Hernandez convicted of first-degree murder; found deceased in his cell. (3 Viewers)

[Sinn Fein]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

 

[Jules Winnfield]

one weird thing is why would he rent a car? I'm sure he has a few cars that he owns. The renting makes me think this could have been a premeditated thing.

Well, every time I plan on shooting someone on the head, I usually rent them a car and leave it close to their dead body. You know, because there certainly is no paper trail back to me. Oh, one other thing, since I'm so hopped up on Mary Jane, I also tend to leave the dead bodies within walking distance from my house...again, so there is no trace back to me.

That would be even dumber than leaving a Miami strip club and shooting a guy in the face.

He couldn't leave the body around the house because there was no sign that said "Dead Semipro Linebacker Storage".

There wasn't a sign but ### #### Jimmy! This is some serious gourmet ####! Usually, me and Vince would be happy with some freeze-dried Taster's Choice right, but he springs this serious gourmet #### on us! What flavor is this?

 

[madd futher]

If this story about the guy being shot in the face is true, I'll be amazed at how a high profile player could do something like this and not have anything hit the media for months.

Imagine how much other stuff gets buried.

It was last week dude.

Put down the bong. The guy was shot in the face in February.

And don't call me Dude.

Just sayin' dude

DON'T CALL HIM DUDE, DUDE....THAT'S RUDE, DUDE

 

[Max Power]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

 

[ghostguy123]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Has he ever suspended anyone for something they were never convicted of?? Ever, even once??

 

[werdnoynek]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Has he ever suspended anyone for something they were never convicted of?? Ever, even once??

On March 5, 2010, it was revealed that a woman from Milledgeville, Georgia had accused Roethlisberger of sexual assault. While Roethlisberger was once again not charged with a crime following the events at the nightclub,[24] the league still suspended him for six games, which was later reduced to four.[25] This is the only time in league history a player has been suspended under the personal conduct policy without being charged with a crime.

via http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Roethlisberger#Milledgeville.2C_Georgia

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

 

[ghostguy123]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

He was suspended for personal conduct that was found to actually be true, just not a crime.

If Hernandez is related to this at all, he goes to prison, so a suspension would be meaningless. Different circumstances. You dont go to prison for being a jerk.

 

[werdnoynek]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

What they were doing wasn't illegal, but it was against the rules.

 

[werdnoynek]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

He was suspended for personal conduct that was found to actually be true, just not a crime.

If Hernandez is related to this at all, he goes to prison, so a suspension would be meaningless. Different circumstances. You dont go to prison for being a jerk.

??? sexual assualt is a crime and he could have gone to jail.

 

[ghostguy123]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

He was suspended for personal conduct that was found to actually be true, just not a crime.

If Hernandez is related to this at all, he goes to prison, so a suspension would be meaningless. Different circumstances. You dont go to prison for being a jerk.

??? sexual assualt is a crime and he could have gone to jail.

He was not convicted of sexual assault though. He was supended for the behavior and personal conduct. As I said, being a d-bag off the field isnt illegal, but he will suspend you for it.

In this case, if hernandez is involved, jail.

 

[ghostguy123]

If Goodell suspends herandez for murder if not convicted, would be interesting though.

 

[werdnoynek]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

He was suspended for personal conduct that was found to actually be true, just not a crime.

If Hernandez is related to this at all, he goes to prison, so a suspension would be meaningless. Different circumstances. You dont go to prison for being a jerk.

??? sexual assualt is a crime and he could have gone to jail.

He was not convicted of sexual assault though. He was supended for the behavior and personal conduct. As I said, being a d-bag off the field isnt illegal, but he will suspend you for it.

In this case, if hernandez is involved, jail.

If Rothlisberger would have been convicted, he would have gone to jail too.

So 2 incidents involving weapons and murder / attempted murder involving Hernandez come up in the last week and you don't think the league will question his behavior and personal conduct? LOL.

 

[ghostguy123]

Then again, you are probably right. Goodell might suspend him for looking at him funny.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

What they were doing wasn't illegal, but it was against the rules.

So much against the rules that the suspensions were overturned

 

[ghostguy123]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

He was suspended for personal conduct that was found to actually be true, just not a crime.

If Hernandez is related to this at all, he goes to prison, so a suspension would be meaningless. Different circumstances. You dont go to prison for being a jerk.

??? sexual assualt is a crime and he could have gone to jail.

