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Top 50 IDP rooks posted (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Sigmund Bloom
- Start date
as always, subject to change in the next week as the dust settles in my noggin.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
8 Anthony Spencer
Now you've done it.
Now you've done it.
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
I like the consensus a lot. 
It's like looking at the class from three different perspectives.
Bloom -- talent first, situation second
Bramel -- talent and situation balanced
Norton -- situation frist, talent second
That's oversimplified, but I think it's pretty descriptive of these first rankings.
I have some bones to pick, but, in the middle of a draft as we speak. And the bones I'm picking are probably free agency bones mostly... when it comes to typical rookie drafts.
Still great stuff. Love the guidance.
It's like looking at the class from three different perspectives.
Bloom -- talent first, situation second
Bramel -- talent and situation balanced
Norton -- situation frist, talent second
That's oversimplified, but I think it's pretty descriptive of these first rankings.
I have some bones to pick, but, in the middle of a draft as we speak. And the bones I'm picking are probably free agency bones mostly... when it comes to typical rookie drafts.
Still great stuff. Love the guidance.
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
he should be embarrassed to have Staff next to his name.
Greg Ellis was producing in that role, I see no reason Spencer can't produce at or near the same level. If Spencer is classified at DL, that's just gravy (see: Thomas, Bryan)he should be embarrassed to have Staff next to his name.
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Chaos Commish
Footballguy
I wrote three long paragraphs then deleted. You know what? Let's not debate this. We'll see. 8 seems real high for him. But his chance at seeing playing time next year seems higher than many I like better. Camp will sort these rankings out, but by then it's really too late for most leagues bothered by rookie IDPs. You guys tackle a tough task, what was that, a fool's errand? It is appreciated. And all opinions are worth considering. Even if you're just stubborn.Greg Ellis was producing in that role, I see no reason Spencer can't produce at or near the same level.he should be embarrassed to have Staff next to his name.
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CC your skepticism about Spencer is well-founded, I just see that killer instinct in him and Ellis showed that the spot opposite Ware is ripe for playmaking. Also, this is just a weak all-around class. I might be too influenced by this recent crop of 3-4 OLBs that are making for good IDPs.You can see in the 100 that I have my 8-14 pretty tightly grouped, and the 51-100 will show that the tight grouping extends farther than that. And yes, you are correct, Spencer having a good shot to start and play 3 downs from day one puts him higher than delayed gratification guys like Timmons, Black, Okwo, Durant...We have had some good back and forth about Spencer already - but I always enjoy hearing what slants through that twisted head of yours.I wrote three long paragraphs then deleted. You know what? Let's not debate this. We'll see. 8 seems real high for him. But his chance at seeing playing time next year seems higher than many I like better next year. Camp will sort these rankings out, but by then it's really too late for most leagues bothered by rookie IDPs. You guys tackle a tough task, what was that, a fool's errand? It is appreciated. And all opinions are worth considering. Even if you're just stubborn.Greg Ellis was producing in that role, I see no reason Spencer can't produce at or near the same level.he should be embarrassed to have Staff next to his name.
kellumsboys
Footballguy
nice work.
in leagues where return yardage counts, how much of a bump in the rankings would these guys get ?
Aaron Ross - 10 spots ?
Darrelle Revis - 10 spots ?
Leon Hall - 5 spots ?
any others ?
in leagues where return yardage counts, how much of a bump in the rankings would these guys get ?
Aaron Ross - 10 spots ?
Darrelle Revis - 10 spots ?
Leon Hall - 5 spots ?
any others ?
Ross and Revis go way up - into the top 20 at least. Eric Wright should also break into the 50 in that system.Id also give Corey Graham a longer look, except I have no idea how he leapfrogs Hester. Funny thing is that Danieal Manning is also an excellent return man. Hall, not so much.
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Chaos Commish
Footballguy
Well, I just droned on about Ellis being a monster in that role from camp until the injury. The coaches were buzzing from early August on about he good he was. He made Carpenter a bad pick, and he was great on the field later. He was in the best shape of his life, dominant at 6-6 with all that power. Spencer is a poor imitation of that kind of play. Now Wade uses the spot differently and substitutes heavily for run and pass, so Spencer will play... how much and how well remains to be seen. He has Carpenter to worry about too, btw. Ridge has pointed out the overkill at the "4" in Dallas.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
I trained at the Miyagi-do school of IDP evaluation. But I also took Hubie Brown's correspondence course on Tremendous Upside.I like the consensus a lot.
It's like looking at the class from three different perspectives.
Bloom -- talent first, situation second
Bramel -- talent and situation balanced
Norton -- situation frist, talent second
That's oversimplified, but I think it's pretty descriptive of these first rankings.
I have some bones to pick, but, in the middle of a draft as we speak. And the bones I'm picking are probably free agency bones mostly... when it comes to typical rookie drafts.
Still great stuff. Love the guidance.
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kellumsboys
Footballguy
thanks
I have a draft starting sunday and need someone to replace last years pick (PACMAN) . 
