Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
Dynasty Rankings (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter Fear & Loathing
- Start date
DoubleG
Footballguy
Honestly, I think it is dropping with each good game Wells has. If Wells actually starts to play through pain/injury, at best (for Williams) it's RBBC, imho. DO take that with a grain of salt though - I do own Beanie and have since his rookie season. I am a big fan of Wells' - I realize that Williams is an extremely talented individual, but here's the rub:To this point, Wiz has seemed oddly loyal to Beannie (trading THT, most of the off season indicating that Wells was going to carry the load, even while Williams was looking impressive at times). If Wells shows this season (and he has to continute having games like he has had) that he can be a consistant producer, can pick up the blitz AND can PLAY THROUGH PAIN/MINOR INJURY - all bets are off.For the most part, not many people ever questioned Wells' talent - it was always his ability to stay on the field and produce through nagging (minor) injury. To this point, he is averaging 5.1 YPC including a 27 attempt day after coming off a week of tweaking his hamstring. IF (yes I realize that is a big "if") he can stay relatively healthy and continue to produce at a 4.5+ YPC average, I think Williams will have a much tougher time taking the starting gig away in 2012 than many would have thought - much tougher than he would have had coming into this season to be sure.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
5.4 actually
Lott's Fingertip
Footballguy
Regarding Ryan Williams vs Beanie Wells, Beanie is signed through 2012.
If Williams can come all the way back by next season, he may get his chance to be the main back in 2013.
If Williams can come all the way back by next season, he may get his chance to be the main back in 2013.
Donsmith753
Footballguy
With Williams skill set and Whis' background I don't see why both couldn't have value.
Bronx Bomber
Footballguy
Whats the situation for the Saints RBs next year? is Thomas under contract, do you think Sproles will have the same impact, will it be Ingrams breakout?
While I agree the injury does lower his value tremendously and that he's a WR2 for next year, he still has very high potential to be a WR1 since no one else on the team has the physical talent that he does. The long-term answer at quarterback is someone they drafted with the 8th pick in the 2011 draft named Jake Locker. Hasselbeck was mentored by Favre and turned out to be a pretty damn good QB and so did Rodgers...so there is a lot of potential there mostly after a pretty good showing in the preseason by Locker. Immediate beneficiary will be Washington...and I don't see Damian Williams stepping up. Washington will probably return for 2012 and not 2013 since his 2013 salary is rather large for a barely above average receiver. I really don't see anyone else being able to make an impact as much as a Britt return.
DoubleG
Footballguy
I think a lot of people are forgetting that Wells is only 23 (and he just turned it in August) - so in 2013, he'll be the ripe old age of 25. ASSUMING he stays relatively healthy and productive, why in the world would Arizona let a 25 year old RB who is 6' 2" 230 lbs walk?
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
Thomas signed a 4 year deal right before the lockout. Sproles signed a 4 year deal during FA. Ingram has a 4 year rookie deal.
I think one of the more interesting players to think about for Dynasty right now is Steve Smith CAR. He's been tearing it up so far this year, and even though he's pretty old, I've gotta think he's being underrated for dynasty purposes.
The problem is that he's currently performing like a top 5 WR, but you'll probably have a tough time getting anything close to that for him in a dynasty league. Pasquino's rankings that just got published have him at WR 24, just between Percy Harvin and Sidney Rice, but if you own Smith right now, are you going to trade him for either of those guys? Maybe if your team is rebuilding, but if you're anywhere near contending you probably won't be able to make a trade that makes sense for him.
I just got offered him for Andre Johnson, and I'm not at all sure its a ridiculous offer. I won't be at all surprised if Smith stays as a top 5 WR for the rest of this year and next and outperforms AJ over that period, but the perception of value indicates I should be able to get a lot more than Smith for AJ.