He was not convicted of sexual assault though. He was supended for the behavior and personal conduct. As I said, being a d-bag off the field isnt illegal, but he will suspend you for it.

In this case, if hernandez is involved, jail.

If Rothlisberger would have been convicted, he would have gone to jail too.

So 2 incidents involving weapons and murder / attempted murder involving Hernandez come up in the last week and you don't think the league will question his behavior and personal conduct? LOL.

They can question it all they want. If he didnt shoot the guy in the face or wasnt there, and didnt kill this dude or wasnt there................in Big Bens case, he was witnessed to have screwed some chic in a bathroom, just couldnt prove a crime. His conduct was actually witnessed. In the saints players case, totally different scenario since at no time was anything legal going on anyway

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

He was suspended for personal conduct that was found to actually be true, just not a crime.

If Hernandez is related to this at all, he goes to prison, so a suspension would be meaningless. Different circumstances. You dont go to prison for being a jerk.

??? sexual assualt is a crime and he could have gone to jail.

He was not convicted of sexual assault though. He was supended for the behavior and personal conduct. As I said, being a d-bag off the field isnt illegal, but he will suspend you for it.

In this case, if hernandez is involved, jail.

If Rothlisberger would have been convicted, he would have gone to jail too.

So 2 incidents involving weapons and murder / attempted murder involving Hernandez come up in the last week and you don't think the league will question his behavior and personal conduct? LOL.

They can question it all they want. If he didnt shoot the guy in the face or wasnt there, and didnt kill this dude or wasnt there................in Big Bens case, he was witnessed to have screwed some chic in a bathroom, just couldnt prove a crime. His conduct was actually witnessed. In the saints players case, totally different scenario since at no time was anything legal going on anyway

Scott Fujita was found to be innocent of all conduct detrimental to the league.

 

[zilladog]

If it turns out that his friends or acquaintances did this without his knowledge then he certainly won't get suspended.

If it turns out that he had knowledge of it or aided and abetted the criminals in any way at all (even in a minor way) he will most certainly get suspended.

It's that simple.

 

[werdnoynek]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

What they were doing wasn't illegal, but it was against the rules.

So much against the rules that the suspensions were overturned

Not for Williams.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

What they were doing wasn't illegal, but it was against the rules.

So much against the rules that the suspensions were overturned

Not for Williams.

I should have said for the players. Williams was guilty especially with that tape of him screaming in the locker room and also with him ordering the Fried Brett Favre Head at the restaurant with the defensive players

 

[Sinrman]

The story gets weirder and weirder. And here I thought Hernandez was the calmer one of the two TEs in NE.

 

[ghostguy123]

The story gets weirder and weirder. And here I thought Hernandez was the calmer one of the two TEs in NE.

Silent but deadly.

If anyone sees a stupid Hernandez trade please post it here, HAHAHA. Cant wait to see Hernandez traded for a 2014 2nd

 

[tombonneau]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Has he ever suspended anyone for something they were never convicted of?? Ever, even once??

I know seriously. This is a Goodell Special. Even if no charges are ever filed Goodell gets to play his own game of Judge & Jury.

This one was my favorite, granted Pac Man has a long rap sheet but a 4-game suspension based on hearsay?

On October 8, Jones was involved in an altercation with his bodyguard in a Dallas hotel.[40] According to ESPN, there wasn't a police report, nor was anyone arrested and nobody was charged with anything in connection with the fight[40] Jones was suspended for a minimum of four games by the NFL due to the altercation, for violating the league's personal conduct policy.[41

 

[Eire32]

On the lighter side of things someone posted this in another Hernandez forum.

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=GKlDBi0cyIA

 

[Max Power]

Can Hernandez get into any legal trouble if it turns out that he knew his friend was shot and just left him on the side of the road without medical care?

Seems to me if that turns out to be a fact, it would be enough for a suspension under the player conduct policy.

 

[ghostguy123]

Can Hernandez get into any legal trouble if it turns out that he knew his friend was shot and just left him on the side of the road without medical care?

Seems to me if that turns out to be a fact, it would be enough for a suspension under the player conduct policy.

Um, yes he can get into legal trouble for that. Several charges actually.

 

[PatsFanCT]

If it turns out that his friends or acquaintances did this without his knowledge then he certainly won't get suspended.

If it turns out that he had knowledge of it or aided and abetted the criminals in any way at all (even in a minor way) he will most certainly get suspended.

It's that simple.

I don't know why some people can't understand this logic.

