Benching Players to Give Opponent Win (1 Viewer)

[Kenny Powers]

So in my 1 league I have first place locked up, and only 2 teams have clinched a playoff spot. 3rd-5th are 7-5, 6th-9th are 6-6, 6 teams make the playoffs. My opponent this week was one of the 6-6 teams, and the team that IMO was the worst of these 7 teams. I was hoping he would beat me as Id like to see him in the playoffs more than any of the other teams. I didnt bench my entire team, only 3 guys actually (Rice, Myers, JPP) as my team had put up enough to still now have the 2nd most pts this week. It turns out the guy I am playing has the most though, but he wouldve lost had even just Myers been in my lineup. The league is pretty up in arms right now because of what I did, but it wasnt against the rules, and I think something that is somewhat important here is I didnt bench my entire team and my opponent still had to put up the league high this week to get the win. So, questions are:

1) Would you do what I did?

2) How bad do you view what I did?

3) Would you bench your whole team to guarantee your opponent wins?

 

[packseasontix]

Is it against the rules?

Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

 

[Kenny Powers]

Is it against the rules?Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

As I said, it is NOT against the rules

 

[packseasontix]

Is it against the rules?Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

As I said, it is NOT against the rules

So you have a rule that specifically states that you can sit any players you want to assure a win for your opponet?

 

[John 14:6]

Regardless of whether or not it's moral, I just think it's a bad idea because you never know what's going to happen. Like you said, the team was the highest scoring team this week even though you think he's one of the worst. Whose to say he doesn't end up outscoring you if you guys meet in the playoffs?

 

[Londo]

Total bush league move. Pretty much your only responsibility as an owner is to field the best lineup you can every week.

 

[lbouchard]

Who did you bench them for?

 

[Kenny Powers]

Is it against the rules?Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

As I said, it is NOT against the rules

So you have a rule that specifically states that you can sit any players you want to assure a win for your opponet?

There's no rule regarding that either. I didnt assure him anything in this case as I had a huge lead when I benched those 3 and it looked like Id still win anyway.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Who did you bench them for?

Left the spots open as I did it after the 1pm games started and didnt have bench guys available.

 

[Chimp Magnet]

Left the spots open? Indefensible. If that happened in a league I was in I'd either be asking that guy to leave or leave myself if he wasn't reprimanded. Shady, shady move. Do you want to win against the best or the rest? Cuz if all you want to do is be a champ then there has to be a couple dozen yahoo leagues full of guppies to whoop up on.

 

[packseasontix]

Is it against the rules?Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

As I said, it is NOT against the rules

So you have a rule that specifically states that you can sit any players you want to assure a win for your opponet?

There's no rule regarding that either. I didnt assure him anything in this case as I had a huge lead when I benched those 3 and it looked like Id still win anyway.

Wouldn't you assume collusion is against rules of any league? If I just gave you AP for nothing wouldnt that be an issue?This is the same here, I am purposly sitting players to give my opponet a better chance to win the week. While you didnt think he would come back the whole point was to make it easier for him to win.

 

[Wrigley]

Hope he beats your ### in the playoffs.

 

[Chimp Magnet]

Hope he beats your ### in the playoffs.

This.

 

[Dark Matter]

If your league doesn't have a rule against this than bad on the league but it's a questionable move and messes with the integrity of the league. Be careful what you wish for and all that stuff.

 

[fred_1_15301]

So in my 1 league I have first place locked up, and only 2 teams have clinched a playoff spot. 3rd-5th are 7-5, 6th-9th are 6-6, 6 teams make the playoffs. My opponent this week was one of the 6-6 teams, and the team that IMO was the worst of these 7 teams. I was hoping he would beat me as Id like to see him in the playoffs more than any of the other teams. I didnt bench my entire team, only 3 guys actually (Rice, Myers, JPP) as my team had put up enough to still now have the 2nd most pts this week. It turns out the guy I am playing has the most though, but he wouldve lost had even just Myers been in my lineup. The league is pretty up in arms right now because of what I did, but it wasnt against the rules, and I think something that is somewhat important here is I didnt bench my entire team and my opponent still had to put up the league high this week to get the win. So, questions are:1) Would you do what I did?2) How bad do you view what I did?3) Would you bench your whole team to guarantee your opponent wins?

Congrats on completely compromising the integrity of the league. If I were one of those fringe playoff teams, I would never play in that league again.

 

[Warhogs]

If you benched guys and then had open spots in your lineup that I think your league has every right to be mad.

