QB Lamar Jackson, BAL (1 Viewer)

[Summer Wheat]

Jackson just seems like a different QB in these types of games.

 

[Bri]

Jackson just seems like a different QB in these types of games.

He is Dak

 

[Grahamburn]

Jackson just seems like a different QB in these types of games.

It does kind of seem like he feels the pressure of the moment.

 

[Faust]

A Nightmare Ending to Lamar Jackson’s Dream Season

For Baltimore Ravens quarterback Lamar Jackson, there are no more excuses

Ravens QB Lamar Jackson 'not frustrated' but 'angry' about loss to Chiefs in AFC Championship Game

 

[kface]

********- this dude has it all but still can’t keep the questionable decisions down. He’s a better runner than Josh Allen but he’s no where near him in passing and mental processing. How much better than Fields is Lamar?

This is his fatal flaw and it's really apparent in games like yesterday

He seemed to have 7 seconds every time he dropped back because KC was not letting him run. If Mahones had 7 seconds on every drop back he would have thrown for 800 yards

 

[crushedspirit]

He is what he is. An athletic QB that struggles when his running lanes are taken away and he's forced to win it through the air vs tight coverage.

 

[Ghost Rider]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

 

[Cobbler1]

********- this dude has it all but still can’t keep the questionable decisions down. He’s a better runner than Josh Allen but he’s no where near him in passing and mental processing. How much better than Fields is Lamar?

I’m genuinely curious how you and the Lamar can’t throw crew justify that Lamar has a significantly better career passer rating than Josh Allen. In fact it’s 9th all time. It’s quite literally closer to being the best ever than to Josh Allen’s. Justin Fields is like 75th so to your last question…uh a lot.

 

[FarFromHome]

Trim the mediocre wrs and bring in Vincent Jackson for 3 years. Flowers and Jackson sound nice.

 

[ghostguy123]

Was something injured on him? Every time he ran it looked like he was jogging. Looked totally different than last week

 

[CalBear]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

 

[Cobbler1]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

FWIW that timeline is a year off (should start in 2018 his rookie year) and his first playoff game was at home against a very good Chargers defense. Youngest qb to start a playoff game in that game.

 

[Ghost Rider]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

The loss to the Chargers was at home.

Baltimore was favored by 3 1/2 on the road in the win at Tennessee following the 2020 season (you have your facts all out of whack), so that was not an expected loss. And he did not have a great game, unless throwing for 179 yards with an INT is a great game in your book. He had a great running game, but not throwing. They won 20-10. Yeehaw.

He has basically had one great playoff game, last week against Houston, and really that was a great half since he and the offense weren't good in the first half. I don't know how anyone could watch yesterday's game and think he didn't choke. It seemed like the moment was too big for him, especially once the Chiefs got the lead. He even said last week that he didn't like competing against Mahomes, which I thought was a bad look. The true greats want to go against the other greats.

 

[zed2283]

Trim the mediocre wrs and bring in Vincent Jackson for 3 years. Flowers and Jackson sound nice.

I don't think Vincent Jackson is playing for anyone anytime soon...

 

[FarFromHome]

Trim the mediocre wrs and bring in Vincent Jackson for 3 years. Flowers and Jackson sound nice.

I don't think Vincent Jackson is playing for anyone anytime soon...

Horrible. It was late. Rip Vincent Jackson. Mike Evans I mean.

 

[Tau837]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

 

[Acrobat7]

Make no mistake, he looked bad in the pocket. But what the hell was that game plan completely abandoning the run game?

 

[menobrown]

Make no mistake, he looked bad in the pocket. But what the hell was that game plan completely abandoning the run game?

Bizarre, like they overthought it or something.

Chiefs are hard to throw on. They also are one of the best teams in the league versus rushing QB's. Fields, Allen and Hurts went a combined 33/108 and Lamar's 21 yard run was actually the longest run they gave up to a QB all year.

By far the best way to attack the Chiefs is with the running backs in the ground game and instead the plan seemed to be have Lamar sit back in the pocket. This is a big reason why I've giving Lamar a little more grace, the horrendous game plan.

One thought I had after that game, and I did not think this a few weeks ago because the Ravens seem stubborn about investing a lot in a RB, is that they must not feel good about their current RB's (how could they?) and with the pressure mounting on everyone now in that organization I'm starting to think they will make a sizeable addition in FA, and thinking Derrick Henry in particular.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Make no mistake, he looked bad in the pocket. But what the hell was that game plan completely abandoning the run game?

