kutta
Footballguy
Hmm. That’s a tough one. Thomas is my fav of the group, but the total value is on the Chark/Zeke side. I’d probably take what you gotFFPC SF
I gave Michael Thomas, Mike Davis
I got Chark, Zeke
Hmm. That’s a tough one. Thomas is my fav of the group, but the total value is on the Chark/Zeke side. I’d probably take what you gotFFPC SF
I gave Michael Thomas, Mike Davis
I got Chark, Zeke
Jefferson should pull that on his own IMO.2 different FFPC SF leagues not involved:
Team A gives Swift, Aiyuk
Team B gives Zeke, Jefferson, Daniel Jones
Team X gives Godwin
Team Y gives Bateman, Toney, Garopollo
Kamara side but if all this Rodgers drama blows over and he keeps on playing then a big win for that side IMO. Nice gamble.12 PPR SF
Traded: Aaron Rodgers, Ekeler
Received: Kamara, Aiyuk
Don't understand the comments on this one being one sided.2 different FFPC SF leagues not involved:
Team A gives Swift, Aiyuk
Team B gives Zeke, Jefferson, Daniel Jones
Doesn’t seem like enough value to move back that far in a startup IMO. Based on ADP I looked at it’s like going from Dalvin Cook or Kamara down to a Dobbins or a Najee Harris.ghostguy123 said:FFPC Startup draft, hasn't started yet.
Pick 14 and a future 1st
For
Pick 4
The 2nd one seems fair but I'd definitely take Zeke/Jefferson over Swift/Aiyuk. I know I'm lower on Swift than others but Jefferson is by far the best player in this trade.2 different FFPC SF leagues not involved:
Team A gives Swift, Aiyuk
Team B gives Zeke, Jefferson, Daniel Jones
Team X gives Godwin
Team Y gives Bateman, Toney, Garopollo
Depends on your initial strategy and what will be available.Doesn’t seem like enough value to move back that far in a startup IMO. Based on ADP I looked at it’s like going from Dalvin Cook or Kamara down to a Dobbins or a Najee Harris.
Claypool side by a mile.12 Team PPR
Team gave Rashad Bateman, Elijah Mitchell
Team got Chase Claypool, 2022 2nd
Detroit is already talking about J-Will being a "lead" back. I think some of it is smoke screen but that does make it seem more like a split than Swift's backfield. Plus, Gurley coming in for a visit. A new QB, a new coach who has never coached in the league, and a team that has had 1 1000 yard rusher in the past 15 years. No thanks for overpaying on Swift. I think he is valued too high.Don't understand the comments on this one being one sided.
If you looked at this as ADP in startups it would look like this:
2.10 and 3.8 for 2.8, 6.7 and 8.4.
No Detroit is not talking about Williams being the lead back. That is not remotely what Lynn was saying. There was no smokescreen in what he was saying. If you are concerned about Gurely you've not been watching the last few years. I own Jefferson and Swift on the same team and their values are close, but I know Swift is more valuable to that team.Detroit is already talking about J-Will being a "lead" back. I think some of it is smoke screen but that does make it seem more like a split than Swift's backfield. Plus, Gurley coming in for a visit. A new QB, a new coach who has never coached in the league, and a team that has had 1 1000 yard rusher in the past 15 years. No thanks for overpaying on Swift. I think he is valued too high.
I'm a Niner fan so I like Aiyuk but I'm not buying him as that great either. He did all his damage last year when Deebo and Kittle was hurt. Plus, your telling me Zeke is a mid-6th round pick in start up drafts. I wouldn't trust that site at all. I would say your numbers there are very wrong. There is no way that Jefferson and Zeek are 2.8 and 6.7.
It’s not terrible, just not enough for me. The ADP I looked at you’re generally moving yourself out of top WR range which is why I listed Dobbins and Harris. But you could always try to move back up a few spots or continue moving down as you said.Depends on your initial strategy and what will be available.
At 14 the last draft I saw could be Tyreek or Derrick Henry. I see Metcalf there sometimes.
Not to mention the possibility of another trade back to maybe pick 30-ish for another future 1st. Still pretty good players on the board there
Yeah I'm surprised by some of the comments too. I personally like the Swift/Aiyuk side quite a bit but I think it's a perfectly square deal. I love Jefferson, too, but I think this is mostly about people hating on Swift. Hating on Aiyuk, too, I guess.Don't understand the comments on this one being one sided.
