An Open Letter to the NFL: (1 Viewer)

[ghostguy123]

I have no issue whatsoever with the rules put in place for safety, but the illegal contact, the 'what is or isn't PI' mess that puts refs in a bad position...those need to change.

I have a pretty big issue with the 15 yard penalties when a blitzer comes flying in and slaps the QB on the top of the head when trying to block the pass........sometimes it even occurs cause the lineman will block the guy a certain way causing his arm to accidentaly slap the QB on the top of the head. These aren't hits or forearm shivers............they are failry light slaps on the top of a damn rock hard HELMET!!!!!!!!!!

Meanwhile after every play several players on the field are slapping their teammates on the helmet to say "good play"............and doing it much harder than the guy who was just flagged 15 yards for doing it to the QB.

I am fine with the rules that actually DO help with safety, not that total abomination of a rule.

 

[ghostguy123]

Change PI to a 15 yard flat penalty.

Illegal contact should be 5 yards BUT NOT an automatic first down.

Those two changes would make the game vastly more competitive and watchable because they're not game changers.

I cannot possibly agree harder with this than I am right now.

In theory I agree..........but wouldnt this lead to even MORE of these penalties and MORE stoppage in play for penalties?

 

[ghostguy123]

, and I expect we will start to see some pretty dramatic declines in tv ratings in the next few years unless these fundamental problems are addressed. I have never seen this level of dissatisfaction and people are starting to realize that there a lot of cool things to do on a beautiful Sunday afternoon in the Fall.

The TV ratings thing will be interesting to see. People will still watch I think, but WHAT will they be watching? A game, redzone, something new?

The number of people who just sit and watch a game is dwindling hard right now.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

I'm going to put on my flak jacket now.

People have been moaning about the game going to #### for approximately forever. There is always something (or multiple somethings) that is ruining the game. And yet...

Viewership is up. Brand awareness is up.

Viewership is up on ####### reality TV shows like the Kardashians..............does that mean the quality is going up?

Actually. the Kardashian numbers are going down. Excellent point.

What I was saying is not that there is a direct relationship between viewership and quality (which is entirely subjective of course). What I am saying is that whatever the NFL is doing right now is working for them. Guys on message boards don't drive business decisions, money does.

Do I think the NFL will last forever? Of course not, nothing does. But all of these "Roman Empire" type comparisons are way off IMO. The NFL may topple tomorrow. The US may topple tomorrow. ANYTHING might topple tomorrow. Those guys may be right, and the NFL is on the edge of disaster, but you could say the same thing about every organization in the world. But until there is something meaningful to suggest that it actually will, speculating that it's right around the corner (as many here seem to be doing) doesn't seem to make sense.

 

[ChuckLiddell]

Have only read the first page, so I dont know if this has been touched on yet...but the ridiculous "completing the process of the catch" rule is just as big of a gripe for me as anything else. They are taking away legitimate touchdowns (or at least they should be legitimate), not because of penalty, but because the actual rules are written in a way that makes it the correct call technically, but from a common sense standpoint, it is moronic. Between that and the unbelievably ridiculous tuck rule, the NFL is messing with the integrity of the game from their plush offices, not on the field.

I also hate the excessive celebration rules. I find that stuff entertaining, and believe that it gets players and fans pumped up. Its not golf.

I dont disagree with the gripes about PI and illegal contact, but these other issues bother me more personally. I do understand that given the fact that players have become bigger, stronger, and faster that rules have to be put in place to protect the players and ultimately the game from it/themselves, so I while I dont like the immediate impact of some of the rules that are being enforced, I do understand that for the good of the game long-term they are necessary.

This logic however does not apply to all of the rules that are in place.

 

[habsfan]

Do I think the NFL will last forever? Of course not, nothing does. But all of these "Roman Empire" type comparisons are way off IMO. The NFL may topple tomorrow. The US may topple tomorrow. ANYTHING might topple tomorrow. Those guys may be right, and the NFL is on the edge of disaster, but you could say the same thing about every organization in the world. But until there is something meaningful to suggest that it actually will, speculating that it's right around the corner (as many here seem to be doing) doesn't seem to make sense.

In the eyes of "true" football fans, it's an impending collapse. I see it more as a gradual but accelerating transition from sport to spectacle. Whoever compared it to WWF has touched upon some aspects of this transition but one important difference is that the NFL has a more respected lineage and that credibility will take a lot longer to erode.

Arguing about whether the "sizzle" has or will pass the "steak" in terms of importance is beside the point because either way we appear to be on that vector. All these things that used to be ancillary to the actual game (fantasy and anything else that further monetizes it) are now parasitic.

I have no doubt that all the "measureables" like viewership are up. Sure the games are "on" but fewer and fewer people are paying any real attention to what's actually going on.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Do I think the NFL will last forever? Of course not, nothing does. But all of these "Roman Empire" type comparisons are way off IMO. The NFL may topple tomorrow. The US may topple tomorrow. ANYTHING might topple tomorrow. Those guys may be right, and the NFL is on the edge of disaster, but you could say the same thing about every organization in the world. But until there is something meaningful to suggest that it actually will, speculating that it's right around the corner (as many here seem to be doing) doesn't seem to make sense.

