PBS Frontline : The Retirement Gamble, sorta Must See (2 Viewers)

[Doctor Detroit]

Times like these are perfect "teaching moments" about being a passive investor and leveraging the "Target Retirement Date" funds. The "slow phase" of reducing risk in your portfolio the closer you get to retirement date is done for you and you're not stuck dealing with a sharp downtown.

On days like this the target date funds are getting hammered too. Some of those funds are also overly weighted in bonds. I have some exposure in my Roth but chose a fund 10 years after my target retirement date.

I would imagine the impact is a lot less.

Talk to me about the strategy of choosing a fund 10 years after your target retirement date

It increases the volatility of the fund and keeps you more invested in equities. I don't want to be 40% in bonds ten years out, I think that's silly. I plan to be over 80% invested in equities up to five years out, then go from there.

When you retire, how long to you plan to live in retirement? If you retire at 60, and you live to 80 that is 20 years of living you need to have money for. It maybe even longer 30 to 40 years even. If you have that long there is time to handle the fluctuations of the market. Most people wont be able to just park their money in low risk, they may need to be more aggressive.

I know that is not worded the best but hopefully you can understand my question/point.

I have quite a bit of real estate, a pension that is already guaranteed, a Roth IRA, whatever I have saved on the side, Social Security bridge payments, then social security. I'm going to be fairly risky with my 401k money until I'm in my mid 50s. It's all profit as far as I'm concerned. Probably end up giving most of it away to charity I'd guess.

ETA: And when I say "risky" I mean equities of all shapes and sizes. I'm not throwing my tax sheltered accounts into bio techs or midget pr0n elevator trampolines. And even if I didn't have all those income streams I'd still be pretty risky, and I'm not really a risky person by nature. Adventurous sure, but not risky.

 

[NutterButter]

How does NewlyRetired spend a day of market turmoil like this?

Overseeding his lawn or maybe that's next week

 

[KCitons]

Probably end up giving most of it away to charity I'd guess.

Why give it to just one stripper? Spread it around.

 

[SoylentGreen]

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

 

[Tiger Fan]

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

oh man

 

[fourd]

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Wouldn't panic would have caused him to sell all of it?

 

[eoMMan]

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Why type of investment vehicle were these in (IRA, general taxable account, etc.)? Maybe he he can rebuy without much consequence.

 

[Tiger Fan]

Brainstorming here...

So I'm looking at buying 1-2 cars by the end of the year. I have the cash to buy both, but I'm playing around with alternatives. One of the cars, Honda Accord looks like it will be a .9% rate; the other, Honda Pilot would likely be a higher rate (b/c of the newness of the car)....so I was toying with taking the cash I was going to spend on that car and investing in a mutual fund that is geared toward dividend paying equities. I'd be able to cover the monthly payments still, the dividends would (in essence) cover the interest...whether or not I actually cash the dividends vs. reinvest them is another decision.

.

Obviously there's risk here if the market tank...but that's with anything.

What am I missing.

 

[Slapdash]

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Tell him to buy it back...

 

[SoylentGreen]

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Wouldn't panic would have caused him to sell all of it?

Apparently he tried, but his adviser talked him down into only selling half of it.

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Why type of investment vehicle were these in (IRA, general taxable account, etc.)? Maybe he he can rebuy without much consequence.

I'm not entirely sure, got the info from my mom last night who was crying. He didn't consult her before he did it, which she was as upset about as anything.

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Tell him to buy it back...

That's what I said. Told my mom to talk to the adviser herself today to discuss their options.

One of the things that came out of the conversation was that various advisers have suggested to them that they have 3-5 years worth of cash on hand. Does that seem right to you all, or awfully conservative? Dad is 73 and still working part time, probably his last year, and mom is 65 and just retired.

 

[Tiger Fan]

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Wouldn't panic would have caused him to sell all of it?

Apparently he tried, but his adviser talked him down into only selling half of it.

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Why type of investment vehicle were these in (IRA, general taxable account, etc.)? Maybe he he can rebuy without much consequence.

