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****OFFICIAL DYNASTY TRADES**** (30 Viewers)

jeaton6 said:
I’d prefer spending those assets for Zeke rather than an unknown. Assets handily unless this is FFPC.
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What sort of pick/player could the combination of Hyde, Kupp, and pick 7 get?

Maybe pick 2?  Mixon or mccaffrey or something?

I dont like the pieces of that package much except Julio and would have to feel pretty confident i could move them all for something i lime better if i was to take this package.  

 
TheBottomLine said:
Really?  I'd go the other side without hesitation.  
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I was a little surprised at that comment as well. Shaheen was a third/fourth round rookie pick in the last draft and while he showed some flashes the other side of the trade has much more potential imo. I'm not the biggest Corey Coleman fan but he was a first round NFL pick and went in the 1.04-1.06 range in rookie drafts and Marquise Lee put together two good seasons in a row. The Falcons have not used Hooper enough, but imo he has just as much upside as Shaheen from a talent perspective.

 
-OZ- said:
Shaheen rather easily
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That's kind of puzzling - did you miss Corey Coleman?  I'd take him flat out over Shaheen and I'm an AU alum (Shaheen's school) so love the guy.  Flip Lee and Hooper for whatever picks they draw (2nd?  late 1st for both?) and I'm happy as a clam.

 
16 man PPR

I gave Deshaun Watson

I got Diggs

I inherited this team and it's deficient at WR so this felt like an easy one to make.

 
Hankmoody said:
That's kind of puzzling - did you miss Corey Coleman?  I'd take him flat out over Shaheen and I'm an AU alum (Shaheen's school) so love the guy.  Flip Lee and Hooper for whatever picks they draw (2nd?  late 1st for both?) and I'm happy as a clam.
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In a 10 team league I want guys I think have a better chance of being studs. I'll gladly give guys that will ride my bench or serve as waiver fodder. 

If you can get a 2nd for Lee or a 1st for Lee and Hooper, good on ya, but that is robbery imo. 

Doc Ock mentioned Hooper having the same upside as Shaheen. I must underrate Hooper by a lot as doc usually isn't out to lunch on these things but I don't see that as the case. To be sure, Hooper has TE1 ability, but Shaheen imo has ability close to kelce, and I suspect Nagy will see what he has in Shaheen. 

Coleman might be a great buy low right now but he looked horrible this year. 

In a deeper league I take the other side. In a 10 team league, I'm taking Shaheen and the pick.

 
-OZ- said:
To be sure, Hooper has TE1 ability, but Shaheen imo has ability close to kelce, and I suspect Nagy will see what he has in Shaheen. 
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Genuine question - what do you see in Shaheen? I don't see him as that great of a fantasy talent. He is big and mobile, but not that fast. He seems closer to Rudolph than Kelce, for me.

 
thriftyrocker said:
Genuine question - what do you see in Shaheen? I don't see him as that great of a fantasy talent. He is big and mobile, but not that fast. He seems closer to Rudolph than Kelce, for me.
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You're right that Kelce isn't a perfect comp, no TE is as fast as Kelce. Kelce was mentioned more in reference to his coaching, despite Reid's reluctance to use Kelce early, Nagy seems to know how to use his players, and he should use Shaheen. If we want to use comps, I see more Jimmy Graham than Rudolph has been pretty good too.

 
-OZ- said:
In a 10 team league I want guys I think have a better chance of being studs. I'll gladly give guys that will ride my bench or serve as waiver fodder. 

If you can get a 2nd for Lee or a 1st for Lee and Hooper, good on ya, but that is robbery imo. 

Doc Ock mentioned Hooper having the same upside as Shaheen. I must underrate Hooper by a lot as doc usually isn't out to lunch on these things but I don't see that as the case. To be sure, Hooper has TE1 ability, but Shaheen imo has ability close to kelce, and I suspect Nagy will see what he has in Shaheen. 

Coleman might be a great buy low right now but he looked horrible this year. 

