Joe's Old - Mobile Messaging - Help me understand SMS alternatives (1 Viewer)

[Joe Bryant]

Joe is old question.

I don't understand the excitement over all the mobile messaging apps.

Here's a good breakdown http://www.wired.com/2014/02/ff_messagingwars/

I mean I understand how they work. I have accounts for Kik, Viber and Telegram but rarely use them.

I guess my question is: What is the draw to them over standard SMS texting?

Is it completely a cost thing?

When I want to send a text, the fact that a friend doesn't have a Kik account is a huge drawback. It's much more convenient to just send a regular text.

Can you help me understand the draw? Or is it all about cost?

J

 

[Abraham]

It's about emerging markets where feature phones still have mass adoption and smart phones do not. That's why what's app sold for so much.

It's about having privacy so your parents don't haggle you for texting so much. That's why Kik is so popular.

It's about being able to manage your convetsations and groups and add and delete recepients on a thread. That's why beluga and group.me gained some traction.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

For anyone answering... please include the app Facebook's purchased, 'WhatsApp', in the answer. [big]I don't get it.[/big]

 

[Abraham]

For anyone answering... please include the app Facebook's purchased, 'WhatsApp', in the answer. [big]I don't get it.[/big]

See above. Most people don't have a smart phone.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

feature phones still have mass adoption and smart phones do not. That's why what's app sold for so much.

Could you upack this?

 

[jon_mx]

The real difference is if you communicate overseas. SMS ain't free, while Viber and Whatsapp use data and are free if you have unlimited or a good data plan.

For domestic, i just think the difference is all the little add ons with the emoticons and other stuff you can add to messages.

 

[Abraham]

Furthermore, don't confuse hype or even popularity with utility.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Sorry to be dumb Abraham, but how do you use an app and text without a smart phone?

 

[Abraham]

feature phones still have mass adoption and smart phones do not. That's why what's app sold for so much.

Could you upack this?

Not sure how. China and India - most people with cell phones have feature phones that are capable of data transmission but don't do apps and email, etc. So what's app is able to transmit SMS over data (instead of using expensive text allowances) without the need for a smart phone.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I get the overseas thing. I have a friend in Australia and Viber has replaced for what I would normally SMS text him. But that's the only time I use Viber. For people in the US, SMS text is by far easier as I know they'll receive it and it's so easy.

But surely the huge popularity can't be all about overseas connecting can it?

J

 

[ShaHBucks]

Group messaging is the big deal. If you have a group of friends who don't all share the same brand of phone group messaging is a problem. if you guys all have Kik, for example, you can basically have a private chat room that will do things like store the pictures you share in one place. It's just a luxury.

 

[Abraham]

I get the overseas thing. I have a friend in Australia and Viber has replaced for what I would normally SMS text him. But that's the only time I use Viber. For people in the US, SMS text is by far easier as I know they'll receive it and it's so easy.

But surely the huge popularity can't be all about overseas connecting can it?

J

Uh, yes. That's exactly why they are valued highly. Popularity follows that ("the next billion dollar business") which creates more value, etc.

 

[jon_mx]

I get the overseas thing. I have a friend in Australia and Viber has replaced for what I would normally SMS text him. But that's the only time I use Viber. For people in the US, SMS text is by far easier as I know they'll receive it and it's so easy.

But surely the huge popularity can't be all about overseas connecting can it?

J

the video capability is big too for sexting. That don't work over SMS.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I get the overseas thing. I have a friend in Australia and Viber has replaced for what I would normally SMS text him. But that's the only time I use Viber. For people in the US, SMS text is by far easier as I know they'll receive it and it's so easy.

But surely the huge popularity can't be all about overseas connecting can it?

J

Uh, yes. That's exactly why they are valued highly. Popularity follows that ("the next billion dollar business") which creates more value, etc.

I'm not asking about the value. I'm asking why they're so popular here compared to SMS texting.

Maybe a question is better: "If you're going to send a text type message to a friend in the US, why would you try to use Kik (hoping he has a kik account) compared to sending a simple SMS message?"

J

 

[jon_mx]

SMS is limited. Apps that work over data opens up the door to a lot more possibilities.

 

[Abraham]

I get the overseas thing. I have a friend in Australia and Viber has replaced for what I would normally SMS text him. But that's the only time I use Viber. For people in the US, SMS text is by far easier as I know they'll receive it and it's so easy.

But surely the huge popularity can't be all about overseas connecting can it?

J

Uh, yes. That's exactly why they are valued highly. Popularity follows that ("the next billion dollar business") which creates more value, etc.

