Patriots being investigated after Colts game (4 Viewers)

[General Tso]

Here's the thing assume NE gives the refs the balls below the allowed PSI. The refs don't check them with a gauge but just squeezed them and say fine. They play the game. NE wins.

What if there's film of Tom Brady inflating the balls with a bike pump and there's a dead ballboy nearby?Since we're leaving reality behind and all.(We already know your scenario has been ruled out.)

Please tell me how my scenario was ruled out? The NFL said the opposite. They said the balls were under inflated in the first half and inflated the 2nd. That's all they've said so far. My scenario might not turn out to be the truth. Yours might. Then again mine might too.

But you're right since I haven't drawn a conclusion with zero evidence like you have I must be a loony.

Why does the NFL even need an investigation when we have wdcrob on the case.

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

I was under the assumption there was no "reinflating of the balls" at halftime, and that they used the 12 backup balls.

Yeah, because that's what Volin reported as fact, and later acknowledged that he was wrong. You know, the same guy that moleculo and wcrob keep saying has reported that gauges were used pregame.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Here's the thing assume NE gives the refs the balls below the allowed PSI. The refs don't check them with a gauge but just squeezed them and say fine. They play the game. NE wins.

What if there's film of Tom Brady inflating the balls with a bike pump and there's a dead ballboy nearby?Since we're leaving reality behind and all.(We already know your scenario has been ruled out.)

Please tell me how my scenario was ruled out? The NFL said the opposite. They said the balls were under inflated in the first half and inflated the 2nd. That's all they've said so far. My scenario might not turn out to be the truth. Yours might. Then again mine might too.But you're right since I haven't drawn a conclusion with zero evidence like you have I must be a loony.

Why does the NFL even need an investigation when we have wdcrob on the case.

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

maybe i have missed something, but where has it been stated that indys balls where the same as pregame? It has been said that they were within the limits of 12.5-13.5.

 

[moleculo]

Here's the thing assume NE gives the refs the balls below the allowed PSI. The refs don't check them with a gauge but just squeezed them and say fine. They play the game. NE wins.

What if there's film of Tom Brady inflating the balls with a bike pump and there's a dead ballboy nearby?Since we're leaving reality behind and all.(We already know your scenario has been ruled out.)

Please tell me how my scenario was ruled out? The NFL said the opposite. They said the balls were under inflated in the first half and inflated the 2nd. That's all they've said so far. My scenario might not turn out to be the truth. Yours might. Then again mine might too.But you're right since I haven't drawn a conclusion with zero evidence like you have I must be a loony.Why does the NFL even need an investigation when we have wdcrob on the case.

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

You know, you're going out on a limb with your continued assertion that the balls were measured with a gauge pregame. It's possible they were, though it's the core of the NFL's case and after 6 days they haven't clarified this, and their statement goes out of their way to use the word "inspected" rather than "measured" when it comes to pregame. You and moleculo are going to get crucified in here if it turns out gauges weren't used pregame.Some people have their minds made up before the evidence comes out, while others wait to actually see the evidence before passing judgment.

hey, man I'm just going by whats been reported by Peter King and the Boston Globe.

When the NFL issues their report, I will go by what they say (provided everything is buttoned up nicely). If the NFL says that gauges weren't initially used, I will be happy to fall back under the assumption that the Patriots may have simply delivered underinflated balls to the refs before the game. I'm not the kind of guy who refuses to change his story in the face of new evidence.

In the mean time, I do not believe the Patriots have earned any benefit of doubt.

 

[bostonfred]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

 

[Deamon]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

I hate supporting such an obvious Homer, but this is bang on. I mean are there people out there who really think the Pats did/would put themselves that much at risk to sneak the balls away and deflate all 11 exactly the same amount by sticking a pin in them? THere's SUCH a low chance of this, but this seems to be what most of the people calling them cheaters are suggesting.

 

[moleculo]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

so the pats inflated their balls at a temperature well above room temperature, maintained that temperature and pressure through inspection, and then lost pressure when brought outside, while the Colts inflated their balls outside, maintained that cold temperature (i.e. as to not overinflate during inpsection), and then did not lose pressure.

For this theory to make sense, the refs had to keep the hot balls hot and the cold balls cold during the entire inspection process. This McDLT theory is just as convoluted as anything else, and still requires the Patriots to purposefully inflate at a higher temperature, a gross attempt to circumvent the inspection process.

