Obama can end all deportation of illegal immigrants by himself (1 Viewer)

[timschochet]

I have to laugh at Ted Cruz's idea of "commonsense immigration reform". He stated that he could get behind Obama's bill, if it only didn't have that "path to citizenship" part! (In other words, his idea of immigration reform is more border security.)

But anyhow, a good sign that it passed the first test. Now we'll see. I expect it to pass through the Senate- barely. The House is a different matter.

He got crucified in Spanish media for trying to insert an English only provision. Hope he didn't really want to be president.

My biggest nightmare is a Republican primary where the competing choices are Ted Cruz vs. Rand Paul.

 

[NCCommish]

I have to laugh at Ted Cruz's idea of "commonsense immigration reform". He stated that he could get behind Obama's bill, if it only didn't have that "path to citizenship" part! (In other words, his idea of immigration reform is more border security.)

But anyhow, a good sign that it passed the first test. Now we'll see. I expect it to pass through the Senate- barely. The House is a different matter.

He got crucified in Spanish media for trying to insert an English only provision. Hope he didn't really want to be president.

My biggest nightmare is a Republican primary where the competing choices are Ted Cruz vs. Rand Paul.

Throw Scott Walker in there and you have the trifecta. Sounds pretty entertaining to me.

 

[timschochet]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

 

[Joe T]

Let's see if he can get it done.

Ok.

 

[NCCommish]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

He could cure cancer and not get the House to fund it. This is DOA in Congress IMO.

 

[timschochet]

The news, and the front page of this forum, are dominated by stories of scandals which turn out to be non-scandals, 4th Amendment violations which turn out not to be violations, and the George Zimmerman trial which pretty much all sides agree is a circus.

But this issue, which will effect the lives of so many millions of living and future generations, is relegated to the back pages. Go figure.

 

[timschochet]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

He could cure cancer and not get the House to fund it. This is DOA in Congress IMO.

I hope you're wrong; I fear you're right. But it will be embarrassing and shameful for the GOP if that happens. It will also be a watershed political moment; quite literally, they will never live it down.

 

[NCCommish]

The news, and the front page of this forum, are dominated by stories of scandals which turn out to be non-scandals, 4th Amendment violations which turn out not to be violations, and the George Zimmerman trial which pretty much all sides agree is a circus.

But this issue, which will effect the lives of so many millions of living and future generations, is relegated to the back pages. Go figure.

I have seen this covered pretty heavily in some places. But you know how it is. We are not a well informed people and since we lap up the infotainment that's what we get. We get exactly the media we pay for.

 

[NCCommish]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

He could cure cancer and not get the House to fund it. This is DOA in Congress IMO.

I hope you're wrong; I fear you're right. But it will be embarrassing and shameful for the GOP if that happens. It will also be a watershed political moment; quite literally, they will never live it down.

Several Congressional GOPers have declared it dead over the provisions for citizenship. And there are people who are supposedly going to be running for the GOP next cycle already out there campaigning against it. They don't seem to understand they hold the House because of gerrymandering not policy support. I think they are in for a rude awakening.

 

[timschochet]

The news, and the front page of this forum, are dominated by stories of scandals which turn out to be non-scandals, 4th Amendment violations which turn out not to be violations, and the George Zimmerman trial which pretty much all sides agree is a circus.

But this issue, which will effect the lives of so many millions of living and future generations, is relegated to the back pages. Go figure.

I have seen this covered pretty heavily in some places. But you know how it is. We are not a well informed people and since we lap up the infotainment that's what we get. We get exactly the media we pay for.

I wasn't speaking just of the media, though. I was also referring to this forum, which is loaded with people more informed than the general public on most political issues. Yet there seems to be lack of interest in this subject, and I find that sad.

 

[NCCommish]

Oh and I should say gerrymandering is wrong whoever does it. I am against Democratic gerrymandering and GOP gerrymandering.

 

[timschochet]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

He could cure cancer and not get the House to fund it. This is DOA in Congress IMO.

I hope you're wrong; I fear you're right. But it will be embarrassing and shameful for the GOP if that happens. It will also be a watershed political moment; quite literally, they will never live it down.

