Patriots being investigated after Colts game (3 Viewers)

[The General]

Patriots:

"Deflator" means McNally was trying to lose weight.

Oh my.....did Yee refer the Patriots to these attorneys?

Boston radio is mocking this thing. Yes, Boston.

That's amazing!

Waiting for run it up / 12 punch response.

 

[davearm]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

 

[Tango]

Patriots:

"Deflator" means McNally was trying to lose weight.

Oh my.....did Yee refer the Patriots to these attorneys?

Boston radio is mocking this thing. Yes, Boston.

That's amazing!

Waiting for run it up / 12 punch response.

Somebody better be taking screen shots of this stuff before the Pats decide to take this down...

 

[BroadwayG]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

It is one of the key features of early 21st century political campaigns and political life in general that every political figure requires a chorus of dedicated partisans who lay down the equivalent of covering fire in their leader's defense. Sometimes this happens with a political figure who attracts intense loyalty. But that's seldom required. Partisans on both sides of the political divide will generally rush to the defense of almost any political figure on their team, even if the person isn't terribly well liked or even if they're getting grief for something that is pretty hard to defend.

In political scandals, it is almost always when that chorus falls silent that you know the target of the scandal is through.

Apropos nothing.

 

[Slapdash]

Patriots have to be trolling at this point.

 

[bostonfred]

I was dying reading the {omitted out of respect to Mrs Jastremski}



12:21:46: JM Whats up dorito dink

12:22:53: JJ Nada

12:22:53: JM Whens the pong party.im on fire

12:23:10: JJ Omg

12:23:34: JM Bring it

16:29:48: JM You still with your women

16:29:59: JJ Yup

16:33:21: JM You must have her [omitted out of respect to Mrs. Jastremski]

16:34:39: JM You must have a picture of her [omitted out of respect to Mrs. Jastremski]

16:36:31: JJ Omg

16:37:16: JM You working

16:37:53 JJ Yup

16:39:40 JM Nice dudejimmy needs some kicks.lets

make a dealcome on help the deflator

[After Mr. Jastremski does not respond for several minutes, Mr. McNally sends a follow-up text.]

16:47:15 JM Chill buddy im just f****n with you.im not going

to espn.yet

this text exchange unequivocally proves three critical things: that jj's dink is orange, triangular and nacho cheese flavored.

 

[Steelers4Life]

One of my closest friends is a die hard Pats fan who's fought hard to try and convince me how Tom Brady would never risk his reputation and do this kind of thing.

He just sent me a text that read "I can't justify how stupid my Pats look after releasing this website. Losing weight? Really? That's the best they can do? I give up."

Keep fighting the good fight Pats fans, it's entertaining for the rest of us.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

Patriots have to be trolling at this point.

Did you read the whole thing? A few things they deserve to be mocked for asserting but overall it has several strong rebukes of the Wells Report.

I will say I thought it a stretch that Kraft would

look to get rid of Goodell over this but I'm fairly convinced now he plans to get other owners to back him in removing him. Not sure it will work though.

 

[davearm]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

 

[mbuehner]

For me the disappearing footballs and the texts messages mentioning deflating and needles months before that game are enough.

That being said, im curious about the Wells report conclusions on measurements as a purely academic questions.

This link sums it up pretty well:

http://wellsreportcontext.com/

Given the gauges varied from each other, the only relevant halftime psi measurements are those shown by the gauge that was used pre-game. One gauge, referred to as the Logo gauge, was consistently .3 to .45 psi higher in its measurements than the non-Logo gauge. Referee Walt Anderson, who was alerted to psi issues before the game, has a detailed recollection of the unrecorded psi levels of the 48 footballs he gauged pre-game — essentially 12.5 for the Patriots footballs and 13.0 or 13.1 for the Colts footballs. His Recollection of those pre-game psi levels is one of the foundations of this report. MR. ANDERSON SPECIFICALLY RECALLS THAT HE USED THE LOGO GAUGE FOR THESE PRE-GAME MEASUREMENTS (pg. 52). (This is the only recollection of Mr. Anderson that the report rejects.) Therefore, the Logo gauge numbers are the correct numbers to use for halftime psi. The investigators did rely on those Logo gauge halftime psi numbers in dealing with the Colts footballs. Using that gauge, all the Colts footballs were within regulation. That justified the officials not adding air to them. However, when assessing the Patriots footballs, the investigators reject Anderson’s best recollection that he used the Logo gauge pre-game, and instead look to the larger psi drop that is shown by the lower psi, non-Logo gauge.

