-fish- Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 (edited) 9 minutes ago, ekbeats said: Dude stay down. You look foolish. funny, cause i think the same of you. only my arguments are based on facts. Edited June 12 by -fish- 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 34 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said: I think fish has been pretty clear about his thoughts. just curious why specifically others say that Chicago's laws are so strict or draconian. All I see is a blanket statement to that effect, but not sure I've seen reasons why people think they are some of the strictest in the country. @ekbeats - can you answer this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 From what I am reading, the laws that Chicago has doesn't apply even to it's surrounding suburbs? Is that correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 1 minute ago, KarmaPolice said: From what I am reading, the laws that Chicago has doesn't apply even to it's surrounding suburbs? Is that correct? no, they don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 7 minutes ago, -fish- said: no, they don't. Just curious what the point really is then. Was it some pissing contest between Chicago mayor and IL SC or something? I am having trouble understanding this from either side - why people would think it would be effective and why the opposition would point to this as being a failure of strict laws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 1 minute ago, KarmaPolice said: Just curious what the point really is then. Was it some pissing contest between Chicago mayor and IL SC or something? I am having trouble understanding this from either side - why people would think it would be effective and why the opposition would point to this as being a failure of strict laws. the NRA talking point is "Chicago has the strictest gun laws in the country, but they have high gun violence.". The truth is that the city had a handgun ban, it was overturned, and gun violence increased. They still have an assault weapons ban, which is unusual for a city. So they have "strict gun laws." But most of the gun violence is handguns, which aren't really regulated anymore. Illinois has separate state laws relating to concealed carry, open carry and gun sales. They are fairly typical for non-southern states. The surrounding states have looser laws for gun sales. That's resulted in a significant amount of out of state guns being used in Chicago gun violence. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 facts are hard for some people Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BladeRunner Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) 9 minutes ago, -fish- said: 9 minutes ago, -fish- said: facts are hard for some people I haven't seen a self own like yours in a long time. Good work. Edited June 13 by BladeRunner 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekbeats Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) 36 minutes ago, -fish- said: funny, cause i think the same of you. only my arguments are based on facts. Helpful hint - when @FairWarningtalked about Chicago having strict gun laws he wasn’t talking relative to other cities in Illinois, and he wasn’t talking about a comparison over time. Chicago is subject to Illinois gun laws, and a simple Google will show you that Illinois consistently ranks as having strict gun laws relative to other states - almost always in the top 10. Like I said, stay down on this one. In your job you get paid for arguing a failed case. In here you just lose credibility. Edited June 13 by ekbeats 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 9 minutes ago, ekbeats said: Helpful hint - when @FairWarningtalked about Chicago having strict gun laws he wasn’t talking relative to other cities in Illinois, and he wasn’t talking about a comparison over time. Chicago is subject to Illinois gun laws, and a simple Google will show you that Illinois consistently ranks as having strict gun laws relative to other states - almost always in the top 10. Like I said, stay down on this one. In your job you get paid for arguing a failed case. In here you just lose credibility. this is just sadly mistaken. if you're talking about city laws, you're comparing to other cities, not states. the Chicago trope is false, a and Illinois laws aren't particularly more strict than any other non-southern states. you keep trying hard, but your facts just don't support the arguments. you reek of desperation because you have no facts to base them on. this Chicago argument has been destroyed over and over. only the NRA and its true believers keep making it. it's really a waste of time to keep debunking it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 such a bad, tired argument oops 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWarning Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) 2 hours ago, KarmaPolice said: I take fish's point to be that Chicago had even stricter laws, and predictably shootings went up when they became less strict (although stricter after that than other areas and cities) His point is wrong though. He also had no problem bringing up Austin’s mass shootinf but neglected the mass shooting of 10 in CHICAGO last night. shootinngs went up in Chicago in the last year because of BLM and defunding police, not any particular softening laws. Edited June 13 by FairWarning 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 28 minutes ago, FairWarning said: His point is wrong though. He also had no problem bringing up Austin’s mass shootinf but neglected the mass shooting of 10 in CHICAGO last night. shootinngs went up in Chicago in the last year because of BLM and defunding police, not any particular softening laws. Did anyone try to say Chicago softened their gun control laws last year? Or did you make that up as a straw man? You're the one falsely