Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Should there be a cap on NIL? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter JohnnyU
- Start date
I'm sure a little NIL influence but I think it has more to do with they just don't have to sit out a season any longer.
I'm not sure the NCAA can put a cap on NIL, will probably have a legal battle if they try.
Heavy transfers and NIL money is not ideal for the game but I can't in good conscience support something limiting either of those unless the same restrictions and caps were put on the coaches. It's bugged me since I was a kid that NCAA rules their labor force, the players, with an iron fist while coaches have been allowed to job hop and get paid big bucks and I'll take a lesser product before I would support that.
This is on the NCAA, should have compromised with the players before letting things get so ugly they kept getting sued and losing. Under a compromise they might have been able to instill some guidelines and have a measure of control, the horse is out of the barn now and no one knows how to get it back.
I'm not sure the NCAA can put a cap on NIL, will probably have a legal battle if they try.
Heavy transfers and NIL money is not ideal for the game but I can't in good conscience support something limiting either of those unless the same restrictions and caps were put on the coaches. It's bugged me since I was a kid that NCAA rules their labor force, the players, with an iron fist while coaches have been allowed to job hop and get paid big bucks and I'll take a lesser product before I would support that.
This is on the NCAA, should have compromised with the players before letting things get so ugly they kept getting sued and losing. Under a compromise they might have been able to instill some guidelines and have a measure of control, the horse is out of the barn now and no one knows how to get it back.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
The NCAA will cease to be soon in college football and probably basketball. There will be no need for them.
Going forward there really will be no need for the players to even attend class if they choose not to.
The boosters will have to see who can outspend each other.
Going forward there really will be no need for the players to even attend class if they choose not to.
The boosters will have to see who can outspend each other.
TLEF316
Footballguy
Would be shut down in court in approximately 7 seconds.
The toothpaste is out of the tube now. No chance it goes back in.
And 95% of the money being paid to players isn't NIL. It's just boosters buying players that are good at their sport. Has nothing to do with their name, image and likeness.
"NIL" plus the transfer portal with instant eligibility was the perfect storm. You can either accept the new reality or stop watching, because it's not changing. I hear some people saying "eventually the boosters will get tired of not getting their money's worth". I promise they don't care. It's just a vanity project for rich guys. They want to be able to brag to the other guys at the country club about how they bought a point guard or quarterback
The toothpaste is out of the tube now. No chance it goes back in.
And 95% of the money being paid to players isn't NIL. It's just boosters buying players that are good at their sport. Has nothing to do with their name, image and likeness.
"NIL" plus the transfer portal with instant eligibility was the perfect storm. You can either accept the new reality or stop watching, because it's not changing. I hear some people saying "eventually the boosters will get tired of not getting their money's worth". I promise they don't care. It's just a vanity project for rich guys. They want to be able to brag to the other guys at the country club about how they bought a point guard or quarterback
I don't like it but many many do so it's gonna stay.
Basically, aside from a select few, their careers are over in a year or two so they want to make the best of it.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
As Tlef said there is no way to put a cap on how much a player can make off their own name image and likeness.
IrishTwinkie
Footballguy
Putting a cap on the NIL money will just push it all under the table, again. The transfers will not stop.
TLEF316
Footballguy
Most of them aren't making ANYTHING from that, but that's the story we're all sticking with.
When you've got local car dealerships giving the entire offensive line (even the 5th string tackle who the head coach couldn't even pick out of a lineup) free Trucks for their "name, image and likeness", you know the entire thing is a farce. But that's where we are.
Caleb Williams is the only Football or basketball player I've seen in a national commercial since "NIL" came into play. And that's pretty much the level of exposure you would need to justify a high 6 figure/low 7 figure "NIL" contract. Its pay for play and everyone knows it.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
How much a business is paying them for how much work they are actually doing doesn't matter. You can't take away their right to make money off of it.
rockaction
Footballguy
Yep.
FairWarning
Footballguy
They messed up when the Northwestern players wanted to unionize.
