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Military coup attempt in Turkey (1 Viewer)

lakerstan said:
I'm guessing the list of judges and others was written long before this coup attempt.
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I'm thinking Erdogen actually forced the coup -  kind of what happened once in China where the government got a list of all the resistance members, so they knew they had to revolt or die. Except there, they won.

 
Round up the enemies of the State. No one will question purging those who would topple democracy. Power to the people. 

 
This is such a weird story.

First off it seemed like everyone was supporting Erdogan and against the coup, from all the governments, to ISIS.

Second, he's blaming the US and some 77-year old in Pennsylvania.

Third, 2,000 judges are stripped of their jobs?

I have no idea what any of this means.

 
shader said:
This is such a weird story.

First off it seemed like everyone was supporting Erdogan and against the coup, from all the governments, to ISIS.

Second, he's blaming the US and some 77-year old in Pennsylvania.

Third, 2,000 judges are stripped of their jobs?

I have no idea what any of this means.
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I'm starting to believe the Erdogen did this himself camp

 
James Daulton said:
Irrelevant, non-economic powers can not force WW3.  Only us, the Russians, and Chinese could force WW3. And the Russians only could because of their nukes and standing army.
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Yeah. When has a World War ever started in a relatively insignificant corner of Eastern Europe and or the Middle East?

 
A long history of Turkish coups from The Atlantic:

"News of a coup in Turkey came as a surprise to the world, but not as great a surprise as it might have been in some countries. In the second half of the 20th century, the nation fell into a pattern of semi-regular military coups, and by that rhythm, it was in fact overdue. Previous coups came in in 1960, 1971, 1980, and 1997, so that the 19-year gap between the last uprising and today was notably long.

Modern Turkey was founded by Mustafa Kemal, a general in the Turkish Army who was later formally granted the surname “Ataturk,” or father of the Turks. Ataturk set about an aggressive program of modernizing and “Westernizing” the country, pushing religion to the margins, banning certain apparel like headscarves and fezes, and converting Turkish from Arabic to Latin script. But that secularism has always remained tenuous. Many Turks, especially rural ones, are religious, and not all of the reforms have remained popular.

The military has long seen its role as safeguarding Ataturk’s secularist agenda, and when it worries the government is shifting too far away, it has tended to take action. The first coup, in 1960, was a response to two currents: Prime Minister Adnan Menderes was both making overtures to Moscow and opening up to religion, reopening shuttered mosques, allowing the call to prayer to be sung in Arabic and more. A few dozen officers launched a coup in May 1960. Menderes was executed the following year after being convicted of violating the constitution.

The military relinquished control to civilians in 1965, when Süleyman Demirel was elected. But by 1971, growing unrest had emboldened Islamists, and the military again stepped in. This time, it did not launch tanks but instead delivered an ultimatum to Demirel, demanding “the formation, within the context of democratic principles, of a strong and credible government, which will neutralize the current anarchical situation and which, inspired by Atatürk's views, will implement the reformist laws envisaged by the constitution.” Demirel resigned; the military did not directly take control.

Nine years later, amid continued instability, the military again intervened, this time seizing power and holding it for three years. There followed a period of relative political stability. But in 1997, generals decided to depose Prime Minister Necmettin Erbakan, the head of an Islamist party. The military again enacted a coup by memo, forcing Erbakan’s resignation and banning him from politics.

Turkey has thus occupied a strange position in world politics: Although it is prone to coups d’etat, Western governments have often cheered the coups on, with varying degrees of enthusiasm, because they are in the service of a secular agenda. Periodic deposition of democratically leaders has, somewhat paradoxically, been treated as a small price to pay for ensuring liberalism.

Already, some analysts are shruggingly embracing the latest coup as a way to rid the country of the increasingly autocratic President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. But what is not clear yet in the latest coup is whether it fits the same pattern of secular Kemalists clamping down on Islamism. There is speculation that the coup’s leaders may in fact be loyal to Fethullah Gulen, an enigmatic Muslim leader who’s currently in exile in Pennsylvania—that’s certainly what Erdogan claimed in his FaceTime address to the nation. Gulen is a former Erdogan ally who was essential to his rise, but the men have since broken. Whether Western leaders would be as eager to embrace a Gulenist coup as a Kemalist coup is unclear, though concerns about how Turkish instability could affect the civil war in Syria might render that question irrelevant: For outsiders, any leaders—whether Gulenist or Kemalist—may be preferable to ISIS."

 
shader said:
This is such a weird story.

First off it seemed like everyone was supporting Erdogan and against the coup, from all the governments, to ISIS.

Second, he's blaming the US and some 77-year old in Pennsylvania.

Third, 2,000 judges are stripped of their jobs?

I have no idea what any of this means.
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Erdogan is mad at the guy in PA because that guy (a political rival of Erdogan) said it was probably staged by Erdogan so he could use it as an excuse to round up those opposed to him... who may have been putting pressure on his style of government, which some claim is disguised as democratic but turning toward autocratic.  It was said that this type of thing has happened in the past.  He's mad at the US if the guy isn't sent back to Turkey.

2,000 judges suddenly out of work may lend credence to idea that he is taking advantage of the situation to move closer to his autocracy.  Or maybe they were just performing poorly.  

 
Sinn Fein said:
This is what has changed.  Most of America did not used to thumb their noses at Blue Collar workers.  It used to be an honorable way to make a living.  Now its "they're still coal miners and truck drivers" as if that is a bad thing.
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I don't know anyone who thinks this.