This is a curious lapse for such a detailed investigation. The second gauge is utterly irrelevant if it wasnt used pregame. You are looking for the difference in pressure, so obviously you need a defined starting pressure. IE- if Anderson OK'd a ball that read 12.5 psi on his gauge, you could immediately remeasure it with the second gauge and it would be an illegal ball. That second gauge should be tossed out completely, it just confuses the issue.

Its also odd that the investigator pressed Anderson on how sure he was on which gauge he used (a monstrously important question) and Anderson that it was 'possible' he used the other gauge. On the other hand, they seemed entirely comfortable with his exact recollections of the pre-game inflation pressures- the Colts were either '13.0 or 13.1', pretty damned precise. And what are the odds that all 48 balls were within .1 psi of each other (per team) when the teams delivered them? Almost impossible i'd argue.

The problem is Anderson. We talked this to death, but it seems very likely that if Anderson even measured the balls, it was a slipshod job done with little precision (see the Bears video floating around of the refs lockerroom). Now long after the fact Anderson is doing some CYA and remembering very specific pressures he read (but never recorded, the usual practice). The other problem is Wells, who knew he had an Anderson problem and muddied the water about what could be truly known about relative pressures that day. But the bottom line is garbage in-garbage out. If you dont have any reliable measurements from pregame, you half time measurements are useless.

Again- Pats are guilty of this ####, but this report was ginned up a bit to make the NFL look better than they should on the issue.

We don't know for certain which gauge Anderson used pre-game. However I'm willing to believe that after ball inflation was made a point of emphasis to him by his bosses, his recollections of the psi measurements are legit (12.5 Pats, 13.0 Colts).

We know from the table shown in the report that at halftime, the Pats' 11 footballs held an average of 11.11 psi on the non-logo gauge, and 11.49 psi on the logo gauge. We also know that the 4 Colts balls measured 12.33 psi and 12.74 on the non-logo and logo gauges, respectively.

So, now what is the loss in psi between pregame and halftime?

If Anderson used the logo gauge to get his pre-game readings, then the Pats' balls deflated by 1.01 psi (12.5 - 11.49), and the Colts' balls deflated by 0.26 psi (13.0 - 12.74). Pats' balls show 0.75 psi more deflation.

If Anderson used the non-logo gauge to get his pre-game readings, then the Pats' balls deflated by 1.39 psi (12.5 - 11.11), and the Colts' balls deflated by 0.68 psi (13.0 - 12.33). Pats' balls show 0.72 psi more deflation.

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

"his recollections of the psi measurements are legit (12.5 Pats, 13.0 Colts)." I find it almost impossible to believe that of 48 balls measured, they all read within .1psi of their target pressure.

The other problem is the refs only measured 4 Colts balls, you have a serious sample size issue there.

The final point is that the Colts balls were measured last. According to the tests done by the Well Report (pg 204) in 5 minutes you would expect a ball to rise about .5psi, meaning the Pats balls only showed .25psi different that the colts balls, normalized. And thats with different sample size sets, which is not a good practice, and also assuming it took only 5 minutes to test the Pats balls and start test the Colts balls (as the refs claimed).

Usual disclaimed- the point isnt that the pats didnt deflate those balls (i believe they did), its that the inflation evidence had serious flaws and its odd such a careful and thorough investigation didnt take them into account. I attribute this to protection the ref and NFL reputation, not to railroading the Pats.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Patriots have to be trolling at this point.

Did you read the whole thing? A few things they deserve to be mocked for asserting but overall it has several strong rebukes of the Wells Report.

I will say I thought it a stretch that Kraft would

look to get rid of Goodell over this but I'm fairly convinced now he plans to get other owners to back him in removing him. Not sure it will work though.

Those owner's may not be so quick to do Kraft's bidding after recent events.

Honestly this has made the Pats look really bad, when the actual transgression was fairly meaningless and would have likely faded as quickly as "textgate" and "noisegate" had the Pats just took notes from how Arthur Blank admitted his wrongdoing like a man.

I really believe this could have been a two game suspension for Brady and loss of a 4th round pick for the Pats if things were handled differently.

 

[GroveDiesel]

Is Kraft trolling everyone, or is he going senile? I mean...wow.

Are we SURE the Patriots weren't hacked and 4chan did this? Or like it's some kind of elaborate FunnyOrDie bit?