Bizarre, like they overthought it or something.

Chiefs are hard to throw on. They also are one of the best teams in the league versus rushing QB's. Fields, Allen and Hurts went a combined 33/108 and Lamar's 21 yard run was actually the longest run they gave up to a QB all year.

By far the best way to attack the Chiefs is with the running backs in the ground game and instead the plan seemed to be have Lamar sit back in the pocket. This is a big reason why I've giving Lamar a little more grace, the horrendous game plan.

One thought I had after that game, and I did not think this a few weeks ago because the Ravens seem stubborn about investing a lot in a RB, is that they must not feel good about their current RB's (how could they?) and with the pressure mounting on everyone now in that organization I'm starting to think they will make a sizeable addition in FA, and thinking Derrick Henry in particular.

I doubt the game plan was to throw that much, but once they got behind early, they seemed to panic and felt they needed to throw all day to catch up.

I have also heard speculation that Lamar stayed in the pocket too much to try and prove that he could beat them by throwing, rather than taking off and running when lanes were there when the pass rush was swarming, but not sure I buy that. I do wonder if his body is starting to feel the effects of many years. Granted, he is so quick that he doesn't take a lot of direct shots on his runs, but he is not a big guy. Cam Newton was a huge dude and even he started breaking down before he hit 30, so it is possible that Lamar's body is feeling it after this many years in the NFL.

 

[CalBear]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

 

[Tau837]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

I love how people around here like to bring up Rivers in discussions totally unrelated to him knowing I am a huge Rivers fan. I'm sure I earned that.

By my estimation, Rivers had 4 clearly bad games in those 12 playoff games, and the Chargers were 1-3 in those games. Jackson has many years to play, but right now Rivers has a stronger playoff resume. If Jackson doesn't end up with a better postseason resume, including record, than Rivers, it will be a negative for his legacy for sure. That said, I don't believe there is a single player with 2 MVPs who is not in the HOF, so I assume Jackson is going to get there, something that is an open question for Rivers (I think he will make it).

 

[Joe Bryant]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

 

[CalBear]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

It's below his baseline, sure. This year he had a game with 121.8 passer rating plus 100 yards rushing and four TDs. That's kind of not terrible.

 

[Joe Bryant]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

It's below his baseline, sure. This year he had a game with 121.8 passer rating plus 100 yards rushing and four TDs. That's kind of not terrible.

I asked about Playoff Performance. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/lamar-jackson-playoff-stats

75.7 passer rating, 1,324 yards, 6 TDs and 6 Interceptions in 6 games when it matters the most and the season is on the line is below most everyone's baseline.

 

[CalBear]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

It's below his baseline, sure. This year he had a game with 121.8 passer rating plus 100 yards rushing and four TDs. That's kind of not terrible.

To break down those six games, he had:

Two outstanding games with > 70% completions and over 100 yards rushing, in wins.
One game (TEN) where he was the entire offense, totaling over 500 yards in a loss.
One game (KC) where he disappointed but had to overcome a number of errors including Flowers' goal-line fumble and still had the team competitive.
Two bad games.

 

[CalBear]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

It's below his baseline, sure. This year he had a game with 121.8 passer rating plus 100 yards rushing and four TDs. That's kind of not terrible.

I asked about Playoff Performance. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/lamar-jackson-playoff-stats

75.7 passer rating, 1,324 yards, 6 TDs and 6 Interceptions in 6 games when it matters the most and the season is on the line is below most everyone's baseline.

+521 yards rushing and 3 TDs.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Which two games were over 70% completions?

I'm going to have to step out if you think that playoff resume is a good stretch.

I haven't seen anyone, especially after this last game try and defend what we all saw Sunday. That was awful. The sad part for Ravens fans is it's a trend of underperforming when it matters the most.

 

[Tau837]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

It's below his baseline, sure. This year he had a game with 121.8 passer rating plus 100 yards rushing and four TDs. That's kind of not terrible.

To break down those six games, he had:

Two outstanding games with > 70% completions and over 100 yards rushing, in wins.
One game (TEN) where he was the entire offense, totaling over 500 yards in a loss.
One game (KC) where he disappointed but had to overcome a number of errors including Flowers' goal-line fumble and still had the team competitive.
Two bad games.

IMO this is disingenuous. Jackson has had 4 objectively bad games in 6 playoff games, and Baltimore lost all of them.

