Low Wonderlic scores ding elite NFL prospects (1 Viewer)

[BigTex]

http://www.profootballweekly.com/2011/03/17/low-wonderlic-scores-ding-elite-nfl-prospects

Posted March 17, 2011 @ 9:01 p.m. ET

By Nolan Nawrocki

Two of the NFL's brightest future stars, LSU CB Patrick Peterson and Georgia WR A.J. Green, registered among the five lowest Wonderlic scores of the 330 participants at this year's Combine.

Peterson was one of four prospects who recorded a dreaded single-digit score, which NFL teams often equate with getting their name right, tying with South Carolina's Chris Culliver for the lowest mark among all defensive backs as both correctly answered only nine questions on the 12-minute, 50-question test.

Green registered the lowest score of all receivers, answering 10 questions correctly.

What does it mean? The Wonderlic test is just a small piece of the evaluation process, designed to gauge the intelligence of prospects. What NFL teams value much more highly is football intelligence — how quickly a player can instinctively read, react and make plays on the field.

"Peterson plays like a low-test guy," one NFL decision maker told PFW on the condition he remain anonymous, "but (if) he's in 'cat' (man-to-man) coverage in the NFL, it's not as big of an issue as it will be for offensive guys."

"He's a press corner," another longtime evaluator said. "His strong suit is that he can run and press. He won't play for the Patriots, where he's disguising coverage after coverage, but I still think he can be a No. 1 shutdown corner."

A scout with deep knowledge of the kid said, "The more I'm around him, the more I love him even more. I love the kid, and I love the talent. But I don't like the way he plays with his back to the ball. He has an instinct issue, and I think it's tied to his mental (ability). He can only handle so much. He's not a quick processor. It's a scary year to be drafting in the top 10 because they all have some issue."

The increasing complexity of NFL offenses creates more pressure for a receiver like Green, but teams are still split about how much of a concern his score is.

"He will get it," one evaluator said. "You're going to have to take it slow with him and let him start at one position and let him learn on the run. He's not going to be able to handle learning all three positions. If you ask him to be an X, Y and Z, you're setting him up for failure."

"A.J. won't reach his full potential," another evaluator said. "It's hard for dumb receivers. I don't know that Julio Jones (who scored a 15, ranking in the bottom 12 among wideouts) will be much better."

A third evaluator said, "You can't cover that guy. He's so difficult to defend. Will it take him some time? It could. That's on the coaches. It's their job not to give him too much. If you overload him, you could have some problems initially, but he's a great kid. He'll work at it. And he'll get it."

Florida OT Carl Johnson produced the worst score among this draft class, registering a 6, and Oklahoma State RB Kendall Hunter was the only other athlete to record a single digit, scoring a 9.

The offensive line and quarterback groups, both expected to score highly given the premium placed on reading defenses and recognizing protection in the NFL, heavily represented the top 10 scores. Alabama QB Greg McElroy registered the top score, correctly answering 43 of the 49 questions he attempted. He was followed by Boston College OT Anthony Castonzo (41), Baylor OG Danny Watkins (40), Wisconsin QB Scott Tolzien (38), Idaho QB Nathan Enderle (38), Central Michigan ILB Nick Bellore (36), Portland State TE Julius Thomas (35), Florida State QB Christian Ponder (35), Michigan OG Steve Schilling (35) and Nebraska CB Prince Amukamara (35).

Although the tests are designed to measure intelligence, many registered NFL player advisers help their clients prepare for the exam, and as a result, the test scores often may be inflated. The Wonderlic company says no tester should improve by more than a handful of points, and any improvement much greater than that should be dismissed.

Castonzo scored a 35 the first time he took the exam last spring, six points lower than he did at the recent Combine; McElroy scored a 32, jumping 11 points, and Enderle a 40, falling two. On the other hand, Watkins scored a 15 the first time he took the exam last spring, so his 25-point improvement will be discarded by NFL teams, which have expressed some concern about his ability to handle playing multiple positions despite having the physical skill set to play anywhere on the line. Bellore scored a 21 the first time he took the test, showing a 15-point improvement. Amukamara, who registered the top score for a cornerback, improved by 21 points from the 14 he recorded last fall, and teams that have interviewed him have said the 14 score is a closer indicator of his intelligence.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Why dismiss a score because they improved from one year to the next? Isn't that what you want? An ability to study a given task and improve?

 

[Stitch]

SEC!! Well, someone had to say it.

 

[Eastwood]

I wonder if the UNC players had their tutors their to help them when they took their wonderlick tests.

 

[The Man With No Name]

In 2009, Nicks got 11 and Harvin got 12.

Hasn't hurt them any.

