Mike X vs. Mike Williams TB (1 Viewer)

[The Moz]

IMO by season start BMW will be the feature WR for Seattle as the kid finally gets it , has his old college coach who knows how to use him and motivate him , and a team that beleives in him. He is 6'5 - 235 with incredible hands and big play ability. He was one of the best College WR's I ever saw play. He might not have the 40 time of others but has nice game speed and is able to adjust to the ball almost Fitz like. IMO the year off from football is what set him and his career in a downward spiral. Guy is a stud IF he wants to be - he is a slower Calvin Johnson. By far the best WR Seattle has - he may be listed as #3 but unless he starts hitting mCd'S again I can't see him not beating out Branch soon. Branch is a better slot guy anyway. Seattle might indeed have a bright wr future with BMW and Tate as the future.

Mike Williams TB - would have been IMO drafted as the #2 wr in the draft if not for headcase worries. Guy is a monster talent with speed and extreme big play making ability. Only question is will Freeman be mature enough to be a decent passer and will he have time to throw. It seems in preseason all he does is make plays. Benn is an afterthought right now as MW is already the #1 wr and with little on D and the running game the passing game will be the primary weapon. He has nice size hands and speed of a protypical NFL star.

IMO BMW if he is made the starter and Hass stays healthy might be the sleeper of the year and laugh if you must has 80 - 1250 - 12 potential if used right Mike W TB has maybe 75 - 1100 - 8 potential this year but with more upside IMO.

so who would you take as you Mike Williams late round sleeper

 

[Bri]

Seattle Mike because he's a veteran. I don't exactly plan to not take any Bucs this year, but I haven't in any draft.

There's a combination of bad team and inexperience that usually just sways me away

 

[Traders2001]

Seattle Mike because he's a veteran. I don't exactly plan to not take any Bucs this year, but I haven't in any draft.There's a combination of bad team and inexperience that usually just sways me away

Tampa Wiiliams is WR1 on his team and very talented.Seattle Williams is # 3 - 4 on the Seahwaks and will disappear come week #1..Not even close..

 

[chidoy]

Glad this was brought up....

IMO.. BMW will have the better year.. Even tho he is listed as the #3wr... he is clearly the best wr on the team. If he can't beat out Branch for the #2....... (insert joke here)

I like the TB version too, and I agree TB will be somewhat better this year but I'd rather have a veteran in Hass vs. Freeman (tho I think Freeman will be ok this year). They are just a young team, and I'm not sure I would want to rely on that.

 

[Otis]

Despite all the hype about the rookie, I'll never count on a rookie WR to put up big points. BMW, however, could be surprisingly good. My money's on him.

 

[NorrisB]

Id much rather have the TB one

 

[Tanner9919]

Seattle Mike because he's a veteran. I don't exactly plan to not take any Bucs this year, but I haven't in any draft.

There's a combination of bad team and inexperience that usually just sways me away

Tampa Wiiliams is WR1 on his team and very talented.

Seattle Williams is # 3 - 4 on the Seahwaks and will disappear come week #1..

Not even close..

I understand your point, but...Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

big, BIG difference..

TB Mike Williams hype reminds me of the Marc Boerigter hype of 2002-3, where everyone was gushing over his potential to be a top 10 WR, but it never panned out.

I'm not denying TB Mike Williams has a lot of talent and will probably catch a decent number of balls this season,

but Hakeem Nicks played for a much more pass-happy offense last year, and only recorded 47 recs..breakout rookie WR's are scarce...even Percy Harvin had a so-so rookie season, playing in an offense with a QB enjoying a career year(Favre).

I just don't see the offensively-challenged Bucs producing an 80-catch rookie WR, especially not with Josh Freeman at QB..

I'll put TB's MW stats at 42 recs for 2010..

 

[MrSoup]

Seattle Mike because he's a veteran. I don't exactly plan to not take any Bucs this year, but I haven't in any draft.