 

[mbuehner]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

From the report- the balls were in the ref room for 13 minutes 30 seconds. The refs said they began testing of the Pats balls within 2 to 4 minutes, that it took 4 to 5 minutes to test the Pats balls, testing the Colts balls 'less time', and reinflating the Pats balls 2-5 minutes.

Its interesting that is is never specifically stated that the Colts balls were tested before the Pats balls were reinflated (although it is definitively said that the same refs doing the testing did the inflating). Thats another important point. Did they stop 4 balls into the test and say, 'crap we gotta get the Pats balls inflated we have to stop here'. Or did they reinflate the Pats balls FIRST, and then start on measuring the Colt balls and run out of time. That time difference would result in an additional .2 to .5 rise in Colts PSI.

 

[BroadwayG]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

 

[Freelove]

The Pats were ALWAYS going to have to explode in spectacular fashion for most/all of the penalties NOT to go away. The real "punishment," and everybody knew it, was the public shaming and the irreparable damage to the legacy. But there's no doubt in my mind the NFL always 100% expected to see the Pats suit Brady up all year.

But man, now I just don't know...

 

[sho nuff]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

Are you seriously under the illusion that the Patriots did not tamper with any balls after inspection?

 

[Burl]

The best part of this is the fact they have to own this story through the entire appeals process for everyone involved. I can't imagine an independent arbitrator is going to hear this story during the proceedings and go, "Yeah, that story makes sense". This hurts the Pats and Brady both in the end both in the appeals process and in the eyes of public opinion. This is looking more and more like the Braun PED case.

 

[The General]

Deflate Weight Loss Program™

 

[IvanKaramazov]

How is it even possible that this organization convinced itself that this rebuttal was a good idea?

 

[Todd Andrews]

Are all pats fans this returded?

 

[massraider]

How is it even possible that this organization convinced itself that this rebuttal was a good idea?

Jonathan Kraft does a lot of blow.

 

[LittlePhatty]

http://wellsreportcontext.com/":

Going in, I was skeptical, but that website contains some sentences written in all caps. ENTIRE SENTENCES. That was enough to convince me thay are innocent.

 

[Burl]

http://wellsreportcontext.com/":

Going in, I was skeptical, but that website contains some sentences written in all caps. ENTIRE SENTENCES. That was enough to convince me thay are innocent.

Seems reasonable.

 

[BroadwayG]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

Are you seriously under the illusion that the Patriots did not tamper with any balls after inspection?

Can you bold my text where I made that assertion? This is simply explaining through verified facts and laboratory testing why the Colts balls measured a lesser psi drop.

 

[12punch]

Someone who has posted about 600 times in this thread should really rethink calling others salty or trolls.

yeah, it only took you guys 19,000 posts to troll those 600 out of me

shark pool really be sharkin'

 

[Ojaays]

If I'm Goodell, I consider further punishment for the Pats, simply based on the "losing weight" comment.

This thing is escalating quickly and it's rather entertaining to watch and listen to the Pats running around screaming like stuck pigs.

 

[davearm]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

What is completely false? The balls were late arriving to the field. The first play from scrimmage almost had to be run using a K-ball.

 

[Tango]

Someone who has posted about 600 times in this thread should really rethink calling others salty or trolls.

yeah, it only took you guys 19,000 posts to troll those 600 out of me

shark pool really be sharkin'

Welcome back. You missed some good comedy. I'd guess that if the Pats leave this report up and publicly defend it that they will lose at least half of the Patriots fans that are still defending them.

Have you read it yet? All of us of course would have you pegged to be the last one off the ship, but any chance that you'll surprise us?

 

[sho nuff]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

Are you seriously under the illusion that the Patriots did not tamper with any balls after inspection?

Can you bold my text where I made that assertion? This is simply explaining through verified facts and laboratory testing why the Colts balls measured a lesser psi drop.

My point is people keep focusing on that.

I don't care about psi drops.

I don't...its irrelevant. What the PSI was is pretty much pointless anymore.

If you believe, as I do, that they altered balls after inspection...they are in violation of the rules of the NFL and subject to punishment incluiding not limited to, $25k.

So spending pages trying to argue why or how balls may be lower...is just a pointless excuse at this point.

So the question is...do you believe the balls were altered by the Patriots?

 

[12punch]

The Pats regarding the texts the day the story broke: "Mr. Brady’s reaching out to Mr. Jastremski to see how he was holding up in these circumstances is not only understandable, but commendable."

But when the report gets released on May 6 and Jastremski gets suspended without pay as a result; what does Brady do about it?

