The General
Footballguy
Man. What a mess they have made this. I don’t blame Bell for wanting to get paid but his agent has screwed him here I think. Limited his options.
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RB Le'Veon Bell, FA - 9.6.21 Workout For Baltimore (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Eminence
- Start date
Franknbeans
Footballguy
Leveon, Leveon likes his money
He makes a lot they say
Spends his days counting
In a garage by the motorway
He makes a lot they say
Spends his days counting
In a garage by the motorway
Steeler
Footballguy
Apples to Oranges. Garrapolo didn't make demands in NE about preserving himself so he could get a bigger contract the following year, etc. Not the same thing as Bell. I just don't see it as a win/win/win. It would be good for the Steelers so I hope they get a first for Bell. But I don't see how it makes sense for the 49ers given Bell's demands about his usage this year. Why would Bell play for the 49ers if he won't play for the Steelers? Would the Niners agree to limit his touches this year? No, so why would Bell play for them if he feels underpaid?
squistion
Footballguy
Aaron Sopchak @AaronSopchak 25m25 minutes ago
This thread is for all the people upset that @LeVeonBell hasn’t reported to the team yet.
Although I’m sure it is frustrating that your fantasy team could be short it’s best player, you’ve gotta think about it from his perspective. This is a defining moment in his career.
Saquon Barkley has yet to play an NFL snap and his team guaranteed him $31,194,751.
Through 44 games Todd Gurley has averaged 17.9 carries - 74.9 yards - 2.9 receptions - 29.6 receiving yards His team decided to give him 45,000,000 guaranteed.
In 62 games Bell has averaged 19.8 carries - 86 yards - 5 receptions - 42.9 receiving yards
Despite having such a large role, he hasn’t been able to secure a long term deal. For those citing health he hasn’t had a major injury since 2015. Even after 406 touches in 2017.
Yes, Bell has had suspensions in the past. But that hasn’t stopped the Steelers from wanting him on the roster. One would think if they were that concerned about his off the field issues that they would have let him leave already.
Lastly, there are those who cite his age as a risk factor. But that’s actually a good argument for why he wants to be paid now. For every season he plays under a franchise tag, he gets another year older. And age definitely decreases the market value for running backs.
In fact, every 400 touch season he plays probably lowers his market value. If Bell were to go out and have another major injury playing for the Steelers this year, it would lower his value. So although for fans it may be frustrating, you’ve gotta view it from his perspective.
Yes, if he sits out until the middle of the season he will lose money. But not as much as he would lose on his next contract if he gets hurt this season. This is strictly a business move. If it were you, would you take that risk with your own finances?
To me, this situation speak more to the fact that the NFL franchise tag system is unfair. If the team tags a player for one season and fails to reach a long term deal following that season they should not be allowed to tag that player again. You either want them, or you don’t.
The contract Le’Veon Bell is trying to get will set up his family for life. And I don’t blame him for trying to make sure that he takes full advantage of his opportunity to get paid. NFL careers are short, you’ve gotta get what you can, when you can. Get that money @LeVeonBell
https://twitter.com/AaronSopchak/status/1037717875694489600
This thread is for all the people upset that @LeVeonBell hasn’t reported to the team yet.
Although I’m sure it is frustrating that your fantasy team could be short it’s best player, you’ve gotta think about it from his perspective. This is a defining moment in his career.
Saquon Barkley has yet to play an NFL snap and his team guaranteed him $31,194,751.
Through 44 games Todd Gurley has averaged 17.9 carries - 74.9 yards - 2.9 receptions - 29.6 receiving yards His team decided to give him 45,000,000 guaranteed.
In 62 games Bell has averaged 19.8 carries - 86 yards - 5 receptions - 42.9 receiving yards
Despite having such a large role, he hasn’t been able to secure a long term deal. For those citing health he hasn’t had a major injury since 2015. Even after 406 touches in 2017.
Yes, Bell has had suspensions in the past. But that hasn’t stopped the Steelers from wanting him on the roster. One would think if they were that concerned about his off the field issues that they would have let him leave already.
Lastly, there are those who cite his age as a risk factor. But that’s actually a good argument for why he wants to be paid now. For every season he plays under a franchise tag, he gets another year older. And age definitely decreases the market value for running backs.
In fact, every 400 touch season he plays probably lowers his market value. If Bell were to go out and have another major injury playing for the Steelers this year, it would lower his value. So although for fans it may be frustrating, you’ve gotta view it from his perspective.
