DoubleG
Footballguy
I cant remember the last time I heard some dork use the term "dork".
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Who is the best team in the NFL? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter ponchsox
- Start date
David Yudkin
Footballguy
I have no dog in this fight, and anyone that doesn't score Brady and Rodgers close to a draw is clearly favoring one or the other.But it's not like Brady has been immune to dealing with injuries and OL issues. His long-time left tackle (Matt Light) retired. Their Pro Bowl RG from last year never reported this season (Brian Waters). All Pro LG Logan Mankins has missed half the season. The rest of the OL has been banged up and missed time or been limited week to week. Gronkowski has missed the last month. Hernandez has missed half the season. Edelman missed a month of games and is done for the year.And Brady has done as well or better with all that and the team has been blowing people out.Again, this is not a pro-Brady / anti-Rodgers post. Both guys have had to deal with things this year and neither one has had it on easy street.
sho nuff
Footballguy
I agree with this...Brady's line has been pretty patchwork itself.They carry their team's offenses...and Brady certainly has been playing better in recent games.
sho nuff
Footballguy
While I agree I am a homer...what in my statements in this topic have I said that are just pro-Packer homeristic? I think I have been quite level headed in this one (for once). Part of it is I don't trust this Packer Oline...and without Matthews I really don't trust the defense.Ive stated that saber is over the top and anyone claiming the Packers are up there right now are out of their mind.And then similar things to the rest of your post.I agree, but both of you guys are such homers, that it is hard to take either of you seriously. Tso's stupidity, among other things, is in implying that Rodgers might be a flash in the pan. Yeah, a guy with 160 TD passes and only 45 INTs in the last five years is a flash in the pan.Even leaving out the comparison to Brady out of the equation, it is moronic to even suggest (which Tso did by posing the question) that Rodgers is a flash in the pan. Flash in the pans do not have five years of pure greatness. And the fact that Tso would suggest that this year might be an anomaly shows how great Rodgers is. 29 TD, 8 INTs, top 10 YPA, top passer rating, top 5 in QBR - and all of this with little to no running game, and with playing what, one or two games, with both of his top two WRs healthy for the whole game? - is considered a down year for Rodgers? That would be a career year for most other QBs, but for Rodgers, it is considered a slight letdown. Unreal.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Thanks for bringing your own facts to the actual topic.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
I agree with most of what you said, but let's not act like losing Edelman is a big blow or anything (to the offense). Edelman is at best their 7th best skill position weapon (behind Gronk, Hernandez, Ridley, Welker, Lloyd and Woodhead). And Vereen is probably more dangerous, too (but he gets limited touches because it is difficult for multiple RBs to get tons of touches on a weekly basis).
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David Yudkin
Footballguy
So take Edelman out of the mix altogether. The point was, two OL starters were gone from day one and 3 other OLmen have been banged up. For a lot of the past month and a half, the OL has had 3 back ups playing a lot with one of Gronk and Hernandez out each week. In that time, the Pats scored 40+ points 3 times and hung 59 on the Colts.Again, you have to play with whoever suits up and whoever is in your huddle. The injuries to the Pats OL and TE up until now haven't seem to phase the Patriots offense and Brady in the least. (However, I think that may catch up to them, but that's another discussion altogether.)The point in all this was that is wasn't just the Packers that had OL issues and injuries. Rodgers numbers have been down some in the time that guys have been out. Brady's numbers have actually gone up dealing with similar issues. I would think most teams would trade their QB for either Brady or Rodgers, as both of them are elite QBs.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Pats running game >>> GB running game. Rodgers leads the league in sacks. the GB oline is very putrid. Im not sure the coaching staff can fix it, give BB credit, the super hurry up/running game has made Bradys life easier
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
That all might be true, but the Patriots talent at the skill positions is deeper than GB's, so it is easier for them to recover from losing one or two of their guys.
The Packers have had only one RB worth a damn this year (Benson) and he hasn't played since October; the Patriots have had a highly productive starting RB this year (Ridley), a change of pace guy who is productive when used (Woodhead) and another young talent who has shown major flashes of greatness when used (Vereen).
The Packers only have one TE worth a damn (Finley), a head case, with a big mouth, who has been majorly disappointing for years now. The Patriots have two absolute studs at TE.