Not only does Brady say/do nothing on May 6 and let's this guy take the fall, the next night on May 7th Brady announces to Jim Gray and the world that he cares so little about Jastremski that he didnt even bother to read the report that took away Jastremski's livelihood. Commendable? What a joke.

This is the issue where that transformed whole saga from slightly amusing talk show banter about a QB I like ----> to me wondering out loud how anyone could possibly ever call Tom Brady a leader. He is the opposite of a leader.

Maybe he bought him off with hush money and the guy is happy? That's quite possible, but it doesnt make Brady look any better, does it?

think you've got a parrot on your keyboard

 

[Flying Elvis]

It's pretty clear the entirety of the Wells report was shoddy and had the direct intention of ignoring serious flaws / inconsistencies / etc. by the NFL and its processes, while working towards a predetermined verdict regarding the Patriots. It's pathetic really. The Pats rebuttal has lots of sound logic and explanations regarding this skewed approach by the investigative team.

None of which matters, since the texts between these two guys specifically mention Sunday. Even if I were to assume "the Deflator" was part weight loss and part "deflate the balls when they arrive in a box", I'm not foolish enough to believe there was ball prep happening on Sundays.

 

[Lutherman2112]

Wow. Check out this tidbit from the wellsreportcontext.com. I clicked the following link: Click here for Nobel Laureate Roderick MacKinnon’s scientific conclusion

Reading the intro, there is this disclaimer: Professor MacKinnon has no business or personal relationship with the Patriots. When news of the investigation became public, he offered his scientific expertise to the team.

Roderick MacKinnion is co-founder of Flex Pharma, where he serves on the Scientific Advisors Board and the Board of Directors.

One member of their "team of investors" is none other than The Kraft Group.

From October 23, 2014 issue of the Boston Globe: Flex Pharma developing treatments for muscle cramps:

...

Flex Pharma is developing not only a prescription medicine that would take a minimum of five years to win Food and Drug Administration approval but also a sports beverage that could be sold in stores as early as 2016.

Unlike Gatorade, which some athletes drink to help with cramps, Flex Pharma will seek to meet the Federal Trade Commission’s standards for advertising clinically proven benefits. The company will also draw on the consumer goods expertise of board member John Sculley, the former chief executive of Apple Inc. and former president of PepsiCo Inc.

Cramping has long been a high-profile employment hazard for professional athletes, dramatized this year when the Miami Heat’s LeBron James was forced to leave the opening game of the NBA finals because of severe leg cramping.

So it may be no coincidence that several owners of professional sports teams, including Wyc Grousbeck and Steve Pagliuca of the Boston Celtics, and the Kraft Group of the New England Patriots, were among the outside investors joining in a $40 million funding round that Flex Pharma disclosed last month.

...

Yep, no business or personal relationships there.

 

[12punch]

"Based on this understanding, the Patriots asked Mr. McNally, a game day only employee with whom the team had no ongoing employment relationship, to leave his full-time, out-of-state job in order to be available for an interview at the stadium. Prior to the interview, the Patriots prevailed upon Mr. McNally to allow his personal phone to be checked for any relevant information, all of which was provided to the Wells investigators before the interview. The investigators therefore had all of Mr. Jastremski’s texts (which were provided three weeks before Mr. McNally was interviewed) as well as Mr. McNally’s phone records. The Wells investigators brought four lawyers to the McNally interview. They spent the entire day with him. He gave over seven hours of testimony. He answered every question. Among other things, the Wells investigators inquired at length about texts with Mr. Jastremski. Having taken a day off work, he was willing to stay as long as it took to finish. The interview did not end until the investigation team exhausted every topic and question they had.

Thus, when subsequently asked for what would have been a fifth interview of Mr. McNally, Patriots counsel wanted to understand what unanticipated circumstances warranted this, including whether the interview would be limited to matters that were simply not available to the investigators during Mr. McNally’s prior interview. The Patriots advised the investigators of their reluctance to have Mr. McNally back yet again, particularly given the media harassment he and his family had suffered as a result of prior leaks of Mr. McNally’s name and hometown. The distress to him and his family caused by the ensuing media attention was described in detail to the investigators. With this background, there was a high hurdle before the Patriots would ask Mr. McNally to appear yet again for what would be his fifth interview, and a particular desire to be sure that the standard for another interview — unanticipated circumstances — was met.

