TO Is The Cincy WR To Draft.... Not Ochocinco (1 Viewer)

[RalphMouth]

yes ... I know it's pre-season football but so far in the two games the Bengals have played

TO has 10 targets to Ochocinco's 3

One must assume that both starting Cincy WRs have left both games at the same time.

Why take Ochocinco in the 4th where his ADP stands when you can get TO three or four rounds later ?

 

[Londo]

I believe the inordinate amount of targets is probably because Palmer is trying to get TO integrated into the offense as quickly as possible. Does Chad need preseason reps in this offense as much as TO? I may be wrong, but I think Chad is still the best Cincy WR to own.

 

[Detroitgodfather]

RalphMouth Posted Today, 11:11 PM yes ... I know it's pre-season football but so far in the two games the Bengals have played

TO has 10 targets to Ochocinco's 3

One must assume that both starting Cincy WRs have left both games at the same time.

Why take Ochocinco in the 4th where his ADP stands when you can get TO three or four rounds later ?

 

[Tango]

Palmer looks like last year in that he doesnt seem to be airing it out / throwing vertically / going for deep scores, etc. It's pre-season and it's early, butI would like to see some signs of 2007 before pulling the trigger on either of them.

All that said, when they're both on the field it seems that they will be even. But TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games. Edge goes to Ocho though for less separation than the ADP delta you quoted.

 

[Warrior]

because preseason =/= regular season and 13 passes = terribly small sample set

 

[LTF]

Palmer looks like last year in that he doesnt seem to be airing it out / throwing vertically / going for deep scores, etc. It's pre-season and it's early, butI would like to see some signs of 2007 before pulling the trigger on either of them.

I don't think I'll be looking to draft either one of them... won't be worth it value wise considering where they will likely go in my draft.

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

I expect Ocho to have ~20 more catches. And probably more TDs - both WRs between 6 and 10 scores.

So both probably a little undervalued, but Ocho def. putting up more points.

 

[bonesman]

One must assume that both starting Cincy WRs have left both games at the same time.

You know what they say about when you assume! Except in this case it's assuroster Seriously, that's a false assumption.

 

[shredhead]

Champ Bailey!

 

[fantasizing]

Palmer looks like last year in that he doesnt seem to be airing it out / throwing vertically / going for deep scores, etc. It's pre-season and it's early, butI would like to see some signs of 2007 before pulling the trigger on either of them.All that said, when they're both on the field it seems that they will be even. But TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games. Edge goes to Ocho though for less separation than the ADP delta you quoted.

Getting tired of seeing every Palmer pass being < 10 yards. This is getting ridiculous.

 

[-jb-]

Palmer looks like last year in that he doesnt seem to be airing it out / throwing vertically / going for deep scores, etc. It's pre-season and it's early, butI would like to see some signs of 2007 before pulling the trigger on either of them.All that said, when they're both on the field it seems that they will be even. But TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games. Edge goes to Ocho though for less separation than the ADP delta you quoted.

Getting tired of seeing every Palmer pass being < 10 yards. This is getting ridiculous.

...and 3 feet over everyone's head.

 

[comet909]

Palmer looks like last year in that he doesnt seem to be airing it out / throwing vertically / going for deep scores, etc. It's pre-season and it's early, butI would like to see some signs of 2007 before pulling the trigger on either of them.All that said, when they're both on the field it seems that they will be even. But TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games. Edge goes to Ocho though for less separation than the ADP delta you quoted.

Getting tired of seeing every Palmer pass being < 10 yards. This is getting ridiculous.

...and 3 feet over everyone's head.

Did you watch the game? 12 for 15.

 

[Multiple Scores]

It's this kind of thread that makes the Shark Pool special.

 

[TitanicHornet]

Meh I drafted them both with the plan to move 1 of them along eventually.

 

[jurb26]

I thought TO looked pretty bad in both the games he's played so far. He isn't creating separation and doesn't look to have nearly as much explosiveness. In short, he just looks old and that he's lost a step to me. There were a couple times the Bengals did a good job of creating routes specifically for him to get the ball with room to run and he didn't make anything happen with it. 2 years ago they would have been long plays. Maybe he will improve and there is a bit of conditioning that he is still going through.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games.

Why would this be true? T.O. is one of the most durable WRs in the league. He missed 9 games in 2005 with a serious injury, but other than that he has only missed 10 games in 13 years. I'm not saying Owens is the WR to own, but this should not be a factor in the decision.

