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**** Official Dolphins 2013 Thread **** (1 Viewer)

SwampDawg

SwampDawg

Footballguy
The 2013 offseason isn't going to be as changing as 2012 was but it is still a very important step in building on the gains we made last year. Coach and QB seem to be settled at least for the time being and the team played about to expectations of most last year. They've got a fair amount of cap space but also some decisions to make on some starters (Long, Bush, Smith, Hartline, Fasano, Starks) that are free agents as well as backup QB Moore. And of course the long rumored logo and uniform change (if it happens).I'd like to keep Smith and Starks for sure, Hartline and Bush if they will take a resonable deal but I wouldn't pay either one. I think it's time to let Long walk. Fasano would have to come back as a backup at backup money for me to keep him. Moore I love as a backup but he is likely to get a chance to compete somewhere so I don't see him back.WR is almost certian to be a spot to improve even if Hartline does come back. Jennings ? Wallace ? Bowe ? Draft ?TE if Finely is realeased as rumored could a move to South Beach reinvent his career ?Will the logo be the fairly boring ugly one that has been "leaked" early or will they do something radical ?

 
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'SwampDawg said:
The 2013 offseason isn't going to be as changing as 2012 was but it is still a very important step in building on the gains we made last year. Coach and QB seem to be settled at least for the time being and the team played about to expectations of most last year. They've got a fair amount of cap space but also some decisions to make on some starters (Long, Bush, Smith, Hartline, Fasano, Starks) that are free agents as well as backup QB Moore. And of course the long rumored logo and uniform change (if it happens).I'd like to keep Smith and Starks for sure, Hartline and Bush if they will take a resonable deal but I wouldn't pay either one. I think it's time to let Long walk. Fasano would have to come back as a backup at backup money for me to keep him. Moore I love as a backup but he is likely to get a chance to compete somewhere so I don't see him back.WR is almost certian to be a spot to improve even if Hartline does come back. Jennings ? Wallace ? Bowe ? Draft ?TE if Finely is realeased as rumored could a move to South Beach reinvent his career ?Will the logo be the fairly boring ugly one that has been "leaked" early or will they do something radical ?
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Keep: Smith, Starks, and HartlineLose: Bush, Long, Moore, and FasanoAquire: Jennings, WR in first round, and FA Tight-end not named Finely.
 
They've just tagged Randy Starks - I think it's the right move. He is SOLID against the run.Jake Long wants 11 million per year - CYA later Jake LongTake Hartline with you

 
Don't understand why the team wouldn't want to lock Starks up anyways. Ireland sure seems to be getting on the bad side of the team's free-agents already.

 
I think Miami should strongly consider drafting Ryan Swope. I like to call him the great white Swope. There is some buzz generating after Swope ran a 4.34 forty at the combine. People should also take note that Swope had 89 catches for 1207 yards and 11 tds' with Tannehill throwing to him in 2011. I am pretty high on Swope being very good at the next level.

 
'Slapdash said:
Don't understand why the team wouldn't want to lock Starks up anyways. Ireland sure seems to be getting on the bad side of the team's free-agents already.
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I'm guessing they do sign him to a long term deal, they just don't want him hitting the open market.
 
'Slapdash said:
'=Smackdown= said:
They've just tagged Randy Starks - I think it's the right move. He is SOLID against the run.Jake Long wants 11 million per year - CYA later Jake LongTake Hartline with you
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Any word on what Hartline is asking?
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On Hartline, the sides continue to talk. Agent Drew Rosenhaus is nothing if not persistent. Hartline wants to remain in Miami and believes he has a chemistry with quarterback Ryan Tannehill. But he also wants $6 million per season.Obviously, the Dolphins have so far resisted this price point. Both sides at this point believe something can get done before the start of free agency.It is possible the Dolphins might decide pay $8 million for another, more accomplished wide receiver such as Greg Jennings is better than paying $6 million to Hartline. The Dolphins are almost certain to chase Mike Wallace as their top free agency target, as well.Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins_in_depth/2013/03/starks-is-not-surprisingly-dolphins-franchise-player.html#storylink=cpy
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6 million for Hartline? No way.
 
'SwampDawg said:
'Slapdash said:
Don't understand why the team wouldn't want to lock Starks up anyways. Ireland sure seems to be getting on the bad side of the team's free-agents already.
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I'm guessing they do sign him to a long term deal, they just don't want him hitting the open market.
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Yeah, I hope so. I've read that Starks wants a deal pretty bad. I hope the Dolphins can get the defense pretty settled and work on adding weapons for Tannehill. Sounds like a CB will be needed at least.
 
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For discussion sake, here are the Dolphins picks in the Shark Pool Mock Draft:

1. Bjoern Werner - OLB - Florida St

2. Robert Woods, WR - USC

2. Robert Alford, CB - Southeastern Louisiana

3. Gavin Escobar, TE - San Diego St (traded back in the second for an extra 3rd)

3. Terron Armstead, OT - Arkansas Pine Bluff

3. Da'Rick Rogers WR - Tennessee Tech

I like the idea of taking 2 WRs in the early rounds. When the trade was made, Eifert was still out there for the first 2nd rounder. I think that has to be the play if he is on the table. Banks was also there and worthy of consideration. I doubt WRs will fall so much in the actual draft.