In the eyes of "true" football fans, it's an impending collapse. I see it more as a gradual but accelerating transition from sport to spectacle. Whoever compared it to WWF has touched upon some aspects of this transition but one important difference is that the NFL has a more respected lineage and that credibility will take a lot longer to erode.

Arguing about whether the "sizzle" has or will pass the "steak" in terms of importance is beside the point because either way we appear to be on that vector. All these things that used to be ancillary to the actual game (fantasy and anything else that further monetizes it) are now parasitic.

I have no doubt that all the "measureables" like viewership are up. Sure the games are "on" but fewer and fewer people are paying any real attention to what's actually going on.

This is the attitude I don't understand. Any time you need to resort to "true" in quotation marks, it's a pretty clear tip off about your mind-set. Obviously, there is a subset of "true" or "diehard" fans who hate (or claim to hate, but still watch anyway) the new game. But does that even matter?

What about the game makes you think it is a spectacle in lieu of being a true competition? It is most certainly a DIFFERENT competition than it used to be, but that doesn't mean it is any LESS competitive. The games aren't rigged like WWE matches are. You still need to be an unbelievable athlete just to make it on to the field. Players work just as hard if not harder at their craft, and for a longer period of time. MAYBE the guys don't need to be as "tough" as they used to, but I'm not really even convinced of that. They might be taking fewer intentionally viscous blows from their opponents, but the average blows they take are from bigger, faster, stronger guys.

I'm not sure I understand why fewer people would be paying attention than before either. Are there more casual fans, driven by culture and the gambling aspects? Probably. But while the former may have a game on for background noise at a party, the latter (most of US by the way) are sure as Hell paying attention more than ever. I think our culture pays attention less in general, and our attention spans are certainly dropping. But that really doesn't have anything to do with the NFL.

 

[RBM]

Change PI to a 15 yard flat penalty.

Illegal contact should be 5 yards BUT NOT an automatic first down.

You ready to see guys just get tackled before the catch on anything over 20 yards?

Absolutely agree about the illegal contract crap. No brainer.

 

[General Tso]

There's a lot of small measures the NFL can take to improve the game. Several have been mentioned here. It's just poor leadership, with a little bit of arrogance mixed in.

Bud Selig gets a lot of abuse but when you think about it he really has instituted some meaningful changes that have improved baseball - the extra wildcard, the 1 game playoff, inter league play, revenue sharing... Goodell hasn't done anything but make the game worse. But he had impeccable timing. He came in at the perfect moment when fantasy football and other stars aligned to guarantee a period of guaranteed growth. Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good.

 

[Vision6]

People have been moaning about the game going to #### for approximately forever. There is always something (or multiple somethings) that is ruining the game. And yet...

Viewership is up. Brand awareness is up.

Lol "and yet"

Viewership and brand awareness being up is the reason why the game is going #### in the first place. The nfl is now marketed to women, people who hate violence, pretty much anyone who isn't a legitimate fan. The people who are more excited about commercials and bad halftime shows than the actual game.

The only thing that can save the nfl is hopefully these player behaviors scandles keep occurring driving away droves of consumers relegating the nfl to an unacknowledged nhl type of existence forcing the league to cater to the true fans once again because they are the only ones left.

 

[General Tso]

It's no longer true that viewership is up across the board. The Monday Night ratings were down about 12% through week 3. Thursdaynight ratings are up but that's because they're on CBS which is available to everyone. Wait until they go to the NFL Network after week 8. I guarantee you those ratings will be down as well.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

People have been moaning about the game going to #### for approximately forever. There is always something (or multiple somethings) that is ruining the game. And yet...

Viewership is up. Brand awareness is up.

Lol "and yet"

Viewership and brand awareness being up is the reason why the game is going #### in the first place. The nfl is now marketed to women, people who hate violence, pretty much anyone who isn't a legitimate fan. The people who are more excited about commercials and bad halftime shows than the actual game.

The only thing that can save the nfl is hopefully these player behaviors scandles keep occurring driving away droves of consumers relegating the nfl to an unacknowledged nhl type of existence forcing the league to cater to the true fans once again because they are the only ones left.

Honestly, this kind of response is exactly why I'm not worried about the "death" of football. You know women can vote now right?

By your standards, I'm fairly sure my "fandom" is illegitimate. But I hate commercials and halftime shows. Go figure.

 

[Hooper31]

People have been moaning about the game going to #### for approximately forever. There is always something (or multiple somethings) that is ruining the game. And yet...

Viewership is up. Brand awareness is up.

Lol "and yet"

Viewership and brand awareness being up is the reason why the game is going #### in the first place. The nfl is now marketed to women, people who hate violence, pretty much anyone who isn't a legitimate fan. The people who are more excited about commercials and bad halftime shows than the actual game.

The only thing that can save the nfl is hopefully these player behaviors scandles keep occurring driving away droves of consumers relegating the nfl to an unacknowledged nhl type of existence forcing the league to cater to the true fans once again because they are the only ones left.

World would be a great place if everyone was a copy of you. Boring, but better for you I guess.

I love where the NFL has come from, where it is, and where its going. If you don't approve, well, bye. You're in the minority, and the NFL won't be changing to suit your needs anytime soon.

