Jamal Charles or Kevin Smith "who will be better" ? (1 Viewer)

[theredoz]

Jamal Charles or Kevin Smith who will be a better pro? I know both of these guys are different kind of runners but do you guys think one of these RB are a lot better then the other one. If you were a NFL GM who would you draft for your team? Lets see what everybody thinks about these two guys....

 

[MAC_32]

Kevin Smith, it's not close.

 

[Jason Wood]

Hey Redoz,

I think that's a really difficult question to answer without knowing where each RB is going to land on draft day. That said, you also asked which I would draft were I a G.M. and that would have to be Jamaal Charles. I'm not a huge fan of Kevin Smith; one big year against non-elite competition. He's an upright runner without top end speed. That said, if Smith were to land on a RB starved team (e.g., Houston) and Charles were to land somewhere like St. Louis, obviously I would have to give the nod to Smith over Charles at least near term.

 

[gianmarco]

In a mock I recently participated in, Detroit passed on a RB in round 1 and Kevin Smith was selected there in round 2. I think that would be a perfect landing spot, however unlikely.

 

[switz]

Jamal Charles or Kevin Smith who will be a better pro? I know both of these guys are different kind of runners but do you guys think one of these RB are a lot better then the other one. If you were a NFL GM who would you draft for your team? Lets see what everybody thinks about these two guys....

Kevin Smith is nothing more than backup material. JMall is COP material. Likely Charles will have a longer career and contribute more.Smith, if landing on an RB starved team, may have a shot to play the lead role for a season, a la Dominic Rhodes, but he is not a long term solution at RB and would shortly be replaced.

 

[Almas_4th_Child]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

 

[Jason Wood]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

 

[Almas_4th_Child]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production.Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

 

[Maroney=Speed]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production.Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

K.Smith=Otis Anderson. Jamaal Charles=Lamar Gordon.Nice write by the way.

 

[Penguin]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production.Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

K.Smith=Otis Anderson. Jamaal Charles=Lamar Gordon.Nice write by the way.

Ottis Anderson, good lord!

 

[FBGPoker]

K.Smith short-term

J.Charles long-term

Charles needs a lot more refinement and likely won't contribute much his rookie year while he learns how to play the RB position.

 

[Maroney=Speed]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production.Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

K.Smith=Otis Anderson. Jamaal Charles=Lamar Gordon.Nice write by the way.

Ottis Anderson, good lord!

?, please explain?

 

[gianmarco]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production.

Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

While I'm actually a pretty big Kevin Smith fan, that statement in bold above is NOT true. He did NOT test well at the combine. In fact, that's one of his bigger knocks at this point.

 

[Almas_4th_Child]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production.

Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

While I'm actually a pretty big Kevin Smith fan, that statement in bold above is NOT true. He did NOT test well at the combine. In fact, that's one of his bigger knocks at this point.

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

 

[Maroney=Speed]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production.Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

K.Smith=Otis Anderson. Jamaal Charles=Lamar Gordon.Nice write by the way.

Ottis Anderson, good lord!

This Ottis OJ Anderson. Career Stats Rushing Yards 10,275 Average 4.0 Touchdowns 86

 

[Penguin]

Oh I know who he is, he ran for over 10,000 yards and 80+ TD's. You have very lofty expectations for K.Smith.

Also, it's spelled OTTIS, not Otis, HTH.

 

[gianmarco]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production

Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

While I'm actually a pretty big Kevin Smith fan, that statement in bold above is NOT true. He did NOT test well at the combine. In fact, that's one of his bigger knocks at this point.

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

ETA--Here is the link from the top performers at the combine from NFL.com

Here is the link from nfldraftscout.com also listing 4.53.

Also, even with the combine verticals being off, 14 other RB's had a higher vert than Smith did under the same circumstances. Some had shorter arms too.

 

[Maroney=Speed]

Oh I know who he is, he ran for over 10,000 yards and 80+ TD's. You have very lofty expectations for K.Smith.