FairWarning
Footballguy
Unfortunately that isn’t going to happen. As long as the coaches can leave, so will the players. The players are there mainly because of the coaches.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
I get why it’s convenient to tie player movement to coaches moving but the two are really separate issues. Coaches are contract employees who enjoy all the protections that go with that status including in the event of termination. The NCAA really has no basis whatsoever to tell a kid where he can play or for how long. I think the next shoe to drop might be eligibility rules altogether. Who’s to say a kid can only play 4 years? That’s arbitrary and lacks any meaningful foundation.
Current NCAA rules allow an athlete to transfer once without penalty but for a second transfer they have to sit out one season. There’s a lawsuit pending now that’s almost certainly going to eliminate that desperate last hook they’re trying to hang on to. It’s possible the entire portal mechanism will be scrapped altogether.
Wigglytuff's Gruff
Footballguy
I like the portal.
Guys moving on to places they can revive a potential career in the game is a good thing. Ken Walker a good example, nobody knows who that guy is if he stays at Wake Forest.
Guys moving on to places they can revive a potential career in the game is a good thing. Ken Walker a good example, nobody knows who that guy is if he stays at Wake Forest.
CalBear
Footballguy
It's hard to see how this all gets resolved, but my hope, as a long-time college sports fan, is that the sports machines like Alabama and USC reorganize into sports clubs of the sort they have in Europe, only nominally connected to the university, and football and basketball programs at actual academic institutions work more like gymnastics and lacrosse.
Hooper31
Footballguy
Watching fans cling to a past that was unfair to players is interesting. It's fascinating to watch the ebb and flow of money as change happens. The free market will win out in the end if we let it. The transition years will be awkward. Perhaps painful to see happen for some.
I've been in education for over thirty years and spent a lot of years coaching track, basketball, and golf. I've felt that the marriage of sports and education has been a bad one for a long time. I would prefer a complete divorce of the two from top to bottom. In my opinion no public dollar should ever be spent on sports in schools. If a municipality or state wants to spend dollars on sports programs, gyms, fields, etc. great. Just divorce it away from schools. I'm talking in both directions. Not passing your classes? That shouldn't impact your eligibility to play sports. If someone wants to make the argument that coercing minimal grades out of kids to be eligible for sports is a good thing, I think they're foolish in the worst ways.
I've been in education for over thirty years and spent a lot of years coaching track, basketball, and golf. I've felt that the marriage of sports and education has been a bad one for a long time. I would prefer a complete divorce of the two from top to bottom. In my opinion no public dollar should ever be spent on sports in schools. If a municipality or state wants to spend dollars on sports programs, gyms, fields, etc. great. Just divorce it away from schools. I'm talking in both directions. Not passing your classes? That shouldn't impact your eligibility to play sports. If someone wants to make the argument that coercing minimal grades out of kids to be eligible for sports is a good thing, I think they're foolish in the worst ways.
-OZ-
Footballguy
And most of us don’t care.
Many of These players make money for their schools, they should make some for themselves.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
I’m all for players getting paid for their brand, but I also believe it separates the haves and have nots (teams) even more.
One of the biggest cons of NIL is the potential for imbalances between players. Some athletes may have a better chance of receiving deals than others, leading to inequities within teams and even different sports. This can create tension and resentment among teammates. if there was a cap it might lessen that.
Cons of NIL
5. Transfers
Many athletes leave their current schools to get better NIL opportunities at a school that can offer more. Smaller schools often lose their best players to bigger schools looking to sweep away their best athletes.6. Recruiting Violations
Some schools illegally pay athletes to come to their schools but disguise the payment as some sort of NIL deal. Coaches, boosters, etc. are not allowed to directly pay recruits. This is seen as a form of bribery and is very much against NCAA rules, but with the new name, image, and likeness rules, people have found a way around these violations.7. Unequal Deals Within Sports
Other athletes like football and basketball players make a lot more money than other sports that don’t generate as much money. This leads to a lot of inequality among athletes who might not make as much as others.8. Unequal Deals Within Divisions
Division II and III athletes have much more limited NIL opportunities depending on their school and location.One of the biggest cons of NIL is the potential for imbalances between players. Some athletes may have a better chance of receiving deals than others, leading to inequities within teams and even different sports. This can create tension and resentment among teammates. if there was a cap it might lessen that.
massraider
Footballguy
Why should a college player with no guarantee of future NFL millions get his ability to make money as an American restricted because you THINK it MIGHT adversely affect parity in college football.