 

[Grahamburn]

People have been moaning about the game going to #### for approximately forever. There is always something (or multiple somethings) that is ruining the game. And yet...

Viewership is up. Brand awareness is up.

Lol "and yet"

Viewership and brand awareness being up is the reason why the game is going #### in the first place. The nfl is now marketed to women, people who hate violence, pretty much anyone who isn't a legitimate fan. The people who are more excited about commercials and bad halftime shows than the actual game.

The only thing that can save the nfl is hopefully these player behaviors scandles keep occurring driving away droves of consumers relegating the nfl to an unacknowledged nhl type of existence forcing the league to cater to the true fans once again because they are the only ones left.

World would be a great place if everyone was a copy of you. Boring, but better for you I guess.

I love where the NFL has come from, where it is, and where its going. If you don't approve, well, bye. You're in the minority, and the NFL won't be changing to suit your needs anytime soon.

You're a Seattle fan, right? I imagine it's pretty easy for you to enjoy it right now.

The NFL has made it virtually impossible for most fans of an individual team to enjoy their actual product (the game itself in its 60 minute entirety). They've watered it down too much with horrible rule changes, penalties, and stoppage of play.

The game between the two teams on the field has become secondary to the individual player's statistical performances. It's intentional and they're obviously capitalizing on it.

Everyone loves Red Zone because you're getting the instant gratification of uninterrupted plays and fantasy statistics. The NFL has set us all up to pay for this channel because they've made the individual games we're actually paying for through our cable provider so brutally unwatchable we now pay them twice. Genius.

 

[Dondante]

People have been moaning about the game going to #### for approximately forever. There is always something (or multiple somethings) that is ruining the game. And yet...

Viewership is up. Brand awareness is up.

Lol "and yet"

Viewership and brand awareness being up is the reason why the game is going #### in the first place. The nfl is now marketed to women, people who hate violence, pretty much anyone who isn't a legitimate fan. The people who are more excited about commercials and bad halftime shows than the actual game.

The only thing that can save the nfl is hopefully these player behaviors scandles keep occurring driving away droves of consumers relegating the nfl to an unacknowledged nhl type of existence forcing the league to cater to the true fans once again because they are the only ones left.

World would be a great place if everyone was a copy of you. Boring, but better for you I guess.

I love where the NFL has come from, where it is, and where its going. If you don't approve, well, bye. You're in the minority, and the NFL won't be changing to suit your needs anytime soon.

You're a Seattle fan, right? I imagine it's pretty easy for you to enjoy it right now.

The NFL has made it virtually impossible for most fans of an individual team to enjoy their actual product (the game itself in its 60 minute entirety). They've watered it down too much with horrible rule changes, penalties, and stoppage of play.

The game between the two teams on the field has become secondary to the individual player's statistical performances. It's intentional and they're obviously capitalizing on it.

Everyone loves Red Zone because you're getting the instant gratification of uninterrupted plays and fantasy statistics. The NFL has set us all up to pay for this channel because they've made the individual games we're actually paying for through our cable provider so brutally unwatchable we now pay them twice. Genius.

Yep.

 

[Hooper31]

You're a Seattle fan, right? I imagine it's pretty easy for you to enjoy it right now.

Yes, but I enjoyed the game just as much while my team went over twenty years without a playoff win. Thanks, Ken Behring.

The NFL has made it virtually impossible for most fans of an individual team to enjoy their actual product (the game itself in its 60 minute entirety). They've watered it down too much with horrible rule changes, penalties, and stoppage of play.

The game between the two teams on the field has become secondary to the individual player's statistical performances. It's intentional and they're obviously capitalizing on it.

Everyone loves Red Zone because you're getting the instant gratification of uninterrupted plays and fantasy statistics. The NFL has set us all up to pay for this channel because they've made the individual games we're actually paying for through our cable provider so brutally unwatchable we now pay them twice. Genius.

Your opinions. You don't like that the league is maximizing their profits at the expense of your personal tastes. If you can't live with it I suggest you take your entertainment dollars elsewhere. The NFL will be more than happy to keep raking in record profits at the expense of you being unhappy with their product.

 

[Grahamburn]

I have absolutely no problem with the NFL turning a gigantic profit. What is bothering me is how they've gone about injecting themselves into the game artificially with awful rules and micro-managed officiating when they didn't need to. Somebody somewhere decided more flags meant more money.

Do you think people would be watching the NFL less if there were fewer flags and a touchdown dance once in a while?

 

[General Tso]

You're a Seattle fan, right? I imagine it's pretty easy for you to enjoy it right now.

Yes, but I enjoyed the game just as much while my team went over twenty years without a playoff win. Thanks, Ken Behring.

The NFL has made it virtually impossible for most fans of an individual team to enjoy their actual product (the game itself in its 60 minute entirety). They've watered it down too much with horrible rule changes, penalties, and stoppage of play.

The game between the two teams on the field has become secondary to the individual player's statistical performances. It's intentional and they're obviously capitalizing on it.