 

[cdwood]

Rich Eisen scored a 36 a few years ago, he has yet to be drafted.

 

[Donnybrook]

http://www.profootba...e-nfl-prospects

Posted March 17, 2011 @ 9:01 p.m. ET

By Nolan Nawrocki

"He's a press corner," another longtime evaluator said. "His strong suit is that he can run and press. He won't play for the Patriots, where he's disguising coverage after coverage, but I still think he can be a No. 1 shutdown corner."

Whatever. He won't play for the Patriots because they are unlikely to trade up for him. Asante Samuel scored a 10 on the wonderlic and didn't have any trouble playing in the Patriots system.

 

[stugnut]

According to the Wonderlic wiki, a rough IQ conversion is 2 X Wonderlic score + 60. So a score of 9 would give an IQ of 78. Only 5% of the population has an IQ of <75.

Just guessing at random would give, on average, a score of 12.

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

I thought someone on Outside the Lines claimed that Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie could barely read but apparently he got 19 so good for him.

 

[Cipherchris]

Anyone else think that all positions, other than QB try to blow off the Wonderlic? The ones who are unknown usually try hard, but I have a sneaking suspicion top prospects just do what all highschool kids do in their senior year, playing paper football during English exam

 

[Polar Dude]

According to the Wonderlic wiki, a rough IQ conversion is 2 X Wonderlic score + 60. So a score of 9 would give an IQ of 78. Only 5% of the population has an IQ of <75.

Just guessing at random would give, on average, a score of 12.

According to that particular conversion chart, a person would have to score a -5 on the Wonderlic to have an average IQ score of 50.

 

[stugnut]

According to the Wonderlic wiki, a rough IQ conversion is 2 X Wonderlic score + 60. So a score of 9 would give an IQ of 78. Only 5% of the population has an IQ of <75.

Just guessing at random would give, on average, a score of 12.

According to that particular conversion chart, a person would have to score a -5 on the Wonderlic to have an average IQ score of 50.

An average IQ score is 100, not 50.

 

[heidbrink]

Wondering about the Wonderlic, I went to Wiki. Interesting stuff there

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonderlic_Test

This caught my attention:

"While an average football player usually scores around 20 points, Wonderlic, Inc. claims a score of at least 10 points suggests a person is literate."

and this:

average scores for each position are:

* Offensive tackle – 26

* Center – 25

* Quarterback – 24 (Most teams want at least 21 for a quarterback.)[6]

* Guard – 23

* Tight end – 22

* Safety – 19

* Linebacker – 19

* Cornerback – 18

* Wide receiver – 17

* Fullback – 17

* Halfback – 16

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

This really is a farce. This test measures next to nothing in the context of football .

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

"A.J. won't reach his full potential," another evaluator said. "It's hard for dumb receivers."

Wow, that's harsh.

 

[FavreCo]

Right in line with a similarly skilled WR. Charles Rogers. Andre Johnson scored a 14. If Green works his ### off, he can end up like Johnson. If not, say hello to Charles Rogers II. Dumb and rich go together like oil and water.

I'll guess he lasts in the NFL but doesn't put up Andre #'s.

 

[Insein]

Right in line with a similarly skilled WR. Charles Rogers. Andre Johnson scored a 14. If Green works his ### off, he can end up like Johnson. If not, say hello to Charles Rogers II. Dumb and rich go together like oil and water.I'll guess he lasts in the NFL but doesn't put up Andre #'s.

It really is about how hard they want to work at it. A guy can be brilliant but if he's lazy, what does it matter? A guy can bust his ### to make sure he understands things and works hard to overcome them. The NFL rarely has guys become stars on pure talent alone. Randy Moss is the only one I can think of in recent years. Guys that become stars and have staying power are the ones that work their butts off. Wonderlic isn't going to measure that.

 

[MDSkinner]

Right in line with a similarly skilled WR. Charles Rogers. Andre Johnson scored a 14. If Green works his ### off, he can end up like Johnson. If not, say hello to Charles Rogers II. Dumb and rich go together like oil and water.I'll guess he lasts in the NFL but doesn't put up Andre #'s.

It really is about how hard they want to work at it. A guy can be brilliant but if he's lazy, what does it matter? A guy can bust his ### to make sure he understands things and works hard to overcome them. The NFL rarely has guys become stars on pure talent alone. Randy Moss is the only one I can think of in recent years. Guys that become stars and have staying power are the ones that work their butts off. Wonderlic isn't going to measure that.

