FF Etiquette Question (1 Viewer)

[Irish Catholic]

My ESPN league agreed at the start of the season to play with 2 keepers from last year's team. (Over my objection: I felt that call would have to be announced the prior season so people could position accordingly, but I acquiesced.)

Under espn rules, no team has to select keepers, and if they don't they get to use that empty slot(s) to pick before the draft technically starts. This is clearly stated even with an example to illustrate.

Because one team had Foster, A. Peterson, and Vick, I knew one of those three would be available so I only chose 1 keeper with the intention of picking up one of those guys in the pre-draft draft. When the draft commenced and the first pick came to me "out of order" the commissioner went back and chose a second keeper for me, then restarted the draft.

I called him out and he started calling me names and basically told me I was out next year. I've not brought it up since then but I still feel pretty strongly I was in the right. Thinking about ditching the league anyway but trying not to be petty about this. Commissioner's argument is that the league agreed to have 2 keepers and my maneuver was trying to take advantage of a loophole contrary to the spirit of the agreement (as he understood it, not me).

Who was right?

 

[FootballGuy22]

Depends on whether your league rules state that you must keep two players or if it states you can protect up to two. Without knowing it's hard to say.

 

[Irish Catholic]

The email exchanges didn't specify but as noted the ESPN rules for keepers expressly states you don't have to select 2 keepers, and expressly provides for what to do if a team doesn't pick 2.

 

[unckeyherb]

Was it written out in the league bylaws that you must keep two? Who did he choose for your second keeper? IMO you need to know 1-2 drafts ahead of time to start a keeper, in order to prep like you said. Commish sounds like a tool.

 

[Irish Catholic]

Since the bylaws are whatever ESPN rules specify (+ any custom-added league settings), I would say the bylaws clearly favored my interpretation. Indeed that is what happened when the draft started before he manually adjusted my keepers.

He took McFadden as my second keeper which was probably the right choice if I had to choose one. He was basically enforcing his intended (unstated) meaning of the rules above what the rules actually stated.

 

[FootballGuy22]

I agree with you if there was nothing other that what is on the ESPN website, i have played in leagues like this previously we had a rule that you MUST protect two players even though the website acted differently. Obviously this occurred about 10 weeks ago, why are you bringing it up now?

 

[Irish Catholic]

I'm deciding now whether I want to stay in the league and making trades accordingly.

 

[Saint]

Having run a keeper, I am definitely in agreement with unckeyherb on this. When switching to a keeper, it is definitely something that needs to be considered in advance so folks know how to plan accordingly. Not sure how ESPN handles it, but typically it should be stated how many keepers can be kept, what the cost is, etc. For example, our league has unlimited keepers, but they cost 2 rounds higher than their draft position each year. Failure to state the detailed rules obviously plays into the strategy. So if there is no rule stating how many keepers can be kept, (0, 1, or 2) in this instance, then I would think it is up to interpretation and the action you took is correct.

If this is a money league, then I would have backed out immediately. Why is this coming out 10 weeks in the season?

 

[B Maverick]

i am guessing this isnt a league of friends, just one you joined on espn?

where you the only one who didnt select two keepers? If not, why arent they upset?

From what you noted above I believe you to be in the right.

 

[Irish Catholic]

It's friends from a Notre Dame message board, not people I've ever met in person. Not money league. We've had a good time over the years fighting for bragging rights.

I'm the laywer of the group so I tend to study rules and exploit to my advantage. No one else seemed to care that much; if anything they were against me because they thought it was unfair for me to get the first pick.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

My ESPN league agreed at the start of the season to play with 2 keepers from last year's team. (Over my objection: I felt that call would have to be announced the prior season so people could position accordingly, but I acquiesced.)

Under espn rules, no team has to select keepers, and if they don't they get to use that empty slot(s) to pick before the draft technically starts. This is clearly stated even with an example to illustrate.

Because one team had Foster, A. Peterson, and Vick, I knew one of those three would be available so I only chose 1 keeper with the intention of picking up one of those guys in the pre-draft draft. When the draft commenced and the first pick came to me "out of order" the commissioner went back and chose a second keeper for me, then restarted the draft.

I called him out and he started calling me names and basically told me I was out next year. I've not brought it up since then but I still feel pretty strongly I was in the right. Thinking about ditching the league anyway but trying not to be petty about this. Commissioner's argument is that the league agreed to have 2 keepers and my maneuver was trying to take advantage of a loophole contrary to the spirit of the agreement (as he understood it, not me).

Who was right?

you are. that's not exploiting aloophole in the rule. It's patently following the listed rule. I'd call the commish out on being a bay for circumventing the rule cuz he didn't like how you played it perfectly. He is a ##### and whiner.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

It's friends from a Notre Dame message board, not people I've ever met in person. Not money league. We've had a good time over the years fighting for bragging rights.

I'm the laywer of the group so I tend to study rules and exploit to my advantage. No one else seemed to care that much; if anything they were against me because they thought it was unfair for me to get the first pick.

here's where it went wrong.

 

[belljr]

Typical lawyers

 

[MIMN]

I'm deciding now whether I want to stay in the league and making trades accordingly.

If you like the league then clarify the rules for next year. Make the point that the is the way the web site operates and is in line with how you think it should work. If you can't live with the rules then exit the league gracefully.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

It's friends from a Notre Dame message board, not people I've ever met in person. Not money league. We've had a good time over the years fighting for bragging rights.

I'm the laywer of the group so I tend to study rules and exploit to my advantage. No one else seemed to care that much; if anything they were against me because they thought it was unfair for me to get the first pick.

Why even bother? Seriously, why do you even give a #### about this league?BTW - you were clearly in the right, and your commish is a moron. Which makes sense, given the ND message board aspect.

 

[Topes]

My ESPN league agreed at the start of the season to play with 2 keepers from last year's team. (Over my objection: I felt that call would have to be announced the prior season so people could position accordingly, but I acquiesced.)

Under espn rules, no team has to select keepers, and if they don't they get to use that empty slot(s) to pick before the draft technically starts. This is clearly stated even with an example to illustrate.

Because one team had Foster, A. Peterson, and Vick, I knew one of those three would be available so I only chose 1 keeper with the intention of picking up one of those guys in the pre-draft draft. When the draft commenced and the first pick came to me "out of order" the commissioner went back and chose a second keeper for me, then restarted the draft.

I called him out and he started calling me names and basically told me I was out next year. I've not brought it up since then but I still feel pretty strongly I was in the right. Thinking about ditching the league anyway but trying not to be petty about this. Commissioner's argument is that the league agreed to have 2 keepers and my maneuver was trying to take advantage of a loophole contrary to the spirit of the agreement (as he understood it, not me).

Who was right?

See bolded part.