Everyone loves Red Zone because you're getting the instant gratification of uninterrupted plays and fantasy statistics. The NFL has set us all up to pay for this channel because they've made the individual games we're actually paying for through our cable provider so brutally unwatchable we now pay them twice. Genius.

Your opinions. You don't like that the league is maximizing their profits at the expense of your personal tastes. If you can't live with it I suggest you take your entertainment dollars elsewhere. The NFL will be more than happy to keep raking in record profits at the expense of you being unhappy with their product.

Yeah yeah, we get it. The NFL doesn't care if their longtime core customers leave. Just like we wouldn't care if you decided to leave this conversation. Do you have anything halfway intelligent to contribute?

 

[MattFancy]

I have no problem with the NFL making money, that's what their in business to do. I just have a problem with them finding any and all ways to eek out a few bucks here and a few buck there from the fans and try to ruin the overall game experience.

Does anyone really like when the games go like this: TD, commercial break, KO, commerical break, TO, commerical break? Yes, the NFL makes a bunch of money off of that, but is it good for the game? No.

Just like the NFL moving the draft to primetime. Did the draft picks get better because they're picked in primetime now? Does having the draft go 3 days instead of 2 suddenly make it better? No. But, the NFL found a way to get more money of it.

They will do just about anything to make a buck at the expense of the fans. I could see if them making more money was because of improvements to the game, but they're not improving it.

I understand taking the headshots out of the game because it's something that is necessary for them to do if the NFL wants to survive long-term. But all the other ticky-tack penalties ruin the flow of the game and make defenses useless. Same with the kickoffs. Why even have them?

 

[Dondante]

I have no problem with the NFL making money, that's what their in business to do. I just have a problem with them finding any and all ways to eek out a few bucks here and a few buck there from the fans and try to ruin the overall game experience.

Does anyone really like when the games go like this: TD, commercial break, KO, commerical break, TO, commerical break? Yes, the NFL makes a bunch of money off of that, but is it good for the game? No.

Just like the NFL moving the draft to primetime. Did the draft picks get better because they're picked in primetime now? Does having the draft go 3 days instead of 2 suddenly make it better? No. But, the NFL found a way to get more money of it.

They will do just about anything to make a buck at the expense of the fans. I could see if them making more money was because of improvements to the game, but they're not improving it.

I understand taking the headshots out of the game because it's something that is necessary for them to do if the NFL wants to survive long-term. But all the other ticky-tack penalties ruin the flow of the game and make defenses useless. Same with the kickoffs. Why even have them?

Ever worked for a corporation?

 

[MattFancy]

I have no problem with the NFL making money, that's what their in business to do. I just have a problem with them finding any and all ways to eek out a few bucks here and a few buck there from the fans and try to ruin the overall game experience.

Does anyone really like when the games go like this: TD, commercial break, KO, commerical break, TO, commerical break? Yes, the NFL makes a bunch of money off of that, but is it good for the game? No.

Just like the NFL moving the draft to primetime. Did the draft picks get better because they're picked in primetime now? Does having the draft go 3 days instead of 2 suddenly make it better? No. But, the NFL found a way to get more money of it.

They will do just about anything to make a buck at the expense of the fans. I could see if them making more money was because of improvements to the game, but they're not improving it.

I understand taking the headshots out of the game because it's something that is necessary for them to do if the NFL wants to survive long-term. But all the other ticky-tack penalties ruin the flow of the game and make defenses useless. Same with the kickoffs. Why even have them?

Ever worked for a corporation?

Again, I understand they're trying to make as much money as possible, but it's hurting their product.

 

[Liquid Tension]

It's a lousy product right now, and it seems to have gotten a lot worse this year.

The average NFL game lasts 3 hours and 12 minutes:

- 11 minutes of actual live game action. 11.

- 17 minutes of replays.

- 75 minutes watching players, coaches and referees loiter on the field.

- 65 minutes of commercials

- 24 minutes halftime and announcer reporting

So only 5% of an NFL game consists of true action. It's no wonder we've seen the emergence of fantasy football, instant replay, and the red zone channel. And it's no wonder attendance at NFL games is declining.

But the problem is that tv ratings have risen dramatically the last 10 years, and that's where all the revenues are generated. So nobody is paying attention to the underlying problems affecting the product. The worm is turning though, and I expect we will start to see some pretty dramatic declines in tv ratings in the next few years unless these fundamental problems are addressed. I have never seen this level of dissatisfaction and people are starting to realize that there a lot of cool things to do on a beautiful Sunday afternoon in the Fall.

I agree with some of it...but how much of that is different from before.

The time allotment for games has been around 3 hours for a long long time.

So its not something that "became" bad. it was always like that.

Or is it the contention of some that there was more time of actual game action? And psst...its more than 11 minutes.

Stopping the dangerous hits is something they have to slow down. But the automatic first downs are killing the game. 3rd and 15 and there is a small hold on the other end of the field for a 1st down is ludicrous. I think teams should be allowed to bump within 10 yards instead of 5, I also would have "flagrant" pass interference which would be a spot foul and regular PI which would be a spot foul or 15 yards whichever is shorter. You don't want corners just taking guys down.

