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Is Michael Koenen this years Neil Rackers? (1 Viewer)

All I want to see is some data showing that over the course of a meaningful amount of time, indoor kickers outperform outdoor kickers.
Mike Herman's Kickology
Both field goal percentage and points-per-game were higher in domes over the past five years. What if the numbers are skewed because some of the better kickers (e.g. Vanderjagt & Wilkins) happened to kick in domes during that time? If we look just at the visitors, which provide a broader spectrum of kickers, they also have better numbers in the domes.
:goodposting: Thanks, I had a long post ready to go filled with simple logic (ie Kicking inside is easier than kicking outside, which should be common sense, IMO), but you had to come here and ruin it with stats that prove the point at hand.

Bottom line, kicking an object in a semi-controlled setting (no other variables like wind, rain, etc...) is much easier than kicking an object with the said variables present. NFL teams that play outdoors rrealize this, and one should then expect these teams to have higher quality kickers, which may explain why the stats don't always show that kicking in a dome is easier.

Is hitting a golf ball in sunny Arizona the same as hitting the ball at St. Andrews?

 
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All I want to see is some data showing that over the course of a meaningful amount of time, indoor kickers outperform outdoor kickers.
Mike Herman's Kickology
Both field goal percentage and points-per-game were higher in domes over the past five years. What if the numbers are skewed because some of the better kickers (e.g. Vanderjagt & Wilkins) happened to kick in domes during that time? If we look just at the visitors, which provide a broader spectrum of kickers, they also have better numbers in the domes.
:goodposting: Thanks, I had a long post ready to go filled with simple logic (ie Kicking inside is easier than kicking outside, which should be common sense, IMO), but you had to come here and ruin it with stats that prove the point at hand.

Bottom line, kicking an object in a semi-controlled setting (no other variables like wind, rain, etc...) is much easier than kicking an object with the said variables present. NFL teams that play outdoors rrealize this, and one should then expect these teams to have higher quality kickers, which may explain why the stats don't always show that kicking in a dome is easier.
Hey, I agree with the logic. But I hope you dont make a lot of decisions based on just logic. Those were the stats I wanted to see, and while Im not sure if five years is a large enough sample, I would lean towards yes.

 
All I want to see is some data showing that over the course of a meaningful amount of time, indoor kickers outperform outdoor kickers.
Mike Herman's Kickology
Both field goal percentage and points-per-game were higher in domes over the past five years. What if the numbers are skewed because some of the better kickers (e.g. Vanderjagt & Wilkins) happened to kick in domes during that time? If we look just at the visitors, which provide a broader spectrum of kickers, they also have better numbers in the domes.
:goodposting: Thanks, I had a long post ready to go filled with simple logic (ie Kicking inside is easier than kicking outside, which should be common sense, IMO), but you had to come here and ruin it with stats that prove the point at hand.

Bottom line, kicking an object in a semi-controlled setting (no other variables like wind, rain, etc...) is much easier than kicking an object with the said variables present. NFL teams that play outdoors rrealize this, and one should then expect these teams to have higher quality kickers, which may explain why the stats don't always show that kicking in a dome is easier.

Is hitting a golf ball in sunny Arizona the same as hitting the ball at St. Andrews?
Prove that one to me. ;)
 
All I want to see is some data showing that over the course of a meaningful amount of time, indoor kickers outperform outdoor kickers.
Mike Herman's Kickology
Both field goal percentage and points-per-game were higher in domes over the past five years. What if the numbers are skewed because some of the better kickers (e.g. Vanderjagt & Wilkins) happened to kick in domes during that time? If we look just at the visitors, which provide a broader spectrum of kickers, they also have better numbers in the domes.
:goodposting: Thanks, I had a long post ready to go filled with simple logic (ie Kicking inside is easier than kicking outside, which should be common sense, IMO), but you had to come here and ruin it with stats that prove the point at hand.

Bottom line, kicking an object in a semi-controlled setting (no other variables like wind, rain, etc...) is much easier than kicking an object with the said variables present. NFL teams that play outdoors rrealize this, and one should then expect these teams to have higher quality kickers, which may explain why the stats don't always show that kicking in a dome is easier.

