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Just now, -fish- said:

Other than secure storage laws, make it more difficult for mentally ill former felons to obtain guns by taking as many as possible out of circulation, creating a national gun registry, allowing the ATF to create a searchable database, institute buy-back programs, close private sale and gunshow loopholes and adopt red flag laws. 

What I wouldn't do is blame CNN for biased reporting, because that's ridiculous and irrelevant.   It must be strange to spend your life trying to find reasons to be outraged by liberals.

None of which would have stopped this from happening.

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Here’s an idea - let’s address the root causes of all the violence and crime.  You know - the stuff that Liberals created with all their race baiting, anti-police rhetoric, and mismanagement of cities like Baltimore, Chicago, St. Louis, New York….

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1 hour ago, KarmaPolice said:

pretty much, especially the cable side.  

 

we can agree with that - and equally too foxnews caters to conservatives 

both have influence on what people see/think and therefore believe

story time - when I was a kid, Smokey the Bear came to school. "Only YOU can prevent forest fires" he said .......... and all us kids? we believed it because that's what we saw and was told

40 years later, we know Smokey the Bear was responsible for great damages to the forests of the USA. By NOT allowing burns, the underbrush grew and grew and when the burns finally did happen, they burned so hot they scorched the landscapes bare. Or, they were suppressed which hurt certain flora/fauna which in turn hurt the ecosystems. Controlled burns are now understood and Smokey is now the leader of "only YOU can prevent "wildfires" "

my point is, far too many people hear it, see it and thus, believe it ............. without questioning it and I hate that

without browsing CNN and FOX and other outlets, I'd not keep any touch at all on the pulse of what they're spewing

 

 

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34 minutes ago, ekbeats said:

None of which would have stopped this from happening.

You have no possible way to say that for certain.   What we do know is that the current laws are ineffective.

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14 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said:

the root cause of everything - Liberals!!! 

must suck to have such distain for almost 1/2 the population of the country.  

Wow, urban areas tend to vote democrat.  Cities have more gun crime.  It must be those liberals!   Weird that republican-led cities have a high incidence of gun crimes too.   Must be because of something else.    Maybe they aren't republican enough.

Just pure nonsense.

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Just now, Stealthycat said:

we can agree with that - and equally too foxnews caters to conservatives 

both have influence on what people see/think and therefore believe

story time - when I was a kid, Smokey the Bear came to school. "Only YOU can prevent forest fires" he said .......... and all us kids? we believed it because that's what we saw and was told

40 years later, we know Smokey the Bear was responsible for great damages to the forests of the USA. By NOT allowing burns, the underbrush grew and grew and when the burns finally did happen, they burned so hot they scorched the landscapes bare. Or, they were suppressed which hurt certain flora/fauna which in turn hurt the ecosystems. Controlled burns are now understood and Smokey is now the leader of "only YOU can prevent "wildfires" "

my point is, far too many people hear it, see it and thus, believe it ............. without questioning it and I hate that

without browsing CNN and FOX and other outlets, I'd not keep any touch at all on the pulse of what they're spewing

 

 

my points are: 

1.  by doing that you are choosing with your clicks and time to support this bs that is being spewed to the masses.  

2.  you seem to post like you think you are in the minority that aren't influenced by it and can tell the difference.  

3.  of all the outlets you listed before, nothing was actual decent news sources.  if I remember right, CNN and Fox were about as highly rated as your news got.  

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1 minute ago, -fish- said:

Wow, urban areas tend to vote democrat.  Cities have more gun crime.  It must be those liberals!   Weird that republican-led cities have a high incidence of gun crimes too.   Must be because of something else.    Maybe they aren't republican enough.