 

[Deamon]

Do any of the people saying they cheated, have an alternate/more reasonable explanation that would support their claim besides "after the check they stuck a needle and gauge in the balls and deflated them all to an exact illegal level hoping no one would ever find out/see/catch wind of this"? I'm just curious what all those wanting the Pats roasted actually, objectively thought happened, and if they thought this happened consistently over the last X years.

 

[Deamon]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

so the pats inflated their balls at a temperature well above room temperature, maintained that temperature and pressure through inspection, and then lost pressure when brought outside, while the Colts inflated their balls outside, maintained that cold temperature (i.e. as to not overinflate during inpsection), and then did not lose pressure.

For this theory to make sense, the refs had to keep the hot balls hot and the cold balls cold during the entire inspection process. This McDLT theory is just as convoluted as anything else, and still requires the Patriots to purposefully inflate at a higher temperature, a gross attempt to circumvent the inspection process.

what is your possible explanation to what happened that is deserving of them being called cheaters?

 

[devouredbychaos]

70 pages, all over speculations. The only thing that's been CONFIRMED is that they're investigating. Way to go NE hater trolls, I can't wait till nothing comes of all of this.

 

[James Daulton]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

This is not difficult to believe at all. If Brady prefers the balls underinflated it would take an equipment dude 5 minutes to do all the balls. I doubt they sequester the balls after testing. Why is this so difficult for Pats fans to believe?

 

[Bucky86]

New England announcement coming up at 2:30est

 

[devouredbychaos]

Patriots are making a big announcement at 230pm, just heard on WEEI. This should be interesting.

 

[Deamon]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

This is not difficult to believe at all. If Brady prefers the balls underinflated it would take an equipment dude 5 minutes to do all the balls. I doubt they sequester the balls after testing. Why is this so difficult for Pats fans to believe?

Really? You think all year, in multiple games, that they sneak the balls after inspection, and get the equipment dude to stick a needle and gauge in all of these balls to a perfectly equal psi and risk cameras, players, ANYONE seeing or hearing of this? Give me a break.

 

[Deamon]

Patriots are making a big announcement at 230pm, just heard on WEEI. This should be interesting.

wow. Wonder what this could be all about

 

[Run It Up]

Patriots are making a big announcement at 230pm, just heard on WEEI. This should be interesting.

wow. Wonder what this could be all about

Wishful thinking, Kraft says they are found to be innocent and that they will be filing charges against the NFL.

And Goodell loses his job.

 

[General Tso]

Here's the thing assume NE gives the refs the balls below the allowed PSI. The refs don't check them with a gauge but just squeezed them and say fine. They play the game. NE wins.

What if there's film of Tom Brady inflating the balls with a bike pump and there's a dead ballboy nearby?Since we're leaving reality behind and all.(We already know your scenario has been ruled out.)

Please tell me how my scenario was ruled out? The NFL said the opposite. They said the balls were under inflated in the first half and inflated the 2nd. That's all they've said so far. My scenario might not turn out to be the truth. Yours might. Then again mine might too.But you're right since I haven't drawn a conclusion with zero evidence like you have I must be a loony.

Why does the NFL even need an investigation when we have wdcrob on the case.

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

maybe i have missed something, but where has it been stated that indys balls where the same as pregame? It has been said that they were within the limits of 12.5-13.5.

You haven't missed a thing. Nowhere has it been definitively reported that gauges were used pregame. Nowhere. The Globe article that wcrob and moleculo keep citing as saying that gauges were used pregame does NOT say that. It says balls were measured with a gauge but it doesn't specify when. The NFL has 6 days and ample opportunities to come out and say this if it is fact. They haven't done that. Why? There are two potential reasons:1. They didn't inspect all the balls pregame using gauges. This is vainly possible given what we have heard the last 6 days from former refs, ball boys, and Aaron Rodgers. It's possible the refs only used gauges after the incident was reported mid game when they did their measurements at halftime and the end of the game. If this indeed happened, it still fits with the statement issued by the NFL and the Volin article.

2. They did inspect with gauges pregame and are intentionally not releasing this info in the hopes that they will trap someone who subsequently lies during the investigation.

There's a growing circle of people who are starting to think that #1 is not only possible, but likely, which is why the NFL is having a hard time with its case as Shefter reported last night.

