Ricky Williams, the bigger picture (1 Viewer)

[sholditch]

When everyone was posting about Ricky taking the job, a lot of the threads mentioned him being a UFA next year and using this year at Miami to get a big payday next offseason. This fits the traditional mold of thinking about an NFL RB. However, the one thing we know about Ricky is that he doesn't fit the mold.

In the past few days, Ricky signed a one-year contract extension:

Dolphins RB Ricky Williams, who recently signed a one-year extension, said he wants to finish his career in Miami.

With his history, Williams may be done before the contract runs out, so this isn't much of a statement. He also said he's studying to become a doctor after he retires. Bill Parcells is a fan, so Ricky's stay in Miami could last as long as he stays healthy.

On paper, this looks good for Ricky's prospects as a starter and bad for Ronnie Brown. However, it might deserve a closer look. When the whole battle was in full-swing, I remember reading something where Ricky said that he wasn't interested in competing with Ronnie. I can't remember whether he said something more specific, but that was the gist.

So put the two things together, and you have Ricky, before the season even gets going, say he isn't interested in competing with his main competition, and then he signs a deal which assures that he won't get a payday from this season. He has also said that he wants to retire as a Dolphin (a bit strange considering his checkered past with the team, especially considering that Miami went after him for quite a bit of money) and as the blurb notes he is finishing his undergrad with a pre-med course load.

To me, this is not the description of a guy who wants to resurrect his career in the NFL, at least terms of making what we think of as a "comeback." If he hadn't signed the deal I was content to let the comment go, but viewing the two together it seems to me that Ricky is not looking to do much more than ride his career into the sunset. He's past his prime in age, is already talking about retiring, and is actively planning for life after the NFL. To me, this is more like a guy who is content to carry the torch for a while and then pass it back to Ronnie.

I freely admit I may be reading too much into this, but does anyone else see where I am coming from here?

 

[TheFanatic]

When everyone was posting about Ricky taking the job, a lot of the threads mentioned him being a UFA next year and using this year at Miami to get a big payday next offseason. This fits the traditional mold of thinking about an NFL RB. However, the one thing we know about Ricky is that he doesn't fit the mold.In the past few days, Ricky signed a one-year contract extensionolphins RB Ricky Williams, who recently signed a one-year extension, said he wants to finish his career in Miami.With his history, Williams may be done before the contract runs out, so this isn't much of a statement. He also said he's studying to become a doctor after he retires. Bill Parcells is a fan, so Ricky's stay in Miami could last as long as he stays healthy.On paper, this looks good for Ricky's prospects as a starter and bad for Ronnie Brown. However, it might deserve a closer look. When the whole battle was in full-swing, I remember reading something where Ricky said that he wasn't interested in competing with Ronnie. I can't remember whether he said something more specific, but that was the gist. So put the two things together, and you have Ricky, before the season even gets going, say he isn't interested in competing with his main competition, and then he signs a deal which assures that he won't get a payday from this season. He has also said that he wants to retire as a Dolphin (a bit strange considering his checkered past with the team, especially considering that Miami went after him for quite a bit of money) and as the blurb notes he is finishing his undergrad with a pre-med course load. To me, this is not the description of a guy who wants to resurrect his career in the NFL, at least terms of making what we think of as a "comeback." If he hadn't signed the deal I was content to let the comment go, but viewing the two together it seems to me that Ricky is not looking to do much more than ride his career into the sunset. He's past his prime in age, is already talking about retiring, and is actively planning for life after the NFL. To me, this is more like a guy who is content to carry the torch for a while and then pass it back to Ronnie.I freely admit I may be reading too much into this, but does anyone else see where I am coming from here?

So to sum up - Ricky is a little off. Oh, and water is wet...

 

[Todem]

Only one thing matters...how he has played thus far.

He has looked very good and running with authority, power, speed, vision.

Don't read into his jargon. Just pay attention to what he does on the field.

The only caveat is can he stay on it? The price most of us were able to land him before the herd got wind of him was so chaep it was worth the risk.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

When everyone was posting about Ricky taking the job, a lot of the threads mentioned him being a UFA next year and using this year at Miami to get a big payday next offseason. This fits the traditional mold of thinking about an NFL RB. However, the one thing we know about Ricky is that he doesn't fit the mold.

In the past few days, Ricky signed a one-year contract extension:

Dolphins RB Ricky Williams, who recently signed a one-year extension, said he wants to finish his career in Miami.