There's a combination of bad team and inexperience that usually just sways me away

Tampa Wiiliams is WR1 on his team and very talented.

Seattle Williams is # 3 - 4 on the Seahwaks and will disappear come week #1..

Not even close..

I understand your point, but...Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

big, BIG difference..

TB Mike Williams hype reminds me of the Marc Boerigter hype of 2002-3, where everyone was gushing over his potential to be a top 10 WR, but it never panned out.

I'm not denying TB Mike Williams has a lot of talent and will probably catch a decent number of balls this season,

but Hakeem Nicks played for a much more pass-happy offense last year, and only recorded 47 recs..breakout rookie WR's are scarce...even Percy Harvin had a so-so rookie season, playing in an offense with a QB enjoying a career year(Favre).

I just don't see the offensively-challenged Bucs producing an 80-catch rookie WR, especially not with Josh Freeman at QB..

I'll put TB's MW stats at 42 recs for 2010..

I love Nicks and TB Williams this year....and I just wanted to point out that the Bucs definitely don't have another WR that can catch 100+ balls though, ala Steve Smith. Which leaves the door open for Williams to have a high reception total.

 

[Modog814]

Seattle Mike because he's a veteran. I don't exactly plan to not take any Bucs this year, but I haven't in any draft.

There's a combination of bad team and inexperience that usually just sways me away

Tampa Wiiliams is WR1 on his team and very talented.

Seattle Williams is # 3 - 4 on the Seahwaks and will disappear come week #1..

Not even close..

I understand your point, but...Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

big, BIG difference..

TB Mike Williams hype reminds me of the Marc Boerigter hype of 2002-3, where everyone was gushing over his potential to be a top 10 WR, but it never panned out.

I'm not denying TB Mike Williams has a lot of talent and will probably catch a decent number of balls this season,

but Hakeem Nicks played for a much more pass-happy offense last year, and only recorded 47 recs..breakout rookie WR's are scarce...even Percy Harvin had a so-so rookie season, playing in an offense with a QB enjoying a career year(Favre).

I just don't see the offensively-challenged Bucs producing an 80-catch rookie WR, especially not with Josh Freeman at QB..

I'll put TB's MW stats at 42 recs for 2010..

It's a little unfair to compare TB Mike Williams situation to Nicks and Harvins of last year. The big difference being that Nicks was the 3rd WR to start the year behind S.Smith and Manningham. Harvin was also 3rd behind Rice and Berrian. TB Mike Williams is TB's top reciever going into the year.

That said, I'd want both of them. I think both have upside of 80-1000-8, but I think TB Mike Williams is probably more likely to reach it being that he's currently planned to be on the field all the time, compared to Seattle MW who is currently only coming on in 3 WR sets. But for the price it's going to cost you in the draft, why not grab both?

 

[Steed]

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

 

[Otis]

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

Wrong. People are aware that, historically speaking, rookie WR's don't tend to produce at a high level. As with most rules there are exceptions, but they are rare.

 

[gasFace]

TB Mike by a million miles

 

[Insein]

Seattle Mike because he's a veteran. I don't exactly plan to not take any Bucs this year, but I haven't in any draft.

There's a combination of bad team and inexperience that usually just sways me away

Tampa Wiiliams is WR1 on his team and very talented.

Seattle Williams is # 3 - 4 on the Seahwaks and will disappear come week #1..

Not even close..

I understand your point, but...Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

big, BIG difference..

TB Mike Williams hype reminds me of the Marc Boerigter hype of 2002-3, where everyone was gushing over his potential to be a top 10 WR, but it never panned out.

I'm not denying TB Mike Williams has a lot of talent and will probably catch a decent number of balls this season,

but Hakeem Nicks played for a much more pass-happy offense last year, and only recorded 47 recs..breakout rookie WR's are scarce...even Percy Harvin had a so-so rookie season, playing in an offense with a QB enjoying a career year(Favre).