Just pure nonsense.

probably just RINOs ;)

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34 minutes ago, -fish- said:

Other than secure storage laws, make it more difficult for mentally ill former felons to obtain guns by taking as many as possible out of circulation, creating a national gun registry, allowing the ATF to create a searchable database, institute buy-back programs, close private sale and gunshow loopholes and adopt red flag laws. 

none of that stops a criminal like in the link 

35 minutes ago, -fish- said:

What I wouldn't do is blame CNN for biased reporting, because that's ridiculous and irrelevant.   It must be strange to spend your life trying to find reasons to be outraged by liberals

what CNN does, it they make it look like guns are bad - never used for self defense, never used to stop the bad guys ............ they intentionally NEVER report those things because if their audience never reads the articles on pro-gun's its way way easier to believe the anti-gun articles

 

I ask now for the 3rd time link that shows "handguns, which aren't really regulated anymore"

I submit they absolutely ARE regulated - with background checks, age laws, felons can't have them, they can and cannot be taken in certain places and dozens of other laws that are very common sense gun laws.

So please link up 

 

 

Quote

 

  On 6/12/2021 at 6:54 PM, -fish- said:

But most of the gun violence is handguns, which aren't really regulated anymore.

 

 

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1 minute ago, KarmaPolice said:

my points are: 

1.  by doing that you are choosing with your clicks and time to support this bs that is being spewed to the masses.  

2.  you seem to post like you think you are in the minority that aren't influenced by it and can tell the difference.  

3.  of all the outlets you listed before, nothing was actual decent news sources.  if I remember right, CNN and Fox were about as highly rated as your news got.  

1. well I don't know any other way to know what liberal media is spewing other than to go look - do you ?

2. hmmm    I'm sure I am influenced in certain ways, sure. You can see a lot of what people think in connection to what they watch and read and hear. doesn't make any of it fact - and yes, I am pretty good at cross referencing and fact checking but I fail sometimes too and get suckered in with misbelieving what I was read/told

3. I remember these stats that came out years ago

"early 90 percent of all internet publishing employees work in a county where Clinton won, and 75 percent of them work in a county that she won by more than 30 percentage points"

 

ever heard the old saying its not who votes but who counts the votes? 

when so much of the media is liberal / Democrat and since we know news/media is biased ( look how facebook and twitter have behaved ) ........... its not easy to find decent news sources if you are conservative minded anymore 

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14 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

1. well I don't know any other way to know what liberal media is spewing other than to go look - do you ?

2. hmmm    I'm sure I am influenced in certain ways, sure. You can see a lot of what people think in connection to what they watch and read and hear. doesn't make any of it fact - and yes, I am pretty good at cross referencing and fact checking but I fail sometimes too and get suckered in with misbelieving what I was read/told

3. I remember these stats that came out years ago

"early 90 percent of all internet publishing employees work in a county where Clinton won, and 75 percent of them work in a county that she won by more than 30 percentage points"

 

ever heard the old saying its not who votes but who counts the votes? 

when so much of the media is liberal / Democrat and since we know news/media is biased ( look how facebook and twitter have behaved ) ........... its not easy to find decent news sources if you are conservative minded anymore 

why do you need to know what liberal media is "spewing".  just this language tells me you think it's crap, are giving them what they want by going there, and ate doing not to see what a rational take of other position is.  you are basically going there for confirmation and kooky extreme stories about libs.  

why do you need liberal news and conservative news?  how about just news? 

 

I agree with you thats it seems hard to find decent news with a conservative viewpoint.   seems like most is terrible newmax, oan type stuff, and that trend doesn't seem to go anywhere.  I try, and mostly where I go is podcasts with multiple views/debates after going to sites like BBC, rueters, etc.  More often than not if it's just a conservative only format I feel like I am getting yelled at about evil libs and Sleepy Joe, and other immature crap that has 0 to do with rational discussion.

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1 minute ago, KarmaPolice said:

why do you need liberal news and conservative news?  how about just news? 

to eliminate being stuck in echo chambers

I find myself less and less going to conservative news .... I know the foundations of why I believe what I believe. Reading same opinions as I have gives me no growth at all

So I seek out people who have different views, try to understand them and the why's behind them

 

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11 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Can we at least agree we need to oppose Chipman's ATF nomination?