With his history, Williams may be done before the contract runs out, so this isn't much of a statement. He also said he's studying to become a doctor after he retires. Bill Parcells is a fan, so Ricky's stay in Miami could last as long as he stays healthy.

On paper, this looks good for Ricky's prospects as a starter and bad for Ronnie Brown. However, it might deserve a closer look. When the whole battle was in full-swing, I remember reading something where Ricky said that he wasn't interested in competing with Ronnie. I can't remember whether he said something more specific, but that was the gist.

So put the two things together, and you have Ricky, before the season even gets going, say he isn't interested in competing with his main competition, and then he signs a deal which assures that he won't get a payday from this season. He has also said that he wants to retire as a Dolphin (a bit strange considering his checkered past with the team, especially considering that Miami went after him for quite a bit of money) and as the blurb notes he is finishing his undergrad with a pre-med course load.

To me, this is not the description of a guy who wants to resurrect his career in the NFL, at least terms of making what we think of as a "comeback." If he hadn't signed the deal I was content to let the comment go, but viewing the two together it seems to me that Ricky is not looking to do much more than ride his career into the sunset. He's past his prime in age, is already talking about retiring, and is actively planning for life after the NFL. To me, this is more like a guy who is content to carry the torch for a while and then pass it back to Ronnie.

I freely admit I may be reading too much into this, but does anyone else see where I am coming from here?

adding your bias, and lack of evidence makes it hard to believe anything out of your mouth when southern football is involved. you really are the definition of an SEC BLIND homer.

 

[sholditch]

Wow, thanks for staying on topic and contributing to the thread. Your insight is astounding. Last I checked the Dolphins weren't considered part of the SEC.

Anyone have anything INTELLIGENT to add besides Todem?

 

[MDSkinner]

I think if Ricky were a normal guy that reading into the contract extension and statement of not wanting to compete would probably be valid especially when coupled with the undergrad/pre med stuff.

However, this is Ricky. All bets are off. Your guess is as good as mine.

 

[IndyHavoc]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

I loved the argument by the pro-Ricky crowd that he was playing for one last big payday this year, and that's why he so valuable. Yeah, he just got that. So, Ricky has now been forgiven his $8 million debt to the fanchise, gotten a little coin for taking as much of a beating as he can take to begin this year, then ride off into the sunset.

Yeah, I'd say I'm pretty much with you more than against you on this, Shol.

 

[massraider]

Good post, and something to think about it.

My first thought is that yeah, yo might be reading too much into his comments, only because Ricky is a such a strange bird. His statement might not mean exactly what a normal person might think he means. Signing Ricky to this deal makes me think the Fins are a bit concerned about Ronnie long term.

 

[BigJim®]

I just can't take Ricky serious as a long term "battle opponent" vs. Ronnie. He's a nice short term FF commodity while Brown is on the mend and could put up some points early this season. I'm not sure why anyone should think he'll get significant PT once Brown heals though. There's no benefit to Miami championing a vet over a guy who could/should be their future. Ricky didn't blow away the CFL, and was injured almost immediately when he got NFL carries last season. If Williams can keep himself from flaking out and be a good insurance policy in case of R.Brown injury over the next 2 years, he'll exceed my expectations.

 

[habsfan]

I don't take the competition comment as a negative. I can see Ricky thinking that competing for a job is not the same as competing against Ronnie.

 

[Bl Deep]

Parcells wouldn't be dealing with RW, nor praising him if he couldn't handle the rock... He is working in maybe a 2-3 year window, probably much less. he isn't a long term option...

I think miami recognizes what they have in him, they know they are going to give him enough touches to make him valuable on the FA market, and they can tie him up much cheaper now than after a 1k season with all the media buzz....

FWIW

 

[TheFanatic]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

I loved the argument by the pro-Ricky crowd that he was playing for one last big payday this year, and that's why he so valuable. Yeah, he just got that. So, Ricky has now been forgiven his $8 million debt to the fanchise, gotten a little coin for taking as much of a beating as he can take to begin this year, then ride off into the sunset.

Yeah, I'd say I'm pretty much with you more than against you on this, Shol.

You would be the only one. While I'm not so sure it's all worthy, he is getting some serious props from the coaching staff, FO (Tuna), local and national media. John Clayton said this morning on Mike and Mike that Ricky was the best player on the team.

 

[sholditch]

off topic, but where the hell and how did John Clayton get involved in football as an expert? Dude looked like he would have gotten mauled playing kicker for Yale.

