This just happened in an online draft (1 Viewer)

[renesauz]

Sonce this has happened in this league, sone teams have decided to wait the full 6 hours to make their picks. I dont condone that, but thats the kind of stuff that happens when others are allowed to break the rules you play with some immature rules lawyers who are trying to make a point....or guys who actually have responsibilities outside of fantasy football

FYP

Like i said, i am not in this league, one of my friends is though. He is not one of the guys who is doing that, nor would i do something like that. I do agree the guys doing that are whiny tools, but those things are to be expected when an owner is rewarded for breaking the rules. Like i said before, not only did he not get Tate, but he was able to pick any player he wanted, he should have at least been given the next guy on the ADP list.

This part I agree with. He shouldn't have been able to pick his replacement. While I vehemently disagree that he should be stuck with Tate, the spirit of the rule is best followed by giving him the next available player via ADP (who isn't on IR), and nobody else should have a pick backed out.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

Sonce this has happened in this league, sone teams have decided to wait the full 6 hours to make their picks. I dont condone that, but thats the kind of stuff that happens when others are allowed to break the rules you play with some immature rules lawyers who are trying to make a point....or guys who actually have responsibilities outside of fantasy football

FYP

Like i said, i am not in this league, one of my friends is though. He is not one of the guys who is doing that, nor would i do something like that. I do agree the guys doing that are whiny tools, but those things are to be expected when an owner is rewarded for breaking the rules. Like i said before, not only did he not get Tate, but he was able to pick any player he wanted, he should have at least been given the next guy on the ADP list.

This part I agree with. He shouldn't have been able to pick his replacement.

I agree with this as well....IF allowed to change his pick, this is what should have been done.....getting pick of the litter not so cool......nobody could really argue with him getting the next guy ADP at the time........

 

[GregR_2]

He complaind to the commish that he didnt know the clock was shut off for only 6 hours during the night

For me, that quote sums it up. You are responsible for knowing the rules. If you tell the commish, sorry I made a mistake and forgot to/didn't set my ADP list properly, I'd be inclined to help out. But giving a BS excuse about not knowing/understanding the rules is the number one reason for me to not help.

And I think for most of us on the other side of the issue, none of that has anything to do with the heart of the issue. It isn't about having Tate replaced because he didn't know the rules. It's about having Tate replaced because the rules to use the ADP list were created with the belief the ADP list from the site would be current enough it wouldn't include players who are no longer playing in the 2010 season.I don't think any discussion with him as to why he missed his pick was necessary to do the right thing and give him a replacement player. It doesn't matter. What matters is that the list the rules had chosen was faulty to the point it didn't meet the spirit of the rules.I'd personally have given him the next pick from the ADP list that wasn't ineligible to play because he's on Injured Reserve. Though now that I mention it, giving him a player of his choice, but after a number of other teams have gotten to jump ahead of him, is probably a suitable penalty as well. On par and quite possibly worse than the spirit of the original rule was trying to give.

 

[CalBear]

it is my understanding that after the Tate pick went through about 5-6 guys drafted after that (no big deal to them)....then the Tate owner was allowed to pick a guy from what was still out there (with another owner actually "on the clock")....meaning in a 12 team draft he got to replace Tate with another player before about another 4-6 guys picked....one of those 4-6 guys may have wanted the guy that the Tate owner got.........= harm

Look, the guy has the 12.01 pick. To the guy who's sitting at 12.07, it makes no difference whether the 12.01 guy makes his pick immediately, or else right after the 12.05 pick; 12.07 has six people ahead of him in the round, and six players were taken before his pick.

 

[Go deep]

He complaind to the commish that he didnt know the clock was shut off for only 6 hours during the night

For me, that quote sums it up. You are responsible for knowing the rules. If you tell the commish, sorry I made a mistake and forgot to/didn't set my ADP list properly, I'd be inclined to help out.

But giving a BS excuse about not knowing/understanding the rules is the number one reason for me to not help.

And I think for most of us on the other side of the issue, none of that has anything to do with the heart of the issue.

It isn't about having Tate replaced because he didn't know the rules. It's about having Tate replaced because the rules to use the ADP list were created with the belief the ADP list from the site would be current enough it wouldn't include players who are no longer playing in the 2010 season.

I don't think any discussion with him as to why he missed his pick was necessary to do the right thing and give him a replacement player. It doesn't matter. What matters is that the list the rules had chosen was faulty to the point it didn't meet the spirit of the rules.

I'd personally have given him the next pick from the ADP list that wasn't ineligible to play because he's on Injured Reserve. Though now that I mention it, giving him a player of his choice, but after a number of other teams have gotten to jump ahead of him, is probably a suitable penalty as well. On par and quite possibly worse than the spirit of the original rule was trying to give.

Tate wasnt technically on injured reserve when this happened.

The biggest problem i have with this is where do you draw the line, what if someone gets stuck with Fred Jackson in a simialar situation?

By the commish doing this, he basically changed the rules for the draft. Anyone timing out now should have a right to choose whatever player they want, totally changing the rule of using the ADP list.

 

[renesauz]

He complaind to the commish that he didnt know the clock was shut off for only 6 hours during the night

For me, that quote sums it up. You are responsible for knowing the rules. If you tell the commish, sorry I made a mistake and forgot to/didn't set my ADP list properly, I'd be inclined to help out.

But giving a BS excuse about not knowing/understanding the rules is the number one reason for me to not help.

And I think for most of us on the other side of the issue, none of that has anything to do with the heart of the issue.

It isn't about having Tate replaced because he didn't know the rules. It's about having Tate replaced because the rules to use the ADP list were created with the belief the ADP list from the site would be current enough it wouldn't include players who are no longer playing in the 2010 season.

I don't think any discussion with him as to why he missed his pick was necessary to do the right thing and give him a replacement player. It doesn't matter. What matters is that the list the rules had chosen was faulty to the point it didn't meet the spirit of the rules.