The problem is that he's currently performing like a top 5 WR, but you'll probably have a tough time getting anything close to that for him in a dynasty league. Pasquino's rankings that just got published have him at WR 24, just between Percy Harvin and Sidney Rice, but if you own Smith right now, are you going to trade him for either of those guys? Maybe if your team is rebuilding, but if you're anywhere near contending you probably won't be able to make a trade that makes sense for him.
I just got offered him for Andre Johnson, and I'm not at all sure its a ridiculous offer. I won't be at all surprised if Smith stays as a top 5 WR for the rest of this year and next and outperforms AJ over that period, but the perception of value indicates I should be able to get a lot more than Smith for AJ.
First, Pasquino has Cam Newton ranked as QB20 in his 10/1 Dynasty Rankings-- so basically, I feel you can pretty much discount his rankings all-together.Second, onto Smiff, who I also own in a dynasty. If I'm rebuilding, I would try to move him for quality youth talent from a contender-- I wouldn't limit myself to just comparable WRs, but I would consider a guy like Harvin, depending on how he progresses as the season goes on. Obviously if you have a decent team, he is a solid hold.
heckmanm
Footballguy
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
How do you guys value MJD? Should he be valued like a top RB, or is the risk too much? He seems like a hard player to sell yet the production hasn't dropped off (other than TDs). The Jags have limited his workload a little bit, but not significantly. It makes me feel like the bone-on-bone and microfracture rumors were overblown. But maybe not enough to actually buy him.
jdoggydogg
Footballguy
Well, we all know that MJD is a talented, powerful runner. But he seems to be a bit past his peak. We all know that RBs tend to wear out quickly sometimes. I guess the "buy/sell/hold" question would depend on your dynasty roster. If MJD were my best RB right now, I'd have a hard time trading him. But if I had a fairly young, talented RB crew and a strong team overall, I'd be looking to sell MJD.
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
What you said could also apply to ADP and Chris Johnson. MJD presents special risks, mostly due to the fact he played through a not insignificant knee injury last year. I stayed away from Gore and SJax when they were 25/26 because I viewed the risk to be too high (knee and back issues, respectively), and it was probably wrong. Is it wrong to do that for MJD? All RBs have risk - it's sort of ironic Jennings is on the IR now given all the worry about MJD - but would you take the fact that MJD is having 20 carry games as optimistic (they couldn't do that if he was majorly hurt) or pessimistic (countdown to annihilation is sped up)?
jdoggydogg
Footballguy
Doesn't MJD have a lot more career carries than both ADP and CJ?
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
RANDOM NOTE: If people are not buying low on Bradford in dynasty then they are missing a golden opportunity. Dropped passes and oline debacle are making him look awful - TAKE ADVANTAGE
Well you can't buy low unless you think he'll rise. What's going to stop those dropped catches and improve his pass blocking? As of now, I see nothing. Even for dynasty purposes...we have no clue what they'll be drafting next year and if the pick would even pan out.'King of the Jungle said:
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
How do we feel about Little? For me, he's one of those guys who sits right around 20, below Sidney Rice and Percy Harvin but above Lloyd, Crabtree, and Holmes. But he easily has the potential to jump into the top-10. All I need to see is him put it together on the field a couple times to confirm the monster talent I think he has. I see him as a future Brandon Marshall type guy, 100+ catches in the WCO, lots of YAC ability.
Where does everyone else have him, and how high do you value him? What would you trade for him, or what would it take to snag him from you? If you drafted early in the summer or right after the NFL draft, you probably got him at the end of the 1st or thereabouts. During preseason, you probably took him top 5 or 6.
Where does everyone else have him, and how high do you value him? What would you trade for him, or what would it take to snag him from you? If you drafted early in the summer or right after the NFL draft, you probably got him at the end of the 1st or thereabouts. During preseason, you probably took him top 5 or 6.
