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****OFFICIAL DYNASTY TRADES**** (32 Viewers)

menobrown said:
No offense but I think doing anything publicly where you try and unite forces with other league members or suggest leagues members unite is collusion and I disdain it feel it's not in the spirit of this hobby. I'll also add, at least when it comes to me, colluding against me is not the best way to ever think I'm going to cut you a good deal on a potential cut. I'd rather just cut someone and make you bid on him with the rest of the colluders and if that is cutting off my nose to save my face so be it.

As for them being right I have tried to impress upon them that they are are welcome to submit blind bids on our scraps after we cut them and drain their FA money competing against each other or deal with us reasonably and if they don't someone else likely will so their choice. Either way having to many good players is a good problem to have, those jackals keep laughing at us like we screwed ourselves having to many good players and it's the strangest thought process I've ever seen.
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Meno, is this an FFPC league? I so, I hope you are beating their asses every year.

On one hand if it isn't specifically prohibited in the rules, (defined as collusion) it is difficult to raise objections.

On the other hand, I see no upside in participating in that type of discussion on a message. It will only foster bad blood, making it more difficult to negotiate with the targeted owner in the future. 

 
menobrown said:
No offense but I think doing anything publicly where you try and unite forces with other league members or suggest leagues members unite is collusion and I disdain it feel it's not in the spirit of this hobby. I'll also add, at least when it comes to me, colluding against me is not the best way to ever think I'm going to cut you a good deal on a potential cut. I'd rather just cut someone and make you bid on him with the rest of the colluders and if that is cutting off my nose to save my face so be it.

As for them being right I have tried to impress upon them that they are are welcome to submit blind bids on our scraps after we cut them and drain their FA money competing against each other or deal with us reasonably and if they don't someone else likely will so their choice. Either way having to many good players is a good problem to have, those jackals keep laughing at us like we screwed ourselves having to many good players and it's the strangest thought process I've ever seen.
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Maybe my tone didn't come through, but my post was all about the gamesmanship of it.  "Heck yeah, we should totally cut them out" "psst, I'll be shooting you an offer out in a moment".  They might be right that you have a surplus and will have tough cuts, but they are kidding themselves if they think banding together like that will do any good.

I wouldn't condone a serious attempt at collusion like that.  My tone probably didn't come through because I don't take something like that seriously.  My guess is that this group doesn't have a lot of experience with this type of league because this kind of thing can't be successful because someone will always break the picket line.  I would be all about the few that think they can pull it off to fool themselves and stay out of it - they are only hurting themselves by not creating more competition for me/us and raising the prices. 

And you're right, even if it goes that way and you end up cutting guys, there is going to be blood in the water on the waiver bidding - and probably overpaying to make sure they win the bid compared to what they could have gotten in a trade.  Their attempt to cut you out will end up hurting them collectively more than it will you.  That kind of folly is hard for me to see as a legit threat.

 
barackdhouse said:
12 team PPR

Team A - Martavis, 2018 5th

Team B - John Ross, 2018 2nd (mid to late)
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Rebuild, competing, or otherwise..easy side to Bryant (and Ross was higher on my board than most boards). 

 
Hankmoody said:
Maybe my tone didn't come through, but my post was all about the gamesmanship of it.  "Heck yeah, we should totally cut them out" "psst, I'll be shooting you an offer out in a moment".  They might be right that you have a surplus and will have tough cuts, but they are kidding themselves if they think banding together like that will do any good.

I wouldn't condone a serious attempt at collusion like that.  My tone probably didn't come through because I don't take something like that seriously.  My guess is that this group doesn't have a lot of experience with this type of league because this kind of thing can't be successful because someone will always break the picket line.  I would be all about the few that think they can pull it off to fool themselves and stay out of it - they are only hurting themselves by not creating more competition for me/us and raising the prices. 

And you're right, even if it goes that way and you end up cutting guys, there is going to be blood in the water on the waiver bidding - and probably overpaying to make sure they win the bid compared to what they could have gotten in a trade.  Their attempt to cut you out will end up hurting them collectively more than it will you.  That kind of folly is hard for me to see as a legit threat.
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I'm sorry, I was really not trying to single you out or make you feel need to explain.

You are right someone will always break the picket line. In fact someone did during the rookie draft and it was a huge relief. It really solved the lions share of our cut problems and now just need to trim a few more and we got a whole training camp of hype to do that. And the league was high pissed when the guy dealt with us, especially when he was one of the teams saying to not deal with us to he kind of used your strategy, well in fact they all have. Every single one of them who said publicly not to deal with us made us offers but most are one sided thinking they got us bent over the barrel but we got a fair offer and jumped on it.

 
menobrown said:
I'm sorry, I was really not trying to single you out or make you feel need to explain.