I don't believe Williams will be the lead back either but I don't think Swift gets a ton of the carries either. I'm not worried about Gurley because I'm not a Swift owner but if they sign him it shows they don't believe Swift is a bell cow back and as I learned long ago not to trust Detroit RBs. I love his talent though and wish he was playing somewhere else. I know Swift/Jefferson are ranked close to each other for a lot of people. I'm just not one of them.No Detroit is not talking about Williams being the lead back. That is not remotely what Lynn was saying. There was no smokescreen in what he was saying. If you are concerned about Gurely you've not been watching the last few years. I own Jefferson and Swift on the same team and their values are close, but I know Swift is more valuable to that team.
No I'm not telling you Zeke is a mid 6th round in startups. That would be Aiyuk. (ETA- I see the mistake I made, will correct that post. The site is accurate, I'm not.)
The site is 100% accurate for FFPC.
I love Aiyuk as a real NFL player. Proud Niner fan since 85. I just know that they don't exactly produce great WRs in fantasy, his numbers last year were mostly without Kittle & Deebo, and a new QB is coming. Just don't see elite fantasy production there but I like having him on my NFL team.Yeah I'm surprised by some of the comments too. I personally like the Swift/Aiyuk side quite a bit but I think it's a perfectly square deal. I love Jefferson, too, but I think this is mostly about people hating on Swift. Hating on Aiyuk, too, I guess.
FWIW Matt Harmon was gushing over Aiyuk in his Reception Perception the other day.
Even if I am willing to concede that Swift=Jefferson (which I am not), Zeke goes about 3 rounds earlier than Aiyuk in startups and you’re getting Jones on top in SF. Now Aiyuk could be an ascending talent and Zeke descending, with Jones possibly in his last year to prove he can hang onto the starting QB job. So that side isn’t terrible, but I much prefer the value of the other side.Yeah I'm surprised by some of the comments too. I personally like the Swift/Aiyuk side quite a bit but I think it's a perfectly square deal. I love Jefferson, too, but I think this is mostly about people hating on Swift. Hating on Aiyuk, too, I guess.
FWIW Matt Harmon was gushing over Aiyuk in his Reception Perception the other day.
Agree with the first sentence, but disagree that Gurley signals a lack of faith in Swift as a 3 down back.I don't believe Williams will be the lead back either but I don't think Swift gets a ton of the carries either. I'm not worried about Gurley because I'm not a Swift owner but if they sign him it shows they don't believe Swift is a bell cow back and as I learned long ago not to trust Detroit RBs.
Well said and I completely agree for the most part. I will probably be trying to buy low on Swift during the season personally. This trade is buying like he is a top 3 RB though and he isn't even close to that.Agree with the first sentence, but disagree that Gurley signals a lack of faith in Swift as a 3 down back.
I bet Gurley gets signed (Holmes was part of the team that drafted him to the Rams) for near league minimum, assuming his physical checks out, and this is a fairly ugly 3 way split this year... something like 40/40/20. The Lions are totally going all in on the 2019 Dolphins tanking strategy... dealing away all their good players for picks, signing vets to one year low cap hit deals, bringing in an entirely new coaching staff... and aiming for a complete rebuild.
Swift is going to disappoint everyone this year in all metrics except possibly efficiency. During the season with the RBBC angst at it's highest will be the time to buy him in anticipation of his true audition as lead back for a completely revamped Lions team in 2022/2023. I think the Williams and Gurley signings are an indication that the Lions don't want to inflict too much wear and tear on their future stud in an essentially lost year.
I believe the talent is there, but I think people aren't going to see it as soon as they are hoping and his value will drop as a result. I think Jefferson is in a value tier above Swift even if you don't buy into this theory... but if you do, that margin is wider.
I'm not really worried about Swift being a bell cow or not and because I assume he is not, I got him pegged for something in the 45-55% snap count range, if it's much more then that it's because injuries hit or he's playing a lot aligned out wide. I do get a sense the franchise understands it's not in win now mode and see's no benefit to running Swift into the ground. It's not about touches to me but the quality of touches. Kamara's been on of the best fantasy RB's since entered the league but he only averages 11 carries a game, CMC just a shade over 13. To me this is the kind of talent/usage I see in Swift. Ekeler would also be applicable. In my head I got him down as a 10-12 carry/4-5 catch guy, anticipating his total workload to be in the 16-18 touch range.I don't believe Williams will be the lead back either but I don't think Swift gets a ton of the carries either. I'm not worried about Gurley because I'm not a Swift owner but if they sign him it shows they don't believe Swift is a bell cow back and as I learned long ago not to trust Detroit RBs. I love his talent though and wish he was playing somewhere else. I know Swift/Jefferson are ranked close to each other for a lot of people. I'm just not one of them.
