Jon Gruden fired in TB (1 Viewer)

[trader jake]

I'm with Chase, Gruden isn't a special coach. I would rather go with someone like McDaniels or Ryan and hope you find a great one.

I suspect Gruden is a better head coach but that really wasn't the problem. Gruden the GM got Gruden the head coach fired.

 

[uconnalum]

Capella I am in Tampa also and I am not shocked one bit 45 - 51 does not keep you around. The horrible draft this year did not help Bruce Allen either. He is not a good scout of college talent this past draft was very suspect for the BUCS. The Glazers were not happy with the character of some players Gruden was bringing in here and there off the field incidents.

Once free agency begins if we don't see the Bucs loosen the purse strings and make some significant signings maybe a Haynesworth, Peppers or Harris on the DL and a top flight WR and maybe give Derek Anderson a look at QB. Also the Glazers should change the image of the BUCS and release Stevens now that Gruden is gone that may happen because he was his biggest supporter.

I don't think Raheem Morris is the answer at coach even though he is the front runner. There will be a few years of growing pains and this franchise is in a critical stage with the Florida economy, and anticipated 10 % to 5 % ticket price increase to season ticket holders based on your section. I think this was a bad time to pull the plug we may be facing blackouts for televised TV games. Its going to be a long few years.

 

[Whiplash Inc.]

If anything, Al should bring Bruce Allen back to Oakland and let him do his thing.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?

 

[zamboni]

Wow - Ryan, Spags and now Gruden available? Its Christmas for a Jets fan! Even Woody can't screw this one up.....could he????

I'd love Chucky to come here to the Jets.He's the fiery type (unlike Mangini) that the team could use, likes his veterans (of which there are plenty), and he could handle the media

Why? So he can talk Favre into coming back? No thanks. Ryan is the guy... I pray and hope.

Yes, I'd want no part of Gruden if it meant Favre coming back. I've always liked Gruden and while I have little problem with Ryan, I'm also a bit reticent about the unknown after so many times of rebuilding.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?

POTD nominee

 

[PewterFan]

This has Bill Parcells written all over it.

Zero chance. Parcells has already done the dance with the Glazers twice before backing out. Parcells is on their s-list.

 

[Buckna]

How can you fire a guy who took you to the playoffs 1 every 2 years he was there, despite having no real franchise QB ever? If only idiot fans realized how difficult it is to sustain success without a great QB....look at any team that does well continuously vs one that does not.

I hate the NFL fan culture these days. All this "fire everyone" every year crap is what hurts franchises more than it helps them. Ask folks in Cleveland or Cincy or Houston etc etc....how changing regimes does not help you get anywhere

 

[ConstruxBoy]

How can you fire a guy who took you to the playoffs 1 every 2 years he was there, despite having no real franchise QB ever? If only idiot fans realized how difficult it is to sustain success without a great QB....look at any team that does well continuously vs one that does not.

I hate the NFL fan culture these days. All this "fire everyone" every year crap is what hurts franchises more than it helps them. Ask folks in Cleveland or Cincy or Houston etc etc....how changing regimes does not help you get anywhere

Forget it, he's on a roll.

 

[NYRAGE]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?

Which one doesn't fit in that example?

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Raheem Morris set to become Bucs new coach

By FRED GOODALL, AP Sports Writer 55 minutes ago

TAMPA, Fla. (AP)—Hours after firing Jon Gruden in a surprise move, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers settled on defensive coordinator Raheem Morris as their new coach.

The move to promote the 32-year-old Morris was confirmed Friday night by a person familiar with the decision who requested anonymity because the team had not yet scheduled an official announcement.

Gruden and general manager Bruce Allen were dismissed earlier in the day, three weeks after the team completed one of the biggest collapses in NFL history, losing four straight games following a 9-3 start to miss the playoffs.

Director of pro personnel Mark Dominik, who has been with the Bucs for 14 seasons, will replace Allen.

Gruden was a rising star when he was hired seven years ago to get a team built by Tony Dungy to the Super Bowl. But Gruden only guided the Bucs to the postseason twice after becoming the youngest coach to win the NFL title in January 2003.

That wasn’t nearly enough for the sons of owner Malcolm Glazer, who took their time before deciding they had seen enough of aging quarterbacks, mediocre drafts and a coach and general manager who often pinned the blame for poor finishes on injuries.

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Morris has been a fast climber, too. He was the Bucs’ defensive back coach the past two seasons, and was promoted to defensive coordinator on Christmas Day, filling a vacancy that opened for next season when Monte Kiffin decided to join his son, Lane, at the University of Tennessee.

The former Hofstra player and assistant coach, who recently interviewed for the opening to replace Mike Shanahan with the Denver Broncos, has been with Tampa Bay for six seasons over two stints.

Morris initially joined Gruden’s staff as a defensive quality assistant in 2002, was a defensive assistant in 2003 and assistant defensive backs coach for the next two seasons before spending one year as defensive coordinator at Kansas State.