I just don't see the offensively-challenged Bucs producing an 80-catch rookie WR, especially not with Josh Freeman at QB..

I'll put TB's MW stats at 42 recs for 2010..

I love Nicks and TB Williams this year....and I just wanted to point out that the Bucs definitely don't have another WR that can catch 100+ balls though, ala Steve Smith. Which leaves the door open for Williams to have a high reception total.

What about Stroughter! Sounds like an 80's hair metal band.

 

[JKL]

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

Wrong. People are aware that, historically speaking, rookie WR's don't tend to produce at a high level. As with most rules there are exceptions, but they are rare.

Historically speaking, receivers who are 26 years old and have less than 600 career receiving yards don't tend to produce at a high level. I'm guessing that breakout rookies, while relatively rare, are infinitely more common than breakouts for guys who have done absolutely nothing for the first 5 years of their careers.

 

[ufshowboat]

I love the rookie Mike Williams on TBB. He has the talent, and opportunity. What does the other Mike Williams have? Neither.

Let me first say I don't think either WR will sniff 80 catches. So I think anybody projecting that for either is getting set up for a let down. I could totally see the rookie grabbing 60+ balls though. That's not bad for a rookie and a guy being drafted in the mid to later rounds.

One last thing.... To the people here who say they will never depend on a rookie WR no matter how talented in no matter what situation...... No problem..... But then why would you EVER depend on a WR who has had plenty of opportunity to show he doesn't suck, who peaked in college, is nowhere near the top option on a terrible team w/ Carlson, Tate, Housh, and Branch. What has anybody ever seen in the SEA Mike Williams that would ever make them think he is more talented than that mediocre group of guys on that terrible team? Did he impress you in college against those PAC-10 defenses? Pete Carrol may be in Seattle, but they are not playing against PAC-10 defenses and Seattle is not the USC of the NFL. Give me a break.

 

[Chewbanks]

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

Wrong. People are aware that, historically speaking, rookie WR's don't tend to produce at a high level. As with most rules there are exceptions, but they are rare.

We're also paying attention to the reports that SEA Mike is in shape, motivated, and looks good . . . for the first time ever. Obviously that could fall apart or be fool's gold, and I certainly think the OP's descriptions/comparisons of him are a bit over the top, but there's definitely good or even excellent value with him this year. One thing to remember, big WR's who start don't necessarily need to dominate the receiving stats to be good because they're red zone threats and figure to get more opportunities for TD's.

 

[Multiple Scores]

I love the rookie Mike Williams on TBB. He has the talent, and opportunity. What does the other Mike Williams have? Neither.Let me first say I don't think either WR will sniff 80 catches. So I think anybody projecting that for either is getting set up for a let down. I could totally see the rookie grabbing 60+ balls though. That's not bad for a rookie and a guy being drafted in the mid to later rounds.One last thing.... To the people here who say they will never depend on a rookie WR no matter how talented in no matter what situation...... No problem..... But then why would you EVER depend on a WR who has had plenty of opportunity to show he doesn't suck, who peaked in college, is nowhere near the top option on a terrible team w/ Carlson, Tate, Housh, and Branch. What has anybody ever seen in the SEA Mike Williams that would ever make them think he is more talented than that mediocre group of guys on that terrible team? Did he impress you in college against those PAC-10 defenses? Pete Carrol may be in Seattle, but they are not playing against PAC-10 defenses and Seattle is not the USC of the NFL. Give me a break.

So much anger you have.

 

[39407]

SEA: Houshmandzadeh > Seahawks scrubs

TB: Williams > Bucs scrubs

 

[ufshowboat]

To the OP...

80-1250-12 for Mike Williams (SEA)?

I would be willing to bet anything he doesn't come close to 51 - 629 - 2 (Career numbers is 4 years of playing in the NFL).

 

[benbadman]

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

Wrong. People are aware that, historically speaking, rookie WR's don't tend to produce at a high level. As with most rules there are exceptions, but they are rare.