I'd personally have given him the next pick from the ADP list that wasn't ineligible to play because he's on Injured Reserve. Though now that I mention it, giving him a player of his choice, but after a number of other teams have gotten to jump ahead of him, is probably a suitable penalty as well. On par and quite possibly worse than the spirit of the original rule was trying to give.

Tate wasnt technically on injured reserve when this happened.

The biggest problem i have with this is where do you draw the line, what if someone gets stuck with Fred Jackson in a simialar situation?

By the commish doing this, he basically changed the rules for the draft. Anyone timing out now should have a right to choose whatever player they want, totally changing the rule of using the ADP list.

Not sure about you, but in most of my drafts when a guy drafts someone who just got hurt so bad it's obvious he'll be IR'd...I tend to tell them about it and insist the guy get a chance to reconsider. I suppose I might feel different in a high HIGH stakes league, but in most friendly and semi-frinedly leagues I'd prefer to give the guy a redo.The rules were fine, the ADP list was flawed. The commish probably went too far here, but sticking him with Tate wasn't the right answer either, especially in a "friendly" league.

 

[Go deep]

He complaind to the commish that he didnt know the clock was shut off for only 6 hours during the night

For me, that quote sums it up. You are responsible for knowing the rules. If you tell the commish, sorry I made a mistake and forgot to/didn't set my ADP list properly, I'd be inclined to help out.

But giving a BS excuse about not knowing/understanding the rules is the number one reason for me to not help.

And I think for most of us on the other side of the issue, none of that has anything to do with the heart of the issue.

It isn't about having Tate replaced because he didn't know the rules. It's about having Tate replaced because the rules to use the ADP list were created with the belief the ADP list from the site would be current enough it wouldn't include players who are no longer playing in the 2010 season.

I don't think any discussion with him as to why he missed his pick was necessary to do the right thing and give him a replacement player. It doesn't matter. What matters is that the list the rules had chosen was faulty to the point it didn't meet the spirit of the rules.

I'd personally have given him the next pick from the ADP list that wasn't ineligible to play because he's on Injured Reserve. Though now that I mention it, giving him a player of his choice, but after a number of other teams have gotten to jump ahead of him, is probably a suitable penalty as well. On par and quite possibly worse than the spirit of the original rule was trying to give.

Tate wasnt technically on injured reserve when this happened.

The biggest problem i have with this is where do you draw the line, what if someone gets stuck with Fred Jackson in a simialar situation?

By the commish doing this, he basically changed the rules for the draft. Anyone timing out now should have a right to choose whatever player they want, totally changing the rule of using the ADP list.

Not sure about you, but in most of my drafts when a guy drafts someone who just got hurt so bad it's obvious he'll be IR'd...I tend to tell them about it and insist the guy get a chance to reconsider. I suppose I might feel different in a high HIGH stakes league, but in most friendly and semi-frinedly leagues I'd prefer to give the guy a redo.The rules were fine, the ADP list was flawed. The commish probably went too far here, but sticking him with Tate wasn't the right answer either, especially in a "friendly" league.

I wouldnt call it a friendly league, it is a bunch of strangers. Sure, its only a $100 buy in, but it is still money. If this happened in one of my local redrafts, i would likely be the first guy to tell him to take a different player because Tate was out for the year. Thats a different situation, because it doesnt involve a rule change half way through the draft.Listen, i understand the other sides point of view, and im fine with it. I just dont want to be in a league where that sort of thing happens, that just my preference. The worse thing that comes out of this for me is i have to find a different online league host than this one for future drafts, not a big deal.

 

[GregR_2]

He complaind to the commish that he didnt know the clock was shut off for only 6 hours during the night

For me, that quote sums it up. You are responsible for knowing the rules. If you tell the commish, sorry I made a mistake and forgot to/didn't set my ADP list properly, I'd be inclined to help out.

But giving a BS excuse about not knowing/understanding the rules is the number one reason for me to not help.

And I think for most of us on the other side of the issue, none of that has anything to do with the heart of the issue.

It isn't about having Tate replaced because he didn't know the rules. It's about having Tate replaced because the rules to use the ADP list were created with the belief the ADP list from the site would be current enough it wouldn't include players who are no longer playing in the 2010 season.

I don't think any discussion with him as to why he missed his pick was necessary to do the right thing and give him a replacement player. It doesn't matter. What matters is that the list the rules had chosen was faulty to the point it didn't meet the spirit of the rules.

I'd personally have given him the next pick from the ADP list that wasn't ineligible to play because he's on Injured Reserve. Though now that I mention it, giving him a player of his choice, but after a number of other teams have gotten to jump ahead of him, is probably a suitable penalty as well. On par and quite possibly worse than the spirit of the original rule was trying to give.

Tate wasnt technically on injured reserve when this happened.

The biggest problem i have with this is where do you draw the line, what if someone gets stuck with Fred Jackson in a simialar situation?

By the commish doing this, he basically changed the rules for the draft. Anyone timing out now should have a right to choose whatever player they want, totally changing the rule of using the ADP list.

There's no line you can draw that will give you a perfect answer every time. That's why you want commissioners who are reasonable people who can come to reasonable answers that fit the situation.I don't think there's a problem deciding which side of the line lie the Tate situation, or your Fred Jackson example. A guy like Tate who it was known won't play a snap is clearly someone who would not be drafted at the ADP the list had him at if it was current.

Fred Jackson, who may return for week 1, is clearly still a viable player as of today, and may even put up the same exact points as if he hadn't been injured. Though he might not be drafted exactly at that ADP, there's plenty of reason to think he can be a productive player and so the situation isn't nearly as unfair to that owner. If the league does think Fred Jackson is unfair, they could use their brains to come up with an acceptable compromise, like letting the owner select a player, but at the end of the round. (Which sounds kind of familiar as a solution, doesn't it?)

 

[Stinkin Ref]

it is my understanding that after the Tate pick went through about 5-6 guys drafted after that (no big deal to them)....then the Tate owner was allowed to pick a guy from what was still out there (with another owner actually "on the clock")....meaning in a 12 team draft he got to replace Tate with another player before about another 4-6 guys picked....one of those 4-6 guys may have wanted the guy that the Tate owner got.........= harm

Look, the guy has the 12.01 pick. To the guy who's sitting at 12.07, it makes no difference whether the 12.01 guy makes his pick immediately, or else right after the 12.05 pick; 12.07 has six people ahead of him in the round, and six players were taken before his pick.