 

[CapnJB]

If it turns out that his friends or acquaintances did this without his knowledge then he certainly won't get suspended.

If it turns out that he had knowledge of it or aided and abetted the criminals in any way at all (even in a minor way) he will most certainly get suspended.

It's that simple.

I don't know why some people can't understand this logic.

And if you wish really hard. I mean REALLY, REALLY hard. Tom Brady WILL show up at your birthday party.

Pats apologists are funny.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I know seriously. This is a Goodell Special. Even if no charges are ever filed Goodell gets to play his own game of Judge & Jury.

This one was my favorite, granted Pac Man has a long rap sheet but a 4-game suspension based on hearsay?

It's a fair court.

No one has any idea what Goodell will do.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

What they were doing wasn't illegal, but it was against the rules.

So much against the rules that the suspensions were overturned

Not for Williams.

Williams was threatened with a ban from the NFL for life. Are you surprised he was the one who caved?

Oh look, the evilest man in football has been hired by the Titans, well off you go then, Gregg, play nicely.

 

[PatsFanCT]

If it turns out that his friends or acquaintances did this without his knowledge then he certainly won't get suspended.

If it turns out that he had knowledge of it or aided and abetted the criminals in any way at all (even in a minor way) he will most certainly get suspended.

It's that simple.

I don't know why some people can't understand this logic.

And if you wish really hard. I mean REALLY, REALLY hard. Tom Brady WILL show up at your birthday party.

Pats apologists are funny.

As funny as Pats conspiracy therorists?

Unless I missed something along the way, Hernandez hasn't been charged with any crime, in either case, or connected in any way. Untill that changes, his status on the field doesn't.

Pretty damn simple.

 

[Sinn Fein]

If he shot a guy, in MA or FL - he is going to be suspended

The NFL investigators are now looking into him now, if they find evidence of other questionable personal conduct, he will be suspended.

 

[werdnoynek]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

What they were doing wasn't illegal, but it was against the rules.

So much against the rules that the suspensions were overturned

Not for Williams.

Williams was threatened with a ban from the NFL for life. Are you surprised he was the one who caved?

Oh look, the evilest man in football has been hired by the Titans, well off you go then, Gregg, play nicely.

What's done is done, I was simply making a point that it doesn't take legal action to be suspended in the NFL. If you're behind the shield you held accountable for the rules. Moving on.

 

[KellysHeroes]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

ghostguy hasn't been paying attention to the suspensions of the past 5 yrs

 

[PatsFanCT]

If he shot a guy, in MA or FL - he is going to be suspended

The NFL investigators are now looking into him now, if they find evidence of other questionable personal conduct, he will be suspended.

Obviously if he shot someone he will get suspended if he's not in jail. Nobody's arguing that. A lot of people here are assuming he was involved with the MA shooting, and still others think because some drug addict in FL decides to sue him, he will get suspended.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

Rothlisberger

Were the Saints players ever convicted?

What they were doing wasn't illegal, but it was against the rules.

So much against the rules that the suspensions were overturned

Not for Williams.

Williams was threatened with a ban from the NFL for life. Are you surprised he was the one who caved?

Oh look, the evilest man in football has been hired by the Titans, well off you go then, Gregg, play nicely.

What's done is done, I was simply making a point that it doesn't take legal action to be suspended in the NFL. If you're behind the shield you held accountable for the rules. Moving on.

Hey I agree, and I was alluding to a point earlier on that "evidence" and whether Hernandez has done anything criminal or wrong or not is really relevant to what Goodell will do. Wrong place, wrong time, too bad, but no one really knows how Goodell will rule or why.

 

[ghostguy123]

Goodell will not suspend Hernandez for this unless he is convicted. How many people accused of things that were unfounded in court were suspended for it?? Z-E-R-O

ghostguy hasn't been paying attention to the suspensions of the past 5 yrs

So if he gets arrested for murder, but is found not guilty, goodell will suspend him for murder??

I am sure some other things could pop up in this thing that are suspension worthy. Not talking about that.

 

[ghostguy123]

If he shot a guy, in MA or FL - he is going to be suspended

The NFL investigators are now looking into him now, if they find evidence of other questionable personal conduct, he will be suspended.

Obviously if he shot someone he will get suspended if he's not in jail. Nobody's arguing that. A lot of people here are assuming he was involved with the MA shooting, and still others think because some drug addict in FL decides to sue him, he will get suspended.