Several Congressional GOPers have declared it dead over the provisions for citizenship. And there are people who are supposedly going to be running for the GOP next cycle already out there campaigning against it. They don't seem to understand they hold the House because of gerrymandering not policy support. I think they are in for a rude awakening.

Agreed. And forgetting everything else, there is one political fact that they're not paying attention to:

Texas is going purple.

Let me repeat that: Texas is going purple! By 2020, if not before, it will be considered a swing state like Ohio and Florida. And when that happens, guess who are going to decide which way it swings? Of course, the Latino population. And guess what failed immigration reform bill they're going to remember? And guess which political party they're going to hold responsible for decades to come?

Without Texas, it is virtually impossible for a Republican to win the White House. The ballgame's over.

 

[NCCommish]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

He could cure cancer and not get the House to fund it. This is DOA in Congress IMO.

I hope you're wrong; I fear you're right. But it will be embarrassing and shameful for the GOP if that happens. It will also be a watershed political moment; quite literally, they will never live it down.

Several Congressional GOPers have declared it dead over the provisions for citizenship. And there are people who are supposedly going to be running for the GOP next cycle already out there campaigning against it. They don't seem to understand they hold the House because of gerrymandering not policy support. I think they are in for a rude awakening.

Agreed. And forgetting everything else, there is one political fact that they're not paying attention to:

Texas is going purple.

Let me repeat that: Texas is going purple! By 2020, if not before, it will be considered a swing state like Ohio and Florida. And when that happens, guess who are going to decide which way it swings? Of course, the Latino population. And guess what failed immigration reform bill they're going to remember? And guess which political party they're going to hold responsible for decades to come?

Without Texas, it is virtually impossible for a Republican to win the White House. The ballgame's over.

I hope most Democrats are not counting their Hispanic vote before it hatches. Remember Gov Good Hair got 40% of the Hispanic vote in 2010. It is going to take more than more Hispanics to make the change. The party is going to have to invest heavily in GOTV efforts as Hispanics don't vote in huge numbers. Only about 53% of eligible Hispanic voters make it to the polls. And Hispanics are also not monolithic on the subject of immigration. A lot has to happen to turn Texas purple.

 

[humpback]

The news, and the front page of this forum, are dominated by stories of scandals which turn out to be non-scandals, 4th Amendment violations which turn out not to be violations, and the George Zimmerman trial which pretty much all sides agree is a circus.

But this issue, which will effect the lives of so many millions of living and future generations, is relegated to the back pages. Go figure.

I have seen this covered pretty heavily in some places. But you know how it is. We are not a well informed people and since we lap up the infotainment that's what we get. We get exactly the media we pay for.

I wasn't speaking just of the media, though. I was also referring to this forum, which is loaded with people more informed than the general public on most political issues. Yet there seems to be lack of interest in this subject, and I find that sad.

More like a lack of interest in discussing this subject with you.

 

[RCon]

The news, and the front page of this forum, are dominated by stories of scandals which turn out to be non-scandals, 4th Amendment violations which turn out not to be violations, and the George Zimmerman trial which pretty much all sides agree is a circus.

But this issue, which will effect the lives of so many millions of living and future generations, is relegated to the back pages. Go figure.

I have seen this covered pretty heavily in some places. But you know how it is. We are not a well informed people and since we lap up the infotainment that's what we get. We get exactly the media we pay for.

I wasn't speaking just of the media, though. I was also referring to this forum, which is loaded with people more informed than the general public on most political issues. Yet there seems to be lack of interest in this subject, and I find that sad.

I find the subject interesting, but...

1. The next few weeks in the Senate are pretty much dead time. I doubt there will be any new revelations.

2. I don't really have anything new to say on the topic. We (the FFA) have been discussing it for years, as opposed to something like the Snowden leak, which is much more recent news.

3. Your tunnel vision on this particular topic (see post 103, for instance) makes it difficult to have a meaningful discussion.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I'm not buying that Texas will be competive in seven years. Maybe 27 years.

 

[Joe T]

I'm not buying that Texas will be competive in seven years. Maybe 27 years.

And we have the first reasonable post in the entire thread. congrats.