By the way, Peter King initially implied in one of his reports that gauges were used pregame. When asked for clarification of it on twitter, he backed off. There's no doubt in my mind that King and others have asked the NFL to specifically clarify this, and they haven't.

Meanwhile wcrob and moleculo continue to overlook this key aspect of the story and report over and over their BELIEF as fact that gauges were used pregame.

 

[Road Warriors]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

This is not difficult to believe at all. If Brady prefers the balls underinflated it would take an equipment dude 5 minutes to do all the balls. I doubt they sequester the balls after testing. Why is this so difficult for Pats fans to believe?

By rule, the balls stay in the "custody" of the officials after the turn-in / inspection until delivered to the ball boys on the sidelines just before gametime.

Equipment dudes don't get to play with the balls after inspection. The balls are under the supervision of the officials.

 

[devouredbychaos]

Patriots are making a big announcement at 230pm, just heard on WEEI. This should be interesting.

wow. Wonder what this could be all about

They've resigned Revis.. Lol

 

[moleculo]

what is your possible explanation to what happened that is deserving of them being called cheaters?

I don't know what happened. Something happened.

If you forced me to make up a story, here is goes:

years ago, the Patriots equipment manager learned, through trial and error, that Brady prefers slightly underinflated footballs. He would know this by seeing which ones Brady selects for game use, kind of a natural selection type of effect. Over the years, he has been habitually submitting balls with lower and lower pressure. Eventually, the refs caught wind of this, and began re-pressurizing...exactly like Rodgers guy submitting overinflated balls in GB.

Brady complains that the game balls feel different, and asks the equipment manager if he's inflating them more..."no sir," he says, and after that, he takes it upon himself to doctor the balls post-inspection. Maybe it's simply a needle when no one is looking.

Neither Brady nor Belichick explicitly were involved in any tampering, it's simply an equipment manager being expedient to get his balls exactly like Brady likes them.

That's my operating theory on how this went down. Obviously I have no proof and it's wild speculation, but seeing as how I am neither judge, jury, nor executioner, it's well within my rights to wildly speculate.

 

[Deamon]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

This is not difficult to believe at all. If Brady prefers the balls underinflated it would take an equipment dude 5 minutes to do all the balls. I doubt they sequester the balls after testing. Why is this so difficult for Pats fans to believe?

By rule, the balls stay in the "custody" of the officials after the turn-in / inspection until delivered to the ball boys on the sidelines just before gametime.

Equipment dudes don't get to play with the balls after inspection. The balls are under the supervision of the officials.

Hmmm...

If this is true, wouldn't this 100% discount every anti-pats poster in here? Unless the new theory is that the equipment guy knocked out the ref, deflated the balls, then returned them to the ref before we woke up. Is that the new theory?

 

[Run It Up]

Stream for the press conference

 

[Touchdown Syndrome]

Coming Thursdays to CBS...

PSI: New England!

#nailedit

 

[Deamon]

what is your possible explanation to what happened that is deserving of them being called cheaters?

I don't know what happened. Something happened.

If you forced me to make up a story, here is goes:

years ago, the Patriots equipment manager learned, through trial and error, that Brady prefers slightly underinflated footballs. He would know this by seeing which ones Brady selects for game use, kind of a natural selection type of effect. Over the years, he has been habitually submitting balls with lower and lower pressure. Eventually, the refs caught wind of this, and began re-pressurizing...exactly like Rodgers guy submitting overinflated balls in GB.

Brady complains that the game balls feel different, and asks the equipment manager if he's inflating them more..."no sir," he says, and after that, he takes it upon himself to doctor the balls post-inspection. Maybe it's simply a needle when no one is looking.

Neither Brady nor Belichick explicitly were involved in any tampering, it's simply an equipment manager being expedient to get his balls exactly like Brady likes them.

That's my operating theory on how this went down. Obviously I have no proof and it's wild speculation, but seeing as how I am neither judge, jury, nor executioner, it's well within my rights to wildly speculate.

So you think its the equipment guy doing this, and that the pats, brady, bb, are all innocent and shouldn't be called cheaters? This doesn't seem consistent with your previous posts.

 

[Deamon]

Stream for the press conference

awesome, was looking for it.

 

[ROCKET]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

so the pats inflated their balls at a temperature well above room temperature, maintained that temperature and pressure through inspection, and then lost pressure when brought outside, while the Colts inflated their balls outside, maintained that cold temperature (i.e. as to not overinflate during inpsection), and then did not lose pressure.