 

[Splicer]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

I loved the argument by the pro-Ricky crowd that he was playing for one last big payday this year, and that's why he so valuable. Yeah, he just got that. So, Ricky has now been forgiven his $8 million debt to the fanchise, gotten a little coin for taking as much of a beating as he can take to begin this year, then ride off into the sunset.

Yeah, I'd say I'm pretty much with you more than against you on this, Shol.

You would be the only one. While I'm not so sure it's all worthy, he is getting some serious props from the coaching staff, FO (Tuna), local and national media. John Clayton said this morning on Mike and Mike that Ricky was the best player on the team.

Keeping the seat warm for Jalen Parmele.....shhhhhh

 

[TheFanatic]

off topic, but where the hell and how did John Clayton get involved in football as an expert? Dude looked like he would have gotten mauled playing kicker for Yale.

true dat, but I trust him more than just about anyone else in the industry. And when guys like Salsbury continually bring up the fact that he played the game as proof he is right and is continually proven wrong by JC it just bolsters my opinion of the guy...

 

[IndyHavoc]

Again, all I can go off of is small snips of camp tape and the preseason games. Ricky in those carries = the definition of mediocrity. Great, everyone loves him in camp. Great, coaches are singing his praises. It's all great and happy in wonderland. I care about what I see on the field. And everyone else is seeing what I don't see. I see a guy that looked a little bit slower/weaker than a guy less than 12 months removed from major knee surgery. If that's who you want to take a flier on in round 4 (YIPES!)....knock yourself out!

I'm not bashing Ricky just to be bashing him. I was never even burned by the guy, but when (EVER!??) has someone taken themselves out of the game, gone on a maryjane and hash bender in India/Paki-wherever-the-flock-he-was, come back to the game at 170 lbs, then built themselves back up into someone that will produce at 32 years old at RB in the NFL.

I think people are GROSSLY overestimating his ability to do so. I think the guy had (read that again, "had") all-world talent. That was 4-5 seasons ago. This is seriously like having Priest Holmes suddenly coming back (again...how'd that work out with Priest getting a 2nd chance and how praised he was by coach, teammates, F.O) and everyone here in the SP just jumping on board and drafting him right away!! Yippeee!!! You guys go ahead and ride that crazy train! I'm getting off while the gettins' good.

 

[j3r3m3y]

I'm not bashing Ricky just to be bashing him. I was never even burned by the guy, but when (EVER!??) has someone taken themselves out of the game, gone on a maryjane and hash bender in India/Paki-wherever-the-flock-he-was, come back to the game at 170 lbs, then built themselves back up into someone that will produce at 32 years old at RB in the NFL.

When has anyone ever tried? This argument is annoying because there is literally zero sample size to compare this situation to. Sure it has never been successfully done before, but that only matters if there were some who attempted.I think Ricky will have a decent (RB3) year, and so will Ronnie. This year they will limit each others fantasy value but from a pure football perspective I don't see any reason to believe Ricky can't be a very good running back. His problem has always been his head not his body and if in fact his head is in the right place he has the tools to be very effective.The fact that you see him as the definition of mediocrity in the face of so many others who are much closer to the situation who say otherwise seems like bias.If Ricky is impressing people like Bill and Clayton, that is good enough for me.

 

[big0mar]

I don't think Ricky is around in three years. I don't think Ronnie is with the Fins in three years either

 

[Football Jones]

This really isn't even about Ronnie Brown. In short, I believe Ricky is currently the most overrated RB in FF (especially in dynasty leagues). Redraft? Who knows, but his ADP is much, much higher than his actual worth, IMO. Not saying RW shouldn't be rostered in either type of league, but I think there's WAY too much optimism regarding his perceived value.

 

[Floyd The Barber]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

And yet he outperformed Ronnie Brown every week and suplanted him atop the Dolphins depth chart.How is this so?

 

[CrazyHorse1581]

This really isn't even about Ronnie Brown. In short, I believe Ricky is currently the most overrated RB in FF (especially in dynasty leagues). Redraft? Who knows, but his ADP is much, much higher than his actual worth, IMO. Not saying RW shouldn't be rostered in either type of league, but I think there's WAY too much optimism regarding his perceived value.

Got him in the 8th round last night... I think he's worth an 8th round gamble.