Is hitting a golf ball in sunny Arizona the same as hitting the ball at St. Andrews?
Prove that one to me. ;)
:P :D
 
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This is from NFL.com

Some critical factors to consider in choosing a kicker is how much your league penalizes for missed field goals (NFC teams tried more field goals from 50-plus (58) than AFC teams (34)). Another consideration is which teams play the most games in domes. Weather, especially late in the year, can affect a kicker's performance. That's something to consider when deciding between players from Green Bay and Buffalo versus kickers in Miami and San Diego.

Note: This theory did not hold up in 2005, when four of the top six kickers in field-goal percentage played their home games in outdoor stadiums, including the two best: Cleveland's Phil Dawson and Arizona's Neil Rackers, who now will play his home games in a dome.

 
It's a little easier to kick in a dome, but nothing is so set in stone that you should avoid good kickers in good situations over bad kickers in domes.

Koenan may be a great week 1 waiver wire pickup, or the steal of the draft in Round 15, but he might also be quite bad. I would not drop Wilkins for Koenan...

 
Averages from the last five years:6.6 PPG by the visiting kicker in a dome7.4 PPG by the home kicker in a dome7.0 PPG by the both kickers in a dome6.0 PPG by the visiting kicker in an outdoor stadium6.9 PPG by the home kicker in an outdoor stadium6.4 PPG by the both kickers in an outdoor stadium
Based upon this, we can expect Koenen to have the following advantage over an average non-dome kicker:8 home dome games * .5 = 4 pts2 away dome games * .6 = 1.2 pts6 away non-dome games * -.6 = -3.6 - Not sure what the appropriate benchmark, if any, should be used here.So somewhere between 1.6 and 5.2 pts should be added to Koenen's expected output(not considering kicking conditions) based on his kicking conditions.
 
Averages from the last five years:6.6 PPG by the visiting kicker in a dome7.4 PPG by the home kicker in a dome7.0 PPG by the both kickers in a dome6.0 PPG by the visiting kicker in an outdoor stadium6.9 PPG by the home kicker in an outdoor stadium6.4 PPG by the both kickers in an outdoor stadium
Based upon this, we can expect Koenen to have the following advantage over an average non-dome kicker:8 home dome games * .5 = 4 pts2 away dome games * .6 = 1.2 pts6 away non-dome games * -.6 = -3.6 - Not sure what the appropriate benchmark, if any, should be used here.So somewhere between 1.6 and 5.2 pts should be added to Koenen's expected output(not considering kicking conditions) based on his kicking conditions.
I'd rather take Feely a round earlier.
 
It comes down to opportunity.Rackers was great last year because Arizona had no running game, and stalled consistently just before the red zone.Atlanta has *nowhere* near the same problem.
I'm pretty sure the guy who scored 8 TDs for the Falcons is now in DC.
They still have Vick though, whose slight speed advantage over Kurt Warner might help negate the loss of their goal line back.
 
i always wait on kickers and grab one who plays in a dome. I might as well take this guy late in my money league draft tomorrow and hope for the best, if not...ah-well, make a ww move...it's only a kicker :ph34r:

 
Yeah man I would pick him up if I was you. I thought he would go undrafted in my money league but somebody grabbed him. I dropped Stover for him in another league
As much as I'd like to pluck the "next Rackers" off the waiver wire, I can't bring myself to make this very same move. Our league rosters are very shallow (only 14 players per roster) and Stover was excellent value in the final round.Koenen may turn out to be the better fantasy player in 2006, but I'm sticking with Stover's experienced leg for now.

 
Week 2 Update

Michael Koenen kept his head up and tried to focus. He heard the boos, but while trotting onto the field he was determined to make his fourth field goal attempt on Sunday. "They were booing, but I still have to do my job," Koenen said. That last one, a 40-yarder, sailed wide left for his fourth miss of the day in the Falcons' 14-3 victory over Tampa Bay in the home opener at the Georgia Dome. "All of the kicks felt good," Koenen said. "It wasn't like I was hitting the ball bad or anything like that."

With misses of 30, 36 and a blocked attempt from 30 yards, Koenen's day as the Falcons' triple-threat field goal kicker, punter and kickoff specialist might be numbered. His kickoffs were fine. He averaged 42.5 yards on two punts. But a team trying to rebound from an 8-8 season and return to Super Bowl contender status is going to need some field goals along the way. In the season opener at Carolina, Koenen made two of four field goals.