Dominik joined the Bucs in 1995 and served in a number of personnel and scouting positions before being named director of pro personnel eight years ago.

Gruden, 39 when the Bucs beat Oakland in the Super Bowl, went 60-57 in seven seasons, including a 3-2 mark in the playoffs. Allen was general manager for the last five seasons in a reunion of a relationship that began when both were with the Raiders.

“These decisions are never easy. This is the toughest decision you can make for an NFL franchise. … Jon and Bruce are consummate professionals. They’ve poured their heart and soul into this franchise,” Buccaneers co-chairman Joel Glazer said. “It’s really been an honor to work with them. They gave their all.”

The Bucs were tied for first place in the NFC South heading into December, but finished with losses to Carolina and Atlanta on the road and San Diego and Oakland at home, where they had been 6-0. One more win would have landed a NFC wild-card berth.

The 9-7 record this season gave Gruden consecutive winning records for the first time since arriving in Tampa Bay, yet still left the Bucs out of the playoffs for the fourth time in six years and prompted the Glazer family to reevaluate the direction of the franchise.

“Any time a season ends, especially the way our season ended, it’s a very, very emotional time. And one thing we always like to do is not act on emotion, let things simmer down, think through things carefully and not make any quick, rash decisions,” Glazer said.

“After taking a lot of time to look at our franchise, look where it’s been, look where it is, look where we want to go, we just felt this was the time for a change.”

In this Dec. 28, 2008 file photo, Tampa Bay Buccaneers head coach Jon Gruden reacts during a news conference after an NFL football game against the Oakland Raiders in Tampa, Fla. The Buccaneers fired Gruden and general manager Bruce Allen on Friday after the team collapsed following a 9-3 start and failed to make the playoffs.

The Glazers fired Dungy after consecutive first-round playoff losses in Philadelphia and used four high draft picks—two No. 1s and two No. 2s—and $8 million cash to pry Gruden away from the Raiders following the 2001 season.

He was an instant hit, retooling an inept offense and riding a defense that ranked No. 1 in the NFL to the Super Bowl.

His firing came four days after Dungy announced his retirement after a successful seven-year run that included one NFL title with the Indianapolis Colts.

Gruden, who had three years remaining on a contract extension he received after winning the NFC South in 2007, leaves as the winningest coach in franchise history.

But since going 15-4, including the Super Bowl, in his first season with the Bucs, Gruden went 45-53 and made quick exits from the playoffs at home after winning division titles in 2005 and 2007.

This season’s collapse continued a trend of playing poorly late in the year. Since winning the Super Bowl, Tampa Bay is 9-17 in the month of December.

In this Dec. 28, 2008 photo, Tampa Bay Buccaneers head coach Jon Gruden watches the game with the Oakland Raiders during their NFL football game in Tampa, Fla. The Tampa Bay Buccaneers fired coach Jon Gruden and general manager Bruce Allen on Friday, Jan. 16, 2009, after the team collapsed following a 9-3 start and failed to make the playoffs.

“This isn’t a decision that’s made on one play or one game or one week or one thing,” Glazer said. “You look at the totality of the situation, evaluate it, look at where your franchise is. For us, the goal is to build a championship team that can compete year in and year out.”

Gruden and Allen both received contract extensions last winter after the Bucs went 9-7 and won the NFC South for the second time in three seasons, however Glazer said that was not a consideration in Friday’s decision.

“At the end of every season we sit back and look at everything. We did that last year and went forward with the extensions,” Glazer said.

“But at the end of the day, every year we feel we owe it to this football team and this community to do a good honest assessment of our franchise. If at any point, we feel that change is in our best interest, we feel we have to make that change. That’s where we got to in this situation. You can’t let decisions you made a year ago affect a decision today.”

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Aoet...p&type=lgns

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?

and marvin lewis still has a job

 

[Capella]

If they have someone lined up, he better be a minority else they run afoul of the Rooney Rule.

Or it could be Raheem Morris. The Glazers knew they were losing him next year, if not before, and maybe decided it was in the best interests of the franchise just to cut bait now so they don't lose a young guy like Tomlin or Wisenhunt (sp?). I'm assuming it will be either Shanny or Morris.

Ah. His name has been thrown out a lot hasn't it? Good call.

every now and then I still show the heater.

 

[the UFFRM]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?

and marvin lewis still has a job

No other coach in their right mind would work for Mike Brown.

 

[Tyrion]

How can you fire a guy who took you to the playoffs 1 every 2 years he was there, despite having no real franchise QB ever? If only idiot fans realized how difficult it is to sustain success without a great QB....look at any team that does well continuously vs one that does not.

I hate the NFL fan culture these days. All this "fire everyone" every year crap is what hurts franchises more than it helps them. Ask folks in Cleveland or Cincy or Houston etc etc....how changing regimes does not help you get anywhere

Forget it, he's on a roll.

