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I Remember When People Were Grilling Me About Starting A Jay Electronica/Jay-Z Anti-Semitism Thread (1 Viewer)

rockaction

rockaction

Footballguy
Now Kanye is all news. You think that apple fell far from Jay-Z's tree? OMG. This board is so stupid sometimes. So Jay and Jay Electronica are five percenters with almost actively anti-Semitic lyrics and that's not worthy of threads, yet Kanye's anti-Semitism is worthy of discussion.

Child, please, why am I always two-five years ahead of my time?
 
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Kanye isn't NGE 😄

He's on some Black Hebrew Israelite stuff.


ETA: Is it really worth starting a new thread to beat your chest over this? You're going to get the same "who TF cares?" reaction as you did in the previous thread.
 
cockroach said:
He's on some Black Hebrew Israelite stuff.
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Yeah, he's on very similar **** to Farrakhan. He's definitely like the Wu when they would take trips to Israel and claim that Israelis were part of the tribe. It's a philosophy that bleeds, much like doctrine in law. There is no official cut-off or demarcation in hip hop between Black Israelites and Five Percenters. They occupy the same space in hip hop and in their practitioners' convoluted minds.

cockroach said:
ETA: Is it really worth starting a new thread to beat your chest over this? You're going to get the same "who TF cares?" reaction as you did in the previous thread.
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Yes, it is. You always seem to chime in on black issues with authority while being wrong, too. It's a good look. Keep doing that. Just like "Engine Engine No. 9" wasn't a classic hip hop lyric in a thread the other night. Okayplayer made it into a parody shirt!

Ay de mi. My experience might not have been black, but I sure take it seriously, unlike some folks.
 
rockaction said:
There is no official cut-off or demarcation in hip hop between Black Israelites and Five Percenters.
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Maybe not "in hip hop", but in reality there sure as hell is. I've been between them while they're yelling at the top of their lungs enough to know there's quite the difference. For starters one is Christian sect and the other is Muslimish. But I'm sure in 2-5 years they'll be the same thing.


That nursery rhyme is wack and only dorks think copying some eenie meanie stuff is "quotable". Flavor of the Month > Choice is yours.

PS: noone cares.
 
cockroach said:
I've been between them while they're yelling at the top of their lungs enough to know there's quite the difference
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Once again, bringing only your own experience to bear vs. what actually is. Yes, one is Christian and the other Muslim. That said, the right to return and other notions are all very similar. Ever hear the Emo Philips religion joke?

cockroach said:
That nursery rhyme is wack and only dorks think copying some eenie meanie stuff is "quotable". Flavor of the Month > Choice is yours.
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Again, experience and opinion over what actually is. That's the point of the song where everyone I know goes nuts. That the leading hip hop website/clothing line turned it into a t-shirt only speaks to it. Evidence, entered and submitted, greater than personal experience.

cockroach said:
PS: noone cares.
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Sick burn, dude. People do or should care.
 
djmich said:
So what changed?
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Ya got me. It's all very similar. Perhpas it's because Kanye was given a megaphone on Fox News and the leaked stuff doesn't sound so good when mainstream audiences hear it. If Jay-Z were truly as mainstream (or didn't hide his five percenter stuff when around white people) as people think, this already would have been an issue. As it is, we're left with assurances by the news media on the left that this is really just black empowerment and the like.

It's a thorny issue. I've linked to many articles discussing it fairly from both sides before. Nobody listens until Kanye does it, though. But it's representative of a community that looks at its place in America and the world and sees some very different things than the dominant culture does.

These differences should be discussed. Only a matter of time before black nationalism comes to the fore and we're faced with unique dilemmas.
 
rockaction said:
Now Kanye is all news. You think that apple fell far from Jay-Z's tree? OMG. This board is so stupid sometimes. So Jay and Jay Electronica are five percenters with almost actively anti-Semitic lyrics and that's not worthy of threads, yet Kanye's anti-Semitism is worthy of discussion.