saying Chicago has strict gun laws. Am i surprised there are a lot of handgun shootings in Chicago since 2010? Absolutely not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 31 minutes ago, FairWarning said: His point is wrong though. He also had no problem bringing up Austin’s mass shootinf but neglected the mass shooting of 10 in CHICAGO last night. shootinngs went up in Chicago in the last year because of BLM and defunding police, not any particular softening laws. so you are saying shootings didn't go up starting after he claims? (was it 2008?) this should be a pretty easy stat to verify, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 So, what exactly makes Chicago gun laws "strict"?? is it the assault weapon ban? do they have no sellers in the city? long wait time? I am trying to wrap my head around this and IMO just saying they are strict isn't enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 let's get back to the point of my original post. Texas just became a case study of some of the loosest gun laws in country. If gun violence goes up, can we agree that's a failure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 3 hours ago, FairWarning said: His point is wrong though. He also had no problem bringing up Austin’s mass shootinf but neglected the mass shooting of 10 in CHICAGO last night. shootinngs went up in Chicago in the last year because of BLM and defunding police, not any particular softening laws. Texas' statewide law allowed permitless carry statewide. It supposedly will reduce crime. You cited Chicago's city law. You were wrong. What don't you understand about the difference between state laws and city laws? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 2 hours ago, KarmaPolice said: so you are saying shootings didn't go up starting after he claims? (was it 2008?) this should be a pretty easy stat to verify, right? 2010 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squistion Posted June 13 Author Share Posted June 13 Pulse shooting survivor Brandon Wolf to CNN: "I am existentially exhausted. I am so tired of statements. I am so tired of hashtags and thoughts and prayers. I am so tired of archaic Senate procedure being used as an excuse to do nothing while people in our communities are dying." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 you want 20 hours ago, -fish- said: But most of the gun violence is handguns, which aren't really regulated anymore. there are no regulations really anymore on handguns in Chicago ? link please 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal El Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 5 hours ago, squistion said: Pulse shooting survivor Brandon Wolf to CNN: "I am existentially exhausted. I am so tired of statements. I am so tired of hashtags and thoughts and prayers. I am so tired of archaic Senate procedure being used as an excuse to do nothing while people in our communities are dying." I mean, he’s got a point. Prayer works, but it also often involves us doing something that God has said to do. The nothing done so far is not helping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 Yeah, this is normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekbeats Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) 7 minutes ago, -fish- said: Yeah, this is normal. I’ve got an idea - let’s defund the police! Edited June 13 by ekbeats 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 2 hours ago, ekbeats said: I’ve got an idea - let’s defund the police! Has anyone suggested that as a solution to gun violence? That's your response to four mass murders? Repulsive. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 22 hours ago, -fish- said: Yeah, this is normal. why are people so mean/evil ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 19 hours ago, -fish- said: Has anyone suggested that as a solution to gun violence? That's your response to four mass murders? Repulsive. no more repulsive than using those tragedies for political gain to ban guns that are used in less murders than knives/hammers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 On 6/12/2021 at 6:54 PM, -fish- said: But most of the gun violence is handguns, which aren't really regulated anymore. 2nd request for link please to support the above Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FBG Moderator Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 Stop with the laughing emoji's as a response. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodycutter Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 Alabama and Georgia shootings racially motivated A 39-year-old man accused of shooting and wounding five people in Alabama and Georgia told police his assaults were racially motivated, and he was targeting white men, a detective testified Monday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 (edited) 3 hours ago, kodycutter said: Alabama and Georgia shootings racially motivated A 39-year-old man accused of shooting and wounding five people in Alabama and Georgia told police his assaults were racially motivated, and he was targeting white men, a detective testified Monday. that won't make headline news, not good agenda material I was in a courtroom today and watched case after case and I never saw the judge place blame on any objects, the blame was on the people and the choices they made, or decisions they made. Never blame on the drugs, or cars, or anything like that fantastic concept isn't it ? Edited June 15 by Stealthycat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekbeats Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 On 6/14/2021 at 6:39 PM, kodycutter said: Alabama and Georgia shootings racially motivated A 39-year-old man accused of shooting and wounding five people in Alabama and Georgia told police his assaults were racially motivated, and he was targeting white men, a detective testified Monday. “I’ll have Things You Won’t See on CNN for $500 Alex”. Actually, before sho and squid come in here saying that CNN did cover this, they only covered the initial shooting and not today’s learnings about the killer’s anti-white racism. Not a word about it. Yeah, no Liberal bias right tim? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 53 minutes ago, ekbeats said: “I’ll have Things You Won’t See on CNN for $500 Alex”. Actually, before sho and squid come in here saying that CNN did cover this, they only covered the initial shooting and not today’s learnings about the killer’s anti-white racism. Not a word about it. Yeah, no Liberal bias right tim? he still shot people, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 Love the obsession about what CNN does and doesn't cover from the right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 14 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said: Love the obsession about what CNN does and doesn't cover from the right. its am amazing things to watch isn't it ? I clicked CNN the other day and there were 4 headlines on Trump - why ? He's gone, why continue the narrative on Trump .... oh, there were no headlines on Biden. Its almost like CNN wants us to only thing "hate Trump" and forget about Biden ...hmmmmmm Same with guns and crime. The only "news" on guns is bad news. Never good news. Its almost like there is an agenda ..... same with what was posted above. White shoots black after saying it was racist and that would have been national news. Black shoots white and says it was racist motivated .... crickets. its a consistency that everyone should see if they'll just look, media doesn't report fairly, equally or why? example - why wasn't this national news ? self defense - a person used a gun legally to save their lives from a criminal. THAT is what guns and self defense is for - and no national news reports it. I submit if every incident like this was reported nationally, people would stop and think hey ... its a good thing people have guns to defend themselves ... which wouldn't be anti-gun and which would hurt the Democratic party's agenda ..... and so, these stories don't get run https://www.denverpost.com/2021/06/13/littleton-intruder-killed-self-defense/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 40 minutes ago, Stealthycat said: its am amazing things to watch isn't it ? Wouldn't know. We all know what the cable shows bring to the table, so I don't bother watching. Some of you guys seem to enjoy being angry and bitter, so I guess knock yourself out by watching CNN and #####ing about what they cover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 28 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said: Wouldn't know. We all know what the cable shows bring to the table, so I don't bother watching. Some of you guys seem to enjoy being angry and bitter, so I guess knock yourself out by watching CNN and #####ing about what they cover. CNN is a core news source for the left as Fox is for the right I'm not so much angry and bitter, I pay attention to what's happening and try to understand the WHY behind it all can't understand anything if I only pay attention to one side Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 5 minutes ago, Stealthycat said: CNN is a core news source for the left as Fox is for the right I'm not so much angry and bitter, I pay attention to what's happening and try to understand the WHY behind it all can't understand anything if I only pay attention to one side Understanding both sides of the aisle does not require you watching Fox and CNN. You know the why - it's mostly clickbait journalism. Most admit here that neither are a good source of news, but still people like you continue to use them. Who cares if they are popular if they aren't good sources of news? So in your pursuit of "understanding", you are freely admitting to wasting your time consuming stuff that isn't great info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 1 hour ago, KarmaPolice said: Understanding both sides of the aisle does not require you watching Fox and CNN. You know the why - it's mostly clickbait journalism. Most admit here that neither are a good source of news, but still people like you continue to use them. Who cares if they are popular if they aren't good sources of news? So in your pursuit of "understanding", you are freely admitting to wasting your time consuming stuff that isn't great info. I think by ignoring the most popular media sites I'd lose a good bit of insight on the liberal and conservative ways that are being distributed if I go to a site that has 4,000 viewers, that's not going to really give me an idea of what is being fed to the public as opposed to a site that has 40,000,000 viewers I go to a lot of sites though, not just 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 26 minutes ago, Stealthycat said: I think by ignoring the most popular media sites I'd lose a good bit of insight on the liberal and conservative ways that are being distributed if I go to a site that has 4,000 viewers, that's not going to really give me an idea of what is being fed to the public as opposed to a site that has 40,000,000 viewers I go to a lot of sites though, not just 2 Lol - by going to the sites to get an understanding what bs is being fed to the public, you are mostly consuming the same bs. I know- you listed the other "news" sites you also use, and it makes sense and correlates to your posting style Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 27 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said: Lol - by going to the sites to get an understanding what bs is being fed to the public, you are mostly consuming the same bs. I know- you listed the other "news" sites you also use, and it makes sense and correlates to your posting style probably true none the less, its my opinion that