Higgs
Footballguy
Enlighten me, please. I think I'm one of the only people left in this country that is committed to being truly colorblind. I've been consistent on this for years.Of course you don't see the irony in what you just wrote.
Enlighten me, please. I think I'm one of the only people left in this country that is committed to being truly colorblind. I've been consistent on this for years.Of course you don't see the irony in what you just wrote.
And yet you support the presidential candidate who talks more about racial, ethnic and religious divisions than any since at least the 1960s and you condone his preposterous assertion that a judge can't do his job properly because is his Mexican heritage.That's the problem. When you spend so much time focusing on race in America, every single thing is tainted with bias, or at least the appearance of it. America is racially obsessed. It permeates every aspect of of society, all of our institutions. So sick of it. You can't have a nation like this. You just can't.
Trump seems to be the one focusing on race...quite often actually.That's the problem. When you spend so much time focusing on race in America, every single thing is tainted with bias, or at least the appearance of it. America is racially obsessed. It permeates every aspect of of society, all of our institutions. So sick of it. You can't have a nation like this. You just can't.
You say:Enlighten me, please. I think I'm one of the only people left in this country that is committed to being truly colorblind. I've been consistent on this for years.
yet support a bozo that calls a man born in Indiana (ie an American) a Mexican. If you don't see the irony in that, it's not worth having a discussionWhy can't we just call everyone Americans?
only illegalsTrump seems to be the one focusing on race...quite often actually.
You mad, ese?Higgs said:Dimples, the implication here is that race matters in jury verdicts and therefore jury selection. Why does race matter in juries but not with judges? What say you dimple face?
I can understand how that doesn't make sense, so let me explain. And this is going to sound a little nuts, so bear with me... My support for Trump thus far has been a protest vote. A vote against the current system, against the GOPe. Trump is undoubtedly engaging in white identity politics, which both disgusts me and pleases me. It disgusts me because, contrary to popular belief around here, I really am a 100% believer in diversity and living in a color-blind society. It pleases me because what Trump is doing is shining a light on the hypocrisy of identity politics. What Trump is doing really isn't all that different than what Hillary and the Dems have been doing for years - injecting race into everything, pandering, creating monsters of the "other side". Now the Left is seeing that done in reverse and it is BLOWING THEIR FRIGGIN MINDS!And yet you support the presidential candidate who talks more about racial, ethnic and religious divisions than any since at least the 1960s and you condone his preposterous assertion that a judge can't do his job properly because is his Mexican heritage.
See the problem here?
Ah, gotcha. See my post above. There's a method to my madness. It may be misguided but it is well intentioned.You say:
yet support a bozo that calls a man born in Indiana (ie an American) a Mexican. If you don't see the irony in that, it's not worth having a discussion
So in other words, by being completely and utterly racist, Trump has gone beyond the conventional understanding of racism and is therefore not racist at all?I can understand how that doesn't make sense, so let me explain. And this is going to sound a little nuts, so bear with me... My support for Trump thus far has been a protest vote. A vote against the current system, against the GOPe. Trump is undoubtedly engaging in white identity politics, which both disgusts me and pleases me. It disgusts me because, contrary to popular belief around here, I really am a 100% believer in diversity and living in a color-blind society. It pleases me because what Trump is doing is shining a light on the hypocrisy of identity politics. What Trump is doing really isn't all that different than what Hillary and the Dems have been doing for years - injecting race into everything, pandering, creating monsters of the "other side". Now the Left is seeing that done in reverse and it is BLOWING THEIR FRIGGIN MINDS!
I don't expect you or any other Liberal to understand what I've been saying in here, and what I've been espousing for years. Nobody gets me in here. People are brainwashed into thinking that some racism is ok, as long as it comes from minority groups. Lefty sociologists were even successful in changing the definition of racism in the early 90's to match this thinking - "racism can only be perpetrated by those in power". And look - I get where all of this came from, and it came from a good place - trying to right past wrongs. There was a time and a place for affirmative action and reverse discrimination. But the time has come to end all that. It's no longer useful, and it's harming the country. No racism is ok. "An injustice anywhere is an injustice everywhere".