 
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'Slapdash said:
For discussion sake, here are the Dolphins picks in the Shark Pool Mock Draft:

1. Bjoern Werner - OLB - Florida St

2. Robert Woods, WR - USC

2. Robert Alford, CB - Southeastern Louisiana

3. Gavin Escobar, TE - San Diego St (traded back in the second for an extra 3rd)

3. Terron Armstead, OT - Arkansas Pine Bluff

3. Da'Rick Rogers WR - Tennessee Tech

I like the idea of taking 2 WRs in the early rounds. When the trade was made, Eifert was still out there for the first 2nd rounder. I think that has to be the play if he is on the table. Banks was also there and worthy of consideration. I doubt WRs will fall so much in the actual draft.
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I think doubling up on WR would be a good idea for Miami too. They really need a guy in THIS draft to pan out for them, so they may as well hedge their initial bet. A couple of teams have done this with good success. Boldin is a prime example of this (taken behind B Johnson) and to a lesser degree Johnny Knox was taken behind Iglesias. A double washout could be a killer (Malcolm (someone) and Devin Thomas by WAS), but I think chances are in your favor that one hits.
 
Where do I begin? The front office continues to run this team into the ground. I don't care what any of you think or say about Jake Long, trying to turn Martin into a starting LT is just plain stupid at this point. Since they have drafted Tannehill they have decided to jettison one of the best WRs in the NFL, made a guy that never caught more than 40-50 balls the WR1, next they seem to be just fine letting a former #1 overall pick at LT, has made the Pro Bowl 4 out of 5 years and they seem OK to let him walk or at the least go out and get $10m a season tossed at him, at least 4-5 teams are ready to jump on that guy. The Oline was one fo the few things I felt didn't need a lot of changes but if they let Long go which they have by not franchising him so now they have to shuffle and bring new guys in which takes time to play together as a unit, and finally they are going to have the biggest weapon in the backfield in Reggie Bush walk out the door as well. We hope for Lamar Miller but we have no idea if he can be an RB1 in the NFL yet. Randy Starks $8.5m, seems like a standard safe Miami move just like they did Solia a couple year back. They tie up no long term money and they can keep him on the hook for another season. Sean Smith is going elsewhere, another high pick in the 2nd round...Long 1st, Vontae Davis 1st, Sean Smith 2nd, Chad Henne, 2nd, and the WVU QB they took in the 2nd that was out of the league after 1 year. Those are the 5 selections the Miami Dolphins made in 2008 and 2009 during the 1st and 2nd round. Some of them were decent picks but now what does Miami have to show for any of it? Jeff Ireland was collecting a paycheck and oversaw those picks as GM did he not? After the Miami fans have finished not showing up to Marlins Park, I hope they also boycott the football games which they seemed to do well by mid season last year. A trend that should continue. I guess that's enough to start. How do you Phinfans feel? Excited? $45M to spend, 10 drafts picks and a GM that doesn't know his head form his ###, we're doomed.

 
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'Slapdash said:
For discussion sake, here are the Dolphins picks in the Shark Pool Mock Draft:

1. Bjoern Werner - OLB - Florida St

2. Robert Woods, WR - USC

2. Robert Alford, CB - Southeastern Louisiana

3. Gavin Escobar, TE - San Diego St (traded back in the second for an extra 3rd)

3. Terron Armstead, OT - Arkansas Pine Bluff

3. Da'Rick Rogers WR - Tennessee Tech

I like the idea of taking 2 WRs in the early rounds. When the trade was made, Eifert was still out there for the first 2nd rounder. I think that has to be the play if he is on the table. Banks was also there and worthy of consideration. I doubt WRs will fall so much in the actual draft.
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I made these picks and did pass up the opportunity to draft Eifert to pick up the extra third. Basically traded Eifert for Woods and Escobar. Was it the right move? We'll see. In the real draft, I doubt there's any way Eiffert lasts until the 2nd so it will be a moot point. I absolutely believe the Dolphins will go defense in the first round. Was a good defense last year, but I think even Ireland knows there are plenty of skill players that he can gobble up later.
 