If I am at 12.07 and 12.01 (Tate guy) is on the clock....I know that by our rules....6 players are going to be gone before my pick.....by the commish allowing him to pick another guy before my pick, in essence (since I won't pick Tate) that number just increased to 7 guys being gone before my pick.....if the 12.01 were to get "stuck" with Tate which is what our current system dictates......then that number is only 6.....when he gets to repick, he may take the guy I wanted at 12.07 or that one of the guys at 12.08, 12.09, etc may have wanted.....and if it's serpentine in your example.....a a few owners would actually have had two cracks at the guy the Tate owner got before the Tate owner would pick again.....so it does make a difference.....as mentioned....if he would have been given the next guy listed ADP, maybe not as big of a deal, although some could still complain.....but giving him pick of the litter changes it......personally if my league allowed him to repick....I would have either given him the next guy ranked at ADP at that time, even if this meant I went back and had to change picks, or let him repick at the end of the 12th round so that all owners had a chance to take a guy that round and the Tate owners replacement pick was still out there for everybody to have a crack at in that round........

 

[GregR_2]

....I wouldnt call it a friendly league, it is a bunch of strangers. Sure, its only a $100 buy in, but it is still money. If this happened in one of my local redrafts, i would likely be the first guy to tell him to take a different player because Tate was out for the year. Thats a different situation, because it doesnt involve a rule change half way through the draft.Listen, i understand the other sides point of view, and im fine with it. I just dont want to be in a league where that sort of thing happens, that just my preference. The worse thing that comes out of this for me is i have to find a different online league host than this one for future drafts, not a big deal.

I apologize for how personal this is going to sound, but I don't know how to make it less so.It's nice to know that you would show that kind of sportsmanship to local people that you know. But it's disappointing to me that someone being a stranger makes them unworthy of being given similar consideration.

 

[Sinn Fein]

it is my understanding that after the Tate pick went through about 5-6 guys drafted after that (no big deal to them)....then the Tate owner was allowed to pick a guy from what was still out there (with another owner actually "on the clock")....meaning in a 12 team draft he got to replace Tate with another player before about another 4-6 guys picked....one of those 4-6 guys may have wanted the guy that the Tate owner got.........= harm

Look, the guy has the 12.01 pick. To the guy who's sitting at 12.07, it makes no difference whether the 12.01 guy makes his pick immediately, or else right after the 12.05 pick; 12.07 has six people ahead of him in the round, and six players were taken before his pick.

If I am at 12.07 and 12.01 (Tate guy) is on the clock....I know that by our rules....6 players are going to be gone before my pick.....by the commish allowing him to pick another guy before my pick, in essence (since I won't pick Tate) that number just increased to 7 guys being gone before my pick.....if the 12.01 were to get "stuck" with Tate which is what our current system dictates......then that number is only 6.....when he gets to repick, he may take the guy I wanted at 12.07 or that one of the guys at 12.08, 12.09, etc may have wanted.....and if it's serpentine in your example.....a a few owners would actually have had two cracks at the guy the Tate owner got before the Tate owner would pick again.....so it does make a difference.....as mentioned....if he would have been given the next guy listed ADP, maybe not as big of a deal, although some could still complain.....but giving him pick of the litter changes it......personally if my league allowed him to repick....I would have either given him the next guy ranked at ADP at that time, even if this meant I went back and had to change picks, or let him repick at the end of the 12th round so that all owners had a chance to take a guy that round and the Tate owners replacement pick was still out there for everybody to have a crack at in that round........

Just stop it.

 

[Go deep]

....I wouldnt call it a friendly league, it is a bunch of strangers. Sure, its only a $100 buy in, but it is still money. If this happened in one of my local redrafts, i would likely be the first guy to tell him to take a different player because Tate was out for the year. Thats a different situation, because it doesnt involve a rule change half way through the draft.Listen, i understand the other sides point of view, and im fine with it. I just dont want to be in a league where that sort of thing happens, that just my preference. The worse thing that comes out of this for me is i have to find a different online league host than this one for future drafts, not a big deal.

I apologize for how personal this is going to sound, but I don't know how to make it less so.It's nice to know that you would show that kind of sportsmanship to local people that you know. But it's disappointing to me that someone being a stranger makes them unworthy of being given similar consideration.

Local people i know would have the courtesy to make their pick in 12 hours, or at least predraft, and if they didnt, i would be fine with them getting stuck with Tate as well. Telling a guy that a player is out for the year during a live draft is alot different than a guy refusing to predraft, or adjust the ADP, and not picking for 12 hours, wouldnt you agree?

 

[Go deep]

it is my understanding that after the Tate pick went through about 5-6 guys drafted after that (no big deal to them)....then the Tate owner was allowed to pick a guy from what was still out there (with another owner actually "on the clock")....meaning in a 12 team draft he got to replace Tate with another player before about another 4-6 guys picked....one of those 4-6 guys may have wanted the guy that the Tate owner got.........= harm

Look, the guy has the 12.01 pick. To the guy who's sitting at 12.07, it makes no difference whether the 12.01 guy makes his pick immediately, or else right after the 12.05 pick; 12.07 has six people ahead of him in the round, and six players were taken before his pick.

If I am at 12.07 and 12.01 (Tate guy) is on the clock....I know that by our rules....6 players are going to be gone before my pick.....by the commish allowing him to pick another guy before my pick, in essence (since I won't pick Tate) that number just increased to 7 guys being gone before my pick.....if the 12.01 were to get "stuck" with Tate which is what our current system dictates......then that number is only 6.....when he gets to repick, he may take the guy I wanted at 12.07 or that one of the guys at 12.08, 12.09, etc may have wanted.....and if it's serpentine in your example.....a a few owners would actually have had two cracks at the guy the Tate owner got before the Tate owner would pick again.....so it does make a difference.....as mentioned....if he would have been given the next guy listed ADP, maybe not as big of a deal, although some could still complain.....but giving him pick of the litter changes it......personally if my league allowed him to repick....I would have either given him the next guy ranked at ADP at that time, even if this meant I went back and had to change picks, or let him repick at the end of the 12th round so that all owners had a chance to take a guy that round and the Tate owners replacement pick was still out there for everybody to have a crack at in that round........