Totally agree. The Swift/Aiyuk side has to hit on all kinds of if's to get in the ballpark realm of production that Jefferson/Zeke have already proven capable of and are likely to repeat for the next couple years.Well said and I completely agree for the most part. I will probably be trying to buy low on Swift during the season personally. This trade is buying like he is a top 3 RB though and he isn't even close to that.
Totally agreed there. I'm a big time believer in building around RBs. I don't hate Swift and wouldn't mind having him but getting Zeke back in that trade makes Swift expendable for the next 2 years IMO. Just don't think the trade is that close. A free Danny Dimes in SF too. I would prefer the Jefferson/Zeke side if he wasn't even included. Swift should be fine, I'm just not sold on him being a top 3 RB ever. I could definitely be wrong though.I'm not really worried about Swift being a bell cow or not and because I assume he is not, I got him pegged for something in the 45-55% snap count range, if it's much more then that it's because injuries hit or he's playing a lot aligned out wide. I do get a sense the franchise understands it's not in win now mode and see's no benefit to running Swift into the ground. It's not about touches to me but the quality of touches. Kamara's been on of the best fantasy RB's since entered the league but he only averages 11 carries a game, CMC just a shade over 13. To me this is the kind of talent/usage I see in Swift. Ekeler would also be applicable. In my head I got him down as a 10-12 carry/4-5 catch guy, anticipating his total workload to be in the 16-18 touch range.
The fact he plays for the Lions being an issue has been discussed here and for me I not only care about the Lions decal on his helmet but view playing behind this OL as a major asset for Swift. Between the OL and easing back on his carriers his longevity projects well to me, of course injuries and luck always play a part in that as well.
I love Jefferson and actually own him more then Swift but position value of RB over WR is no small thing which is why I tend to view them as equal in value, but again the team I own them both on I believe losing Swift would hurt more which ties back to positional value.
I wouldI wouldn't bash someone who values Zeke over Swift straight up
Kind of depends on the team. I value Zeke or Swift in redraft leagues so if I was going all in for winning a Chip in the next 1-2 years, then there is nothing wrong with Zeke over Swift straight up.I would
They haven’t signed Gurley and I doubt they do.Agree with the first sentence, but disagree that Gurley signals a lack of faith in Swift as a 3 down back.
I bet Gurley gets signed (Holmes was part of the team that drafted him to the Rams) for near league minimum, assuming his physical checks out, and this is a fairly ugly 3 way split this year... something like 40/40/20. The Lions are totally going all in on the 2019 Dolphins tanking strategy... dealing away all their good players for picks, signing vets to one year low cap hit deals, bringing in an entirely new coaching staff... and aiming for a complete rebuild.
Swift is going to disappoint everyone this year in all metrics except possibly efficiency. During the season with the RBBC angst at it's highest will be the time to buy him in anticipation of his true audition as lead back for a completely revamped Lions team in 2022/2023. I think the Williams and Gurley signings are an indication that the Lions don't want to inflict too much wear and tear on their future stud in an essentially lost year.
I believe the talent is there, but I think people aren't going to see it as soon as they are hoping and his value will drop as a result. I think Jefferson is in a value tier above Swift even if you don't buy into this theory... but if you do, that margin is wider.
True but either way they signed J-Will, drafted Jermar Jefferson, and brought in Gurley to look at. Swift is still fine but I view Jefferson definitely higher. Zeke definitely over Aiyuk. Plus, they get a free starting QB with added weapons in SF format. Definitely can differ on Swift's value but I find it hard to see why people think that this isn't paying as if Swift is a top 3-5 RB right now and he isn't. It is an overpay. Could pay off though in the long run but would take a lot. I see that side losing this trade easily.They haven’t signed Gurley and I doubt they do.
I'm actually hoping they do so I can slide in and get Swift more often/cheaper.They haven’t signed Gurley and I doubt they do.
I’ve been wanting to find a better RB3 than David Johnson for my SF team that I feel is a contender, especially if I can buy solid depth. Mixon is one I’ve thought of targeting but I already have Burrow and now J Chase. If it’s just a late first and early 2nd value, I might have to be okay with such reliance on the Bengals offenseNot involved, 12 Team PPR, Superflex
Team gave AJ Dillon, 2022 1st, should be late
Team gave Joe Mixon
Team getting Mixon is in win now mode and Mixon is his RB3.