 

[Floyd The Barber]

I'm not bashing Ricky just to be bashing him. I was never even burned by the guy, but when (EVER!??) has someone taken themselves out of the game, gone on a maryjane and hash bender in India/Paki-wherever-the-flock-he-was, come back to the game at 170 lbs, then built themselves back up into someone that will produce at 32 years old at RB in the NFL.

It's not exactly the same, but John Riggins "individualized" himself out of the game for a while and then ran himself into the Hall of Fame in the second phase of his career as a 30+ year old stud for the Washington Redskins.

 

[thatguy]

off topic, but where the hell and how did John Clayton get involved in football as an expert? Dude looked like he would have gotten mauled playing kicker for Yale.

true dat, but I trust him more than just about anyone else in the industry. And when guys like Salsbury continually bring up the fact that he played the game as proof he is right and is continually proven wrong by JC it just bolsters my opinion of the guy...

I agree with this but man he really is one of the goofiest looking guys alive...

 

[Manster]

i'm using ricky as a flex this week. i hope he scores 3 TD's so i can trade him way high. no pun intended.

imo, we see the best ricky has to offer in the 1st half of the season.

 

[BigRed]

Wms isn't a long term answer, hey out on a limb there. (?) What matters is this year. I have only seen a little too but thought he looked good, most reports from most people have said anywhere from good to great, and given Brown's health status generally and Wms flashing some ability, he has a real chance to do some real damage at LEAST part of the year, and maybe as the main guy most of the year. Well worth his late draft position and wish I'd gotten him.

 

[Gatorman]

Boy, am I going to disagree here. RW, back in the day, was one of the Best RBs out there. He ran hard, hit hard, and could not be arm tackled. He was a headcase, sure, but the truth (looking back) is he figured out that wanny sucked before the rest of us did, and he didn't want to play for him anymore.

Fast forward a few years. Every coach that has had him since has only had good things to say about RW. And now he has become a "parcells guy". While I agree that ronnie is a good/great talent, this league is RBBC (and look no further than BP's last team, and JJ + MBIII < RW +RB). I think this year it is RW1 and RB as the 2 rb until he gets healthy. I think 2009 is RW and Parmelee with Brown being shipped for picks.

AS for his "pedestrian" preseason, you must have been watching a different game. Ricky ran hard and broke a few, or was one shoestring tackle away for a TD. In any case, ricky is a 20 carry player. He wears you down then pops a big one.

I have him in 2 leagues in the 8th round or later, and may take a shot at him in WCOFF as well if things break a certain way.

Gator

PS. As for the classes he is taking etc: He needs to take stuff like algeba and other "basics" before getting o Osteopathy. This is about 3-5 years away and all takes place at Nova Southeastern University, which happens to be where the phins' training camp is located.

 

[Jon_Moore]

A friend and I were discussing this last night. I think Ricky is the backup in 2009. They upped his pay a tad, to keep him an extra year. If they'd waited, and he had a good first few games, he could hit free agency, and get more money than what they want to pay him, having Brown on the roster. Ricky won't ever get a premium, given all the issues surrounding him, but with Brown at less than 100%, he could have played himself into more money. That said, they have just a smidge more invested in Brown, so it seems logical that they use Ricky all they can while he's effective, to still compete, while not overdoing things with Brown.

 

[DrJamesAndrews Fan]

Short memory Cool-Aid drinkers...this is Ricky Williams, hope you got him late, he won't be playing beyond week 4 is my guess.

Just my 2 pennies.

 

[simey]

Short memory Cool-Aid drinkers...this is Ricky Williams, hope you got him late, he won't be playing beyond week 4 is my guess.

Why do you think he won't be playing beyond week 4?

 

[WiDDoW_MaKeR]

I just can't take Ricky serious as a long term "battle opponent" vs. Ronnie. He's a nice short term FF commodity while Brown is on the mend and could put up some points early this season. I'm not sure why anyone should think he'll get significant PT once Brown heals though. There's no benefit to Miami championing a vet over a guy who could/should be their future. Ricky didn't blow away the CFL, and was injured almost immediately when he got NFL carries last season. If Williams can keep himself from flaking out and be a good insurance policy in case of R.Brown injury over the next 2 years, he'll exceed my expectations.

It makes perfect sense to me. Why wouldn't Miami ride on Ricky's shoulders for at least a year, while Ronnie Brown (their future) heals up? How exactly would it serve Miami to rush Ronnie Brown out this year, if they don't need him? Wouldn't it make much more sense to save him?

 

[sholditch]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

And yet he outperformed Ronnie Brown every week and suplanted him atop the Dolphins depth chart.How is this so?

