoffs versus the Eagles (after Frerotte came in for him and got the Vikings to the playoffs).I really think it is amazing how many people in the national media continue to say they should play Jackson since he is the future. Tells me how much they really know.

 

[Shutout]

I watched the game last night and I honestly jus thave to block this game out when trying to think of what TJAX may/may not be. A lot of players on that team rolled over and quit (not all...some of the guys you would expect were playing and trying, but some guys were mentally checked out). There was a lot more going on than what you can put on one person.

 

[Da Guru]

This is a good thing for the Vikings. At least now they know for sure they have to get a QB for next season. McNabb will be available but do they want to bring in another aging QB or go younger?

 

[Andy Dufresne]

I watched the game last night and I honestly jus thave to block this game out when trying to think of what TJAX may/may not be. A lot of players on that team rolled over and quit (not all...some of the guys you would expect were playing and trying, but some guys were mentally checked out). There was a lot more going on than what you can put on one person.

This is his FIFTH year in the league. He looked just as timid and lost as he did the first game he started.

 

[omahabrad]

Different coach same results. Why do Viking coaches refuse to run the offense through AP? I know he was struggling but so was TJax. It should have been a heavy dose of running, draws and screens with AP and Gerhart when facing that pass rush. the same could be said about the Texans. 2 Straight passes out your end zone in over time when you have the top RB in the league and facing a defense that's gassed?

 

[Sudsy]

Anyone still think that Jackson is the answer to anything but the question "Which free agent quarterback is a former Viking"?

Not a believer in one game referendums. Give me a couple of more samples and I may get there.

Shirley, you can't be serious.

I am, and don't call me ....

 

[smitty63]

Yes, Childress is mostly to blame for Minny's problems but Farve should take some blame too (along with the defense). I think Tavarris could and would play better than Farve is playing right now.

How'd that work out?

 

[omahabrad]

I watched the game last night and I honestly jus thave to block this game out when trying to think of what TJAX may/may not be. A lot of players on that team rolled over and quit (not all...some of the guys you would expect were playing and trying, but some guys were mentally checked out). There was a lot more going on than what you can put on one person.

This is his FIFTH year in the league. He looked just as timid and lost as he did the first game he started.

He learned nothing being behind Favre. At the top of the Vkings want list will be QB and O-line.

 

[Da Guru]

Different coach same results. Why do Viking coaches refuse to run the offense through AP? I know he was struggling but so was TJax. It should have been a heavy dose of running, draws and screens with AP and Gerhart when facing that pass rush. the same could be said about the Texans. 2 Straight passes out your end zone in over time when you have the top RB in the league and facing a defense that's gassed?

No Chilly to blame, this is on the players. The team plays the same way under Frazier as they did with Chilly. Minny may be looking for a new HC and QB this off-season.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

To be fair to the entire team last night, missing Steve Hutchinson (starting a 5th round rookie in his place) and Harvin on offense takes two huge chunks of talent out of the scheme. Plus, AP seemed to have suffered a setback to his leg even though he looked good last week.

I said it before and I'll say it again - The Vikings season was sunk when Cedric Griffin went down.

 

[omahabrad]

Different coach same results. Why do Viking coaches refuse to run the offense through AP? I know he was struggling but so was TJax. It should have been a heavy dose of running, draws and screens with AP and Gerhart when facing that pass rush. the same could be said about the Texans. 2 Straight passes out your end zone in over time when you have the top RB in the league and facing a defense that's gassed?

No Chilly to blame, this is on the players. The team plays the same way under Frazier as they did with Chilly. Minny may be looking for a new HC and QB this off-season.

Yep, looks like the Viking's problems are alittle more than Chilly and Favre.

 

[snogger]

Anyone still think that Jackson is the answer to anything but the question "Which free agent quarterback is a former Viking"?

He didn't add any more fans yesterday, if there were any. Then again, to be fair, the whole Offense SUCKED.. OL couldn't block worth crap, ADP did nothing, whenever TJ actually hit a WR, they were dropping them. Complete and utter embarrassment by the Offense yesterday.Next week could be fun vs. Da' Bear and Outside!! Truthfully, he has 3 weeks to find a job for next year.He consistently shows he can be a worthwhile backup QB, but so far hasn't shown he has learned anything the last two years carrying a Clipboard.