Just stop it.

Yeah, just stop making sense.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

sorry Sinn.... just simply trying to say that all things considered, just giving the guy immediate pick of the litter is not fair to other owners that round......if they are going to let him repick....do it at the end of the 12th....or go back and give him the next ADP guy at the time.....otherwise he may grab a guy that the other owners wanted that round.......

 

[Sinn Fein]

sorry Sinn.... just simply trying to say that all things considered, just giving the guy immediate pick of the litter is not fair to other owners that round......if they are going to let him repick....do it at the end of the 12th....or go back and give him the next ADP guy at the time.....otherwise he may grab a guy that the other owners wanted that round.......

I have not kept up with the entire thread, but at one point some were arguing the guy should just drop Tate after the draft because it was the 13th round, and it was an inconsequential pick. Now, the pick is so valuable that it will doom the chances of the teams picking behind him if the guy chooses a different player (some of which were already off the board if I recall the post correctly)?Sorry - that just does not fly.This was a flaw in the system. If the league had a rule where an owner lost his pick if he missed the time deadline, I would be on your side. This was clearly a rule designed to keep the draft moving, not to eliminate a draft pick. You fix the flaw in the system don't blindly adhere to rules that did not account for this situation - a player out for the year on the ADP list.The solution here was the best outcome - the guy who missed his pick, also missed out on several players that got drafted after he missed his pick. He got a player that teams drafting behind him had no right to assume would have been available if not for the flawed system.Its fantasy football. BTW - did anyone ever post what player he got in lieu of tate?

 

[Go deep]

sorry Sinn.... just simply trying to say that all things considered, just giving the guy immediate pick of the litter is not fair to other owners that round......if they are going to let him repick....do it at the end of the 12th....or go back and give him the next ADP guy at the time.....otherwise he may grab a guy that the other owners wanted that round.......

I have not kept up with the entire thread, but at one point some were arguing the guy should just drop Tate after the draft because it was the 13th round, and it was an inconsequential pick. Now, the pick is so valuable that it will doom the chances of the teams picking behind him if the guy chooses a different player (some of which were already off the board if I recall the post correctly)?

Sorry - that just does not fly.

This was a flaw in the system. If the league had a rule where an owner lost his pick if he missed the time deadline, I would be on your side. This was clearly a rule designed to keep the draft moving, not to eliminate a draft pick. You fix the flaw in the system don't blindly adhere to rules that did not account for this situation - a player out for the year on the ADP list.

The solution here was the best outcome - the guy who missed his pick, also missed out on several players that got drafted after he missed his pick. He got a player that teams drafting behind him had no right to assume would have been available if not for the flawed system.

Its fantasy football.

BTW - did anyone ever post what player he got in lieu of tate?

Any of the owners can adjust the draft list to their liking. So if you dont want to pick within the time limit, or predraft, you can set it up so you dont get stuck with players like Tate. By rule he ended up with Tate, and it was his own fault, with his excuse being not knowing the rules. Im not suggesting the guy deserves bodily harm, but ending up with Tate in the 13th round seems fair to me. Instead, it made a mess of the draft, now some of the owners are taking their entire 6 hours to pick, and its only a matter of time before someone times out. At which point the commissioner will have to allow that owner to pick any player he wants. So basically the rule about the ADP list is out the window.

 

[SSOG]

Each owner can adjust the MFL ADP list to their liking. So if you dont want to get stuck with Ben Tate, then take him off the ADP list. If i were too busy to make my pick in the 12 hours, thats what i would do if i refused to predraft. Its not like this guy didnt have plenty of options.

One more thing, im not out to screw guys over, if someone took Adrian Peterson(formally of the Bears) in the first round. That is obviously an accident, just like if someone accidentally dropped Chris Johnson. In these cases i am all for the commissioner making it right. In this case however, the guy agreed to the rules, and had plenty of options to avoid this sort of thing.

As i edited in the OP, this is an online site that hosts multiple drafts, not a draft amongst friends.

Is there a rule in your league that if someone takes the wrong Adrian Peterson in the first round the Commish can fix it? If not, why are you willing to break the rules for Adrian Peterson but not for Ben Tate? Seems like you have no problem breaking the rules at all.

I love how some of you guys keep saying this guy would be getting "screwed" if he had to keep Tate. If so, who's fault is that? His own...not the commish, not the other owners, it's his OWN fault. He has nobody to blame but HIMSELF. If he gets his pick in then he wouldn't have to worry about what player was getting assigned to him. If he pre drafts then he wouldn't have to worry about what player was assigned to him. If he pre ranks his players he would at least get assigned a player that he would want for sure. Lastly, if the guy just takes out the injured players from the ADL he would have gotten somebody that at least plays. So many steps this guy could have taken to prevent anything like this from happening yet HE chose not to. Be a man, be accountable and move on. Don't expect the commish to have to take your hand like a little kid and fix the problem that YOU created!

Imagine there was a law in place that said that the punishment for speeding was a $100 fine (i.e. "getting stuck with the top player on the MFL ADP list"), but there was some loophole in the language that made it so that if you got caught speeding at exactly 2:04 PM (i.e. in the time between Tate getting put on IR and MFL taking him off of their ADP list), then you get the death penalty (i.e. "lose your pick"). If you were a judge sitting a court room and someone came in for speeding at 2:04 PM, would you say "Well, it seems clear to me that the whole point of the law was for you to get a $100 fine here... but the letter of the law says you get the death penalty, so I'm just going to put you to death anyway. Remember, though- it's your own damn fault for speeding in the first place!"

