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Watch What You Say (1 Viewer)

Z

zed2283

Footballguy
Very, very long read. This kind of thing infuriates me, and I don't undertstand why more people aren't up in arms about it. The standard FBG response is "I don't have anything to hide" but that's a pretty ignorant stance IMO. Welcome to the police state.

My link

Flowing through its servers and routers and stored in near-bottomless databases will be all forms of communication, including the complete contents of private emails, cell phone calls, and Google searches, as well as all sorts of personal data trails—parking receipts, travel itineraries, bookstore purchases, and other digital “pocket litter.” It is, in some measure, the realization of the “total information awareness” program created during the first term of the Bush administration—an effort that was killed by Congress in 2003 after it caused an outcry over its potential for invading Americans’ privacy.

But “this is more than just a data center,” says one senior intelligence official who until recently was involved with the program. The mammoth Bluffdale center will have another important and far more secret role that until now has gone unrevealed. It is also critical, he says, for breaking codes. And code-breaking is crucial, because much of the data that the center will handle—financial information, stock transactions, business deals, foreign military and diplomatic secrets, legal documents, confidential personal communications—will be heavily encrypted. According to another top official also involved with the program, the NSA made an enormous breakthrough several years ago in its ability to cryptanalyze, or break, unfathomably complex encryption systems employed by not only governments around the world but also many average computer users in the US. The upshot, according to this official: “Everybody’s a target; everybody with communication is a target.”
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ETA quote from article.
 
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Haven't read it all yet, but it infuriates me. The government should not have such power. But what are we to do? The majority of Americans don't care and label everyone that does a conspiracy theorist. Both our major parties and every "electable" politician supports this type of thing.

 
'Mello said:
Haven't read it all yet, but it infuriates me. The government should not have such power. But what are we to do? The majority of Americans don't care and label everyone that does a conspiracy theorist. Both our major parties and every "electable" politician supports this type of thing.
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:goodposting: Sadly, the sheeple will sacrifice any freedom they have as long as big brother makes them feel safe from outsiders.
 
I didn't read the article, but if Congress shutdown a smaller version of this while Bush was in office, what gave Obama the right to create this larger version?

 
So if all this stuff is so uber top secret, then how did this guy get all the info, including what sounds like schematics of the interior, of one of the most secret facilities in the country?

I'm not saying he's not right on all of this, but some of it smells fishy. His one big source that goes on the record with his name almost has to be lying about some of the stuff he claims. If not, he's going to end up in jail for a long time for disclosing all sorts of NSA secrets. Just because he doesn't work there anymore doesn't mean he can go telling all that stuff to everyone.

You can argue that he's a whistleblower and that what he's doing is just, and you may be right, but I would imagine that legally he's in quite a bit of trouble if he is telling the truth.

And FWIW, the author of this story Bamford is someone that I would classify as a conspiracy theorist of sorts and someone that hasn't always had clean hands. He's done some shady stuff in the past to try to advance his beliefs.

 
'GroveDiesel said:
I didn't read the article, but if Congress shutdown a smaller version of this while Bush was in office, what gave Obama the right to create this larger version?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what that line was referring too, but I believe this stuff was happing throughout his administration.
 
'GroveDiesel said:
So if all this stuff is so uber top secret, then how did this guy get all the info, including what sounds like schematics of the interior, of one of the most secret facilities in the country?I'm not saying he's not right on all of this, but some of it smells fishy. His one big source that goes on the record with his name almost has to be lying about some of the stuff he claims. If not, he's going to end up in jail for a long time for disclosing all sorts of NSA secrets. Just because he doesn't work there anymore doesn't mean he can go telling all that stuff to everyone. You can argue that he's a whistleblower and that what he's doing is just, and you may be right, but I would imagine that legally he's in quite a bit of trouble if he is telling the truth.And FWIW, the author of this story Bamford is someone that I would classify as a conspiracy theorist of sorts and someone that hasn't always had clean hands. He's done some shady stuff in the past to try to advance his beliefs.
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Whistleblower or Patriot.I don't know, but those are legitimate questions. The guy who sent me the article works for an insurance company that had looked into the insurance program for the project.
 
