Patriots being investigated after Colts game (3 Viewers)

[GreekFreak]

Damn, the season starts tomorrow. How about rooting for your teams to...you know...beat the Patriots on the field. Unfortunately most of them will not, but I can't wait to see the AFC East give it a try with the rest of the division as loaded up with defensive talent as it's been in a while.

Whoooosh! Over your head. This whole thing has been about how badly the Patriots cheat. And even though it's ten years later, more and more details are coming out. They illegally filmed teams at least 40 times. I didn't know that until yesterday.

What a novel idea! Just beat them on the field. lol If it's a level playing field, I agree with you. But when they know the plays you're going to run, and you don't know there's, and when their QB is using an underinflated ball, and their backs are fumbling less because they can grip the ball better, that's hardly a level playing field.

One good thing about all of this, Brady, Belichick and company wouldn't dare to try any other illegal crap this year, right? Right? Hmmm, I wish I was more confident of that. They've always appeared to think they are above all rules and that the league has no right to tell them what they can and can't do. And Judge Berman just gave them reassurance that they may be right.

Repeating the false accusations over and over don't make them true -- a federal judge debunked Deflategate for having no proof.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

Awesome. Another Pats fan who doesn't even know what the trial was about. lol That trial was not about the Patriot's guilt or innocence. It was about whether the league was within it's rights to administer the suspension to Brady. Last I looked, the Pats still lost two draft picks, were fined a million bucks, and two equipment guys are without a job.

Somewhere Donovan Mcnabb just puked. (again)

 

[GreekFreak]

Yeah like I said back to normal.

Unbiased unnamed sources claiming new and exciting ways how the Pats cheated almost a decade ago.

It's like nothing has changed at all.

The difference being it's OTL reporting it. A branch of ESPN, a totally credible news outlet that isn't known for being a complete joke or anything.

Back to Normal.

Pats once again put back in their place (as lying cheats who have lost the respect of most of the non-Pats fan sports world) by realities that only foolish and blind fanatics could deny. Meanwhile, the rest of the universe, other players, coaches, fans, writers and most their collective role as writing history will recall this reality:

One of the best teams for a generation, that seemed to cheat literally the entire way, has forced what would have been one of if not the greatest legacy of success to become the byline of the story. A generation of cheating - which produced 4 (questionable, sadly) Super Bowl wins. Only leaves two real questions:

How many would the Pats have won without cheating (it could have been 2 or 3, I doubt 4 - but who knows, maybe you get 5 because of no distractions)? Unfortunately, because of your cheating, we will never know. Could have been more, and in a way, each you won is under a cloud of legit suspicion by 95% of the football universe.

Who else who may have deserved the win would actually be champion today, if not for the Pats cheating? Again, because of the Pats arrogance and continued, concerted effort to win at all costs, we won't know who actually DESERVED those wins.

We just have this awful feeling that the team that DID win, since they cheated (and likely in more ways than we know), shouldn't have.

See how it calls into question even the admitted success you have had? It's a sad tale. Great franchise. Repeatedly cheated and got caught. Fan base so in denial the rest of us can't even move on, because said foolish fan base really thinks they won on the up and up. When they didnt. They cheated and got caught. How much a fool does one have to be to not actually admit that. Oh, I guess we can see right here in this thread.

The Patriots got punished 1x for Spygate. A federal judge debunked the Wells Report, because it had no evidence.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

So there's no "repeatedly cheated". More like Salty Haters repeatedly make false/debunked accusations vs. Patriots (Formation-gate, Waiver-gate, Deflate-gate all debunked!)

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Damn, the season starts tomorrow. How about rooting for your teams to...you know...beat the Patriots on the field. Unfortunately most of them will not, but I can't wait to see the AFC East give it a try with the rest of the division as loaded up with defensive talent as it's been in a while.

Whoooosh! Over your head. This whole thing has been about how badly the Patriots cheat. And even though it's ten years later, more and more details are coming out. They illegally filmed teams at least 40 times. I didn't know that until yesterday.

What a novel idea! Just beat them on the field. lol If it's a level playing field, I agree with you. But when they know the plays you're going to run, and you don't know there's, and when their QB is using an underinflated ball, and their backs are fumbling less because they can grip the ball better, that's hardly a level playing field.