"It's been an issue," special teams coach Joe DeCamillis said. "We were concerned about that situation coming in. Now we've got to look at it and see which way we are going to go." It was frustrating for the Falcons, who whipped Tampa Bay up and down the field but could not score any points to show for their domination. "It is an issue that we are not going to disregard," Falcons coach Jim Mora said. "But I feel very confident that we have the people in place to rectify that situation, between Joe, [assistant special teams coach] Steve Hoffman and Michael Koenen." Koenen, who was mainly the team's punter last season, won the field goal job by making 8-of-8 during the exhibition season. "What I'm hoping is that we don't judge it all on one game," DeCamillis said. "He's a young guy just like any other player. He had a bad game. Hopefully he can come back from that and rebound, but again that's going to a team decision that we're going to have to make."

Koenen didn't get much help from his snapper. Boone Stutz was erratic, missing his spot on at least two of the misses. "He had some low snaps on field goal placements, even on punts," DeCamillis said. "He's just a young kid that has to pick it up." Stutz accepted some of the blame for Koenen's woes. "I can hit my spots better," Stutz said. "I can make Mike not worry about it."

A downcast Koenen, who was forcing one of those beauty pageant smiles, was philosophical about his misses. "Everybody has a bad day," Koenen said. "If that's my worse day in my life, I've got it pretty good." Koenen's first miss was wide right. The second and fourth were wide left. He said he wasn't trying compensate after pushing the first one slightly to the right. (The third field goal was blocked.) "I just tried to go through my normal routine," Koenen said. "I didn't try to overcompensate. That's one of the things that could really mess you up."
link
 
Falcons coach Jim Mora said Monday that the team is still reviewing options at the field goal kicker position. "There is obvious concern with the kicking game, with the field goal kicking game," Mora said. "That is something that we are evaluating. We have not made any decisions one way or another. I think he's [Koenen] a good kicker," Mora said. "I'm going to stand by that. Some people might not think that's the right thing to do, but I just think that this kid has something to him."

As of Monday afternoon, the Falcons had not contacted two of the top free-agent kickers with NFL experience. Todd Peterson, who made 23 of 25 field goal attempts last season for the Falcons, is available. Also, Paul Edinger, who's kicked for the Vikings and Bears, is a free agent. Peterson's agent, Michael Moye, tried to reach the team. "I left a phone message [sunday] evening and have not heard back," Moye said. "Todd is game-ready and kicking great." Peterson has worked out for the Saints. Edinger worked out for the Packers a few weeks ago and for the Jets last week. "I haven't spoken with them in some time," said Ken Harris, Edinger's agent. "Whatever the decision that Joe DeCamillis makes, I'll certainly respect it, because he's a heck of a special teams coach."
link
 
Falcons coach Jim Mora said Monday that the team is still reviewing options at the field goal kicker position. "There is obvious concern with the kicking game, with the field goal kicking game," Mora said. "That is something that we are evaluating. We have not made any decisions one way or another. I think he's [Koenen] a good kicker," Mora said. "I'm going to stand by that. Some people might not think that's the right thing to do, but I just think that this kid has something to him."

As of Monday afternoon, the Falcons had not contacted two of the top free-agent kickers with NFL experience. Todd Peterson, who made 23 of 25 field goal attempts last season for the Falcons, is available. Also, Paul Edinger, who's kicked for the Vikings and Bears, is a free agent. Peterson's agent, Michael Moye, tried to reach the team. "I left a phone message [sunday] evening and have not heard back," Moye said. "Todd is game-ready and kicking great." Peterson has worked out for the Saints. Edinger worked out for the Packers a few weeks ago and for the Jets last week. "I haven't spoken with them in some time," said Ken Harris, Edinger's agent. "Whatever the decision that Joe DeCamillis makes, I'll certainly respect it, because he's a heck of a special teams coach."
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thanks for the info........i'm sweating this situation out as i've got koenen and janikowski (who's on a bye).....looks like koenen will make it through this week, (hopefully).....i really thought this guy was going to have a heck of a year. maybe he can stick it out through this.....
 
Man I hope they give him one more chance. He is my ace in the hole on my fantasy team. I play him as a PK, but we have PNs too, so I get points for his punts and FGs. Give the kid one more chance. One was blocked and the long snapper didn't help with a pair of low snaps.

 
Guys...I started this thread and was a believer, but after misisng 6 of 8 FGs, I hate to say that I've dropped him. These kinds of things can be psychological to the point where a kicker loses his confidence. I can't afford his misses anymore...