I'm not entirely sure, got the info from my mom last night who was crying. He didn't consult her before he did it, which she was as upset about as anything.

Just found out my 73 year old dad panicked and sold 1/2 his equity holdings this morning. If you're planning for a life expectancy of 90+, not sure how a long-overdue market correction almost 20 years from then causes that kind of panic. But it apparently did. Ooooof.

Tell him to buy it back...

That's what I said. Told my mom to talk to the adviser herself today to discuss their options.

One of the things that came out of the conversation was that various advisers have suggested to them that they have 3-5 years worth of cash on hand. Does that seem right to you all, or awfully conservative? Dad is 73 and still working part time, probably his last year, and mom is 65 and just retired.

Hard to say w/o knowing other particulars about the situation, but that seems like a lot to me

 

[rick6668]

Back in today on some specific stocks. Likely early next week on some specific mutual funds.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

I cashed out of my government securities and bought equities after yesterday's close. Market could definitely go lower but I felt a 10-12% correction territory was a good place to cash in some bonds as a long-term investor.

Tiger fan>you could buy the cars cash and then invest what you would have used on those cars every month. Dollar cost averaging over three to five years reduces volatility. However, right now doesn't seem like a terrible time to drop a chunk in the market. So taking the loans and grabbing some equities doesn't seem like a terrible idea.

 

[kutta]

Brainstorming here...

So I'm looking at buying 1-2 cars by the end of the year. I have the cash to buy both, but I'm playing around with alternatives. One of the cars, Honda Accord looks like it will be a .9% rate; the other, Honda Pilot would likely be a higher rate (b/c of the newness of the car)....so I was toying with taking the cash I was going to spend on that car and investing in a mutual fund that is geared toward dividend paying equities. I'd be able to cover the monthly payments still, the dividends would (in essence) cover the interest...whether or not I actually cash the dividends vs. reinvest them is another decision.

.

Obviously there's risk here if the market tank...but that's with anything.

What am I missing.

Maybe I'm just really lazy and like to keep things simple. But there is no risk at all with paying off the car and you will have the peace of mind knowing you don't have debt hanging over your head. If we are voting, I vote pay off the car and move on.

 

[ghostguy123]

Brainstorming here...

So I'm looking at buying 1-2 cars by the end of the year. I have the cash to buy both, but I'm playing around with alternatives. One of the cars, Honda Accord looks like it will be a .9% rate; the other, Honda Pilot would likely be a higher rate (b/c of the newness of the car)....so I was toying with taking the cash I was going to spend on that car and investing in a mutual fund that is geared toward dividend paying equities. I'd be able to cover the monthly payments still, the dividends would (in essence) cover the interest...whether or not I actually cash the dividends vs. reinvest them is another decision.

.

Obviously there's risk here if the market tank...but that's with anything.

What am I missing.

Maybe I'm just really lazy and like to keep things simple. But there is no risk at all with paying off the car and you will have the peace of mind knowing you don't have debt hanging over your head. If we are voting, I vote pay off the car and move on.

Yeah either way here is fine. I went the other route buying a new van a few weeks back and put zero down, taking the 1.9% over 5 years. The total interest after 5 years is around $1,500. We will put a little extra each month, but rather than paying off the van up front we are putting extra towards out house payment. Doing that will say us a lot more interest over that time than the interest we will pay on the car.

Even if you don't have a house payment though, it's hard to find fault in paying off the car.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Maxing contributions to my 401k (TSP) now, it was time.

In the recent market downturn I moved a bunch of money from my government securities to equities, because even if the market went lower, it would be higher 15 years from now when I can retire. Simple calculation on that really, and I welcome market downturns in the next 15 years as opportunities to increase my wealth.

I have people working for me in their 50s and I'm not sure they ever even consider what they will do in retirement. Sure they are going to get a pension, but federal pensions aren't GM foreman pensions or the old 110% city police department pensions. It's 1% a year before taxes and survivor benefits, and these folks are making $70k a year. Do 30 years and take your high five average salaries, and you are looking at $21k a year. And they have their TSP funds in government securities, some not even contributing the 5% to get the match.