Our country is in danger of not being a nation anymore. Just look around. We are more polarized than ever. Discrimination and racism, regardless of its intent and regardless of what form it takes - breeds more racism. 8 years ago I watched Obama's acceptance speech literally in tears thinking that America had come such a long way. I feel the complete opposite after 8 years of Obama. Race relations are at levels not seen since Rodney King.
But would you feel ok if he were to win the Presidency? If you want a protest vote, vote 3rd party.I can see the Trump protest vote point of view. Anti-government, the establishment, the cronyism, etc.
No. By being a complete and utter racist, Trump is putting a mirror up to Democrats and the Left showing that they've been doing the exact same things for years.So in other words, by being completely and utterly racist, Trump has gone beyond the conventional understanding of racism and is therefore not racist at all?
I have big concerns with Trump or Hillary becoming President. Starting to look at 3rd party candidates.But would you feel ok if he were to win the Presidency? If you want a protest vote, vote 3rd party.
No, I'm not voting for Donald Trump, I can just see the protest vote point-of-view for Trump. In another cycle he may have been a third party candidate, you'll have to ask Republicans to explain how he co-opted their party, I certainly can't explain it.But would you feel ok if he were to win the Presidency? If you want a protest vote, vote 3rd party.
Well, if murders are the cost of doing business, its long overdue for the cost of guns to reflect that.Hillary want the law changed so gun makers/companies can be sued if an idiot shoots someone with a gun the company made. If this is made possible & Ruger gets a multi million dollar judgment against them then gun manufacturing companies will probably go out of business. IMO. So yea, they are kind of coming after guns.
You don't know enough to make a that call?I don't know enough about her to make that call. But what I see right now gives me major pause. My God that article is laced with bias - she's out front and open about it. I commend her for her honesty at least. And her little spiel about judges making policy??? Oh my goodness. Only a goof like Obama would think of nominating someone this bad.
The Boy Scouts also harbored child molesters. Hardly an unimpeachable organization.Hmmm. This guy must have been reading my posts... http://spectator.org/trump-is-right-the-shame-of-paul-ryan-and-mitch-mcconnell/
Because they'd get sanctioned.Why won't the Trump lawyers file a motion to recuse?
Judges have been making policy as long as there's been a common law system.I don't know enough about her to make that call. But what I see right now gives me major pause. My God that article is laced with bias - she's out front and open about it. I commend her for her honesty at least. And her little spiel about judges making policy??? Oh my goodness. Only a goof like Obama would think of nominating someone this bad.
That's the problem. When you spend so much time focusing on race in America, every single thing is tainted with bias, or at least the appearance of it. America is racially obsessed. It permeates every aspect of of society, all of our institutions. So sick of it. You can't have a nation like this. You just can't.
You are not some special snowflake that understands the world in ways that no one else can. No one else agrees with you because you're wrong.I don't expect you or any other Liberal to understand what I've been saying in here, and what I've been espousing for years. Nobody gets me in here. People are brainwashed into thinking that some racism is ok, as long as it comes from minority groups.
He is not showing any hypocrisy...he is showing the ugly side of identity politics and embracing it.I can understand how that doesn't make sense, so let me explain. And this is going to sound a little nuts, so bear with me... My support for Trump thus far has been a protest vote. A vote against the current system, against the GOPe. Trump is undoubtedly engaging in white identity politics, which both disgusts me and pleases me. It disgusts me because, contrary to popular belief around here, I really am a 100% believer in diversity and living in a color-blind society. It pleases me because what Trump is doing is shining a light on the hypocrisy of identity politics. What Trump is doing really isn't all that different than what Hillary and the Dems have been doing for years - injecting race into everything, pandering, creating monsters of the "other side". Now the Left is seeing that done in reverse and it is BLOWING THEIR FRIGGIN MINDS!