Childress
Footballguy
Last year Andre Johnson played almost all year on a damaged ankle and the optimism and lack of information we are hearing from the Texans about Johnson's reattached hamstring make me feel they will try to get a lot of of him this year when maybe they should just let him rest. In my view, 2010 and 2011 will put a large amount of wear on Johnson and I'm not sure how confident I feel about Johnson going forward. I'm in win-now mode for my dynasty league and I just moved AJohnson for SS and some draft picks because I see them being similar ages because of the wear Johnson will have on him after this season. Cam Newton I feel will continue to improve and make SS a monster again, I've watched every play for both of these guys and right now I'd rather have SS. I'm sure I'll get killed for talking this heresy but things change very quickly in the NFL and I am jumping off the Andre Johnson bandwagon before the Texans run him into the ground.
Donsmith753
Footballguy
What's everyones views on Freeman, has started out pretty slowly and is at this moment a far better NFL QB than fantasy QB.
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
Fair enough, wait until they fix those issues and he is a top 5 QB. Shark move.'whatadai said:
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
I think he was valued too highly based on where he was drafted. He was drafted about 2 rounds ahead of where he was projected pre-draft and went to a team with little competition. He's not the #4 rookie or top 50 player and that's how some had him valued 2 months ago. For all the RB skills he is touted to have, it doesn't apply to how he's played WR so far (including at UNC), and he's still a project at WR IMO. (It's interesting that the TE the Browns drafted is also a heavy project drafted on athletic ability over football ability - J. Cameron.) The chance Little is ever a better fantasy WR than Holmes is about 20%, and if you can get Holmes for him do it. I would prefer Crabtree, Collie, Denarius Moore, Cobb, and Torrey as "help more next year" WRs, and I think Jordy and Decker are more valuable too. IMO, he is this year's Arrelious Benn.That said, the upside is still there. I don't disagree that is the upside. And I have tried to buy, hoping the owner thought they'd get top 30 production from him short term and offering a guy who'd give that. Hasn't worked so far. Still would rather have him than Baldwin.'ConnSKINS26 said:
DoubleG
Footballguy
Freeman is a very intiguing prospect, imho. Currently he seem to be in a "QB sophomore slump" (which isn't a true 2nd year slump, more of a dip after a nice season early on) - much like Matt Ryan's 2nd year or Phillip Rivers' 2007 season or even Big Ben in '06. Now the interesting thing is that all 3 of the above bounced back the next season with very good to amazing seasons. (Matt Ryan's "very good" 2010 being a little less than hoped for).The reason I find Freeman interesting is that the talent he has at WR isn't really all that close to what Rivers has with VJax and Gates or Ryan with White and now Gonzo (and Julio) or Big Ben in Hines Ward, Mike Wallace and (then) Santonio Holmes. Even with a little less in terms of WR/TE talent, Freeman has actually put up great numbers (as an example, last season's TD% and INT% were both better than Ryan's in 2010.) The thing that is also interesting is that his 6 INTs last season was lower than the 3 others mentioned have ever thrown in a season where they threw at least 400 passes (and he threw the 6 on 474 attempts) - as a point of comparison, Rivers in 478 attempts in 2008 (one of his best years) threw 11 picks.
What's my point? That Freeman seems to be off to a better start than Ryan (statistically speaking) - and while "Rivers-like" numbers could be a ways off, maybe not as far as many suspect - and all that with less talent at his receiving positions. If Tampa Bay were to go out and add more WR talent in the 2011-12 off season, Freeman could start to emerge as an excellent QB - both NFL and fantasy.
At this point I would rank him around Ryan - maybe a single slot higher for the simple fact that he seems to do more with less around him and has the added capability of running the ball on occasion.
Last edited by a moderator:
what were these pasquino ranks dated? If he has newton outside top5 i'd scream, if it's outside qb 12, he's dead to me.