I love Animal House.

 

[bucsbaby]

As a Bucs homer, I have to say I'm glad they are letting Gruden go, although I am also surprised. I honestly don't understand all the love for him. He loves aging veterans and imo does not do enough to secure and play good, young talent. Also, a lot of his play-calling has been really bad this year, especially in crunch time, 2-min drills, etc. On top of that, for an offensive genious, I have to say over the last few years, the offense has been pretty bad. Yes, I'm not disputing that there were games this year, especially down the stretch where Tamp was putting up respectable points. However, those games caused me to raise my eyebrows as the exception and not the rule. Many games I had to watch dink-and-dunk-and-stall until I was ready to throw something at the tv.

I'm fine with Tampa going into a bit of a rebuilding mode. We need a good, young QB. We need young WRs. We need an injection of youth on the defensive side of the ball, and talent along the defensive line. I'm also happy to have a defensive mind as HC.

 

[monessen]

Glazer rhetoric is a study in contradictory gibberish.

When they refused to approve Marvin Lewis as Dungy's successor years ago, they had press conferences with some jabbering about how "the process is continuing." They yammered on about "the process" so much, they sounded like they had watched The Spanish Prisoner starring Steve Martin (a good movie about a commodity called "the process" if you haven't seen it) a billion times. Truth be told, they felt Lewis brought nothing new to the table. "The process," for which there is no apparent blueprint, led to a flirtation with Parcells. Evidently, the process stalled and the new direction was to give up a load of draft picks for Gruden.

Gruden comes in and the team is pretty successful until the horrible lapse at the end of the 2008 season. Though some adjoining process had both Gruden and Allen under contract for a few more years, the Glazers waited a couple of weeks under whatever procedure was now operable in their brains before canning Chucky. And now, the so-called process dictates elevating Raheem Morris. There is no logic to the process, just the arbitrary actions of rich punks and their egos being bruised by missing the playoffs. Why elevate Morris so swiftly without conducting any interviews? What new paradigm are they operating under?

In any event, if/when Morris is introduced as the new guy, look and listen for more jive from the Glazers, delivered in smooth and seemingly plausible fashion, when the reality is that they were ticked off by Chucky's late season meltdown and therefore opted to go younger and cheaper.

 

[vikingdave]

I'm pretty shocked. These guys got us to the playoffs 2 consecutive years without a single 1st ballot Pro-Bowler. At 45 million under the cap the next HC is a lucky s.o.b.

When was that...he never made the playoffs back to back years in Tampa...

 

[PurplePride]

I'm fine with Tampa going into a bit of a rebuilding mode. We need a good, young QB.

Is Josh Johnson the answer for a good young QB? Does he have what it takes?

 

[PewterFan]

I'm fine with Tampa going into a bit of a rebuilding mode. We need a good, young QB.

Is Josh Johnson the answer for a good young QB? Does he have what it takes?

If he's groomed properly, yes. He's so, so, raw right now that I wouldn't count on him playing any in '09.

 

[zed2283]

Someone wanna tell me why Gruden is so great? He won a SB with Dungy's team...he finished what Dungy couldnt do but that team was ready...He has won ZERO playoff games since the SB even though they have hosted a few...and they hadnt had back to back winning season with him since he got to Tampa until this year and last...I dont see the greatness...do I think he is good, yes, do I think he is so great as to not be fired, no way...

Gruden's a sure fire first ballot Hall of Famer, mister!

 

[Doug B]

Michael Clayton radio replay on ESPN news. I'm sure Gruden was responsible for him dropping passes. fwiw, my cousin saw Clayton on an elevator the night before the Oak. game reaking of weed and holding a 12 pack.

I first read this as "John Clayton"

 

[Ron_Mexico]

How about Gruden back to OAK?

**Big Al does like to reach into the past.** see Art Shell

 

[Chase Stuart]

I'm fine with Tampa going into a bit of a rebuilding mode. We need a good, young QB.

Is Josh Johnson the answer for a good young QB? Does he have what it takes?

If he's groomed properly, yes. He's so, so, raw right now that I wouldn't count on him playing any in '09.

I'd like to see Johnson, too. As much as I think Gruden is overrated, he knows his QBs. I thought Tampa was a great landing spot for him, and hope he continues to get good tutoring. That said, I don't think Brian Griese's the guy in '09 and you can't count on a 39 year old Jeff Garcia starting sixteen games. I'd like to see JJ be at least the #2.

 

[QUEZILLA]

I'm pretty shocked. These guys got us to the playoffs 2 consecutive years without a single 1st ballot Pro-Bowler. At 45 million under the cap the next HC is a lucky s.o.b.

When was that...he never made the playoffs back to back years in Tampa...

My bad. I was typing after happy hour last night, so a few of my facts were off.

 

[Ron_Mexico]

I think many owners will stand up and take notice

of why Gruden was fired, his ego issues along with

his treatment of players.