I pass this along because these are the same employees who are always for a grade/pay bump, instead of making sacrifices now to save for the future. So it irritates me. There are many people out there who don't have a 401k plan, or don't have a match of any kind, those are the people I can empathize with. But if you have a plan available to you and you don't take advantage of it, don't come to me asking for a handout when you realize you've erred.

 

[wilked]

Why not work with management / HR to get an unbiased FA to come in to speak about general retirement items, point out some of these obvious items? I know that unrequested financial advice wouldn't go over well, but from a professional might be effective?

Could be a good semaritan act before the holidays...

 

[FUBAR]

Maxing contributions to my 401k (TSP) now, it was time.

In the recent market downturn I moved a bunch of money from my government securities to equities, because even if the market went lower, it would be higher 15 years from now when I can retire. Simple calculation on that really, and I welcome market downturns in the next 15 years as opportunities to increase my wealth.

I have people working for me in their 50s and I'm not sure they ever even consider what they will do in retirement. Sure they are going to get a pension, but federal pensions aren't GM foreman pensions or the old 110% city police department pensions. It's 1% a year before taxes and survivor benefits, and these folks are making $70k a year. Do 30 years and take your high five average salaries, and you are looking at $21k a year. And they have their TSP funds in government securities, some not even contributing the 5% to get the match.

I pass this along because these are the same employees who are always for a grade/pay bump, instead of making sacrifices now to save for the future. So it irritates me. There are many people out there who don't have a 401k plan, or don't have a match of any kind, those are the people I can empathize with. But if you have a plan available to you and you don't take advantage of it, don't come to me asking for a handout when you realize you've erred.

OTOH, my senior boss has almost 50 years in and if he retired today he'd lose maybe $100 a month while doing nothing (or taking another job). He works because he'd go crazy if he didn't. Sad really, but at least he's financially set. (though he may die within a year of retiring).

Why not work with management / HR to get an unbiased FA to come in to speak about general retirement items, point out some of these obvious items? I know that unrequested financial advice wouldn't go over well, but from a professional might be effective?

Could be a good semaritan act before the holidays...

Nice idea, but it goes over like a fart in church around here. Our community services office offered a free finanical planning class taught by a professor at the local college. maybe 10 other people out of 25,000 eligible actually came to it.

 

[NutterButter]

OTOH, my senior boss has almost 50 years in and if he retired today he'd lose maybe $100 a month while doing nothing (or taking another job). He works because he'd go crazy if he didn't. Sad really, but at least he's financially set. (though he may die within a year of retiring).

Part of me thinks that I'd call it quits when I can, but a local gig like I have now where you're commuting little and working 9-5 isn't bad. Once the kids are out, I'll have so much more free time that as long as I got say 4 weeks vaca, that might be the right balance. It would be great to have all that discretionary income.

 

[IC FBGCav]

Why not work with management / HR to get an unbiased FA to come in to speak about general retirement items, point out some of these obvious items? I know that unrequested financial advice wouldn't go over well, but from a professional might be effective?

Could be a good semaritan act before the holidays...

I do this every 5 years. He is runs our 401K plan's investment options so not technically unbiased but he has set up things for free for some of our employees and even two that were not in our 401K plan.

 

[Chadstroma]

Why not work with management / HR to get an unbiased FA to come in to speak about general retirement items, point out some of these obvious items? I know that unrequested financial advice wouldn't go over well, but from a professional might be effective?

Could be a good semaritan act before the holidays...

I have tried to do it many times being on the banker side. People don't show up.

Doesn't matter if it is through an employer or at the bank. If you advertise the hell out it of and offer free food and drinks along with it. People do not go.

 

[FUBAR]

OTOH, my senior boss has almost 50 years in and if he retired today he'd lose maybe $100 a month while doing nothing (or taking another job). He works because he'd go crazy if he didn't. Sad really, but at least he's financially set. (though he may die within a year of retiring).