Yes, if he sits out until the middle of the season he will lose money. But not as much as he would lose on his next contract if he gets hurt this season. This is strictly a business move. If it were you, would you take that risk with your own finances?
To me, this situation speak more to the fact that the NFL franchise tag system is unfair. If the team tags a player for one season and fails to reach a long term deal following that season they should not be allowed to tag that player again. You either want them, or you don’t.
The contract Le’Veon Bell is trying to get will set up his family for life. And I don’t blame him for trying to make sure that he takes full advantage of his opportunity to get paid. NFL careers are short, you’ve gotta get what you can, when you can. Get that money @LeVeonBell
https://twitter.com/AaronSopchak/status/1037717875694489600
steelers1080
Footballguy
NJ
Footballguy
apalmer
Footballguy
Sorry, Aaron, nearly everyone reading this will say "Playing last year for $12 million and this year for $14.5 million should be enough to set up his family for life."
steelers1080
Footballguy
Gurley was stuck with Jeff Fisher, it's woefully inaccurate to use the numbers from that coaching regime and compare it to Bell who's had the same coach his whole career. Using just 1 year's worth of stats also isn't great, but Gurley averaged 18.6 carries, 87 yards, 4.3 rec, 52.5 receiving yards last year. So more rushing yards on less carries and more receiving yards on less receptions with worse talent around him.
Also, Saquon was drafted at #2 overall and is on a rookie contract that follows the rookie pay scale, comparing that to a free agent contract is dumb.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
The General
Footballguy
You shouldn’t hate on Bell for being in a position to get paid this money. He thinks he’s worth more and is trying to get it.
mozzy84
Footballguy
He might be the new bellcow but that doesn't instantly lead to him actually producing. He's a third round running back that most everyone said got drafted 2-3 rounds too early, he had 30 sum carries last season and he managed to get hurt with those carries. I would not be surprised if the steelers bring someone else in if this is going to week ten like it may.
Instead of the lineman whining and crying about bell maybe they should be propping this guy up instead if the steelers and them like him so much.
Bronco Billy
Footballguy
I think I’m worth a lot more than what I get paid. I think I’ll notify my boss that I intend to hold out.
apalmer
Footballguy
He should have left that line out about setting up his family because as you point out, there are fans that won't sympathize with a millionaire trying to make more millions. Especially if it negatively affects the team they root for.
But Sorry, nearly everyone reading this would also say "75+ Million over the course of a career is worth a hell of a lot more than 30~40M total." Saying a specific dollar amount should be "enough" for someone is foolish and just sounds like petty jealousy. Sure we all wish that the great players for our team were like Tom Brady who had the luxury to take slightly below market deals in the twilight of his career because he'd already made $100 million dollars and married a woman worth more money than him. But the reality is that for 99% of players, "enough" is the most you can get while you can get it.
solorca
Footballguy
Any response that talks about how 14.5 million is such a large number and he should accept it because "everyone would love to make that kind of money" is clearly unable to put themselves in someone else's shoes.
I make fairly good money in my job. Enough where I am above the average for my area. There are plenty of people I know who would like to make what I make, but that doesn't mean I would be happy to simply take a one year contract that pays me twice what I currently make without any guarantee of future money. Especially if my career involved risks that could potentially ruin my future prospects.
I make fairly good money in my job. Enough where I am above the average for my area. There are plenty of people I know who would like to make what I make, but that doesn't mean I would be happy to simply take a one year contract that pays me twice what I currently make without any guarantee of future money. Especially if my career involved risks that could potentially ruin my future prospects.
rangerforme
Footballguy
The problem with us regular joes is the bill's keep coming and we don't have a few million in the bank to ride it out
solorca
Footballguy
If you were in a job where you perform under a contract, that's exactly what you could and should do.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
If Bell sits, i think he will wait till near week 10 and inform the team he will sit if they make the playoffs.
He wants to be CUT. That is the ONLY way he can sign a big deal this year, and some team who is playoff bound who needs RB help just might do it.
A trade isnt going to happen. He has zero trade value under this franchise tag. Who is going to want a guy for 6 weeks who plans to sit out the playoffs?
He wants to be CUT. That is the ONLY way he can sign a big deal this year, and some team who is playoff bound who needs RB help just might do it.