 

[Joe T]

Here's is the mayor of Los Angeles' plan for immigration reform. Interested to know if posters here approve or disapprove. This is going to be one of THE main political topics of discussion in the coming months:

keep us posted!

 

[jonessed]

Here's is the mayor of Los Angeles' plan for immigration reform. Interested to know if posters here approve or disapprove. This is going to be one of THE main political topics of discussion in the coming months:

keep us posted!

 

[timschochet]

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/poll-huge-support-for-immigration-reform-92701.html?hp=r3

Immigration reform continues to attract broad public support as the Gang of Eight compromise legislation moves through the Senate, according to a huge raft of polling conducted for three pro-reform groups: the Partnership for a New American Economy, the Alliance for Citizenship and Republicans for Immigration Reform.

In a polling memo set for release Thursday– and shared early with POLITICO – Democratic pollster Tom Jensen and Republican pollster Brock McCleary reveal that their surveys found “overwhelming, bipartisan support for the bill” across 29 states.

“Over the last few years, we’ve seen a country increasingly polarized across party lines when it comes to almost all attempts to move legislation. Yet, the compromise that’s been crafted on immigration reform is a rare exception to that rule. The bill that’s been constructed has broad support with every segment of the electorate in every part of the country,” write Jensen, who heads the firm Public Policy Polling, and McCleary, of Harper Polling.

(PHOTOS: At a glance: The Senate immigration deal)

The two firms, which use IVR methodology (often called “robo-polling”), collected a mountain of data in states ranging from strongly Republican Idaho and Utah to solidly Democratic Illinois and Maine.

In each state, the pollsters described the legislation in accurate but positive terms, telling participants that the Gang of Eight bill would help “secure our borders, block employers from hiring undocumented immigrants” and require undocumented immigrants to meet “a long list of requirements … over more than a decade” in order to obtain a pathway to citizenship.

Presented with that favorable description of the legislation, voters responded warmly, with between 61 and 78 percent in each state expressing support.

(Also on POLITICO: First immigration votes stalled)

Those are probably best-case numbers for immigration reform advocates. The reform proposals currently under consideration have not yet been picked apart in the Senate and House legislative processes. When politicians debate immigration reform before the voters next year, they won’t be presenting such a plainly one-sided view of the issue.

But at this point, in states represented by key advocates of immigration reform, both the Gang of Eight proposal and a pathway to citizenship earn robust support, as described.

In Florida, where GOP Sen. Marco Rubio has been one of the staunchest supporters of reform legislation, 72 percent of voters said they support the legislation (including 45 percent who strongly support it) and 71 percent backed the pathway to citizenship.

In South Carolina, home to reform-boosting Republican Lindsey Graham, those numbers were only a bit lower: 62 percent who support the Gang of Eight bill and 60 percent who backed the pathway to citizenship.

And in Texas, the rapidly changing but still-conservative state with two senators who have resisted reform – Ted Cruz and John Cornyn – 67 percent said they could support the reform bill as described, with 72 percent backing a pathway to citizenship.

The average support for the “Gang of Eight” legislation was just under 68 percent, according to the pollsters.

McCleary and Jensen write in their memo: “The bipartisan immigration reform package represents a rare opportunity to cast an affirmative vote for major legislation that enjoys overwhelming support from voters of all stripes.”

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/poll-huge-support-for-immigration-reform-92701.html#ixzz2WE04cuO4

 

[timschochet]

It's become an extremely popular idea everywhere- everywhere, that is, except in the Tea Party dominated House of Representatives.

 

[RCon]

It's become an extremely popular idea everywhere- everywhere, that is, except in the Tea Party dominated House of Representatives.

I can't yet say I favor or oppose the legislation, but that's because they're not done fiddling with it yet. I imagine it will change quite a bit more before it becomes "final".

 

[timschochet]

It's become an extremely popular idea everywhere- everywhere, that is, except in the Tea Party dominated House of Representatives.

I can't yet say I favor or oppose the legislation, but that's because they're not done fiddling with it yet. I imagine it will change quite a bit more before it becomes "final".