Would be funny if the NFL would find him guilty of shooting someone, while the actual LAW never even gets enough evidence to charge him, lol. Maybe the wrong people are in charge of the legal system.

 

[Anarchy99]

Any player at any time can be suspended for conducting unbecoming at the commissioner's discretion. Whether that ultimately sticks or gets overturned is another matter, but it's in the CBA and league rules.

 

[Rhythmdoctor]

Hot damn this is a mess!

 

[Max Power]

If he shot a guy, in MA or FL - he is going to be suspended

The NFL investigators are now looking into him now, if they find evidence of other questionable personal conduct, he will be suspended.

Obviously if he shot someone he will get suspended if he's not in jail. Nobody's arguing that. A lot of people here are assuming he was involved with the MA shooting, and still others think because some drug addict in FL decides to sue him, he will get suspended.

That guy shot in Florida is his buddy from MA. The last time they were seen in public, they were having a disagreement and sounds like they left the strip club in the same car. The next time someone sees Bradley, he is bleeding in an alley. That doesn't look good for Hernandez...

 

[ghostguy123]

Any player at any time can be suspended for conducting unbecoming at the commissioner's discretion. Whether that ultimately sticks or gets overturned is another matter, but it's in the CBA and league rules.

Agreed. But murder is murder correct?? It is a yes or now answer, you did it or you didnt.

If Goodell wants to suspend him for all sorts of other stuff surrounding the incident fine. It seems like enough is popping up that he could..............but not for MURDER. Seems pretty black and white cut and dry, you either murder someone or you dont.;

 

[Anarchy99]

Any player at any time can be suspended for conducting unbecoming at the commissioner's discretion. Whether that ultimately sticks or gets overturned is another matter, but it's in the CBA and league rules.

Agreed. But murder is murder correct?? It is a yes or now answer, you did it or you didnt.

If Goodell wants to suspend him for all sorts of other stuff surrounding the incident fine. It seems like enough is popping up that he could..............but not for MURDER. Seems pretty black and white cut and dry, you either murder someone or you dont.;

I think you missed the point. He could get suspended just for making the league look bad . . . they don't need to point to an exact reason. Whether he is charged or convicted could be totally irrelevant (as witnessed by other examples already listed). I'm not saying that is likely or unlikely to happen, but Goodell has that option in his hip pocket for whenever he sees fit to use it. IMO, the best way to describe the situation is that Hernandez COULD be facing a suspension. So it's not a 0% chance and it's not a 100% chance . . . it's somewhere in the middle. But it certainly a much higher chance than it was last week.

 

[PatsFanCT]

If he shot a guy, in MA or FL - he is going to be suspended

The NFL investigators are now looking into him now, if they find evidence of other questionable personal conduct, he will be suspended.

Obviously if he shot someone he will get suspended if he's not in jail. Nobody's arguing that. A lot of people here are assuming he was involved with the MA shooting, and still others think because some drug addict in FL decides to sue him, he will get suspended.

That guy shot in Florida is his buddy from MA. The last time they were seen in public, they were having a disagreement and sounds like they left the strip club in the same car. The next time someone sees Bradley, he is bleeding in an alley. That doesn't look good for Hernandez...

It's more compelling to leave out all the facts.

...The next time someone sees Bradley, he is bleeding in an alley. He then tells the police that a black guy and a hispanic guy shot him and took off. Four months later he sues Hernandez without so much as filing a police report against him. He's a drug adict and has along criminal record.

Unless they have the gun that shot him connecedto Hernandez, he doesn't even get arrested, neve mind suspended.

 

[Touchdown There]

The next 26 page thread in the Pool has arrived.

 

[Max Power]

If he shot a guy, in MA or FL - he is going to be suspended

The NFL investigators are now looking into him now, if they find evidence of other questionable personal conduct, he will be suspended.

Obviously if he shot someone he will get suspended if he's not in jail. Nobody's arguing that. A lot of people here are assuming he was involved with the MA shooting, and still others think because some drug addict in FL decides to sue him, he will get suspended.

That guy shot in Florida is his buddy from MA. The last time they were seen in public, they were having a disagreement and sounds like they left the strip club in the same car. The next time someone sees Bradley, he is bleeding in an alley. That doesn't look good for Hernandez...

It's more compelling to leave out all the facts.

...The next time someone sees Bradley, he is bleeding in an alley. He then tells the police that a black guy and a hispanic guy shot him and took off. Four months later he sues Hernandez without so much as filing a police report against him. He's a drug adict and has along criminal record.