You are right someone will always break the picket line. In fact someone did during the rookie draft and it was a huge relief. It really solved the lions share of our cut problems and now just need to trim a few more and we got a whole training camp of hype to do that. And the league was high pissed when the guy dealt with us, especially when he was one of the teams saying to not deal with us to he kind of used your strategy, well in fact they all have. Every single one of them who said publicly not to deal with us made us offers but most are one sided thinking they got us bent over the barrel but we got a fair offer and jumped on it.
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It's all good.  My original post could have been miscontrued so the clarification was needed anyway.  I was just amused that people actually think that a bunch of players could ever hold out like that.  Funny to hear that their "attempt" didn't last the first wave of opportunity.  If they aren't idiots they will realize that they can't win a stalemate because no owner worth his salt is going to let it get to that.  I post in every league, at every cut deadline "PM me your cuts, one man's trash, yadda yadda" because I know I can get bargains easier there than I can in a FAAB competition. 

 
menobrown said:
I'm sorry, I was really not trying to single you out or make you feel need to explain.

You are right someone will always break the picket line. In fact someone did during the rookie draft and it was a huge relief. It really solved the lions share of our cut problems and now just need to trim a few more and we got a whole training camp of hype to do that. And the league was high pissed when the guy dealt with us, especially when he was one of the teams saying to not deal with us to he kind of used your strategy, well in fact they all have. Every single one of them who said publicly not to deal with us made us offers but most are one sided thinking they got us bent over the barrel but we got a fair offer and jumped on it.
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It's always fun when half the league gangs up against your team.  Happened in two out of my three FFPC leagues. 

 
Some trades I'm not involved in any

Joe Williams for Kevin White (0.5 PPR)

Duke Johnson for Theo Riddick (0.5 PPR)

Jarvis Landry for 1.6 (Perine) (0.5 PPR)

LeSean McCoy for Tevin Coleman (0.5 PPR)

Elliott for David Johnson and Carlos Hyde (1 PPR)

Landry for Enuwa, Reed (1 PPR)

Crowell for DeMarco, Gabriel, late 2018 2nd (no PPR)

Melvin Gordon for Crowell, mid 2018 1st (1 PPR)

1.1 (Fournette), 2018 4th for Allen Robinson, 1.7 (OJ Howard), 2019 2nd

 
thriftyrocker said:
Some trades I'm not involved in any

Joe Williams for Kevin White (0.5 PPR)

Duke Johnson for Theo Riddick (0.5 PPR)

Jarvis Landry for 1.6 (Perine) (0.5 PPR)

LeSean McCoy for Tevin Coleman (0.5 PPR)

Elliott for David Johnson and Carlos Hyde (1 PPR)

Landry for Enuwa, Reed (1 PPR)

Crowell for DeMarco, Gabriel, late 2018 2nd (no PPR)

Melvin Gordon for Crowell, mid 2018 1st (1 PPR)

1.1 (Fournette), 2018 4th for Allen Robinson, 1.7 (OJ Howard), 2019 2nd
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Wow.  Since when is Zeke worth that much more than DJ to have to add Hyde?  Steal for whoever got DJ and Hyde

 
Sitch said:
Wow.  Since when is Zeke worth that much more than DJ to have to add Hyde?  Steal for whoever got DJ and Hyde
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I don't think it's bad.  They are a toss up short term and Elliott is 3.5 years younger.  Paying Hyde for that extra 3.5 years of youth isn't a bad move.

Elliott - 7/22/95

DJ - 12/16/91

 
ILUVBEER99 said:
I don't think it's bad.  They are a toss up short term and Elliott is 3.5 years younger.  Paying Hyde for that extra 3.5 years of youth isn't a bad move.

Elliott - 7/22/95

DJ - 12/16/91
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Agree the age is a big factor plus you have to factor in stuff like Palmer is very much year to year and that's a concern for DJ if they have an issue getting a quality replacement because running against a stacked box was one of his few weak area's last year. Meanwhile I think Dallas keeps the main core of their OL intact for at least most if not all of the duration of Elliot's rookie deal which means you are likely looking at 4 more years of running behind a dominant OL.

 Hyde would not close the DJ gap on Elliot for me.

 
ILUVBEER99 said:
I don't think it's bad.  They are a toss up short term and Elliott is 3.5 years younger.  Paying Hyde for that extra 3.5 years of youth isn't a bad move.