A trade isnt going to happen. He has zero trade value under this franchise tag. Who is going to want a guy for 6 weeks who plans to sit out the playoffs?
Ask for a raise then and if they say no then walk. People can and do this all the time. Difference is you can leave your job for another one whenever you want.
Bell cannot do that because of the Franchise tag.
solorca
Footballguy
I think at this point the bridge has been burned and they won't be able to trust him even if he signs. Especially if he signs later in the year.
If he makes it clear he won't be playing this year, even when he signs the deal, I think the smart move (as much as it will hurt the Steelers) is to rescind the offer and get a third round compensatory pick for him (I've read numerous people say they wouldn't get one in this case, but the Panthers got one for Josh Norman two years ago...so unless there is a rule I'm not aware of, I think it would be eligible). Otherwise he signs in week 10, fakes an injury they get nothing.
If he makes it clear he won't be playing this year, even when he signs the deal, I think the smart move (as much as it will hurt the Steelers) is to rescind the offer and get a third round compensatory pick for him (I've read numerous people say they wouldn't get one in this case, but the Panthers got one for Josh Norman two years ago...so unless there is a rule I'm not aware of, I think it would be eligible). Otherwise he signs in week 10, fakes an injury they get nothing.
Last edited by a moderator:
Godsbrother
Footballguy
If he does this then I will be surprised cause he seems to enjoy keeping the team in the dark.
At this point I think the Steelers are committed to not releasing him so they can get a 3rd round compensatory pick and they don't set a precedence for future players to do the same thing.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
If i am the steelers i am making it clear to Bell that I expect him to sit in the playoffs, and that it is worth it for 5-6 weeks of his services.
Might be the only way to get him in soon.
If they have a terrible start to the year, maybe a Ben i jury, then they probably just rescind the tag before he could sign it.
Might be the only way to get him in soon.
If they have a terrible start to the year, maybe a Ben i jury, then they probably just rescind the tag before he could sign it.
IDK, seems like most players and owners are grownups and realize that holding out is just part of the business. Faking injuries and dogging it on the field not giving 100% is something else entirely and I think would really hurt him in the eyes of future teams that would be interested in signing him.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Godsbrother
Footballguy
ghostguy123
Footballguy
The General
Footballguy
Pigskin Fanatic
Footballguy
Godsbrother
Footballguy
True but based on the reactions by the GM and players it sure seems like they thought he was going to report for Week 1
TheFanatic
Footballguy
TheFanatic
Footballguy
That seems like the biggest issue with all of this for the players and the coaches. They expected a mirror of last year. Bell seemed to indicate a mirror to last year would happen and then he ghosts the team at the last second giving them no option to snag extra help at RB in a FA RB or a rookie. Sure this helps his negotiating position, but it's a #### move for a guy playing a team sport.
BassNBrew
Footballguy
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Godsbrother
Footballguy
Yes. Bell will be free to negotiate with any team, including the Steelers. However if they rescind and another team signs him they may not get the 3rd round compensatory pick.
BassNBrew
Footballguy
Well if he's traded week 10 the value of the contract is minimal for this year. I doubt Bell is going to miss a chance at ring if he's even remotely competitive.
BassNBrew
Footballguy
If Sportrac is close to accurate:
Browns
Colts
49ers
Texans
Titans
Jets
Bengals
Raiders
matttyl
Footballguy
7 teams currently have that or more (two of them being the Colts and Jets, both with a need at the position - another being the 49ers, but I can't see that after the McKinnon deal). 5 more have between $10-15m, though none of those really have a need at the position.
They can view him that way (and they may end up being right), but he hasn't shown it in games that count. To be honest, he hasn't shown it this preseason, either. He doesn't have the elusiveness that DWill did. He's more of a power-type back. IMO, Pitts offense isn't as suited to a power-back as they are to one like Bell who is more of an elusive, shifty type RB (obviously he can run with power, too).
matuski
Footballguy
I done this successfully myself.
But I am not sure how this is relevant to Bell.