While the report states that certain of Mr. Jastremski’s texts were not “discovered” until after this interview (pg. 75, footnote 47), there is no question that the investigators had all such texts in their possession and available for the questioning. They apparently just overlooked them, identifying them now as a matter they wanted to cover in yet another interview. (pg. 75) Although asked numerous times for the reason for their request for yet another interview with Mr. McNally, the Wells investigators never stated the reason that now appears evident from the Report: They had overlooked texts in their earlier interviews and wanted the opportunity to ask about them. This information would have confirmed what is now clear. The request was inconsistent with the interview protocol agreed to at the outset.

Although receiving no assurances that the requested additional Mr. McNally interview would satisfy the agreed-upon interview protocol, Patriots counsel nonetheless suggested that there might be ways other than another in-person interview to get whatever further information was sought. Patriots counsel offered to be of assistance in those respects. There was no follow-up from the investigators. It now appears that the Patriots are being severely punished because the Wells investigative team apparently overlooked materials they had in their possession long before their interview with Mr. McNally — scarcely an “unanticipated circumstance” calling for yet another interview — and refused to disclose their reason for an additional interview. There was no refusal to cooperate by the Patriots."

______________

lotta salty trolls wearing clown suits right now, as expected

 

[12punch]

I was dying reading the {omitted out of respect to Mrs Jastremski}

12:21:46: JM “Whats up dorito dink”

12:22:53: JJ “Nada”

12:22:53: JM “Whens the pong party….im on fire”

12:23:10: JJ “Omg”

12:23:34: JM “Bring it”

16:29:48: JM “You still with your women”

16:29:59: JJ “Yup”

16:33:21: JM “You must have her [omitted out of respect to Mrs. Jastremski]”

16:34:39: JM “You must have a picture of her [omitted out of respect to Mrs. Jastremski]”

16:36:31: JJ “Omg”

16:37:16: JM “You working”

16:37:53 JJ “Yup”

16:39:40 JM “Nice dude…jimmy needs some kicks….lets

make a deal…come on help the deflator”

[After Mr. Jastremski does not respond for several minutes, Mr. McNally sends a follow-up text.]

16:47:15 JM “Chill buddy im just f****n with you….im not going

to espn….yet”

there's a lot of funny #### in this thread, but the texts have to be the best thing in this whole drama

that #### is awesome --- dorito dink might be my team name this year

 

[Capella]

that response was written by the onion, right?

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Have you read it yet?

Read it? My guess is he wrote it.

 

[mbuehner]

Wow. Check out this tidbit from the wellsreportcontext.com. I clicked the following link: Click here for Nobel Laureate Roderick MacKinnons scientific conclusion

Reading the intro, there is this disclaimer: Professor MacKinnon has no business or personal relationship with the Patriots. When news of the investigation became public, he offered his scientific expertise to the team.

Roderick MacKinnion is co-founder of Flex Pharma, where he serves on the Scientific Advisors Board and the Board of Directors.

One member of their "team of investors" is none other than The Kraft Group.

From October 23, 2014 issue of the Boston Globe: Flex Pharma developing treatments for muscle cramps:

...

Flex Pharma is developing not only a prescription medicine that would take a minimum of five years to win Food and Drug Administration approval but also a sports beverage that could be sold in stores as early as 2016.

Unlike Gatorade, which some athletes drink to help with cramps, Flex Pharma will seek to meet the Federal Trade Commissions standards for advertising clinically proven benefits. The company will also draw on the consumer goods expertise of board member John Sculley, the former chief executive of Apple Inc. and former president of PepsiCo Inc.

Cramping has long been a high-profile employment hazard for professional athletes, dramatized this year when the Miami Heats LeBron James was forced to leave the opening game of the NBA finals because of severe leg cramping.

So it may be no coincidence that several owners of professional sports teams, including Wyc Grousbeck and Steve Pagliuca of the Boston Celtics, and the Kraft Group of the New England Patriots, were among the outside investors joining in a $40 million funding round that Flex Pharma disclosed last month.

...

Yep, no business or personal relationships there.

Rofl. Kinda like Hillary claiming she has nothing to do with the Clinton Foundation. Nice endowment professor, be a shame if something happened to it

 

[The General]

that response was written by the onion, right?

"Explains everything" -12 Punch

 

[BroadwayG]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

What is completely false? The balls were late arriving to the field. The first play from scrimmage almost had to be run using a K-ball.

Where is your source? The Wells investigation makes it clear when the balls returned to the field.

 

[mbuehner]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

What is completely false? The balls were late arriving to the field. The first play from scrimmage almost had to be run using a K-ball.