 

[Tango]

TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games.

Why would this be true? T.O. is one of the most durable WRs in the league. He missed 9 games in 2005 with a serious injury, but other than that he has only missed 10 games in 13 years. I'm not saying Owens is the WR to own, but this should not be a factor in the decision.

I have TO projected at 15 starts, Ocho 16. So not a huge deal. TO is 4 years older. 36. That should not be ignored.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

I dont think this is true. Palmer has to get his timing down w TO.

Over re-action to pre-season IMO

 

[jasvic]

TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games.

Why would this be true? T.O. is one of the most durable WRs in the league. He missed 9 games in 2005 with a serious injury team suspension, but other than that he has only missed 10 games in 13 years. I'm not saying Owens is the WR to own, but this should not be a factor in the decision.

It was 2004 where he had the bad injury and missed the last 2 games and playoffs, but came back for the Super Bowl. '05 was the sit ups in the driveway, team disruptions, suspension year.

 

[OnThInIcE911]

I think you guys are forgetting someone.

Antonio Bryant.

Bengals worked out both these guys extensively in the off-season. Bengals chose Bryant and signed him to a 4 year deal worth $28 million. Owens got signed 2 months later as insurance for $2 million. His knee is a concern but when healthy he will be part of the offense, Mike Brown doesn't shell out money w/o making sure he gets something out of it. When on the field Bryant is going to cut into other WR's production and I don't think its gonna be 85's.

 

[notdarkyet]

I think you guys are forgetting someone. Antonio Bryant. Bengals worked out both these guys extensively in the off-season. Bengals chose Bryant and signed him to a 4 year deal worth $28 million. Owens got signed 2 months later as insurance for $2 million. His knee is a concern but when healthy he will be part of the offense, Mike Brown doesn't shell out money w/o making sure he gets something out of it. When on the field Bryant is going to cut into other WR's production and I don't think its gonna be 85's.

Bryant's knee is jello. He won't see any significant time and could be IR'd/

 

[Anthony Borbely]

TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games.

Why would this be true? T.O. is one of the most durable WRs in the league. He missed 9 games in 2005 with a serious injury team suspension, but other than that he has only missed 10 games in 13 years. I'm not saying Owens is the WR to own, but this should not be a factor in the decision.

It was 2004 where he had the bad injury and missed the last 2 games and playoffs, but came back for the Super Bowl. '05 was the sit ups in the driveway, team disruptions, suspension year.

Thanks for clarifying. I forgot all about that.

 

[Jackal King]

I thought TO looked pretty bad in both the games he's played so far. He isn't creating separation and doesn't look to have nearly as much explosiveness. In short, he just looks old and that he's lost a step to me. There were a couple times the Bengals did a good job of creating routes specifically for him to get the ball with room to run and he didn't make anything happen with it. 2 years ago they would have been long plays. Maybe he will improve and there is a bit of conditioning that he is still going through.

I've watched both games too...and TO doesn't look right to me. Strides are short and seems to always be in traffic. As odd as this is to say about TO...he seems to lack confidence.

 

[whodeywhodey]

yes ... I know it's pre-season football but so far in the two games the Bengals have played

TO has 10 targets to Ochocinco's 3

One must assume that both starting Cincy WRs have left both games at the same time.

Why take Ochocinco in the 4th where his ADP stands when you can get TO three or four rounds later ?

I agree with this and said as much over the weekend: http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=543499I think if you can get TO in the 7th round as your WR3 it could be huge.

 

[rickyg]

I thought TO looked pretty bad in both the games he's played so far. He isn't creating separation and doesn't look to have nearly as much explosiveness. In short, he just looks old and that he's lost a step to me. There were a couple times the Bengals did a good job of creating routes specifically for him to get the ball with room to run and he didn't make anything happen with it. 2 years ago they would have been long plays. Maybe he will improve and there is a bit of conditioning that he is still going through.

I've watched both games too...and TO doesn't look right to me. Strides are short and seems to always be in traffic. As odd as this is to say about TO...he seems to lack confidence.

No doubt in my mind that the targets TO has been getting is nothing more than he and Palmer trying to use the preseason to get in sync. Ocho Cinco will end up with the better #'s this year, although maybe not by much. Bottom line, Palmer sucks now. His arm is a shade of what it used to be, and the Bengals are a run first team now make no mistake. Draft him and his wr's accordingly.