Elliott - 7/22/95

DJ - 12/16/91
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They are not a toss-up in the short-term imo.  They are a toss-up overall because Elliot is 3.5 years younger.  The youth advantage is already factored in to their value being equal and is the only reason DJ isn't way ahead.

DJ outscored Elliot by 80 points last year.  Or to put it another way, the point difference between DJ and Elliot was the same as the point difference between Elliot and Mark Ingram.

 
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FreeBaGeL said:
They are not a toss-up in the short-term imo.  They are a toss-up overall because Elliot is 3.5 years younger.  The youth advantage is already factored in to their value being equal and is the only reason DJ isn't way ahead.

DJ outscored Elliot by 80 points last year.  Or to put it another way, the point difference between DJ and Elliot was the same as the point difference between Elliot and Mark Ingram.
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Elliot put up almost 2k total yards in 15 games his rookie season.

I'd put the FF betting line at about 60/40 in favor of DJ, but wouldn't be surprised one bit if Elliott outscored him.  So basically a toss up IMO.

 
FreeBaGeL said:
They are not a toss-up in the short-term imo.  They are a toss-up overall because Elliot is 3.5 years younger.  The youth advantage is already factored in to their value being equal and is the only reason DJ isn't way ahead.

DJ outscored Elliot by 80 points last year.  Or to put it another way, the point difference between DJ and Elliot was the same as the point difference between Elliot and Mark Ingram.
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It's not quite a toss up for 2017 but it's about as close as you can get. I got Bell/DJ as 1A/1b and Elliot #3.

Last year was last year and  I also think Elliot will be better this season, especially as a receiving threat, and I think the gap closes a good amount. ILUVBEER mentioned he'd put odds of Elliot outdoing him in the 40% range as well and that's about how I'd see it but I still won't call it dead even which means it's not a  toss up because I would take DJ for 2017.

Now you said short term, not necessarily 2017. If short terms is a two or three year window I'd either take Elliot straight up or at worse label it a true coin flip toss up. Why? Got a head coach battling some health issues and a QB and both top WR's who could all be gone after this season. To much unknown and instability is a concern for me especially when it impacts the passing game for a player who relies so heavily on his receiving.  Due to Bell's injury history and what I view as strong chance he hits UFA next season, even if I"m just talking the next 2-3 years, which for some is short term, I'd likely take Elliot over both of them and again at a minimum would categorize it as a toss up.

 
10 team -2 QB start, tiered PPR(.5 pt. for RB, 1 pt. WR,1.5 for TE) Dynasty league with IDP 

Team A is same team for all four trades

1) Team B received:

D Murray, D Henry, Paul Perkins, Shane Vereen, Calais Cambell and  2.2 

Team A relieved:

Tom Savage, Jonathan Stewart, Cameron Artis-Payne, Chris Ivory, Jerick McKinnon, Latavius Murray, Pierre Garçon, Stephon Tuitt & 1.5

2) Team B recieved: 

A. Dalton, A.J. McCarron, D. Baldwin, Jordan Reed, 4.2, 5.2 & 6.2

Team A recieved:

T.J. Yeldon, M.Thomas, 2018 1st rounder(likely 6-10 range)

3) Team B recieved:

Terrelle Pryor, Khalil Mack & 3.2

Team A recieved:

Ty Montgomery, Allen Hurns, Ben Heeney, 2.9, 5.9 & 8.9

4) Team B recieved: 

M. Bennett

Team A recieved:

Zach Brown 

 
32 Counter Pass said:
Team A gives L. Miller & D. Baldwin

Team B gives A. Abdullah & S. Diggs
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Prefer Miller & Baldwin. But it's close, and don't fault anyone for wanting to take a chance on Abdullah since we haven't really seen him get much of a chance yet. Whereas Miller's ceiling is pretty well established at this point.

 
FFPC  

Team A gives:
Antonio Brown (WR), PIT 
DeMarco Murray (RB), TEN 
Theo Riddick (RB), DET 
Samaje Perine (RB), WAS 
2018 2nd Round Draft Pick (expected to be late)

Team B gives:
Ezekiel Elliott (RB), DAL
Stefon Diggs (WR), MIN 
Jack Doyle (TE), IND 
Erik Swoope (TE), IND 

 
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non ppr, but a 1 point bonus at 5 catches and another two points at 10.  start 1 qb, 1 rb, 2 wrs, 3 flex, 1 te, idp

Carlos Hyde for Keenan Allen.

 
thriftyrocker said:
Some trades I'm not involved in any

Joe Williams for Kevin White (0.5 PPR)