I personally try to play what I think is my best lineup to win every game. The fantasy gods will punish you for this.

 

[packseasontix]

If your league doesn't have a rule against this than bad on the league but it's a questionable move and messes with the integrity of the league. Be careful what you wish for and all that stuff.

This is one of those things that just falls into common sense rules. Like you cant bribe a person with real $ to get a trade done. Well the rules dont say its against the rules....

 

[Alkahsu]

Total bush league move.

This. No one in my league would do this because 1) it's bush league and 2) our league bylaws state you have to start a full team and we have a section on Ethics.Bylaws are a must if you play for any kind of money so there are clear guidelines/rules for the things you can't enforce with standard settings on a website.

 

[lbouchard]

Who did you bench them for?

Left the spots open as I did it after the 1pm games started and didnt have bench guys available.

Yeah, that makes it a problem IMO. Rice has a very tough matchup and Myers is by no means a stud, so I could have entertained you benching them for others. But leaving spots open jumps WAY past the line.

 

[BassNBrew]

Really dude???

Way to destroy a league.

 

[simey]

 

[Jersey35]

If your league doesn't have a rule against this than bad on the league but it's a questionable move and messes with the integrity of the league. Be careful what you wish for and all that stuff.

First off, the bolded is an altogether too often made argument for unsportsmanlike conduct. The absence of a rule strictly forbidding an activity does not mean that activity must be allowed. Any decent commissioner needs to be able to interpret an action and rule upon it if it is not covered in the rules. If it were my league, I would reverse the benching, set a rule for the future, and enforce no punishment for now - since the move wasn't defined illegal. But I'm sure not going to set a precedent for allowing this activity.

 

[otb_lifer]

Hope he beats your ### in the playoffs.

This.

and that. just bad FF etiquette. piss poor.

 

[iamkoza]

if there is no rule, then I dont see why you cant do it since you feel as though this move could improve your team win a championship...

why did you half as# it though? only benching 3 people... you should have started your team or not started anyone.

you probably should have just come out and said what you were doing and why... people would still probably accuse you of colluding with the other owner...

I'm not sure I would have done it myself because of the drama that type of action causes in a league... plus you just made yourself public enemy #1... so if you lose people are really going to give it to you

 

[Chaka]

I like you KP but I voted "##### move".

 

[ConnSKINS26]

You'd be out of my leagues for that, and I'd be out of any league that didn't kick you out for doing that. Especially leaving the spots open. Talk about a slap in the face to the entire league.

 

[AtomicFalcon]

Is it against the rules?Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

Agreed. He purposely tried to help another owner win, to the detriment of the league. OP - It's cool that you want to see your friend do well, but you simply cannot conspire to give him an unfair advantage. It hurts the integrity of your league; the other owners have every right to be unhappy with what you did.

 

[Short Corner]

Commish should freeze your team and remove you from the playoffs. Unless of course there is a rule that says he can't.

 

[lod01]

So in my 1 league I have first place locked up, and only 2 teams have clinched a playoff spot. 3rd-5th are 7-5, 6th-9th are 6-6, 6 teams make the playoffs. My opponent this week was one of the 6-6 teams, and the team that IMO was the worst of these 7 teams. I was hoping he would beat me as Id like to see him in the playoffs more than any of the other teams. I didnt bench my entire team, only 3 guys actually (Rice, Myers, JPP) as my team had put up enough to still now have the 2nd most pts this week. It turns out the guy I am playing has the most though, but he wouldve lost had even just Myers been in my lineup. The league is pretty up in arms right now because of what I did, but it wasnt against the rules, and I think something that is somewhat important here is I didnt bench my entire team and my opponent still had to put up the league high this week to get the win. So, questions are:1) Would you do what I did?2) How bad do you view what I did?3) Would you bench your whole team to guarantee your opponent wins?

No on everyone of them.The FFL gods will wreak havoc on you. When everything falls apart, now you will know why.

 

[Dark Matter]

If your league doesn't have a rule against this than bad on the league but it's a questionable move and messes with the integrity of the league. Be careful what you wish for and all that stuff.

First off, the bolded is an altogether too often made argument for unsportsmanlike conduct. The absence of a rule strictly forbidding an activity does not mean that activity must be allowed. Any decent commissioner needs to be able to interpret an action and rule upon it if it is not covered in the rules. If it were my league, I would reverse the benching, set a rule for the future, and enforce no punishment for now - since the move wasn't defined illegal. But I'm sure not going to set a precedent for allowing this activity.