Part of me thinks that I'd call it quits when I can, but a local gig like I have now where you're commuting little and working 9-5 isn't bad. Once the kids are out, I'll have so much more free time that as long as I got say 4 weeks vaca, that might be the right balance. It would be great to have all that discretionary income.

I can see the benefits and it has to be nice to have the options. I think my ideal would be doing some defense work, traveling from home for a week or two at a time for a motions hearing, to meet with the defendant, for the trial, etc would be great. Take maybe 10-12 cases each year. Spend most of the time at the beach and keeping ourselves healthy.

 

[urbanhack]

http://www.npr.org/2015/10/30/453163154/when-high-fees-stink-up-your-401-k-what-you-can-do?

 

[Chadstroma]

http://www.npr.org/2015/10/30/453163154/when-high-fees-stink-up-your-401-k-what-you-can-do?

feex.com is a good resource for investments (retirement or not) to find funds like what you have but lower expense ratios.

The thing that sucks about 401k's is that they can soak you before the investment options, limit your investment options and there really is no alternative other than talking to the upper management like the article says or you just do not participate.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Why not work with management / HR to get an unbiased FA to come in to speak about general retirement items, point out some of these obvious items? I know that unrequested financial advice wouldn't go over well, but from a professional might be effective?

Could be a good semaritan act before the holidays...

I have tried to do it many times being on the banker side. People don't show up.

This

 

[KCitons]

Our retirement is about to take a big hit. Will confirm tomorrow, but it looks like the wife will be forced into FERS disability retirement due to her eyes. Once the dust settles, monthly take home won't change but current contributions will dry up. We had been maxing out her TSP contribution (including catch up contribution), fully funding both Roths, and investing another grand or so a month into stocks or index funds. Honestly, I'm not sure what my investment/retirement strategy is at this point.

 

[wilked]

It's hard to tell, but are you looking for advice?

 

[KCitons]

It's hard to tell, but are you looking for advice?

Always. At this point I'm not even sure I can formulate a question. Up first is whether to keep funding her TSP while she uses all of her sick leave and vacation time. Last chance to get money into the account. But having extra cash in short term investments makes more sense.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

KC

I was writing out some stuff about leave rules, buyback, rolling over sick leave towards retirement, calculating the survivor benefit, etc but stopped because it's just too much to cover.

However here is a site with hundreds of questions surrounding FERs, federal retirement, and a lot of things you might not know. Some of this may be useful to you and yours.

 

[KCitons]

Thanks DD. I will read through the info on that site. She will need to exhaust all of her sick leave and annual leave prior to FERS disability kicking in. It's a different calculation from early retirement. We've had a few years to prepare, which led to many of our financial decisions like paying off the mortgage, not creating monthly bills, etc. I am confident that day to day life will be ok. Just not sure how aggressive I should be with her TSP? I keep thinking nothing should change. She has over 10 years before she would be able to withdraw on it anyway. I tend to go conservative when faced with adversity. I'm trying to fight that urge.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Thanks DD. I will read through the info on that site. She will need to exhaust all of her sick leave and annual leave prior to FERS disability kicking in. It's a different calculation from early retirement. We've had a few years to prepare, which led to many of our financial decisions like paying off the mortgage, not creating monthly bills, etc. I am confident that day to day life will be ok. Just not sure how aggressive I should be with her TSP? I keep thinking nothing should change. She has over 10 years before she would be able to withdraw on it anyway. I tend to go conservative when faced with adversity. I'm trying to fight that urge.

This may be a better search for you then.

Look at it this way man, she can't withdrawal it for ten years. Will the stock market be more valuable than it is today, or less valuable? You can also roll it over into an IRA, but you'd have a tough time beating the expense ratio of the TSP. However if you feel the TSP does not offer the right mix of investments for your goals, then a rollover is a real option.

 

[KCitons]

Thanks again DD. I don't want to pull the money out of her TSP and agree on the expense ratio. At this point, I'm just frustrated with the whole situation and probably just rambling on.