Really? Rookie WRs can be good WR3/4 types to contribute to your fantasy team.2009

Percy Harvin WR25

Mike Wallace WR28

Hakeem Nicks WR29

Austin Collie WR31

Jeremy Maclin WR40

2008

Eddie Royal WR20

DeSean Jackson WR29

Donnie Avery WR39

2007

Dwayne Bowe WR24

Calvin Johnson WR35 (probably overdrafted in ADP though)

Not to mention alot of 2nd year WRs are blowing up now (instead of the "3rd year breakout" for WRs)

 

[big0mar]

For as bad as Freeman might be, the one thing he does possess is a strong arm. Mike Williams doesn't need him to be efficient, he just needs him to throw some deep balls. The team can be terrible offensively, but that doesn't mean Freeman and Williams won't hook up a lot, especially when they're being blown out.

TB M. Williams alllll day.

 

[ufshowboat]

So if the Seattle Mike Williams hasn't played football since 2007. Does that make him a rookie all over again?

 

[Multiple Scores]

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

Wrong. People are aware that, historically speaking, rookie WR's don't tend to produce at a high level. As with most rules there are exceptions, but they are rare.

Really? Rookie WRs can be good WR3/4 types to contribute to your fantasy team.2009

Percy Harvin WR25

Mike Wallace WR28

Hakeem Nicks WR29

Austin Collie WR31

Jeremy Maclin WR40

2008

Eddie Royal WR20

DeSean Jackson WR29

Donnie Avery WR39

2007

Dwayne Bowe WR24

Calvin Johnson WR35 (probably overdrafted in ADP though)

Not to mention alot of 2nd year WRs are blowing up now (instead of the "3rd year breakout" for WRs)

He said there were exceptions, you missed that, quick to reply you are.

 

[ufshowboat]

He said there were exceptions, you missed that, quick to reply you are.

So the exceptions are the ones that panned out? Come on now.

 

[Multiple Scores]

So if the Seattle Mike Williams hasn't played football since 2007. Does that make him a rookie all over again?

Always in motion is the future. Relax you must.

 

[Banger]

Seattle Mike because he's a veteran. I don't exactly plan to not take any Bucs this year, but I haven't in any draft.

There's a combination of bad team and inexperience that usually just sways me away

Tampa Wiiliams is WR1 on his team and very talented.

Seattle Williams is # 3 - 4 on the Seahwaks and will disappear come week #1..

Not even close..

I understand your point, but...Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

big, BIG difference..

TB Mike Williams hype reminds me of the Marc Boerigter hype of 2002-3, where everyone was gushing over his potential to be a top 10 WR, but it never panned out.

I'm not denying TB Mike Williams has a lot of talent and will probably catch a decent number of balls this season,

but Hakeem Nicks played for a much more pass-happy offense last year, and only recorded 47 recs..breakout rookie WR's are scarce...even Percy Harvin had a so-so rookie season, playing in an offense with a QB enjoying a career year(Favre).

I just don't see the offensively-challenged Bucs producing an 80-catch rookie WR, especially not with Josh Freeman at QB..

I'll put TB's MW stats at 42 recs for 2010..

and Nicks missed the early part of the season with an injury, then he had a broken toe, had to beat out Manningham and had to battle for targets with S. Smith. M. Williams is TB's #1 wr right out of TC, they have no red zone targets and no other decent options. Even though they aren't a pass happy offense, they will be down in the 2nd half of every game and be passing the ball. Give me the TB Williams easily.

 

[ufshowboat]

So if the Seattle Mike Williams hasn't played football since 2007. Does that make him a rookie all over again?

motion must Always Relax in the future. you is.

?

 

[Chewbanks]

So if the Seattle Mike Williams hasn't played football since 2007. Does that make him a rookie all over again?