I personally don't expect to see him land another

HC gig anytime soon.

 

[QUEZILLA]

I was optimistic about this when I heard the news, but I'm not too thrilled about Raheem Moris as HC. I don't think he will do bad, but they should have at least interviewed some of the other coaches out there.

Mark Dominick as GM... He was one of the guys that was most involved in the drafts that they are critisizing Bruce Allen about.

Either way these guys are going to do well. They are getting handed a playoff calibre team that's 45 mil under. No doubt this was the most attractive HC vacancy out there, even if it was only for a matter of hours.

And lets talk about the past drafts that were apparently "so bad."

-Michael Clayton - guy could have been ROY if it were not for Big Ben

-Caddy - ROY

-Barret Rudd - should have been a Pro-Bowler

-Davin Joseph - Pro Bowl this year

-Gaines - Looks like a bust so far, but Monte still thinks he is going to be elite. Much of his struggle was a result of the injured interior of the line.

-Aquib Talib - still too early, but they like him

-Sears - looks great so far

-Trueblood- been decent at RT

-Geno Hays - looks promising

-Sabby Piscatlli - jury is still out on this guy

-Dan Buenning - our best guard the year he was drafted, but got injured

-Alex Smith - could go either way with him

bust

-Dexter Jackson - this was a nightmare pick

-Larry Brackins - so we missed on a 4th rounder

-Alen Zamitis - nightmare pick, but a late rounder

FA we hit on

-Hovan - most consistant D line player in past several years

-Donald Penn - how often do you find a solid starting LT in FA?

-Clifton Smith - undrafted rookie, made Pro Bowl (they redeemed themselves of the Dexer Jackson pick here in my opinion)

-Faine - best FA of 08'

-Garcia - He did better than expected the year he came in

-Antonio Bryant - stud

-Joey Galloway - was a stud

-Jeremy Stevens - rapist

 

[SpecOpLoad]

I was optimistic about this when I heard the news, but I'm not too thrilled about Raheem Moris as HC. I don't think he will do bad, but they should have at least interviewed some of the other coaches out there.Mark Dominick as GM... He was one of the guys that was most involved in the drafts that they are critisizing Bruce Allen about. :( Either way these guys are going to do well. They are getting handed a playoff calibre team that's 45 mil under. No doubt this was the most attractive HC vacancy out there, even if it was only for a matter of hours.And lets talk about the past drafts that were apparently "so bad." -Michael Clayton - guy could have been ROY if it were not for Big Ben-Caddy - ROY-Barret Rudd - should have been a Pro-Bowler-Davin Joseph - Pro Bowl this year-Gaines - Looks like a bust so far, but Monte still thinks he is going to be elite. Much of his struggle was a result of the injured interior of the line.-Aquib Talib - still too early, but they like him-Sears - looks great so far-Trueblood- been decent at RT-Geno Hays - looks promising-Sabby Piscatlli - jury is still out on this guy-Dan Buenning - our best guard the year he was drafted, but got injured-Alex Smith - could go either way with himbust-Dexter Jackson - this was a nightmare pick-Larry Brackins - so we missed on a 4th rounder-Alen Zamitis - nightmare pick, but a late rounderFA we hit on-Hovan - most consistant D line player in past several years-Donald Penn - how often do you find a solid starting LT in FA?-Clifton Smith - undrafted rookie, made Pro Bowl (they redeemed themselves of the Dexer Jackson pick here in my opinion)-Faine - best FA of 08'-Garcia - He did better than expected the year he came in-Antonio Bryant - stud-Joey Galloway - was a stud-Jeremy Stevens - rapist

 

[FunkyPlutos]

I always thought Gruden was a good head coach that got a ton of production out of players that weren't extraordinary. I hadn't heard all these examples of players not liking him. So I guess I am a bit confused on if he is a good coach or not.

 

[T Bell]

Please come back to Oakland. Please.

Only if Bruce comes with him. Gruden has no quarrel with Big Al, AFAIK.

I thought Al ran him out of there because he was flirting with other jobs too much.

I think they both currently share a mutual respect regardless of the circumstances surrounding Gruden's exit. That's all.

Based upon what? Honestly, I'd like to know as you're the only one I've ever heard say anything like this.

Tim Ryan has a show on Sirius NFL Radio. He also works for FOX as a game analyst. He worked a Tampa game around the time that Kiffin was fired. In the pre-game production meeting, Ryan asked Gruden about Al Davis, figuring maybe he would pile on the old man. But Gruden said "I have nothing but respect for Mr. Davis, and I enjoyed my time in Oakland." Ryan was relating the story, and the way he told it, Gruden wasn't just feeding a line of BS. He got the sense that he was being genuine. Now as far as Al goes, I have no evidence that he doesn't hold any grudges against Gruden. But if he recycled Art Shell, he can probably find his way to bringing back Chucky. He realizes that he's 164 years old, and his opening days might be limited.