Also, it's spelled OTTIS, not Otis, HTH.

I guess others have spelled His name wrong as well. Go here and to just about every site.http://www.walterfootball.com/history.php

But to jump on me, because you can spell it more than one way, is rather FBG.

Look at it for what it's worth, a very good player that He compares too. But again spelling means so much on here.

But knowledge of players means nothing. Ok I'm DONE. Continue to think K.Smith has no game, I'm ok with that.

 

[Maroney=Speed]

Oh I know who he is, he ran for over 10,000 yards and 80+ TD's. You have very lofty expectations for K.Smith.Also, it's spelled OTTIS, not Otis, HTH.

'You have very lofty expectations for K.Smith' Yes I do, I have Him ranked higher than anyone I know.

 

[switz]

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.

4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

Even at his Pro Day he ran a 4.47, and only improved his vert 1.5" to 33.5". That's not a good result, in fact it's one of the worst, especially for his Pro Day.

 

[switz]

Oh I know who he is, he ran for over 10,000 yards and 80+ TD's. You have very lofty expectations for K.Smith.

Also, it's spelled OTTIS, not Otis, HTH.

I guess others have spelled His name wrong as well. Go here and to just about every site.http://www.walterfootball.com/history.php

But to jump on me, because you can spell it more than one way, is rather FBG.

Look at it for what it's worth, a very good player that He compares too. But again spelling means so much on here.

But knowledge of players means nothing. Ok I'm DONE. Continue to think K.Smith has no game, I'm ok with that.

M=S, I really don't see the Anderson comparisons. What about the two of them stands out to you as being similar?Also, I cannot find ANY team in the NFL (not even the RB starved Lions) who project Smith as starting RB material. In an RB rich draft, all the info I have on him is that he's no more than a 4th or 5th round pick. Why are you so high on him?

 

[Maroney=Speed]

Oh I know who he is, he ran for over 10,000 yards and 80+ TD's. You have very lofty expectations for K.Smith.

Also, it's spelled OTTIS, not Otis, HTH.

I guess others have spelled His name wrong as well. Go here and to just about every site.http://www.walterfootball.com/history.php

But to jump on me, because you can spell it more than one way, is rather FBG.

Look at it for what it's worth, a very good player that He compares too. But again spelling means so much on here.

But knowledge of players means nothing. Ok I'm DONE. Continue to think K.Smith has no game, I'm ok with that.

M=S, I really don't see the Anderson comparisons. What about the two of them stands out to you as being similar?Also, I cannot find ANY team in the NFL (not even the RB starved Lions) who project Smith as starting RB material. In an RB rich draft, all the info I have on him is that he's no more than a 4th or 5th round pick. Why are you so high on him?

No way I'm saying He's a Home Run hitter, He's not. He's a guy that can handle the rock 25-30 times a game. On tape He leans forward gets the extra yard or two. He will be a guy you can count on. I see K.Smith going 3rd or 4th round. He will be the surprise of this class.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

What does vertical leap have to being a running back? Are they raising the goal lines next year?

BTW, Kevin Smith averaged 5.5/carry on 27 carries against the Longhorns, so it wasn't all against lesser competition.

 

[gianmarco]

What does vertical leap have to being a running back? Are they raising the goal lines next year?

Apparently it has enough to do with being a RB that NFL scouts decide to include it in their evaluation of talent. If you're really interested in finding out, go search on some posts here, particularly by EBF.40 time, vertical, and broad jump are pretty good indicators on who has the chance to be successful and who doesn't. Great #'s don't necessarily predict who will do well, but not meeting minimal requirements in those 3 do indeed predict pretty well who will not do well.Smith did not meet those criteria and that is definitely something to take note of. Even without raising the goal lines.ETA--As I stated above, I'm a big Kevin Smith fan. I'm actually a UCF alum and paid particular attention to him the past couple years. I argued pretty strongly for him in a previous thread. That being said, I am definitely not going to ignore his poor combine performance as it is not a good indication of success. There are exceptions to every rule, but he's got some odds to beat with those #'s.