Child, please, why am I always two-five years ahead of my time?
Click to expand...


Photo of Kanye West hugging Donald Trump while wearing a MAGA hat

I've said this several times before, with the practical leverage points that Team Blue has ( Big Education, Big Tech, Most of Big Social Media, Hollywood, a large share of Big Finance, most of the MSM, etc, etc), they should have total control over this country.

Except they keep prodding and inciting the Jewish Establishment. Cuomo and De Blasio in NY were particularly egregious about it. Ilhan Omar has created a fracture point that will never be healed. It has created an internal resistance in many critical industries against the leftist narrative.

What's going to happen is the Jewish Establishment won't be happy with what West and later Trump said. However the disparity in outrage is going to piss them off even more.

It was not "politically expedient" for FDR to do anything about the Holocaust. And it's not "politically expedient" to criticize the endless host of other celebrities, high profile African Americans in the public eye and black entertainers/athletes as long as they ride the Team Blue wave but are also antisemitic.
 
GordonGekko said:
rockaction said:
Now Kanye is all news. You think that apple fell far from Jay-Z's tree? OMG. This board is so stupid sometimes. So Jay and Jay Electronica are five percenters with almost actively anti-Semitic lyrics and that's not worthy of threads, yet Kanye's anti-Semitism is worthy of discussion.

Child, please, why am I always two-five years ahead of my time?
Click to expand...


Photo of Kanye West hugging Donald Trump while wearing a MAGA hat

I've said this several times before, with the practical leverage points that Team Blue has ( Big Education, Big Tech, Most of Big Social Media, Hollywood, a large share of Big Finance, most of the MSM, etc, etc), they should have total control over this country.

Except they keep prodding and inciting the Jewish Establishment. Cuomo and De Blasio in NY were particularly egregious about it. Ilhan Omar has created a fracture point that will never be healed. It has created an internal resistance in many critical industries against the leftist narrative.

What's going to happen is the Jewish Establishment won't be happy with what West and later Trump said. However the disparity in outrage is going to piss them off even more.

It was not "politically expedient" for FDR to do anything about the Holocaust. And it's not "politically expedient" to criticize the endless host of other celebrities, high profile African Americans in the public eye and black entertainers/athletes as long as they ride the Team Blue wave but are also antisemitic.
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The Jewish Establishment?

:mellow:

Oh, my, I don't like the phrasing of that. :frown:
 
I don’t pay attention to this, don’t really listen to this music, don’t follow these folks so bear with me, How did Jay Z tell us this?
 
Where is this thread you started where this all happened?

I found a thread from 2021 on this topic but your depiction in the OP of how it went down doesn't match the content of that thread.
 
I’ve started two threads on this. Jay Electronica and in 2019 or 20 about Jay Z. Everyone asked why even bother starting this thread.
 
rockaction said:
I’ve started two threads on this. Jay Electronica and in 2019 or 20 about Jay Z. Everyone asked why even bother starting this thread.
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I’ll ask you directly since it’s your thing - I don’t pay attention to this, don’t really listen to this music, don’t follow these folks so bear with me, How did Jay Z tell us this stuff?
 
TheMagus said:
I found a thread from 2021 on this topic
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What thread was it? Everybody asked "Who cares what some guy I've never heard of thinks?!" That was about the extent of it. I'm not "depicting" it in the OP in any other way.

What the **** are you?

Get off my lawn, son.
 
The General said:
How did Jay Z tell us this stuff?
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Jay Z has talked about "Jews" and "credit" and "finances" a bunch of times in his lyrics, which makes it uncomfortable. He embraces 5 Percenter-ism, which is close to Farrakhan, and is the Muslim sect of a weird black nationalism that claims Israel as rightfully theirs and that current Israelis are historically misplaced in the current Israel. It is argued that those lands belong to a black Muslim state that should be placed there.