One good thing about all of this, Brady, Belichick and company wouldn't dare to try any other illegal crap this year, right? Right? Hmmm, I wish I was more confident of that. They've always appeared to think they are above all rules and that the league has no right to tell them what they can and can't do. And Judge Berman just gave them reassurance that they may be right.

I'm a Jets' fan, so I have no love for the Patriots. I'm just sick of rehashing all of this and would just rather let things be settled on the field.

As I said in that other thread 100s of times. Anyone that doesn't think the Pats pull some shady stuff are hiding their heads in the sand, but at the same time if they weren't one of the most successful teams over the past 15 seasons, no one would care as much. To deny that the Pats win mostly because they have one of the greatest HCs of all time and one of the greatest QBs of all time and to pin it all on cheating is equally hiding one's head in the sand.

Let's go Steelers tomorrow night!

 

[Vector]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

 

[SeniorVBDStudent]

Damn, the season starts tomorrow. How about rooting for your teams to...you know...beat the Patriots on the field. Unfortunately most of them will not, but I can't wait to see the AFC East give it a try with the rest of the division as loaded up with defensive talent as it's been in a while.

Whoooosh! Over your head. This whole thing has been about how badly the Patriots cheat. And even though it's ten years later, more and more details are coming out. They illegally filmed teams at least 40 times. I didn't know that until yesterday.What a novel idea! Just beat them on the field. lol If it's a level playing field, I agree with you. But when they know the plays you're going to run, and you don't know there's, and when their QB is using an underinflated ball, and their backs are fumbling less because they can grip the ball better, that's hardly a level playing field.

One good thing about all of this, Brady, Belichick and company wouldn't dare to try any other illegal crap this year, right? Right? Hmmm, I wish I was more confident of that. They've always appeared to think they are above all rules and that the league has no right to tell them what they can and can't do. And Judge Berman just gave them reassurance that they may be right.

Repeating the false accusations over and over don't make them true -- a federal judge debunked Deflategate for having no proof.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

Awesome. Another Pats fan who doesn't even know what the trial was about. lol That trial was not about the Patriot's guilt or innocence. It was about whether the league was within it's rights to administer the suspension to Brady. Last I looked, the Pats still lost two draft picks, were fined a million bucks, and two equipment guys are without a job.

True. Unlike what happened to Jay Feeley and the Jets.

The truth is out there now, twas but a kangaroo court for payback driven by spiteful owners.

 

[satch]

This may have been brought up already, but if opposing coaches believed The Pats were infiltrating their locker room to steal play books, etc, are we to believe that not one of them was bright enough to set up a video camera on the playbook and catch them in the act? Supposedly opposing coaches went as far as planting fake playbooks for the Pats to steal, but it never occurred to them to videotape the theft?

 

[espnespn]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

By law, the judge could only rule on the process. But the judge certainly said there was no evidence -- that is an indisputable fact. I like how Salty Haters everywhere ignore that.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

 

[bostonfred]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you lol

 

[simey]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you

Vector is right. The judge did not rule on Brady's guilt or innocence in regard to the deflated balls. He ruled on the legality of the arbitration process used by the NFL.

 

[moleculo]

to me, what's embarassing is that if teams knew the Pats would be doing this, it would be so easy to slip them faulty info and take advantage of it. I know that Mike Shanahan was a really paranoid guy, and a very smart coach. Looking at his record vs NE, I'd bet dollars to dougnnuts that's exactly what Shanahan did (5-3 record vs Belichick/Brady, including playoffs). It's pathetic that teams like the Dolphins, Jets, Steelers, Colts, etc didn't change things up to catch NE off guard.

Example: if you know they will steal your scripted play sheet, leave a play sheet that shows a WR screen. In game, fake the WR screen, and hit the "blocking" WR deep - he should be wide open. Change up your defensive signs - what was a blitz is now a 3 deep zone, etc.

 

[moleculo]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

By law, the judge could only rule on the process. But the judge certainly said there was no evidence -- that is an indisputable fact. I like how Salty Haters everywhere ignore that.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

he is correct that was no direct evidence pointing to a Brady-orchestrated conspiracy to deflate balls on the specific date of Jan 18. It doesn't mean that Brady wasn't generally aware of Dorito Dink and Friends ball-deflating routine.