We also need to oppose the pistol brace proposal and new reciever definition. 

Why?

The NRA has opposed every nominee to head the ATF since 2006.   They even opposed Trump's nominee.   Chipman has said that he will enforce the laws of the country, and if there is an assault weapons ban he will enforce it.   That's what the head of the ATF should do.   

The pistol brace proposal is another example of doing nothing while pretending to do something, like the Trump bump stock ban.

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19 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

to eliminate being stuck in echo chambers

I find myself less and less going to conservative news .... I know the foundations of why I believe what I believe. Reading same opinions as I have gives me no growth at all

So I seek out people who have different views, try to understand them and the why's behind them

 

So you try to understand other people by going to sources that are bad and designed to keep people riled up and watching/clicking? 

Imo, based on the places you go all you get of liberal views are from the liberal version of Fox, and the conservative opinions of what CNN and the left are doing.  

if you truly belive most media is liberal slanted why in the world would you go to sites that graded so lowly for actual content? 

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2 minutes ago, -fish- said:

Why?

The NRA has opposed every nominee to head the ATF since 2006.   They even opposed Trump's nominee.   Chipman has said that he will enforce the laws of the country, and if there is an assault weapons ban he will enforce it.   That's what the head of the ATF should do.   

The pistol brace proposal is another example of doing nothing while pretending to do something, like the Trump bump stock ban.

Chipman is a mess as a leader and has actively worked for gun control organizations over the past several years.

A prior ATF director has come out saying he won't be a good pick.

He may have lied to Congress already.

We can do better.

The pistol brace proposal is another infringement and has the potential to turn current gun owners into felons. Plus it doesnt accomplish anything...

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5 hours ago, KarmaPolice said:

Understanding both sides of the aisle does not require you watching Fox and CNN.    

You know the why - it's mostly clickbait journalism.   Most admit here that neither are a good source of news, but still people like you continue to use them.  Who cares if they are popular if they aren't good sources of news?   So in your pursuit of "understanding", you are freely admitting to wasting your time consuming stuff that isn't great info.  

To build on this-

Am I mistaken but hasn't cable news viewership been in a free fall since the inauguration give or take.  Something along the lines of Fox down 55%, CNN down 45%, MSNBC down about 35%?   (From what I believe I remember  so could be off a little or a lot or even have them mixed up.)

That total viewership of them all combined in a typical day is less than 1% of the population?

Sure there are those that get their news from the companion web pages to these networks and those that get their thoughts second and third hand from being told what was there, but in aggregate this is not where people get their news.   Right? 

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40 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Chipman is a mess as a leader and has actively worked for gun control organizations over the past several years.

A prior ATF director has come out saying he won't be a good pick.

He may have lied to Congress already.

We can do better.

The pistol brace proposal is another infringement and has the potential to turn current gun owners into felons. Plus it doesnt accomplish anything...

Can you give me an example of him being a "mess as a leader?"   What ATF director?  There hasn't been a confirmed ATF director in 15 years.   

What lie?   

If you have factual information, I'd be interested in seeing it.   I don't know a ton about Chipman, and I don't really care what the NRA's position is.  They literally oppose everyone.   I do know he was a decorated ATF agent and had a significant role in both Waco and Oklahoma City.

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38 minutes ago, Bottomfeeder Sports said:

To build on this-

Am I mistaken but hasn't cable news viewership been in a free fall since the inauguration give or take.  Something along the lines of Fox down 55%, CNN down 45%, MSNBC down about 35%?   (From what I believe I remember  so could be off a little or a lot or even have them mixed up.)

That total viewership of them all combined in a typical day is less than 1% of the population?

Sure there are those that get their news from the companion web pages to these networks and those that get their thoughts second and third hand from being told what was there, but in aggregate this is not where people get their news.   Right? 

