UFC wagering: breaking news - judging is so terrible it got me to return here to update this thread title

[Punxsutawney Phil 900]

They criticized the UFC for rushing Yair along and not along and giving him some bad matchups.  This was a stylistically perfect matchup for both fighters.  Great fight and incredible awareness & creativity by Yair to be able to execute that elbow.  Do you think he trains for that?  Insane!  KOoTY indeed!

[Punxsutawney Phil 900]

I wish the Cowboy fight would have gone longer.  Cerrone was right on point when he was talking before the fight Perrys wrestling & jj suck!  Perry needs a guy like Usman, Till, Lawler, Stephen Thompson, etc.  The kid is a Justin Gathje, and fans love that style.

[Good Posting Judge 13,669]

Dumb casual guy question here:

Is a fight immediately stopped as soon as a guy loses consciousness? Or is it stopped to protect the ko'ed fighter from being hit, which wouldn't be necessary if a blow is landed at the bell that knocks the fighter out. Is it possible to be hit right at the bell, go unconscious after the bell, and still win a decision?

Watching back, the ref was just putting his arm up to wave it as the horn sounded.

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

3 hours ago, Punxsutawney Phil said:

I wish the Cowboy fight would have gone longer.  Cerrone was right on point when he was talking before the fight Perrys wrestling & jj suck!  Perry needs a guy like Usman, Till, Lawler, Stephen Thompson, etc.  The kid is a Justin Gathje, and fans love that style.

With the way Cerrone is prone to being hurt by body shots, I wanted that fight over as soon as possible.

And Perry's not even close to being ready for the type of guys you listed.

1 hour ago, Good Posting Judge said:

Is a fight immediately stopped as soon as a guy loses consciousness? Or is it stopped to protect the ko'ed fighter from being hit, which wouldn't be necessary if a blow is landed at the bell that knocks the fighter out. Is it possible to be hit right at the bell, go unconscious after the bell, and still win a decision?

Watching back, the ref was just putting his arm up to wave it as the horn sounded.

It depends on the ref. The fight should be stopped immediately when a fighter falls like Jung did yesterday. Sometimes, though, refs aren't all the ball.

However, if the fight hasn't been called by the horn, the fighter is supposed to be able to get up on his own and get back to his corner. If he can't, the fight could be called at the 5:00-minute mark.

[Punxsutawney Phil 900]

2 hours ago, Clayton Gray said:

With the way Cerrone is prone to being hurt by body shots, I wanted that fight over as soon as possible.

And Perry's not even close to being ready for the type of guys you listed.

 

I agree, all the guys I listed are superior to Perry.  I'm just trying to make the point that he needs matchups with stand up guys.   The stand up / push fwd style is a crowd pleaser.  Mike needs to get his ground game up though.  Cowboy knew it sucked thats why he was going for the clinch takedown immediately.  

[EYLive 5,337]

4 hours ago, Good Posting Judge said:

Dumb casual guy question here:

Is a fight immediately stopped as soon as a guy loses consciousness? Or is it stopped to protect the ko'ed fighter from being hit, which wouldn't be necessary if a blow is landed at the bell that knocks the fighter out. Is it possible to be hit right at the bell, go unconscious after the bell, and still win a decision?

Michael Bisping was knocked unconscious by Anderson Silva at the end of a round. The ref allowed the fight to continue and Bisping (who is British) won a crooked decision in England.

[Bobcat10 1,979]

Guess I should find some video for the last 2 matches.

 

What happened in the Pena match? The numbers say Trizano pretty much owned him, but good ‘ol Sal gave the decision to Pena. 

[ILUVBEER99 1,369]

Insane.  The Korean Zombie was up and scorecards confirmed he had fight locked up before the KO.  He was up 39-37 on (2) of the judges cards going into the 5th round.  One judge had it even.

Before the KO there was no way it was gonna be a 10-8 round, so it was a 100% win if he doesn't get KO'ed in the final second.

[EYLive 5,337]

We saw another timeout for a low blow in the Pennington/DeRandamie fight. Is the vag an especially vulnerable spot like nuts are? The ladies get 5 minutes for a groin shot but I wonder if it's any worse than getting hit in the kidneys or chin.