'Ministry of Pain said:
Where do I begin? The front office continues to run this team into the ground. I don't care what any of you think or say about Jake Long, trying to turn Martin into a starting LT is just plain stupid at this point. Since they have drafted Tannehill they have decided to jettison one of the best WRs in the NFL, made a guy that never caught more than 40-50 balls the WR1, next they seem to be just fine letting a former #1 overall pick at LT, has made the Pro Bowl 4 out of 5 years and they seem OK to let him walk or at the least go out and get $10m a season tossed at him, at least 4-5 teams are ready to jump on that guy. The Oline was one fo the few things I felt didn't need a lot of changes but if they let Long go which they have by not franchising him so now they have to shuffle and bring new guys in which takes time to play together as a unit, and finally they are going to have the biggest weapon in the backfield in Reggie Bush walk out the door as well. We hope for Lamar Miller but we have no idea if he can be an RB1 in the NFL yet. Randy Starks $8.5m, seems like a standard safe Miami move just like they did Solia a couple year back. They tie up no long term money and they can keep him on the hook for another season. Sean Smith is going elsewhere, another high pick in the 2nd round...Long 1st, Vontae Davis 1st, Sean Smith 2nd, Chad Henne, 2nd, and the WVU QB they took in the 2nd that was out of the league after 1 year. Those are the 5 selections the Miami Dolphins made in 2008 and 2009 during the 1st and 2nd round. Some of them were decent picks but now what does Miami have to show for any of it? Jeff Ireland was collecting a paycheck and oversaw those picks as GM did he not? After the Miami fans have finished not showing up to Marlins Park, I hope they also boycott the football games which they seemed to do well by mid season last year. A trend that should continue. I guess that's enough to start. How do you Phinfans feel? Excited? $45M to spend, 10 drafts picks and a GM that doesn't know his head form his ###, we're doomed.
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Would you have them bring back players like Long, Smith, and Bush for their current prices? I don't know if bringing back overpriced players is the answer. Seems like the writing has been on the wall for Long since the Martin pick. I don't think losing any of these guys is a huge blow, but I do suspect Bush will end up with the Dolphins.
 
'JackReacher said:
'Slapdash said:
For discussion sake, here are the Dolphins picks in the Shark Pool Mock Draft:

1. Bjoern Werner - OLB - Florida St

2. Robert Woods, WR - USC

2. Robert Alford, CB - Southeastern Louisiana

3. Gavin Escobar, TE - San Diego St (traded back in the second for an extra 3rd)

3. Terron Armstead, OT - Arkansas Pine Bluff

3. Da'Rick Rogers WR - Tennessee Tech

I like the idea of taking 2 WRs in the early rounds. When the trade was made, Eifert was still out there for the first 2nd rounder. I think that has to be the play if he is on the table. Banks was also there and worthy of consideration. I doubt WRs will fall so much in the actual draft.
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I made these picks and did pass up the opportunity to draft Eifert to pick up the extra third. Basically traded Eifert for Woods and Escobar. Was it the right move? We'll see. In the real draft, I doubt there's any way Eiffert lasts until the 2nd so it will be a moot point. I absolutely believe the Dolphins will go defense in the first round. Was a good defense last year, but I think even Ireland knows there are plenty of skill players that he can gobble up later.
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I agree he is unlikely to fall that far. I don't know too much about Escobar. Who else do you think is in the mix at defense in the first round?

I am also starting to think a RB may be in the mix again this year, if Bush leaves. Thomas hasn't panned out and I doubt Miller will carry the load.

 
'Slapdash said:
Would you have them bring back players like Long, Smith, and Bush for their current prices? I don't know if bringing back overpriced players is the answer. Seems like the writing has been on the wall for Long since the Martin pick. I don't think losing any of these guys is a huge blow, but I do suspect Bush will end up with the Dolphins.
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Long is going to look like a huge mistake. They invested the #1 overall pick, they made no attempt to extend him even 2 yrs ago when he was healthy. I don't think they would have extended him even if he was playing as his old self last season. Look at all the draft picks from 2008 and 2009 with Long gone...zip, zippo, nada, nothing, and still this bleephole is the GM of the team. Martin is not a LT, I have no problem posting that and stand behind it. He is a marginal RT and I didn't see anything spectacular when he was pushed over to the left side for Long. Long 2008-2011 to Martin at LT in 2013...major downgrade. You can just throw the money they will toss at WR into the toilet because Tannehill will be running for his life. They gave him no tools to work with last year, now they start shuffling up the OL and not for the better. Holes at DB, missing an impact DE opposite Wake, aging LBs, no receivers, best RB is leaving town, nothing at TE, a QB that has just as many if not more questions than answers, a stadium that is half full and they want the city to kick in for upgrades, a senile owner that is so out of touch with the fan base you wonder what made him think owning the team was a good idea. Cirque DeSoleil has been in town for the last month parked next to the stadium on their parking lot...a human circus, very appropriate place to set up indeed.
 
Toss Mike Wallace into the lineup, and watch how good it makes Tannehill, Bess, Hartline, and the running game look. Our offense was so easy to defend for the past decade because we have not had a single reliable deep threat in all that time. Even further back. You have to go back to Irving Fryar in the mid 90s, unless I am forgetting someone (please dont say Chris Chambers - it was only one month).

Wallace will change everything if they can get him. Not because he is a phenomenal receiver (he is not), but because he will change the way defenses have to play against us. They have to make that happen, even at the cost of overpaying him. We finally have hope at QB...for the first time since 1999. Sign Wallace, and acquire a TE who can pose a threat as a receiver, and watch this offense come to life. Losing Long will hurt, but the truth is that we lost Jake Long a season and a half ago. He has not been the same player since that first injury. Its a shame, but I am on board with letting someone else pay all that money to see if they can revitalize that broken down body.