ACL recovery and thumb sprain?

 

[DrJamesAndrews Fan]

Short memory Cool-Aid drinkers...this is Ricky Williams, hope you got him late, he won't be playing beyond week 4 is my guess.

Why do you think he won't be playing beyond week 4?

Let's see1) 31 years old2) lasted a whole 6 carries last year3) Has only played 13 games since 20034) Loves Reefer5) Loves Yoga6) wears wedding dressesI'm just not buying the Hype.

 

[IndyHavoc]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

And yet he outperformed Ronnie Brown every week and suplanted him atop the Dolphins depth chart.How is this so?

ACL recovery and thumb sprain?

Beat me to it, heh. Come on, seriously you think RB should have looked faster, quicker, stronger, and more decisive than Ricky? What, 8 months post ACL surgery. The funny thing is, I was absolutely amazed at how far along he is, and how good he looked already by week 2 preseason. The fact he dinged his thumb was a bonus in my eyes. The fact they gave the guy 12 carries in week 4 to me was a great green light for him on his road back to a work-horse RB.I guess we'll all be able to bump this thread around week 4-6 to see who will be eating crow.

 

[Homer]

Only one thing matters...how he has played thus far.He has looked very good and running with authority, power, speed, vision.Don't read into his jargon. Just pay attention to what he does on the field.The only caveat is can he stay on it? The price most of us were able to land him before the herd got wind of him was so chaep it was worth the risk.

Uhmmm, in practice and in pre-season?I don't think anyone ever questioned Ricky's TALENT under any circumstances? He may be no worse of a back than he was the last time he was a relevant fantasy factor FIVE YEARS AGO!!!One "other" thing that <<just might????>> matter isWHAT THE HE!! HAS CHANGED FROM THE LAST 48 MONTHS THAT WOULD MAKE ANYONE BELIEVE THAT RICKY WILLIAMS IS ANYTHING BUT A PIMPLE ON RB's AHRSE?

 

[Todem]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

And yet he outperformed Ronnie Brown every week and suplanted him atop the Dolphins depth chart.How is this so?

ACL recovery and thumb sprain?

Beat me to it, heh. Come on, seriously you think RB should have looked faster, quicker, stronger, and more decisive than Ricky? What, 8 months post ACL surgery. The funny thing is, I was absolutely amazed at how far along he is, and how good he looked already by week 2 preseason. The fact he dinged his thumb was a bonus in my eyes. The fact they gave the guy 12 carries in week 4 to me was a great green light for him on his road back to a work-horse RB.I guess we'll all be able to bump this thread around week 4-6 to see who will be eating crow.

We all know if Ronnie was not hurt...but the reality is he shredded his knee and has a long road back. Yeah he looked good in preseason game 4 and I think will eventually spilt carries with Ricky. But don't fool yourself about what Ronnie's role will be this season. It will not be a workhorse back. Ricky will be the starter as long as he plays as well as he had this pre-season. There is no doubt in my mind about it. I have serious doubts about Ronnie Brown being on this team next year too. I like Ronnie's game and think he has great upside. But let's also be real about him. He has never been healthy a full season and has given us 5 great games in 3 seasons. Five.

Ricky when right has given us an amazing year (2002) and followed it up with a very solid one (2003). He came back in Saban's first season and he was really coming into his own in the second half of that season and was a big part of our winning ways that year (2005). Last year (2007) he had a freak injury...it happens. Ricky has earned this shot and most of us here in South Florida that are tuned in to this team 7 days a week know Ricky is about to embark on a resurgence this year and give us everything he has. I was talking about Ricky Williams as a huge deep sleeper in May. The herd caught up to him by week 2 of the preseason and the true deep value was going away fast. He was a shark play in Dynasty leagues for months this off-season as a great flex player with upside to a RB2 if Ronnie has any set backs or suffers his annual injury which has been his M.O since he came into the league.

Naysayers can say whatever they want....but the reality is Ricky Williams is the starting RB for the Miami Dolphins...and IMO will remain so all year long as long as he plays to his abilities. Ronnie will play a good role as well. Fantasy wise they are both RB3's this year. If one get's hurt then we know the upside.

 

[chofolo]

Short memory Cool-Aid drinkers...this is Ricky Williams, hope you got him late, he won't be playing beyond week 4 is my guess.

Why do you think he won't be playing beyond week 4?