[GOB 2,567]

4 hours ago, Punxsutawney Phil said:

I agree, all the guys I listed are superior to Perry.  I'm just trying to make the point that he needs matchups with stand up guys.   The stand up / push fwd style is a crowd pleaser.  Mike needs to get his ground game up though.  Cowboy knew it sucked thats why he was going for the clinch takedown immediately.  

Since when is Usman a stand up fighter?

Mike Perry is a brawler and fans love him. Hell, I love him. But the UFC basically used him up and he is near the end of the line already.

[NewlyRetired 16,758]

1 hour ago, EYLive said:

We saw another timeout for a low blow in the Pennington/DeRandamie fight. Is the vag an especially vulnerable spot like nuts are? The ladies get 5 minutes for a groin shot but I wonder if it's any worse than getting hit in the kidneys or chin.

I read this a while ago about said topic when this came up on reddit a while back

===========

As I said in the other comment I have experience in martial arts, and I've seen several unfortunate women take kicks to the nether regions, women who stupidly didn't wear a pelvic protector, assuming that since they didn't have balls they wouldn't need them. That is a sensitive, fragile area for women as well, it's just largely unknown because it's a lot harder to hit than it is on a guy. A strong enough blow can damage the tissues of the vulva, cause ripping or tearing, and it can also break or shatter the pelvis. I may not be a woman, but I've had the training to know the medical facts about how physical blows affect parts of the body on both genders.

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

2 hours ago, Bobcat10 said:

Guess I should find some video for the last 2 matches.

 

What happened in the Pena match? The numbers say Trizano pretty much owned him, but good ‘ol Sal gave the decision to Pena. 

 

Yes, you should watch the last two.

And Pena didn't seem to have a real plan when "pick my opponent apart standing" didn't work.

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

4 minutes ago, NewlyRetired said:

I read this a while ago about said topic when this came up on reddit a while back

===========

As I said in the other comment I have experience in martial arts, and I've seen several unfortunate women take kicks to the nether regions, women who stupidly didn't wear a pelvic protector, assuming that since they didn't have balls they wouldn't need them. That is a sensitive, fragile area for women as well, it's just largely unknown because it's a lot harder to hit than it is on a guy. A strong enough blow can damage the tissues of the vulva, cause ripping or tearing, and it can also break or shatter the pelvis. I may not be a woman, but I've had the training to know the medical facts about how physical blows affect parts of the body on both genders.

Uh, that sounds terrible.

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

10 minutes ago, GOB said:

Mike Perry is a brawler and fans love him. Hell, I love him. But the UFC basically used him up and he is near the end of the line already.

I agree with all of that, except I can't stand him. Dude's a bigtime turd who talks like he's on top of the heap.

[EYLive 5,337]

2 hours ago, NewlyRetired said:

I read this a while ago about said topic when this came up on reddit a while back

===========

As I said in the other comment I have experience in martial arts, and I've seen several unfortunate women take kicks to the nether regions, women who stupidly didn't wear a pelvic protector, assuming that since they didn't have balls they wouldn't need them. That is a sensitive, fragile area for women as well, it's just largely unknown because it's a lot harder to hit than it is on a guy. A strong enough blow can damage the tissues of the vulva, cause ripping or tearing, and it can also break or shatter the pelvis. I may not be a woman, but I've had the training to know the medical facts about how physical blows affect parts of the body on both genders.

I'll take that guy's word for it. It's just weird that we never hear about it in combat sports or otherwise. Everyone knows a hit to the balls is extremely painful but you never see the female version mentioned in media/entertainment.

[NewlyRetired 16,758]

9 hours ago, EYLive said:

I'll take that guy's word for it. It's just weird that we never hear about it in combat sports or otherwise. Everyone knows a hit to the balls is extremely painful but you never see the female version mentioned in media/entertainment.

I have no idea but I am sure the feelings are MUCH different.

The point he made about it not happening much to women because of the location of the equipment is interesting.

With guys, most sports can present this issue but with girls, it sounds like you basically need a c_nt punt for it to happen which is fairly rare in the normal sports women participate in.