'Slapdash said:
'GroveDiesel said:
I didn't read the article, but if Congress shutdown a smaller version of this while Bush was in office, what gave Obama the right to create this larger version?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what that line was referring too, but I believe this stuff was happing throughout his administration.
Click to expand...
It is, in some measure, the realization of the “total information awareness” program created during the first term of the Bush administration—an effort that was killed by Congress in 2003 after it caused an outcry over its potential for invading Americans’ privacy.
 
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'GroveDiesel said:
'Slapdash said:
'GroveDiesel said:
I didn't read the article, but if Congress shutdown a smaller version of this while Bush was in office, what gave Obama the right to create this larger version?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what that line was referring too, but I believe this stuff was happing throughout his administration.
Click to expand...
It is, in some measure, the realization of the “total information awareness” program created during the first term of the Bush administration—an effort that was killed by Congress in 2003 after it caused an outcry over its potential for invading Americans’ privacy.
Click to expand...
Yeah I read that, I just don't buy it. The only way that makes sense is if it just referring to having a location to bring all of the information together and analyzed. They have certainly still been collecting it from every source possible.
 
Imagine that, the USA becoming more and more like a Nazi police state, but hey I'm not doing anything wrong so why should I worry... :rolleyes:

 
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Our freedoms are still relatively great at this point. Can you imagine what it will be like if terrorists are successful in another attack here? Suppose they blow up a nuclear bomb in a city for example. At that point the Congress, with the overwhelming support of the public, will pass laws which make the Patriot Act seem insubstantial by comparison.

 
'timschochet said:
Our freedoms are still relatively great at this point. Can you imagine what it will be like if terrorists are successful in another attack here? Suppose they blow up a nuclear bomb in a city for example. At that point the Congress, with the overwhelming support of the public, will pass laws which make the Patriot Act seem insubstantial by comparison.
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When our government is transparent enough that I can make an informed decision on what level of restrictions and spying are truly appropriate compared to the threat that's really out there, then I might agree with you (I doubt it though). Until then I'll base my opinion on history and assume that the government is simply trying to control and scare the public more. People with the attitude you posted are far more destructive to our nation than some terrorists. It gives the powers that really threaten our country a free ride to make any changes they want under the guise of protecting you.
 
Slapdash said:
zed2283 said:
NSA collecting data on cell phones worldwide.

http://nypost.com/2013/12/05/nsa-tracks-5-billion-cellphone-users/

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/12/05/nsa-reportedly-collects-5-billion-cell-phone-location-records-day/
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Posted this in the other NSA thread to :crickets: . We love Big Brother :shrug:
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I don't think anyone is surprised. I assume all forms of electronic communication are monitored at this point.

Bombs assassination President Obama Islam #### Pot Sniper Rifle Koran

If I'm looking to overthrow the government, I'll probably be a little more cautious with my communications, but when I'm just trying to entertain myself on a message board or ask my wife what's for dinner it doesn't matter a whole lot.

 
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Jayrod said:
Slapdash said:
zed2283 said:
NSA collecting data on cell phones worldwide.

http://nypost.com/2013/12/05/nsa-tracks-5-billion-cellphone-users/

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/12/05/nsa-reportedly-collects-5-billion-cell-phone-location-records-day/
Click to expand...
Posted this in the other NSA thread to :crickets: . We love Big Brother :shrug:
Click to expand...
I don't think anyone is surprised. I assume all forms of electronic communication are monitored at this point.

Bombs assassination President Obama Islam #### Pot Sniper Rifle Koran

If I'm looking to overthrow the government, I'll probably be a little more cautious with my communications, but when I'm just trying to entertain myself on a message board or ask my wife what's for dinner it doesn't matter a whole lot.
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[SIZE=10.5pt]This is just the "If you're not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about" argument. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]Electronic seems like an unnecessary qualifier here. [/SIZE]

 
Advisory panel calls for end to bulk collection of U.S. phone records

[SIZE=medium]A divided Obama administration privacy panel has recommended ending the bulk collection of U.S. phone records, saying the controversial program amounts to an unlawful invasion of privacy that has not made Americans any safer.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium]“We have not identified a single instance involving a threat to the United States in which the telephone records program made a concrete difference in the outcome of a counterterrorism investigation,” the report said. “Moreover, we are aware of no instance in which the program directly contributed to the discovery of a previously unknown terrorist plot or the disruption of a terrorist attack.”[/SIZE]

 
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