 

[satch]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

By law, the judge could only rule on the process. But the judge certainly said there was no evidence -- that is an indisputable fact. I like how Salty Haters everywhere ignore that.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

he is correct that was no direct evidence pointing to a Brady-orchestrated conspiracy to deflate balls on the specific date of Jan 18. It doesn't mean that Brady wasn't generally aware of Dorito Dink and Friends ball-deflating routine.

Even IF Brady was generally aware, which has never been proven, what should he have done? What is he required to do? What if Brandon Lafell was generally aware? Should he be facing the same scrutiny?

 

[Bad_Mo]

Whatever you do, don't disparage patriot fans in here or you'll get a warning. Guess some of the Mods are pats lovers.

I'm still trying to figure out how these warning points are expunged from my profile. I may have to get Judge Berman involved.

 

[Old Smiley]

Patriots have asked for McNally and Jastremski's reinstatement.

Update:

Tom E. Curran ‏@tomecurran 47s48 seconds ago

The NFL acknowledged it received reinstatement request. First request sent Monday, no reply. After 2 more, league said they got it.

 

[sho nuff]

Altering balls after inspection wasn't in the rule book?

You're struggling man...your schtick is bad.

It sure is, and the penalty for altering balls is outlined specifically in the rule book as well.

Not quite. There is a minimum penalty outlined though.

But nothing specific for what went on.

Oh, and most agree the 4 games was way overboard anyway.

 

[Old Smiley]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

By law, the judge could only rule on the process. But the judge certainly said there was no evidence -- that is an indisputable fact. I like how Salty Haters everywhere ignore that.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

he is correct that was no direct evidence pointing to a Brady-orchestrated conspiracy to deflate balls on the specific date of Jan 18. It doesn't mean that Brady wasn't generally aware of Dorito Dink and Friends ball-deflating routine.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you lol

 

[Anarchy99]

I have already heard discussions on this (some including former players) openly wondering how this would even be possible to the level that the article made it out to be. People have indicated that if teams wrote a list of scripted plays, only the HC or OC would have them and if there was a printed or hand written list, it would be attached to the coach like a cell phone . . . they wouldn't leave it out for anyone to access it. At no time would it be left out for someone else to sneak in and grab the top sheet off a clipboard, and if someone were to go and snag it, it would be obvious because the list of plays would have gone missing (ie, the team would notice IMMEDIATELY that their script of plays had disappeared). If that were the case, no sane team would let that slide and not report it to the league.

Similarly, if they did have stuff on paper, they would probably have used a shorthand notation to list it. Even if they did write out the name of the entire play, it would take a full playbook to have any idea what the play call was to have any idea what the play was going to be. Add in audible calls, game conditions, etc. and the whole cloak and dagger story line of have secret agents tyring to infiltrate the opposition's locker room with people in it starts to fall apart.

 

[ShamrockPride]

I have already heard discussions on this (some including former players) openly wondering how this would even be possible to the level that the article made it out to be. People have indicated that if teams wrote a list of scripted plays, only the HC or OC would have them and if there was a printed or hand written list, it would be attached to the coach like a cell phone . . . they wouldn't leave it out for anyone to access it. At no time would it be left out for someone else to sneak in and grab the top sheet off a clipboard, and if someone were to go and snag it, it would be obvious because the list of plays would have gone missing (ie, the team would notice IMMEDIATELY that their script of plays had disappeared). If that were the case, no sane team would let that slide and not report it to the league.

Similarly, if they did have stuff on paper, they would probably have used a shorthand notation to list it. Even if they did write out the name of the entire play, it would take a full playbook to have any idea what the play call was to have any idea what the play was going to be. Add in audible calls, game conditions, etc. and the whole cloak and dagger story line of have secret agents tyring to infiltrate the opposition's locker room with people in it starts to fall apart.

I think I trust NFL personnel more than you lol

 

[Doug B]

Patriots have asked for McNally and Jastremski's reinstatement.

Update:

Tom E. Curran ‏@tomecurran 47s48 seconds ago

The NFL acknowledged it received reinstatement request. First request sent Monday, no reply. After 2 more, league said they got it.

Somewhat surprised that those equipment guys never got an immense offer from TMZ, or heck even one of the Big Four networks for their story.