[Abrantes 1,931]

Seen a bunch of people talking up Cerrone vs. McGregor since this last card, and it feels like I'm taking crazy pills. I certainly don't care about Cerrone like that.

[AhrnCityPahnder 4,607]

3 minutes ago, Abrantes said:

Seen a bunch of people talking up Cerrone vs. McGregor since this last card, and it feels like I'm taking crazy pills. I certainly don't care about Cerrone like that.

CmG will wreck him.  don't really wanna see it. 

[scoobus 1,230]

Mcgregor needs a fight to gain some momentum. Seems like a fun fight. 

[Abrantes 1,931]

I mean, I do love seeing Cerrone getting smashed.

In more important fight news though, it looks like we're getting Masvidal vs. Nick f'n Diaz, homies. 

[Punxsutawney Phil 900]

Good fight for Diaz.  I like both his and Masividals styles.

Everyone really thinks Cerrone is easy work for CM?  I think Cerrone is a more well rounded fighter.  There was a reason Cowboy moved up though.  He started sucking at 155 and the weight cut was taking too much out of him.  Iirc from Rogan.  Masvidal was also saying he wanted to go try 155 recently.  They need a 165.

[NewlyRetired 16,758]

I really enjoy MMA but this is by far the worst part of the sport for me.  How can any governing body watch this and not be alarmed is beyond me.  The poor girl is probably in the top .01% of humans in terms of being in shape and she can barely stand up

https://twitter.com/MMAFighting/status/1063410664629141505

[EYLive 5,337]

The fighters, coaches and managers need to pick the correct division for each person. I'm not sure how Calvillo can cut weight the point of collapse, miss weight by 3 pounds and still believe she's a strawweight.

[AhrnCityPahnder 4,607]

13 hours ago, Punxsutawney Phil said:

Good fight for Diaz.  I like both his and Masividals styles.

Everyone really thinks Cerrone is easy work for CM?  I think Cerrone is a more well rounded fighter.  There was a reason Cowboy moved up though.  He started sucking at 155 and the weight cut was taking too much out of him.  Iirc from Rogan.  Masvidal was also saying he wanted to go try 155 recently.  They need a 165.

Cerrone is really good everywhere but not great anywhere, imo.  

 

Any fighter that wants to stand and throw with CMG is probably in for a long night.  Cerrone isn't good enough with offensive takedowns to take over the fight that way.  Despite how he looked against Khabob, CMG is better at escaping bottom positions than Cerrone is imposing them.

 

Plus, I bet Cerrone believes he's good enough to throw hands with Connor and see what happens.   CmG finishes this fight in under 2 rounds.

Edited November 17, 2018 by AhrnCityPahnder

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

So Phil Davis is fulfilling about 5% of his potential. What a waste.

[Ted Stickles 232]

That first fight on the main card was a very enjoyable slugfest 

[Abrantes 1,931]

12:30 here already and I'll probably stay up just until Botelho/Calvillo. Botelho looked great in her UFC showings so far and I was curious to see how she'd fare against more of a tenacious wrestler type, but with Calvillo looking to be at death's door at the weigh-in (seriously, that was just scary, hope she moves up), it's hard to know what to expect.

Only other fight I'd care to watch is the main, where I'm torn 'cause they're both super likable and damn good fighters. It's so much easier when it's a nice guy against the Colbys of the world.

[Good Posting Judge 13,669]

Magny just got the brakes beaten off him. /expert analysis

[Good Posting Judge 13,669]

Oscar is SKIING:

https://twitter.com/streetfitebanch/status/1065038577447432192

[Craig_MiamiFL 2,560]

Probably the last time we see Oscar in the MMA world.

God good that was cringe to watch. Watching that 2 minute clip put me to sleep.

[Good Posting Judge 13,669]

1 hour ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

Probably the last time we see Oscar in the MMA world.

God good that was cringe to watch. Watching that 2 minute clip put me to sleep.

Nobody's (literally) buying this nonsense, right?

[AhrnCityPahnder 4,607]

That was one of those  " __________ shreds" videos, right?   

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

Video is gone.