TheGreatest
Footballguy
B. Davis at #6? I think thats a bit high with G. Hayes still around.And I assume with Waters ranked #7 you are betting on him being the starter in the middle this year?
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he'll fit in right next to Hayes just fine. The new regime clearly believes in him.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Is this just a hunch because they spent a third round pick on him? Strong belief in the speculation from the Scout.com piece? Or something you saw said by the coaches/front office?Where does Dansby go in this scenario for 2007? I don't mind considering Davis a big part of the plans for 2008, but it sure seemed like Dansby would play inside in the pre-draft mini-camps. Not that that's the best role for him necessarily; maybe they didn't like what they saw.
Just curious...
Chaos Commish
Footballguy
If the plan is to go 3-4, where does Buster fit? I know very short LBs have played great on the inside, but in a 3-4? Who? It seems the prototype has more height for necessary vision in all that trash and to avoid being swamped by OLs... right?
I think the fact that they took him in the top of the 3rd makes it more than a hunch. Clearly they like him and have plans for him. You dont spend a top 75 pick on an LB you dont expect to start for you.I see Dansby going outside, which is where he fits best, but in the hybrid his versatility gives him extra value.
this is how I think things will shake out too.there haven't been many LBs at 5'9" in the NFL so it's tough to find comparisons for him, but I have little doubt players like London Fletcher and Zach Thomas would be effective playing ILB in a 3-4. For a team with plenty of needs, I don't see why they'd spend that pick on him if they didn't plan to make major use of him.Doesn't Florida State play a lot of 3-4 themselves? I think they used to anyway as I remember Cowart was one of the best 3-4 ILBs in the league when he came out of Florida State. Buster reminds me a bit of a cross between London Fletcher and Sam Cowart.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
I agree with all of the above. Still, I'm going to be stubborn and wait for some official word that he'll play a valued ILB role before I recommend him for 2007. Davis looks like a very good 2008 option -- assuming the Cards don't re-sign Dansby as an ILB -- and I probably ought to bump him ahead of some of the filler I have ahead of him.I don't know if I agree with the third round pick meaning instant starter though. I'll concede the new regime point but last year's third round picks included Abdul Hodge, Chris Gocong, Anthony Schegel, Clint Ingram, James Anderson, Freddie Keiaho and Gerris Wilkinson. Only one (Gocong) was considered a likely starter entering (and leaving) camp. I'm still surprised that Dansby was slated to play inside whenever the 3-4 is the call. And I'm even more surprised that there are already rumors about Davis booting Hayes from the starting lineup. Hard to know what legitimate smoke and what's post-draft speculation.
Benchwarmers
Footballguy
LB Anthony Waters, SD at 8?
Who do you think will be the starting LBer's for the Chargers?
I just don't see it, with Cooper and Wilhem there and have one year in the system.
Who do you think will be the starting LBer's for the Chargers?
I just don't see it, with Cooper and Wilhem there and have one year in the system.
Weiner Dog
Footballguy
Sounds like Lance Mitchell has been reincarnated...I agree with Jene. Davis is ranked too high.
Just to be clear, I didnt mean week one starter or even 07 starter. I treat rookie rankings as dynasty rankings. When a team takes a guy that high, they are projecting him as a starter down the line. Hodge is a tough nut to crack - I saw him pushing Barnett to SLB - still waiting for the other shoe to drop on that one. Philly's rookies almost never do much in year one. Schlegel was a wasted pick, and I felt comfortable with that conclusion from the moment his name was called. Ingram is starting. Keiaho is the presumptive starter. Wilkinson will get to compete for a starting spot.I think going in the 3rd round is still a good indicator that a team will give an LB an opportunity to start.
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Cooper and Wilhelm will start this year, but I really like Waters and think 3-4 ILB is perfect for him. You may not get much out of him this year, but I expect to him to win a starting job in 08 as long as his knee is sound - and his 4.69 before the draft indicates that it is.
rotorooter
Footballguy
Do you see Waters as a 3 down ILB for SD next year? and who do you see him replacing?
I dont know if he's got the coverage skills to be a 3 down LB, but I think he can equal the presence of David Harris.I withhold judgment on who he'll replace until I see Cooper and Wilhelm on a full time basis, although I think he can outperform either of them if he comes back 100% from the ACL tear. I just love this guy's spirit, and I have a hunch AJ Smith does too.
His ranking is high mainly because he's unimpeded. An LB that doesn't play in the nickel, but has a strong presence in run defense, can still be valuable in start 3/4 LB leagues (see: Trotter, Jeremiah)
what happens to Eric Barton? June 1st cut? surprised he doesn't garner some trade interest, even for a late round pick.
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Jene Bramel
Footballguy
The Jets were pleased enough with Brad Kassell inside last year to rotate him with Barton and seem to have some designs on moving Hobson inside for some snaps too so it looks like Barton is a longshot for the roster. I was a little surprised he didn't get any interest either, but there were a lot of LBs available in UFA this year.
I can see Barton rotating with Harris inside and Hobson/Thomas outside and still playing a decent role, easing into Harris becoming "the man" next to Vilma by 08.