I wouldn't expect Gruden to say anything else under the circumstances. Hell, Lane Kiffin was praising Al Davis on his departure from Oakland a few months ago! This is called "playing the game" and not appearing embittered, as much because you don't want to poison future employers' view of you as because you don't want Davis to think he "won" by making you embittered because he got the best of you. You may as well stick a camera in Gruden's face and ask him if he loves his wife for all the candor you're going to get.

 

[T Bell]

I'm fine with Tampa going into a bit of a rebuilding mode. We need a good, young QB.

Is Josh Johnson the answer for a good young QB? Does he have what it takes?

If he's groomed properly, yes. He's so, so, raw right now that I wouldn't count on him playing any in '09.

I've got Johnson stashed away on one of my practice squads. The shame of it was that I drafted him because I figured Gruden would groom him.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?

Which one doesn't fit in that example?

Uh, Jauron?

 

[QUEZILLA]

Please come back to Oakland. Please.

Only if Bruce comes with him. Gruden has no quarrel with Big Al, AFAIK.

I thought Al ran him out of there because he was flirting with other jobs too much.

I think they both currently share a mutual respect regardless of the circumstances surrounding Gruden's exit. That's all.

Based upon what? Honestly, I'd like to know as you're the only one I've ever heard say anything like this.

Tim Ryan has a show on Sirius NFL Radio. He also works for FOX as a game analyst. He worked a Tampa game around the time that Kiffin was fired. In the pre-game production meeting, Ryan asked Gruden about Al Davis, figuring maybe he would pile on the old man. But Gruden said "I have nothing but respect for Mr. Davis, and I enjoyed my time in Oakland." Ryan was relating the story, and the way he told it, Gruden wasn't just feeding a line of BS. He got the sense that he was being genuine. Now as far as Al goes, I have no evidence that he doesn't hold any grudges against Gruden. But if he recycled Art Shell, he can probably find his way to bringing back Chucky. He realizes that he's 164 years old, and his opening days might be limited.

I wouldn't expect Gruden to say anything else under the circumstances. Hell, Lane Kiffin was praising Al Davis on his departure from Oakland a few months ago! This is called "playing the game" and not appearing embittered, as much because you don't want to poison future employers' view of you as because you don't want Davis to think he "won" by making you embittered because he got the best of you. You may as well stick a camera in Gruden's face and ask him if he loves his wife for all the candor you're going to get.

I can't speak too much much for what is said behind closed doors, but JG and BA have been nothing but professionals in front of the cameras. When Keyshawn, Sapp, McCardell, and Simeon were bashing Gruden he never shot back. Yesterday the local radio host was trying to get Brooks to say something about Gruden, but he was sticking up for him. Pretty much said "lets not kick a guy while he's down." Unlike dip #### Mike Clayton.

 

[T Bell]

Please come back to Oakland. Please.

Only if Bruce comes with him. Gruden has no quarrel with Big Al, AFAIK.

I thought Al ran him out of there because he was flirting with other jobs too much.

I think they both currently share a mutual respect regardless of the circumstances surrounding Gruden's exit. That's all.

Based upon what? Honestly, I'd like to know as you're the only one I've ever heard say anything like this.

Tim Ryan has a show on Sirius NFL Radio. He also works for FOX as a game analyst. He worked a Tampa game around the time that Kiffin was fired. In the pre-game production meeting, Ryan asked Gruden about Al Davis, figuring maybe he would pile on the old man. But Gruden said "I have nothing but respect for Mr. Davis, and I enjoyed my time in Oakland." Ryan was relating the story, and the way he told it, Gruden wasn't just feeding a line of BS. He got the sense that he was being genuine. Now as far as Al goes, I have no evidence that he doesn't hold any grudges against Gruden. But if he recycled Art Shell, he can probably find his way to bringing back Chucky. He realizes that he's 164 years old, and his opening days might be limited.

I wouldn't expect Gruden to say anything else under the circumstances. Hell, Lane Kiffin was praising Al Davis on his departure from Oakland a few months ago! This is called "playing the game" and not appearing embittered, as much because you don't want to poison future employers' view of you as because you don't want Davis to think he "won" by making you embittered because he got the best of you. You may as well stick a camera in Gruden's face and ask him if he loves his wife for all the candor you're going to get.

I can't speak too much much for what is said behind closed doors, but JG and BA have been nothing but professionals in front of the cameras. When Keyshawn, Sapp, McCardell, and Simeon were bashing Gruden he never shot back. Yesterday the local radio host was trying to get Brooks to say something about Gruden, but he was sticking up for him. Pretty much said "lets not kick a guy while he's down." Unlike dip #### Mike Clayton.

That's consistent with what I'm saying. Players are another matter, but the NFL coaching and front office fraternity is extremely small and interconnected. You don't burn bridges because chances are that you'll either need that person in the future, or you'll be interviewed by one of that person's friends or proteges. Remaining classy and taking the high road costs you nothing if you're in Gruden's or Allen's position.