 

[jurb26]

I thought TO looked pretty bad in both the games he's played so far. He isn't creating separation and doesn't look to have nearly as much explosiveness. In short, he just looks old and that he's lost a step to me. There were a couple times the Bengals did a good job of creating routes specifically for him to get the ball with room to run and he didn't make anything happen with it. 2 years ago they would have been long plays. Maybe he will improve and there is a bit of conditioning that he is still going through.

I've watched both games too...and TO doesn't look right to me. Strides are short and seems to always be in traffic. As odd as this is to say about TO...he seems to lack confidence.

No doubt in my mind that the targets TO has been getting is nothing more than he and Palmer trying to use the preseason to get in sync. Ocho Cinco will end up with the better #'s this year, although maybe not by much. Bottom line, Palmer sucks now. His arm is a shade of what it used to be, and the Bengals are a run first team now make no mistake. Draft him and his wr's accordingly.

I think the Cinci passing game as a whole is going to let fantasy owners down this year. I know most people aren't super high on Palmer anyway, but I don't think he is going to have a good statistical year for fantasy owners. You're right in that his arm just isn't what it used to be. I think Gresham is going to have a solid season and looks to benefit a ton from the new run 1st philosophy as well as Palmer's loss in arm strength. Gresham will steal vital looks from all of the WRs as Palmer relies on him more in the short passing game.

 

[whodeywhodey]

Bottom line, Palmer sucks now. His arm is a shade of what it used to be, and the Bengals are a run first team now make no mistake. Draft him and his wr's accordingly.

His arm looks pretty good on this 50 yard pass to TO...Palmer 50 Yard Pass to TO

 

[Deuce'sWild]

I agree with the few who have said Palmer doesn't look right. He just doesn't have any zip on his balls. I see a lot of short passes and if the WRs can't do anything with it, then they won't have a very good YPC avg.

 

[Gopher State]

If you go by pre-season games, Shipley is the one to own

 

[MongoL3]

I still think Benson is the one to own here....

 

[-jb-]

Palmer looks like last year in that he doesnt seem to be airing it out / throwing vertically / going for deep scores, etc. It's pre-season and it's early, butI would like to see some signs of 2007 before pulling the trigger on either of them.All that said, when they're both on the field it seems that they will be even. But TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games. Edge goes to Ocho though for less separation than the ADP delta you quoted.

Getting tired of seeing every Palmer pass being < 10 yards. This is getting ridiculous.

...and 3 feet over everyone's head.

Did you watch the game? 12 for 15.

Yep, I watched. They were caught, but they were high.

 

[KellysHeroes]

Palmer looks like Pennington

 

[texasbirdfan]

I think you guys are forgetting someone. Antonio Bryant. Bengals worked out both these guys extensively in the off-season. Bengals chose Bryant and signed him to a 4 year deal worth $28 million. Owens got signed 2 months later as insurance for $2 million. His knee is a concern but when healthy he will be part of the offense, Mike Brown doesn't shell out money w/o making sure he gets something out of it. When on the field Bryant is going to cut into other WR's production and I don't think its gonna be 85's.

I think you are forgetting someone. Matt Jones especially in dynasty. Bryant = old= injuries. TO = old = injuries.Both Owens and M Jones have been available late in drafts and are steals. I see Bryant at the end of his trail kind of the way Harrison fell off the map late...

 

[Otis]

I'm glad I brought my floaties, with all these sharks in here.

 

[-jb-]

tis:

 

[Tango]

Re The other guys other then TO and Ocho.

Matt Jones seems to be playing for trade bait value or for his next gig if he is cut. We never know the true ins and outs of what went on when it came down to Cinci or TN, but the Titans seemed like the better fit. In any event, he is showing well but there are too many mouths to feed assuming he isnt contributing on special teams.

Then there is Andre Caldwell. He looked the true WR1 if you only looked at the 2009 4Qs! (and certainly through the Bengals cardiac stretch in Sept/Oct) He is another guy who could get a job elsewhere. I'm curious how his speed really is though. I've never seen him catch a deep ball, so perhaps I should assume it's not where it needs to be.

And finally Bryant. Yep, seems like a knee problem here. I'm not up enough on cap-onomics to know if it makes sense to even hold onto him at all if you're the Bengals.