As for the above, we used to get more football, but ever since replay, they let the clock continue on out of bounds plays so we get a lot less real plays dictating the winning team. Out of bounds should stop the clock. I would also seriously think about a different game when it comes to special teams. My brother and I actually "created" a game that would have no special teams. Kickoffs are eliminated and teams start at the 20. Punts would be an automatic 35 yard net and what makes it interesting is that you could punt from anywhere inside the other teams 35 and they would get the ball on the one yard line (possible safety). FG's could be done a lot of ways but we said to have anything inside of 25 yard line be worth 3 points and anything from the 25-30 be worth 2 points. I know the special teams part many people won't like but who wants to see a 100 pound kicker decide games where 300 pound guys are killing each other?

Oh, one other item, why in the world can't coaches use a challenge if they have one under 2 minutes? Makes ZERO sense. Then again, I am someone who has 4 TV's in one room and we watch all the games and have a lot of knowledgeable fans and I am no sure any of us know what a catch is any more

Enjoy

 

[dhockster]

The NFL could actually learn from soccer. It used to be that soccer stopped play everytime a player was offside. Now they only blow the whistle only if the offside player gets the ball or would have gotten the ball. I have no problem if the NFL did not call penalties on players who are clearly not impacting the play.

 

[Godsbrother]

It's a lousy product right now, and it seems to have gotten a lot worse this year.

The average NFL game lasts 3 hours and 12 minutes:

- 11 minutes of actual live game action. 11.

- 17 minutes of replays.

- 75 minutes watching players, coaches and referees loiter on the field.

- 65 minutes of commercials

- 24 minutes halftime and announcer reporting

So only 5% of an NFL game consists of true action. It's no wonder we've seen the emergence of fantasy football, instant replay, and the red zone channel. And it's no wonder attendance at NFL games is declining.

But the problem is that tv ratings have risen dramatically the last 10 years, and that's where all the revenues are generated. So nobody is paying attention to the underlying problems affecting the product. The worm is turning though, and I expect we will start to see some pretty dramatic declines in tv ratings in the next few years unless these fundamental problems are addressed. I have never seen this level of dissatisfaction and people are starting to realize that there a lot of cool things to do on a beautiful Sunday afternoon in the Fall.

I agree with some of it...but how much of that is different from before.

The time allotment for games has been around 3 hours for a long long time.

So its not something that "became" bad. it was always like that.

Or is it the contention of some that there was more time of actual game action? And psst...its more than 11 minutes.

Stopping the dangerous hits is something they have to slow down. But the automatic first downs are killing the game. 3rd and 15 and there is a small hold on the other end of the field for a 1st down is ludicrous. I think teams should be allowed to bump within 10 yards instead of 5, I also would have "flagrant" pass interference which would be a spot foul and regular PI which would be a spot foul or 15 yards whichever is shorter. You don't want corners just taking guys down.

As for the above, we used to get more football, but ever since replay, they let the clock continue on out of bounds plays so we get a lot less real plays dictating the winning team. Out of bounds should stop the clock. I would also seriously think about a different game when it comes to special teams. My brother and I actually "created" a game that would have no special teams. Kickoffs are eliminated and teams start at the 20. Punts would be an automatic 35 yard net and what makes it interesting is that you could punt from anywhere inside the other teams 35 and they would get the ball on the one yard line (possible safety). FG's could be done a lot of ways but we said to have anything inside of 25 yard line be worth 3 points and anything from the 25-30 be worth 2 points. I know the special teams part many people won't like but who wants to see a 100 pound kicker decide games where 300 pound guys are killing each other?

Oh, one other item, why in the world can't coaches use a challenge if they have one under 2 minutes? Makes ZERO sense. Then again, I am someone who has 4 TV's in one room and we watch all the games and have a lot of knowledgeable fans and I am no sure any of us know what a catch is any more

Enjoy

You're right. I don't like the special teams rules you outlined above. IN fact I hate them.

 

[Grahamburn]

Oh, one other item, why in the world can't coaches use a challenge if they have one under 2 minutes? Makes ZERO sense.

Kind of like the Colston fumble late in the TB/NO game where he caught the ball, tucked it, took two steps, braced for the hit, and then got stripped? It was ruled incomplete on the field and because it was inside two minutes the Bucs couldn't challenge. Why didn't the replay officials take a look at this? The Saints kicked a FG to tie it and won the game after another gift first down on a penalty in OT.

Yes, I'm a bitter Buc fan and this game was the last straw.

 

[Dondante]

Oh, one other item, why in the world can't coaches use a challenge if they have one under 2 minutes? Makes ZERO sense.

Kind of like the Colston fumble late in the TB/NO game where he caught the ball, tucked it, took two steps, braced for the hit, and then got stripped? It was ruled incomplete on the field and because it was inside two minutes the Bucs couldn't challenge. Why didn't the replay officials take a look at this? The Saints kicked a FG to tie it and won the game after another gift first down on a penalty in OT.

Yes, I'm a bitter Buc fan and this game was the last straw.

Why? Because the NFL is going the way of the NBA and has been since the Tuck Rule game.

 

[Rubi]

Solution for Sunday afternoons: The Red Zone Channel. 7 hours of football...NO commercials

Solution for Monday Nights: Watch "The Voice" with your S.O. and DVR the game. You'll make her/him happy and as a bonus Gwen/Adam(your preference) is easy on the eyes.