I don't expect you or any other Liberal to understand what I've been saying in here, and what I've been espousing for years. Nobody gets me in here. People are brainwashed into thinking that some racism is ok, as long as it comes from minority groups. Lefty sociologists were even successful in changing the definition of racism in the early 90's to match this thinking - "racism can only be perpetrated by those in power". And look - I get where all of this came from, and it came from a good place - trying to right past wrongs. There was a time and a place for affirmative action and reverse discrimination. But the time has come to end all that. It's no longer useful, and it's harming the country. No racism is ok. "An injustice anywhere is an injustice everywhere".
Our country is in danger of not being a nation anymore. Just look around. We are more polarized than ever. Discrimination and racism, regardless of its intent and regardless of what form it takes - breeds more racism. 8 years ago I watched Obama's acceptance speech literally in tears thinking that America had come such a long way. I feel the complete opposite after 8 years of Obama. Race relations are at levels not seen since Rodney King.
Sure...then, he turned into big government, establishment type guy anyway.I can see the Trump protest vote point of view. Anti-government, the establishment, the cronyism, etc.
Except...they have not been doing the exact same thing.No. By being a complete and utter racist, Trump is putting a mirror up to Democrats and the Left showing that they've been doing the exact same things for years.
Get it?
As did the Catholic Church. Should affiliations with that group also be banned?The Boy Scouts also harbored child molesters. Hardly an unimpeachable organization.
The scholarship recipient did not reveal his undocumented status until after he was awarded the scholarship.Hmmm. This guy must have been reading my posts... http://spectator.org/trump-is-right-the-shame-of-paul-ryan-and-mitch-mcconnell/
Most assuredly, Judge Gonzalo Curiel has gone out of his way to not only openly tie himself to this group of racially directed lawyers — but to participate in the left-wing agenda favored so deeply by leftist race-driven Hispanics. In 2014 the Judge served as a member of the group’s 2014 Scholarship Selection Committee, which in turn awarded a $1,500 scholarship to a self-advertised “undocumented.” Think of that for a moment. The very first act of this student was to break American law, and Judge Curiel awards him a scholarship — for law school!
So, there are people of Mexican decent out there asking judges to recuse themselves in court cases because they are white, and said person has had a history of saying critical things about white people?No. By being a complete and utter racist, Trump is putting a mirror up to Democrats and the Left showing that they've been doing the exact same things for years.
Get it?
First off, in no way do I want to minimize the horrific racial sins of this country. They were horrible, and should never be forgotten. But America paid a big price for the sin of slavery. Hundreds of thousands of white men gave their lives to put an end to it. I believe we are the only country in the history of the world to fight a war to abolish slavery. At some point we have to let it go, forgive, and move forward.I posted a really long post to you about 6 or 7 pages ago, and don't really feel like finding it. You responded, but you were so worked up, I don't know if the substance registered with you. The long and short of it is that this country has a very long, very brutal history of treating one particular race of people incredibly horrible. And it isn't just "ancient" history. We are talking in my lifetime. Black people brutalized, taunted, raped, murdered, mistreated, cordoned off, not allowed to frequent businesses, not allowed to go to the same schools, not allowed to open businesses, not allowed to live in the same area. When black people have gone to simply purchase a home in a "white" neighborhood, they have been terrorized.
This is in our lifetime.
So, yes, America has been racially obsessed for centuries. As long as it has been alive, really.
EVEN IF we were to pretend that there is not a single spec of racism or bad effects in this country anymore (which I don't accept), it is amazing that white people refuse to accept the horrible things that have happened to black people and want to simply move on. That's not how it works. But we ARE still dealing with the shockwave effects of the last 2 centuries.
Do I know how to fix it? No.
Do I necessarily think Affirmative Action or other government mandate is the answer? Not necessarily. (for all I know, the "fix" is making things worse).
But I don't accept "there isn't a problem with race" as a realistic statement.
One more thing: If my grandfather was lynched without consequence. If my little brother was murdered for smiling at a white woman with no consequence. If my sister was raped while the government actors stood and did nothing. Then yes, I'd be ready to burn sh_t to the ground. It's really amazing that this hasn't happened.