The biggest problem i have with this is where do you draw the line, what if someone gets stuck with Fred Jackson in a simialar situation?

Actually, you have no such problem. You said you'd undo the pick if someone took the wrong Adrian Peterson in the first round, so obviously you have no problem bending the "you get who you get" rule or finding some place to draw the line.

If I am at 12.07 and 12.01 (Tate guy) is on the clock....I know that by our rules....6 players are going to be gone before my pick.....by the commish allowing him to pick another guy before my pick, in essence (since I won't pick Tate) that number just increased to 7 guys being gone before my pick.....if the 12.01 were to get "stuck" with Tate which is what our current system dictates......then that number is only 6.....when he gets to repick, he may take the guy I wanted at 12.07 or that one of the guys at 12.08, 12.09, etc may have wanted.....

Wait, how are there 7 guys gone before your pick? Ben Tate is a non-quantity, he's an empty roster spot. If you're at 12.07, there should have been 6 players picked before you. Due to a technicality, there were almost only 5 players selected before you (because Tate is not a player, he's an empty roster spot)... but the Commish restored order and then there were only 6 players selected before you, exactly as it should have been.Sure, you might have missed out on the opportunity to gain a net advantage like the guys who picked before you in the round, but not getting an advantage is not the same thing as getting screwed, just like not getting a $200 bonus is not the same thing as losing $200. If I said "hey Ref, I'm going to paypal you $20. Oh wait, on second thought, no I'm not", would you accuse me of stealing $20 from you? Of course not, because in this situation you haven't lost anything.

 

[Instinctive]

sorry Sinn.... just simply trying to say that all things considered, just giving the guy immediate pick of the litter is not fair to other owners that round......if they are going to let him repick....do it at the end of the 12th....or go back and give him the next ADP guy at the time.....otherwise he may grab a guy that the other owners wanted that round.......

That's stupid. If he was there for the pick and took Dixon (per your example), the guy still wouldn't have Dixon anyway. At 12.01, the 12.07 guy had to wait for 6 picks. To his pick, it doesn't matter what order the guys in front of him pick in, they're all gonna pick before he does.

 

[GregR_2]

As a result of this thread I'm going to submit a feature request to MFL that they add a third option for dealing with timer expires. One where it skips him for the time being, but allows him to submit a player on his own.

I don't use the "pick a player from ADP" option for reasons exactly like this situation... I don't think the ADP list is a good enough option for putting a player on someone's roster. But the alternative... skipping the pick and commish has to submit a replacement... has problems too. I've had it occur where an owner emailed in an available player for his replacement pick, and between the time of his email and myself and my co-commishes seeing it, someone else took him.

We had that covered in our rules (he had to choose someone else), but requiring the commish to submit his pick is problematic when it doesn't have to be. If an owner can fill in a skipped pick on his own, it would get rid of the biggest negative of that option, letting him make his selection as soon as he can.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

ssog....I am not saying anything about Tate's value/commodity, etc....just the mere fact that he takes up a pick...thus allowing more players to be available to me at 12.07

if he is allowed to re-pick again before me that means one less player is available to me becuase I am obviously not going to take Tate......but I might have taken the guy he got when he got to to repick.......

 

[Sinn Fein]

ssog....I am not saying anything about Tate's value/commodity, etc....just the mere fact that he takes up a pick...thus allowing more players to be available to me at 12.07

if he is allowed to re-pick again before me that means one less player is available to me becuase I am obviously not going to take Tate......but I might have taken the guy he got when he got to to repick.......

SSOG's point was, if that had happened it would be a windfall for you. You have lost nothing by not getting the windfall.

 

[Novice2]

Is there a rule in your league that if someone takes the wrong Adrian Peterson in the first round the Commish can fix it? If not, why are you willing to break the rules for Adrian Peterson but not for Ben Tate? Seems like you have no problem breaking the rules at all.

Because there is no rule that covers the situation in regards to mistaken picks then the commish may use his judgement in this situation. There is a rule about a timer expiring and it is clearly stated imo. You either go by it or not.

Just don't see the two issues ( timer expired/picked wrong player ) as the same.

 

[Instinctive]

ssog....I am not saying anything about Tate's value/commodity, etc....just the mere fact that he takes up a pick...thus allowing more players to be available to me at 12.07

if he is allowed to re-pick again before me that means one less player is available to me becuase I am obviously not going to take Tate......but I might have taken the guy he got when he got to to repick.......

The thing is, HE wouldn't have taken Tate either. So if the rule actually made sense (next team OTC pick when you can) then you'd be in the same situation. Not getting lucky is not the same as being unlucky.

 

[GregR_2]

ssog....I am not saying anything about Tate's value/commodity, etc....just the mere fact that he takes up a pick...thus allowing more players to be available to me at 12.07

if he is allowed to re-pick again before me that means one less player is available to me becuase I am obviously not going to take Tate......but I might have taken the guy he got when he got to to repick.......

The rules didn't intend to have the result of an expired timer be that some other owner (e.g. you) have more players available for you to pick. Their intent was that an appropriate player be taken with the pick. Because the ADP list wasn't current enough to eliminate inactive players, the result was not in line with the rules intent.If one could go back in time and fix the situation by getting MFL to update the ADP list, the people with subsequent picks wouldn't have had the aforementioned advantage. So why would them not getting it in another solution be a bad thing? I mean other than when judged from a self-serving viewpoint instead of from "a what is fair" viewpoint?

 

[Herm23]

We had an identical situation to this come up in one of my startup dynasty drafts this weekend.

An owners time expired and it auto-picked a second QB for him in the 3rd round. Considering this is a 16 team league and quite deep, this essentially would have buried his roster. I happened to the be the next person on the clock and rather than just picking, paused, brought up discussion about what to do, and as a league we decided to allow the owner to re-pick. It was quite clear he would not have picked a 2nd QB on purpose and simply had neglected to set a draft list and didn't check in on time. It just so happens that when he did re-select, he took the player I was targetting with my next pick...and I am still 100% satisfied we chose this route and that it played out that way, rather than forcing him to stick with the original bunk pick.