The Packers two best WRs have been riddled with injuries all season. Jennings missed two months, and Nelson has been in and out at times all season. Cobb has been great as a fill-in, and James Jones has shown flashes, but neither is a true number 1, so it is not as easy for them to step up when there is no running game and no TE to take the heat off. Meanwhile, the Patriots have the best possession WR in the league (Welker) and a good deep threat in Lloyd (who, granted, has been inconsistent, but still came up huge at times).
So factor that in with the huge difference in running games, as well as the much easier schedule NE has had, and it is no surprise that Brady is putting up a little better numbers than Rodgers this year. What both are doing, all things considered, speaks to the greatness of both.
The Packers have had only one RB worth a damn this year (Benson) and he hasn't played since October; the Patriots have had a highly productive starting RB this year (Ridley), a change of pace guy who is productive when used (Woodhead) and another young talent who has shown major flashes of greatness when used (Vereen).
The Packers only have one TE worth a damn (Finley), a head case, with a big mouth, who has been majorly disappointing for years now. The Patriots have two absolute studs at TE.
The Packers two best WRs have been riddled with injuries all season. Jennings missed two months, and Nelson has been in and out at times all season. Cobb has been great as a fill-in, and James Jones has shown flashes, but neither is a true number 1, so it is not as easy for them to step up when there is no running game and no TE to take the heat off. Meanwhile, the Patriots have the best possession WR in the league (Welker) and a good deep threat in Lloyd (who, granted, has been inconsistent, but still came up huge at times).
So factor that in with the huge difference in running games, as well as the much easier schedule NE has had, and it is no surprise that Brady is putting up a little better numbers than Rodgers this year. What both are doing, all things considered, speaks to the greatness of both.
butcher boy
Footballguy
The answer is clear to me.
The New England Patriots
Offensive Yards/Game: #1
Points/Game: #1 and the #2 team is more than 10 points/game less!
Turnover Margin: +24
Points Against: #11
Team QB Rating: #3
All this with the second hardest SOS so far this season.
I mean come on guys.
The New England Patriots
Offensive Yards/Game: #1
Points/Game: #1 and the #2 team is more than 10 points/game less!
Turnover Margin: +24
Points Against: #11
Team QB Rating: #3
All this with the second hardest SOS so far this season.
I mean come on guys.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Pats opponents are a combined 88-80-1.Pack opponents are a combined 85-82-2.In fact, they share 8 common opponents this year. Not sure schedule plays a role in the debate on this one.
After the Pats win another super bowl this year, can we crown Tom Brady as the best NFL player ever? That would be 4 for 6 in Super Bowls. Montana went 4 for 4, but I have to think it's more impressive to get to an additional two, even if you lost them (closely).
I love that he was selected in the late 6th round as a compensatory pick. A lot of history's best players felt "snubbed" and used that as motivation (Jordan, Rodgers, Brady).
I love that he was selected in the late 6th round as a compensatory pick. A lot of history's best players felt "snubbed" and used that as motivation (Jordan, Rodgers, Brady).
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ImTheScientist
Footballguy
Seahawks on offense are averaging more PPG than the Packers fwiw. 
Sabertooth
Footballguy
So? Won't mean #### when the real refs are out there.Seahawks on offense are averaging more PPG than the Packers fwiw.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
I believe Denver,GB and NYG can win it all too.Going to be an interesting playoffs, If the Pats have to travel to Denver and Houston after winning a round1 game they might stumble and not get there. tougher road for them. who knew playing seattle,Arizona and SF would mean losses
Sabertooth
Footballguy
I'd swap Houston and New England there. I think the Conference games should be Texans vs Pats, 49ers vs Packers. I think the 49ers and the Pats in the SB in all honesty.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
The way it's looking, GB and SF will be the 2 and 3 seeds, which means it will be impossible for them to meet in the NFC title game.
SoCalBroncoFan
Footballguy
First Tier: (in alphabetical order)
Denver
New England
San Francisco
Second Tier:
Atlanta
Green Bay
Houston
Seattle
Third Tier:
Baltimore
Cincinnati
Indianapolis
Denver
New England
San Francisco
Second Tier:
Atlanta
Green Bay
Houston
Seattle
Third Tier:
Baltimore
Cincinnati
Indianapolis
SoCalBroncoFan
Footballguy
If the Broncos hold on to the second seed and get a first-round bye they are going to be dangerous. If the favorites win out the second round match-ups in the AFC will be Baltimore at Houston and New England at Denver. That NE-Den game might be the game of the year.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Is this the same Houston team that got lit up both times in primetime?Not sure how you can claim that about Houston...and then just say "the pats are right there too"...given how thoroughly the Pats dismantled the Texans.Id put it:SFNEDenverSeattle and then Houstonright now...with some others not far behind...Falcons, Giants and Packers in the NFC could all make nice runs.