"I represent ABC ... and whatever Kraft paid you, we'll triple it for you guys to chat with Diane Sawyer for 30 minutes".

Surely Kraft didn't get those guys 8 figures each?

 

[Tau837]

Did cheating Pats cost Chargers titles, new stadium?

 

[Anarchy99]

I have already heard discussions on this (some including former players) openly wondering how this would even be possible to the level that the article made it out to be. People have indicated that if teams wrote a list of scripted plays, only the HC or OC would have them and if there was a printed or hand written list, it would be attached to the coach like a cell phone . . . they wouldn't leave it out for anyone to access it. At no time would it be left out for someone else to sneak in and grab the top sheet off a clipboard, and if someone were to go and snag it, it would be obvious because the list of plays would have gone missing (ie, the team would notice IMMEDIATELY that their script of plays had disappeared). If that were the case, no sane team would let that slide and not report it to the league.

Similarly, if they did have stuff on paper, they would probably have used a shorthand notation to list it. Even if they did write out the name of the entire play, it would take a full playbook to have any idea what the play call was to have any idea what the play was going to be. Add in audible calls, game conditions, etc. and the whole cloak and dagger story line of have secret agents tyring to infiltrate the opposition's locker room with people in it starts to fall apart.

I think I trust NFL personnel more than you lol

So the opinion of people that were having these discussions (former NFL players and personnel) should count less than the unnamed, anonymous sources that appear to have an ax to grind against the Patriots?

It's great that OTL went out and interviewed 90+ people and then wrote an article with no one going on the record, no names, no quotes, and no evidence and all speculation. What they wrote was a fear mongering piece 8 years after the fact with the same whispers that have been circulating for years. And has been noted many times by many people, other teams engaged in the same type of activity to try to get an edge.

It's easy to say someone did something and not even come out with what the something was. I would give ESPN a lot more credit if they had an actual person with their exact quote and what the allegations were. For example, Joe Jones, former locker room attendant for the Bills, said he say someone from the Patriots take the game scripts from a clipboard while playing in New England in 2004 and 2005. Then there is something to research and try to verify.

Saying somebody said NE did something and may have taken scripted plays off a clipboard at some point from 2000-2014 is a wild goose chase. To me, that shows little to nothing and can't be verified or refuted.

 

[Workhorse]

Bill Belichick is firmly in the head of nearly every front office person in the league. He's got them so paranoid, they're thinking that he's going to pop out from under their beds at night like the boogie man.

 

[AngryPatriot]

Bill Belichick is firmly in the head of nearly every front office person in the league. He's got them so paranoid, they're thinking that he's going to pop out from under their beds at night like the boogie man.

lol that's priceless! He surely stealing their stem cells as well- and then injecting then into his brain and the rest into his top players. Just do your damn job!

 

[ChuckLiddell]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you lol

Hypothetical question(s)...

1. Had the judge upheld the suspension, would you still trust that same Federal Judge? Or would you still be claiming prejudice against the Patriots organization?

2. If the suspension is upheld on appeal, will you then change your position simply because it was ruled so in court?

3. Is OJ really (in the real world, not the eyes of the law) innocent of murder just because the gloves didnt fit?

 

[yabahos]

No. The most stunning part is the revelation that the Patriots actually sent people in to opposing team's locker rooms to steal play sheets. Don't blame the victim.

Victims of their own stupidity should have some responsibility for their actions and will be apportioned blame accordingly. Put yourself in a bad situation and yes, you need to take some responsibility for that.

Maybe in the end it paid off for Cowher and the Steelers because they ended up winning the Superbowl in 2006. Maybe they decided to start changing their signals.

 

[moleculo]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

By law, the judge could only rule on the process. But the judge certainly said there was no evidence -- that is an indisputable fact. I like how Salty Haters everywhere ignore that.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

he is correct that was no direct evidence pointing to a Brady-orchestrated conspiracy to deflate balls on the specific date of Jan 18. It doesn't mean that Brady wasn't generally aware of Dorito Dink and Friends ball-deflating routine.

I think I trust what I think a federal judge said more than you lol

well, yeah...that has been made abundantly clear.

 

[conan2]

Can't wait for this thread to be quoted as an unnamed source in the "Deflategate was way worse than you thought it was" article 10 years from now.

