FairWarning
Footballguy
I need to find out what is a good job vs a crappy job and how much will they need to get off the couch to work a 40 hour week.
A "good job" is one where you have no experience, no skills but still make 100K+ a year.I need to find out what is a good job vs a crappy job and how much will they need to get off the couch to work a 40 hour week.
Only for the left? What about the other 60 to 70 percent of Americans?I need to find out what is a good job vs a crappy job and how much will they need to get off the couch to work a 40 hour week.
Lol there are a few. Nothing personal.I get the feeling this is a thread because of me.
Im not concerned with them - yet.Only for the left? What about the other 60 to 70 percent of Americans?
I'm already off the couch so what I make works for me.Im not concerned with them - yet.
Don't forget the 40% or so who don't vote.Are you saying there is a different threshold for people on the right not working vs. people on the left?
I see far more excuse making from the left about what can’t be done. I say start with the D run cities, and people say it’s racism.Are you saying there is a different threshold for people on the right not working vs. people on the left?
That is their problem, they only hurt themselves.Don't forget the 40% or so who don't vote.
There are no bad jobs around San Diego.Every November I get a large van, pick up 20 illegal immigrants at the San Diego border, and take them around to vote at several polling places. For this George Soros pays me $500,000 a year. I don’t have to work the rest of the year.
I would call this a good job.
Is it? They get to set on their couches and watch without being called out as part of the problems.That is their problem, they only hurt themselves.
Well, then let's at least put a little context to what I was trying to say. (and to be fair, I think most jobs are crappy - I am not a jobs/career person).Lol there are a few. Nothing personal.
Actually…you have a point. It really is paradise on Earth there.There are no bad jobs around San Diego.
Vs. sitting in an office counting your money and laughing while posting. I'd say you already got that job.Every November I get a large van, pick up 20 illegal immigrants at the San Diego border, and take them around to vote at several polling places. For this George Soros pays me $500,000 a year. I don’t have to work the rest of the year.
I would call this a good job.
I can’t complain but sometimes I still do. Life’s been good to me so far.Vs. sitting in an office counting your money and laughing while posting. I'd say you already got that job.
And to piggy back on this, I believe what he is doing is equating what we are seeing now = UBI.In all seriousness-
@FairWarning’s objection to UBI is why I have my doubts it will ever pass in this country. It’s too much at odds with how we perceive ourselves as a hard working people, you earn what you get, etc. it’s not just capitalism, it’s the whole Protestant ethic thing which is ingrained into so many of us (including many of us who aren’t even Protestant). Having millions of people get paid for doing nothing, not because they’re personally destitute but for purely economic reasons, just does not sit well with many, and not just conservatives either. And it may never.
That being said, automation is threatening to lead us into a situation in which there are more people than jobs. UBI is one logical solution to that problem. If we reject it, we’re gonna need to find others.
I think I heard somewhere (NPR maybe?) that a big part of the labor shortage is baby boomers took COVID as a reason to finally retire. Lots of folks have been holding on way longer than 65 and after getting a year off from COVID, just said " screw it, I'm not going back".Well, then let's at least put a little context to what I was trying to say. (and to be fair, I think most jobs are crappy - I am not a jobs/career person).
We were talking about how everywhere we go, there seems to be hiring signs everywhere. We (I work at a busy fast food restaurant) haven't struggled getting workers ever to this level. We are constantly out of odd product items because the factories are struggling. There are signs up everywhere - restaurants, grocery stores, gas stations, etc.
I also admitted there could be dozens of reasons that this could be - laziness, covid, reaction of being cooped up for a year (people want to enjoy the summer and not work), poor working conditions, on and on.
My point was that we have to have a little bit of honest when we think about the jobs that are open, and that they are pretty crappy jobs where people aren't treated that well, and maybe a year off made people realize that or they were able to structure their expenses/lives so (talking a family here), one of the household didn't have to go back. Dunno.
ETA: in other words, I was pushing back on what I took the tone of your post to being "everybody is just lazy and too busy eating Cheetos".
What do you mean not treated well, like forced to put your face too close to a frying pan?My point was that we have to have a little bit of honest when we think about the jobs that are open, and that they are pretty crappy jobs where people aren't treated that well,
I think people making independent decisions like this is great. And if they can manage their expenses and are happier as a result that is even greater. And if wages rise as a result to get back to an employment equilibrium that is fine (understanding that the cost of living for everyone rises impacting those particularly at the lower end). But if all that is a basis to be unhappy about what others earn, creating envy based unhappiness and wanted to take what others earn so you can enjoy your family or eat more Cheetos...then that is not great.maybe a year off made people realize that or they were able to structure their expenses/lives so (talking a family here), one of the household didn't have to go back. Dunno.
ETA: in other words, I was pushing back on what I took the tone of your post to being "everybody is just lazy and too busy eating Cheetos".
