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If Aaron Rodgers chokes away the NFC title game.. (1 Viewer)

Gachi

Footballguy
..would you think less of him? The Packers look absolutely unstoppable now, and I expect them to make it to the super bowl but there is always a chance that they could loose to the bears. Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.'

Would you consider Rodgers a 'choker' if he has a terrible game against the bears?

 
That would make it 3 good games and one poor game against a top defense. Hardly enough to call anyone a "choker".

 
..would you think less of him? The Packers look absolutely unstoppable now, and I expect them to make it to the super bowl but there is always a chance that they could loose to the bears. Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.' Would you consider Rodgers a 'choker' if he has a terrible game against the bears?
FYI - Mcnabb completed a pass on 4th and 26 in the playoffs - I don't consider him a choker. Manning's poor post season record has more to do with the fact that he has lead many teams into the post season that probably didn't even deserve to be there by virtue of his incredible regular season play. His QB rating in post season games is actually higher than Tom Brady's (at least it was coming into these playoffs - I haven't seen updates playoff stats for the two). I don't consider him a choker either.Aaron Rodgers has the highest QB rating of any QB left in these playoffs - and his team made it to the pllayoffs despite over a dozen players on IR. They are on the road in an outdoor stadium with one of the worst playing surfaces in the league and play against the #2 seed in the NFC, who happen to have a top 5 defense. Do I have to go on as to why this question is ludicrous?Even as a Bear fan, there is no way you can in any way quesion Rodgers' ability or his preformance in the post season. IF GB loses, there maybe quite few fingers pointed - but no intelligent ones will be pointed at the GB QB.
 
Is it choking if you are not supposed to win? Not IMO...
The Packers are favored by 3.5 in this game and it is in Chicago. So while I agree with your sentiment, the Packers are most assuredly supposed to win, at least according to Vegas.But as said before one game does not make a choker. Against the Bears this year, Rodgers has had two solid games, the lesser of which they won. I expect he will have another solid game.
 
Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.'
Manning isn't 9-10 and McNabb isn't 1-4...their teams are.
 
The Packers are favored by 3.5 in this game and it is in Chicago. So while I agree with your sentiment, the Packers are most assuredly supposed to win, at least according to Vegas.
3.5 really isn't that big of a spread. Jets were getting 9 & Seahawks were getting 9 & 10 in their two games. Location means nothing, that is worked into the spread.
 
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The Packers aren't expected to win. Vegas is setting the line in a way so money will fall on both sides. Gamblers are betting Packers, especially after they've played in these playoffs.

Rodgers is too young to be labeled anything but successful. If we're still wondering when they'll reach a Super Bowl a few years from now, he'll have some labels that fit by then.

 
The Bears play the packers tough every time. I would not consider rodgers a choker if he loses to the Bears this week.

 
This just in....the Bears have a pretty good defense. No way is he a choker if the Pack lose this weekend.

 
No way. Most divisional games are major battles anyway. This particular game happens to be for the NFC Championship between two of the NFLs most storied franchises. It's going to be a BATTLE. I wouldn't think he's a choker no matter what happens in this game, same goes for Cutler.

 
The Packers are favored by 3.5 in this game and it is in Chicago. So while I agree with your sentiment, the Packers are most assuredly supposed to win, at least according to Vegas.
3.5 really isn't that big of a spread. Jets were getting 9 & Seahawks were getting 9 & 10 in their two games. Location means nothing, that is worked into the spread.
Location certainly means something. The spread would be at least 6.5 in favor of the Packers if it were in GB. You are right, 3.5 is not that big of a spread at all (and this spread should not be large given the teams history against each other) but to say that the Packers are not expected to win is silly when they are favored on the road.None of that matters for this thread though, since it still would not make Rodgers and less great if they were to lose. He has a lot of years to show what he is made of from that perspective and this would just be one of the first few of what I imagine to be many opportunities.
 
The fact that Rodgers has managed to get this far already minus his top pass catching target (Finley) and his top RB option for almost the entire season speaks well about his talent.

Choker? They are lucky to still be alive, and he was lights out against the #1 team in the NFC...

 
MDSkinner said:
Leroy Hoard said:
MDSkinner said:
The Packers are favored by 3.5 in this game and it is in Chicago. So while I agree with your sentiment, the Packers are most assuredly supposed to win, at least according to Vegas.
3.5 really isn't that big of a spread.Jets were getting 9 & Seahawks were getting 9 & 10 in their two games. Location means nothing, that is worked into the spread.
Location certainly means something. The spread would be at least 6.5 in favor of the Packers if it were in GB. You are right, 3.5 is not that big of a spread at all (and this spread should not be large given the teams history against each other) but to say that the Packers are not expected to win is silly when they are favored on the road.