This owner has since been removed (for a variety of reasons, chief among them repeatedly missing picks and complete lack of activity), and it is far easier to find a replacement owner with an actual functioning roster than find one with the odds already stacked against him.

I will echo what MANY have said- why would you be so hard nosed and short sighted as to enforce a generally meaningless rule that only serves to harm the league as a whole? Having competitive rosters harbors an environment where everyone is more involved and active, which in turn makes the whole thing a hell of a lot more fun. How could you NOT be for using common sense to circumvent a rule when the end result will be creating a more enjoyable all around league?

 

[CalBear]

If I am at 12.07 and 12.01 (Tate guy) is on the clock....I know that by our rules....6 players are going to be gone before my pick.....by the commish allowing him to pick another guy before my pick, in essence (since I won't pick Tate) that number just increased to 7 guys being gone before my pick.....if the 12.01 were to get "stuck" with Tate which is what our current system dictates......then that number is only 6.....when he gets to repick, he may take the guy I wanted at 12.07 or that one of the guys at 12.08, 12.09, etc may have wanted.....

This makes no sense. Tate is there at 12.07 in either scenario. The number of guys picked before 12.07 is six in either scenario.

 

[Go deep]

Each owner can adjust the MFL ADP list to their liking. So if you dont want to get stuck with Ben Tate, then take him off the ADP list. If i were too busy to make my pick in the 12 hours, thats what i would do if i refused to predraft. Its not like this guy didnt have plenty of options.

One more thing, im not out to screw guys over, if someone took Adrian Peterson(formally of the Bears) in the first round. That is obviously an accident, just like if someone accidentally dropped Chris Johnson. In these cases i am all for the commissioner making it right. In this case however, the guy agreed to the rules, and had plenty of options to avoid this sort of thing.

As i edited in the OP, this is an online site that hosts multiple drafts, not a draft amongst friends.

Is there a rule in your league that if someone takes the wrong Adrian Peterson in the first round the Commish can fix it? If not, why are you willing to break the rules for Adrian Peterson but not for Ben Tate? Seems like you have no problem breaking the rules at all.

I love how some of you guys keep saying this guy would be getting "screwed" if he had to keep Tate. If so, who's fault is that? His own...not the commish, not the other owners, it's his OWN fault. He has nobody to blame but HIMSELF. If he gets his pick in then he wouldn't have to worry about what player was getting assigned to him. If he pre drafts then he wouldn't have to worry about what player was assigned to him. If he pre ranks his players he would at least get assigned a player that he would want for sure. Lastly, if the guy just takes out the injured players from the ADL he would have gotten somebody that at least plays. So many steps this guy could have taken to prevent anything like this from happening yet HE chose not to. Be a man, be accountable and move on. Don't expect the commish to have to take your hand like a little kid and fix the problem that YOU created!

Imagine there was a law in place that said that the punishment for speeding was a $100 fine (i.e. "getting stuck with the top player on the MFL ADP list"), but there was some loophole in the language that made it so that if you got caught speeding at exactly 2:04 PM (i.e. in the time between Tate getting put on IR and MFL taking him off of their ADP list), then you get the death penalty (i.e. "lose your pick"). If you were a judge sitting a court room and someone came in for speeding at 2:04 PM, would you say "Well, it seems clear to me that the whole point of the law was for you to get a $100 fine here... but the letter of the law says you get the death penalty, so I'm just going to put you to death anyway. Remember, though- it's your own damn fault for speeding in the first place!"

The biggest problem i have with this is where do you draw the line, what if someone gets stuck with Fred Jackson in a simialar situation?

Actually, you have no such problem. You said you'd undo the pick if someone took the wrong Adrian Peterson in the first round, so obviously you have no problem bending the "you get who you get" rule or finding some place to draw the line.

If I am at 12.07 and 12.01 (Tate guy) is on the clock....I know that by our rules....6 players are going to be gone before my pick.....by the commish allowing him to pick another guy before my pick, in essence (since I won't pick Tate) that number just increased to 7 guys being gone before my pick.....if the 12.01 were to get "stuck" with Tate which is what our current system dictates......then that number is only 6.....when he gets to repick, he may take the guy I wanted at 12.07 or that one of the guys at 12.08, 12.09, etc may have wanted.....

Wait, how are there 7 guys gone before your pick? Ben Tate is a non-quantity, he's an empty roster spot. If you're at 12.07, there should have been 6 players picked before you. Due to a technicality, there were almost only 5 players selected before you (because Tate is not a player, he's an empty roster spot)... but the Commish restored order and then there were only 6 players selected before you, exactly as it should have been.Sure, you might have missed out on the opportunity to gain a net advantage like the guys who picked before you in the round, but not getting an advantage is not the same thing as getting screwed, just like not getting a $200 bonus is not the same thing as losing $200. If I said "hey Ref, I'm going to paypal you $20. Oh wait, on second thought, no I'm not", would you accuse me of stealing $20 from you? Of course not, because in this situation you haven't lost anything.

Actually, i do, but thanks for being so smart you know what i think better than me. I cant believe i have to explain this, i would think the difference is pretty obvious. Read slowly this time(Like my SSOG way of be-littling here?)

If there was a rule that said you get who you pick, then yes, i would NOT be for swithcing an accidental pick. The same goes for this, if there was not a rule on what to do with what happens when you time out, i would have been OK with the commish letting the owner make a replacmement pick when he showed up.

However, the rule clearly states "IF YOU TIME OUT, YOU GET THE NEXT PLAYER ON THE MFL ADP LIST".

There was already a rule for this situation, see the difference?

 

[Instinctive]

Isn't "you get who you pick" the most basic rule of any draft? If I picked Payton Manning but then changed my mind a pick later to Brees, would you let me do that?

 

[AB in DC]

Haven't read the full thread, but this poll needs a "none of the above" option. Commish shouldn't have just given him a new pick, but sticking him with a player on IR is totally contrary to the spirit of the rules.

 

[Go deep]

Isn't "you get who you pick" the most basic rule of any draft? If I picked Payton Manning but then changed my mind a pick later to Brees, would you let me do that?