We have plenty of picks, and plenty of cash. We can fill holes this season. I like Philbin, and I like Tannehill. Thats a solid foundation to work with. This is the offseason that will make or break Jeff Ireland, and likely determine if we are going to have another crappy decade ahead of us, or if we will be ready to pounce once Brady starts to show his age.

I am cautiously optimistic, myself.

 
'ChuckLiddell said:
Toss Mike Wallace into the lineup, and watch how good it makes Tannehill, Bess, Hartline, and the running game look. Our offense was so easy to defend for the past decade because we have not had a single reliable deep threat in all that time. Even further back. You have to go back to Irving Fryar in the mid 90s, unless I am forgetting someone (please dont say Chris Chambers - it was only one month).

Wallace will change everything if they can get him. Not because he is a phenomenal receiver (he is not), but because he will change the way defenses have to play against us. They have to make that happen, even at the cost of overpaying him. We finally have hope at QB...for the first time since 1999. Sign Wallace, and acquire a TE who can pose a threat as a receiver, and watch this offense come to life. Losing Long will hurt, but the truth is that we lost Jake Long a season and a half ago. He has not been the same player since that first injury. Its a shame, but I am on board with letting someone else pay all that money to see if they can revitalize that broken down body.

We have plenty of picks, and plenty of cash. We can fill holes this season. I like Philbin, and I like Tannehill. Thats a solid foundation to work with. This is the offseason that will make or break Jeff Ireland, and likely determine if we are going to have another crappy decade ahead of us, or if we will be ready to pounce once Brady starts to show his age.

I am cautiously optimistic, myself.
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:goodposting: It seems like Ireland has been building up to this offseason. I think trading Marshall was a mistake, but let's see what he can do with a bunch of cap space and draft picks. If he can't propel the team forward with this kind of ammunition he's got to go next offseason. I'm not saying I fully trust him to do a good job, I'm a bit worried that a significant chunk of the sparse talent we had last year is set to enter free agency in a few days but like Chuck, I'm cautiously optimistic.

 
'Rooster said:
'ChuckLiddell said:
Toss Mike Wallace into the lineup, and watch how good it makes Tannehill, Bess, Hartline, and the running game look. Our offense was so easy to defend for the past decade because we have not had a single reliable deep threat in all that time. Even further back. You have to go back to Irving Fryar in the mid 90s, unless I am forgetting someone (please dont say Chris Chambers - it was only one month).

Wallace will change everything if they can get him. Not because he is a phenomenal receiver (he is not), but because he will change the way defenses have to play against us. They have to make that happen, even at the cost of overpaying him. We finally have hope at QB...for the first time since 1999. Sign Wallace, and acquire a TE who can pose a threat as a receiver, and watch this offense come to life. Losing Long will hurt, but the truth is that we lost Jake Long a season and a half ago. He has not been the same player since that first injury. Its a shame, but I am on board with letting someone else pay all that money to see if they can revitalize that broken down body.

We have plenty of picks, and plenty of cash. We can fill holes this season. I like Philbin, and I like Tannehill. Thats a solid foundation to work with. This is the offseason that will make or break Jeff Ireland, and likely determine if we are going to have another crappy decade ahead of us, or if we will be ready to pounce once Brady starts to show his age.

I am cautiously optimistic, myself.
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:goodposting: It seems like Ireland has been building up to this offseason. I think trading Marshall was a mistake, but let's see what he can do with a bunch of cap space and draft picks. If he can't propel the team forward with this kind of ammunition he's got to go next offseason. I'm not saying I fully trust him to do a good job, I'm a bit worried that a significant chunk of the sparse talent we had last year is set to enter free agency in a few days but like Chuck, I'm cautiously optimistic.
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:goodposting: from the both of you and I completely agree.

A ton of picks and a ton of cap space. THIS is the off season that will make or break Ireland. Wallace would be a great start to FA for the Dolphins.

Lot of OL on the FA market right now - wonder how close Long will get to his desired 11 million a year request? They made the mistake of taking Long over Ryan. Admit it, let him walk and move on once and for all.