Not Sleeping
Footballguy
Sabertooth
Footballguy
How so?
Not Sleeping
Footballguy
If the #3 seed wins the first week, that means the #1 seed will play the winner of #4 vs. #5 and #2 will play #3. So there is no way #2 can play #3 in the NFC title game...if they meet, it has to be in the divisional round.
GunslingerEnder
Footballguy
3 seed can't play 1 seed in round 2 if they get there
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Got it.
packseasontix
Footballguy
Sorry until they beat a good team on the road I am not buying the Seahawks. (Sorry the Bears dont count as they are very mediocre middle of the road team)Both the Patriots and Packers games have a supposed 3-5 points swing because of home field advantage and your looking at them losing the games. Unless the 49ers lose out I see a first round exit for the Seahawks when they go on the road against Washington/49ers/Packers, it would be very interesting to see a 49ers Seahawks 1st round game
49ers
Patriots
Texans
Falcons
Packers
Ravens - injuries and offensive struggles as of late
Seahawks - road weakness against good teams
Colts/Vikings/Redskins/Giants - All roughly the same level due to different reasons
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asuterlowe
Footballguy
Kaepernick gives SF the only thing they were really missing, a respectable passing threat. On top of that he's great on his feet and hard to contain. He's obviously not Brady or Rodgers but with that defense and running game he really doesn't need to be.
The switch to Kaep elevated the offense that's paired with arguably the best defense is the league, I don't think there's a more complete team out there. Denver and Seattle are really close though, The pats and the pack round out the top five, simply due to how potent their offenses can be, but those three teams ahead of them are scary on both sides of the ball.
SF @ SEA is going to be awesome game
The switch to Kaep elevated the offense that's paired with arguably the best defense is the league, I don't think there's a more complete team out there. Denver and Seattle are really close though, The pats and the pack round out the top five, simply due to how potent their offenses can be, but those three teams ahead of them are scary on both sides of the ball.
SF @ SEA is going to be awesome game
thatguy
Footballguy
Denver?
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
Again, Seahawks are the best.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
Conclusion : Seattle by a mile. Defense got utterly torched by a rookie and they only scored a late garbage TD that should've been reviewed probably. One big difference I see is that Wilson got his rookie jitters out if the 3 months ago. Keeper nick looked lost out there at times. Wide eyed and confused.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Seattle has looked awesome, but let's remember that they normally are not the same team on the road that they are at home - 3-5 on the road and they lost at Miami just a month ago - and they will likely have to win three road games in the NFC to make it to the Super Bowl.
Call me a homer, but I am going with my Broncos right now. They are 12-3, have won 10 in a row, and have a top 5 offense and defense.