 

[Chadstroma]

I was optimistic about this when I heard the news, but I'm not too thrilled about Raheem Moris as HC. I don't think he will do bad, but they should have at least interviewed some of the other coaches out there.Mark Dominick as GM... He was one of the guys that was most involved in the drafts that they are critisizing Bruce Allen about. Either way these guys are going to do well. They are getting handed a playoff calibre team that's 45 mil under. No doubt this was the most attractive HC vacancy out there, even if it was only for a matter of hours.And lets talk about the past drafts that were apparently "so bad." -Michael Clayton - guy could have been ROY if it were not for Big Ben-Caddy - ROY-Barret Rudd - should have been a Pro-Bowler-Davin Joseph - Pro Bowl this year-Gaines - Looks like a bust so far, but Monte still thinks he is going to be elite. Much of his struggle was a result of the injured interior of the line.-Aquib Talib - still too early, but they like him-Sears - looks great so far-Trueblood- been decent at RT-Geno Hays - looks promising-Sabby Piscatlli - jury is still out on this guy-Dan Buenning - our best guard the year he was drafted, but got injured-Alex Smith - could go either way with himbust-Dexter Jackson - this was a nightmare pick-Larry Brackins - so we missed on a 4th rounder-Alen Zamitis - nightmare pick, but a late rounderFA we hit on-Hovan - most consistant D line player in past several years-Donald Penn - how often do you find a solid starting LT in FA?-Clifton Smith - undrafted rookie, made Pro Bowl (they redeemed themselves of the Dexer Jackson pick here in my opinion)-Faine - best FA of 08'-Garcia - He did better than expected the year he came in-Antonio Bryant - stud-Joey Galloway - was a stud-Jeremy Stevens - rapist

One good season a career makes? I would label Clayton and Caddy busts.

 

[Whiplash Inc.]

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2009/jan/17/sp...ra/sports-bucs/

 

[gump]

-Michael Clayton - guy could have been ROY if it were not for Big Ben-Caddy - ROY-Barret Rudd - should have been a Pro-Bowler-Davin Joseph - Pro Bowl this year-Gaines - Looks like a bust so far, but Monte still thinks he is going to be elite. Much of his struggle was a result of the injured interior of the line.-Aquib Talib - still too early, but they like him-Sears - looks great so far-Trueblood- been decent at RT-Geno Hays - looks promising-Sabby Piscatlli - jury is still out on this guy-Dan Buenning - our best guard the year he was drafted, but got injured-Alex Smith - could go either way with him

I agree it's a good core...without any skill position studs. You also left off 23-year-old Tanard Jackson.

 

[SproutDaddy]

I was optimistic about this when I heard the news, but I'm not too thrilled about Raheem Moris as HC. I don't think he will do bad, but they should have at least interviewed some of the other coaches out there.Mark Dominick as GM... He was one of the guys that was most involved in the drafts that they are critisizing Bruce Allen about. Either way these guys are going to do well. They are getting handed a playoff calibre team that's 45 mil under. No doubt this was the most attractive HC vacancy out there, even if it was only for a matter of hours.And lets talk about the past drafts that were apparently "so bad." -Michael Clayton - guy could have been ROY if it were not for Big Ben-Caddy - ROY-Barret Rudd - should have been a Pro-Bowler-Davin Joseph - Pro Bowl this year-Gaines - Looks like a bust so far, but Monte still thinks he is going to be elite. Much of his struggle was a result of the injured interior of the line.-Aquib Talib - still too early, but they like him-Sears - looks great so far-Trueblood- been decent at RT-Geno Hays - looks promising-Sabby Piscatlli - jury is still out on this guy-Dan Buenning - our best guard the year he was drafted, but got injured-Alex Smith - could go either way with himbust-Dexter Jackson - this was a nightmare pick-Larry Brackins - so we missed on a 4th rounder-Alen Zamitis - nightmare pick, but a late rounderFA we hit on-Hovan - most consistant D line player in past several years-Donald Penn - how often do you find a solid starting LT in FA?-Clifton Smith - undrafted rookie, made Pro Bowl (they redeemed themselves of the Dexer Jackson pick here in my opinion)-Faine - best FA of 08'-Garcia - He did better than expected the year he came in-Antonio Bryant - stud-Joey Galloway - was a stud-Jeremy Stevens - rapist

One good season a career makes? I would label Clayton and Caddy busts.

Sorry, but injuries don't make players busts. Caddy is just one unlucky guy.

 

[massraider]

Please come back to Oakland. Please.

Only if Bruce comes with him. Gruden has no quarrel with Big Al, AFAIK.

I thought Al ran him out of there because he was flirting with other jobs too much.

I think they both currently share a mutual respect regardless of the circumstances surrounding Gruden's exit. That's all.

Based upon what? Honestly, I'd like to know as you're the only one I've ever heard say anything like this.