Correct, but IMO we should talk in terms of what the % of people who even bother ingesting news to begin with, and what % they are getting from those sources.   

 

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2 hours ago, ekbeats said:

Here’s an idea - let’s address the root causes of all the violence and crime.  You know - the stuff that Liberals created with all their race baiting, anti-police rhetoric, and mismanagement of cities like Baltimore, Chicago, St. Louis, New York….

Problems with cities like Baltimore in no particular order are -

  • Poverty
  • Dealing drugs is the most rational opportunity for way too many
  • Decaying infrastructure
  • Police utilization  (which includes in a round about way corruption in the force and labor "shut downs")
  • Food deserts
  • White flight from the relatively recent past (which resulted in the exodus of more than just white people)
  • Education
  • Welfare traps (both economic such as unable to work a little more due to loss of welfare benefit and social ones such as benefits being at risk if legally married)
  • War on drugs
  • Gentrification
  • Guns
  • Lack of Healthcare (both as in healthcare insurance and in providers).  Yet Baltimore is pretty much a health care Mecca with Hopkins, University of Maryland's Shock Trauma, Union Memorial right there,

Democrats at the local level have failed to address a lot of these and have made some of these worst.  No doubt.  But there isn't a whole lot of liberalism being practiced in part because there isn't any money,  And to be blunt where there is money there are just too many opportunist politicians knee deep in corruptions.  And that includes the leadership in the police department.  Baltimore City is hampered being left on its own with the suburbs all being independent counties. 

While I'm sure plenty here will disagree a good healthy dosage of liberal social welfare spending and work projects along with treating drugs as a health crisis rather than a crime along with figuring out education (this is tough because inner cities already spend more per student to try to bridge gaps in the communities but is still isn't enough nor can spending money make up for some of the other issues.

I'm rambling, but I think that the issue is the kind of liberalism that would help cities more or less like Baltimore require spending much more than we do to have a prayer of being successful.  

 

ETA;  Seconds after posting  https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/bs-md-ci-cr-shooting-multiple-victims-lexington-street-20210616-plkfqpqjmnhk3j4qcxy74wewaa-story.html?utm_source=onesignal&utm_medium=notification&utm_campaign=2021-06-16-Six-shot-in-Wes

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14 minutes ago, KarmaPolice said:

Correct, but IMO we should talk in terms of what the % of people who even bother ingesting news to begin with, and what % they are getting from those sources.   

 

Don't disagree.  And surveyed numbers (I do this to stay informed) would be inflated.

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2 hours ago, KarmaPolice said:

the root cause of everything - Liberals!!! 

must suck to have such distain for almost 1/2 the population of the country.  

They are only dangerous when they are in groups and vote.  

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18 minutes ago, -fish- said:

Can you give me an example of him being a "mess as a leader?"   What ATF director?  There hasn't been a confirmed ATF director in 15 years.   

What lie?   

If you have factual information, I'd be interested in seeing it.   I don't know a ton about Chipman, and I don't really care what the NRA's position is.  They literally oppose everyone.   I do know he was a decorated ATF agent and had a significant role in both Waco and Oklahoma City.

I call him a mess of an ATF leader because he was an agent during the Waco fiasco.  He lied about the situation back then and last year he did a reddit ask me anything where he continued to lie to the American people.  I think AMAs are stupid as is, but lying to the people you're supposed to be serving along with being on the scene for ATFs biggest scandals ever doesn't promote confidence in his abilities.  

More on that here. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9454603/Biden-ATF-nominee-anti-gun-lobbyist-Waco-lied-cult-shooting-helicopters.html

Michael Sullivan: Biden's ATF nominee would compromise agency's mission. ATF needs less politically biased and more mission-focused director

Quote

As former acting director of the ATF, I commend the president for acknowledging that the agency needs a Senate-confirmed leader. I have nothing personal against Chipman; I worked with him, and I respect and will always defend his right to express his position on firearms. But the hard-working patriots who staff this vital law enforcement and regulatory agency deserve, and the public served by ATF needs, a less politically biased and more mission-focused director than the nominee.  