Ok dimples. You know it all. We gotcha.You are not some special snowflake that understands the world in ways that no one else can. No one else agrees with you because you're wrong.
imo voting Trump is the kick in the nuts both political parties need . It's like voting for a 3rd party that actually has a chance to win .I want to flip the table overI have big concerns with Trump or Hillary becoming President. Starting to look at 3rd party candidates.
I strongly disagree, and I would guess so do most people who write on the subject of race relations and racial discrimination in America. What I suspect they would tell you is that the Obama presidency has inspired African-Americans to fight injustice where they previously felt such efforts would be futile or counterproductive. In other words, there has always been discriminatory policing, always been predatory lending, always been disparities in media portrayals of black and white people. You just didn't hear about it nearly as much before, but you're hearing about it now, and that's progress, whether you admit it or not. And now that everyone is hearing about it, some Conservatives are refusing to accept it and rebelling against it because it doesn't fit their idyllic but still distant notion of a world without race. Trump's pitch appeals to these Conservatives- hell it's right there in his motto. "Make America Great Again." He wants to move backwards, to the time when we didn't have to confront these uncomfortable truths.I can understand how that doesn't make sense, so let me explain. And this is going to sound a little nuts, so bear with me... My support for Trump thus far has been a protest vote. A vote against the current system, against the GOPe. Trump is undoubtedly engaging in white identity politics, which both disgusts me and pleases me. It disgusts me because, contrary to popular belief around here, I really am a 100% believer in diversity and living in a color-blind society. It pleases me because what Trump is doing is shining a light on the hypocrisy of identity politics. What Trump is doing really isn't all that different than what Hillary and the Dems have been doing for years - injecting race into everything, pandering, creating monsters of the "other side". Now the Left is seeing that done in reverse and it is BLOWING THEIR FRIGGIN MINDS!
I don't expect you or any other Liberal to understand what I've been saying in here, and what I've been espousing for years. Nobody gets me in here. People are brainwashed into thinking that some racism is ok, as long as it comes from minority groups. Lefty sociologists were even successful in changing the definition of racism in the early 90's to match this thinking - "racism can only be perpetrated by those in power". And look - I get where all of this came from, and it came from a good place - trying to right past wrongs. There was a time and a place for affirmative action and reverse discrimination. But the time has come to end all that. It's no longer useful, and it's harming the country. No racism is ok. "An injustice anywhere is an injustice everywhere".
Our country is in danger of not being a nation anymore. Just look around. We are more polarized than ever. Discrimination and racism, regardless of its intent and regardless of what form it takes - breeds more racism. 8 years ago I watched Obama's acceptance speech literally in tears thinking that America had come such a long way. I feel the complete opposite after 8 years of Obama. Race relations are at levels not seen since Rodney King.
Some of that is true. But it's gone overboard. The police issue is a perfect example. Ferguson Effect anyone? How's that crime rate doing these days? Baltimore and Chicago murder rates? BLM and others took a legitimate issue (police brutality) and turned it racial. And I will argue with you until the cows come home that the facts do NOT support that blacks are unfairly abused by police in comparison to whites. It's a farce that has been disproven by facts over and over. And now the people worse off are those people - mostly black - living in Baltimore and Chicago.I strongly disagree, and so do most people who write on the subject of race relations and racial discrimination in America. What I suspect they would tell you is that the Obama presidency has inspired African-Americans to fight injustice where they previously felt such efforts would be futile or counterproductive. In other words, there has always been discriminatory policing, always been predatory lending, always been disparities in media portrayals of black and white people. You just didn't hear about it nearly as much before, but you're hearing about it now, and that's progress, whether you admit it or not. And now that everyone is hearing about it, some Conservatives are refusing to accept it and rebelling against it because it doesn't fit their idyllic but still distant notion of a world without race.
Don't worry, we're the good guys. Always have been, always will be.
I was with you on the first part, and would have simply pointed out that every progressive movement has a minority of activists that take things too far, but that usually doesn't interfere with the progress.Some of that is true. But it's gone overboard. The police issue is a perfect example. Ferguson Effect anyone? How's that crime rate doing these days? Baltimore and Chicago murder rates? BLM and others took a legitimate issue (police brutality) and turned it racial. And I will argue with you until the cows come home that the facts do NOT support that blacks are unfairly abused by police in comparison to whites. It's a farce that has been disproven by facts over and over. And now the people worse off are those people - mostly black - living in Baltimore and Chicago.