 

[Almas_4th_Child]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production

Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

While I'm actually a pretty big Kevin Smith fan, that statement in bold above is NOT true. He did NOT test well at the combine. In fact, that's one of his bigger knocks at this point.

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

ETA--Here is the link from the top performers at the combine from NFL.com

Here is the link from nfldraftscout.com also listing 4.53.

Also, even with the combine verticals being off, 14 other RB's had a higher vert than Smith did under the same circumstances. Some had shorter arms too.

I went to footballsfuture for their combine results and they have him at 4.43.Arm length has no factor in a vertical. If you don't know how they do it. The prospect stands next to the vert with his hands above his head and they make him stretch it out, to adjust how high to put the vertical bar.

 

[Almas_4th_Child]

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.

4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

Even at his Pro Day he ran a 4.47, and only improved his vert 1.5" to 33.5". That's not a good result, in fact it's one of the worst, especially for his Pro Day.

Switz you don't think that some of these tests at the Pro Day are tweaked to help the player? I don't care who it is...you test very hard to do well at the combine. Then a month later you magically add all those inches to your vertical? I don't believe those results.

 

[gianmarco]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production

Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

While I'm actually a pretty big Kevin Smith fan, that statement in bold above is NOT true. He did NOT test well at the combine. In fact, that's one of his bigger knocks at this point.

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

ETA--Here is the link from the top performers at the combine from NFL.com

Here is the link from nfldraftscout.com also listing 4.53.

Also, even with the combine verticals being off, 14 other RB's had a higher vert than Smith did under the same circumstances. Some had shorter arms too.

I went to footballsfuture for their combine results and they have him at 4.43.Arm length has no factor in a vertical. If you don't know how they do it. The prospect stands next to the vert with his hands above his head and they make him stretch it out, to adjust how high to put the vertical bar.

I know arm length has no factor in the vertical. It was a reference to a previous thread that M=S swore that it did. I hope it doesn't start up again, but it may be too late. I apologize in advance.I actually saw a couple sites list Smith has having run a 4.43 as well, but that's not accurate. It was 4.53. I really wish it were 4.43.

 

[gianmarco]

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.

4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

Even at his Pro Day he ran a 4.47, and only improved his vert 1.5" to 33.5". That's not a good result, in fact it's one of the worst, especially for his Pro Day.

Switz you don't think that some of these tests at the Pro Day are tweaked to help the player? I don't care who it is...you test very hard to do well at the combine. Then a month later you magically add all those inches to your vertical? I don't believe those results.

First, the vert #'s this year at the combine, as a group, were very far off from every other year. Noticeably different, as in at leat 2-3 inches. Most of the other guys SUBSTANTIALLY improved their verticals at their pro days. Those have to be taken with a grain of salt, but they are actually much closer to reality than the combine. However, there is nothing much to compare them to each other at that point.However, that being said, Kevin Smith only improved to 33.5, which again, is not very good. The fact that he didn't improve as much as the others is yet another red flag.

 

[Almas_4th_Child]

I think that both will have better NFL careers than many think on this board.

I'm sorry but I can't let this comment go. There are thousands of people on these boards on a given day, suffice to say you can find people who think neither of these guys are going to amount to anything and, no doubt, people who believe both could be NFL studs. So rather than posting a comment that essentially cast aspersions on a big chunk of the board without any tangible justification, how about you quantify what YOU think these guys are capable of and letting the other readers decide how that compares to what this ethereal "many" think.