Duke Johnson for Theo Riddick (0.5 PPR)

Jarvis Landry for 1.6 (Perine) (0.5 PPR)

LeSean McCoy for Tevin Coleman (0.5 PPR)

Elliott for David Johnson and Carlos Hyde (1 PPR)

Landry for Enuwa, Reed (1 PPR)

Crowell for DeMarco, Gabriel, late 2018 2nd (no PPR)

Melvin Gordon for Crowell, mid 2018 1st (1 PPR)

1.1 (Fournette), 2018 4th for Allen Robinson, 1.7 (OJ Howard), 2019 2nd
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I'm going to go try and get Gordon of that right now. I have a feeling I'll be laughed at. But my first should be late (lost in the super bowl last year).

ETA: Insta reject :lol:  

 
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32 Counter Pass said:
FFPC  

Team A gives:
Antonio Brown (WR), PIT 
DeMarco Murray (RB), TEN 
Theo Riddick (RB), DET 
Samaje Perine (RB), WAS 
2018 2nd Round Draft Pick (expected to be late)

Team B gives:
Ezekiel Elliott (RB), DAL
Stefon Diggs (WR), MIN 
Jack Doyle (TE), IND 
Erik Swoope (TE), IND 
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Zeke for me, but it's fair.

 
12 Team PPR

Gave: Burkhead/2018 1 (late)

Got: Martavis

I'm back on the train.

 
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barackdhouse said:
12 team PPR 

Team A - Juju, Paul Richardson

Team B - Carlos Henderson, D'Onta Foreman, 2018 3rd.
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Then the same two teams swapped PRich back. With a 2018 3rd added on to get Rob Kelley.

So, in the end:

Juju and Kelley

Carlos, Foreman, two 2018 3rds

 
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32 Counter Pass said:
FFPC  

Team A gives:
Antonio Brown (WR), PIT 
DeMarco Murray (RB), TEN 
Theo Riddick (RB), DET 
Samaje Perine (RB), WAS 
2018 2nd Round Draft Pick (expected to be late)

Team B gives:
Ezekiel Elliott (RB), DAL
Stefon Diggs (WR), MIN 
Jack Doyle (TE), IND 
Erik Swoope (TE), IND 
Click to expand...
This is very close but I would probably go Zeke side

 
That ODB trade sounds pretty fair and if anything I'd prefer the ODB side.

I think that it's a good illustration on the advantages of trading up early in a startup dynasty draft.  In terms of picks in my league that trade would have been 1.12, 3.06, 4.11 for 1.04, 20.12.  From a picks standpoint most people would see that as a massive ripoff in favor of the side moving back to 1.12, but in terms of players people prefer the 1.04 side.  In reality, in a startup, you could trade up from 1.12 to 1.04 range for a lot less than your 3rd and 4th rounder and get one of the big 4 for far less than most people would deem acceptable when looking at the actual players.

 
PPR WR/TE flex

Team A gave up Dixon, Kenneth BAL RB and Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.05 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.10 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.11

Team B gave up Henry, Derrick TEN RB and Hilton, T.Y. IND WR and Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.09 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 3.05

 
12 Team PPR 

just made an in draft trade. I took Mixon 1.1 Perine 1.6 and Mike Williams 1.7

I just dealt Mike Williams & my 2018 first for Corey Davis, 3.3 and 3.11 this year. 

Andrew Luck/Matthew Stafford - David Johnson/Joe Mixon/Samaje Perine/Rob Kelley - Julio Jones/Brandin Cooks/Keenan Allen/Martavis Bryant/Corey Davis/Tyreek Hill - Martellus Bennett - Texans D - Dan Bailey - 3.3 - 3.11 and 2 free agents after the draft

 
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Kleck said:
PPR WR/TE flex

Team A gave up Dixon, Kenneth BAL RB and Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.05 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.10 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.11

Team B gave up Henry, Derrick TEN RB and Hilton, T.Y. IND WR and Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.09 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 3.05
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Henry/Hilton side in a landslide.  For me it is...

Henry = 1.05 (roughly)

Hilton >>> Dixon + 2.10 + 2.11

1.09 > nothing

3.05 > nothing

 
Kleck said:
PPR WR/TE flex

Team A gave up Dixon, Kenneth BAL RB and Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.05 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.10 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 2.11

Team B gave up Henry, Derrick TEN RB and Hilton, T.Y. IND WR and Year 2017 Draft Pick 1.09 and Year 2017 Draft Pick 3.05
Click to expand...
WTF?

 
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