Gold Jerry, Gold!!!Ok dimples. You know it all. We gotcha.
Contrary to your closed-minded stance, which shines through consistently in here, there's a very large group of people in this country who think exactly as I do. Including many black people. Once again, read the book "Stop Helping Us".
We've gone round and round on this and I feel like you guys have just ignored or glossed over the hard data that I've brought to the table. Let me start by saying I agree with you on one issue - blacks are profiled at a higher rate than whites. I've witnessed this myself when I've gone to the Mall with my sister (who is black).I was with you on the first part, and would have simply pointed out that every progressive movement has a minority of activists that take things too far, but that usually doesn't interfere with the progress.
But then I got to the bolded, and ... no. No no no no no. There's been study after study of everything from traffic stops to drug arrest/conviction rates to disparate sentencing. And there's large amounts of anecdotal evidence of racism in the law enforcement community. It's been documented over and over again. If you refuse to see that, it's on you.
The conventional thinking about police-involved shootings, and some scientific research, has been that black suspects are more likely to be shot than white suspects because of an implicit racial bias among police officers. But now a new study has found exactly the opposite: even with white officers who do have racial biases, officers are three times less likely to shoot unarmed black suspects than unarmed white suspects.
The results come from a laboratory project at Washington State University using highly realistic police simulators, in which actors in various scenarios approach and respond to officers on large, high-definition video screens in an attempt to recreate critical situations on the street. The officers are equipped with real guns, modified to fire infrared beams rather than bullets, and the scenarios can branch into conflict or cooperation, depending on the officers’ words and actions.
It’s the third time researchers at Washington State — Lois James, Stephen M. James and Bryan J. Vila — have set up simulations to monitor the differing reactions of police when confronted by white or black suspects. And all three times, they found that officers took significantly more time to fire their weapons if the subject was black, according to their latest report, “The Reverse Racism Effect,” to be published in the journal Criminology & Public Policy.
Yet no one in here gets you.Ok dimples. You know it all. We gotcha.
Contrary to your closed-minded stance, which shines through consistently in here, there's a very large group of people in this country who think exactly as I do. Including many black people. Once again, read the book "Stop Helping Us".
A few do. Certainly not you and the other hard core Lefties. Quite honestly, and I say this without malice just as a matter of fact, you guys are some of the most closed-minded bunch I've ever dealt with. I used to think the Evangelicals were bad. You guys are right there with them, only you're nastier.Yet no one in here gets you.
You've taken a very broad issue that's very well supported by evidence- racial bias in the criminal justice system- and reduced to a single question (are white police officers more prone to shooting black people than white people) with a small sample size and unreliable reporting.We've gone round and round on this and I feel like you guys have just ignored or glossed over the hard data that I've brought to the table. Let me start by saying I agree with you on one issue - blacks are profiled at a higher rate than whites. I've witnessed this myself when I've gone to the Mall with my sister (who is black).
But with regard to police brutality, you and the Left have been patently wrong on that issue for some time now, and it's really really annoying. I spent about 10 hours last year compiling and analyzing crime statistics and pulling together reports from multiple sources. I linked them all together and created a frequency measure that showed a ratio of the number of times an unarmed black person was shot by police per police encounter (that is the variable that is missing in all the stats). I wish I could find it - it was under my old General Tso id and I think it was in the Baltimore, Ferguson or Cincinnati threads. The data over the last three years showed that unarmed blacks were shot by police less frequently than whites. The ratios were remarkably close, but whites were shot at a slightly higher frequency.
And then there's the Washington University studies on implicit bias, which have repeatedly shown that white officers are less inclined to pull the trigger against a black than a white. These are controlled, scientific laboratory studies. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2016/04/27/this-study-found-race-matters-in-police-shootings-but-the-results-may-surprise-you/