The Jets are overrated here in Shark Pool (1 Viewer)

[rabidfireweasel]

I do think it is great that Pennington has bounced back from injury. I also think that Mangini is likely to be a great coach. However, I am baffled when people want to have things both ways. They want to give the Jets partial credit for almost beating the Patriots and Indy at home. I think that if you want to do that then you have to acknowledge that they barely beat Kerry Collins lead Tennessee Titans and Buffalo (although I must admit, those were road games).

There defense will keep games close, but unless they develop a running game, they will lose more than they win. They are 2 and 2 and have had a number of bounces go their way.

 

[3C's]

Considering many people thought they'd be about as good as the Titans, Texans and/or Raiders, I think they've done well.

 

[pantagrapher]

Considering many people thought they'd be about as good as the Titans, Texans and/or Raiders, I think they've done well.

I agree. They've been much better than anyone expected them to be. Are people not supposed to talk about them?

 

[Sack-Religious]

Considering many people thought they'd be about as good as the Titans, Texans and/or Raiders, I think they've done well.

Without much of a running game, they're doing very, very well.

 

[rabidfireweasel]

People shouldn't have thought that they would be that bad. They have a good D. They were going to dramatically improve special teams. They were 10-6 in 2004. Everything went wrong in 2005 and they still won 4 games. They have a better coach and a good new left tackle. I think reasonable expectations were 5-11 if Pennington could not play at an NFL level and 7-9 if he could.

 

[Reaper]

IT'S A REBUILDING YEAR.

Still.

They Beat Buffalo and Tenn.

That's it.

Having a good QB makes a diference and the Jets weren't supposed to have one but Chad came back from the dead. What does that mean? - It means they are no long in contention for the #1 pick like all the posts around here preseason were saying. They are no longer in that bottom tier, they are just above it.

BUT, the schedule isn't overly difficult so, they can possibly win 8 games or so, IF healthy.

You know what the Jets are - the Jets are Miami from last year - A new coach that gives the team a bounce from a Real bad coach, and a favorable schedule - NEXT YEAR, the Jets might be "OVERRATED" and the 06' version of the Dolphins.

But, I can't see ho much "Overrated" they can be at this poitn - Sheesh, they're still a decent surprise to be playing as well as they are in a rebuilding year.

 

[SeniorVBDStudent]

What people said:

Miami >> New England >>>> Buffalo > NY Jets.

What's happening:

New England > NY Jets > Buffalo >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Miami.

 

[Reaper]

People shouldn't have thought that they would be that bad. They have a good D. They were going to dramatically improve special teams. They were 10-6 in 2004. Everything went wrong in 2005 and they still won 4 games. They have a better coach and a good new left tackle. I think reasonable expectations were 5-11 if Pennington could not play at an NFL level and 7-9 if he could.

Maybe people shouldn't have thought they would be THAT bad but, It was hard to debate it and as, what I consider myself to be, an honest and as unbiased as I could be as a fan, I wasn't one who would waste time debating it much this year... In year 1 of a rebuild you never know - Even Bellichik wasn't that good.They also changed systems on both sides of the ball to go with the complete coaching changes - And lost maybe the best 2 players on each side of the ball in Abraham and Mawae along with Ty Law. Then they Lost their next Best OL, who came back this week and had 2 rookies on the OL along with a ton of inexperience - People thought they had NO RB's and only a hobbled Coles at WR to go with no QB. So?There was also a MAJOR question mark on how Mangini would coach and have this team prepared for the season as well as weekly - And to me, I have those answers and see a much better prepared team and a team with some ballz.The local media was getting all over the coaching staff and calling the preseason a disaster (mostly cuz they were pissed Mangini wouldn't talk to them like Herm did). The media was circling waiting for this team to start off poorly BUT, now they are all giddy, of course.

 

[Wheelhouse]

The Jets nearly beat the Colts yesterday. Any team that beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is a very good team. Any team that nearly beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is still a good team.