 
'Ministry of Pain said:
'Slapdash said:
Would you have them bring back players like Long, Smith, and Bush for their current prices? I don't know if bringing back overpriced players is the answer. Seems like the writing has been on the wall for Long since the Martin pick. I don't think losing any of these guys is a huge blow, but I do suspect Bush will end up with the Dolphins.
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Long is going to look like a huge mistake. They invested the #1 overall pick, they made no attempt to extend him even 2 yrs ago when he was healthy. I don't think they would have extended him even if he was playing as his old self last season. Look at all the draft picks from 2008 and 2009 with Long gone...zip, zippo, nada, nothing, and still this bleephole is the GM of the team. Martin is not a LT, I have no problem posting that and stand behind it. He is a marginal RT and I didn't see anything spectacular when he was pushed over to the left side for Long. Long 2008-2011 to Martin at LT in 2013...major downgrade. You can just throw the money they will toss at WR into the toilet because Tannehill will be running for his life. They gave him no tools to work with last year, now they start shuffling up the OL and not for the better. Holes at DB, missing an impact DE opposite Wake, aging LBs, no receivers, best RB is leaving town, nothing at TE, a QB that has just as many if not more questions than answers, a stadium that is half full and they want the city to kick in for upgrades, a senile owner that is so out of touch with the fan base you wonder what made him think owning the team was a good idea. Cirque DeSoleil has been in town for the last month parked next to the stadium on their parking lot...a human circus, very appropriate place to set up indeed.
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It all comes down to whether the coaching staff feels Long is an elite LT in their system. Otherwise, it is a better move to use one of the 5 picks the team has in the first three rounds on another OL. I don't agree with assesment of Tannehill. Bush may be the best RB on the team, but it is a pretty devalued position overall. I think Miller, Thomas, + a FA will be a fine committee. If Bush wants to re-sign cheaply that is fine. The team has a good deal of cap space, but it doesn't have room to bring back some of these overpaid players AND make a splash in FA with Wallace/Jennings. TE is the position I cannot figure out. I like some of the guys hitting FA (Keller/Cook) this year but I don't think they're worth anywhere near what they'll get. Yet, the Egnew pick was so bad I don't know if they should be allowed to draft another one.
 
'Slapdash said:
'Ministry of Pain said:
'Slapdash said:
Would you have them bring back players like Long, Smith, and Bush for their current prices? I don't know if bringing back overpriced players is the answer. Seems like the writing has been on the wall for Long since the Martin pick. I don't think losing any of these guys is a huge blow, but I do suspect Bush will end up with the Dolphins.
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Long is going to look like a huge mistake. They invested the #1 overall pick, they made no attempt to extend him even 2 yrs ago when he was healthy. I don't think they would have extended him even if he was playing as his old self last season. Look at all the draft picks from 2008 and 2009 with Long gone...zip, zippo, nada, nothing, and still this bleephole is the GM of the team. Martin is not a LT, I have no problem posting that and stand behind it. He is a marginal RT and I didn't see anything spectacular when he was pushed over to the left side for Long. Long 2008-2011 to Martin at LT in 2013...major downgrade. You can just throw the money they will toss at WR into the toilet because Tannehill will be running for his life. They gave him no tools to work with last year, now they start shuffling up the OL and not for the better. Holes at DB, missing an impact DE opposite Wake, aging LBs, no receivers, best RB is leaving town, nothing at TE, a QB that has just as many if not more questions than answers, a stadium that is half full and they want the city to kick in for upgrades, a senile owner that is so out of touch with the fan base you wonder what made him think owning the team was a good idea.

Cirque DeSoleil has been in town for the last month parked next to the stadium on their parking lot...a human circus, very appropriate place to set up indeed.
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It all comes down to whether the coaching staff feels Long is an elite LT in their system. Otherwise, it is a better move to use one of the 5 picks the team has in the first three rounds on another OL. I don't agree with assesment of Tannehill.

Bush may be the best RB on the team, but it is a pretty devalued position overall. I think Miller, Thomas, + a FA will be a fine committee. If Bush wants to re-sign cheaply that is fine.

The team has a good deal of cap space, but it doesn't have room to bring back some of these overpaid players AND make a splash in FA with Wallace/Jennings.

TE is the position I cannot figure out. I like some of the guys hitting FA (Keller/Cook) this year but I don't think they're worth anywhere near what they'll get. Yet, the Egnew pick was so bad I don't know if they should be allowed to draft another one.
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And these are the folks you trust with one of the 5 picks in the 1st 3 rounds on an OL to replace Long?And what was my assessment of Tannehill? I can't possibly tell until he gets some real weapons and time to throw the football.

 
Matt Moore has re-signed with the Dolphins. No contract details yet. Solid backup for Tannehill.

The QB market is really thin.

 
MOP, I'm not sure why all the Jake Long love. Was he a great left tackle, yep, 3 years ago. He has given us basically nothing the past 2 seasons and has become injury prone. I really think that LT has become overvalued in the NFL, especially with the rule changes to protect QB's. I'm not saying I 100% trust this front office but to me for the first time in a long time it seems they a have a plan and they aren't just doing things. If he was playing at 2010 form maybe I give Long his $11 million a year but no way after the last two years. Will someone give it to him...almost assuredly, will it be a good deal ? I'd say 50/50 at best.

I'm more concerned with losing Sean Smith and replacing him. Bush I think ends up resigning because he isn't going to get a huge offer anywhere. Moore was a pleassant surprise, I figured he would go somewhere that he thought he had a chance to compete, but he is a solid backup for Miami. Hartline is over paying a little but I think WR is such a value position right now and we need multiple weapons that I'm ok wit it as long as we either draft a couple or go get a play maker to go along with Hartline.