How many hundreds of millions of dollars did former college athletes (who never played in the NFL) miss out on because the NCAA restricted their AMERICAN right to make money in the free market? Billions? Maybe billions of dollars?
massraider
Footballguy
Maybe NIL is awesome.
Maybe Harvard, Stanford and Texas Tech will make national title runs because tech and oil money allows them to acquire good players.
That would be awesome!!
Maybe Harvard, Stanford and Texas Tech will make national title runs because tech and oil money allows them to acquire good players.
That would be awesome!!
JohnnyU
Footballguy
No simple solution, but maybe a capped NIL of some kind is. There are negatives to NIL whether anyone wants to admit or not.
TLEF316
Footballguy
For the "kids should be able to do whatever they want" crowd.....how far does it go?
We're basically at the point where the NCAA is petrified about going to court and bends whenever they are challenged (2nd transfer waivers for example)
Are you guys ok with in-season transfers? Alabama loses their qb and decides to spend 2 million dollars to buy someone else's on November 15th. Cool?
And as someone noted earlier...4 years of eligibility is the next problem. The ncaa cracked the door by giving everyone a 5th year for covid (leading to a bunch of 24 and 25 year olds all over college basketball, which is dumb). That ends next year, but what happens the year after when someone who doesn't get a 5th year sues? We cool with a bunch of 27 year olds who can't make the nba but are good enough to dominate college hoops sticking around for 9 years making NIL money?
The NCAA as an organization was/is a joke. A lot of the kids were getting absolutely screwed. But you need SOME rules if we're going to have college sports. State Attorneys general filing a lawsuit because their school's 26 year old 3x transfer got denied immediate eligibility is a bit silly.
We're basically at the point where the NCAA is petrified about going to court and bends whenever they are challenged (2nd transfer waivers for example)
Are you guys ok with in-season transfers? Alabama loses their qb and decides to spend 2 million dollars to buy someone else's on November 15th. Cool?
And as someone noted earlier...4 years of eligibility is the next problem. The ncaa cracked the door by giving everyone a 5th year for covid (leading to a bunch of 24 and 25 year olds all over college basketball, which is dumb). That ends next year, but what happens the year after when someone who doesn't get a 5th year sues? We cool with a bunch of 27 year olds who can't make the nba but are good enough to dominate college hoops sticking around for 9 years making NIL money?
The NCAA as an organization was/is a joke. A lot of the kids were getting absolutely screwed. But you need SOME rules if we're going to have college sports. State Attorneys general filing a lawsuit because their school's 26 year old 3x transfer got denied immediate eligibility is a bit silly.
massraider
Footballguy
There were negatives to the old system.
Teams did the best they could under that system.
They will do their best under the new system.
Nugget
Footballguy
Kansas Jayhawks and the University of Kansas should be separate at this point. If the players want to use their money to attend college, fantastic.
massraider
Footballguy
Current College Sports Television Contracts
Trying to figure out which network has tv rights for which conference and for which sports or games? Check our updated list.
businessofcollegesports.com
eighsse2
Footballguy
That makes sense. So I guess, what if the athletes just received some (relatively) small player-by-player abitrated portion of that revenue? I guess that still wouldn't solve the disparity problem ... Big schools would be in big conferences being paid big money ... Players going to those schools would be getting more money ...Current College Sports Television Contracts
Trying to figure out which network has tv rights for which conference and for which sports or games? Check our updated list.
eighsse2
Footballguy
A nice way to do it would be an equal NIL cap for each school, but either (a) the cap would be so high that smaller schools wouldn't even be able to reach it, in which case it's back to square one, or (b) the cap would be low enough that every school could max out their cap, but then so low that the players as a whole would not be earning as much as is deemed fair, though they would be receiving significant earnings.
massraider
Footballguy
Let's say they did, that would constitute some sort of salary. Fine.
But that is not what NIL is.
NIL is endorsement money. Or money some kid makes on his Tiktok or Instagram. That's what NIL is.