He isn't holding out to get more (the franchise tag dictates what he can get this year), he is holding out to minimize the risk of missing out on more next year.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
My understanding is that once the Steelers rescind the franchise tag then they have essentially released him and so are not awarded a compensatory pick
gethugefast1
Footballguy
That’s what I thought, but I’m not sure. Car got a comp pick when they rescinded the tag on Norman. That was earlier in the process, though, so it’s unclear.
babydemon90
Footballguy
Are you currently employed? If so, not an apples to apples comparison. If you had a contract expire, and are negotiating a new contract with the company that employed you last year - pretty sure that happens all the time.
babydemon90
Footballguy
I think it depends on what contact he signs for THIS year. If they rescind the tag, and no one signs him to a big enough deal to qualify for a 3rd round pick, then no. Which, if he gets released midway through the season, he'll probably just sit the year out - so I don't think there would be a compensatory pick, as he went unsigned. If they rescind and someone signs him to a big long term THIS year - then yea, they should get the pick.
jtp1982
Footballguy
One thing getting missed is that a big part of Bell’s motivation is resetting the market for other backs. There’s strong evidence that he has told other RBs in his peer group he is going to use this season’s contract to fix problems with RB contracts.
Here’s Bell in January when he made waves saying he’d retire before he went back to the Steelers under the franchise tag:
"I don't necessarily care about the money aspect of it. I just want to be valued where I'm at. If I am playing this game, I want to set standards for all the other running backs behind me, like Todd Gurleyand Ezekiel Elliott, Melvin Gordon, guys like that. I'm a guy they can kind of look at. I feel I can do that. I'm in a position where I can do that, and I'm going to do it."
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/22044556/leveon-bell-pittsburgh-steelers-sit-2018-retire-tagged-again
Ok great. People say stuff right?
Ya except here’s Kamara six months later to a TMZ reporter:
“All I know is that Le’veon is about to change something up for us.”
https://www.google.com/amp/amp.tmz.com/2018/07/22/alvin-kamara-leveon-bell-money-contract-steelers/
So early summer Kamara seems to know something that’s probably a lot like what we’re all figuring out this week.
Scroll down Kamara’s twitter feed and the first mention of Gurley or Bell is a retweet of Gurley saying the Steelers should have paid Bell the multi year contract he wanted. Anytime these elite RBs tag each other it’s usually related to this issue.
So this has been top of mind for these guys and they’ve been discussing it, including what Bell told them he is going to do about it.
When you tell peers you respect and who respect you that you will do something there’s an intense psychological drive to follow through on it.
It’s likely this is at least one of the reasons, if not the main reason, this year’s hold out seems to be going very differently than last year’s even though it’s basically the same situation on paper just with a higher contract value.
Here’s Bell in January when he made waves saying he’d retire before he went back to the Steelers under the franchise tag:
"I don't necessarily care about the money aspect of it. I just want to be valued where I'm at. If I am playing this game, I want to set standards for all the other running backs behind me, like Todd Gurleyand Ezekiel Elliott, Melvin Gordon, guys like that. I'm a guy they can kind of look at. I feel I can do that. I'm in a position where I can do that, and I'm going to do it."
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/22044556/leveon-bell-pittsburgh-steelers-sit-2018-retire-tagged-again
Ok great. People say stuff right?
Ya except here’s Kamara six months later to a TMZ reporter:
“All I know is that Le’veon is about to change something up for us.”
https://www.google.com/amp/amp.tmz.com/2018/07/22/alvin-kamara-leveon-bell-money-contract-steelers/
So early summer Kamara seems to know something that’s probably a lot like what we’re all figuring out this week.
Scroll down Kamara’s twitter feed and the first mention of Gurley or Bell is a retweet of Gurley saying the Steelers should have paid Bell the multi year contract he wanted. Anytime these elite RBs tag each other it’s usually related to this issue.
So this has been top of mind for these guys and they’ve been discussing it, including what Bell told them he is going to do about it.
When you tell peers you respect and who respect you that you will do something there’s an intense psychological drive to follow through on it.
It’s likely this is at least one of the reasons, if not the main reason, this year’s hold out seems to be going very differently than last year’s even though it’s basically the same situation on paper just with a higher contract value.
steelers1080
Footballguy
Some analysts sound really confident he'll show up on Saturday. Miss out on 20 touches and still get paid. I'm not as sure, but that would be nice.
Also, I think that if he does hold out and then skips the playoffs, whatever team signs him next definitely won't give him as much as if he had a great year. (presuming he could stay healthy)
Also, I think that if he does hold out and then skips the playoffs, whatever team signs him next definitely won't give him as much as if he had a great year. (presuming he could stay healthy)
ghostguy123
Footballguy
I disagree. He wants paid first, competetive second.
I think he sits out the playoffs
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