 
Wish they could have got Hartline back cheaper. Spending $6mm per year with him and adding Jennings/Wallace seems like a bit much.

 
'Slapdash said:
Wish they could have got Hartline back cheaper. Spending $6mm per year with him and adding Jennings/Wallace seems like a bit much.
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Philbin has gushed about Hartline since day 1. Hartline didn't practice much at all during the preseason last year and Philbin kept telling everyone he would be good. And he was. The guy was a chain mover last year and has a great rapport with Tanne. Is 6 million too much? All the salaries are out of whack so who knows for sure, but we can have our opinions. Great post earlier about why Long just isn't worth the risk anymore. Martin did get pushed around last year, but lets see how he has grown. On Marshall, the word is that the entire team hated him. Addition by subtraction. Lots of reasons to question Ireland, but I believe he has this team finally headed in the right direction.
 
'JackReacher said:
'Slapdash said:
Wish they could have got Hartline back cheaper. Spending $6mm per year with him and adding Jennings/Wallace seems like a bit much.
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Philbin has gushed about Hartline since day 1. Hartline didn't practice much at all during the preseason last year and Philbin kept telling everyone he would be good. And he was. The guy was a chain mover last year and has a great rapport with Tanne. Is 6 million too much? All the salaries are out of whack so who knows for sure, but we can have our opinions. Great post earlier about why Long just isn't worth the risk anymore. Martin did get pushed around last year, but lets see how he has grown. On Marshall, the word is that the entire team hated him. Addition by subtraction. Lots of reasons to question Ireland, but I believe he has this team finally headed in the right direction.
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I agree with most of this. Just can't see the Dolphins getting a big name WR and taking a WR in the first couple of rounds after they brought Hartline back at that level. Eric Winston is a name I wouldn't be surprised to show up in Miami if they intend to part ways with Long.
 
'Slapdash said:
'JackReacher said:
'Slapdash said:
Wish they could have got Hartline back cheaper. Spending $6mm per year with him and adding Jennings/Wallace seems like a bit much.
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Philbin has gushed about Hartline since day 1. Hartline didn't practice much at all during the preseason last year and Philbin kept telling everyone he would be good. And he was. The guy was a chain mover last year and has a great rapport with Tanne. Is 6 million too much? All the salaries are out of whack so who knows for sure, but we can have our opinions. Great post earlier about why Long just isn't worth the risk anymore. Martin did get pushed around last year, but lets see how he has grown. On Marshall, the word is that the entire team hated him. Addition by subtraction. Lots of reasons to question Ireland, but I believe he has this team finally headed in the right direction.
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I agree with most of this. Just can't see the Dolphins getting a big name WR and taking a WR in the first couple of rounds after they brought Hartline back at that level. Eric Winston is a name I wouldn't be surprised to show up in Miami if they intend to part ways with Long.
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Yep I can see that as well, and depending on the numbers it might be a brillant move.
 
'Slapdash said:
Matt Moore deal is 2 years for $8mm.
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$6m for Hartline, $4m for Moore, they totaled how many TDs for the Phins last season? $10m they have already committed to a backup QB that may or may not even touch the field and a slot WR. We are off to the races. $45M to play with and so far they have $18.5m tied up in a DT with no long term outlook, a back up QB, and a slot WR. $27M left, can't wait to see what they do next.
 
'Slapdash said:
'JackReacher said:
'Slapdash said:
Wish they could have got Hartline back cheaper. Spending $6mm per year with him and adding Jennings/Wallace seems like a bit much.
Click to expand...
Philbin has gushed about Hartline since day 1. Hartline didn't practice much at all during the preseason last year and Philbin kept telling everyone he would be good. And he was. The guy was a chain mover last year and has a great rapport with Tanne. Is 6 million too much? All the salaries are out of whack so who knows for sure, but we can have our opinions. Great post earlier about why Long just isn't worth the risk anymore. Martin did get pushed around last year, but lets see how he has grown. On Marshall, the word is that the entire team hated him. Addition by subtraction. Lots of reasons to question Ireland, but I believe he has this team finally headed in the right direction.
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I agree with most of this. Just can't see the Dolphins getting a big name WR and taking a WR in the first couple of rounds after they brought Hartline back at that level. Eric Winston is a name I wouldn't be surprised to show up in Miami if they intend to part ways with Long.
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Has ties to the area with Univ of Miami, I thought he was solid for KC last year. I still think Phinsfans will be cursing Martin at LT. Winston is likely to get how much? Is he worth more than $4m-$5m a season right now?
 