Let's say you have a kid who golfs. And he gets a partial scholarship to Western Michigan to play on their golf team. Free school for playing golf. And let's say your kid makes a YouTube channel where he makes trick golf shots with his buddies. And he starts making money from his channel. And a local car dealership gives him a free car lease while he's in school, so YOU don't have to buy him a car.
But see, the golf team at Eastern Michigan doesn't have a kid with a popular YouTube channel, so-----sorry!!! We have to take your kids money, and give it to the kids at Eastern Michigan, because it's MIGHT NOT BE FAIR to the competitive balance of the Directional Michigan Golf School Conference.
As a father, do you feel this is fair?
FairWarning
Footballguy
It would be far easier to do in basketball than football. There will be a school that will pay for a fab-5 type of team.
Spartans Rule
Footballguy
On top of the already-mentioned TV revenue, there’s the donations.
Look at these stupid numbers
It makes headlines when billionaires pony up the millions to cover a coach contract or buyout, but there’s also just legions of ordinary rich alumni giving their schools tens of thousands per year so they can park next to the football stadium, have really good seats, and shake the coach’s hand at a golf outing.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Is anyone really in this crowd?
Most of us want some rules.
I feel targeted (EMU undergrad, KU law school)
-OZ-
Footballguy
Never say never but this really doesn’t seem like it would work. A LOT of money going into these sports is due to their representing schools.
Nobody would care about non-NBA basketball teams in North Carolina, Kentucky or Kansas. But we sure do when they’re Duke, Kentucky, Kansas and UNC.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Well, if it's freight train out of control and nothing can be done, people shouldn't cry when it all falls apart.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
The picture for ALL colleges is far more reaching than just viewership for college football playoffs.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Sure, but is it really out of control?
transfers and NIL are fine IMO.
I wouldn’t want to see in season transfers, but if these are basically one year deals, I’m good with it.
massraider
Footballguy
habsfan
Footballguy
From the outside looking in, I find it weird to talk about rules when there are as many people in the "ecosystem" trying to break (or work around) every rule they can as often as they can as there are people who want rules. The amateur career is when we're still pretending it isn't all about money and the pro career is when we finally admit it is.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
I posted some cons in an earlier post.
massraider
Footballguy
Yes, I saw it.
Some players might not like it if other players are making more than them. ----Did Michael Jordan's Nike deal tear apart the very fabric of the NBA, creating massive divisions between him and BIll Cartwright? Or........was Bill Cartwright happy to be playing with MJ?
Students are allowed to transfer to better programs. They always should have been allowed to, and the school they are leaving is completely within their rights to accept incoming transfers.
Texas just signed Sarkisian to a $10 mill/year deal, with use of two cars and a private jet.
Now how is that fair to Utah State?
massraider
Footballguy
I really really don't want to seem to be more of a jerk than I normally am about this. But a cap on player endorsements is un-American, it just is. I love NIL. LOVE IT. Free agency?? YES!! and some kid blows up at a smaller school, and gets to play on a big stage, I love this.
People evaluate draft picks, and if they play in a crap conference, everyone holds it against them, right? Well, this EDGE played at Buffalo, so he gets knocked down two rounds. Instead, he gets to transfer to West Virginia, and make the life changing money his talent and hard work deserve. I think that's totally awesome.
People evaluate draft picks, and if they play in a crap conference, everyone holds it against them, right? Well, this EDGE played at Buffalo, so he gets knocked down two rounds. Instead, he gets to transfer to West Virginia, and make the life changing money his talent and hard work deserve. I think that's totally awesome.
-OZ-
Footballguy
OTOH, players who develop later than others aren’t stuck with the school they could get into out of high school.
I suppose there could be some rule about compensation to schools the kids leave but that seems overly complicated and with potential for more issues.
Spartans Rule
Footballguy
I think there's an opportunity for the smaller schools to get higher-caliber talent when there's no transfer restrictions.
Ask that 4-star guy why he wants to go to Michigan State and redshirt as a freshman when he can come to Eastern Michigan and be a star for a year or two, then transfer with no penalty.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
You keep saying this and refuse to listen to the fact that it is illegal to cap it.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Illegal? Link?
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
By "something else" we could call it "the way its done for all sports in every other country in the entire world."