None of that matters for this thread though, since it still would not make Rodgers and less great if they were to lose. He has a lot of years to show what he is made of from that perspective and this would just be one of the first few of what I imagine to be many opportunities.
But it's NOT. Or do you QBs to win at the same rate on the road as home?3.5 favorites win at the same rate whether they are at home or away.

 
But it's NOT. Or do you QBs to win at the same rate on the road as home?

3.5 favorites win at the same rate whether they are at home or away.
I agree with the bolded even though I have not seen the stats to prove that out. My suggesetion is that Location most definitely has impact on what the spread will be.To the point of this thread, all I was saying is that according to the spread he (and the Packers) are expected to win. Are you saying that is not true?

 
But it's NOT. Or do you QBs to win at the same rate on the road as home?

3.5 favorites win at the same rate whether they are at home or away.
I agree with the bolded even though I have not seen the stats to prove that out. My suggesetion is that Location most definitely has impact on what the spread will be.To the point of this thread, all I was saying is that according to the spread he (and the Packers) are expected to win. Are you saying that is not true?
I think most people consider it a huge jump from "more likely to win than to lose" to "expected to win." Expected to win implies that it would be quite surprising if they lost. Nobody should never be surprised if a 3.5 point favorite loses. I'm guessing it happens around 40% of the time. I can't see the money line on the game thanks to my work filter but I'm guessing the Bears are maybe in the neighborhood of +120.
 
But it's NOT. Or do you QBs to win at the same rate on the road as home?

3.5 favorites win at the same rate whether they are at home or away.
I agree with the bolded even though I have not seen the stats to prove that out. My suggesetion is that Location most definitely has impact on what the spread will be.To the point of this thread, all I was saying is that according to the spread he (and the Packers) are expected to win. Are you saying that is not true?
I think most people consider it a huge jump from "more likely to win than to lose" to "expected to win." Expected to win implies that it would be quite surprising if they lost. Nobody should never be surprised if a 3.5 point favorite loses. I'm guessing it happens around 40% of the time. I can't see the money line on the game thanks to my work filter but I'm guessing the Bears are maybe in the neighborhood of +120.
:confused:
 
But it's NOT. Or do you QBs to win at the same rate on the road as home?

3.5 favorites win at the same rate whether they are at home or away.
I agree with the bolded even though I have not seen the stats to prove that out. My suggesetion is that Location most definitely has impact on what the spread will be.To the point of this thread, all I was saying is that according to the spread he (and the Packers) are expected to win. Are you saying that is not true?
I think most people consider it a huge jump from "more likely to win than to lose" to "expected to win." Expected to win implies that it would be quite surprising if they lost. Nobody should never be surprised if a 3.5 point favorite loses. I'm guessing it happens around 40% of the time. I can't see the money line on the game thanks to my work filter but I'm guessing the Bears are maybe in the neighborhood of +120.
I agree completely. I guess the point is that in this case strictly based on the spread the Bears are more likely to lose and the Packers are more likely to win. I doubt that many would be shocked if it went either way, no disagreement there at all. And from the perspective of what this does to Rodgers spot in history I would suggest absolutely nothing unless he does it a whole bunch more. I just think that it is incorrect to say ( the post that I originally responded to)
Is it choking if you are not supposed to win? Not IMO...
because as per what you even said, he is more likely to win than to lose. That was really the only point I was making and using the spread to show that he is more likely to win.
 
http://blogs.nfl.com/2011/01/17/warner-rod...le=HP_spotlight

NFL Network

Warner: Rodgers is among elite quarterbacks

We were all witness to a high level of quarterback play during the 2010 season. Twenty two 3,000-yard passers. Ten quarterbacks had at least 25 touchdowns. Four with passer ratings of 100.0 or better. These are the reasons why many are calling this the “era of the quarterback.”

The strong quarterback play of Jay Cutler, Aaron Rodgers, Ben Roethlisberger and Mark Sanchez this weekend led their teams to the conference championship round.

Unlock HQ Video HQ video delivered by Akamai

Let’s focus on Rodgers, because his brilliant performance against the Falcons was nearly without precedent and one of the top performances in recent memory. Rodgers is trending right now, leaving many to opine he’s among the elite quarterbacks in the NFL.

Chatting about quarterback play earlier with resident NFL signal caller Kurt Warner, he came way from Rodgers’ most recent performance with a familiar feeling. It reminded him a lot of his own performance from a year ago in the wild-card round against Rodgers.

He’s right. Here are the two stat lines:

Warner: 29-33, 379 yards, 5 TD, 0 INT.

Rodgers: 31-36, 366 yards, 3 TD, 0 INT, rush TD.

Watching Rodgers now, Warner told me he’s developed an appreciation for his game.

“As a guy who has played the position, I appreciate guys who play the position a particular way,” Warner said. “What I love about Rodgers is he’s playing the game great from inside the pocket. He’s dropping back, making his reads, is accurate with his throws and is making good decisions. He’s prototypical. I appreciate guys that play the position the way I believe it has to be played in the NFL to win.”