Wonderlic certainly doesn't measure that directly, no doubt. But I do think that intelligence has a lot to do with how hard a guy works, as does maturity (which is often a sign of intelligence). The Wonderlic is certainly not a direct indicator of intelligence, but it does show how a guy will think quickly on their feet and it can show how much pre-work a guy has put in ahead of time to prepare for the test that they know is coming up. Showing that preparation could certainly be seen as an indicator of how hard a guy is willing to work to perfect his craft. I am a big fan of Green, but I could understand why it might be something that would raise some eyebrows. I don't personally think it should deter teams from him but it would not be unreasonable for them to think a little extra harder because of it.

 

[Da Guru]

Was it Vince Young that scored a 6 on his first test? They coached him up and let him retake it and he scored a 13.

 

[B Maverick]

i read a report that Roddy White scored a 4 on his. How's that working out for him?

 

[FUBAR]

According to the Wonderlic wiki, a rough IQ conversion is 2 X Wonderlic score + 60. So a score of 9 would give an IQ of 78. Only 5% of the population has an IQ of <75.

Just guessing at random would give, on average, a score of 12.

According to that particular conversion chart, a person would have to score a -5 on the Wonderlic to have an average IQ score of 50.

OTOH, the conversion means a score of 20 = 100 IQ. Seems about right.

 

[ROYALWITCHEESE]

Right in line with a similarly skilled WR. Charles Rogers. Andre Johnson scored a 14. If Green works his ### off, he can end up like Johnson. If not, say hello to Charles Rogers II. Dumb and rich go together like oil and water.

I'll guess he lasts in the NFL but doesn't put up Andre #'s.

It really is about how hard they want to work at it. A guy can be brilliant but if he's lazy, what does it matter? A guy can bust his ### to make sure he understands things and works hard to overcome them. The NFL rarely has guys become stars on pure talent alone. Randy Moss is the only one I can think of in recent years. Guys that become stars and have staying power are the ones that work their butts off. Wonderlic isn't going to measure that.

Wonderlic certainly doesn't measure that directly, no doubt. But I do think that intelligence has a lot to do with how hard a guy works, as does maturity (which is often a sign of intelligence). The Wonderlic is certainly not a direct indicator of intelligence, but it does show how a guy will think quickly on their feet and it can show how much pre-work a guy has put in ahead of time to prepare for the test that they know is coming up. Showing that preparation could certainly be seen as an indicator of how hard a guy is willing to work to perfect his craft. I am a big fan of Green, but I could understand why it might be something that would raise some eyebrows. I don't personally think it should deter teams from him but it would not be unreasonable for them to think a little extra harder because of it.

I'm sorry but this statement is just stupid. I know plenty of folks who aren't close to the sharpest tool in the shed. But they bust their asses everyday to take care of their families.Most of the time the smart people don't have to work as hard.

 

[eakfootball]

i read a report that Roddy White scored a 4 on his. How's that working out for him?

That would be like answering 5 of 50 questains right. Its multiple choice right? If so it would take skill to get that low.

 

[pk4239]

i read a report that Roddy White scored a 4 on his. How's that working out for him?

Seems to be the rumor of the week. It took me three pages on a google search to get to this.Agility tests: 4.45 in the 40-yard dash...31 5/8-inch arm length...9 5/8-inch hands...Right-handed...17 Wonderlic score.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/2005draft/White,Roddy-WR-Alabama.htm

 

[MDSkinner]

I'm sorry but this statement is just stupid. I know plenty of folks who aren't close to the sharpest tool in the shed. But they bust their asses everyday to take care of their families.

Most of the time the smart people don't have to work as hard.

I know where you are coming from, but I don't think that is true, particularly at the level of an NFL player. I also think that the bolded statements that you make here are contradictions to one another. I think that anyone who busts their tail in order to take care of their families is absolutely someone I would consider smart. Perhaps smart is subjective here and that you are talking nothing but book smarts? That is possible but I would argue that a person willing to do whatever is necessary to take care of their families is indeed smart, at least in one way.

From the perspective of an NFL player I believe it absolutely requires intelligence to be at the highest level. I have no clue what kind of grades Jerry Rice, Tom Brady or Peyton Manning made, I think that part of what makes them the best is that they are smart enough to understand the level of dedication, preparation and practice that it takes to get to and stay at that level. My guess is that all three were book smart but continued to work hard anyway because they knew that in order to be successful at this level it did not matter how book smart you are if you were not smart enough to put in the effort that it takes to be the best of the best.

JMO. I definitely understand where you are coming from here, I just don't agree.

 

[Demian]

Right in line with a similarly skilled WR. Charles Rogers. Andre Johnson scored a 14. If Green works his ### off, he can end up like Johnson. If not, say hello to Charles Rogers II. Dumb and rich go together like oil and water.

I'll guess he lasts in the NFL but doesn't put up Andre #'s.

You see, it's a jump to conclusions mat!