In a deeper league I take the other side. In a 10 team league, I'm taking Shaheen and the pick.
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I would have thought from a value perspective you'd have to take the Coleman side, no questions asked. I really like the possibilities with Shaheen next year and I don't believe that Hooper has shown anything really to suggest he has genuine TE1 ability or really much upside at all. To me, Shaheen is a much better asset. Still, even taking the other pieces out of the deal I'd snap accept getting Coleman for Shaheen and a third rounder. The pick is a bit more valuable in IDP, but not that much. 

 
Minor deal but please read format before commenting on it

2QB 3WR 2RB 2TE 2Flex 10 team .5ppr

AJ McCarron 

for

Eric Ebron 

The team getting McCarron has Prescott/Ryan/A. Smith, and has Olsen/Clay/OJ Howard/Shaheen/McDonald still at TE.  While the team giving up McCarron has Flacco/Rivers/Lynch/Tannehill/Cutler/Foles and only Kelce/Kroft/Reed at TE.  Seems to make sense for both teams.  

 
-OZ- said:
You're right that Kelce isn't a perfect comp, no TE is as fast as Kelce.
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There are a few faster but I think speed at TE is overrated. Gronk ran a 4.68 at his pro day but he seems to get open fine.  Tony G a 4.83, no idea on Gates but I'd guess not very fast.

Back to Shaheen I can see why you'd think he has more upside than Coleman. Can see it and agree with it.

This to me boils down to how you manage your team. Because the people who are saying the other side of the deal is better value are correct, today. If you manage your fantasy teams like a stock, and a lot of people do, the other side of the deal is absolutely better. I don't manage my teams that way myself.  I'll misfire like everyone else,  but I try and get players I actually like and believe in them enough to think that eventually they'll be the more valuable piece.

 
Zyphros said:
Minor deal but please read format before commenting on it

2QB 3WR 2RB 2TE 2Flex 10 team .5ppr

AJ McCarron 

for

Eric Ebron 

The team getting McCarron has Prescott/Ryan/A. Smith, and has Olsen/Clay/OJ Howard/Shaheen/McDonald still at TE.  While the team giving up McCarron has Flacco/Rivers/Lynch/Tannehill/Cutler/Foles and only Kelce/Kroft/Reed at TE.  Seems to make sense for both teams.  
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Ebron and I did read the comments.  I just don't see McCarron equal to Ebron.

 
Zyphros said:
Minor deal but please read format before commenting on it

2QB 3WR 2RB 2TE 2Flex 10 team .5ppr

AJ McCarron 

for

Eric Ebron 

The team getting McCarron has Prescott/Ryan/A. Smith, and has Olsen/Clay/OJ Howard/Shaheen/McDonald still at TE.  While the team giving up McCarron has Flacco/Rivers/Lynch/Tannehill/Cutler/Foles and only Kelce/Kroft/Reed at TE.  Seems to make sense for both teams.  
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Maybe if McCarron gets out of cincy and lands a starting gig. Ebron has had a positive career arc and is in his 4th year which is commonly when tes blossom. I don’t think mccarron is going to turn into a great fantasy qb either way, so I’m solidly on the Ebron side. All he really needs to be a top 5 te is some tds. 

 
Snorkelson said:
Maybe if McCarron gets out of cincy and lands a starting gig. Ebron has had a positive career arc and is in his 4th year which is commonly when tes blossom. I don’t think mccarron is going to turn into a great fantasy qb either way, so I’m solidly on the Ebron side. All he really needs to be a top 5 te is some tds. 
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I assume his assumption for acquiring McCarron was that he ends up being a starter somewhere.  I've like McCarron a while too and Ebron has been pretty underwhelming, new scenery could change that for both these players.  Anyone know if the Lions have picked up his option yet?  

 
Zyphros said:
I assume his assumption for acquiring McCarron was that he ends up being a starter somewhere.  I've like McCarron a while too and Ebron has been pretty underwhelming, new scenery could change that for both these players.  Anyone know if the Lions have picked up his option yet?  
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That has to be done prior to the player's 4th season.  The Lions exercised their option on Ebron 5/2/17

 
Hankmoody said:
That has to be done prior to the player's 4th season.  The Lions exercised their option on Ebron 5/2/17
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Yeah I looked into it a bit after I posted ha.  So it's non-guaranteed salary even though they picked up the option?  New coaching staff could still cut him no?  