No, but if you picked Adrian Peterson, RB, Chicago Bears in the first round, i would insist on you getting the Vikings RB....unless of course the rules stated that you are stuck with a player you pick, even if you accidentally click the wrong name. I would not play in an online league like that though, because it is too easy to accidentally click on the wrong name.

 

[Go deep]

Here is something funny that just happened. I am doing a league(same set of leagues, but different league) and someone just voluntarily took Ben Tate in the 11th round. Should the commish(same commish as in the other league) give him a do over? Obviously the guy is not aware that Tate is out for the season.

 

[Pipes]

We had an identical situation to this come up in one of my startup dynasty drafts this weekend.

An owners time expired and it auto-picked a second QB for him in the 3rd round. Considering this is a 16 team league and quite deep, this essentially would have buried his roster. I happened to the be the next person on the clock and rather than just picking, paused, brought up discussion about what to do, and as a league we decided to allow the owner to re-pick. It was quite clear he would not have picked a 2nd QB on purpose and simply had neglected to set a draft list and didn't check in on time. It just so happens that when he did re-select, he took the player I was targetting with my next pick...and I am still 100% satisfied we chose this route and that it played out that way, rather than forcing him to stick with the original bunk pick.

This owner has since been removed (for a variety of reasons, chief among them repeatedly missing picks and complete lack of activity), and it is far easier to find a replacement owner with an actual functioning roster than find one with the odds already stacked against him.

I will echo what MANY have said- why would you be so hard nosed and short sighted as to enforce a generally meaningless rule that only serves to harm the league as a whole? Having competitive rosters harbors an environment where everyone is more involved and active, which in turn makes the whole thing a hell of a lot more fun. How could you NOT be for using common sense to circumvent a rule when the end result will be creating a more enjoyable all around league?

 

[Pnishthm]

Each owner can adjust the MFL ADP list to their liking. So if you dont want to get stuck with Ben Tate, then take him off the ADP list. If i were too busy to make my pick in the 12 hours, thats what i would do if i refused to predraft. Its not like this guy didnt have plenty of options.

One more thing, im not out to screw guys over, if someone took Adrian Peterson(formally of the Bears) in the first round. That is obviously an accident, just like if someone accidentally dropped Chris Johnson. In these cases i am all for the commissioner making it right. In this case however, the guy agreed to the rules, and had plenty of options to avoid this sort of thing.

As i edited in the OP, this is an online site that hosts multiple drafts, not a draft amongst friends.

Is there a rule in your league that if someone takes the wrong Adrian Peterson in the first round the Commish can fix it? If not, why are you willing to break the rules for Adrian Peterson but not for Ben Tate? Seems like you have no problem breaking the rules at all.

I love how some of you guys keep saying this guy would be getting "screwed" if he had to keep Tate. If so, who's fault is that? His own...not the commish, not the other owners, it's his OWN fault. He has nobody to blame but HIMSELF. If he gets his pick in then he wouldn't have to worry about what player was getting assigned to him. If he pre drafts then he wouldn't have to worry about what player was assigned to him. If he pre ranks his players he would at least get assigned a player that he would want for sure. Lastly, if the guy just takes out the injured players from the ADL he would have gotten somebody that at least plays. So many steps this guy could have taken to prevent anything like this from happening yet HE chose not to. Be a man, be accountable and move on. Don't expect the commish to have to take your hand like a little kid and fix the problem that YOU created!

Imagine there was a law in place that said that the punishment for speeding was a $100 fine (i.e. "getting stuck with the top player on the MFL ADP list"), but there was some loophole in the language that made it so that if you got caught speeding at exactly 2:04 PM (i.e. in the time between Tate getting put on IR and MFL taking him off of their ADP list), then you get the death penalty (i.e. "lose your pick"). If you were a judge sitting a court room and someone came in for speeding at 2:04 PM, would you say "Well, it seems clear to me that the whole point of the law was for you to get a $100 fine here... but the letter of the law says you get the death penalty, so I'm just going to put you to death anyway. Remember, though- it's your own damn fault for speeding in the first place!"

The biggest problem i have with this is where do you draw the line, what if someone gets stuck with Fred Jackson in a simialar situation?

Actually, you have no such problem. You said you'd undo the pick if someone took the wrong Adrian Peterson in the first round, so obviously you have no problem bending the "you get who you get" rule or finding some place to draw the line.

If I am at 12.07 and 12.01 (Tate guy) is on the clock....I know that by our rules....6 players are going to be gone before my pick.....by the commish allowing him to pick another guy before my pick, in essence (since I won't pick Tate) that number just increased to 7 guys being gone before my pick.....if the 12.01 were to get "stuck" with Tate which is what our current system dictates......then that number is only 6.....when he gets to repick, he may take the guy I wanted at 12.07 or that one of the guys at 12.08, 12.09, etc may have wanted.....

Wait, how are there 7 guys gone before your pick? Ben Tate is a non-quantity, he's an empty roster spot. If you're at 12.07, there should have been 6 players picked before you. Due to a technicality, there were almost only 5 players selected before you (because Tate is not a player, he's an empty roster spot)... but the Commish restored order and then there were only 6 players selected before you, exactly as it should have been.Sure, you might have missed out on the opportunity to gain a net advantage like the guys who picked before you in the round, but not getting an advantage is not the same thing as getting screwed, just like not getting a $200 bonus is not the same thing as losing $200. If I said "hey Ref, I'm going to paypal you $20. Oh wait, on second thought, no I'm not", would you accuse me of stealing $20 from you? Of course not, because in this situation you haven't lost anything.

This makes no sense at all. There is no loophole in the language for anything. You miss your pick you get the next guy on ADP list. You speed you get a $100 fine. Those are both clear as day. Changing the rule to giving him another pick is more like changing the fine for speeding from $100 to the death penalty in your example as now the fine is no longer what the rule clearly states...it is being changed. I respect your opinion on this and you can have yours and I will have mine, but this example was horrible.