The Real Hipster Doofus
Footballguy
He was projected that low in the draft because of character questions. Talent wise he has first round talent. So I don't think he was overdrafted in dynasties. But let's say for example that he has only a 20% chance of being Santonio Holmes (a premise I disagree with). Santonio Holmes isn't winning anyone anything. He is a solid WR2, who because he is still relatively young carries and inflated value. You can get that same production out of the Hines Ward's (in years past) and Santana Moss' of the world for a fraction of the cost. Little on the other hand, has top 10 upside. He may never get there, but if he does the payoff is big. Take your chances on Little and hedge your bet with a guy who will give you guaranteed points for a year or two for cheap.
Little had some character questions and missed an entire year of football.He is a freak athlete and was on the tar heels basketball team as a freshman.He has very high upside and is already on the field more then any cle wr due to his blocking ability. He's raw as a receiver but once he gets more experience watch out. As soon as 2012 he should be a solid FF wr and late this season we will start to see his abilities.Thread Bump! Two weeks is way too long for this one to be dormant!!!
How would you rank the following WR's in a non-ppr 10-team dynasty league:
Early Doucet
Damian Williams
Randall Cobb
Titus Young
Emmanuel Sanders
James Jones
Preston Parker
Donario Alexander
Mohamed Massoquoi
Laurent Robinson
Eddie Royal
What would your top-3 out of this bunch if you don't want to rank all 11?
How would you rank the following WR's in a non-ppr 10-team dynasty league:
Early Doucet
Damian Williams
Randall Cobb
Titus Young
Emmanuel Sanders
James Jones
Preston Parker
Donario Alexander
Mohamed Massoquoi
Laurent Robinson
Eddie Royal
What would your top-3 out of this bunch if you don't want to rank all 11?
Last edited by a moderator:
az_prof
Footballguy
Emmanuel Sanders: 1
Cobb: 2
Damian Williams: 3
Early Doucet: 4
After that it is Meh.
quote name='WFR' timestamp='1319214153' post='13706304']
Thread Bump! Two weeks is way too long for this one to be dormant!!!
How would you rank the following WR's in a non-ppr 10-team dynasty league:
Early Doucet
Damian Williams
Randall Cobb
Titus Young
Emmanuel Sanders
James Jones
Preston Parker
Donario Alexander
Mohamed Massoquoi
Laurent Robinson
Eddie Royal
What would your top-3 out of this bunch if you don't want to rank all 11?
Cobb: 2
Damian Williams: 3
Early Doucet: 4
After that it is Meh.
quote name='WFR' timestamp='1319214153' post='13706304']
Thread Bump! Two weeks is way too long for this one to be dormant!!!
How would you rank the following WR's in a non-ppr 10-team dynasty league:
Early Doucet
Damian Williams
Randall Cobb
Titus Young
Emmanuel Sanders
James Jones
Preston Parker
Donario Alexander
Mohamed Massoquoi
Laurent Robinson
Eddie Royal
What would your top-3 out of this bunch if you don't want to rank all 11?
Last edited by a moderator:
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Hits: Tebow, Ridley, Witten, Bush, RiversMisses: Forte (Big time),Too soon to tell: Austin, Simpson (although Green is clearly not going bust)
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
Cobb is the only one in that set who has star ability. I would trade all 10 of those guys for Cobb. Like a 10 for 1 trade.In a ten team league, where guys like this might be on waivers at some point, after Cobb I'd favor near term production in deciding who to roster. Depending on format that might point me to Jones, Damian, Doucet, and Danario in different orders.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Buys:
Shane Vereen - RB - Patriots - More talented than his current value. In the Patriots crowed backfield, I like to sell the lead man and invest in the lottery tickets. Vereen offers solid odds.
C.J. Spiller - RB - Bills - He is moving to a Percy Harvin role, while offering future potential at the RB spot, post Jackson. He is a playmaker and will do just that. His owners are still feeling burned, having hoped Spiller would at least get 5-7 carries a game this season. Hope his owners didn't notice Spiller lining up at WR, or haven't put two and two together.