Let's see1) 31 years old2) lasted a whole 6 carries last year3) Has only played 13 games since 20034) Loves Reefer5) Loves Yoga6) wears wedding dressesI'm just not buying the Hype.

HORN HATER!

 

[Scooby1974]

None of those 6 things you mention really matter. Besides the fact that other than age, you are throwing out arbitrary ideas.

All accounts, Ricky seems to be a new man. Hasn't been beat up the last 5 years, seems to be straightened up, is saying and doing all the right things. His GM, an unpleasable man, just signed him on for another year w/o him playing a real down yet this year.

What if Barry Sanders decided to come back at age 32after a few years of little to no beating? I prayed that Barry would come back. Would we be saying the same things? Ricky was a similarly dominant force when he mailed it in. He let himself go, and seems to have "found himself". To hear him speak of a future after football is admirable and doesn't speak to a desire to ease on into retirement. It sounds to me that Ricky has his heart back, his motivation is there.

Run over your doubters, Ricky, and then go be the best darn doctor you can be.

 

[GoBirds]

None of those 6 things you mention really matter. Besides the fact that other than age, you are throwing out arbitrary ideas. All accounts, Ricky seems to be a new man. Hasn't been beat up the last 5 years, seems to be straightened up, is saying and doing all the right things. His GM, an unpleasable man, just signed him on for another year w/o him playing a real down yet this year.What if Barry Sanders decided to come back at age 32after a few years of little to no beating? I prayed that Barry would come back. Would we be saying the same things? Ricky was a similarly dominant force when he mailed it in. He let himself go, and seems to have "found himself". To hear him speak of a future after football is admirable and doesn't speak to a desire to ease on into retirement. It sounds to me that Ricky has his heart back, his motivation is there.Run over your doubters, Ricky, and then go be the best darn doctor you can be.

Ricky is a "new man".A Barry Sanders comparison.This will be truly funny to revisit by week 8, hilarious.

 

[T Bell]

Ricky is Parcells' new OJ Anderson, and he's going to run him into the ground over the next two seasons.

Ronnie's going to be in a new uniform next year; in the meantime Parcells will use him as much as he can to show he's still got trade value, but not so much as to jeopardize Brown's recovery.

 

[stbugs]

I'm not bashing Ricky just to be bashing him. I was never even burned by the guy, but when (EVER!??) has someone taken themselves out of the game, gone on a maryjane and hash bender in India/Paki-wherever-the-flock-he-was, come back to the game at 170 lbs, then built themselves back up into someone that will produce at 32 years old at RB in the NFL.

It's not exactly the same, but John Riggins "individualized" himself out of the game for a while and then ran himself into the Hall of Fame in the second phase of his career as a 30+ year old stud for the Washington Redskins.

Bad analogy. I think someone above was better on the Priest Holmes one. Yes, RW seems to be in much better shape than Holmes was, but Holmes was getting praised quite a bit and ended up doing nothing. I don't think RW does nothing like Priest, but I worry a lot about all of the praise.Riggins is a bad analogy because I believe it was a contract squabble and he missed 1 year, i.e. about the same as someone like Edge who misses a year due to injury (like Brown). RW had 6 carries total in 3 of the last 4 years. Again, I think Riggins situation is a lot more similar to Brown's than Williams'. I honestly don't think there is another case like Williams where a person missed so much time and came back.That is my whole problem with Williams. It was 3 years ago when he last had significant NFL playing time and in 2005, he had only been out of the game 1 year and while it was for flaking out, it also probably stemmed from the fact that he had failed his drug tests (remember he was forced to sit out the first four games of 2005 once he unretired).He may look fine in pre-season, but I think it is making a huge assumption that he will be able to jump back to 250+ carries. In Ricky's career, he has finished in the top 10 when he had 310+ carries and 18th, 27th and 27th with 253 or less carries. He has only 1 year of more than 9 TDs and 2 years of better than 4.0 ypc, one in his career year of 2002 and the other in 2005 when he had almost half his yardage and half his TDs in Weeks 15-17.

 

[amnesiac]

ok, i'm not good at math, but here it goes:

typical recovery from ACL surgery is about 12 months, right? if Ronnie's at about 8 months, doesn't that leave about 4 months to go before he's fully back?

doesn't this point to them holding him back this year as much as possible?

i really wouldn't hope for much from Williams next year, but he looks like a good play for 1 year.

 

[stanmarino13]

Does the fact that both Ricky and Ronnie have trouble with injuries and holding onto the ball come into play??? Neither sounds like a parcells back to me in the least.