 

[Fla\/\/ed]

The Jets nearly beat the Colts yesterday. Any team that beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is a very good team. Any team that nearly beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is still a good team.

 

[rabidfireweasel]

The Jets nearly beat the Colts yesterday. Any team that beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is a very good team. Any team that nearly beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is still a good team.

This line of thinking is painful. I could just as easily say this. The Jets nearly lost to the Kerry Collins lead Titans. Any team that nearly loses to the Titans is a very bad team.

 

[Wheelhouse]

The Jets nearly beat the Colts yesterday. Any team that beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is a very good team. Any team that nearly beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is still a good team.

This line of thinking is painful. I could just as easily say this. The Jets nearly lost to the Kerry Collins lead Titans. Any team that nearly loses to the Titans is a very bad team.

Maybe so, but you're only as good as your last game.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Maybe so, but you're only as good as your last game.

The Bengals and Seahawks must suck then.

 

[Kiddnets]

Overrated? Most of what I read is just appreciation that they aren't the worst team in the league as was predicted all off season.

They are not going to the Super Bowl this year - but they are showing signs of a talented, well coached team that will be competitive this year and gearing up to be a force the next few years.

That's saying a lot coming off a 4 win season and the Germ Edwards catastrophe.

 

[Wheelhouse]

Maybe so, but you're only as good as your last game.

The Bengals and Seahawks must suck then.

I don't know what happened to Cincinnati - other than BB figured them out. Seattle, on the other hand is a MUCH different team on the road. You know who should win the MVP? The Seattle 12th man. But yes, now we have to lower CIN and SEA down the ranks because of their abyssmal performances in their "last game". It's true, you are only as good as your last game.

 

[Shrek]

Considering many people thought they'd be about as good as the Titans, Texans and/or Raiders, I think they've done well.

This is the whole point. No one is saying they are a playoff caliber team yet. But I don't know anyone who thought they would show up for games the way they have so far. They seem to have taken on a new persona as a team. They aren't folding when they get down by 7 points now. They are actually showing heart, creativity, and surprising toughness. That's pretty good news for a team with a new coaching staff. I don't know how many times I read posts on this board prior to week 1 that said things like, "Well, the Jets are going to be playing for either the #1 or #2 pick next year". So far they are looking like a legitimate 6-8 win team.

 

[rabidfireweasel]

Considering many people thought they'd be about as good as the Titans, Texans and/or Raiders, I think they've done well.

This is the whole point. No one is saying they are a playoff caliber team yet. But I don't know anyone who thought they would show up for games the way they have so far. They seem to have taken on a new persona as a team. They aren't folding when they get down by 7 points now. They are actually showing heart, creativity, and surprising toughness. That's pretty good news for a team with a new coaching staff. I don't know how many times I read posts on this board prior to week 1 that said things like, "Well, the Jets are going to be playing for either the #1 or #2 pick next year". So far they are looking like a legitimate 6-8 win team.

Actually everyone's favorite Jet's fan/ staff member, Chase Stewart sees them going 9-7. HE mentioned this in the Jets- Indy thread after the loss. Then there are the numerous posts about how since they played Indy close at home, they are a good team.If I was a Jets fan, I would be happy to have a new coach and a new direction. I would be thrilled to see Pennington playing well and the improvement in the wr corps. I would be thrilled about that they have a renewed interest in special teams. I would feel as you feel. I just wouldn't call them good.

 

[SlaX]

I see them trying to get into the Playoffs Nightclub, but I doubt the bouncer lets them in this year.

 

[brednbuddah]

If I was a Jets fan, I would be happy to have a new coach and a new direction. I would be thrilled to see Pennington playing well and the improvement in the wr corps. I would be thrilled about that they have a renewed interest in special teams. I would feel as you feel. I just wouldn't call them good.

I am thrilled for all you said and more (trust me you don't want me to list).Are they a good team? not yet, but well ahead of schedule.