 

[SSOG]

If there was a rule that said you get who you pick, then yes, i would NOT be for swithcing an accidental pick.

Your league doesn't have a rule where you get who you pick? How does your draft work then? Who do you wind up getting if you don't get who you pick? Do you go through the entire draft, have everyone draft their entire team, and then put all the players back in the pool and reassign them alphabetically? Do you get the guy who was picked by the guy in front of you?Some rules are so blindingly obvious that they don't need to get spelled out. That doesn't mean they're not rules. For instance, not a single one of my leagues has a rule explicitly stating that you get whatever points were scored by your starters and not whatever points were scored by your bench... but that doesn't mean that I can say "hey, Jonathan Stewart went for 20 points on my bench, and I want to add that to my total score because there's no rule explicitly stating that I can't".

This makes no sense at all. There is no loophole in the language for anything. You miss your pick you get the next guy on ADP list. You speed you get a $100 fine. Those are both clear as day. Changing the rule to giving him another pick is more like changing the fine for speeding from $100 to the death penalty in your example as now the fine is no longer what the rule clearly states...it is being changed. I respect your opinion on this and you can have yours and I will have mine, but this example was horrible.

There is a loophole in the language. The intent of the rule is that if you miss your pick you get a reasonably valuable player assigned to you... but there's this loophole in the language that makes it so that if you happen to miss your pick in the 13th round instead of the 11th round, you forfeit your pick entirely.

 

[OnThInIcE911]

SSOG I am not sure why you waste your time on this thread. Many people, including the OP, do not understand a commissioners DUTY to enforce laws in their spirit and not only the flawed writing they were written up in.

The OP is obviously more concerned with winning leagues based on technicalities than trying to resolve problems rationally. The purpose of this thread was not to discover if his sentiment was correct, it was only to make him feel better about himself and his ideas, which are quite obviously wrong.

The commissioners job, much like that of a judge in our court system(someone else said this and it was quite accurate), is to look at each instance and make a fair ruling based on logic. A league can easily run on rules alone so why even appoint a commissioner if you don't want someone to solve these unforeseen problems?

Moral of the story is that OP, like many others in this thread, is a whiny little girl and would not be welcome anywhere near my leagues.

 

[Pnishthm]

SSOG I am not sure why you waste your time on this thread. Many people, including the OP, do not understand a commissioners DUTY to enforce laws in their spirit and not only the flawed writing they were written up in. The OP is obviously more concerned with winning leagues based on technicalities than trying to resolve problems rationally. The purpose of this thread was not to discover if his sentiment was correct, it was only to make him feel better about himself and his ideas, which are quite obviously wrong. The commissioners job, much like that of a judge in our court system(someone else said this and it was quite accurate), is to look at each instance and make a fair ruling based on logic. A league can easily run on rules alone so why even appoint a commissioner if you don't want someone to solve these unforeseen problems? Moral of the story is that OP, like many others in this thread, is a whiny little girl and would not be welcome anywhere near my leagues.

I really have no problem with the guy being given a new pick for Tate as I would also have no problem with the guy being forced to keep Tate. I too would want to see things go smoothly and each owner being given a "fair shake". My problem is that some in this thread makes the owner who missed his pick some kind of a martre like he's the good guy and is getting royaly screwed. I have asked repeadedly in this thread what about accountability and have not gotten one reply on that. Maybe I'm willing to accept the consequences of MY OWN actions and had I been the guy who didn't make my pick in a timely manner, had I been the guy not pre drafting when it was one pick away from my turn, had I been the guy who didn't update my own ADP list I would have graciously accepted the consequences for MY OWN actions and would not have whined about it. I guess that's just me.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

the problem here is not the commish stepping in, it is what he did when he did step in.....

all of the owners agreed to play in this league with the understanding that:

a. if they don't make their pick on time and

b. they don't do a predraft list and

c. they don't adjust their own ADP list

they will..

d. be given the next guy up on the ADP list

not

e. the next guy on the ADP list not on IR or of "reasonable value"

I doubt there are many websites that have an "up to the second" ADP list that takes out guys who are out for the year as soon as it is announced.....that sucks in situations like this, but thats is the system they chose to use and let's remember the original drafter had plenty of chances on his own (a,b,c) that could have kept it from happening....in addition to him admitting that he did not know the 6 hour rule....which is also his fault.....

with that said, the commish stepped in (rightly so).... and this is where the problem started....he didn't even change (d) to (e).....he just let homeboy immediately get a pick of whoever was still available.....

that is the problem.....

as far as I am concerned homeboy lost his right to pick whoever he wanted when he failed to do (a) and (b)....

what is flawed is just giving the guy who did nothing on his own to prevent this from happening the pick of the litter as soon as he said something.....he had given up his right to make that choice....

I am ok with allowing him to replace Tate, but it should be with the guy that was next on the ADP list at the time of the Tate assignment.....or wait until the 12th round is over and let him change his pick then.....

we can all have thoughts on the spirit of the rule, etc....but there has to be a balance between the spirit of the rule and holding an owner accountable for his actions or lack there of.......

eta: love how people have gotten all personal about not wanting guys in their league, etc when we are simply having a discussion on a message board about a fantasy football issue.....some pretty quick judge of characters going on around here based on what side of a meaningless fantasy issue we are on.....

 

[Go deep]

SSOG I am not sure why you waste your time on this thread. Many people, including the OP, do not understand a commissioners DUTY to enforce laws in their spirit and not only the flawed writing they were written up in. The OP is obviously more concerned with winning leagues based on technicalities than trying to resolve problems rationally. The purpose of this thread was not to discover if his sentiment was correct, it was only to make him feel better about himself and his ideas, which are quite obviously wrong. The commissioners job, much like that of a judge in our court system(someone else said this and it was quite accurate), is to look at each instance and make a fair ruling based on logic. A league can easily run on rules alone so why even appoint a commissioner if you don't want someone to solve these unforeseen problems? Moral of the story is that OP, like many others in this thread, is a whiny little girl and would not be welcome anywhere near my leagues.

Why do you take it so personally?