Agreed and don't be mistaken that I would condone it but I am amazed each and every year when situations arise that need to be clarified, in writing. In this case something as simple as, "Listen up ####-for-brains everyone starts a legal line-up every week no exceptions," should suffice.

 

[flooredyas]

Totally banworthy.

As a commish, you would NOT be coming back next year. Leaving 3 open roster spots is the reason. Your actions caused all other teams trying to make the playoffs to be adversly affected. Hope those who were eliminated by your actions decide to come by one by one and not only kick your dog, but punch you in the face in front of your wife and kids.

 

[MIMN]

Really dude???Way to destroy a league.

Agreed. This type of move is collusion and I would not want to be in a league with that. If you don't have a rule against collusion then I hope your competitors conspire and bring you down. Trade stars for crap. Time add/drops. Whatever. There are now no rules.http://youtu.be/qxiSe4iwwGE

 

[ROCKET]

And now if you win you look like a complete ##### and if you lose you do as well. I'd rather finish in last place as opposed to looking the fool like that.

 

[Ladsud]

You should be ashamed of yourself.

 

[twistd]

What this sort of reminds me of is a discussion I saw about a move someone made last year. In this other instance a guy was going against a team that had a kicker on bye. So one team went in and picked up, then dropped, every free agent kicker. Players who were dropped were locked until the following week. So he was making it so the team he was playing couldn't pick up a kicker and would have to go dead on that spot. It wasn't specifically against the rules, but it was a sleazy move. I would classify this the same way. It may not be specifically against the rules but you knew that it was ethically wrong, yet you did it anyway. IF I was commissioner in the league I would first change the rule concerning this, and I would replace you in the league for next year.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Is it against the rules?Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

Agreed. He purposely tried to help another owner win, to the detriment of the league. OP - It's cool that you want to see your friend do well, but you simply cannot conspire to give him an unfair advantage. It hurts the integrity of your league; the other owners have every right to be unhappy with what you did.

I didnt try to help another owner win, I tried to give myself the best chances as I saw it based on the other teams for me to win a championship. I think there is a difference. Ive seen people in here call it collusion, which I dont see that as the case.I didnt conspire with anyone to do this, all my decision, or do it for a friend. In fact in retrospect, I wish I didnt do it because this is a league where a lot of the guys are my friends and this might screw my best friend out of a playoff spot. Whats done is done though, unless the commish re-inserts them in my lineup (which he is for but most of the league seems to be against). I did put JPP in my lineup for tonights game but he's gonna need 14pts for my decision not to effect anything, so its unlikely.

 

[twistd]

Really dude???Way to destroy a league.

Agreed. This type of move is collusion and I would not want to be in a league with that. If you don't have a rule against collusion then I hope your competitors conspire and bring you down. Trade stars for crap. Time add/drops. Whatever. There are now no rules.http://youtu.be/qxiSe4iwwGE

It is not collusion because that would require two teams working together for this outcome. The other team was not knowingly involved. They benefited from the action, but were not involved in the actions that led to this outcome.

 

[GregR]

I'd kick you out of the league and if it was a cash league, donate your entry fee to charity.

 

[Not Sleeping]

I wouldn't do it only because I know that the team I let into the playoffs would be the team that ends up beating me. I think it's better to always play for the win and let fate handle the matchups.

FWIW, my league doesn't have a specific rule against this either (i.e. you technically can field an incomplete lineup). But we have a money prize for the highest score each week, which is probably enough to keep people from ever doing this.

 

[Nucker101]

Not gonna lie, I would consider it if it isn't against league rules and I'd try to be sneaky about it instead of starting Brady Quinn and the Bills D/ST. I wouldn't make any shady adds/drops or any absolutely ridiculous lineup moves, but I would sit a couple of guys that I would normally start if I had decent bench options(flex type guys).

 

[Phenix]

Just because someone does not like it does not mean it is not strategy. The point is to win the league, if it is not in the league rules or bylaws the specifics of submitting full lineups, its fair game.

If it is a rule, you cant do it, simple as that. If it is not a rule, bush league or not, its fair game.

Only rule my league had was you cannot start someone on bye, that changed this past year, you must submit full lineups.

Simple fix is starting someone who sucks, like Ryan Mathews, instead of no one. (Its almost the same thing, ZING)

 

[TheFootballJesus]

http://www.nbcolympics.com/news-blogs/badminton/all-eight-women-disqualified-for-throwing-badminton-matches.html

Reminds me of this.