 
Zyphros said:
Yeah I looked into it a bit after I posted ha.  So it's non-guaranteed salary even though they picked up the option?  New coaching staff could still cut him no?  
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Yes they can cut or trade him if they want.  Quinn said he'd be back but if Patricia said he hated him I'm sure Quinn would oblige.

I thought Ebron closed strong myself and they are glad to retain his rights another year. I think it would take someone coming to Lions with a trade offer they can't refuse for him not to be a Lion next year. Texans did reportedly have interest near the deadline, not impossible but I don't see him getting cut.

 
RushHour said:
I would have thought from a value perspective you'd have to take the Coleman side, no questions asked. I really like the possibilities with Shaheen next year and I don't believe that Hooper has shown anything really to suggest he has genuine TE1 ability or really much upside at all. To me, Shaheen is a much better asset. Still, even taking the other pieces out of the deal I'd snap accept getting Coleman for Shaheen and a third rounder. The pick is a bit more valuable in IDP, but not that much. 
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If this were even 2 months ago, yes. 

I'm might be overreacting but Coleman was simply abysmal at the end of this year. The QB didn't help for sure, but he has done virtually nothing to warrant us thinking he's going to become a valuable player. Other than his draft slot - which means nothing when it's the browns.

 
Zyphros said:
I assume his assumption for acquiring McCarron was that he ends up being a starter somewhere.  I've like McCarron a while too and Ebron has been pretty underwhelming, new scenery could change that for both these players.  Anyone know if the Lions have picked up his option yet?  
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Ebrons expectations have never been realistic. He’s progressed every year and cut out a lot of the mental errors. He still drops one here and there but Stafford seemed to find him in big spots this year. It seems like the red zone looks would be there but the lions frustratingly have tried to run inside the 5 when they just plain can’t. Perhaps he never becomes a focal point but I think a floor of 55/550/4 is reasonable and it wouldn’t be hard for him to better that. 

McCarron on the other hand, if he becomes an unrestricted free agent, will be entering what should be a pretty solid qb market, with a deep qb rookie class, and isn’t a guaranteed starter imo. Unless Hugh Jackson wants him I don’t see teams lining up for McCarron based on what he’s shown over cousins, Taylor, Bradford/keenum/bridgewater, 

I guess I feel McCarron should be cheaper even in 2 qb leagues (2 te mitigates value difference) and I’ll take the guy that will see the field rather than hope or sit on aj for a year taking up a roster spot. 

 
menobrown said:
This to me boils down to how you manage your team. Because the people who are saying the other side of the deal is better value are correct, today. If you manage your fantasy teams like a stock, and a lot of people do, the other side of the deal is absolutely better. I don't manage my teams that way myself.  I'll misfire like everyone else,  but I try and get players I actually like and believe in them enough to think that eventually they'll be the more valuable piece.
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This is purely anecdotal but over a period of 10 years across 6-7 dynasty leagues, I've never seen someone who does things this way (to clarify, your way, but this isn't an attack on you at all--just a jumping-off point) have sustained success. Never. The harsh reality is that almost nobody is really that good at hand-picking talent and being consistently right about it across a large sample size. Not without a ton of luck. I've most often found that owners who observe "wisdom of the crowd" values enough to make smart trades, stockpile value, and flip it for safer studs do better in the long run, consistently keeping value on their rosters, which allows them to buy the players they want anyways. 

Now I can see how that would be significantly less fun for some owners than the strategy you subscribe to--you run your teams much more like an NFL team does, making your evaluations and standing by them as you collect players you value more than anyone else--sometimes by being on the less popular end of a deal that got you "your guy". Across my leagues these types of owners usually stubbornly end up with lots and lots of untradeable players who lose their shine, because they got cute and held guys they believed in because somewhere along the way they convinced themselves they were a scout. Lots of ugly rosters in my leagues belong to owners who target and stockpile "their guys" regardless of market value.

That doesn't mean they aren't having fun. We all play dynasty for different reasons. 