I'm atheist, don't give a #### if you work, just don't take what I earn and complain you don't have enough you cheeto eating hippie.In all seriousness-
@FairWarning’s objection to UBI is why I have my doubts it will ever pass in this country. It’s too much at odds with how we perceive ourselves as a hard working people, you earn what you get, etc. it’s not just capitalism, it’s the whole Protestant ethic thing which is ingrained into so many of us (including many of us who aren’t even Protestant). Having millions of people get paid for doing nothing, not because they’re personally destitute but for purely economic reasons, just does not sit well with many, and not just conservatives either. And it may never.
Agree on automation and continue outsourcing to cheaper labor markets of what have traditionally been not "production" jobs...like accounting. I think the impacts will be big, meaning life, work and standards of living will look a lot different in 50yrs. There's lots of reasons to think that this will create negative impacts, because ALL change does. The obsolescence of the horse and buggy destroyed all the jobs associated with it, along with thousands of others things no longer produced...but are we lamenting that we have automobiles and iphone 18's and the improvement to lives that the progress has created? Its myopic to think of it singularly as this will mean less human jobs. Service sector should have meaningful growth. Cost of living / Living standards, particularly for will continue to crater with automation. The cost of a bananas may go up over time, but I know I can buy 10x the TV for 1/10th the price of 10yrs ago.That being said, automation is threatening to lead us into a situation in which there are more people than jobs. UBI is one logical solution to that problem. If we reject it, we’re gonna need to find others.
Answers from me on the initial question don't seem to be wanted....yet.I think I heard somewhere (NPR maybe?) that a big part of the labor shortage is baby boomers took COVID as a reason to finally retire. Lots of folks have been holding on way longer than 65 and after getting a year off from COVID, just said " screw it, I'm not going back".
I don't have stats to back it up but I do know the elderly have not been retiring like they should for a while now...I think the collapse of 2008 maybe burned up some 401(k)s so they kept going, postponing retirement.
That's got to have an effect.
Makes sense to me. Interestingly it feels like to me I see a lot more elderly working that in the past. Not necessarily a pre/post covid thing and this is all perception based.I think I heard somewhere (NPR maybe?) that a big part of the labor shortage is baby boomers took COVID as a reason to finally retire. Lots of folks have been holding on way longer than 65 and after getting a year off from COVID, just said " screw it, I'm not going back".
I don't have stats to back it up but I do know the elderly have not been retiring like they should for a while now...I think the collapse of 2008 maybe burned up some 401(k)s so they kept going, postponing retirement.
That's got to have an effect.
The supply of workers has changed. The market hasn’t adjusted and conservatives just want to go back to the way it was instead of adjustingI think I heard somewhere (NPR maybe?) that a big part of the labor shortage is baby boomers took COVID as a reason to finally retire. Lots of folks have been holding on way longer than 65 and after getting a year off from COVID, just said " screw it, I'm not going back".
I don't have stats to back it up but I do know the elderly have not been retiring like they should for a while now...I think the collapse of 2008 maybe burned up some 401(k)s so they kept going, postponing retirement.
That's got to have an effect.
I probably missed a bigger discussion on this. What exactly do conservatives want when you say they don't want to adjust? I'd think that a conservative would believe that in the case of a supply shortage wages will adjust up to achieve equilibrium. The equilibrium point may change as well as prices increase and that has a downward impact on demand.The supply of workers has changed. The market hasn’t adjusted and conservatives just want to go back to the way it was instead of adjusting
Scratch "conservatives" and replace with "business owners". Yes, I know there's a lot of overlap but their reluctance to adapt isn't political (imo).The supply of workers has changed. The market hasn’t adjusted and conservatives just want to go back to the way it was instead of adjusting
Ya'll seem to try to be coming to some sort of conclusion that paints some group of people as "not well intended"? Or what exactly is the point?Scratch "conservatives" and replace with "business owners". Yes, I know there's a lot of overlap but their reluctance to adapt isn't political (imo).
I tend to agree with what you're saying here moleculo. It isn't political. However, I HAVE noticed that in "day to day" living where things are progressing and changing, it tends to be "conservatives" who resist that change. The "back in my day" crowd if you will.Scratch "conservatives" and replace with "business owners". Yes, I know there's a lot of overlap but their reluctance to adapt isn't political (imo).The supply of workers has changed. The market hasn’t adjusted and conservatives just want to go back to the way it was instead of adjusting
Not sure what you are referring to with the top. I think my general point is this is supply/demand in action and not inherently political.Ya'll seem to try to be coming to some sort of conclusion that paints some group of people as "not well intended"? Or what exactly is the point?
What are you thoughts on the reluctance of first time homeowners to want to adapt to a 30% increase in the cost of housing?
The last 10 posts are political as they reference "conservative". The dude, commish and you (unless you missed your alot of overlap between business owners and conservatives?)Not sure what you are referring to with the top. I think my general point is this is supply/demand in action and not inherently political.
To part two - not sure how that's related. I understand why first time homeowners don't like prices exploding like they are....whats your point?
Calm down guy. I explicitly said it's NOT political.The last 10 posts are political as they reference "conservative". The dude, commish and you (unless you missed your alot of overlap between business owners and conservatives?)