'Ministry of Pain said:
'Slapdash said:
Matt Moore deal is 2 years for $8mm.
Click to expand...
$6m for Hartline, $4m for Moore, they totaled how many TDs for the Phins last season? $10m they have already committed to a backup QB that may or may not even touch the field and a slot WR. We are off to the races. $45M to play with and so far they have $18.5m tied up in a DT with no long term outlook, a back up QB, and a slot WR. $27M left, can't wait to see what they do next.
Click to expand...
More than Jake Long. :)
 
'Ministry of Pain said:
'Slapdash said:
Matt Moore deal is 2 years for $8mm.
Click to expand...
$6m for Hartline, $4m for Moore, they totaled how many TDs for the Phins last season? $10m they have already committed to a backup QB that may or may not even touch the field and a slot WR. We are off to the races. $45M to play with and so far they have $18.5m tied up in a DT with no long term outlook, a back up QB, and a slot WR. $27M left, can't wait to see what they do next.
Click to expand...
Your worry about cap space is completely ridiculous. Especially since the numbers you are quoting are inaccurate as that won't be what Moore and hartline count against the cap in 2013. Additionally, resigning a tackle who has not been healthy or really all that good in 1.5 years would have done what exactly?
 
'Ministry of Pain said:
'Slapdash said:
Matt Moore deal is 2 years for $8mm.
Click to expand...
$6m for Hartline, $4m for Moore, they totaled how many TDs for the Phins last season? $10m they have already committed to a backup QB that may or may not even touch the field and a slot WR. We are off to the races. $45M to play with and so far they have $18.5m tied up in a DT with no long term outlook, a back up QB, and a slot WR. $27M left, can't wait to see what they do next.
Click to expand...
I dont think Hartline ever lines up in the the slot, but I could be mistaken. If he does, it is not often. He lines up wide on most plays. Dude had 1000 yards last year with a rookie QB in a brand new offense, against the defense's top corner and/or a double team. I think he got what he is worth in today's pass-happy NFL. He showed some good skills and I think he will be a very good, very reliable WR2 for us for the next half decade.I also think they intend to sign Starks to a multi-year deal, which will free up cap space from that signing. Regarding Mooore, great insurance, and probably a great guy to have on the sidelines and in the QB meetings. Its a lot to pay a backup, but I can see why they wanted to keep him around. I was kind of hoping that the staff had enough faith in Pat Devlin to be the backup, but clearly they do not.

 
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Everything I read says Wallace is coming to Miami...and has tons of Steeler fans commenting on how terrible he is.

 
If the Dolphins do sign Wallace, theyre filling their #1 hole this offseason. I have no doubt that Philbin will find many ways to get him the ball and justify the investment were putting into him. Its a no brainer really. Assuming hes in the fold, the next biggest needs are:

1. CB - Letting Sean Smith go is the right thing to so but its also a gamble as they dont have anyone behind him. Theyll need to sign a FA AND spend an early pick to shore up the secondary

2. OT - Especially if Long doesnt come back. Dont know that a RT like Winston at $8M/year is prudent shopping. But they need someone

3. WR - IMO Tannehill will need more than Wallace and Hartline if hes to become an upper echelon QB. Would love to see Miami flood him with options the way the Falcons surrounded Matt Ryan with Roddy White, Julio and Gonzalez. I hoping one of their first three picks will be used on a WR - possibly even at #11.

---

4. TE - Many rumblings that Miami may be in for Jared Cook but would hate to see them spend so much money on a position they may not feature heavily. Signing Fasaono is the more prudent move, and a mid round selection makes sense too.

5. DE/LB - Dolphins need one more pass rusher opposite Cam Wake (where Odrick doesnt seem to fit). Would love to see Olivier Venron step up here but I can see us making a move in the mid-rounds to shore up this position.

 
'ChuckLiddell said:
'Ministry of Pain said:
'Slapdash said:
Matt Moore deal is 2 years for $8mm.
Click to expand...
$6m for Hartline, $4m for Moore, they totaled how many TDs for the Phins last season? $10m they have already committed to a backup QB that may or may not even touch the field and a slot WR. We are off to the races. $45M to play with and so far they have $18.5m tied up in a DT with no long term outlook, a back up QB, and a slot WR. $27M left, can't wait to see what they do next.
Click to expand...
I dont think Hartline ever lines up in the the slot, but I could be mistaken. If he does, it is not often. He lines up wide on most plays. Dude had 1000 yards last year with a rookie QB in a brand new offense, against the defense's top corner and/or a double team. I think he got what he is worth in today's pass-happy NFL. He showed some good skills and I think he will be a very good, very reliable WR2 for us for the next half decade.I also think they intend to sign Starks to a multi-year deal, which will free up cap space from that signing. Regarding Mooore, great insurance, and probably a great guy to have on the sidelines and in the QB meetings. Its a lot to pay a backup, but I can see why they wanted to keep him around. I was kind of hoping that the staff had enough faith in Pat Devlin to be the backup, but clearly they do not.
Click to expand...
Or he had about 750 in the other 15 games combined, right? That 1 game against AZ, we gotta throw that out right? And maybe the bagel he threw up another week, OK how about 750 yds over 14 weeks? 1 Touchdown...$6 Million a season.
 