For this theory to make sense, the refs had to keep the hot balls hot and the cold balls cold during the entire inspection process. This McDLT theory is just as convoluted as anything else, and still requires the Patriots to purposefully inflate at a higher temperature, a gross attempt to circumvent the inspection process.

How about if they just inspected them in say a 65-70 degree room in Gillette Stadium? The Pats balls wouldn't start to lose pressure til they were out in the cold a couple hours later before game time. And they inflated them at what temperature? Tell me the temp. of the air they inflated them with and your evidence to prove it ?

Gross attempt ? You can't even prove they did anything wrong.

Newsflash, atmospheric conditions, humidity and temperature fluctuation can have varied effects on air pressure in a football. GL proving anything they did was against the rules.

 

[DropKick]

Here's the thing assume NE gives the refs the balls below the allowed PSI. The refs don't check them with a gauge but just squeezed them and say fine. They play the game. NE wins.

What if there's film of Tom Brady inflating the balls with a bike pump and there's a dead ballboy nearby?Since we're leaving reality behind and all.(We already know your scenario has been ruled out.)

It hasn't been ruled out in the slightest. Take a look at the carefully worded NFL statements and you'll find that they never say that the football pressures were tested prior to the game, only that the balls were "inspected". Why do you think they worded it that way? Do you think in a league office filled with lawyers, they aren't incredibly precise and particular with their language in this situation?

They're also supposed to be inspected by an official as they go into the game... so somebody isn't doing their job to the letter of the law. I could believe they weren't checked with a gauge,

I could also believe they were intentionally modified. We've seen it with baseballs, baseball bats, hockey sticks... why not here too?

 

[moleculo]

what is your possible explanation to what happened that is deserving of them being called cheaters?

I don't know what happened. Something happened.

If you forced me to make up a story, here is goes:

years ago, the Patriots equipment manager learned, through trial and error, that Brady prefers slightly underinflated footballs. He would know this by seeing which ones Brady selects for game use, kind of a natural selection type of effect. Over the years, he has been habitually submitting balls with lower and lower pressure. Eventually, the refs caught wind of this, and began re-pressurizing...exactly like Rodgers guy submitting overinflated balls in GB.

Brady complains that the game balls feel different, and asks the equipment manager if he's inflating them more..."no sir," he says, and after that, he takes it upon himself to doctor the balls post-inspection. Maybe it's simply a needle when no one is looking.

Neither Brady nor Belichick explicitly were involved in any tampering, it's simply an equipment manager being expedient to get his balls exactly like Brady likes them.

That's my operating theory on how this went down. Obviously I have no proof and it's wild speculation, but seeing as how I am neither judge, jury, nor executioner, it's well within my rights to wildly speculate.

So you think its the equipment guy doing this, and that the pats, brady, bb, are all innocent and shouldn't be called cheaters? This doesn't seem consistent with your previous posts.

I think Bill Belichick has fostered an organizational culture of bending whatever rules you can to gain a competitive advantage. Playing within the rules and maintaining high moral standards are not valued within the Patriots. I believe he is still complicit.

 

[Road Warriors]

Stream for the press conference

where's the flexball logo? I thought that was rather comical in the Belichick and Brady pressers.

 

[Run It Up]

Stream for the press conference

where's the flexball logo? I thought that was rather comical in the Belichick and Brady pressers.

Electronic background, its their.

 

[moleculo]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

so the pats inflated their balls at a temperature well above room temperature, maintained that temperature and pressure through inspection, and then lost pressure when brought outside, while the Colts inflated their balls outside, maintained that cold temperature (i.e. as to not overinflate during inpsection), and then did not lose pressure.

For this theory to make sense, the refs had to keep the hot balls hot and the cold balls cold during the entire inspection process. This McDLT theory is just as convoluted as anything else, and still requires the Patriots to purposefully inflate at a higher temperature, a gross attempt to circumvent the inspection process.

How about if they just inspected them in say a 65-70 degree room in Gillette Stadium? The Pats balls wouldn't start to lose pressure til they were out in the cold a couple hours later before game time. And they inflated them at what temperature? Tell me the temp. of the air they inflated them with and your evidence to prove it ?

Gross attempt ? You can't even prove they did anything wrong.

Newsflash, atmospheric conditions, humidity and temperature fluctuation can have varied effects on air pressure in a football. GL proving anything they did was against the rules.