 

[parrot]

No. The most stunning part is the revelation that the Patriots actually sent people in to opposing team's locker rooms to steal play sheets. Don't blame the victim.

Yeah, pretty much everyone agrees that was the most stunning part, yet somehow that isn't mentioned anywhere in the first 2,800 or so words of the article, and then is just thrown in haphazardly with a bunch of other "throw it all and see what sticks" claims and rumors. Boy, talk about burying the lead.

It's funny too, what with the competition committee pulling it's hair out over how to hang something on the Patriots, with nothing being ''outside the realm of possibility" and all, no one thought to grab, or film, this "low level employee" engaging in this well-known pattern nefarious behavior.

 

[Doug B]

Kind of wondering if the days of coaches sending in signals will come to an end.

Again, if enough anti-Kraft owners have the itch, pass some new rules regarding length of play clock. Add 10-15 seconds so that teams have time for a designated person (not a player) to run into the huddle with one or more plays. Or the messenger can run in some eye-in-the-sky pics for the QB to analyze and then call his own play.

If sideline signals are so vulnerable, might be time to get away from them.

 

[Old Smiley]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

By law, the judge could only rule on the process. But the judge certainly said there was no evidence -- that is an indisputable fact. I like how Salty Haters everywhere ignore that.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

he is correct that was no direct evidence pointing to a Brady-orchestrated conspiracy to deflate balls on the specific date of Jan 18. It doesn't mean that Brady wasn't generally aware of Dorito Dink and Friends ball-deflating routine.

I think I trust what I think a federal judge said more than you lol

well, yeah...that has been made abundantly clear.

Can't fool you. You've turned my own words against me.

 

[parrot]

Maybe in the end it paid off for Cowher and the Steelers because they ended up winning the Superbowl in 2006. Maybe they decided to start changing their signals.

From the ESPN article:

Some of the Steelers' defensive coaches remain convinced that a deep touchdown pass from Brady to Deion Branch in the January 2005 AFC Championship Game, which was won by the Patriots 41-27, came from stolen signals because Pittsburgh hadn't changed its signals all year, sources say, and the two teams had played a game in the regular season that Walsh told investigators he believes was taped. "They knew the signals, so they knew when it went in what the coverage was and how to attack it," says a former Steelers coach.

https://youtu.be/HCwOPhsMScM?t=10m39s

Farrior: "Shea thought he had post help?"

Coach: "He does..."

Farrior: "Where the hell was he?"

So Polamalu bites on the underneath route - even though, by his own teammate and coach's admission, he is supposed to be giving deep help - Brady reads it and hits Branch RIGHT WHERE TROY IS SUPPOSED TO BE, but the Pats must have cheated. Talk about your salt.

 

[ShamrockPride]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you lol

Hypothetical question(s)...1. Had the judged upheld the suspension, would you still trust that same Federal Judge? Or would you still be claiming prejudice against the Patriots organization?

2. If the suspension is upheld on appeal, will you then change your position simply because it was ruled so in court?

3. Is OJ really (in the real world, not the eyes of the law) innocent of murder just because the gloves didnt fit?

Game. Set. Match. Everyone just go home, It's OVA!

 

[Mookie]

to me, what's embarassing is that if teams knew the Pats would be doing this, it would be so easy to slip them faulty info and take advantage of it. I know that Mike Shanahan was a really paranoid guy, and a very smart coach. Looking at his record vs NE, I'd bet dollars to dougnnuts that's exactly what Shanahan did (5-3 record vs Belichick/Brady, including playoffs). It's pathetic that teams like the Dolphins, Jets, Steelers, Colts, etc didn't change things up to catch NE off guard.

Example: if you know they will steal your scripted play sheet, leave a play sheet that shows a WR screen. In game, fake the WR screen, and hit the "blocking" WR deep - he should be wide open. Change up your defensive signs - what was a blitz is now a 3 deep zone, etc.

Agreed, but either way, you are at a disadvantage as you're spending valuable preparation time reacting to the Pats cheating. The first time you show your hand, the Pats will know that you've played them and Adams will alert BB, so best case scenario is you get one positive play and then are forced to play them straight up. It would be a whole lot simpler, and more fair, if they just didn't cheat in the first place. The Patriot Way is nothing more than systemic cheating, and the NFL has done very little about it.