 

[Scooby1974]

I for one am not swinging the pendulum so far as to expect a top 15 finish out of RW. My issue is that some people in here are still stuck w/ a picture of RW smoking week and eatting shrooms. To expect RW to run for 800-900 yards and 6 TD's just doesn't seem that far out of the realm of possibility.

The reference to Barry was simply to make a point that perhaps a guy (stud) w/no drug issues)that left near the top of his game could have another pretty solid year or two left to give even if it had been a while since he played full time. It wasn't to suggest that RW was as good as Barry, only a reference to their individual dominance at the) position.

800-900 yards and 6-8 TD's from a 10th round pick isn't a bad flyer to take.

 

[amnesiac]

right, he seems like an upside RB3 to me.

 

[GoBirds]

ok, i'm not good at math, but here it goes:typical recovery from ACL surgery is about 12 months, right? if Ronnie's at about 8 months, doesn't that leave about 4 months to go before he's fully back?doesn't this point to them holding him back this year as much as possible?i really wouldn't hope for much from Williams next year, but he looks like a good play for 1 year.

If they were holding him back as much as possible why would they give him 12 carries in week four of the preseason and not sit him out completely? Isn't he also a good month or two passed 8 months?

 

[IndyHavoc]

OK, I can totally deal with RB3 (later) with some thoughts for upside. I wouldn't do it, but I can see the case for it...I just get the impression that the vast majority are ignoring the seriously high risk he presents. Low percentage bet, imo. Might pan out, but I'll go ahead and play my open-ended straight nut flush to the river (aka RB) =P. Just for reference sake, I literally own RB in zero leagues (out of 4 I care about). Think I might have got him in 1 of the FAF (fire and forget leagues) here at FBG, don't even remember.

 

[Road Warriors]

Personally I thought Ricky looked very pedestrian throughout the preseason and have been completely mistified by so many folks putting a good deal of faith in him. I'll be suprised if Ricky is getting more touches than Ronnie by week 3, very suprised.

And yet he outperformed Ronnie Brown every week and suplanted him atop the Dolphins depth chart.How is this so?

There have been more than a few preseason wonders around the NFL through the years. Not all of them pan out.Preseason football is a joke, and it is nearly impossible to discern anything reasonable from the play you see there. Ricky may be back to 100% of what he was. If thats true, than he's a bargain. However, if he's not ( and I believe he's not ) then he's worthy of a roster spot somewhere near his ADP, but temper expectations. I don't have a good feel for the MIA running game, and would have a hard time depending on either Ricky or Ronnie. If I had to choose just 1, I'd probably roster Ronnie. I think he's the more likely candidate to receive a significant number of carries.

 

[az_prof]

I'm not bashing Ricky just to be bashing him. I was never even burned by the guy, but when (EVER!??) has someone taken themselves out of the game, gone on a maryjane and hash bender in India/Paki-wherever-the-flock-he-was, come back to the game at 170 lbs, then built themselves back up into someone that will produce at 32 years old at RB in the NFL.

It's not exactly the same, but John Riggins "individualized" himself out of the game for a while and then ran himself into the Hall of Fame in the second phase of his career as a 30+ year old stud for the Washington Redskins.

I watched John Riggins play and I heard John Riggins speak: Mr. Ricky Williams is no John Riggins. Not even close.

 

[2nice]

Again, all I can go off of is small snips of camp tape and the preseason games. Ricky in those carries = the definition of mediocrity. Great, everyone loves him in camp. Great, coaches are singing his praises. It's all great and happy in wonderland. I care about what I see on the field. And everyone else is seeing what I don't see. I see a guy that looked a little bit slower/weaker than a guy less than 12 months removed from major knee surgery. If that's who you want to take a flier on in round 4 (YIPES!)....knock yourself out!I'm not bashing Ricky just to be bashing him. I was never even burned by the guy, but when (EVER!??) has someone taken themselves out of the game, gone on a maryjane and hash bender in India/Paki-wherever-the-flock-he-was, come back to the game at 170 lbs, then built themselves back up into someone that will produce at 32 years old at RB in the NFL.I think people are GROSSLY overestimating his ability to do so. I think the guy had (read that again, "had") all-world talent. That was 4-5 seasons ago. This is seriously like having Priest Holmes suddenly coming back (again...how'd that work out with Priest getting a 2nd chance and how praised he was by coach, teammates, F.O) and everyone here in the SP just jumping on board and drafting him right away!! Yippeee!!! You guys go ahead and ride that crazy train! I'm getting off while the gettins' good.