 

[SouthJersey]

What's the best investment strategy here:

Recently switched to a new job that does not offer a 401k plan to employees. I had been maxing both mine and my wife's 401k's as well as ROTHs. I still plan to keep things the same with my wife's plan. But now since I do have the opportunity to defer taxes on $18k of my salary, should I put they ROTH money ($11k/yr between the 2 accounts) into a traditional IRA to take advantage of the tax break?

 

[Binky The Doormat]

What's the best investment strategy here:

Recently switched to a new job that does not offer a 401k plan to employees. I had been maxing both mine and my wife's 401k's as well as ROTHs. I still plan to keep things the same with my wife's plan. But now since I do have the opportunity to defer taxes on $18k of my salary, should I put they ROTH money ($11k/yr between the 2 accounts) into a traditional IRA to take advantage of the tax break?

You first will need to look at your combined income and expected tax to know the current tax benefit. Don't know that you want to put your income in here.

 

[mquinnjr]

Get past the title because it is misleading. President Obama wants to put rules on financial advisers to steer clients in the client's best interest and not of that of the commission the adviser could receive from a sale to a client. While not as bullet-proof as a fee only adviser, this would be a big step in the right direction to get people away from some of the more predatory advisers. I'd expect Republicans to block/delay, but seeing Democrats also join in just stinks IMO. Is anyone in it for American savers, or are the banks just this powerful and we just need to accept that? This should (in theory) be the least partisan initiative ever, and it angers me that both sides are caving to the banks.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/05/opinion/democrats-undermine-efforts-to-protect-retirement-savers.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur

 

[urbanhack]

Get past the title because it is misleading. President Obama wants to put rules on financial advisers to steer clients in the client's best interest and not of that of the commission the adviser could receive from a sale to a client. While not as bullet-proof as a fee only adviser, this would be a big step in the right direction to get people away from some of the more predatory advisers. I'd expect Republicans to block/delay, but seeing Democrats also join in just stinks IMO. Is anyone in it for American savers, or are the banks just this powerful and we just need to accept that? This should (in theory) be the least partisan initiative ever, and it angers me that both sides are caving to the banks.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/05/opinion/democrats-undermine-efforts-to-protect-retirement-savers.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur

yes. we are ####ed.

 

[cstu]

OTOH, my senior boss has almost 50 years in and if he retired today he'd lose maybe $100 a month while doing nothing (or taking another job). He works because he'd go crazy if he didn't. Sad really, but at least he's financially set. (though he may die within a year of retiring).

Part of me thinks that I'd call it quits when I can, but a local gig like I have now where you're commuting little and working 9-5 isn't bad. Once the kids are out, I'll have so much more free time that as long as I got say 4 weeks vaca, that might be the right balance. It would be great to have all that discretionary income.

I can see the benefits and it has to be nice to have the options. I think my ideal would be doing some defense work, traveling from home for a week or two at a time for a motions hearing, to meet with the defendant, for the trial, etc would be great. Take maybe 10-12 cases each year. Spend most of the time at the beach and keeping ourselves healthy.

I'm glad I found a job where I can work from home and never have to retire (appraising). I can easily live off writing a couple of commercial reports a month.

 

[⚡DEADHEAD⚡]

Good program. Glad I watched. Will look into a Vanguard Index fund for my 401k contributions.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Just re-balanced my 401k and did my annual account maintenance. Up 1.37% for the year, pedestrian yet expected in this market environment. Put a few more bucks into government securities, reduced my exposure in short and intermediate bonds, and bought more into small caps as I think that is the sector most likely to yield the best intermediate returns. I don't shift a lot though, stay the course with a few adjustments based on what is happening right now in the world. Only check this account a handful of times per year, just for re-balancing and tweaking ever so slightly.

13.5 years until I can retire, 18.5 years until I retire for certain. My Roth returns were in the negative this year, stupid energy stocks weighed me down.

Interested in hearing what other people's 401k did, I think if you got 5% this year you killed it.

 

[Fennis]

Good thread, can't believe I have not read most of it. I'm going to catch up on it.