Austin Collie - WR - Colts - This is obvious, fair enough, but hear me out. Of the two young WRs on the colts roster, Collie is the player with the tools to replace Reggie Wayne. Garcon is a playmaker and is taking advantage of that, now that the offense has had to change so drastically. But it will change back, and Collie's superior skill set will once again land him above Garcon on dynasty rankings.
Kyle Rudolph - TE - Vikings - Target him now. This week. The guys hands are amazing and he reminds me a bit of Jason Witten. A young QB like Ponder will appreciate the safety blanket that I think Rudolph will be this year. In an offense as inconsistent as the Vikings, consistency will start to separate Kyle from the other targets on the roster.
Arrelious Benn - WR - Vikings - Mike Williams is not WR1 material, long term. Benn is a lottery ticket to the TBWR1 sweep steaks and offers the best risk/reward price on the roster.
Sells:
Tom Brady - QB - Patriots - His value is high right now, as it should be. He is the safest QB outside of GB. I am selling not because his value at the QB spot is being over valued. I am selling because his value compared to other positions is being over done. 34 year old QBs can only offer so much VORP for the duration of their career. I would happily downgrade from Brady for an upgrade at another position. Outside of Rodgers and Newton, there is a sizable 2nd tier, with little separation. I am looking to use that to my advantage.
Beanie Wells - RB - Cardinals - He was a buy after the draft this year, a hold during the first few games, and a sell currently. Fantasy owners are looking for RB1s and RB2s for their playoff runs - dealing with injuries and buy weeks. Beanie looks the part and is putting up the numbers. I am simply not ready write off all of the red flags he has had up to this point. I would be trying to package Beanie with other pieces for McCoy, Foster, Forte, and DMC. I would also be willing to downgrade from Wells to guys like Ingram and Stewart, for the right price, depending on my team.
Hakeem Nicks - WR - Giants - Despite how most feel about Eli Manning, he produces high WR1 numbers, year in, year out, regardless of who lines up at the position. While Nicks is talented, his value was disproportionately raised due to a nice season, in which his primary competitor for targets was injured. As long as he is the best WR on the Giants roster by the current margin, his value will stay high. But I would rather invest in more talented players, like Fitzgerald, Dez Bryant, and even Miles Austin.
Adrian Peterson - RB - Vikings - I debated listing him, because "sell high" doesn't mean the same thing in every situation. Peterson is the most talented RB in the league, in my option, and he will produce for more than the 1-2 years being thrown out by the Chicken Little crowd. That said, every year of RB1 production is such a premium, that guys like McCoy and McFadden are now a tier above Peterson, because I think they will over 1-3 additional years of it. Yet, they are not being valued as such, according to the rankings I see. I think it is time to move Peterson for the likes of McFadden and McCoy, including additional incentive for the other owner, if needed.
EDIT: The easiest way to put it - I think McCoy and McFadden are what Peterson was at 23 and 24 years old. I think the difference between a 23 or 24 YO AP and 26 YO AP are bigger than most realize.
Shane Vereen - RB - Patriots - More talented than his current value. In the Patriots crowed backfield, I like to sell the lead man and invest in the lottery tickets. Vereen offers solid odds.
C.J. Spiller - RB - Bills - He is moving to a Percy Harvin role, while offering future potential at the RB spot, post Jackson. He is a playmaker and will do just that. His owners are still feeling burned, having hoped Spiller would at least get 5-7 carries a game this season. Hope his owners didn't notice Spiller lining up at WR, or haven't put two and two together.
Austin Collie - WR - Colts - This is obvious, fair enough, but hear me out. Of the two young WRs on the colts roster, Collie is the player with the tools to replace Reggie Wayne. Garcon is a playmaker and is taking advantage of that, now that the offense has had to change so drastically. But it will change back, and Collie's superior skill set will once again land him above Garcon on dynasty rankings.