Where is your source? The Wells investigation makes it clear when the balls returned to the field.

Its in the Wells Report index in a footnote that the balls arrived after kickoff and Anderson offered Brady the use of a K ball.

 

[12punch]

Patriots have to be trolling at this point.

Did you read the whole thing? A few things they deserve to be mocked for asserting but overall it has several strong rebukes of the Wells Report.

I will say I thought it a stretch that Kraft would

look to get rid of Goodell over this but I'm fairly convinced now he plans to get other owners to back him in removing him. Not sure it will work though.

Those owner's may not be so quick to do Kraft's bidding after recent events.

Honestly this has made the Pats look really bad, when the actual transgression was fairly meaningless and would have likely faded as quickly as "textgate" and "noisegate" had the Pats just took notes from how Arthur Blank admitted his wrongdoing like a man.

like a man who was piping noise into his stadium for over 2 years to try and get some kind of sneaky edge

a true american hero

 

[BroadwayG]

So the question is...do you believe the balls were altered by the Patriots?

I waver back and forth so I can argue both sides in this thread.

 

[mbuehner]

So the question is...do you believe the balls were altered by the Patriots?

I waver back and forth so I can argue both sides in this thread.

I like this guy.

 

[BroadwayG]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

What is completely false? The balls were late arriving to the field. The first play from scrimmage almost had to be run using a K-ball.

Where is your source? The Wells investigation makes it clear when the balls returned to the field.

Its in the Wells Report index in a footnote that the balls arrived after kickoff and Anderson offered Brady the use of a K ball.

It doesn't change the fact that the Colts balls were tested after the Pats balls.

 

[mbuehner]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

What is completely false? The balls were late arriving to the field. The first play from scrimmage almost had to be run using a K-ball.

Where is your source? The Wells investigation makes it clear when the balls returned to the field.

Its in the Wells Report index in a footnote that the balls arrived after kickoff and Anderson offered Brady the use of a K ball.

There is no index in the Wells Report.

*appendix. Its in the breakdown of the haltime measurement explanation. Can get you the page when im back at work stealing time.

 

[12punch]

Someone who has posted about 600 times in this thread should really rethink calling others salty or trolls.

yeah, it only took you guys 19,000 posts to troll those 600 out of me

shark pool really be sharkin'

Welcome back. You missed some good comedy. I'd guess that if the Pats leave this report up and publicly defend it that they will lose at least half of the Patriots fans that are still defending them.

Have you read it yet? All of us of course would have you pegged to be the last one off the ship, but any chance that you'll surprise us?

nah, I haven't even looked at it yet --- probably tonight or tomorrow

can barely even catch up with this thread -- you guys are very prolific

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

Patriots fire back with "Full #######" report.

 

[12punch]

Ignoring for now what the Ideal Gas Law tells us the psi loss should have been, we're left to wonder why, regardless of which gauge was used pre-game, the Pats' balls showed 0.72-0.75 psi more deflation than the Colts' balls.

In the scientific report, they expect nearly a .8 psi increase from being taken from the cold into the warm locker room at halftime. Perfectly reasonable the colts balls, tested at the end of halftime instead of the beginning are significantly higher. Of course, this is never brought up by the investigation because it all points to nothing happening.

The chart is on page 204 of the report.

Where is it established that the Colts balls were tested at the end of halftime, and the Pats balls at the beginning of halftime?

A much more reasonable assumption (IMO) is that all the balls were tested at about the same time.

It is specifically stated in pg 72-73 they stopped measuring the Colts balls because they ran out of time. A matter of 2 minutes can increase the psi by .3 as it warms up.

And the Pats' balls were late arriving to the field to start the second half. Sounds like everything with the footballs took place toward the end of halftime.

That is completely false, as video evidence proves (pg 70). It's simply a fact that the Colts balls got to warm up in the locker room longer before being tested. It is also completely obvious that due to this fact, that the Colts balls will show a significantly less pressure drop.

Are you seriously under the illusion that the Patriots did not tamper with any balls after inspection?

Can you bold my text where I made that assertion? This is simply explaining through verified facts and laboratory testing why the Colts balls measured a lesser psi drop.

My point is people keep focusing on that.

I don't care about psi drops.

I don't...its irrelevant. What the PSI was is pretty much pointless anymore.

you guys will never catch 'dorito dink', though

 

[Jeremy]

Football is meant to be entertainment. Patriots...You've entertained us all today and given us comedic fodder for years to come.