That's definitely a concern, but no, he's not a rookie. He's at least had the benefit of being in NFL offensive systems and game planning meetings and having faced NFL DB's and defensive schemes. That gives him an advantage. My main concerns with him is that 1) he starts - if he's a non-starter then he's not worth rostering except in the deepest of leagues, and maybe not even then, and 2) he physically hasn't lost his short area quickness or athleticism that he displayed in college. The first criteria looks like it's met, and so far he's looked promising as to the second one especially given his physical fitness which was always a major problem, though I'd like to see more in that regard in real game conditions during the first couple of weeks of the season.

 

[TheDirtyWord]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn't until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

Historically speaking, receivers who are 26 years old and have less than 600 career receiving yards don't tend to produce at a high level. I'm guessing that breakout rookies, while relatively rare, are infinitely more common than breakouts for guys who have done absolutely nothing for the first 5 years of their careers.

IMO, that's what makes this Mike X. situation so unique. I don't know if anyone has watched any Seahawks games this pre-season, but if you did not know Mike X's. back story, you would essentially say "that's the best player on the field for the Seahawks and it's not really close".I don't really mean for this to get into a whose better debate, the question simply asked for the 2010 season and it's possible both breakout. The tidbits I've seen of the TB's Mike Williams have also been impressive along with camp reports. But it seems we're willing to give him more of a chance at success even though just last year, he quit on his team.My suggestion is to do a bit of reserch on Mike X's comeback...there have been plenty of write-ups. What you'll see is a guy who recognized he was blowing it and did not just a career u-turn, but a life u-turn. Is it a reach to expect 80/1200/8? Yes...once the real games start I anticipate it will be tougher for both Mike W's to impress. But the one in Seattle is clearly the most talented WR on that team, and at 6'5 230-235 presents the type of out wide target QB's thirst for. And from a talent perspective, he was the #10 pick in the draft once upon a time after sitting out a season. That hasn't left.

 

[39407]

he was the #10 pick in the draft once upon a time

Which is the biggest reason we are having this discussion at this point.

 

[Banger]

BMW could be a Cedric Benson type reclaimation project, it happens nearly every year. Guys that were busts, completely sucked, etc. get it, get healthy, get in the right situation and all the sudden people wonder where they came from and how they missed them. You have to keep your ears and eyes open and not automatically write off players just becuase they disappointed in the past especially guys with talent that were highly drafted.

 

[Steed]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn't until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

Historically speaking, receivers who are 26 years old and have less than 600 career receiving yards don't tend to produce at a high level. I'm guessing that breakout rookies, while relatively rare, are infinitely more common than breakouts for guys who have done absolutely nothing for the first 5 years of their careers.

IMO, that's what makes this Mike X. situation so unique. I don't know if anyone has watched any Seahawks games this pre-season, but if you did not know Mike X's. back story, you would essentially say "that's the best player on the field for the Seahawks and it's not really close".I don't really mean for this to get into a whose better debate, the question simply asked for the 2010 season and it's possible both breakout. The tidbits I've seen of the TB's Mike Williams have also been impressive along with camp reports. But it seems we're willing to give him more of a chance at success even though just last year, he quit on his team.My suggestion is to do a bit of reserch on Mike X's comeback...there have been plenty of write-ups. What you'll see is a guy who recognized he was blowing it and did not just a career u-turn, but a life u-turn. Is it a reach to expect 80/1200/8? Yes...once the real games start I anticipate it will be tougher for both Mike W's to impress. But the one in Seattle is clearly the most talented WR on that team, and at 6'5 230-235 presents the type of out wide target QB's thirst for. And from a talent perspective, he was the #10 pick in the draft once upon a time after sitting out a season. That hasn't left.

Good post but the Cris Carter comparison is a bit off. He didn't have his 1000 yard season until year 7 but he did have 962 yards one year and 11 TDs another year. His talent was unquestionable, he just was a coke-head. And he never took a year off of football. I think a better comparison would be Antonio Bryant who was a talented knucklehead that took a year off, came back and flourished in Tampa. But I'm still not convinced Mike Williams can play at the NFL level. 350 yards and 1 TD is his best year. My amateur eye tells me he's too slow to succeed, it's that simple to me.