I know, prove it/everybody does it/Goodell and ESPN are out to get us/isn't the timing curious/but Berman asked a pointed question in oral argument even though he never addressed guilt or innocence in his decision/you're a salty hater/blah blah blah - No need for Pats slappies to respond as I won't read it and don't care.

 

[Old Smiley]

The World Wide Leader

 

[satch]

There have been numerous dynasties throughout NFL history, but only one has been so thoroughly dominant that their opponents had to resort to convincing themselves that "they must be cheating".

Embrace it Pats fans. It's not easy being the greatest NFL dynasty of all time.....and they're not done yet.

 

[bostonfred]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2696227

Without convening a congressional hearing or hiring an independent counsel to investigate the incident, the NFL has ruled that the Miami Dolphins violated no league rules in the Tapegate affair associated with the team's 21-0 victory over the New England Patriots last Sunday.

The incident spawned considerable attention on Tuesday after some Dolphins players suggested to the Palm Beach (Fla.) Post that the team "purchased" tapes of the New England offense that provided audio of quarterback Tom Brady making audible and line-blocking calls.

Those players strongly hinted that the tapes were critical in preparing for the game and provided the Dolphins inside information about New England's offensive audible system.

"I've never seen [brady] so flustered," middle linebacker Zach Thomas said.

The league's response? Pretty much a stifled yawn, since there is no rule prohibiting such film study.

"Reaction around the league office was, 'That's football,' " AFC spokesman Steve Alic said.

Patriots coach Bill Belichick, speaking Wednesday at his news conference, doubted that Miami gained an advantage.

"I stand out on that field every day, as do our defensive players -- who are pretty smart players -- and I don't see it," Belichick said. "If I can't pick it up and our players can't pick it up, with what we know and the opportunity to see and work against each other, I have a hard time thinking somebody else [could]."

Even with the contentions of the Miami defenders, there remains uncertainty over just what measures the Dolphins took in their surveillance of the New England offense. While players said the team "purchased" the tape, coach Nick Saban said his club simply watched TV replays of Brady in an attempt to decipher the calls.

One Miami defender said it is common practice to take a TV tape of a game and enhance the volume to try to hear the quarterback's signals. The so-called "coaching" tapes supplied by the league to teams do not include audio. Television tapes often capture a quarterback's calls at the line of scrimmage because of the parabolic microphones used on the sideline.

Despite the attention garnered by the story, most league observers dismissed the importance of whatever the Dolphins did and chose to attribute the shutout victory to superior execution.

The Dolphins limited the Patriots to 12 first downs and 189 yards and held Brady to 78 passing yards and a passer rating of 55.1 while sacking him four times.

Len Pasquarelli is a senior NFL writer for ESPN.com.

 

[bostonfred]

So when the dolphins players openly admitted to cheating against the Patriots, there was no investigation, Belichick said it didn't bother him, and the league says there's technically no rule against buying a tape of all of Brady's play calls.

But when the rest of the league finds out the Patriots did something similar, they invent new rules, like suspending Brady four games for being "generally aware" of an equipment violation, upholding it on appeal, then taking Brady to court - not the other way around - to get a federal judge to back then up.

Champs vs crybabies.

 

[JIslander]

There have been numerous dynasties throughout NFL history, but only one has been so thoroughly dominant that their opponents had to resort to convincing themselves that "they must be cheating".

Embrace it Pats fans. It's not easy being the greatest NFL dynasty of all time.....and they're not done yet.

Dominant? Cake division and 4 suspect SB wins by what 12 points total?

 

[ShamrockPride]

There have been numerous dynasties throughout NFL history, but only one has been so thoroughly dominant that their opponents had to resort to convincing themselves that "they must be cheating".

Embrace it Pats fans. It's not easy being the greatest NFL dynasty of all time.....and they're not done yet.

Hmm, there have been many great dominant dynasties in all sports. Interesting how in none of those other sports I ever heard such widespread rampant allegations. Never heard it with any Yankee dynasty, never the Lakers, Celtics, Steelers, Cowboys, UCLA, (I don't watch hockey but I'm sure there are some). Strange how people are only jealous of the Patriots despite other (and even more superior) dynasties in other sports.

 

[espnespn]

There have been numerous dynasties throughout NFL history, but only one has been so thoroughly dominant that their opponents had to resort to convincing themselves that "they must be cheating".