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'Faust said:
Report: Dolphins have no competition for Mike Wallace
Click to expand...
And yet Miami fans want to act like this is the 2nd coming of Christ. I really am not very impressed with this. I would much rather have the skills of a Brandon Marshall...that's right we traded him for 2 3rds...I'm sure those guys will more then compensate. If they were gonna re-create what they had in GB, wouldn't it make more sense for them to try and pay about $5m-$7m a slot across and go 4-5 deep plus the TE position? I guess I would rather have a bunch of No 2s instead of one 2 and a few 3s which is what we are collecting. Wallace has speed but he runs terrible routes IMO and also a lot of Steeler fans, beat writers, etc...he really is not a true No 1 WR.

I know I'm always the wet blanket for Phinsfans but honestly I'm just trying to keep it real. You all love to spin it as many ways as you can but I have not wavered since this thing really came off the tracks as we bottomed out at 1-15. I don't think many of us were fooled by the 2008 season but I think many of us saw Jake Long and that plan with Sporano and Parcells was gonna be a commitment to the running game and sound defense. That was the plan, so i kind of get why Philbin might want to change everything. I just fail to see how keeping Jake Long would hurt, by far the best LT we had since Richmond Webb and I remember many solid if not great years and he was a pillar at the position for 10 years.

So now we bring in new weapons, the OL takes a major hit or molting into what suits Philbin...what happens when Philbin and Ireland are gone in the next 2-3 years? I guess we just flush everyone again and start over? Seems the good teams are not in a constant flux with their personnel, coaches, front office. The Phins are their own worst enemy.

 
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MOP - I hear your concerns about Wallace although I don't necessarily agree. I believe he'd be a dynamic addition to the Dolphins. If not Wallace, who? Would you rather have Jennings (I'd be ok with that)? Would you rather get noone? The choices are slim unfortunately. They, of course, will draft a wide either way.

 
'Ministry of Pain said:
'ChuckLiddell said:
'Ministry of Pain said:
'Slapdash said:
Matt Moore deal is 2 years for $8mm.
Click to expand...
$6m for Hartline, $4m for Moore, they totaled how many TDs for the Phins last season? $10m they have already committed to a backup QB that may or may not even touch the field and a slot WR. We are off to the races. $45M to play with and so far they have $18.5m tied up in a DT with no long term outlook, a back up QB, and a slot WR. $27M left, can't wait to see what they do next.
Click to expand...
I dont think Hartline ever lines up in the the slot, but I could be mistaken. If he does, it is not often. He lines up wide on most plays. Dude had 1000 yards last year with a rookie QB in a brand new offense, against the defense's top corner and/or a double team. I think he got what he is worth in today's pass-happy NFL. He showed some good skills and I think he will be a very good, very reliable WR2 for us for the next half decade.I also think they intend to sign Starks to a multi-year deal, which will free up cap space from that signing. Regarding Mooore, great insurance, and probably a great guy to have on the sidelines and in the QB meetings. Its a lot to pay a backup, but I can see why they wanted to keep him around. I was kind of hoping that the staff had enough faith in Pat Devlin to be the backup, but clearly they do not.
Click to expand...
Or he had about 750 in the other 15 games combined, right? That 1 game against AZ, we gotta throw that out right? And maybe the bagel he threw up another week, OK how about 750 yds over 14 weeks? 1 Touchdown...$6 Million a season.
Click to expand...
I am not really in to throwing out weeks arbitrarily like that. He had 250 yards that week, playing against Patrick Peterson for a lot of his snaps. Its not like he was facing Nolan Carroll in that game. The numbers count. The 1 TD was a concern, but I know you watched the games and saw Tannehill miss him for at least 3 would-be TDs. A couple of those were long ones too. Tannehill was a rookie, so you have to allow for those to happen, but this year he wont be, and if he is what we all hope he is, then those will be completions for big plays next year. Lets also remember that Wes Welker had 1 TD in 2 years (I believe) for us. He turned out to be a decent WR in the NFL, no?

Even with all of that, and the fact that Hartline was being game-planned as the top threat in the passing game for every team we faced, he still put up 1000 yards and established himself as a very good starting WR. Runs good routes, has good hands, and can move the sticks. You need one of those guys to go with your field-stretcher. Next step is to get that field-stretcher.

Rumors today that we may pay Wallace $13M/year due to the Vikings desperation after trading Harvin. I would agree that that is definitely pushing the envelope of insanity and reeks of desperation. $12M is right up against that envelope, but sub 4.4 speed combined with decent hands is tough to find. Hoping they can get him for $12M or less. I'd still be excited even if they had to pay more, but I would not argue that it would be a massive case of overpaying.

Also- I tend to ignore the Steelers fans sour grapes on Wallace. The team, which is historically a very financially responsible team offered him $11M per season. Thats a lot of money for some bum that the fan base is supposedly happy to see leave. The fans are (IMO) basing a lot of their opinions on last season. A season in which Wallace sat out camp when a brand new, complicated offense was being installed. He put himself in that position, which I am sure angered a lot of fans - justifiably. But, I put a lot more stock into his on-field play in the previous 3 seasons, which was stellar both statistically, and in how it opened up the rest of the Steeler offense.

 
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