 

[sheerterror]

The Jets nearly beat the Colts yesterday. Any team that beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is a very good team. Any team that nearly beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is still a good team.

This line of thinking is painful. I could just as easily say this. The Jets nearly lost to the Kerry Collins lead Titans. Any team that nearly loses to the Titans is a very bad team.

I'm going to assume you didn't watch this game. I know I'm gonna hear the "typical Jets fan making excuses" and coulda, shoulda, woulda; but the fact is the Jets dominated this game, and were pitching a shutout through 3 quarters when the defense collapsed a bit, allowing the Titans to score 2 TDs and get 2 2-point conversions. Without some major errors in the kicking game, which have since been apparently corrected, Nugents hits the PAT that he shouldn't have missed, the Jets are up 17-14 instead of it being tied 16-16 and coming down to the wire. And despite this, the Jets still ended up winning by 7, on the road, as a 3 point dog, in this coaching staff's first NFL game. How are you going to currently criticize this team as "just barely being able to beat Tenn." when all things are considered? I'm willing to bet if these two teams played again, it wouldn't be nearly as close.Is Indianapolis severely overrated now because they "just barely beat the Jets"?

Edit to add: I wasn't bolding that part of your quote to suggest that you were saying the Jets are a very bad team, but just responding to the thought that they Jets just barely beat the Titans.

 

[Bri]

I do think it is great that Pennington has bounced back from injury. I also think that Mangini is likely to be a great coach. However, I am baffled when people want to have things both ways. They want to give the Jets partial credit for almost beating the Patriots and Indy at home. I think that if you want to do that then you have to acknowledge that they barely beat Kerry Collins lead Tennessee Titans and Buffalo (although I must admit, those were road games).There defense will keep games close, but unless they develop a running game, they will lose more than they win. They are 2 and 2 and have had a number of bounces go their way.

I'm thoroughly impressed with how the Saints and Jets have taken to their new coaches system. Parcells had no business making the playoffs his first year in Dallas and no one would have predicted that so I'm not so sure I want to say these teams won't but it's very impressive.The Jets didn't run with any purpose until last week. I don't think they'll win much without being able to run. I(and everyone else) said once those rookie linemen get comfy they'll improve. Yesterday I was loving some blocks by Mangold, either a huge hole or he got himself out wide to lead and......oh so special for a young lineman. Apparently, he can be a key to their running success.

 

[Bri]

Is Indianapolis severely overrated now because they "just barely beat the Jets"?

Freeney looked very good in a few GL stands but just here and there the rest of the game. Several of us noticed Manning looking angry/posessed/focussed...something after the Jets scored and he took them to a score. I think Dungy would have done things differently in hindsight and the NFL will still be worried about Manning's O putting up too many points to match. Dungy will always be a man that can create a defensive scheme that wins any game. I don't think they're overrated.One thing about Jets vs Colts, people have to realize division games are different. You can say they know each other and rivalry and make up reasons but it's always been an odd occurence. I remember the terrible Packers sticking with the Supe Bears, the horrible Cowboys sticking with the Supe Giants and many many other games. Division games are always different. They were in the same division for a llllong time before the realignment.

 

[Da Guru]

I don`t understand going for it on fourth and 2 from the 2 and the game tied. That was plain stupidity.

 

[Bri]

I don`t understand going for it on fourth and 2 from the 2 and the game tied. That was plain stupidity.

field positionI'd have put Brad Smith in as they did earlier

 

[PahtyTom]

I don`t understand going for it on fourth and 2 from the 2 and the game tied. That was plain stupidity.

field positionI'd have put Brad Smith in as they did earlier

I would have had at least 1 WR in the game. They are the Jet's playmakers.

 

[sheerterror]

Is Indianapolis severely overrated now because they "just barely beat the Jets"?

Freeney looked very good in a few GL stands but just here and there the rest of the game. Several of us noticed Manning looking angry/posessed/focussed...something after the Jets scored and he took them to a score. I think Dungy would have done things differently in hindsight and the NFL will still be worried about Manning's O putting up too many points to match. Dungy will always be a man that can create a defensive scheme that wins any game. I don't think they're overrated.