Let me save you the time- the net result, if it passes, will be a path to citizenship for illegals in this country. There's a bunch of talk about border security and enforcing e-verify and all that, but I'm as cynical as you that any of that will have a great effect. Even with this bill, if our labor economy turns around again, there will be another influx of illegals, and another, and another, until and unless one day latin America solves it's economic problems. We can't stop it. (The difference between you and I being that i don't want to.)

 

[timschochet]

Looking more and more like Senate will pass the bill. Then it's up to the House...

 

[ducktales]

democrats want vote/control

republications want cheap labor

who are the ones getting screwed here yet again? The middle class

 

[jonessed]

It's become an extremely popular idea everywhere- everywhere, that is, except in the Tea Party dominated House of Representatives.

I can't yet say I favor or oppose the legislation, but that's because they're not done fiddling with it yet. I imagine it will change quite a bit more before it becomes "final".

The House will pass a bill that looks nothing like the Senate one so this has a long way to go before we know what the final product may look like.

 

[timschochet]

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2013/0624/Immigration-reform-takes-giant-leap-forward-with-Senate-vote

The Senate will pass the bill by the end of the week. Then it goes to the House, and John Boehner will be faced with what might be the biggest decision of his career, with the future of the GOP on the line...

 

[Christo]

democrats want vote/control

republications want cheap labor

who are the ones getting screwed here yet again? The middle class

How does cheap, uneducated labor screw the middle class?

 

[timschochet]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

I strongly support immigration reform, but the bolded part contains a million times more hyperbole than all other posts on this board combined.

 

[NCCommish]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

Don't be sad little camper it's only a matter of when not if. If the Congressional GOP decides to die on this hill then so be it. Yes they have themselves some room due to gerrymandering but even that might not be enough to keep the erosion from starting next cycle. I do believe these southern states rushing to try to screw voters are setting the table for a wave election and they aren't going to like how it turns out.

 

[RCon]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

I find it odd that somehow the House is at fault when they spend time and vote on bills that have no chance of passing the Senate, yet the House is also at fault when the Senate spends time and votes on bills that have no chance of passing the House.

 

[StrikeS2k]

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

The undocumented are not out in the cold. They can go home whenever they want to. I'm sure they're documented there, wherever that is.

 

[Kal El]

I think we should pass at least some type of immigration reform so these folks can get started on a more streamlined path to citizenship, and at the same time start enforcing border patrols and deporting an immigrant convicted of a crime. If someone can't follow the rules, then they can't stay.

 

[NCCommish]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

I find it odd that somehow the House is at fault when they spend time and vote on bills that have no chance of passing the Senate, yet the House is also at fault when the Senate spends time and votes on bills that have no chance of passing the House.

Because they pass bills that are toxic to anyone but their Tea Party masters.

 

[jonessed]

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2013/0624/Immigration-reform-takes-giant-leap-forward-with-Senate-vote

The Senate will pass the bill by the end of the week. Then it goes to the House, and John Boehner will be faced with what might be the biggest decision of his career, with the future of the GOP on the line...

 

[timschochet]

I am not a fan of Barack Obama as POTUS. I did not vote for him either time. I don't approve of Obamacare, don't approve of much of his economic policies, and thus far I've generally considered him to be a good, decent fellow but overall a mediocre President.

HOWEVER- and this is not hyperbole on my part- if Obama somehow twists enough arms in the Senate and House to pass this bill which gives a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants and finally brings them out of the shadows, against the opposition of all the of the nativists in this country- it will IMO be the greatest achievement of any President in this country in the past 3 decades or so. This one act alone will elevate Obama in my mind to one of the great Presidents we have had in quite some time.

Let's see if he can get it done.

I strongly support immigration reform, but the bolded part contains a million times more hyperbole than all other posts on this board combined.

It's not hyperbole to me. This, along with energy reform, is my #1 political issue.

 

[timschochet]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

Don't be sad little camper it's only a matter of when not if. If the Congressional GOP decides to die on this hill then so be it. Yes they have themselves some room due to gerrymandering but even that might not be enough to keep the erosion from starting next cycle. I do believe these southern states rushing to try to screw voters are setting the table for a wave election and they aren't going to like how it turns out.