The whole piece from Michael Sullivan is worth a read IMO.

 

The potential lie to congress...

Quote

 

Four GOP senators — Tom Cotton of Arkansas, Ted Cruz of Texas, Mike Lee of Utah, and Judiciary ranking member Chuck Grassley of Iowa all had the same question for the retired ATF agent -- did he ever misplace or have his firearm stolen?

Chipman wrote back to each senator with a definite "No," according to testimony obtained by Fox News. 

But a Senate staffer said their office has received information suggesting that Chipman’s answer may not be true, and they are still looking into the matter.

A separate source familiar with the allegations told Fox News that "Senate staff continue their inquiries about Chipman’s mishandling of service weapons."

The White House defended the president's nominee and said, "David Chipman served honorably in law enforcement for 25 years – promoted into positions of trust and management at the ATF, participating in complex investigations, and putting himself in harm’s way as a member of the Bureau’s SWAT team," White House spokesperson Michael Gwin told Fox News.

"Chipman stated to Congress these allegations are flat-out false, and leading law enforcement organizations are supporting his nomination to lead ATF," he added.

A former ATF agent who served under Chipman told Fox News the allegations could be easily verified by checking federal and local law enforcement records. 

 

I'm just saying we can a LOT better than this guy.  

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3 hours ago, -fish- said:

Other than secure storage laws, make it more difficult for mentally ill former felons to obtain guns by taking as many as possible out of circulation, creating a national gun registry, allowing the ATF to create a searchable database, institute buy-back programs, close private sale and gunshow loopholes and adopt red flag laws. 

What I wouldn't do is blame CNN for biased reporting, because that's ridiculous and irrelevant.   It must be strange to spend your life trying to find reasons to be outraged by liberals.

You plant a demon seed
You raise a flower of fire

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2 hours ago, -fish- said:

Wow, urban areas tend to vote democrat.  Cities have more gun crime.  It must be those liberals!   Weird that republican-led cities have a high incidence of gun crimes too.   Must be because of something else.    Maybe they aren't republican enough.

Just pure nonsense.

What would those Republican led cities be?

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2 hours ago, -fish- said:

You have no possible way to say that for certain.   What we do know is that the current laws are ineffective.

Your suggestions as to how to prevent this particular situation were:

Quote

Other than secure storage laws, make it more difficult for mentally ill former felons to obtain guns by taking as many as possible out of circulation, creating a national gun registry, allowing the ATF to create a searchable database, institute buy-back programs, close private sale and gunshow loopholes and adopt red flag laws. 

Not one of those measures prevents a felon from stealing a gun.  But keep pimping your meaningless regulations that do nothing but place the burden on law abiding citizens.

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3 minutes ago, ekbeats said:

Your suggestions as to how to prevent this particular situation were:

Not one of those measures prevents a felon from stealing a gun.  But keep pimping your meaningless regulations that do nothing but place the burden on law abiding citizens.

I haven't been paying attention - is he still calling all disagreements with his posts as "NRA Talking Points"?

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1 hour ago, Max Power said:

The pistol brace proposal is another infringement and has the potential to turn current gun owners into felons. Plus it doesnt accomplish anything...

as far as I know - one time a pistol brace was used in a murder (the Boulder violent crime)

 

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23 minutes ago, ekbeats said:

What would those Republican led cities be?

 

14 minutes ago, ekbeats said:

Your suggestions as to how to prevent this particular situation were:

Not one of those measures prevents a felon from stealing a gun.  But keep pimping your meaningless regulations that do nothing but place the burden on law abiding citizens.

secure storage doesn't prevent gun theft?