[modogg 4,802]

On 11/17/2018 at 3:33 PM, Clayton Gray said:

So Phil Davis is fulfilling about 5% of his potential. What a waste.

yeah i would love to figure out why some guys with such high potential never reach it. You have to think a big factor is training and camp they are at training correctly, but some of the really good camps have had fighters crap out too

[modogg 4,802]

So i can't figure out if i am a bad MMA fan or what, but i am definitely more excited for Tito-Chuck 3 than the UFC card this weekend.

Line is Chuck -260, Tito +220.   i guess the line makers haven't realized Chuck retired like 5 years ago? I think a bet on Tito isn't too bad of an idea

[Craig_MiamiFL 2,560]

20 hours ago, Good Posting Judge said:

Nobody's (literally) buying this nonsense, right?

I really don't think I've ever witnessed a more lifeless promo from a promoter in my life. Saying more or less "I really dont know the other fighters on the card" probably isn't going to garner buys. That said, I'll watch it before whatever the UFC card is.

I think Oscar's got a reality check as we've gotten closer to the fight. Just read they lowered the PPV a couple days ago to $39.99. Alternatively read you can get for $19.99 thru the Fite TV app on black Friday. https://mmainsight.com/ufc/chuck-liddell-vs-tito-ortiz-3-pay-per-view-prices-lowered    

LOL I'm too lazy to look but it seems like Chuck retired like a decade ago. Not a gambler but I'd bet Tito. I'd wager we'll see a chemically enhanced Chuck

Edited November 22, 2018 by Craig_MiamiFL

[Good Posting Judge 13,669]

47 minutes ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

I really don't think I've ever witnessed a more lifeless promo from a promoter in my life. Saying more or less "I really dont know the other fighters on the card" probably isn't going to garner buys. That said, I'll watch it before whatever the UFC card is.

I think Oscar's got a reality check as we've gotten closer to the fight. Just read they lowered the PPV a couple days ago to $39.99. Alternatively read you can get for $19.99 thru the Fite TV app on black Friday. https://mmainsight.com/ufc/chuck-liddell-vs-tito-ortiz-3-pay-per-view-prices-lowered    

LOL I'm too lazy to look but it seems like Chuck retired like a decade ago. Not a gambler but I'd bet Tito. I'd wager we'll see a chemically enhanced Chuck

He's a very good boxing promoter, for better or worse. You'd think he'd be a bit better prepared. He might also just be ####### coked off his ###.

[scoobus 1,230]

1 hour ago, modogg said:

So i can't figure out if i am a bad MMA fan or what, but i am definitely more excited for Tito-Chuck 3 than the UFC card this weekend.

Line is Chuck -260, Tito +220.   i guess the line makers haven't realized Chuck retired like 5 years ago? I think a bet on Tito isn't too bad of an idea

Wow is that really the line?  I'd be on Tito all day.  Chuck has looked horrendously slow hitting pads, and I'm guessing his gas tank will be pretty bad as well.

I'd probably drop $5 max to see this if it was convenient, gotta think the PPV doesn't do very well.

[AhrnCityPahnder 4,607]

Agree that at +220 Egghead Tito is the right call here

 

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

I would have guessed the exact opposite line.

[GOB 2,567]

Yeah not sure where you are getting Tito at + money. All the books I've seen have Tito -300ish

[NewlyRetired 16,758]

Chael Sonnen‏Verified account @ChaelSonnen

They just posted Chuck Liddell’s open work out. That’s the first time I’ve seen someone lose a shadow boxing match.

[Craig_MiamiFL 2,560]

De la Hoya reportedly didn't even show up for the Chuck "lie Dell" and Ortiz ceremonial weigh in.