If the price of immigration reform is a Democrat controlled House and Senate, I suppose I'll pay it. But I don't want to. There are too many issues that I disagree with Democrats on. I would much rather the Republicans get behind this. But it doesn't look likely.

 

[humpback]

Can we make this the official Tim forum?

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Can we make this the official Tim forum?

The dude has been consistently passionate about this issue for as long as he's been here. You had to know that there would be a lot Tim in here.

 

[StrikeS2k]

I think we should pass at least some type of immigration reform so these folks can get started on a more streamlined path to citizenship, and at the same time start enforcing border patrols and deporting an immigrant convicted of a crime. If someone can't follow the rules, then they can't stay.

We already did all of this. 1986. but the feds didn't enforce the border or go after businesses as they were supposed to. So you can understand why some of have a more hard nosed, let's get the border secured first, attitude about immigration reform this time around.

 

[humpback]

Can we make this the official Tim forum?

The dude has been consistently passionate about this issue for as long as he's been here. You had to know that there would be a lot Tim in here.

I wasn't joking.

 

[RCon]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

I find it odd that somehow the House is at fault when they spend time and vote on bills that have no chance of passing the Senate, yet the House is also at fault when the Senate spends time and votes on bills that have no chance of passing the House.

Because they pass bills that are toxic to anyone but their Tea Party masters.

Fine, then argue against the bill itself, but it's not intellectually consistent to complain about "wasting everyone's time" because they're working on a bill that won't ever pass the Senate, unless you also complain that the Senate just wasted everyone's time on this bill.

 

[NCCommish]

I think we should pass at least some type of immigration reform so these folks can get started on a more streamlined path to citizenship, and at the same time start enforcing border patrols and deporting an immigrant convicted of a crime. If someone can't follow the rules, then they can't stay.

We already did all of this. 1986. but the feds didn't enforce the border or go after businesses as they were supposed to. So you can understand why some of have a more hard nosed, let's get the border secured first, attitude about immigration reform this time around.

Yes let's spend more on the border that every foot of is already patrolled daily by both people and drones. Let's add so many border agents they can practically stand shoulder to shoulder instead of building a fence. Let's spend 30 billion on this while we try to cut 20 billion from Food Stamps because we just don't have the money.

 

[StrikeS2k]

I think we should pass at least some type of immigration reform so these folks can get started on a more streamlined path to citizenship, and at the same time start enforcing border patrols and deporting an immigrant convicted of a crime. If someone can't follow the rules, then they can't stay.

We already did all of this. 1986. but the feds didn't enforce the border or go after businesses as they were supposed to. So you can understand why some of have a more hard nosed, let's get the border secured first, attitude about immigration reform this time around.

Yes let's spend more on the border that every foot of is already patrolled daily by both people and drones. Let's add so many border agents they can practically stand shoulder to shoulder instead of building a fence. Let's spend 30 billion on this while we try to cut 20 billion from Food Stamps because we just don't have the money.

Yes, because what you describe is the ONLY way to secure the border. God you're as bad as Tim.

 

[NCCommish]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

I find it odd that somehow the House is at fault when they spend time and vote on bills that have no chance of passing the Senate, yet the House is also at fault when the Senate spends time and votes on bills that have no chance of passing the House.

Because they pass bills that are toxic to anyone but their Tea Party masters.

Fine, then argue against the bill itself, but it's not intellectually consistent to complain about "wasting everyone's time" because they're working on a bill that won't ever pass the Senate, unless you also complain that the Senate just wasted everyone's time on this bill.

it is intellectually consistent. The same people forcing through repeal Obamacare for the 37th time are the sames ones saying if this comes to a vote with any hint of citizenship they will try to vote out Boehner.

 

[NCCommish]

I think we should pass at least some type of immigration reform so these folks can get started on a more streamlined path to citizenship, and at the same time start enforcing border patrols and deporting an immigrant convicted of a crime. If someone can't follow the rules, then they can't stay.

We already did all of this. 1986. but the feds didn't enforce the border or go after businesses as they were supposed to. So you can understand why some of have a more hard nosed, let's get the border secured first, attitude about immigration reform this time around.