I've been over this many times. Per the ideal gas law, you need a significantly larger temperature swing for a football to lose over 2 PSI than you would have seen indoors in Foxborough and the air temperature that night. It wasn't that cold. If the balls were 50 dF at halftime when measured (big if as they were measured indoors), they must have been 90 dF or more during their initial inspection.

 

[ROCKET]

70 pages, all over speculations. The only thing that's been CONFIRMED is that they're investigating. Way to go NE hater trolls, I can't wait till nothing comes of all of this.

I hope you're right. If they can't prove anything I still have the fear that Kraft will take a hit for the betterment of the league and let the Pats plead to some bs indescretion that we could fight and win against in court. IMO he cares more about $$ and the shield than he does about his own team or fans. It's pretty frustrating seeing him come out in support of Goodell in the Ray Rice case and not support his coach and qb over this. If he truly believes in BB and TB he should have their backs on this. Maybe he doesn't?

 

[Gandalf the Grey]

HAPPY GROUNDHOG DAY EVERYONE !!

 

[ROCKET]

what is your possible explanation to what happened that is deserving of them being called cheaters?

I don't know what happened. Something happened.

If you forced me to make up a story, here is goes:

years ago, the Patriots equipment manager learned, through trial and error, that Brady prefers slightly underinflated footballs. He would know this by seeing which ones Brady selects for game use, kind of a natural selection type of effect. Over the years, he has been habitually submitting balls with lower and lower pressure. Eventually, the refs caught wind of this, and began re-pressurizing...exactly like Rodgers guy submitting overinflated balls in GB.

Brady complains that the game balls feel different, and asks the equipment manager if he's inflating them more..."no sir," he says, and after that, he takes it upon himself to doctor the balls post-inspection. Maybe it's simply a needle when no one is looking.

Neither Brady nor Belichick explicitly were involved in any tampering, it's simply an equipment manager being expedient to get his balls exactly like Brady likes them.

That's my operating theory on how this went down. Obviously I have no proof and it's wild speculation, but seeing as how I am neither judge, jury, nor executioner, it's well within my rights to wildly speculate.

So you think its the equipment guy doing this, and that the pats, brady, bb, are all innocent and shouldn't be called cheaters? This doesn't seem consistent with your previous posts.

I think Bill Belichick has fostered an organizational culture of bending whatever rules you can to gain a competitive advantage. Playing within the rules and maintaining high moral standards are not valued within the Patriots. I believe he is still complicit.

Let me guess, every other organization does everything within the rules to a T and this is only a Pats thing? I'm glad he bends the rules and hope he bends every one he can to give his team the best chance of winning just as every other team is doing. I just don't want him breaking any.

 

[Run It Up]

This dramatic pause, holy ####.

 

[Bucky86]

 

[ROCKET]

All of the balls were tested with a gauge before the game.

At halftime the Patriots' were found to be underinflated using a gauge. The Colts balls, however, were at the same pressure as at the start of the game.

All balls were reinflated to the same pressure at halftime.

At the end of the game all balls were still fully inflated.

I'm not Sherlock Holmes, just literate and able to add 2+2.

colts balls inflated outside - stay inflatedpats balls inflated inside - gradually lose pressure

backup balls reinflated outside to same pressure at halftime - stay inflated

Seems pretty straightforward really. warm air loses pressure as it cools. The colts knew they were going to test the balls, so they knew not to fall for the same trap.

Seems a lot less complicated than some imaginary scenario where patriots were on the sidelines manually deflating ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball after ball aftee ball after ball after ball, and testing each to make sure they got down to exactly the same pressure, without any of the refs who were tipped off to check this at halftime noticing, or any of the fans, or any of the dozens of cameras.

The idea that someone manually deflated all of these balls is way more far fetched than the logical explanation that this was just regular air pressure loss. But you when you want to believe the worst about someone I'm sure you can convince yourself of plenty of crazy things.

so the pats inflated their balls at a temperature well above room temperature, maintained that temperature and pressure through inspection, and then lost pressure when brought outside, while the Colts inflated their balls outside, maintained that cold temperature (i.e. as to not overinflate during inpsection), and then did not lose pressure.

For this theory to make sense, the refs had to keep the hot balls hot and the cold balls cold during the entire inspection process. This McDLT theory is just as convoluted as anything else, and still requires the Patriots to purposefully inflate at a higher temperature, a gross attempt to circumvent the inspection process.