Unlock HQ Video HQ video delivered by Akamai

So what separates the good quarterbacks from the great quarterbacks? From Warner’s perspective, that divide is among the select few who can make the throws others can’t when the situation is less than ideal. Under pressure. On the move. When you can’t follow through. With defenders in your face.

“To me, the best quarterbacks in this business are the ones who have the ability to throw from different positions,” Warner explained. “Because most guys in this league can throw in a perfect world. You have to be able to make those throws. But where the great ones are separated from everyone else is in their ability to make throws not everyone else can make.

“To me, that’s one of the things that separates Rodgers from so many other people. He doesn’t have to be playing in a perfect world. He can elude pressure, he has the ability to throw with pressure in his face when his feet aren’t set, he can throw when scrambling to the right or left. To me those are things not everyone can be taught, and not everyone can do.”

It’s an interesting take from someone who very recently was doing it himself.

Follow The NFL Network on Twitter @nflnetwork.

 
Gachi said:
..would you think less of him? The Packers look absolutely unstoppable now, and I expect them to make it to the super bowl but there is always a chance that they could loose to the bears. Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.' Would you consider Rodgers a 'choker' if he has a terrible game against the bears?
Yes because he is the only player for the Packers that will be playing on Sunday. 22 vs 1.Gonna be tough!
 
Gachi said:
..would you think less of him? The Packers look absolutely unstoppable now, and I expect them to make it to the super bowl but there is always a chance that they could loose to the bears. Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.' Would you consider Rodgers a 'choker' if he has a terrible game against the bears?
Yes because he is the only player for the Packers that will be playing on Sunday. 22 vs 1.Gonna be tough!
I'm thinking maybe this was the OP's point. Sort of ripping on the simple-minded fans who consider Manning and McNabb to be chokers despite their decent postseason numbers. Or maybe I'm giving him too much credit.
 
wadegarrett said:
Gachi said:
Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.'
Manning isn't 9-10 and McNabb isn't 1-4...their teams are.
:goodposting: It's hilarious to me that people keep touting QB's records like they have anything to do with how the other teams Offense or their own Defense plays.In Baseball a pitcher CAN affect how the other teams Offense does, in football he CANNOT.TEAMS win and LOSE games. In baseball, again, a pitcher can win a game nearly by himself.
 
wadegarrett said:
Gachi said:
Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.'
Manning isn't 9-10 and McNabb isn't 1-4...their teams are.
:thumbup: It's hilarious to me that people keep touting QB's records like they have anything to do with how the other teams Offense or their own Defense plays.In Baseball a pitcher CAN affect how the other teams Offense does, in football he CANNOT.TEAMS win and LOSE games. In baseball, again, a pitcher can win a game nearly by himself.
A pitcher also needs:-a good catcher to call the game-a solid defense fielding behind himI don't call that nearly by himself, unless he strikes out all 27 batters.
 
The title specifically says if Rogers chokes away the game ... That is different than Greenbay getting completely outplayed as a team.

If the defense is playing good and the running game is working but Rogers is making bad decisions and bad throws and the packers lose because of this then yes I will think less of him.

But that won't happen

 
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wadegarrett said:
Gachi said:
Players like Peyton Manning, who has a ring but has a lowly 9-10 playoff record and Donovan McNabb who is only 1-4 in conference title games who are referred to as 'chokers.'
Manning isn't 9-10 and McNabb isn't 1-4...their teams are.
:hifive: It's hilarious to me that people keep touting QB's records like they have anything to do with how the other teams Offense or their own Defense plays.

In Baseball a pitcher CAN affect how the other teams Offense does, in football he CANNOT.

TEAMS win and LOSE games. In baseball, again, a pitcher can win a game nearly by himself.
A pitcher also needs:

-a good catcher to call the game

-a solid defense fielding behind him

I don't call that nearly by himself, unless he strikes out all 27 batters.
Exactly. He has the opportunity to do it by himself. In baseball he needs a lot less help than in football to win.
 
DoubleG said:
FYI - Mcnabb completed a pass on 4th and 26 in the playoffs - I don't consider him a choker. Manning's poor post season record has more to do with the fact that he has lead many teams into the post season that probably didn't even deserve to be there by virtue of his incredible regular season play. His QB rating in post season games is actually higher than Tom Brady's (at least it was coming into these playoffs - I haven't seen updates playoff stats for the two). I don't consider him a choker either.
Excellent post. The term "choke" gets bandied around too much, and is typically used by haters who are trying to denigrate a player without even considering the fact that rarely is one player responsible for the outcome of the game. Sometimes players to choke, but it would need to happen regularly as a trend to say one is a choker.
 
gandalas said:
The fact that Rodgers has managed to get this far already minus his top pass catching target (Finley) and his top RB option for almost the entire season speaks well about his talent.

Choker? They are lucky to still be alive, and he was lights out against the #1 team in the NFC...
huh?
 

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