Fair enough....didn't think someone would get aggressive over it.Kevin Smith may have an upright style and played against poor competition. However, he has an uncanny knack of finding creases and holes. He is awkward but I believe in a good way. He tested well at the combine and is more athletic than people give him credit. He follows his blockers well and has good instincts. I won't give a statistical prediction because much of that depends on team and situation. However, I do believe he will be a successful similiar to Rudi Johnson production

Jamaal Charles is an elite athlete and has all of the tools. However, he will need to develop his first couple of seasons in the NFL. He needs to add some weight and develop his pass blocking skills. That is a downfall of many young RB's and Charles needs to develop that part of his game. However, after that I believe he could be one of the special RB's of this class and the NFL.

While I'm actually a pretty big Kevin Smith fan, that statement in bold above is NOT true. He did NOT test well at the combine. In fact, that's one of his bigger knocks at this point.

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

ETA--Here is the link from the top performers at the combine from NFL.com

Here is the link from nfldraftscout.com also listing 4.53.

Also, even with the combine verticals being off, 14 other RB's had a higher vert than Smith did under the same circumstances. Some had shorter arms too.

I went to footballsfuture for their combine results and they have him at 4.43.Arm length has no factor in a vertical. If you don't know how they do it. The prospect stands next to the vert with his hands above his head and they make him stretch it out, to adjust how high to put the vertical bar.

I know arm length has no factor in the vertical. It was a reference to a previous thread that M=S swore that it did. I hope it doesn't start up again, but it may be too late. I apologize in advance.I actually saw a couple sites list Smith has having run a 4.43 as well, but that's not accurate. It was 4.53. I really wish it were 4.43.

well if it is indeed a 4.53....he will be nothing in the NFL...jkjkI still think he will be a solid RB.

 

[switz]

What does vertical leap have to being a running back? Are they raising the goal lines next year?BTW, Kevin Smith averaged 5.5/carry on 27 carries against the Longhorns, so it wasn't all against lesser competition.

There has been a proven correlation between vert leap, 40, and broad jump and successful NFL RBs. I can't quite remember who posted it, I believe EBF. It does show leg power, which is needed to drive through tacklers, and explode out of cuts.

 

[switz]

Running a 4.43 and a 32 inch vertical at the combine isn't good? Its not like at a guy's pro day in which their vertical is increased by 6 inches b/c of who is testing.

4.43 was good for 6th best 40 time among RB's....that include alridge and chad simpson, etc.

He did not run a 4.43 He ran a 4.53. He wasn't even in the top 10 in terms of times. He wasn't in the top 10 for bench press. He wasn't in the top 10 for vertical. He wasn't in the top 10 for broad jumb. He did not have a good combine.

Even at his Pro Day he ran a 4.47, and only improved his vert 1.5" to 33.5". That's not a good result, in fact it's one of the worst, especially for his Pro Day.

Switz you don't think that some of these tests at the Pro Day are tweaked to help the player? I don't care who it is...you test very hard to do well at the combine. Then a month later you magically add all those inches to your vertical? I don't believe those results.

I'm sure the Pro Days do in general make a player look better. And that is an even greater strike against Smith. His Pro Day was not that much of an improvement. He really just doesn't measure up to the requirements of a great NFL RB.BTW, the arm length thing was a poke at M=S who tried using it as an argument that JStew's vert was more accurate than the others because he has shorter arms. We all had a good laugh.

 

[switz]

However, that being said, Kevin Smith only improved to 33.5, which again, is not very good. The fact that he didn't improve as much as the others is yet another red flag.

Are we allowed to agree on stuff?

 

[gianmarco]

However, that being said, Kevin Smith only improved to 33.5, which again, is not very good. The fact that he didn't improve as much as the others is yet another red flag.

Are we allowed to agree on stuff?

Whenever we do, I usually go back and reevaluate my thinking and whether or not I might be in some form of altered mental state. Luckily, it doesn't happen too often

 

[gianmarco]

EBF post about combine #'s -- Good Read

You'll see why you need to be wary of Kevin Smith there (of course, I still like him too )