Kyle Rudolph - TE - Vikings - Target him now. This week. The guys hands are amazing and he reminds me a bit of Jason Witten. A young QB like Ponder will appreciate the safety blanket that I think Rudolph will be this year. In an offense as inconsistent as the Vikings, consistency will start to separate Kyle from the other targets on the roster.
Arrelious Benn - WR - Vikings - Mike Williams is not WR1 material, long term. Benn is a lottery ticket to the TBWR1 sweep steaks and offers the best risk/reward price on the roster.
Sells:
Tom Brady - QB - Patriots - His value is high right now, as it should be. He is the safest QB outside of GB. I am selling not because his value at the QB spot is being over valued. I am selling because his value compared to other positions is being over done. 34 year old QBs can only offer so much VORP for the duration of their career. I would happily downgrade from Brady for an upgrade at another position. Outside of Rodgers and Newton, there is a sizable 2nd tier, with little separation. I am looking to use that to my advantage.
Beanie Wells - RB - Cardinals - He was a buy after the draft this year, a hold during the first few games, and a sell currently. Fantasy owners are looking for RB1s and RB2s for their playoff runs - dealing with injuries and buy weeks. Beanie looks the part and is putting up the numbers. I am simply not ready write off all of the red flags he has had up to this point. I would be trying to package Beanie with other pieces for McCoy, Foster, Forte, and DMC. I would also be willing to downgrade from Wells to guys like Ingram and Stewart, for the right price, depending on my team.
Hakeem Nicks - WR - Giants - Despite how most feel about Eli Manning, he produces high WR1 numbers, year in, year out, regardless of who lines up at the position. While Nicks is talented, his value was disproportionately raised due to a nice season, in which his primary competitor for targets was injured. As long as he is the best WR on the Giants roster by the current margin, his value will stay high. But I would rather invest in more talented players, like Fitzgerald, Dez Bryant, and even Miles Austin.
Adrian Peterson - RB - Vikings - I debated listing him, because "sell high" doesn't mean the same thing in every situation. Peterson is the most talented RB in the league, in my option, and he will produce for more than the 1-2 years being thrown out by the Chicken Little crowd. That said, every year of RB1 production is such a premium, that guys like McCoy and McFadden are now a tier above Peterson, because I think they will over 1-3 additional years of it. Yet, they are not being valued as such, according to the rankings I see. I think it is time to move Peterson for the likes of McFadden and McCoy, including additional incentive for the other owner, if needed.
EDIT: The easiest way to put it - I think McCoy and McFadden are what Peterson was at 23 and 24 years old. I think the difference between a 23 or 24 YO AP and 26 YO AP are bigger than most realize.
Last edited by a moderator:
DoubleG
Footballguy
I disgaree with selling Wells. He just turned 23 in August. In his 4 starts in 2011 he is averaging 20 carries for 95 yards (4.8 YPC) and 1.5 TDs per game. The coaching staff said coming into the year (even before the injury to Williams) that they were going to give Wells the chance to be "the man" - and he has seemingly siezed said opportunity. In dynasty, there is no way I would trade away a 23 year old who is showing he is capable of being a bell-cow back. His last two games (after sitting out with the hamstring) - the Cards loaded him up with 27 & 20 carries (and the 20 was in a big loss). While Williams is indeed talented, Wells seems to be running away(no pun intended) with the starting job. If he can continue at this pace (or frankly, anywhere near it), there is no reason to expect the Cards (or Williams) are going to take it from him easily in 2012.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
The reason I think Wells is an ideal sell, is because I can market him as a (newly) 23 year old franchise, bell-cow RB, putting up high RB1 numbers. But I don't think the fact that he can handle being a bell-cow back has been established; quite the opposite, actually. I don't trust his health history and I don't trust his running style. I think I know how Wells' career story reads. At the very least, I know the happy ending doesn't start today. His value is high and he is a very risky hold. There is zero chance of me buying right now. Also, my wanting to sell Wells has nothing to do with Williams, who would not be a threat if I felt Wells could hold up.'DoubleG said:
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
Re: Wells
Under the parameters lined up by CC I think there might be a chance there. If you're out of it and a top 4 team has Ingram, swapping Wells for Ingram makes sense. They are about the same age. And talent level, really. But it makes some sense to go with the guy in the better offense whose best days are ahead of him.