Solution for Sunday and Thursday nights: Sorry,I'll take suggestions,even if you DVR those nights you still get Michaels/Collingsworth/Nance and Sims,sorry.

 

[Hooper31]

Yeah yeah, we get it.

Okay then. So the rest of this is just a whiny rant?

:iHug:

Its not your fault.

 

[ghostguy123]

I'm going to put on my flak jacket now.

People have been moaning about the game going to #### for approximately forever. There is always something (or multiple somethings) that is ruining the game. And yet...

Viewership is up. Brand awareness is up.

Viewership is up on ####### reality TV shows like the Kardashians..............does that mean the quality is going up?

Actually. the Kardashian numbers are going down. Excellent point. What I was saying is not that there is a direct relationship between viewership and quality (which is entirely subjective of course). What I am saying is that whatever the NFL is doing right now is working for them. Guys on message boards don't drive business decisions, money does.

Do I think the NFL will last forever? Of course not, nothing does. But all of these "Roman Empire" type comparisons are way off IMO. The NFL may topple tomorrow. The US may topple tomorrow. ANYTHING might topple tomorrow. Those guys may be right, and the NFL is on the edge of disaster, but you could say the same thing about every organization in the world. But until there is something meaningful to suggest that it actually will, speculating that it's right around the corner (as many here seem to be doing) doesn't seem to make sense.

Making many changes, none of which has to do with making the game itself better, is a recipe for a blowup.

And the fact that the ratings of the kardashian crap are going down helps me prove my point so thanks for that. Those ratings were through the roof but oversaturation killed it. Oversaturation of a lesser product is bad.

 

[ghostguy123]

If the NFL loses the die hard fans, they will eventually lose the rest of the fans who pretty much only follow the sport to fit in with those die hard fans. You know, the fans who throw the parties, set up the tailgaiting, run the fantasy leagues........list goes on.

 

[comfortably numb]

I have no problem with the NFL making money, that's what their in business to do. I just have a problem with them finding any and all ways to eek out a few bucks here and a few buck there from the fans and try to ruin the overall game experience.

Does anyone really like when the games go like this: TD, commercial break, KO, commerical break, TO, commerical break? Yes, the NFL makes a bunch of money off of that, but is it good for the game? No.

Just like the NFL moving the draft to primetime. Did the draft picks get better because they're picked in primetime now? Does having the draft go 3 days instead of 2 suddenly make it better? No. But, the NFL found a way to get more money of it.

They will do just about anything to make a buck at the expense of the fans. I could see if them making more money was because of improvements to the game, but they're not improving it.

I understand taking the headshots out of the game because it's something that is necessary for them to do if the NFL wants to survive long-term. But all the other ticky-tack penalties ruin the flow of the game and make defenses useless. Same with the kickoffs. Why even have them?

Ever worked for a corporation?

Right.

I actually like the draft in prime time.

Yea they are milking it and why wouldn't they. It's an entertainment event.

 

[dschuler]

Change PI to a 15 yard flat penalty.

Illegal contact should be 5 yards BUT NOT an automatic first down.

Those two changes would make the game vastly more competitive and watchable because they're not game changers.

I cannot possibly agree harder with this than I am right now.

So true. It would fix this mess quite a bit.

 

[ghostguy123]

Change PI to a 15 yard flat penalty.

Illegal contact should be 5 yards BUT NOT an automatic first down.

Those two changes would make the game vastly more competitive and watchable because they're not game changers.

I cannot possibly agree harder with this than I am right now.

So true. It would fix this mess quite a bit.

Again, will ask.................do you think this will cause LESS penalties?? Seems to me they would double because the consequence for PI or illegal contact would be far less severe

 

[DaveL]

I've even bailed on the Red Zone this year. I'm quite content doing other things on Sunday and monitoring the stats on my phone as they roll in.

I'm the complete opposite. I don't check my scores until Monday morning. Games are MUCH more enjoyable when not freaking out about stuff you can't control

 

[ghostguy123]

I've even bailed on the Red Zone this year. I'm quite content doing other things on Sunday and monitoring the stats on my phone as they roll in.

I kinda doubt I would be able to do/enjoy FF without watching actual football. I mean, every move you make would be based on what?? Stats and rotoworld posts? Random rankings?

If a lot of people did this though, I think after a while fantasy would dwindle a bit.

 

[comfortably numb]

I've even bailed on the Red Zone this year. I'm quite content doing other things on Sunday and monitoring the stats on my phone as they roll in.

I'm the complete opposite. I don't check my scores until Monday morning. Games are MUCH more enjoyable when not freaking out about stuff you can't control

I just checked my week 13 matchup from 2009.

I just need need 6pts from Antonio Freeman on MNF to clinch a playoff spot

:HAWKSCREECH:

 

[pecorino]

Sold our overvalued seat licenses a couple years ago and haven't regretted it for one minute. Lots not to like about the NFL and the OP is spot on about the endless penalties. True, my Steelers are hard to watch this year, but I think it is more pervasive than just one team. Just not a good product right now.