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29 minutes ago, Bottomfeeder Sports said:

Problems with cities like Baltimore in no particular order are -

  • Poverty
  • Dealing drugs is the most rational opportunity for way too many
  • Decaying infrastructure
  • Police utilization  (which includes in a round about way corruption in the force and labor "shut downs")
  • Food deserts
  • White flight from the relatively recent past (which resulted in the exodus of more than just white people)
  • Education
  • Welfare traps (both economic such as unable to work a little more due to loss of welfare benefit and social ones such as benefits being at risk if legally married)
  • War on drugs
  • Gentrification
  • Guns
  • Lack of Healthcare (both as in healthcare insurance and in providers).  Yet Baltimore is pretty much a health care Mecca with Hopkins, University of Maryland's Shock Trauma, Union Memorial right there,

Democrats at the local level have failed to address a lot of these and have made some of these worst.  No doubt.  But there isn't a whole lot of liberalism being practiced in part because there isn't any money,  And to be blunt where there is money there are just too many opportunist politicians knee deep in corruptions.  And that includes the leadership in the police department.  Baltimore City is hampered being left on its own with the suburbs all being independent counties. 

While I'm sure plenty here will disagree a good healthy dosage of liberal social welfare spending and work projects along with treating drugs as a health crisis rather than a crime along with figuring out education (this is tough because inner cities already spend more per student to try to bridge gaps in the communities but is still isn't enough nor can spending money make up for some of the other issues.

I'm rambling, but I think that the issue is the kind of liberalism that would help cities more or less like Baltimore require spending much more than we do to have a prayer of being successful.  

 

ETA;  Seconds after posting  https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/bs-md-ci-cr-shooting-multiple-victims-lexington-street-20210616-plkfqpqjmnhk3j4qcxy74wewaa-story.html?utm_source=onesignal&utm_medium=notification&utm_campaign=2021-06-16-Six-shot-in-Wes

I'm going to do a Tim here and say that I believe I've heard that Baltimore spends an inordinate amount on education.  Baltimore is a perfect example of the failures of Liberal policies.  They literally have no one to blame but themselves.  If you look back at the last 100 years you can count on one hand the number of Republican leaders the city has had.

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3 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

as far as I know - one time a pistol brace was used in a murder (the Boulder violent crime)

 

Turning a braced AR pistol into an AR rifle with a stock makes it deadlier, so congrats ATF....

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1 hour ago, -fish- said:

 I don't know a ton about Chipman

if Trump had nominated a very pro-gun person employed by the NRA ,,,, would you have opposed that nominee? 

Biden has appointed a very anti-gun person employed by anti-gun Giffords right ?

 

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42 minutes ago, Max Power said:

I'm just saying we can a LOT better than this guy.  

he's anti-gun .... he's the perfect pick for an anti-gun President and an anti-gun party isn't he ?

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5 minutes ago, Max Power said:

Turning a braced AR pistol into an AR rifle with a stock makes it deadlier, so congrats ATF....

Obama's administration / ATF   ok'd them - they are pistols, not rifles per the definitions that have long stood

in a super market, I don't think it'd have mattered much to be honest - its just another target IMO to strike fear and keep people mad about inanimate objects

Al Aliwi Alissa ............. would ya'll rather him used a 12 ga shotgun with buckshot ? 

Focusing on a small % of guns in order to stop criminals ..... vs actually STOPPING the criminals .... that's a mentality I will never, ever, ever understand

 

There is a failure alright ........ the US Fed Govt .....

Al Aliwi Alissa

https://www.bostonherald.com/2021/03/27/howie-carr-fbi-whiffs-again-on-colorado-mass-shooting-suspect/

Quote

 

So now it turns out that the FBI knew all about the accused Boulder shooter, but paid no attention to the obvious warning signs until police say the rabidly anti-American immigrant from Syria murdered 10 U.S. citizens in the supermarket.

“The suspect’s identity,” the New York Times reported, “was known to the FBI because he was linked to another individual under investigation by the bureau, according to law enforcement officials.”