Cheap for Hock10 team, standard non-ppr
TJ Hockenson for 2021 #14 overall & ‘22 2nd (likely top 4).
Like Larry Fitzgerald? Why would anyone take that deal. You must mean Fitzpatrick.PantherThunder said:14 Team SF rookie draft
Gave up Fitzgerald, 1.05(would have been Pitts)
Got 1.04(Harris)
Shoulda/Coulda/Woulda gotten a little bag of chips coming back
I agree with you.Shawnky said:This just went down. Not involved. 12 team ppr.
Team A gives Javonte Williams, Shenault, Darnell Mooney
Team B gives D’andre Swift and 2022 4th rd rookie.
I personally like Williams/Shenault by quite a bit.
Opps Yes FitzpatrickLike Larry Fitzgerald? Why would anyone take that deal. You must mean Fitzpatrick.
That's way too light for Mixon, IMO. Dillon is buried by roster, if not by talent. I roster him and have come to no other conclusion than that he's worth something, for sure, but he and a first rounder next year shouldn't fetch Mixon. This year's class isn't supposed to be that deep, though who knows once the season goes along.Not involved, 12 Team PPR, Superflex
Team gave AJ Dillon, 2022 1st, should be late
Team gave Joe Mixon
Team getting Mixon is in win now mode and Mixon is his RB3.
I don't. Give me Swift.I agree with you.
Until he gets hurt. Which won't take long at sixteen to twenty touches per game.Swift will be a sixteen-twenty touch guy for sure in Detroit, and if he's lining up in the slot and whatnot, will be a PPR machine.
Huh. If you see him more as a twelve-sixteen touch guy, I won't disagree too vehemently, but I think you're on the short end of things. And if he is a twelve-sixteen touch kind of guy, then the trade does look different, I will admit.Until he gets hurt. Which won't take long at sixteen to twenty touches per game.
There’s no way for you to know that right now, and even if he is, how much are those touches really going to be worth on a bottom 3 offense? They have a downgrade at QB and just lost by far their best receiver. Their receiving group is laughably bad.Swift will be a sixteen-twenty touch guy for sure in Detroit
Sounds like some springtime coachspeak that we hear about players literally every year. I know Swift owners want to dismiss Jamaal Williams as being a positively ordinary player(and he may just be that as strictly a rusher) but he’s an above average pass catcher. He is not the guy you wanted to see Detroit go out and sign. It’s going to be a lot of him in the 4th Quarter this year when the Lions are trailing by 17 points. I like Swift. I’ve already said that on this forum multiple times. But I’m not paying what his market value is to acquire him in dynasty.and if he's lining up in the slot and whatnot, will be a PPR machine
Sure. I wasn't getting on you or saying you didn't like Swift. I was just laying out my reasoning for disagreeing so that people could understand why.I like Swift. I’ve already said that on this forum multiple times. But I’m not paying what his market value is to acquire him in dynasty.
For sure. I am kinda “meh” on Shenault, I’m not sure he’ll ever be a big-time difference maker in fantasy. Mooney, however, I am a fan of. Anxious to see what he can do once Fields takes over, as I do believe he is more than just a field stretcher. And I don’t expect much out of Williams this year, but I do like him quite a bit long-term. I’m a Tarheel fan so I had the pleasure of watching him in college(and high school, actually) so I pray it’s not my homer glasses blinding me a little, but I think he’s going to have a good career. I agree the trade is pretty fair, I just lean that side. I wish Swift were on a different team.Sure. I wasn't getting on you or saying you didn't like Swift. I was just laying out my reasoning for disagreeing so that people could understand why.
As for the second sentence here, perhaps you only needed to say that before. "I'm not paying what his market value is" is definitely a position where you're not as high on Swift as everybody. So, really, you kind of like him less. I was thinking market value when assessing the trade. It's probably close to even, regardless of which side one takes. I still prefer the Swift side.
I was stunned when I was hoping to add Mooney last year after our rookie draft and a Chicago homer nabbed him near the end of that said draft. I had the exact same thought about Fields, and I would bet a lot of people are thinking about the potential for him and Fields deep. That you like him as more than that is interesting, but I don't know enough to comment intelligently. I am gonna pony up one of these days for Matt Harmon's Reception Perception, so I'll know better.Mooney, however, I am a fan of. Anxious to see what he can do once Fields takes over, as I do believe he is more than just a field stretcher.