 

[DaveGrumbles]

I hate to do it but I have to side with the embittered longtime fan on this one. I grew up a Los Angeles Ram fan so I've spent the last 20 years without a team. Yet during that time I played football, watched football and flat out loved football. I guess I would label myself a hardcore fan as every weekend I watch something like 75% of the games with zero rooting interest in half of them.

All that said, I can safely say without fan bias that the game has drastically changed in the last 5 years or so. Like the NBA there has become an obsession with over-regulation of play (and the NBA is really awesome, right?). It's gotten to the point that wins & losses are far more dependant on how the game is called rather than how its played. That's sad. I'm not romanticizing the history of the game but I'm frustrated with waiting for the inevitable flag after every play. It's just ugly to watch. And as others have said, when the hardcore fan abandons the game...the casual fan is soon to follow.

 

[ghostguy123]

It does kinda suck now that the most enjoyable part of the NFL doesnt even have anything to do with the games (Fantasy, gambling, tailgating)..............obviously not everyone feels this way, but I am gonna go ahead and say MOST feel this way. By most I mean more than 50%, not 99%.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

I'd like to see them consider penalties away from the play to be like an uncatchable ball for PI. Exception would be personal fouls, but why worry about hands to the face on the other side of the field?

In any case, i agree that just a few tweaks would make the penalty-fest more manageable. I've really noticed a lot flags that take away from the rhythm of the game.

 

[Grigs Allmoon]

The NFL could actually learn from soccer. It used to be that soccer stopped play everytime a player was offside. Now they only blow the whistle only if the offside player gets the ball or would have gotten the ball. I have no problem if the NFL did not call penalties on players who are clearly not impacting the play.

That's not a bad idea...

ETA: Although, it would add a lot more subjectivity to rulings, which I am wholly against.

ETA: Also, what happens on a play where a LT holds a DE on a run to the right, and the RB fumbles 30 yards down field, 4 seconds later...? Does the ref throw the flag when he see's anything, with an option to pick it up later, if it indeed had no impact after the play is over?

After further review... The ruling on the field is overturned. Bad idea!

 

[Liquid Tension]

It's a lousy product right now, and it seems to have gotten a lot worse this year.

The average NFL game lasts 3 hours and 12 minutes:

- 11 minutes of actual live game action. 11.

- 17 minutes of replays.

- 75 minutes watching players, coaches and referees loiter on the field.

- 65 minutes of commercials

- 24 minutes halftime and announcer reporting

So only 5% of an NFL game consists of true action. It's no wonder we've seen the emergence of fantasy football, instant replay, and the red zone channel. And it's no wonder attendance at NFL games is declining.

But the problem is that tv ratings have risen dramatically the last 10 years, and that's where all the revenues are generated. So nobody is paying attention to the underlying problems affecting the product. The worm is turning though, and I expect we will start to see some pretty dramatic declines in tv ratings in the next few years unless these fundamental problems are addressed. I have never seen this level of dissatisfaction and people are starting to realize that there a lot of cool things to do on a beautiful Sunday afternoon in the Fall.

I agree with some of it...but how much of that is different from before.

The time allotment for games has been around 3 hours for a long long time.

So its not something that "became" bad. it was always like that.

Or is it the contention of some that there was more time of actual game action? And psst...its more than 11 minutes.

Stopping the dangerous hits is something they have to slow down. But the automatic first downs are killing the game. 3rd and 15 and there is a small hold on the other end of the field for a 1st down is ludicrous. I think teams should be allowed to bump within 10 yards instead of 5, I also would have "flagrant" pass interference which would be a spot foul and regular PI which would be a spot foul or 15 yards whichever is shorter. You don't want corners just taking guys down.

As for the above, we used to get more football, but ever since replay, they let the clock continue on out of bounds plays so we get a lot less real plays dictating the winning team. Out of bounds should stop the clock. I would also seriously think about a different game when it comes to special teams. My brother and I actually "created" a game that would have no special teams. Kickoffs are eliminated and teams start at the 20. Punts would be an automatic 35 yard net and what makes it interesting is that you could punt from anywhere inside the other teams 35 and they would get the ball on the one yard line (possible safety). FG's could be done a lot of ways but we said to have anything inside of 25 yard line be worth 3 points and anything from the 25-30 be worth 2 points. I know the special teams part many people won't like but who wants to see a 100 pound kicker decide games where 300 pound guys are killing each other?

Oh, one other item, why in the world can't coaches use a challenge if they have one under 2 minutes? Makes ZERO sense. Then again, I am someone who has 4 TV's in one room and we watch all the games and have a lot of knowledgeable fans and I am no sure any of us know what a catch is any more

Enjoy

You're right. I don't like the special teams rules you outlined above. IN fact I hate them.

That is fine, but do you like special teams as they are now or would you like more traditional football plays? But, that is what makes the world go around, perhaps you could offer your own opinion on what you would do?

 

[Liquid Tension]

Oh, one other item, why in the world can't coaches use a challenge if they have one under 2 minutes? Makes ZERO sense.

Kind of like the Colston fumble late in the TB/NO game where he caught the ball, tucked it, took two steps, braced for the hit, and then got stripped? It was ruled incomplete on the field and because it was inside two minutes the Bucs couldn't challenge. Why didn't the replay officials take a look at this? The Saints kicked a FG to tie it and won the game after another gift first down on a penalty in OT.