I just personally haven't seen it work over a long period of time. Playing the dynasty 'stock market' and staying active means you get stuck holding the bag and losing the value on guys you're wrong about way less often--assuming you continued trading upwards into safer, obvious studs. 

 
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ConnSKINS26 said:
This is purely anecdotal but over a period of 10 years across 6-7 dynasty leagues, I've never seen someone who does things this way (to clarify, your way, but this isn't an attack on you at all--just a jumping-off point) have sustained success. Never. The harsh reality is that almost nobody is really that good at hand-picking talent and being consistently right about it across a large sample size. Not without a ton of luck. I've most often found that owners who observe "wisdom of the crowd" values enough to make smart trades, stockpile value, and flip it for safer studs do better in the long run, consistently keeping value on their rosters, which allows them to buy the players they want anyways. 

Now I can see how that would be significantly less fun for some owners than the strategy you subscribe to--you run your teams much more like an NFL team does, making your evaluations and standing by them as you collect players you value more than anyone else--sometimes by being on the less popular end of a deal that got you "your guy". Across my leagues these types of owners usually stubbornly end up with lots and lots of untradeable players who lose their shine, because they got cute and held guys they believed in because somewhere along the way they convinced themselves they were a scout. Lots of ugly rosters in my leagues belong to owners who target and stockpile "their guys" regardless of market value.

That doesn't mean they aren't having fun. We all play dynasty for different reasons. 

I just personally haven't seen it work over a long period of time. Playing the dynasty 'stock market' and staying active means you get stuck holding the bag and losing the value on guys you're wrong about way less often--assuming you continued trading upwards into safer, obvious studs. 
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It's fine if you have not seen it work and I pretty much can't defend myself without coming off like a ##### but  I've been highly successful at dynasty for several years and have seen many other players with a similar strategy do the same.

What I've personally never seen is someone who can't evaluate talent doing well.

 
menobrown said:
It's fine if you have not seen it work and I pretty much can't defend myself without coming off like a ##### but  I've been highly successful at dynasty for several years and have seen many other players with a similar strategy do the same.

What I've personally never seen is someone who can't evaluate talent doing well.
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You may be correct. And I've been reading your posts here for years, I absolutely believe that you've had success doing it your way. 

But I would contend that a good communicator, who reads enough to stay up on current market values can do well in dynasty never watching a single clip of football. If you play it like the stock market, keep up on your leaguemates and their values vs. generally "accepted" market values, stay active in the trade market, and always consolidate value into your starting lineup--you can do pretty damn well without pretending you are going to write the next Rookie Scouting Portfolio. 

I probably watched less football than ever before--both college and NFL--this past year just due to being busy in life...and I won 3 leagues, won another devy/dynasty bestball, and made the playoffs in another. That's 5/6 leagues where I'd contend I was "successful", 4/6 leagues that I literally won and took home the majority of the pot. These are competitive leagues, 14 owners, mostly devy leagues.

Can only speak for myself, but I stay on top of my ####, I know values and I keep track of my leaguemates tendencies--hell, I generally have ongoing private message/email chains with most owners across my leagues where we talk values/trade ideas/general football chatter. Paying attention, being active, and being a good communicator are by far the most important assets a dynasty owner can possess imo. Not some mythical "eye for talent". 

I used to be one of the guys who watched hours of cut-ups on draftbreakdown (when it still existed), tons of highlights, etc. Wanted to "scout for myself", and had extremely strong opinions on guys' talent and skill-sets. I still do this to some degree, its not like I've completely detached from this part of dynasty. But I do much less of it, and I'm as successful, if not more successful, than ever. 

No, you can't do well in dynasty if you can't "evaluate talent"--if the way you run your teams relies on your eye for talent. Again, its just my own experience, but learning how to rationally set aside whatever talent you may think you have for watching football players, and just making smart moves based on market value, consistently trading upward in value whenever you can--that's a perfectly viable strategy in dynasty, and technically doesn't need to involve watching any football at all, nevermind actually having a scout's eye for talent. 