Stop me if you’ve heard this one before.

The Famous But Incompetent FBI likewise knew all about accused shooter Ahmad al-Aliwi Alissa’s fellow Muslim immigrants who committed mass murder, like the Tsarnaev brothers — but did nothing until those welfare-collecting “asylees” blew up the Boston Marathon.

The FBI also had early warnings about the Muslim terrorists who shot up the gay nightclub in Orlando, the Christmas party in San Bernardino, Fort Hood, the cartoon-drawing contest in Texas … and yet the G-men sat on their soft hands until scores of Americans were murdered in cold blood.

But it’s not only foreign Muslim terrorists the FBI can’t be bothered lugging. It’s domestic killers as well.

For instance, in 2018 the FBI’s national tip line got a 13-minute-long earful from the aunt of the Parkland High shooter Nikolas Cruz — but did nothing until 17 people were gunned down.

Remember serial killer Gary Sampson? Before he murdered three innocent men in 2001, he called the FBI office in Boston from a pay phone in Abington and offered to turn himself in on some unsolved bank robberies.

But it was a Friday afternoon, so the FBI “disconnected” his call and didn’t bother to pick him up. The next day, Sampson started his two-state carjacking murder spree.

 

 

 

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here is a radical idea

 

the FBI starts dealing with these people on watch lists. Sure, people are going to have to give up some freedoms but hey, that's what gun owners are asked to do all the time so, nobody should really complain right? we're trying to save lives here

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11 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

he's anti-gun .... he's the perfect pick for an anti-gun President and an anti-gun party isn't he ?

Not when they are playing word games with gun laws vs passing new laws

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1 minute ago, ekbeats said:

I'm going to do a Tim here and say that I believe I've heard that Baltimore spends an inordinate amount on education.  Baltimore is a perfect example of the failures of Liberal policies.  They literally have no one to blame but themselves.  If you look back at the last 100 years you can count on one hand the number of Republican leaders the city has had.

Machine democrats are not really liberals.   Corrupt politicians are not either.  I'm not going to argue that Baltimore City is place where conservative ideas have been the norm, because they haven't.  But its not really liberal in practice either.  It is more "tread water" with the status quo.  That doesn't mean there are not ten liberals for every one conservative in the general population and even ten liberals for every moderate office holder, just that the end result policies aren't really liberal. 

Along that the line the lack of policing that has happened since Freddie Gray riots to make bad even worst isn't because Baltimore City reallocated those police dollars elsewhere.  

Yes, Baltimore City is somewhere in the top five annually in per student spending and it doesn't do a whole lot of good.  As I mentioned education is harder than just spending money.  Now some of this is because the good students are siphoned off to the Catholic schools of the area (which do operate for less).   But I think the city has floundered in its flirtation with privatization.  (I've never been a resident so I could be off about the extent of this flirting.)   And YES the state of Maryland is still constantly being sued for underfunding Baltimore City schools based on whatever formula it is supposed to use.  

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3 minutes ago, Max Power said:

 

Not when they are playing word games with gun laws vs passing new laws

if he's approved he'll be very anti-gun and that's what this administration wants though - dance with the ones that brought ya, right ?

but I bet he'll be surrounded with guns and have guns watching his family at night ... he just will not want citizens to have the same - funny that, isn't it ?

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3 minutes ago, Bottomfeeder Sports said:

Machine democrats are not really liberals

is that kinda like pretending Democrats weren't Jim Crow and against civil rights? I mean history says they were, and history says machine Democrats are Democrats too, can't really split 'em

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Just now, Stealthycat said:

if he's approved he'll be very anti-gun and that's what this administration wants though - dance with the ones that brought ya, right ?

but I bet he'll be surrounded with guns and have guns watching his family at night ... he just will not want citizens to have the same - funny that, isn't it ?

He is an idiot. The guy admitted to hiding his gun behind pickles and beef jerky in his pantry. 