There is a reason why Bill Parcells and the Miami Dolhpins org have respect for this guy enough to pay him for this and next season. I dont consider a guy that goes away to get away from what people like to deem is "life" here in the US and away from the spotlight -a crazy whacked out guy. The guy wanted to come to his senses to remember what is really important in life. I just got done traveling for 6 months myself. There is a reason why the majority of people dont like Americans- Ignorance. People see americans as thinking of themselves as being the only ones that exist in this world. Smokin weed? He should have never been suspended in the first place. If a guy wants to smoke some weed- let him. Weed or no weed, Ricky is highly intellectual and I believe this whole hoo rah of him leaving just goes to show how smart of a guy he really is. Ricky is going to be the best he can be, and I believe he can be better than alot of RB's in the league not only due to his physical ability, but due to the fact that he is mentally content with himself with out letting the pressures of other people and the game getting in his way of performing to his fullest ability. This is different from Priest Holmes. Unlike Priest, Ricky is not coming back from a serious injury, had a full camps worth of work, had a year off, and is simply ready to play some football. As mentioned, it all boils down to what he looks like on the field.....and to not look into th side jargon. If Parcells has trust in Ricky and his desire and his motives to play, it should not be questioned by us. Also take note that Parcells is the guy that let jason taylor know that he disapproved of him being a dancer on dancing wih the stars....and eventually ended up trading him. Ricky looked great in preseason, and we will see how he does reg season. Just dont worry about all of that other stuff off the field. It can be viewed as a strength. Ricky is just fine from a mental standpoint.

 

[gregjcross]

Again, all I can go off of is small snips of camp tape and the preseason games. Ricky in those carries = the definition of mediocrity. Great, everyone loves him in camp. Great, coaches are singing his praises. It's all great and happy in wonderland. I care about what I see on the field. And everyone else is seeing what I don't see. I see a guy that looked a little bit slower/weaker than a guy less than 12 months removed from major knee surgery. If that's who you want to take a flier on in round 4 (YIPES!)....knock yourself out!I'm not bashing Ricky just to be bashing him. I was never even burned by the guy, but when (EVER!??) has someone taken themselves out of the game, gone on a maryjane and hash bender in India/Paki-wherever-the-flock-he-was, come back to the game at 170 lbs, then built themselves back up into someone that will produce at 32 years old at RB in the NFL.I think people are GROSSLY overestimating his ability to do so. I think the guy had (read that again, "had") all-world talent. That was 4-5 seasons ago. This is seriously like having Priest Holmes suddenly coming back (again...how'd that work out with Priest getting a 2nd chance and how praised he was by coach, teammates, F.O) and everyone here in the SP just jumping on board and drafting him right away!! Yippeee!!! You guys go ahead and ride that crazy train! I'm getting off while the gettins' good.

There is a reason why Bill Parcells and the Miami Dolhpins org have respect for this guy enough to pay him for this and next season. I dont consider a guy that goes away to get away from what people like to deem is "life" here in the US and away from the spotlight -a crazy whacked out guy. The guy wanted to come to his senses to remember what is really important in life. I just got done traveling for 6 months myself. There is a reason why the majority of people dont like Americans- Ignorance. People see americans as thinking of themselves as being the only ones that exist in this world. Smokin weed? He should have never been suspended in the first place. If a guy wants to smoke some weed- let him. Weed or no weed, Ricky is highly intellectual and I believe this whole hoo rah of him leaving just goes to show how smart of a guy he really is. Ricky is going to be the best he can be, and I believe he can be better than alot of RB's in the league not only due to his physical ability, but due to the fact that he is mentally content with himself with out letting the pressures of other people and the game getting in his way of performing to his fullest ability. This is different from Priest Holmes. Unlike Priest, Ricky is not coming back from a serious injury, had a full camps worth of work, had a year off, and is simply ready to play some football. As mentioned, it all boils down to what he looks like on the field.....and to not look into th side jargon. If Parcells has trust in Ricky and his desire and his motives to play, it should not be questioned by us. Also take note that Parcells is the guy that let jason taylor know that he disapproved of him being a dancer on dancing wih the stars....and eventually ended up trading him. Ricky looked great in preseason, and we will see how he does reg season. Just dont worry about all of that other stuff off the field. It can be viewed as a strength. Ricky is just fine from a mental standpoint.

Question everything.