Yes let's spend more on the border that every foot of is already patrolled daily by both people and drones. Let's add so many border agents they can practically stand shoulder to shoulder instead of building a fence. Let's spend 30 billion on this while we try to cut 20 billion from Food Stamps because we just don't have the money.

Yes, because what you describe is the ONLY way to secure the border. God you're as bad as Tim.

30 billion in cost to fully militarize the border is what is in the bill that passed the Senate. It adds something like 20k border agents. It requires another 700 miles of the stupid fence be finished. Maybe you should read it before you comment further.

 

[RCon]

Well, it passed the Senate 68-32. Now the real battle begins.

And right now, that battle looks like a defeat for all those in favor of immigration reform. The House Republicans simply won't have it. Boehner says it's "dead on arrival".

The House Republicans are dominated by the far right and the Tea Party. They appear to refuse to budge on this issue, and it will likely die, leaving the undocumented out in the cold...again. :(

I find it odd that somehow the House is at fault when they spend time and vote on bills that have no chance of passing the Senate, yet the House is also at fault when the Senate spends time and votes on bills that have no chance of passing the House.

Because they pass bills that are toxic to anyone but their Tea Party masters.

Fine, then argue against the bill itself, but it's not intellectually consistent to complain about "wasting everyone's time" because they're working on a bill that won't ever pass the Senate, unless you also complain that the Senate just wasted everyone's time on this bill.

it is intellectually consistent. The same people forcing through repeal Obamacare for the 37th time are the sames ones saying if this comes to a vote with any hint of citizenship they will try to vote out Boehner.

It is intellectually consistent to argue for one bill (immigration) and against another (repeal Obamacare). It is intellectually consistent to argue that the House sucks in general. It is intellectually consistent to argue that the GOP sucks in general.

It is not intellectually consistent to argue that the House is wasting time passing a bill to repeal Obamacare, but argue that the Senate is not wasting time passing an immigration bill that has no chance of passing the House (even if the reason it has no chance of passing the House is because the GOP sucks).

 

[Kal El]

I think we should pass at least some type of immigration reform so these folks can get started on a more streamlined path to citizenship, and at the same time start enforcing border patrols and deporting an immigrant convicted of a crime. If someone can't follow the rules, then they can't stay.

We already did all of this. 1986. but the feds didn't enforce the border or go after businesses as they were supposed to. So you can understand why some of have a more hard nosed, let's get the border secured first, attitude about immigration reform this time around.

Yes let's spend more on the border that every foot of is already patrolled daily by both people and drones. Let's add so many border agents they can practically stand shoulder to shoulder instead of building a fence. Let's spend 30 billion on this while we try to cut 20 billion from Food Stamps because we just don't have the money.

Yes, because what you describe is the ONLY way to secure the border. God you're as bad as Tim.

30 billion in cost to fully militarize the border is what is in the bill that passed the Senate. It adds something like 20k border agents. It requires another 700 miles of the stupid fence be finished. Maybe you should read it before you comment further.

When I was younger, I felt that we should just kick out all the illegals. I realize now that such an idea is logistically impossible, at least concerning those already here. Reinforcing the borders shouldn't be particularly difficult, but as for the people already here, get them on the path to citizenship, but if they or a new immigrant commits a crime, they're deported and their citizenship process starts back at square one, if they're allowed back in.

 

[RCon]

I think we should pass at least some type of immigration reform so these folks can get started on a more streamlined path to citizenship, and at the same time start enforcing border patrols and deporting an immigrant convicted of a crime. If someone can't follow the rules, then they can't stay.

We already did all of this. 1986. but the feds didn't enforce the border or go after businesses as they were supposed to. So you can understand why some of have a more hard nosed, let's get the border secured first, attitude about immigration reform this time around.

Yes let's spend more on the border that every foot of is already patrolled daily by both people and drones. Let's add so many border agents they can practically stand shoulder to shoulder instead of building a fence. Let's spend 30 billion on this while we try to cut 20 billion from Food Stamps because we just don't have the money.

Or, we could come down hard on businesses that hire illegals or pay under the table. That seems much more practical and effective anyway.