How about if they just inspected them in say a 65-70 degree room in Gillette Stadium? The Pats balls wouldn't start to lose pressure til they were out in the cold a couple hours later before game time. And they inflated them at what temperature? Tell me the temp. of the air they inflated them with and your evidence to prove it ?

Gross attempt ? You can't even prove they did anything wrong.

Newsflash, atmospheric conditions, humidity and temperature fluctuation can have varied effects on air pressure in a football. GL proving anything they did was against the rules.

I've been over this many times. Per the ideal gas law, you need a significantly larger temperature swing for a football to lose over 2 PSI than you would have seen indoors in Foxborough and the air temperature that night. It wasn't that cold. If the balls were 50 dF at halftime when measured (big if as they were measured indoors), they must have been 90 dF or more during their initial inspection.

Thank you professor Moleculo.

 

[Capella]

They are going to dump it all on some ball boy during this presser. "We found the guilty party" etc

 

[Run It Up]

50/50 atm that Kraft is gonna come out and either settle it for or against the Pats, the other 50% being he says literally nothing.

1% he commits honorable seppuku
1% he announces they have sided with ISIS

 

[Bayhawks]

the Patriots would be just as guilty because they would be violating the spirit of the rule.

Especially since if they did it they've now lied about it.Love how people are completely ignoring reports that the refs checked the balls with a gauge this time in favor of all kinds of other reports not related to this game.

IMO the Colts and/or Ravens figured out what the Pats were doing with the balls. Tipped the league off and now they've been caught red-handed. Only question left is how much evidence they can gather and who takes the fall. But they aren't going to skate at this point.

Because there is NO such report as yet that the balls were checked pregame with a gauge. King reported that the balls were checked at halftime with a gauge...and that they were checked post game with a gauge but all he says about the pregame inspection is that they are within the psi range. I realize that the only way to know that they are within range is to use a gauge so I know this is gonna be seen as splitting hairs but the reality is all we have for known facts are what is on the deflategate wiki page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeflateGate. I strongly recommend anyone posting to read that page and compare it to the 67 pages in this thread since its instructive of the vast diff between facts and rumor/conjecture/theories/misinformation that is contained within these 67 pages (and counting). Nothing wrong with rumor, conjecture and theories but we all need to be careful about what we are ALL passing off as "facts" because the fact is we just don't have that many.

There are countless reports that the balls were checked pre-game. The standard way of checking air-pressure is with a gauge. According to this video, that's exactly how the officials check the balls before EVERY game. Why do you need to see a report that specifically says "the balls were checked with a gauge?"

I think critical to this entire investigation was how the balls were measured at half time. Ideally, if you are truly running an even test, all the balls, colts and pats, are tested exactly the same way, in the same type of environment, at the same time.

For example, after halftime did they measure the pats balls first?

From the time those balls left the field to the time they were measured, temperature would have an impact. If the pats balls were measured first vs. simultaneously with the cots balls, the colts balls would have an opportunity to warm up. PSI would change.

All variables in this sting operation should be held constant. Otherwise, the results will be garbage.

I don't have any confidence that the NFL ran this "test" in a scientific manner. If they did, I want to understand step by step what they did to both sets of balls.

Until then, I think everyone needs to calm down.

I think at some point, you (not "YOU," but anyone) has to use common sense. Whether they measured the Pats balls first or last, we're talking about a matter of minutes, not hours. It would make no sense for the refs to test the NE balls 2 hours before the game, then 5 minutes before kick-off go "why don't we check Indy's footballs now." Common sense says they test them all at once, and in the same location (refs locker/changing room). Common sense tells me:

The refs used a gauge to check ALL the footballs pre-game at the same time (within minutes of each other).

The refs used a gauge to check ALL the footballs at halftime at the same time.

The balls were all checked after the game at the same time.

Common sense (and science) also tells me that the NE balls WOULD NOT have lost over 2 lbs of air pressure from pre-game to half-time (unless they were artificially inflated with hot air, or tested in a ridiculously hot room like 90+ degrees).

Therefore, someone must have deflated the NE balls, and common sense says that no one in the NE organization would tamper with the footballs that Tom Brady was going to be using without Brady knowing about it.