I was being facetious with that remark - just using it as the same analogy that the Jets were overrated for having "barely beaten Tennessee" as the OP suggested. I don't think Indy is overrated because I don't think people regard them as the best team in the league anymore. They've got a spot in most people's top 5 which is right where they belong, IMO.

 

[Bri]

Is Indianapolis severely overrated now because they "just barely beat the Jets"?

Freeney looked very good in a few GL stands but just here and there the rest of the game. Several of us noticed Manning looking angry/posessed/focussed...something after the Jets scored and he took them to a score. I think Dungy would have done things differently in hindsight and the NFL will still be worried about Manning's O putting up too many points to match. Dungy will always be a man that can create a defensive scheme that wins any game. I don't think they're overrated.

I was being facetious with that remark - just using it as the same analogy that the Jets were overrated for having "barely beaten Tennessee" as the OP suggested. I don't think Indy is overrated because I don't think people regard them as the best team in the league anymore. They've got a spot in most people's top 5 which is right where they belong, IMO.

OK gotcha

 

[rabidfireweasel]

The Jets nearly beat the Colts yesterday. Any team that beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is a very good team. Any team that nearly beats Peyton Manning and the Colts is still a good team.

This line of thinking is painful. I could just as easily say this. The Jets nearly lost to the Kerry Collins lead Titans. Any team that nearly loses to the Titans is a very bad team.

I'm going to assume you didn't watch this game. I know I'm gonna hear the "typical Jets fan making excuses" and coulda, shoulda, woulda; but the fact is the Jets dominated this game, and were pitching a shutout through 3 quarters when the defense collapsed a bit, allowing the Titans to score 2 TDs and get 2 2-point conversions. Without some major errors in the kicking game, which have since been apparently corrected, Nugents hits the PAT that he shouldn't have missed, the Jets are up 17-14 instead of it being tied 16-16 and coming down to the wire. And despite this, the Jets still ended up winning by 7, on the road, as a 3 point dog, in this coaching staff's first NFL game. How are you going to currently criticize this team as "just barely being able to beat Tenn." when all things are considered? I'm willing to bet if these two teams played again, it wouldn't be nearly as close.Is Indianapolis severely overrated now because they "just barely beat the Jets"?

Edit to add: I wasn't bolding that part of your quote to suggest that you were saying the Jets are a very bad team, but just responding to the thought that they Jets just barely beat the Titans.

You are not responding to the thought. The thought is - you don't get to have it both ways. If you give partial credit to the Jets for almost winning ("see how good the Jets are, they hung with Indy") then you have to discredit them for almost losing. You don't have to partial credit to the Colts, because they don't hang their hats on playing close to good teams. They say- "we are 4-0" They simply measure their record in wins and losses.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

they gave up almost 500 yards of offense to the Bills, including career days from Losman, Parrish, and McGahee. They were pretty fortunate to win that game, IMO.

they are definitely better than I expected them to be though. Pennington and those WRs are carrying the offense, but their running game and run defense are pretty poor.

 

[Shrek]

Bump

 

[LBH]

they gave up almost 500 yards of offense to the Bills, including career days from Losman, Parrish, and McGahee. They were pretty fortunate to win that game, IMO.they are definitely better than I expected them to be though. Pennington and those WRs are carrying the offense, but their running game and run defense are pretty poor.

Not much has changed except their run game is a little better. This team is a product of great coaching

 

[rabidfireweasel]

I was very wrong. Chase Stuart was right. In my defense, I did say in my original post if they don't develop a running game, they will have a long season. They did start running with more success utilizing Houston and Wahington. I think they can go into NE and win again. Like the 2001 Patriots, they rarely look good winning. They simply play smarter than their opponents, seize opportunities, and rarely turn it over. That is a proven formula for success.