Uh, I'm not asking about the value. I'm asking why they're so popular here compared to SMS texting.

J

For starters...Most don't require a phone number, which means teens can use names or nicknames but also means low cost and burner phones can be used.

 

[jon_mx]

I get the overseas thing. I have a friend in Australia and Viber has replaced for what I would normally SMS text him. But that's the only time I use Viber. For people in the US, SMS text is by far easier as I know they'll receive it and it's so easy.

But surely the huge popularity can't be all about overseas connecting can it?

J

Uh, yes. That's exactly why they are valued highly. Popularity follows that ("the next billion dollar business") which creates more value, etc.

Uh, I'm not asking about the value. I'm asking why they're so popular here compared to SMS texting.

J

For starters...Most don't require a phone number, which means teens can use names or nicknames but also means low cost and burner phones can be used.

Or you can use iPads.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I get the overseas thing. I have a friend in Australia and Viber has replaced for what I would normally SMS text him. But that's the only time I use Viber. For people in the US, SMS text is by far easier as I know they'll receive it and it's so easy.

But surely the huge popularity can't be all about overseas connecting can it?

J

Uh, yes. That's exactly why they are valued highly. Popularity follows that ("the next billion dollar business") which creates more value, etc.

Uh, I'm not asking about the value. I'm asking why they're so popular here compared to SMS texting.

J

For starters...Most don't require a phone number, which means teens can use names or nicknames but also means low cost and burner phones can be used.

Maybe a question is better: "If you're going to send a text type message to a friend in the US, why would you try to use Kik (hoping he has a kik account) compared to sending a simple SMS message?"

 

[Otis]

Sometimes I think Joe is being very shuke when he plays coy about something, but this time I'm in agreement. Totally don't understand why I'm supposed to want one of these apps.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Sometimes I think Joe is being very shuke when he plays coy about something, but this time I'm in agreement. Totally don't understand why I'm supposed to want one of these apps.

You guys think I'm smarter than I am. This one really has me

I get it if you're in a developing country and using a prepaid phone or something. What I don't get is why people in the US would have it on their iphone.

Just seems 10x as inconvenient as using SMS.

I get it if SMS isn't available. But that's pretty rare for most people reading this board.

J

 

[jon_mx]

There are still phone companies that charge real money per each text. These 20,000 text show up on phone bills and can be expensive. Now with Kik, parents have zero insight into your online communication.

 

[Abraham]

Sometimes I think Joe is being very shuke when he plays coy about something, but this time I'm in agreement. Totally don't understand why I'm supposed to want one of these apps.

You guys think I'm smarter than I am. This one really has me

I get it if you're in a developing country and using a prepaid phone or something. What I don't get is why people in the US would have it on their iphone.

Just seems 10x as inconvenient as using SMS.

I get it if SMS isn't available. But that's pretty rare for most people reading this board.

J

There are a lot of people on plans with few texts and limited data. Texts use virtually no data. So a teen with 500mb of data and 200 texts can use an app to text a ton.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Sometimes I think Joe is being very shuke when he plays coy about something, but this time I'm in agreement. Totally don't understand why I'm supposed to want one of these apps.

You guys think I'm smarter than I am. This one really has me

I get it if you're in a developing country and using a prepaid phone or something. What I don't get is why people in the US would have it on their iphone.

Just seems 10x as inconvenient as using SMS.

I get it if SMS isn't available. But that's pretty rare for most people reading this board.

J

There are a lot of people on plans with few texts and limited data. Texts use virtually no data. So a teen with 500mb of data and 200 texts can use an app to text a ton.

Thanks. So in the US, it's mostly teens trying to skate around data limits / parents. And then emerging / developing countries for the others?

So for yourself, would you ever use them?

J

 

[Abraham]

Sometimes I think Joe is being very shuke when he plays coy about something, but this time I'm in agreement. Totally don't understand why I'm supposed to want one of these apps.

You guys think I'm smarter than I am. This one really has me

I get it if you're in a developing country and using a prepaid phone or something. What I don't get is why people in the US would have it on their iphone.

Just seems 10x as inconvenient as using SMS.

I get it if SMS isn't available. But that's pretty rare for most people reading this board.

J

There are a lot of people on plans with few texts and limited data. Texts use virtually no data. So a teen with 500mb of data and 200 texts can use an app to text a ton.

Thanks. So in the US, it's mostly teens trying to skate around data limits / parents. And then emerging / developing countries for the others?

So for yourself, would you ever use them?