 

[timschochet]

I own them both now. I dumped Kareem Huggins (hope I don't regret it) to add Seattle Mike. My starters are Brandon Marshall and Ocho, and I don't love Ocho at all. So I have added a ton of WRs on the bench: Sims-Walker, Terrell Owens, Jacoby Jones, and both Mike Williams. My hope is that at least one of these guys rises up and allows me to get rid of Ocho.

 

[TheDirtyWord]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they'd rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It's comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn't until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

Historically speaking, receivers who are 26 years old and have less than 600 career receiving yards don't tend to produce at a high level. I'm guessing that breakout rookies, while relatively rare, are infinitely more common than breakouts for guys who have done absolutely nothing for the first 5 years of their careers.

IMO, that's what makes this Mike X. situation so unique. I don't know if anyone has watched any Seahawks games this pre-season, but if you did not know Mike X's. back story, you would essentially say "that's the best player on the field for the Seahawks and it's not really close".I don't really mean for this to get into a whose better debate, the question simply asked for the 2010 season and it's possible both breakout. The tidbits I've seen of the TB's Mike Williams have also been impressive along with camp reports. But it seems we're willing to give him more of a chance at success even though just last year, he quit on his team.My suggestion is to do a bit of reserch on Mike X's comeback...there have been plenty of write-ups. What you'll see is a guy who recognized he was blowing it and did not just a career u-turn, but a life u-turn. Is it a reach to expect 80/1200/8? Yes...once the real games start I anticipate it will be tougher for both Mike W's to impress. But the one in Seattle is clearly the most talented WR on that team, and at 6'5 230-235 presents the type of out wide target QB's thirst for. And from a talent perspective, he was the #10 pick in the draft once upon a time after sitting out a season. That hasn't left.

Good post but the Cris Carter comparison is a bit off. He didn't have his 1000 yard season until year 7 but he did have 962 yards one year and 11 TDs another year. His talent was unquestionable, he just was a coke-head. And he never took a year off of football. I think a better comparison would be Antonio Bryant who was a talented knucklehead that took a year off, came back and flourished in Tampa. But I'm still not convinced Mike Williams can play at the NFL level. 350 yards and 1 TD is his best year. My amateur eye tells me he's too slow to succeed, it's that simple to me.

I too have an amateur eye so I could be pulling a 'Peter King says to draft Danny Wuerffel' here. I don't know if you've watched him this pre-season but I don't see a slow guy. And while the statistical comparison might be off between Carter/Williams, the heart of the comparision really centers around the notion of taking one's career seriously. Carter didn't wake up until about this point in his life (26-27 years old). Once he came to that realization, he became obsessive about his craft. Is Mike X at that point? Can't say because I would need ot see alonger track record that 4 months. But in those 4 months, he's earned back my attention.

 

[Chewbanks]

he was the #10 pick in the draft once upon a time

Which is the biggest reason we are having this discussion at this point.

No, that would have been true three years ago though.

 

[guderian]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they\'d rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It\'s comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn\'t until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

First, finding one exception doesn\'t prove anything. Second, Cris Carter had more yards in his second season alone than BMW's had in the five years since he joined the NFL. BMW has averaged 10 receptions and 125 yards per year since he was drafted.

 

[guderian]

My vote is for Tampa Mike. In 5 fewer years in the NFL he has only 629 fewer yards and 2 less TDs than Seattle Mike. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Tampa Mike exceeds the cumulative stats from Seattle Mike since he was drafted 5 years ago--51 receptions for 629 yards and 2 TDs.

 

[FantasyTrader]

TB Mike by a million miles

SEA Mike and it's not even close.

 

[LittlePhatty]

Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

I'm predicting that Freeman and the TB offense will surprise you this year.And USCeattle will disappoint.