So, I'm left to assume one of these things:

1-Brady was behind the deflation of those balls (told someone to do it, most likely-I doubt he deflated them personally)

2-Someone is "framing" Brady/BB/NE and deflated those balls to set them up.

3-BB/Josh McDaniels knows Brady likes the balls deflated and had them deflated without Brady being involved.

4-BB/McDaniels had the balls deflated, with Brady's knowledge.

1 is the most likely, IMO, with 4 being the next most likely, followed by #3, with #2 being ridiculously improbable.

See my common sense is different.

Everyone we've heard a ref and a ball boy from 10+ years ago say they don't use a gauge to check PSI. That might not be true anymore in the current NFL. But nobody has disputed that. Until the NFL says they used a gauge I'm not so sure they did more than a squeeze test. We will know soon. So I guess I will withhold judgment until the NFL gives us more info.

I posted a video (you quoted the post that contains the link) that SHOWS the refs using a gauge. That is from THIS SEASON. So, your common sense says ignore evidence that you can see with your own eyes and believe what a ball boy and ref remember from 10 years ago?

 

[ROCKET]

They are going to dump it all on some ball boy during this presser. "We found the guilty party" etc

So you think the Patriots are going to trust some 20 year old, pimple faced ball boy with helping them pull off some conspiracy against the NFL and it's lawyers,detectives and forensic guys? Yeah, I can see that.

 

[Capella]

They are going to dump it all on some ball boy during this presser. "We found the guilty party" etc

So you think the Patriots are going to trust some 20 year old, pimple faced ball boy with helping them pull off some conspiracy against the NFL and it's lawyers,detectives and forensic guys? Yeah, I can see that.

Forensic guys?

 

[southeastjerome]

Living in MA and not being a Pats fan is tough. Most Pats fans have come up with the strangest and most crack-pot theories, anything but blaming the team or whoever deflated the balls. If this happened last year when they lost in Denver and it was the Broncos who were found to have under inflated balls, they would have lost their minds. I have a few friends who are mad at the team and it is just refreshing to hear that rather than blind homer-ism and amateur physicists babble about cold air and conspiracy theories of the Colts trying to set them up.

 

[ROCKET]

Living in MA and not being a Pats fan is tough. Most Pats fans have come up with the strangest and most crack-pot theories, anything but blaming the team or whoever deflated the balls. If this happened last year when they lost in Denver and it was the Broncos who were found to have under inflated balls, they would have lost their minds. I have a few friends who are mad at the team and it is just refreshing to hear that rather than blind homer-ism and amateur physicists babble about cold air and conspiracy theories of the Colts trying to set them up.

I'm sure your neighbors have most likely brought up the scenario of you moving?

 

[Touchdown There]

Dumbest thread in the history of the pool.

 

[Deamon]

They are going to dump it all on some ball boy during this presser. "We found the guilty party" etc

So you think the Patriots are going to trust some 20 year old, pimple faced ball boy with helping them pull off some conspiracy against the NFL and it's lawyers,detectives and forensic guys? Yeah, I can see that.

"we blamed the wrong people. We found who did it, it was just kids"

- Mystic River 2.0

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Dumbest thread in the history of the pool.

Has a long way to go to catch the "Josh Gordon will play 16 Games" thread.

 

[biju]

Do any of the people saying they cheated, have an alternate/more reasonable explanation that would support their claim besides "after the check they stuck a needle and gauge in the balls and deflated them all to an exact illegal level hoping no one would ever find out/see/catch wind of this"? I'm just curious what all those wanting the Pats roasted actually, objectively thought happened, and if they thought this happened consistently over the last X years.

Are you claiming you are on the side of Occam's Razor? The one where the team accidentally fills 12 balls with hot air in a hot room, accidentally maintains that heat in the ball before and during the inspection, and then the cold air deflates it by 2 PSI? Oh, and adding in that based on Ravens' accusations of previous situations, this has happened multiple times exactly on game day and during the game?

 

[Thorn]

what is up with the delay? I AM FREAKING OUT MAN

 

[ROCKET]

Pats press conference coming up on Sportscenter. Kraft better be backing BB and TB.

 

[Morton Muffley]

50/50 atm that Kraft is gonna come out and either settle it for or against the Pats, the other 50% being he says literally nothing.

1% he commits honorable seppuku

1% he announces they have sided with ISIS

Lol

Maybe belichick is gonna expound for 45 minutes on the evolution of the forward pass