 
Since I'm sending Koenen to the waiver wire, is there such a thing as playing the matchups with kickers? Any team that has a tendency to give up a lot of field goals (i.e. a bad defense but plays solid around the goalline)

I seem to remember the Rams historically giving up a lot of FGs

 
Guys...I started this thread and was a believer, but after misisng 6 of 8 FGs, I hate to say that I've dropped him. These kinds of things can be psychological to the point where a kicker loses his confidence. I can't afford his misses anymore...
I would love to pick up another guy, but there are ZERO kickers left in our league, and our waiver draft is wednesday night.....so i need him to go next weekend during janikowski's bye, or hope they decide on somebody else before wednesday night.... i think they will likely give him another chance....the coaching staff seems to support him and he was money during the preseason.....like you said though, losing those points is tough, even though i won despite him (and having to sit portis and housyourmama)
 
Head coach Jim Mora said the Falcons still haven't decided whether Michael Koenen will work as the field-goal kicker in Week 3. The second-year specialist missed three attempts and had another blocked against Tampa Bay to drop to 2-for-8 this year. Regardless of his fate in that role, Koenen likely would continue handling punts and kickoffs.
link
 
Guys...I started this thread and was a believer, but after misisng 6 of 8 FGs, I hate to say that I've dropped him. These kinds of things can be psychological to the point where a kicker loses his confidence. I can't afford his misses anymore...
I would love to pick up another guy, but there are ZERO kickers left in our league, and our waiver draft is wednesday night.....so i need him to go next weekend during janikowski's bye, or hope they decide on somebody else before wednesday night.... i think they will likely give him another chance....the coaching staff seems to support him and he was money during the preseason.....like you said though, losing those points is tough, even though i won despite him (and having to sit portis and housyourmama)
Watch the SP and the Blogger, or the Atlanta Newspapers for info.See who / if they bring in for tryouts.

 
Guys...I started this thread and was a believer, but after misisng 6 of 8 FGs, I hate to say that I've dropped him. These kinds of things can be psychological to the point where a kicker loses his confidence. I can't afford his misses anymore...
I would love to pick up another guy, but there are ZERO kickers left in our league, and our waiver draft is wednesday night.....so i need him to go next weekend during janikowski's bye, or hope they decide on somebody else before wednesday night.... i think they will likely give him another chance....the coaching staff seems to support him and he was money during the preseason.....like you said though, losing those points is tough, even though i won despite him (and having to sit portis and housyourmama)
Watch the SP and the Blogger, or the Atlanta Newspapers for info.See who / if they bring in for tryouts.
I would be surprised if they didnt bring Edinger in for a workout
 
Wingnut said:
Guys...I started this thread and was a believer, but after misisng 6 of 8 FGs, I hate to say that I've dropped him. These kinds of things can be psychological to the point where a kicker loses his confidence. I can't afford his misses anymore...
I would love to pick up another guy, but there are ZERO kickers left in our league, and our waiver draft is wednesday night.....so i need him to go next weekend during janikowski's bye, or hope they decide on somebody else before wednesday night.... i think they will likely give him another chance....the coaching staff seems to support him and he was money during the preseason.....like you said though, losing those points is tough, even though i won despite him (and having to sit portis and housyourmama)
Watch the SP and the Blogger, or the Atlanta Newspapers for info.See who / if they bring in for tryouts.
I would be surprised if they didnt bring Edinger in for a workout
Well they had 3 in camp this year, he wasn't one of them (Yelk and another).Gramatica?

Todd Peterson?

All possible.

 
Guys...I started this thread and was a believer, but after misisng 6 of 8 FGs, I hate to say that I've dropped him. These kinds of things can be psychological to the point where a kicker loses his confidence. I can't afford his misses anymore...
I would love to pick up another guy, but there are ZERO kickers left in our league, and our waiver draft is wednesday night.....so i need him to go next weekend during janikowski's bye, or hope they decide on somebody else before wednesday night.... i think they will likely give him another chance....the coaching staff seems to support him and he was money during the preseason.....like you said though, losing those points is tough, even though i won despite him (and having to sit portis and housyourmama)
Watch the SP and the Blogger, or the Atlanta Newspapers for info.See who / if they bring in for tryouts.
I would be surprised if they didnt bring Edinger in for a workout
Well they had 3 in camp this year, he wasn't one of them (Yelk and another).Gramatica?

Todd Peterson?

All possible.
Two words.George Blanda.

 

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