Call me a homer, but I am going with my Broncos right now. They are 12-3, have won 10 in a row, and have a top 5 offense and defense.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
I'm glad the road to NO doesn't go through Denver. The altitude is much more intimidating to Seattle than the frozen tundra (Wilsons a Basger) and a dome for the ultra fast Seahawks? Perfect place to go, IMO. The Seahawks are going to take a long time shedding their road woes rep, but this team has been great recently. The Miami game was a letdown but they did appear to get hosed on a TD* (brought up by non-Seattle fans here in the board) and got too tricky and went away from Lynch when it came time to run out the clock at midfield. So, I think they're overcoming the road problems but there's a lot of work to do. * - Im confused how karma carries over for all those that think Seattle owes it. Does it only count against the same team? Seems like lots if people thought GB deserved some help in the weeks following the Fail Mary and the opposite for Seahawks.Seattle has looked awesome, but let's remember that they normally are not the same team on the road that they are at home - 3-5 on the road and they lost at Miami just a month ago - and they will likely have to win three road games in the NFC to make it to the Super Bowl. Call me a homer, but I am going with my Broncos right now. They are 12-3, have won 10 in a row, and have a top 5 offense and defense.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Wilson was a Badger for one year...and the college season ends before it even gets cold.That said...Seattle worries me more than any other team as a Packers fan.'mad sweeney said:I'm glad the road to NO doesn't go through Denver. The altitude is much more intimidating to Seattle than the frozen tundra (Wilsons a Basger) and a dome for the ultra fast Seahawks? Perfect place to go, IMO. The Seahawks are going to take a long time shedding their road woes rep, but this team has been great recently. The Miami game was a letdown but they did appear to get hosed on a TD* (brought up by non-Seattle fans here in the board) and got too tricky and went away from Lynch when it came time to run out the clock at midfield. So, I think they're overcoming the road problems but there's a lot of work to do. * - Im confused how karma carries over for all those that think Seattle owes it. Does it only count against the same team? Seems like lots if people thought GB deserved some help in the weeks following the Fail Mary and the opposite for Seahawks.'Ghost Rider said:Seattle has looked awesome, but let's remember that they normally are not the same team on the road that they are at home - 3-5 on the road and they lost at Miami just a month ago - and they will likely have to win three road games in the NFC to make it to the Super Bowl. Call me a homer, but I am going with my Broncos right now. They are 12-3, have won 10 in a row, and have a top 5 offense and defense.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
That's true about the season ending before it gets cold, I forgot about that.Wilson was a Badger for one year...and the college season ends before it even gets cold.That said...Seattle worries me more than any other team as a Packers fan.'mad sweeney said:I'm glad the road to NO doesn't go through Denver. The altitude is much more intimidating to Seattle than the frozen tundra (Wilsons a Basger) and a dome for the ultra fast Seahawks? Perfect place to go, IMO. The Seahawks are going to take a long time shedding their road woes rep, but this team has been great recently. The Miami game was a letdown but they did appear to get hosed on a TD* (brought up by non-Seattle fans here in the board) and got too tricky and went away from Lynch when it came time to run out the clock at midfield. So, I think they're overcoming the road problems but there's a lot of work to do. * - Im confused how karma carries over for all those that think Seattle owes it. Does it only count against the same team? Seems like lots if people thought GB deserved some help in the weeks following the Fail Mary and the opposite for Seahawks.'Ghost Rider said:Seattle has looked awesome, but let's remember that they normally are not the same team on the road that they are at home - 3-5 on the road and they lost at Miami just a month ago - and they will likely have to win three road games in the NFC to make it to the Super Bowl. Call me a homer, but I am going with my Broncos right now. They are 12-3, have won 10 in a row, and have a top 5 offense and defense.
devouredbychaos
Footballguy
Just remember that Brady and BB have Jack Del Rio's number'Ghost Rider said:Seattle has looked awesome, but let's remember that they normally are not the same team on the road that they are at home - 3-5 on the road and they lost at Miami just a month ago - and they will likely have to win three road games in the NFC to make it to the Super Bowl. Call me a homer, but I am going with my Broncos right now. They are 12-3, have won 10 in a row, and have a top 5 offense and defense.
SacramentoBob
Footballguy
Armed robbery?They are taking it one way or the other.Do you want to backtrack on this yet? Or do they need to demolish a couple more teams?How many losses did the 15-1 team have (you don't have to count the playoffs)? How many losses do the 2012 Packers have?Seriously though, I don't think anyone lets the Packers "sneak up on them". Everyone knows when the offense is on they can basically score at will. Last year they were a juggernaut and most teams knew they had no shot at beating them. I don't know what has changed, but this year they are clearly flawed, just like every other team in the NFL. Do you really think the 2011 Packers lose to San Francisco, Indianapolis, and Seattle?I love that people don't think the Packers are every bit the team they were when they won the Super Bowl and then went 15-1. I wouldn't think they'd be able to sneak up on anyone.
They beat the mighty Rams by 10. Might as well hand them the Lombardi trophy now, huh?
devouredbychaos
Footballguy
What's that about a top 5 defense??Seattle has looked awesome, but let's remember that they normally are not the same team on the road that they are at home - 3-5 on the road and they lost at Miami just a month ago - and they will likely have to win three road games in the NFC to make it to the Super Bowl. Call me a homer, but I am going with my Broncos right now. They are 12-3, have won 10 in a row, and have a top 5 offense and defense.
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