-.062% on my 401k YTD. Good news is my employer is increasing their match 50% this upcoming year.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Good thread, can't believe I have not read most of it. I'm going to catch up on it.

-.062% on my 401k YTD. Good news is my employer is increasing their match 50% this upcoming year.

Yeah this thread is pretty awesome.

Always nice to read the bolded, free money is the best kind of money.

 

[Sand]

Just re-balanced my 401k and did my annual account maintenance. Up 1.37% for the year, pedestrian yet expected in this market environment. Put a few more bucks into government securities, reduced my exposure in short and intermediate bonds, and bought more into small caps as I think that is the sector most likely to yield the best intermediate returns. I don't shift a lot though, stay the course with a few adjustments based on what is happening right now in the world. Only check this account a handful of times per year, just for re-balancing and tweaking ever so slightly.

13.5 years until I can retire, 18.5 years until I retire for certain. My Roth returns were in the negative this year, stupid energy stocks weighed me down.

Interested in hearing what other people's 401k did, I think if you got 5% this year you killed it.

401k was -7% YTD. Everything in the red - awful on the year. My small overall allocation to commodities is buried in here and really took this down. That and a reallocation from real estate to the S&P small cap, which earned -15% in the second half. Yay for bad timing, though mathematically it was sound. Oh, and my bit of high yield in is there, too. That's done awesome this year.

Overall I'm -4% YTD on investments, which considering I'm 10% CVX and another 5% or so energy/commodity heavy isn't too bad. Net worth +7%, so not miserable, but this will be the first year since '08 that that metric hasn't been over 10%.

Given that the S&P is flat on the year, bonds are up a whopping .5%, foreign is down, foreign bonds are way down, and the DOW is down I'd be surprised if many folks spread out into appropriate asset classes were up this year.

 

[Mr. Pickles]

Interested in hearing what other people's 401k did, I think if you got 5% this year you killed it.

+4.69% YTD. Not sure I did anything special.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Interested in hearing what other people's 401k did, I think if you got 5% this year you killed it.

+4.69% YTD. Not sure I did anything special.

You're special, and don't let anyone tell you any different.

 

[NutterButter]

Down .5%. Oh well. I'm just stoked that my company is going to be offering some low fee index funds this year.

 

[Dentist]

Up 0.03 percent.

 

[eoMMan]

What end date is everyone using?

 

[Dentist]

What end date is everyone using?

Death

 

[Tiger Fan]

-.10%

 

[lod01]

Just re-balanced my 401k and did my annual account maintenance. Up 1.37% for the year, pedestrian yet expected in this market environment. Put a few more bucks into government securities, reduced my exposure in short and intermediate bonds, and bought more into small caps as I think that is the sector most likely to yield the best intermediate returns. I don't shift a lot though, stay the course with a few adjustments based on what is happening right now in the world. Only check this account a handful of times per year, just for re-balancing and tweaking ever so slightly.

13.5 years until I can retire, 18.5 years until I retire for certain. My Roth returns were in the negative this year, stupid energy stocks weighed me down.

Interested in hearing what other people's 401k did, I think if you got 5% this year you killed it.

Up 8.5% on my 457B (this of course does not include $ I put in) but I move my money around a lot. I have 57 funds to choose from and I track them weekly (daily when the market goes up or down 1+%). That way I know which ones are performing best at the time. For instance, small cap funds suck right now and have for a couple months. I flip between bonds and stocks, run to 1 of 2 money market funds when the #### hits the fan. Rode VUSTX up at the end of previous year and held to the 20th of Jan. That got me up 6% and the market was down so I flipped to stocks. Peaked at 16% in June.

I moved my money 52 times. That was nuts. Moved it 15 times the previous year. Also I don't split it up. I'm either in stocks or in bonds and I am in 1 fund usually, sometimes as many as 3. Multiple small cap funds, mid caps and large caps, growth and value but I am rarely in value. Have to wait 30 days to get back in a fund so I had to know exactly what all 57 are.