Just a ##### move. If I'm one of the other 6-6 teams and don't make the playoffs, I'm incredibly pissed off.

 

[oPlaiD]

This season in one of my dynasty leagues I ended up in last place before the final week. I had made a deadline trade that moved my only defense, the Broncos D/ST, to the top team.

I didn't want to pick up a defense because I'd rather keep the other players on my roster, since I'll just be able to grab a defense next season when I need it and the guys I keep on my roster will potentially have value.

The guy I was playing against was in the thick of the playoff race, so a lot of people were unhappy with this.

I ended up grabbing a random defense and putting it in to keep people happy, but there are no rules against not having a full lineup.

If I want to manage my team in the best way possible to compete and win championships, I shouldn't pick up that defense. It's better for my teams future if I don't bother with it and use those roster spots to hold players who may have value next season. But I'll admit it's also a bit unsportsmanlike.

It's a money league so obviously money is on the line with me throwing that match, but my money is also on the line in future seasons so I will want to do what's best for my chances to win that money. How do you reconcile an issue like this?

 

[packseasontix]

Not gonna lie, I would consider it if it isn't against league rules and I'd try to be sneaky about it instead of starting Brady Quinn and the Bills D/ST. I wouldn't make any shady adds/drops or any absolutely ridiculous lineup moves, but I would sit a couple of guys that I would normally start if I had decent bench options(flex type guys).

And this is how you could get away with it, no one would be wiser.... Outright sitting studs or having empty lineup spots is just crazy.

 

[CalBear]

It's a money league so obviously money is on the line with me throwing that match, but my money is also on the line in future seasons so I will want to do what's best for my chances to win that money. How do you reconcile an issue like this?

Rule 1: Don't be a hoser.Any doubts about the legality/ethicality of a move? See Rule 1.

 

[Sweet Feet]

I don't like what you did but I understand it and nothing in the league's rules state you cant. My league has a rule that every slot must be filled and no bye week players.

Guy did it in my league last year so he wouldnt have to play my 6th seeded team (highest scoring in the league) and he actually lost because of it so its not full proof. He wouldve won if he faced me and then he wouldve went on to win the championship. Few guys had a problem with it so now the rule.

I voted yes but I wouldve at least put players in roster spots to make it look like I wasnt throwing it. Easier said than done. I get your strategy but I also understand why others would be upset.

 

[GregR]

This season in one of my dynasty leagues I ended up in last place before the final week. I had made a deadline trade that moved my only defense, the Broncos D/ST, to the top team.I didn't want to pick up a defense because I'd rather keep the other players on my roster, since I'll just be able to grab a defense next season when I need it and the guys I keep on my roster will potentially have value.The guy I was playing against was in the thick of the playoff race, so a lot of people were unhappy with this.I ended up grabbing a random defense and putting it in to keep people happy, but there are no rules against not having a full lineup.If I want to manage my team in the best way possible to compete and win championships, I shouldn't pick up that defense. It's better for my teams future if I don't bother with it and use those roster spots to hold players who may have value next season. But I'll admit it's also a bit unsportsmanlike.It's a money league so obviously money is on the line with me throwing that match, but my money is also on the line in future seasons so I will want to do what's best for my chances to win that money. How do you reconcile an issue like this?

A pretty good rule of thumb is that if you are intentionally trying to lose any of your games to gain a benefit, then you've broken the understood spirit of sports and games like this, and crossed into the unethical.In your case you haven't, you weren't trying to lose. Though I can understand why many leagues require a full lineup to be set, to help combat people willing to cheat or rules lawyer to get ahead.

 

[KellysHeroes]

Is it against the rules?Yes that would be collusion... So ban-worthy

As I said, it is NOT against the rules

So you have a rule that specifically states that you can sit any players you want to assure a win for your opponet?

There's no rule regarding that either. I didnt assure him anything in this case as I had a huge lead when I benched those 3 and it looked like Id still win anyway.

Wouldn't you assume collusion is against rules of any league? If I just gave you AP for nothing wouldnt that be an issue?This is the same here, I am purposly sitting players to give my opponet a better chance to win the week. While you didnt think he would come back the whole point was to make it easier for him to win.

I would not let you back in the league, there probably no rule that says the commish has to accept your money next yr.

 

[Dentist]

if you had to post the thread.................

 

[DoubleG]

Congrats on completely compromising the integrity of the league. If I were one of those fringe playoff teams, I would never play in that league again.

Or, as the guy in Stripes said when Bill Murray made them run 2 miles at 5 am "Nice move #######."