 
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Lots of ways to be successful in fantasy. Some people get a high pick and move back over and over to get more assets, some people trade picks for established vets. Some people are good at it, some people aren’t. It’s hard to quantify if one method is “faster” or “better” because there is a lot of variance. 

 
Zealots Field (non-PPR)

Traded 1.09/1.10/1.12

Received Odell Beckham Jr and 3.06

I had a good WR corps (A Brown, Dez, C Coleman, Cooper, AJ Green, Watkins) but some age (Brown, Dez, Green) and top-line uncertainty (Dez, Coleman and Cooper) made me want what I feel is a lock at the top with Brown.

The other team is in rebuilding mode.

 
Spike said:
Zealots Field (non-PPR)

Traded 1.09/1.10/1.12

Received Odell Beckham Jr and 3.06

I had a good WR corps (A Brown, Dez, C Coleman, Cooper, AJ Green, Watkins) but some age (Brown, Dez, Green) and top-line uncertainty (Dez, Coleman and Cooper) made me want what I feel is a lock at the top with Brown.

The other team is in rebuilding mode.
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Nice deal for you

 
Spike said:
Zealots Field (non-PPR)

Traded 1.09/1.10/1.12

Received Odell Beckham Jr and 3.06

I had a good WR corps (A Brown, Dez, C Coleman, Cooper, AJ Green, Watkins) but some age (Brown, Dez, Green) and top-line uncertainty (Dez, Coleman and Cooper) made me want what I feel is a lock at the top with Brown.

The other team is in rebuilding mode.
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That’s pretty light for obj. Now you got brown obj green to start and three young guys to wait and see on (or that have enough value that you could move them). 

ETA: After reading this again, “pretty light” means robbery. Seems he could have gotten the picks and one of those WRs on top. 

 
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Spike said:
Zealots Field (non-PPR)

Traded 1.09/1.10/1.12

Received Odell Beckham Jr and 3.06

I had a good WR corps (A Brown, Dez, C Coleman, Cooper, AJ Green, Watkins) but some age (Brown, Dez, Green) and top-line uncertainty (Dez, Coleman and Cooper) made me want what I feel is a lock at the top with Brown.

The other team is in rebuilding mode.
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Did you at least cuddle for a minute after? 

 
Spike said:
Zealots Field (non-PPR)

Traded 1.09/1.10/1.12

Received Odell Beckham Jr and 3.06

I had a good WR corps (A Brown, Dez, C Coleman, Cooper, AJ Green, Watkins) but some age (Brown, Dez, Green) and top-line uncertainty (Dez, Coleman and Cooper) made me want what I feel is a lock at the top with Brown.

The other team is in rebuilding mode.
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Do like how the guy had to throw in the 3.06 to make it work.

 
Snorkelson said:
Lots of ways to be successful in fantasy. Some people get a high pick and move back over and over to get more assets, some people trade picks for established vets. Some people are good at it, some people aren’t. It’s hard to quantify if one method is “faster” or “better” because there is a lot of variance. 
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I'll just venture to say that the best FFers incorporate several of the methods you guys are referring to into their strategy.  I know I do.  

 
Spike said:
Zealots Field (non-PPR)

Traded 1.09/1.10/1.12

Received Odell Beckham Jr and 3.06

I had a good WR corps (A Brown, Dez, C Coleman, Cooper, AJ Green, Watkins) but some age (Brown, Dez, Green) and top-line uncertainty (Dez, Coleman and Cooper) made me want what I feel is a lock at the top with Brown.

The other team is in rebuilding mode.
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Terrible 

 
Spike said:
Zealots Field (non-PPR)

Traded 1.09/1.10/1.12

Received Odell Beckham Jr and 3.06

I had a good WR corps (A Brown, Dez, C Coleman, Cooper, AJ Green, Watkins) but some age (Brown, Dez, Green) and top-line uncertainty (Dez, Coleman and Cooper) made me want what I feel is a lock at the top with Brown.

The other team is in rebuilding mode.
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I got offered the 1.03, 1.05, 1.10, 1.12 Moncrief and Pryor for OBJ.  Turned it down.  Not sure how Zealots leagues work but this is robbery for OBJ.  

 
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