 

[whodeywhodey]

I think you guys are forgetting someone. Antonio Bryant. Bengals worked out both these guys extensively in the off-season. Bengals chose Bryant and signed him to a 4 year deal worth $28 million. Owens got signed 2 months later as insurance for $2 million. His knee is a concern but when healthy he will be part of the offense, Mike Brown doesn't shell out money w/o making sure he gets something out of it. When on the field Bryant is going to cut into other WR's production and I don't think its gonna be 85's.

Nope. Not going to happen.

NFL Network's Jason La Canfora has joined the Cincinnati Enquirer in reporting that it's a "distinct possibility" Antonio Bryant will be released by the Bengals with an injury settlement.Terrell Owens and Jordan Shipley have looked very good this preseason, and Bryant has yet to resume practicing since taking the field for the first day of Bengals camp. La Canfora passes along word that the team's concern with Bryant's bum left knee is "very real." He's not expected to be ready for Week 1.

 

[gpthatsme]

T.O. sure is looking good tonight...

 

[Team ROFLCOPTERS]

I was running the whole ADP thing too just as an excersize. Chad's ADP is closer to 5 than 4 and TO's has been rising. We know that Chad is going to get his. He's the one constant in the offense. The difference in the proven consistency of Chad playing in the same offense with the same QB and TO who has been on the decline and the possibility of being out of favor come playoffs is well worth the cost of Chad if choosing between the two.

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

I took Chad in the 4th today.

I still think TO has some value if you are stocking up elsewhere but I prefer Ocho as part of a BALLER WR corps (Moss/Colston/Ocho).

 

[moderated]

TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games.

Why would this be true? T.O. is one of the most durable WRs in the league. He missed 9 games in 2005 with a serious injury, but other than that he has only missed 10 games in 13 years. I'm not saying Owens is the WR to own, but this should not be a factor in the decision.

I have TO projected at 15 starts, Ocho 16.

 

[whodeywhodey]

I was running the whole ADP thing too just as an excersize. Chad's ADP is closer to 5 than 4 and TO's has been rising. We know that Chad is going to get his. He's the one constant in the offense. The difference in the proven consistency of Chad playing in the same offense with the same QB and TO who has been on the decline and the possibility of being out of favor come playoffs is well worth the cost of Chad if choosing between the two.

Highly disagree with this.TO is the player to own given his ADP. I've been saying this for weeks.

 

[whodeywhodey]

TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games.

Why would this be true? T.O. is one of the most durable WRs in the league. He missed 9 games in 2005 with a serious injury, but other than that he has only missed 10 games in 13 years. I'm not saying Owens is the WR to own, but this should not be a factor in the decision.

I have TO projected at 15 starts, Ocho 16.

How many games has TO missed in the last 4 years?Look it up --- you will be surprised. I'll wait here for your answer.

 

[[icon]]

Look it up --- you will be surprised. I'll wait here for your answer.

Lies.13 User(s) are reading this topic (6 Guests and 1 Anonymous Users)6 Members: [icon], OddibeMcD, bostonfred, seventwentykay, kyter1, BoneYardDog

 

[whodeywhodey]

Look it up --- you will be surprised. I'll wait here for your answer.

Lies.13 User(s) are reading this topic (6 Guests and 1 Anonymous Users)6 Members: [icon], OddibeMcD, bostonfred, seventwentykay, kyter1, BoneYardDog

In the shark pool.I am still waiting btw.

 

[Binky The Doormat]

OK - I didn't want to say it but I have had 2 of his children and he is a great father. I live on the TO-dole and that train ain't stoppin' fo 18 mo years.

God love that man. He scores touchdowns for my babies.

 

[whodeywhodey]

OK - I didn't want to say it but I have had 2 of his children and he is a great father. I live on the TO-dole and that train ain't stoppin' fo 18 mo years.God love that man. He scores touchdowns for my babies.

Word.

 

[moderated]

TO is less likely to be on the field all 16 games.

Why would this be true? T.O. is one of the most durable WRs in the league. He missed 9 games in 2005 with a serious injury, but other than that he has only missed 10 games in 13 years. I'm not saying Owens is the WR to own, but this should not be a factor in the decision.

I have TO projected at 15 starts, Ocho 16.

How many games has TO missed in the last 4 years?Look it up --- you will be surprised. I'll wait here for your answer.

it was amusing because not only did he try to predict injury but tried to predict the exact amount of games.but offhand TO hasn't missed much time, if any, the past few years.

 

[whodeywhodey]

One game. Total.

 

[beavers]

Very good call ... thanks!