Re: Spiller
I think you have define what qualifies as buying low. I get garbage offers for him pretty regularly. Unless the Spiller owner is just fed up with him, I think the main question is whether letting him recoup his investment with a mid 1st is a good deal. I don't think it is.
Re: Nicks
I think you are low on his talent level. Fitzgerald, Johnson, and Johnson are in their own tier, but aside from those it is splitting hairs.
Re: Benn and Vereen
These are guys I've bought and held in a lot of places, hopefully at their low points.
I think the tide is turning on Benn (rule of thumb: if they show up in a redraft waiver wire article, it's probably too late), so the question becomes whether giving up a guy like Decker or Denarius Moore is a good swap long term. I'm not ready to take that leap yet.
I like Vereen's talent a lot more than Powell, Green, and even Taiwan. Basically any lightly used rookie can be a good buy low at this point when teams are desperate for short term help, but Vereen's talent makes him a special case. Unfortunately the NE timeshare makes him a huge risk.
Under the parameters lined up by CC I think there might be a chance there. If you're out of it and a top 4 team has Ingram, swapping Wells for Ingram makes sense. They are about the same age. And talent level, really. But it makes some sense to go with the guy in the better offense whose best days are ahead of him.
Re: Spiller
I think you have define what qualifies as buying low. I get garbage offers for him pretty regularly. Unless the Spiller owner is just fed up with him, I think the main question is whether letting him recoup his investment with a mid 1st is a good deal. I don't think it is.
Re: Nicks
I think you are low on his talent level. Fitzgerald, Johnson, and Johnson are in their own tier, but aside from those it is splitting hairs.
Re: Benn and Vereen
These are guys I've bought and held in a lot of places, hopefully at their low points.
I think the tide is turning on Benn (rule of thumb: if they show up in a redraft waiver wire article, it's probably too late), so the question becomes whether giving up a guy like Decker or Denarius Moore is a good swap long term. I'm not ready to take that leap yet.
I like Vereen's talent a lot more than Powell, Green, and even Taiwan. Basically any lightly used rookie can be a good buy low at this point when teams are desperate for short term help, but Vereen's talent makes him a special case. Unfortunately the NE timeshare makes him a huge risk.
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
If I was a competitive team and I could get Wells for Stewart, I would do it without hesitation. While there are red flags around Wells, the ones around Stewart are worse. Bad offense for RBs. Timeshare. Continuing issues around Achilles. I would not rebuild around Stewart, and he's very hit-and-miss for a competing team.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I think Well's value is higher than both Ingram and Stewart. But, I would happily look to get pieces back in a downgrade from Wells to the two mentioned. Wells for Ingram/Stewart + late 1st, for example. I would first look to include a 1st with Wells for a tier 1 RB, however.Spiller: I think anything less than Spiller's draft day value is a fair price; I would look to get him for less and think that is very possible. For reference, in the only league I have been able to get him in, I traded what will be a late first. I consider that buying low. The big thing for Spiller, is that his future is no longer lead back or nothing. The Harvin role is now a recognized option and a step up from worst case scenario: not being lead back material/SD Sproles.Nicks: You could be right. I, however, think guys like Sidney Rice and Kenny Britt (when healthy) would be doing even more in NYG. I don't feel comfortable holding Nicks when his value is greater than his talent level. That of course is just my opinion.Benn: I wouldn't move Decker for him. I would consider Moore. But I think he can be had for less than that. I would say anything less than Moore would be a buy low. I would happily downgrade, picking up pieces in return, from Garcon/Nelson/etc to Benn. Vereen: I think we agree here. I just think his price is such that the risk is mitigated or minimal.