Embrace it Pats fans. It's not easy being the greatest NFL dynasty of all time.....and they're not done yet.

Dominant? Cake division and 4 suspect SB wins by what 12 points total?

Please explain why a federal judge saying there was no evidence of deflation in the AFC game, makes the SB suspect.

A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

 

[espnespn]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you lol

Hypothetical question(s)...

1. Had the judge upheld the suspension, would you still trust that same Federal Judge? Or would you still be claiming prejudice against the Patriots organization?

2. If the suspension is upheld on appeal, will you then change your position simply because it was ruled so in court?

3. Is OJ really (in the real world, not the eyes of the law) innocent of murder just because the gloves didnt fit?

1) The judge has said there was no evidence of deflation for the AFC game. Period.

"A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

2) I like how Salty Haters compare OJ (where there was plenty of evidence of murders) to Deflategate (where a judge said there was no evidence). Yes, if you assume your conclusion, then then your conclusion is correct. QED!

 

[ChuckLiddell]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you lol

Hypothetical question(s)...

1. Had the judge upheld the suspension, would you still trust that same Federal Judge? Or would you still be claiming prejudice against the Patriots organization?

2. If the suspension is upheld on appeal, will you then change your position simply because it was ruled so in court?

3. Is OJ really (in the real world, not the eyes of the law) innocent of murder just because the gloves didnt fit?

1) The judge has said there was no evidence of deflation for the AFC game. Period.

"A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

2) I like how Salty Haters compare OJ (where there was plenty of evidence of murders) to Deflategate (where a judge said there was no evidence). Yes, if you assume your conclusion, then then your conclusion is correct. QED!

There is plenty of evidence...it just isnt under the ground where you seem to have hidden your head.

Nice job of not answering a single one of the questions, but rather regurgitating the only thing you seem to want to cling to in this mess that you team has put you and your fellow fans into. As jealous as I admittedly once was of all of the Patriots success, I now actually feel badly for the fans. You are good, loyal fans (obviously) and do not deserve this.

I dont deserve the torture my team has given me with its ineptitude on the field either, but thats a whole different story.

 

[espnespn]

The court case was specifically a trial about guilt or innocence and the verdict was total exoneration of tom brady, the patriots, everything. If you didnt know that then I don't know what you've been watching the last seven months.

This is an inaccurate statement. The judge only ruled the process the NFL used was flawed. There was no exoneration of guilt for Brady or the Pats organization.

I think I trust a federal judge more than you lol

Hypothetical question(s)...

1. Had the judge upheld the suspension, would you still trust that same Federal Judge? Or would you still be claiming prejudice against the Patriots organization?

2. If the suspension is upheld on appeal, will you then change your position simply because it was ruled so in court?

3. Is OJ really (in the real world, not the eyes of the law) innocent of murder just because the gloves didnt fit?

1) The judge has said there was no evidence of deflation for the AFC game. Period.

"A skeptical Berman sounded unconvinced: "What is the evidence of a scheme or conspiracy that covers the Jan. 18 game? I'm having trouble finding it."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/roger-goodell-greeted-boos-deflategate-hearing-article-1.2323018

2) I like how Salty Haters compare OJ (where there was plenty of evidence of murders) to Deflategate (where a judge said there was no evidence). Yes, if you assume your conclusion, then then your conclusion is correct. QED!

There is plenty of evidence...it just isnt under the ground where you seem to have hidden your head.

Nice job of not answering a single one of the questions, but rather regurgitating the only thing you seem to want to cling to in this mess that you team has put you and your fellow fans into. As jealous as I admittedly once was of all of the Patriots success, I now actually feel badly for the fans. You are good, loyal fans (obviously) and do not deserve this.

I dont deserve the torture my team has given me with its ineptitude on the field either, but thats a whole different story.

A federal judge (who looked at everything and questioned both sides) disagrees with you, and said there was no evidence.

Sorry you refuse to believe it.

 

[Anarchy99]

The judge said there was no evidence involving the single game played against the Colts in the AFCCG. That doesn't mean the Patriots didn't manually alter the football in any other game. To be fair, it doesn't mean they did alter the footballs in any other game either.