Unless they have the gun that shot him connecedto Hernandez, he doesn't even get arrested, neve mind suspended.

From the TMZ update

According to police reports, obtained by TMZ, the victim was discovered outside of a John Deere store in Riviera Beach, FL on Feb 13 around 6:48 AM. The manager of the store, who found Bradley, says the victim was bleeding from his head and one of his hands.

According to the police report, Bradley instructed the John Deere employee to call 911 and warned -- "Tell them to hurry -- I'm gonna bleed out."

When the employee tried to ask Bradley if he knew who shot him, Bradley replied, "I'm done talking -- it hurts too bad."

Emergency responders raced to the scene -- but when they arrived, Bradley was being difficult ... refusing to cooperate and being "rude" to personnel.

Eventually, cops say Bradley identified his attackers as being "both Hispanic and black males."

From an NFL.com article referring to Bradley's response when police arrived...

The man repeatedly said at the time he did not know who shot him, the report said, but the wounds were not self-inflicted.

The man wasn't cooperative, and told one investigator he didn't want the case to go any further.

"I explained that without his cooperation, the investigation would cease," one deputy wrote. "He understood."

The case is inactive, according to the report.

You can see it how you want. But this strikes me as a guy who didn't want the cops involved and at one point said it was some black and Hispanic guys just to end questioning. A possible scenario is that he didn't want Hernandez to take the fall for it, but hoped Hernandez would take care of him financially and since he failed to do so, a lawsuit was filed.

 

[Anarchy99]

If you read the complaint, it alleges that there were 4 people in the car at the time of the shooting. That opens up a can of worms for both sides. if they can find the other two guys, they could fry or free Hernandez, and that also opens up the door that one of them could have owned the gun and pulled the trigger. Again, way too soon to start dissecting this as there are more questions than there are answers right now.

 

[PatsFanCT]

If he shot a guy, in MA or FL - he is going to be suspended

The NFL investigators are now looking into him now, if they find evidence of other questionable personal conduct, he will be suspended.

Obviously if he shot someone he will get suspended if he's not in jail. Nobody's arguing that. A lot of people here are assuming he was involved with the MA shooting, and still others think because some drug addict in FL decides to sue him, he will get suspended.

That guy shot in Florida is his buddy from MA. The last time they were seen in public, they were having a disagreement and sounds like they left the strip club in the same car. The next time someone sees Bradley, he is bleeding in an alley. That doesn't look good for Hernandez...

It's more compelling to leave out all the facts.

...The next time someone sees Bradley, he is bleeding in an alley. He then tells the police that a black guy and a hispanic guy shot him and took off. Four months later he sues Hernandez without so much as filing a police report against him. He's a drug adict and has along criminal record.

Unless they have the gun that shot him connecedto Hernandez, he doesn't even get arrested, neve mind suspended.

From the TMZ update

According to police reports, obtained by TMZ, the victim was discovered outside of a John Deere store in Riviera Beach, FL on Feb 13 around 6:48 AM. The manager of the store, who found Bradley, says the victim was bleeding from his head and one of his hands.

According to the police report, Bradley instructed the John Deere employee to call 911 and warned -- "Tell them to hurry -- I'm gonna bleed out."

When the employee tried to ask Bradley if he knew who shot him, Bradley replied, "I'm done talking -- it hurts too bad."

Emergency responders raced to the scene -- but when they arrived, Bradley was being difficult ... refusing to cooperate and being "rude" to personnel.

Eventually, cops say Bradley identified his attackers as being "both Hispanic and black males."

From an NFL.com article referring to Bradley's response when police arrived...

The man repeatedly said at the time he did not know who shot him, the report said, but the wounds were not self-inflicted.

The man wasn't cooperative, and told one investigator he didn't want the case to go any further.

"I explained that without his cooperation, the investigation would cease," one deputy wrote. "He understood."

The case is inactive, according to the report.

You can see it how you want. But this strikes me as a guy who didn't want the cops involved and at one point said it was some black and Hispanic guys just to end questioning. A possible scenario is that he didn't want Hernandez to take the fall for it, but hoped Hernandez would take care of him financially and since he failed to do so, a lawsuit was filed.

So now you're starting to confuse me. Are you agreeing with me, or are you saying Hernandez will get suspended based on that information? Cuz that would be crazy.

 

[ScottNorwood]

He's guilty

 

[Keith Lewis]

Is there now a separate allegation he shot a man in February ?