Safe storage right?

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3 minutes ago, Bottomfeeder Sports said:

Machine democrats are not really liberals.   Corrupt politicians are not either.  I'm not going to argue that Baltimore City is place where conservative ideas have been the norm, because they haven't.  But its not really liberal in practice either.  It is more "tread water" with the status quo.  That doesn't mean there are not ten liberals for every one conservative in the general population and even ten liberals for every moderate office holder, just that the end result policies aren't really liberal. 

Along that the line the lack of policing that has happened since Freddie Gray riots to make bad even worst isn't because Baltimore City reallocated those police dollars elsewhere.  

Yes, Baltimore City is somewhere in the top five annually in per student spending and it doesn't do a whole lot of good.  As I mentioned education is harder than just spending money.  Now some of this is because the good students are siphoned off to the Catholic schools of the area (which do operate for less).   But I think the city has floundered in its flirtation with privatization.  (I've never been a resident so I could be off about the extent of this flirting.)   And YES the state of Maryland is still constantly being sued for underfunding Baltimore City schools based on whatever formula it is supposed to use.  

Oh, c'mon.  You can't really believe this.  The entire government of Baltimore is filled with Democrats/Liberals but they aren't effecting liberal policy?  Get out of here.

You sound like the people who always point to failed Socialist regimes (like, every one in history) and say, "Well, that wasn't REAL Socialism.  I know what REAL socialism is and I would have done it better."

 

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2 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

is that kinda like pretending Democrats weren't Jim Crow and against civil rights? I mean history says they were, and history says machine Democrats are Democrats too, can't really split 'em

When your history is horrible - rewrite it!!

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17 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

can we agree "illegal guns" vs law abiding people who have legal guns ?

vast difference 

FYI - I don't think there are any legal gun stores in Baltimore City.   I think Baltimore and Maryland are worst than Chicago in out of state guns coming in and being used in crimes.  Of course nowhere in Maryland are you all that far from at least one other state because of its size and shape so this probably isn't too surprising.   I move a few years ago but assuming nothing has changed I95 is called the Iron Pipeline as illegal guns flow from the Carolinas north.   So sort of.  But this also shows how liberals in Baltimore City or even Maryland can't really implement effective gun control on their own even if they want to.

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Just now, BladeRunner said:

When your history is horrible - rewrite it!!

well I mean lets just say Trump wasn't REALLY Republican or conservative and not allow anyone to group him like that, right ?

its funny to read things like that though - I mean just own it

 

wasn't it a few pages ago I linked how long the most violent cities have been controlled by Democrats? 

doesn't anyone remember that ? or is it like I've asked -fish- 3 times now to link how handguns aren't really regulated much anymore and he refuses .... selective discussion because hey, if it were honest what pillars are those to stand on right ?

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4 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

is that kinda like pretending Democrats weren't Jim Crow and against civil rights? I mean history says they were, and history says machine Democrats are Democrats too, can't really split 'em

It has only been the last decade where most democrats self identify as liberals.   Even now its just over half.  Democrat does not equate to liberal.  Especially when it comes to office holders. 

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1 minute ago, Bottomfeeder Sports said:

FYI - I don't think there are any legal gun stores in Baltimore City.   I think Baltimore and Maryland are worst than Chicago in out of state guns coming in and being used in crimes.  Of course nowhere in Maryland are you all that far from at least one other state because of its size and shape so this probably isn't too surprising.   I move a few years ago but assuming nothing has changed I95 is called the Iron Pipeline as illegal guns flow from the Carolinas north.   So sort of.  But this also shows how liberals in Baltimore City or even Maryland can't really implement effective gun control on their own even if they want to.

if that's true then again, you've got people LEGALLY owning or ILLEGALLY

I'm guessing very few committing murders with guns have a squeaky clean record ... I'm betting they almost all have rap sheets. Sometimes people kill in crimes of passion etc 

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