 

[FantasyTrader]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they\'d rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It\'s comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn\'t until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

First, finding one exception doesn\'t prove anything. Second, Cris Carter had more yards in his second season alone than BMW's had in the five years since he joined the NFL. BMW has averaged 10 receptions and 125 yards per year since he was drafted.

Finding an example doesn't disprove it either. Nobody's saying SEA Mike Williams isn't a risk. Dude obviously had a horrible attitude and mindset early in his career. To mail it in so badly you can actually eat your way out of football with so much on the line is pathetic. But he's back to his playing weight for the first time in ever. There is no arguing he has elite talent. He has a coach that (I would suspect) has more than a casual interest in seeing him succeed and he has opportunity. TB Williams has all of the above as well, but he's just getting started on the learning curve. He's going to be an exceptional NFL receiver in time. For this year though, the talent, experience and system all go to SEA Williams.

 

[Multiple Scores]

Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

I'm predicting that Freeman and the TB offense will surprise you this year.And USCeattle will disappoint.

I still think BMW can find some success, not sure which MW I like more for this year, just agree that Freeman will be better than people think and Seattle will disappoint, their line is still awful (Okung is out 6 weeks), the running game is putrid, Carlson at TE and Housh are in the middle somewhere, BMW could fill that WR2 spot cause they don't have one, Branch is not reliable, he's like Bob Sanders, talented but never on the field.

 

[Multiple Scores]

My vote is for Tampa Mike. In 5 fewer years in the NFL he has only 629 fewer yards and 2 less TDs than Seattle Mike. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Tampa Mike exceeds the cumulative stats from Seattle Mike since he was drafted 5 years ago--51 receptions for 629 yards and 2 TDs.

These are the kinds of posts that I listen to, try and follow and then roll my eyes. I do think it's important to base future stats on past stats - to a point. This post is all stats and dangerous thinking IMO.

 

[TheDirtyWord]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they\'d rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It\'s comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn\'t until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

First, finding one exception doesn\'t prove anything. Second, Cris Carter had more yards in his second season alone than BMW's had in the five years since he joined the NFL. BMW has averaged 10 receptions and 125 yards per year since he was drafted.

Overall point: People saying he is a career loser probably have done little to no research on understanding his resurrgence, why it's occurring and what it could mean. To be dismissive of a guy like Mike X. only means you're missing out on a potential buy low opportunity which is what we are all looking out for. If he flames out, you wasted a 14th round pick. If he catches fire and realizes his considerable gifts - well lookey here.If you really think the comparison was so stats related, you missed the point.

 

[guderian]

My vote is for Tampa Mike. In 5 fewer years in the NFL he has only 629 fewer yards and 2 less TDs than Seattle Mike. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Tampa Mike exceeds the cumulative stats from Seattle Mike since he was drafted 5 years ago--51 receptions for 629 yards and 2 TDs.

These are the kinds of posts that I listen to, try and follow and then roll my eyes. I do think it's important to base future stats on past stats - to a point. This post is all stats and dangerous thinking IMO.

It's not directly about stat extrapolation at all. The pro-BMW crowd is touting his experience, talent and noting that rookie WRs don't do much. The fact is that all of the talent and experience of BMW for the past five years wouldn't have totaled a single decent season. It's not like he's been mediocre for the past 5 years and suddenly has a big opportunity. It's not like he had some up-and-down seasons like a Cris Carter before he put it all together. He's done almost nothing over the past five years. We're not talking about bumping up his recent past by, say 50%. No, he'd have to have a 400% increase over his average season to get to 50 receptions--which is certainly doable by a rookie WR. People are saying that he has talent. No. He had talent--5 years ago. Again, I think it's important to keep BMW in context--he's a guy that's done essentially nothing for the past 5 years.

 

[guderian]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they\'d rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It\'s comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn\'t until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

First, finding one exception doesn\'t prove anything. Second, Cris Carter had more yards in his second season alone than BMW's had in the five years since he joined the NFL. BMW has averaged 10 receptions and 125 yards per year since he was drafted.