J

No chance I would use one. 90% of my texts are to my wife and she is a Luddite. It took years to convince her to text in the first place.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Sometimes I think Joe is being very shuke when he plays coy about something, but this time I'm in agreement. Totally don't understand why I'm supposed to want one of these apps.

You guys think I'm smarter than I am. This one really has me

I get it if you're in a developing country and using a prepaid phone or something. What I don't get is why people in the US would have it on their iphone.

Just seems 10x as inconvenient as using SMS.

I get it if SMS isn't available. But that's pretty rare for most people reading this board.

J

There are a lot of people on plans with few texts and limited data. Texts use virtually no data. So a teen with 500mb of data and 200 texts can use an app to text a ton.

Thanks. So in the US, it's mostly teens trying to skate around data limits / parents. And then emerging / developing countries for the others?

So for yourself, would you ever use them?

J

No chance I would use one. 90% of my texts are to my wife and she is a Luddite. It took years to convince her to text in the first place.

Thanks.

I do find this segment fascinating. And I'm always more interested when I see something exploding that I don't really "get" like this.

J

 

[jon_mx]

I never use Kik, but I have used viber, whatsapp, skype, and Line. But I travel overseas some and communicate with people there too. It carries over here and use them for domestic communications.

 

[GoFishTN]

feature phones still have mass adoption and smart phones do not. That's why what's app sold for so much.

Could you upack this?

Not sure how. China and India - most people with cell phones have feature phones that are capable of data transmission but don't do apps and email, etc. So what's app is able to transmit SMS over data (instead of using expensive text allowances) without the need for a smart phone.

TIL What's App has a J2ME version. Wow.

 

[BoltBacker]

Can you help me understand the draw? Or is it all about cost?

For me at least it has nothing to do with cost. It's all about being device agnostic as I move throughout the day. The prices are dropping like crazy on all this hardware and for a few hundred dollars you can have a phone, tablet, and laptop. For people using several different devices I think the apps make managing your communication much easier. Interacting with multiple specialized devices instead of the holy phone will become more common very soon, imo. I know plenty of people that treat their phone like it's an appendage and they go into a panic if they are not within ear shot of their phone. I would hate to depend on any single device like that. Ever.

 

[jon_mx]

feature phones still have mass adoption and smart phones do not. That's why what's app sold for so much.

Could you upack this?

Not sure how. China and India - most people with cell phones have feature phones that are capable of data transmission but don't do apps and email, etc. So what's app is able to transmit SMS over data (instead of using expensive text allowances) without the need for a smart phone.

TIL What's App has a J2ME version. Wow.

Yep...opens up a market to billions of people.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I have used Kik in the past with the same group of friends when we all got tired of...

1) Speed of SMS, especially group texts. Kik shows up instantly on their end whereas a group SMS can often take 20-30 seconds to send and then another 20-30 seconds to be received.

2) Unreliability of SMS. Again, this likely has to do with group texts on Android. They just don't go through sometimes. Something like Kik is not only more reliable, but shows you if/when they received it on the other end.

3) General horribleness of group SMS, especially on Android. This is much better than it was a few builds ago, but it's freaking ridiculous that group texting essentially did not exist on Android until a few months ago. There are still lots of problems with group texts when some of the group is on iOS and some of them on Android.

 

[SpurrierisisGod]

I have used Kik in the past with the same group of friends when we all got tired of...

1) Speed of SMS, especially group texts. Kik shows up instantly on their end whereas a group SMS can often take 20-30 seconds to send and then another 20-30 seconds to be received.

2) Unreliability of SMS. Again, this likely has to do with group texts on Android. They just don't go through sometimes. Something like Kik is not only more reliable, but shows you if/when they received it on the other end.

3) General horribleness of group SMS, especially on Android. This is much better than it was a few builds ago, but it's freaking ridiculous that group texting essentially did not exist on Android until a few months ago. There are still lots of problems with group texts when some of the group is on iOS and some of them on Android.

to number 3

I've been group texting on a droid for over 3 years now. That's why I went android and got rid of my iphone.

I have a 10 year old begging me for an ipod/ipad. His group of friends already know that they don't need a "phone" anymore when they can all get a certain app and chat as much as they want.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I have used Kik in the past with the same group of friends when we all got tired of...

1) Speed of SMS, especially group texts. Kik shows up instantly on their end whereas a group SMS can often take 20-30 seconds to send and then another 20-30 seconds to be received.

2) Unreliability of SMS. Again, this likely has to do with group texts on Android. They just don't go through sometimes. Something like Kik is not only more reliable, but shows you if/when they received it on the other end.