Tim Ryan has a show on Sirius NFL Radio. He also works for FOX as a game analyst. He worked a Tampa game around the time that Kiffin was fired. In the pre-game production meeting, Ryan asked Gruden about Al Davis, figuring maybe he would pile on the old man. But Gruden said "I have nothing but respect for Mr. Davis, and I enjoyed my time in Oakland." Ryan was relating the story, and the way he told it, Gruden wasn't just feeding a line of BS. He got the sense that he was being genuine. Now as far as Al goes, I have no evidence that he doesn't hold any grudges against Gruden. But if he recycled Art Shell, he can probably find his way to bringing back Chucky. He realizes that he's 164 years old, and his opening days might be limited.

I wouldn't expect Gruden to say anything else under the circumstances. Hell, Lane Kiffin was praising Al Davis on his departure from Oakland a few months ago! This is called "playing the game" and not appearing embittered, as much because you don't want to poison future employers' view of you as because you don't want Davis to think he "won" by making you embittered because he got the best of you. You may as well stick a camera in Gruden's face and ask him if he loves his wife for all the candor you're going to get.

Read Gruden's book. He writes that the Tampa job came up, and Al Davis asked him if he wanted the job. Gru said yes, and Al made the deal. There is zero evidence that Al ran him out of anywhere. And if you have proof to the contrary, or even a quote from someone other than speculating bloggers, I'd honestly like to see it.

 

[QUEZILLA]

I was -Michael Clayton - guy could have been ROY if it were not for Big Ben-Caddy - ROY-Jeremy Stevens - rapist

One good season a career makes? I would label Clayton and Caddy busts.

Sorry, but injuries don't make players busts. Caddy is just one unlucky guy.

Nobody knew these guys would fall off the map after 1 season. Can you blame the people that scouted them for that? Maybe you can argue Caddy had a history of injuries, but I am sure team doctors OK'd him.

 

[Raider Nation]

Still just wishful thinking at this point, but it's picking up steam.

LINK

The Oakland Raiders are proceeding through their coaching search at their usual lethargic pace. They have interviewed three candidates and fulfilled their "Rooney Rule" requirement, so it would seem that they could announce their new coach at any time. However, the Raiders like to spend time picking other coaches' brains for ideas before they announce their hire. It would seem that Tom Cable has the job all but wrapped up, but recent events have added a dark horse candidate to the race.The sudden firing of former Raiders coach Jon Gruden has many in the Raider Nation dreaming of his return.

This idea seems outlandish at first glance, but the reality is both Gruden and Al Davis had their best years when they were working together. Unlike the Lane Kiffin fiasco where Davis called his former coach everything but a milk-cow, Gruden had wanted to explore greener pastures and Davis worked a deal for Gruden to move on and receive compensation in return. Gruden has not blasted the Raiders organization as many former employees have, and Davis has expressed regret for letting Gruden move on. He would be by far the most intriguing candidate.

LINK

Guess there's some interest in the Jon Gruden-Bruce Allen firings and how they may or may not relate to the Raiders.

First, think economics. Gruden and Allen are each due three years worth of salary and can wait for the best offers. Seems doubtful Gruden would coach for something in the $2 million range six years after he felt a three-year, $9 million offer was unceremoniously pulled off the table in the midst of second straight AFC West title.

That said, Gruden seemed to be going out of his way before the Week 17 loss to the Raiders to downplay any thoughts of animosity. "There's been a lot of water going under that bridge... I had a great experience there, we had a great group of players,'' Gruden said in a conference call to Bay Area reporters.

"We had some of the best players in football at that time... there seems to be some people that want to say I had a bad experience there.''

Neither Gruden nor Allen ever burned a bridge, publicly disparaging the Raiders.

Nothing's impossible. We're talking about a man who moved his team to Los Angeles and then back to Oakland. Davis hired back Art Shell as head coach and has had front office and assistant coaches leave and return. Ron Wolf left the Raiders personnel department in 1975 and returned in 1978.Steve Ortmayer left in 1986 and was back in 1990.

Gruden's pitch to Rich Gannon on playing for the Raiders: "If we can turn this place around, this can be our legacy.'' They turned it around to a great degree without reaching the ultimate goal. Oddly enough, both men had their greatest season the first year they were apart -- Gruden winning a Super Bowl, Gannon winning an MVP.

But if you don't think hiring Gruden, and the subsequent signing of Gannon weren't the two biggest factors in the Raiders' three-year run of excellence, you're drinking too much Kool-Aid or paid no attention to how and why 2000 through 2002 happened.

Would Gruden want to be identified with twice turning around the same franchise?

For the sake of discussion, let's assume Gruden was sending some sort of message to Davis with his Week 17 show of respect. How would he interact with JaMarcus Russell -- the most important player in the immediate future of the franchise?

He spoke glowingly of Russell's progress before the game, while at the same time noting that at some point a quarterback has to either elevate to the next level, or it's time to move on.