Would be interested in seeing those contracts as de la hoyas been pimping their paydays and attendance. But it's fairly obvious this is gonna tank hard. (And likely why de la hoyas checked out leading up to this)

[Craig_MiamiFL 2,560]

On 11/21/2018 at 7:21 PM, Craig_MiamiFL said:

 

I think Oscar's got a reality check as we've gotten closer to the fight. Just read they lowered the PPV a couple days ago to $39.99. Alternatively read you can get for $19.99 thru the Fite TV app on black Friday. https://mmainsight.com/ufc/chuck-liddell-vs-tito-ortiz-3-pay-per-view-prices-lowered    

Update: Fite TV wound up not being able to do the $19.99 promotion.  

https://mmajunkie.com/2018/11/dont-count-that-19-99-deal-for-liddell-ortiz-3-among-your-black-friday-specials-anymore

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

Here are the reported payouts for the entire card (except the amateur bouts), via MMA Fighting:

• Chuck Liddell: $250,000 (no win bonus)
• Tito Ortiz: $200,000 (no win bonus)
• Tom Lawlor: $25,000 (no win bonus)
• Deron Winn: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Efrain Escudero: $10,000 ($10,000 win bonus)
• Gleison Tibau: $10,000 ($10,000 win bonus)
• Walel Watson: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Ricardo Palacios: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Albert Morales: $2,500 ($2,500 win bonus)
• James Barnes: $2,500 ($2,500 win bonus)
• Oscar Cota: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Jay Silva: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Fernie Garcia: $1,500 ($1,500 win bonus)
• Joe Roye: $1,250 ($1,250 win bonus)
• Jose Huerta: $1,250 ($1,250 win bonus)
• Francisco Estrada: $1,000 ($1,000 win bonus)
• Keith Berry: $3,000 ($3,000 win bonus)
• Joseph Henle: $3,000 ($3,000 win bonus)
• Craig Wilkerson: $1,500 ($1,500 win bonus)
• Joshua Jones: $1,500 ($1,500 win bonus)
• Johnny Cisneros: $2,000 ($2,000 win bonus)
• Dave Terrel: $2,500 ($2,500 win bonus)

[kutta 5,529]

12 minutes ago, Clayton Gray said:

Here are the reported payouts for the entire card (except the amateur bouts), via MMA Fighting:

• Chuck Liddell: $250,000 (no win bonus)
• Tito Ortiz: $200,000 (no win bonus)
• Tom Lawlor: $25,000 (no win bonus)
• Deron Winn: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Efrain Escudero: $10,000 ($10,000 win bonus)
• Gleison Tibau: $10,000 ($10,000 win bonus)
• Walel Watson: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Ricardo Palacios: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Albert Morales: $2,500 ($2,500 win bonus)
• James Barnes: $2,500 ($2,500 win bonus)
• Oscar Cota: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Jay Silva: $5,000 ($5,000 win bonus)
• Fernie Garcia: $1,500 ($1,500 win bonus)
• Joe Roye: $1,250 ($1,250 win bonus)
• Jose Huerta: $1,250 ($1,250 win bonus)
• Francisco Estrada: $1,000 ($1,000 win bonus)
• Keith Berry: $3,000 ($3,000 win bonus)
• Joseph Henle: $3,000 ($3,000 win bonus)
• Craig Wilkerson: $1,500 ($1,500 win bonus)
• Joshua Jones: $1,500 ($1,500 win bonus)
• Johnny Cisneros: $2,000 ($2,000 win bonus)
• Dave Terrel: $2,500 ($2,500 win bonus)

It’s amazing how little these guys make.

But they got my $39.99. I’ll be watching - the wife’s all-time favorite fighter is Chuck, so there’s no way she’s not seeing this.

[NewlyRetired 16,758]

6 minutes ago, kutta said:

It’s amazing how little these guys make.

But they got my $39.99. I’ll be watching - the wife’s all-time favorite fighter is Chuck, so there’s no way she’s not seeing this.

I read that Chuck and Tito's total pay is tied highly to attendance and ppv numbers.

[Bobcat10 1,979]

PPV starts at 9pm for anyone looking to tune into the main event only, so it will likely be earlier than a UFC main event (even though this card has 6 PPV bouts).

[Clayton Gray 2,112]

3 hours ago, kutta said:

It’s amazing how little these guys make.

 

There are three fighters making more than the UFC gives a debut fighter.

[kutta 5,529]

44 minutes ago, Clayton Gray said:

There are three fighters making more than the UFC gives a debut fighter.

And that’s just crazy.

ETA: To be clear, I think Chuck and Tito are making about the correct amount. It’s just amazing to me that there’s guys who train and train for weeks and make $1500 for a fight.

Edited November 25, 2018 by kutta