What I do know is government jobs used to be the "safe" route.  Decent living.  Not a risk-taking job.

Now?

The private sector hasn't given raises in two decades while the government jobs have gotten modest raises along the way.  Now everyone thinks government workers are getting a free ride living it up with their "benefits."

 
Daywalker said:
I don't know anyone who thinks this.

What I do know is government jobs used to be the "safe" route.  Decent living.  Not a risk-taking job.

Now?

The private sector hasn't given raises in two decades while the government jobs have gotten modest raises along the way.  Now everyone thinks government workers are getting a free ride living it up with their "benefits."
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One non-trivial perk of government employment is that performance doesn't matter one iota.

 According to a recent GAO report, 99% of Federal government employees were rated "fully successful" or better. http://www.gao.gov/assets/680/676998.pdf

 
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sho nuff said:
If true...worst coup ever.  Not that I condone death and assassination like that.  But if you are leading a coup against a leader...its almost always shown if you don't just take him out (especially in one as flimsy as this coup was)...you lose.  You have the chance to take the guy down, I would guess you just do so if your goal is really to win.
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It's a coup unlike all other coups.

 
The latest:

Turkey reopened the airspace around Incirlik Air Base on Sunday, allowing the U.S. to restart strike missions targeting the Islamic State terror group, as the alliance between the two nations showed signs of serious strain.

Pentagon Press Secretary Peter Cook confirmed that power had been cut to the air base in southern Turkey, near the Syria border. 

"U.S. facilities at Incirlik are still operating on internal power sources, but we hope to restore commercial power soon. Base operations have not been affected," Cook said in a statement.

Meanwhile, U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry spoke to his Turkish counterpart, Mevlut Cavosoglu, for the second time in as many days following the failed coup, which left at least 265 people dead and 1,400 wounded.

Despite the support for Recep Tayyip Erdogan's government by the Obama administration during the coup, the country's labor minister suggested Washington was behind the uprising. Meanwhile, Erdogan himself bluntly requested the extradition of Pennsylvania-based cleric Fethullah Gulen, whom Erdogan blamed for inspiring the coup, saying, "If we are strategic partners, then you should bring about our request."

Although he didn't outline any threat, Erdogan's emphasis on U.S.-Turkish counterterrorism cooperation raised the prospect of a prolonged closure of Incirlik if he didn't get his way.

Stung by the criticism, the State Department fired back. In a readout of the telephone call between Kerry and Cavosoglu, the department said Kerry told his fellow diplomat, "public insinuations or claims about any role by the United States in the failed coup attempt are utterly false and harmful to our bilateral relations."

Kerry reiterated U.S. support for Turkey's democratically elected government, according to the State Department readout, and urged authorities to respect the rule of law and safeguard civilian life as they respond to the coup attempt. Kerry also said Turkey needed to respect due process as it investigates those it believes were involved in the plot.

Earlier, on a visit to Luxembourg, Kerry told reporters the U.S. would entertain an extradition request for Gulen if the Turks provided evidence of wrongdoing. Erdogan has long accused Gulen, a former ally, of trying to overthrow the government, but Washington has never found the claims compelling.

"We fully anticipate that there will be questions raised about Mr. Gulen," Kerry told reporters. "And obviously we would invite the government of Turkey, as we always do, to present us with any legitimate evidence that withstands scrutiny. And the United States will accept that and look at it and make judgments about it appropriately."

A Turkish official, speaking on condition of anonymity in line with government regulations, said Turkey was preparing a formal extradition request with detailed information about Gulen's involvement in illegal activities. He said the coup attempt was seen as "one more thing to add to an already extensive list."

In a statement, Gulen said he condemned, "in the strongest terms, the attempted military coup in Turkey" and sharply rejected any responsibility or knowledge of who might be involved.

Kerry said the U.S. had no indication beforehand of the coup attempt, which began as he and Russia's foreign minister were in a Russian government villa in Moscow, locked in negotiations over Syria.

"If you're planning a coup, you don't exactly advertise to your partners in NATO," Kerry said. "So it surprised everyone. It does not appear to be a very brilliantly planned or executed event."

Turkish authorities arrested Gen. Bekir Ercan Van, the Incirlik commander, a U.S. official told Fox News. 

Late Saturday, the State Department also issued a new travel warning, suggesting U.S. citizens "reconsider travel to Turkey at this time."
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I have to say that this coup looks like the biggest military bungle since Carter tried rescuing the hostages in Iran.

 
badmojo1006 said:
At height of Turkish coup bid, rebel jets had Erdogan's plane in their sights

Wow.
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There are a lot of interesting tidbits in this article.

However, the rogue aircraft were able to keep flying through the night by refueling mid-air after a tanker plane was commandeered, the first senior official said.

The tanker aircraft was taken from the Incirlik air base in southern Turkey, which is used by the U.S.-led coalition to bomb Islamic State in Syria and Iraq. The commander of Incirlik was detained on Sunday for complicity, the official said.
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The former military officer said the coup plotters appeared to have launched their attempt prematurely because they realized they were under surveillance, something corroborated by other officials in Ankara.

"They weren't fully prepared. The plans were leaked, they found out they were being monitored and it all apparently forced them to move faster than planned," the ex-officer said.
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They didn't fire on Erdogan's plane, Erdogan had escaped narrowly but somehow his plane seemed ready for takeoff. I am wondering if he knew the coup was coming, and if so, how.

 
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