Gruden's not as brutal on quarterbacks as Mike Martz. He'll mix in the atta-boys with the sarcasm. But Gruden is still notoriously impatient with quarterbacks who don't put as much into preparation as he does -- and there are few who do. Fact is, Gruden's offensive language (and we're not talking F-bombs, but X's and O's) is among the most complicated in the league, and if you don't get it out with the proper confidence and emphasis, you hear about it -- with more offensive language.

I wondered years ago whether Gruden was another Larry Brown -- a gifted coach destined to go from franchise to franchise for quick fixes before wearing out his welcome and moving on.

Wrong, of course. He's been at two jobs in the last 11 years -- not bad by NFL standards. But his energy is indeed perfect for the quick-fix. No doubt Gruden would elevate the Raiders level of intensity immediately.

It's what happens afterward that is the concern.

LINK

Attention Al Davis: Bring back Jon Gruden and Bruce Allen. Your former dynamic duo just got fired Friday by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers.This may be a pipe dream. Bridges may have been burned (not publicly). And, still, this certainly is a rich, rich concept.

The Raiders are looking for a coach (as long as Tom Cable hasn't officially been re-hired after his interim stint). Gruden and Allen are out of work. Bingo! Chucky returns as coach, Allen returns to fix the Raiders' roster.

Al should welcome them back to Oakland. He should make whatever concessions are necessary. Money. Personnel control. Invisibility by The Al. Rename the Coliseum in their honor.

Odds are highly, highly likely it won't happen, but, eh, it's fun to dream.

It's been seven long years since the Raiders traded Gruden to Tampa Bay for quite a bounty (two first-round draft picks, two second-round choices and $8 million in cash). It was one of the worst coaching moves of Davis' storied Raiders career, challenging last season's debacle with Lane Kiffin and the Art Shell Redux.

 

[Ed Wood]

People are talking about the delicious irony of the Raiders being the final nail in Gruden's coffin but is this so? If the Bucs beat the Raiders and made the playoffs but lost in the first round, do you think he still would have been canned? It sounds like it...

 

[Lucky Lefty]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?

Yep And include M. Lewis also

 

[bostonfred]

Stranger still is that some combination of Shanahan, Gruden, Holmgren, Dungy and/or Cowher are all theoretically available, and yet Jauron is still a head coach.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Stranger still is that some combination of Shanahan, Gruden, Holmgren, Dungy and/or Cowher are all theoretically available, and yet Jauron is still a head coach.

Rubbing salt in my wound? Thanks!

 

[massraider]

People are talking about the delicious irony of the Raiders being the final nail in Gruden's coffin but is this so? If the Bucs beat the Raiders and made the playoffs but lost in the first round, do you think he still would have been canned? It sounds like it...

I would bet so. I think the overall performance the last few games did him in. Raiders were just one team that played them.

 

[T Bell]

People are talking about the delicious irony of the Raiders being the final nail in Gruden's coffin but is this so? If the Bucs beat the Raiders and made the playoffs but lost in the first round, do you think he still would have been canned? It sounds like it...

I would bet so. I think the overall performance the last few games did him in. Raiders were just one team that played them.

I don't know. The delay in making this move and then the hiring of a relatively unknown position coach without conducting interviews or first hiring a GM makes me wonder what's going on here. This seems sort of impulsive, as if the relationship between Gruden and the ownership (and Allen and the ownership) ultimately went over the proverbial cliff for more reasons than just the late season collapse. I don't think we have the full story yet.

 

[duece2626]

Citing a Bucs team source, the NY Daily News is "hearing" that Jon Gruden could be headed to Notre Dame to replace Charlie Weis.

Reporter Rich Cimini admits it seems "a little far fetched," but says there's a theory that Notre Dame will buy out Weis' contract after his recruiting class signs in 1-2 weeks. Weis was nearly fired this past season. Gruden went to high school in South Bend and has long had an affinity for the university he nearly attended. Still, he'd be a risky hire for the Irish. Gruden is passionate about the NFL and hasn't worked the college game in nearly 20 years. Jan. 18 - 10:02 pm et

Source: St. Petersburg Times

 

[Chadstroma]

I was -Michael Clayton - guy could have been ROY if it were not for Big Ben-Caddy - ROY-Jeremy Stevens - rapist

One good season a career makes? I would label Clayton and Caddy busts.

Sorry, but injuries don't make players busts. Caddy is just one unlucky guy.

Nobody knew these guys would fall off the map after 1 season. Can you blame the people that scouted them for that? Maybe you can argue Caddy had a history of injuries, but I am sure team doctors OK'd him.

Durability is something you do try to scout and project. Further, I never heard anyone say that someone was not a bust because they got injured- that is a new one to me. But let's say for the sake of argument that we will roll that way... explain Clayton to me.

 

[Devine Intervention]

Just so I'm clear, Shanahan, Gruden and Mangini were fired, but the Bills kept Jauron. Do I have that right?