3) General horribleness of group SMS, especially on Android. This is much better than it was a few builds ago, but it's freaking ridiculous that group texting essentially did not exist on Android until a few months ago. There are still lots of problems with group texts when some of the group is on iOS and some of them on Android.

I think this is a big one. And I'm sure some older Android phones still aren't updated to use Messages. It was incredibly annoying to get a group text and only be able to reply to a single individual on Android.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I have used Kik in the past with the same group of friends when we all got tired of...

1) Speed of SMS, especially group texts. Kik shows up instantly on their end whereas a group SMS can often take 20-30 seconds to send and then another 20-30 seconds to be received.

2) Unreliability of SMS. Again, this likely has to do with group texts on Android. They just don't go through sometimes. Something like Kik is not only more reliable, but shows you if/when they received it on the other end.

3) General horribleness of group SMS, especially on Android. This is much better than it was a few builds ago, but it's freaking ridiculous that group texting essentially did not exist on Android until a few months ago. There are still lots of problems with group texts when some of the group is on iOS and some of them on Android.

to number 3I've been group texting on a droid for over 3 years now. That's why I went android and got rid of my iphone.

I have a 10 year old begging me for an ipod/ipad. His group of friends already know that they don't need a "phone" anymore when they can all get a certain app and chat as much as they want.

A lot of Android phones didn't have group messaging. It wasn't a stock Android feature until the last year or so. Some phones did it on their own, but most didn't. I was frustrated when I went from an Atrix 2 to a Galaxy S2 and lost group messaging until the the OS update before KitKat.

 

[Guster]

It's also handy if you're going to be cheating on a significant other. Texts show up on your phone bill, but you can cover your tracks better with an app because it's just all lumped into data usage.

 

[TenTimes]

I haven't used SMS for at least 3-4 years now. I don't have business and whatnot to conduct via SMS, I'm solely a social texter, so it works for me. Google Hangouts is what I and most of my texting circle use, had some trade talks last night with a leage mate via GH last night.

My theory has been that some people have been or will be removing SMS from their cell bills to cut costs, like I have, and the rest will eventually add a free text service to connect with the SMS-less, and eventually we will all be on board with free text services, and nobody will be paying to text anymore.

Like what Skype did for voice.

 

[Gadzooks]

It's also handy if you're going to be cheating on a significant other. Texts show up on your phone bill, but you can cover your tracks better with an app because it's just all lumped into data usage.

You son of a #####!!!!! I knew it!!!!!

 

[johnjohn]

alternative SMS have different features other than texting, for example, one features it has that regular texting doesn't have is you can use it to talk to random people that have the app as well, at least on kik.

Also, like previous posters have said, privacy is a big factor here, especially with the internet, and the potential to meet strangers all the time on it, and perhaps wanting to chat with said stranger on your phone without giving him or her your personal info in case this person turns out to be a psycho.

 

[chauncey]

It's also handy if you're going to be cheating on a significant other. Texts show up on your phone bill, but you can cover your tracks better with an app because it's just all lumped into data usage.

Great advice! I bet it would be harder to have the content of the messages from these apps subpoenaed and used in court too. Verizon has little problem turning over your info if requested, so I hear.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

I don't use Kik (or even know what it is), but I do use Google Voice, which also transmits texts as data rather than SMS.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I haven't used SMS for at least 3-4 years now. I don't have business and whatnot to conduct via SMS, I'm solely a social texter, so it works for me. Google Hangouts is what I and most of my texting circle use, had some trade talks last night with a leage mate via GH last night.

My theory has been that some people have been or will be removing SMS from their cell bills to cut costs, like I have, and the rest will eventually add a free text service to connect with the SMS-less, and eventually we will all be on board with free text services, and nobody will be paying to text anymore.

Like what Skype did for voice.

Doesn't GH send SMSs to non-Android users?

 

[Brony]

If you are trying to send a message to a group of people and trying to avoid texting fees and you know that all recipients have a smartphone, why wouldn't you just use e-mail? #getoffmylawn

 

[jon_mx]

If you are trying to send a message to a group of people and trying to avoid texting fees and you know that all recipients have a smartphone, why wouldn't you just use e-mail? #getoffmylawn

Email is slower and in many cases people don't get instant notification of a message. Group discussions are more efficient with messaging apps

 

[MattFancy]

I never got the excitement over messaging apps. Seems like more of a hassle than anything. Unless you can get all of your friends to use one messaging service, it doesn't seem like it would come in very handy. I just use text to all of my friends. I have Facebook Messenger, but rarely use it. Just seems like texting is easier since EVERYONE has SMS on their phone whether its a smart phone, iPhone, Android, Windows Phone, etc. Can't go wrong with a text.