Overall point: People saying he is a career loser probably have done little to no research on understanding his resurrgence, why it's occurring and what it could mean. To be dismissive of a guy like Mike X. only means you're missing out on a potential buy low opportunity which is what we are all looking out for. If he flames out, you wasted a 14th round pick. If he catches fire and realizes his considerable gifts - well lookey here.If you really think the comparison was so stats related, you missed the point.

I don't think it was stats related at all. I just think it's a bad comparison to compare a guy who had some mediocre seasons before breaking out to a guy that's done almost literally nothing for 5 years. You have to have some work ethic and maturity to even have a mediocre season in the NFL--which Carter proved and Seattle Mike hasn't.

 

[JohnnyU]

TB Mike by a million miles

SEA Mike and it's not even close.

Please don't say "it's not even close". As a group we're trying very hard to quit saying these little irritating phrases

 

[lyon812]

Seattle MW is WR 2-A on his team, has a quality QB in Hass throwing to him, while TB's MW has Josh Freeman..

Freeman was as good as any rookie QB last year. Hasselbeck, unfortunately, looked as good as a rookie starter last year as well and has been up and down this preseason. One's on the upside of his career, one's not.

For as bad as Freeman might be, the one thing he does possess is a strong arm.

Except he isn't bad; he was a first round pick who was has poise, confidence, a strong arm. He was considered very talented, but raw. And we saw that last year. He made a lot of great, intelligent throws, had strong pocket presence, and used his mobility to good advantage. Of course, he also made some bad throws, mostly because of that confidence in his arm. He, and the coaching staff, were unafraid to take shots down the field. This bodes well for Williams.

 

[Multiple Scores]

TB Mike by a million miles

SEA Mike and it's not even close.

Please don't say "it's not even close". As a group we're trying very hard to quit saying these little irritating phrases

You on the staff now?

 

[Righetti]

Despite all the hype about the rookie, I'll never count on a rookie WR to put up big points. BMW, however, could be surprisingly good. My money's on him.

BMW will outperform his draft positionthe Mini Cooper will underpeform relative to his draft position

 

[TheDirtyWord]

Some interesting commentary already in this thread...

People are so afraid of the unkown that they\'d rather cast their lot with a career loser like Mike X. It\'s comical.

You know who was also a career loser like Mike X. at 26 years old? Cris Carter. Drug addled and not taking his career seriously, Carter woke up...but it wasn\'t until his 7th year in the league when he posted his first 1000 yard season when he was 28.

First, finding one exception doesn\'t prove anything. Second, Cris Carter had more yards in his second season alone than BMW's had in the five years since he joined the NFL. BMW has averaged 10 receptions and 125 yards per year since he was drafted.

Overall point: People saying he is a career loser probably have done little to no research on understanding his resurrgence, why it's occurring and what it could mean. To be dismissive of a guy like Mike X. only means you're missing out on a potential buy low opportunity which is what we are all looking out for. If he flames out, you wasted a 14th round pick. If he catches fire and realizes his considerable gifts - well lookey here.If you really think the comparison was so stats related, you missed the point.

I don't think it was stats related at all. I just think it's a bad comparison to compare a guy who had some mediocre seasons before breaking out to a guy that's done almost literally nothing for 5 years. You have to have some work ethic and maturity to even have a mediocre season in the NFL--which Carter proved and Seattle Mike hasn't.

I again disagree here. Cris Carter entered an NFL without a salary cap or free agency. The ability to acquire players (outside of trades) from other teams was extremely rare. With the restrictions around player movement, once you had a guy, you were stuck with him. Carter himself, in one of his on-stage talks at the rookie symposiums, has said that if entered the league in this day and age with the attitude he had and the problems he had, he would have been out.Carter was able to accumulate some level of production not because he had some semblance of work ethic and maturtity but because the time in which he entered the league allowed for him to coast at an underachiever level more than todays NFL would.