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
Maybe you should say "the Sproles role" because I don't think "the Harvin role" is very well defined at this point. If the role is sitting on the bench a lot of snaps and watching Michael Jenkins get targets, that's not very good. Even if you're looking at best case, getting WR2 production at a RB2 slot is not a good situation. (Of course multiflex leagues change this, so YMMV.)
It sounds like you're saying Sidney Rice is a buy low because his price has gone down a lot since guys like Obomanu and Baldwin started outproducing him. Nicks is averaging 80 yards, and 0.7 TDs per game played over the past 2 years. Andre Johnson 90 yards and 0.6 TDs over that same time. Nicks has done a lot. If you think he's underperformed this year, he's had 90+ yards or a TD in 5 of 6 games. No monster TD games so far, but maybe they're coming. Britt obviously destroyed early in the year (much in the same way Nicks did coming out of the gate last year), but I don't see the logic that Britt would do more than Nicks has.
Last edited by a moderator:
Concept Coop
Footballguy
CJ Spiller getting on the field more is a good thing. Name the role what you want. I think you should look at the game logs before you claim Sidney is being outproduced. He has played in 3 games, and was outproduced in one. One game, ironically enough, is still half as much as Nicks has been outproduced by Victor Cruz, in that same stretch. Rice has averaged 5/75/0.3 in a new system, with poor QB play, compared to Nick's 5/80/.05 with the Giants - who have been racking up passing yards. EDIT: But yes, I do think Rice is a very good buy right now. There is risk, mostly with injury. But I think his talent is real. As for my logic in suggesting Britt would produce more, I think he is a better football player.
Last edited by a moderator:
DoubleG
Footballguy
Since you guys keep bringing up Seattle, what do we think of Baldwin? I realize the QB situation is...well...horrible. But in anyone's opinion is Baldwin's recent trend of increasing production indicative of at least solid WR3 (FF) type play? Put another way, is the Seattle WR situation stabilizing, or looking like the Raiders?
Or in CC terms, is Baldwin a buy, sell or hold?
Or in CC terms, is Baldwin a buy, sell or hold?
Max Power
Footballguy
???So you don't want to build around Wells or Stewart? Which RBs are you trying to "build" around? McFadden, McCoy, Rice, Foster, Peterson, CJ? These young RB who are currently producing are GOLD in dynasty leagues. Any deal for one of those guys and you're probably going to have to give up more than they are worth.Wells, Stewart, Ingram, Charles (due to injury only), Mathews, and Mendy are more the tier that can be more easily acquired to build around. Its just a call of which one or two an owner likes the most.
The Real Hipster Doofus
Footballguy
Disagree big time with the bolded. Titus Young has looked like a future star to me this year.'thriftyrocker said:
thriftyrocker
Footballguy
I am saying if I had Stewart and could swap him for Wells I would, even in a rebuild. Both have risk factors and I'd prefer Wells' at this point if I was rebuilding. In a rebuild I'd trade away any RB I thought was a risk for other positions. Unload all of them and draft your RBs next year. Obviously McFadden, McCoy and some of the other tier 1 RBs don't qualify as huge risks. If McFadden is your only good player you keep him regardless of team situation unless you can get one of a very small set of WRs.If I had Mendenhall and was a rebuilder, I would sell ASAP.
I like Young as well but think he's more of a stash for next year and beyond.If I find space for him I'll stash him.
Where does Nicks rank in terms of points per game in terms of production since last year? Top 5. Exactly where most slot him. I would prefer Nicks to Fitzgerald and Andre right now. Nicks has 0 drops this year. The guy can play.
Benn is someone I wholeheartedly agree with you however. He seems to be a playmaker to target in TB.
Benn is someone I wholeheartedly agree with you however. He seems to be a playmaker to target in TB.