It's very complicated, actually, and I don't know it perfectly, but I know Jay-Z has adopted 5 Percenter imagery in his lyrics and in his wardrobe choices. He also pushed Jay Electronica, and admitted Nation Of Islam follower (and therefore Farrakhan) who deals with Farrakhan directly in his sampling and music. It's all a nudge-nudge wink-wink effort at bringing the most anti-Semitic lunacy of Farrakhan to the fore.

The black nationalist movements are generally anti-white and anti-Semitic, since they tend to concern the Middle East and Jews and the right to return of Muslim African-Americans to the holy land.
 
rockaction said:
The General said:
How did Jay Z tell us this stuff?
Click to expand...

Jay Z has talked about "Jews" and "credit" and "finances" a bunch of times in his lyrics, which makes it uncomfortable. He embraces 5 Percenter-ism, which is close to Farrakhan, and is the Muslim sect of a weird black nationalism that claims Israel as rightfully theirs and that current Israelis are historically misplaced in the current Israel. It is argued that those lands belong to a black Muslim state that should be placed there.

It's very complicated, actually, and I don't know it perfectly, but I know Jay-Z has adopted 5 Percenter imagery in his lyrics and in his wardrobe choices. He also pushed Jay Electronica, and admitted Nation Of Islam follower (and therefore Farrakhan) who deals with Farrakhan directly in his sampling and music. It's all a nudge-nudge wink-wink effort at bringing the most anti-Semitic lunacy of Farrakhan to the fore.

The black nationalist movements are generally anti-white and anti-Semitic, since they tend to concern the Middle East and Jews and the right to return of Muslim African-Americans to the holy land.
Click to expand...
I think doing this through lyrics is what allows this to have not become a thing.

First, it’s art so people get some artistic license there and second many people simply don’t see it or know what they are talking about when it’s in a song. I don’t know what any of these means to be honest and have barely heard any of these terms.

In any case it is interesting.
 
rockaction said:
TheMagus said:
I found a thread from 2021 on this topic
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What thread was it? Everybody asked "Who cares what some guy I've never heard of thinks?!" That was about the extent of it. I'm not "depicting" it in the OP in any other way.

What the **** are you?

Get off my lawn, son.
Click to expand...

This thread?

Media Silence About Hip Hop, Five Percenters, Farrakhan, and Anti-Semitism. Where Are You, Wu? Plus, Some Personal Musings

Recently, Jay Electronica made news for tweeting out blatantly anti-Semitic stuff from the teachings of Louis Farrakhan. Nick Cannon, Wiley from Britain, and others have been right alongside him in their views on Jews and Judaism. Claiming that they are the rightful sons and descendants of...
forums.footballguys.com forums.footballguys.com

I mean I don't know but reading that very short thread everyone was pretty civil by PSF standards and mostly agreeing with you that there was hypocrisy in the MSM (even the libs). I don't see any "grilling." I think you started the thread expecting backlash that never happened inferring from your original comments there. I see one or two posters saying they don't know who Jay Electronica is (note: I don't either. old white guy here). I just don't feel that the contents of that thread mirror your description of it here. :shrug:Unless it is someone I have on ignore, I didn't see anyone giving you a hard time for starting the thread last year.

You just called this board stupid and seemed to be railing against some sort of hypocrisy here so I went looking for the thread you were talking about. I found it hard to believe that a bunch of left-leaning posters here would be defending anti-Semitism of certain rappers.

Also, are you OK?
 
Actually, I just went back and read the thread. Everything from "I don't care," "I don't know who it is" to being accused of "Suckerism." I was getting grilled in that thread less than the 2019 thread I took out about Jay-Z.

All I'm saying is we have a problem with black nationalists and Jews. Always been a problem, continues to be and rears its head in the weirdest of places at times.
 
TheMagus said:
You just called this board stupid
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I simply said it was stupid "sometimes." I wouldn't post here if I felt that the whole board or exercise was stupid. I remembered it worse than it was -- I think the first one about Jay-Z was a lot more caustic. I was lambasted in that thread before when bringing up rap and anti-Semitism. By admission, this one was more tame than the other. Or at least my memory.