Part two...is that it should be fairly obvious that business owners won't like increases to costs any more than homebuyers would. Alluding to this being a political resistance to change and progress is silly.
I think a pod I was listening to put it well: a lot of places treat employees like cogs, not people.What do you mean not treated well, like forced to put your face too close to a frying pan?
That sucks. We're those temporary moves to get thru COVID?I think a pod I was listening to put it well: a lot of places treat employees like cogs, not people.
On top of getting #####ed at by customers, places are taking away benefits, increasing hours, etc. on top of that there has been stuff coming out about huge employers tracking movement (Amazon, Wal-Mart) and automating firings.
Where I work, bonuses have been taken away, as have vacations. My wife is a veterinarian, and she doesn't get paid vacations and gets attitude if she does sign off or reminds them she is working 20+ more hours than they agreed on (really effecting her health physically and mentally). Her employer also recently told someone who's husband died and had a doctor note saying she can't work, that they would claim job abandonment is she didn't show up for work.
Stuff like that.
Taking away vacations is the exact opposite of what companies should be doing. Vacation and mental health days are more important than ever in the last year. Employers that do this are so short sighted. I honestly can't believe there are still companies out there that stilly think this way.I think a pod I was listening to put it well: a lot of places treat employees like cogs, not people.
On top of getting #####ed at by customers, places are taking away benefits, increasing hours, etc. on top of that there has been stuff coming out about huge employers tracking movement (Amazon, Wal-Mart) and automating firings.
Where I work, bonuses have been taken away, as have vacations. My wife is a veterinarian, and she doesn't get paid vacations and gets attitude if she does sign off or reminds them she is working 20+ more hours than they agreed on (really effecting her health physically and mentally). Her employer also recently told someone who's husband died and had a doctor note saying she can't work, that they would claim job abandonment is she didn't show up for work.
Stuff like that.
Agree on benefits, particularly for employees below $15/hr (in that it is crappy...holding aside if it is "ok")I think a pod I was listening to put it well: a lot of places treat employees like cogs, not people.
On top of getting #####ed at by customers, places are taking away benefits, increasing hours, etc. on top of that there has been stuff coming out about huge employers tracking movement (Amazon, Wal-Mart) and automating firings.
Where I work, bonuses have been taken away, as have vacations. My wife is a veterinarian, and she doesn't get paid vacations and gets attitude if she does sign off or reminds them she is working 20+ more hours than they agreed on (really effecting her health physically and mentally). Her employer also recently told someone who's husband died and had a doctor note saying she can't work, that they would claim job abandonment is she didn't show up for work.
Stuff like that.
Many are too lazy. I won’t disagree that most jobs are crappy. Some of that is on the worker also. There were a few who had referred to crappy jobs and unemployment was better. I know few sectors that are not hiring.Well, then let's at least put a little context to what I was trying to say. (and to be fair, I think most jobs are crappy - I am not a jobs/career person).
We were talking about how everywhere we go, there seems to be hiring signs everywhere. We (I work at a busy fast food restaurant) haven't struggled getting workers ever to this level. We are constantly out of odd product items because the factories are struggling. There are signs up everywhere - restaurants, grocery stores, gas stations, etc.
I also admitted there could be dozens of reasons that this could be - laziness, covid, reaction of being cooped up for a year (people want to enjoy the summer and not work), poor working conditions, on and on.
My point was that we have to have a little bit of honest when we think about the jobs that are open, and that they are pretty crappy jobs where people aren't treated that well, and maybe a year off made people realize that or they were able to structure their expenses/lives so (talking a family here), one of the household didn't have to go back. Dunno.
ETA: in other words, I was pushing back on what I took the tone of your post to being "everybody is just lazy and too busy eating Cheetos".
Just trying to get a peg on your views. when you say many, what % you talking?Many are too lazy. I won’t disagree that most jobs are crappy. Some of that is on the worker also. There were a few who had referred to crappy jobs and unemployment was better. I know few sectors that are not hiring.
At our store that happened quite a bit ago.That sucks. We're those temporary moves to get thru COVID?
My company cut 401(k) matching last year, and my previous employer implemented a 10% pay cut across the board in 2008. Both of those measures were rescinded after a year - I.e. temporary things to keep afloat.
If these changes were permanent, it's a great time to find a new job.
Why work to be broke?Many are too lazy. I won’t disagree that most jobs are crappy. Some of that is on the worker also. There were a few who had referred to crappy jobs and unemployment was better. I know few sectors that are not hiring.
Can I post on FBGs while at work?I need to find out what is a good job vs a crappy job and how much will they need to get off the couch to work a 40 hour week.
I had plenty of bad jobs in San Diego that also didn't keep up with the cost of living or the real estate market. Part of the reason I ended up leaving.There are no bad jobs around San Diego.
I think there is truth to this, and it gets to my post in the thread about how our purchasing power has dropped, and now more and more people are busting their ### to barely make ends meet. I am sure thereare people thinking like that- why bust my ### to barely make ends meet vs staying at home to barely make ends meet?Why work to be broke?