After 300+ pages, I find it odd that a poll has been added about play sheets. Apparently the OTL article is having its intended effect. Lots of people are reading it and both fully believe what was written (with very little to support it) and people are back to being outraged by Spygate (albeit it 8 years later).

 

[satch]

There have been numerous dynasties throughout NFL history, but only one has been so thoroughly dominant that their opponents had to resort to convincing themselves that "they must be cheating".

Embrace it Pats fans. It's not easy being the greatest NFL dynasty of all time.....and they're not done yet.

Dominant? Cake division and 4 suspect SB wins by what 12 points total?

Just more excuses. The only thing suspect about those 4 SB wins is the integrity of the losers making excuses and baseless cheating accusations. There's no shame in losing, until you start making excuses.

 

[AngryPatriot]

It just proves HobbsAB is a hater and that was a troll move putting some stupid poll up. In other news Pats looking to reinstate the 2 ball boys/locker room guys.

 

[Run It Up]

The judge said there was no evidence involving the single game played against the Colts in the AFCCG. That doesn't mean the Patriots didn't manually alter the football in any other game. To be fair, it doesn't mean they did alter the footballs in any other game either.

After 300+ pages, I find it odd that a poll has been added about play sheets. Apparently the OTL article is having its intended effect. Lots of people are reading it and both fully believe what was written (with very little to support it) and people are back to being outraged by Spygate (albeit it 8 years later).

No different then when that article last year about headsets that was complete bs. Just ignorant chirping.

 

[AngryPatriot]

There have been numerous dynasties throughout NFL history, but only one has been so thoroughly dominant that their opponents had to resort to convincing themselves that "they must be cheating".

Embrace it Pats fans. It's not easy being the greatest NFL dynasty of all time.....and they're not done yet.

Dominant? Cake division and 4 suspect SB wins by what 12 points total?

Just more excuses. The only thing suspect about those 4 SB wins is the integrity of the losers making excuses and baseless cheating accusations. There's no shame in losing, until you start making excuses.

Exactly, win the game on the field... it's hard to do.

 

[yabahos]

Maybe in the end it paid off for Cowher and the Steelers because they ended up winning the Superbowl in 2006. Maybe they decided to start changing their signals.

From the ESPN article:

Some of the Steelers' defensive coaches remain convinced that a deep touchdown pass from Brady to Deion Branch in the January 2005 AFC Championship Game, which was won by the Patriots 41-27, came from stolen signals because Pittsburgh hadn't changed its signals all year, sources say, and the two teams had played a game in the regular season that Walsh told investigators he believes was taped. "They knew the signals, so they knew when it went in what the coverage was and how to attack it," says a former Steelers coach.

https://youtu.be/HCwOPhsMScM?t=10m39s

Farrior: "Shea thought he had post help?"

Coach: "He does..."

Farrior: "Where the hell was he?"

So Polamalu bites on the underneath route - even though, by his own teammate and coach's admission, he is supposed to be giving deep help - Brady reads it and hits Branch RIGHT WHERE TROY IS SUPPOSED TO BE, but the Pats must have cheated. Talk about your salt.

You might want to go back and read my posts. Basically started off by saying the Steelers were idiots for running the same set of signals for an entire season, hearing allegations that NE tapes signals, and then still rolling out the same old signals for the AFC Championship game. Essentially, they got what they deserved.

 

[Statler & Waldorf]

There have been numerous dynasties throughout NFL history, but only one has been so thoroughly dominant that their opponents had to resort to convincing themselves that "they must be cheating".

Embrace it Pats fans. It's not easy being the greatest NFL dynasty of all time.....and they're not done yet.

Hmm, there have been many great dominant dynasties in all sports. Interesting how in none of those other sports I ever heard such widespread rampant allegations. Never heard it with any Yankee dynasty, never the Lakers, Celtics, Steelers, Cowboys, UCLA, (I don't watch hockey but I'm sure there are some). Strange how people are only jealous of the Patriots despite other (and even more superior) dynasties in other sports.

The Pats dynasty also coincides with the explosion of the Internet age. Back in the day, fan bases were more insulated and news was relayed either at night on the tv or in the paper the next day. Now, everything is known instantaneously. Not to mention discussed ad nauseam on message boards or comments sections by fans from all different regions.

And the celtics dynasty of the 60's had all sorts of conspiracies around them. Everyone accused Red of everything and anything.