Yes, I'm a bitter Buc fan and this game was the last straw.

Bitter or not, this is exactly why it doesn't make any sense if the coaches still have a challenge that they can't use it?

 

[Liquid Tension]

I'd like to see them consider penalties away from the play to be like an uncatchable ball for PI. Exception would be personal fouls, but why worry about hands to the face on the other side of the field?

In any case, i agree that just a few tweaks would make the penalty-fest more manageable. I've really noticed a lot flags that take away from the rhythm of the game.

While I agree with this, it makes it more subjective on the refs which is obviously not their strength. Also, a hold might make teh QB switch to the other side quickly and occasionally a play comes back to that side. I do think the refs need to look at the play and decide if the infraction was worthy of a call, but in reality it is harder to officiate that way.

An example was the switch the league made that both feet had to come down in bounds regardless if the player was pushed. I think this is a good rule as it takes away and subjectivity from refs. I was concerned that players woudl lift up and carry players out but that hasn't happened yet.

 

[Grahamburn]

I hate to do it but I have to side with the embittered longtime fan on this one.

Thanks?

Oh, one other item, why in the world can't coaches use a challenge if they have one under 2 minutes? Makes ZERO sense.

Kind of like the Colston fumble late in the TB/NO game where he caught the ball, tucked it, took two steps, braced for the hit, and then got stripped? It was ruled incomplete on the field and because it was inside two minutes the Bucs couldn't challenge. Why didn't the replay officials take a look at this? The Saints kicked a FG to tie it and won the game after another gift first down on a penalty in OT.

Yes, I'm a bitter Buc fan and this game was the last straw.

Bitter or not this is exactly why it doesn't make any sense if the coaches still have a challenge that they can't use it?

I agree with you. It's almost like the game was a foregone conclusion. Oh, the Bucs couldn't have forced a turnover there. No challenge necessary. This is the Saints in New Orleans. Oh, the Bucs stopped Drew Brees on 3rd and 10 in overtime? Impossible. Throw the flag.

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

Was thinking about this thread this weekend. Not so much about the flag issues and over-protectiveness of players that have led to a more confusing environment for players in terms of playing with aggression -- but more about the "I'd rather watch Red Zone than watch a whole game" aspect.

I have spent the last few seasons having the game on TV, watching several at once via a borrowed Sunday Ticket login, and monitoring Yahoo Game Channel. and of course, checking as many SP threads as I could. While it allowed me to follow what was going on on my fantasy squads, it always felt incredibly OCD, and my focus was so scattered, I'm not sure I would call it an enjoying experience. Was able to see my fantasy players score, but it was (of course) always after the fact.

I decided today to just sit down old school with snacks, beer, and just focus on one locally televised game. In this case, was GB/MIA. So glad I did this. You can't know it's going to be this kind of game going in, but made me realize how much in a football game depends on momentum, flow, personnel packages, mismatches, play calling, and so many other subtleties.

This is what football is about. This is why I fell in love with the sport. And it made me realize I will take this experience over the fractured, frantic experience of checking multipe screens and browser windows at once, or even one that shows highlights of just touchdowns and FGs. Will just check in with fantasy team performance at halftimes and commercials, and just watch a game. It's so much richer of an experience.

My 2 cents.

 

[General Tso]

Here's another request... When you advertise in advance that you will be showing the Cowboys / Seahwaks game at 4:25 on Fox, please do not show me instead the overtime of the Cincinnati / Carolina game. Nobody gives a flying #### about that game, not where I live, nor anywhere else for that matter.

Un-fukking-believable.

 

[General Tso]

This league, and the networks that cover it, couldn't be more ####ed up right now. Someone please tell me if this makes any sense:

- local Fox affiliate advtises all week that they'll be showing two games - the local Bills / Patriots game at one and then the game of the week - Seattle versus Dallas - at 4:25.

- Pats / Bills game ends at 4:20.

- Instead of going to the Seahawks / Cowboys game, as scheduled, my local Fox affiliate decides to show the overtime of Cincinnati / Carolina. Mind you - I don't live within 1,000 miles of either location.

- I'm thinking they'll cut to the Cowboys game right when it starts. No - they show the entire overtime.

- by the time they cut to the Cowboys / Seahawks game it's almost halfway through the 2nd quarter.

I was at a sports bar and came home specifically at 4:15 to see the Cowboys game. What the #### are these idiots doing?

 

[Tango]

Open question to all in this open letter thread:

IF the NFL didnt sign the NFL Sunday Ticket extension and instead did two things:

(1) spread out Sunday so that a minimum of 5 games were on at 4pm Eastern, and

(2) showed every game on a combination of network and cable a la the NCAA first.second round

would you watch RZ or would you get multiple Tvs/and or flip from game-to-game?

 

[Grahamburn]

I stayed true to my word. No NFL football whatsoever yesterday. I did not miss it. Beautiful day on the golf course.

No stress worrying about my fantasy teams. No depression after Flacco torched my Bucs. Best Sunday I've had in a month. NFL.