Anyway, I wasn't being harsh before. Just couldn't believe that stuff I'd posted three years ago was becoming mainstream news fodder about Kanye West because of a leaked tape from Tucker. I think it's just odd that people were calling me a "sucker" for posting about stuff like this, though the person who called me susceptible to Suckerism™, is now deceased and was and is one of my favorite people on the board.

So it's a little more complicated than I first remembered, but not too far from the truth that people were bewildered why I considered it a topic.
 
Actually, I'm reading threads on the first page and it seems the tactic of asking "Who is this? Why are they important?" are ways of excoriating the poster who posted the information/kerfuffle/situation and paint the matter as a subject beneath discussion. What is ironic in this case is that it wasn't good enough for discussion back in 2021 but ever since Kanye's leaked tape, it's become worthy of comment and mention.

That "Who is this? Why should I care?" happened in that thread I mentioned a bunch. It's a way of deflecting a larger, more uncomfortable point through the means of sea lioning the entire subject or questioning the whole topic of its worthiness. It's another tactic I'm seeing, much like the way "Why Do You Care?™" became a tactic to deflect the point and hijack the speaker and his or her point by interjecting that something was inherently wrong with either the speaker's state of inquisitiveness or with the topic itself.

For example: Eight guys got together and claimed polyamorous relationships in order to avoid rent raises because relationships can't be subject to raises via law X or jurisprudential decision Y. Somebody brings up the story as a relevant topic, a topic worthy of discussion. He or she is met with "Why do you care about law X or decision Y? What's it to you?" It's a way of deflecting the obvious policy discussion with an ad hominem question. Now, I've been apprised some people genuinely are confused why. That's fine. Get it out of the way after one question and move on to the subject. Anything more than that is badgering the speaker and not moving substantively, which happens often. Usually, in practice, there's an avalanche of "Why do you care?™" until the speaker is totally sidetracked.

So goes the "I've never heard of that person? Why do I care what he or she says?™" when the issue at hand is obvious and begging for substantive comment. Instead, we get a "Why do you care?™" type of question designed to stunt the point being made. Granted, at times it's more than a valid question, but it seems like the way in which these threads work is to ask "Who is this? So what about what he or she says?" and then others chime with the same lack of knowledge about the person in question to marginalize the topic itself. It's common, and happens all the time on this board.

There are several practitioners of this, who will remain nameless, but they happen to appear in almost all threads like this with a declaration of innocence about knowledge of the person, and that therefore, the topic is suspect. Now I've said my two cents.

That, I guess, is what's wrong with me. Similar tactics, different topics.
 
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rockaction said:
So goes the "I've never heard of that person? Why do I care what he or she says?™" when the issue at hand is obvious and begging for substantive comment. Instead, we get a "Why do you care?™" type of question designed to stunt the point being made. Granted, at times it's more than a valid question, but it seems like the way in which these threads work is to ask "Who is this? So what about what he or she says?" and then others chime with the same lack of knowledge about the person in question to marginalize the topic itself. It's common, and happens all the time on this board.

There are several practitioners of this, who will remain nameless, but they happen to appear in almost all threads like this with a declaration of innocence about knowledge of the person, and that therefore, the topic is suspect. Now I've said my two cents.
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Use the Report Button, when warranted.

It's the simplest answer.
 
rockaction said:
but I know Jay-Z has adopted 5 Percenter imagery in his lyrics and in his wardrobe choices. He also pushed Jay Electronica
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I thought Jay Z/Jay Electronica were the same guy. I know who Jay Z is but not familiar with his music. Never heard of the other guy.
 
HellToupee said:
I thought Jay Z/Jay Electronica were the same guy
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Yep, different guys. Jay Electronica is much more outspoken about his involvement in the Nation Of Islam. He was nominated for a Grammy in 2020 or '21. It was an album that had speeches by Farrakhan interspersed throughout. His production and rapping is top-notch, but one wonders about his sociopolitical subject matter.
 
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