all the BS being fed is the source of the anti-gun hysteria that has no logical or reasonable foundation .... yet it is believed by so many people why ? media weaponizes information and releases it with clear agenda - they also hold back information with clear agenda as well know your enemy right ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Z Machine Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 4 minutes ago, Stealthycat said: its my opinion that all the BS being fed is the source of the anti-gun hysteria that has no logical or reasonable foundation You think there's no foundation for the opinion for people to be for gun restrictions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 A new deflection. we can't justify all of these mass shootings, so we'll change the subject to media bias even though nobody was discussing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 3 minutes ago, -fish- said: A new deflection. we can't justify all of these mass shootings, so we'll change the subject to media bias even though nobody was discussing it. what I find amusing is this is the guy that seems to be strongly arguing the position that if you watch and listen to violent things you will be violent. you know- evidently you become what you surround yourself with. So following that logic, what happens when he surrounds himself and consumes a bunch of misinformation and click bait crap produced to rile him up and make him angry and paranoid about the other side? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 18 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said: what I find amusing is this is the guy that seems to be strongly arguing the position that if you watch and listen to violent things you will be violent. you know- evidently you become what you surround yourself with. So following that logic, what happens when he surrounds himself and consumes a bunch of misinformation and click bait crap produced to rile him up and make him angry and paranoid about the other side? watching how media reports things isn't the same as digesting/idolizing/glamourizing lets see an example of my point - shall we? https://www.foxnews.com/politics/22-states-ninth-circuit-california-assault-weapons-ban FIRST ON FOX: A coalition of 22 states on Wednesday announced it has filed a court brief in support of a decision that struck down California’s ban on "assault weapons" – which the liberal state has now appealed to the Ninth Circuit Court. The coalition, led by Arizona, is urging the Ninth Circuit to uphold a lower court decision to strike down the three-decade ban on the state’s definition of illegal military-style rifles. A federal judge overturned the ban with a permanent injunction earlier this month but has given the state 30 days to appeal -- which it is doing. I'd say that is newsworthy for most outlets. Lets see if CNN is running the above story at all https://www.cnn.com/search?size=10&q=A coalition of 22 states I tried several key word searches and couldn't find anything why ? I can find articles on CNN bashing the judge that overturned the CA Assault weapons ban https://www.cnn.com/search?size=10&q=California assault&category=us but nothing on all the states gathering in support - why ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealthycat Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 23 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said: happens when he surrounds himself and consumes a bunch of misinformation and click bait crap produced to rile him up is that what you think CNN is ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 28 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said: what I find amusing is this is the guy that seems to be strongly arguing the position that if you watch and listen to violent things you will be violent. you know- evidently you become what you surround yourself with. So following that logic, what happens when he surrounds himself and consumes a bunch of misinformation and click bait crap produced to rile him up and make him angry and paranoid about the other side? I think that speaks for itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 12 minutes ago, Stealthycat said: is that what you think CNN is ? pretty much, especially the cable side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaPolice Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 6 minutes ago, -fish- said: I think that speaks for itself. pretty much. it's probably a big reason why some of the posters post like they do- other side is terrible, doom and gloom, their coming for our stuff, etc, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekbeats Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 13 hours ago, -fish- said: he still shot people, right? Right - focus on the method rather than what gave rise to the act. He was a convicted felon who stole a handgun. He was also a racist who hated white people. What do you propose we do about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-fish- Posted June 16 Share Posted June 16 1 minute ago, ekbeats said: Right - focus on the method rather than what gave rise to the act. He was a convicted felon who stole a handgun. He was also a racist who hated white people. What do you propose we do about that? Other than secure storage laws, make it more difficult for mentally ill former felons to obtain guns by taking as many as possible out of circulation, creating a national gun registry, allowing the ATF to create a searchable database, institute buy-back programs, close private sale and gunshow loopholes and adopt red flag laws. What I wouldn't do is blame CNN for biased reporting, because that's ridiculous and irrelevant. It must be strange to spend your life trying to find reasons to be outraged by liberals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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