 

[Ghost Rider]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

It's below his baseline, sure. This year he had a game with 121.8 passer rating plus 100 yards rushing and four TDs. That's kind of not terrible.

To break down those six games, he had:

Two outstanding games with > 70% completions and over 100 yards rushing, in wins.
One game (TEN) where he was the entire offense, totaling over 500 yards in a loss.
One game (KC) where he disappointed but had to overcome a number of errors including Flowers' goal-line fumble and still had the team competitive.
Two bad games.

IMO this is disingenuous. Jackson has had 4 objectively bad games in 6 playoff games, and Baltimore lost all of them.

Agreed, and it seemed to be implied as if it were a small sample size because it's only 6 games, but the sample size is that small because he keeps playing poorly and they keep losing.

 

[crushedspirit]

No doubt, he'll win a ring eventually. But, he should be playing for a ring in two weeks if the Chiefs would've paid the refs off! There were calls in that game that should have gone against the Chiefs that weren't called, and that's why he'll just settle for being regular-season MVP and not win it all this year.

No doubt? It almost feels like if he was gonna win one, he would have by now. He is already not quite as fast as he used to be (we saw that on his long run yesterday where he was caught after 25 yards or so, when no one would have caught him years ago), and he has shown that he simply regresses under the pressure of playoff football. We have seen it too many times now for it to be a small sample size. If he was playing well and they were losing playoff games, that would be one thing, but in every playoff loss, he has played poorly and been a main reason why the Ravens lost.

2017: On the road against a 12-4 Chargers team (at age 21). Expected loss, lost.

2018: Home game against Tennessee. Bad game. Should have won, lost.

2019: Road game against Tennessee. Great game. Expected loss, won.
Road game against 13-3 Buffalo. Bad game. Expected loss, lost.

2023: Home game against Houston. Massive game. Expected win, won.
Home game against Kansas. Mediocre game. Expected win, lost.


So in his playoff career, Jackson has lost two games as the favorite, and had a bad game in one of those. He also had one great game as an underdog that he won. And one great game in an expected win, which was this year.

Seems like there's more left in that career.

You are off by one on the years for the first 3 years, i.e., should be 2018-2020. And Jackson had a bad game against the Chargers that you didn't note (under 50% completion percentage, 7 sacks, 3 fumbles, 1 interception, 1 fumble lost).

I also disagree with calling his game against KC mediocre. It was bad, especially in the context that he is the presumptive MVP playing at home - 1 TD to 2 TOs, 4 sacks, just 54% completion percentage with a lot of missed chances, particularly deep.

I'm counting 4 bad games, all losses, in 6 playoff games. It is a fairly easy and straightforward narrative for Jackson to bear a lot of responsibility for those losses.

But of course he has many years left. It just doesn't seem likely he will be in situations as good as Sunday very often -- #1 seed at home with top defense. It is certainly possible he will not ever encounter a better opportunity to make it to the Super Bowl.

The game at KC looks a whole lot better if Flowers doesn't fumble at the goal line, right? The last INT was a terrible throw but the game is entirely different if they get the TD on the earlier drive.

Anyway, we're talking about 6 games, and yes, he didn't play well in some of them. It's not like it's the 12 games with a 5-7 record that Philip Rivers had.

[For the record, I think Rivers was also unfairly criticized.]

You're not saying Jackson's performance in the playoffs, a 6 game sample, isn't terrible are you ?

It's below his baseline, sure. This year he had a game with 121.8 passer rating plus 100 yards rushing and four TDs. That's kind of not terrible.

To break down those six games, he had:

Two outstanding games with > 70% completions and over 100 yards rushing, in wins.
One game (TEN) where he was the entire offense, totaling over 500 yards in a loss.
One game (KC) where he disappointed but had to overcome a number of errors including Flowers' goal-line fumble and still had the team competitive.
Two bad games.

IMO this is disingenuous. Jackson has had 4 objectively bad games in 6 playoff games, and Baltimore lost all of them.

That Ten game he was picked off in the 1st Q and stopped on 4th which led to 14 pts for Tenn out of the gate. His 3rd Q fumble iced the game away for Ten. The rest of the game was playing catch up down 28-6. It was a bad game but the box score stats were nice, except for 3 turnovers.

He's really been sub par to bad in 4 of those 6 games.

 

[CalBear]

Which two games were over 70% completions?

I'm going to have to step out if you think that playoff resume is a good stretch.

I haven't seen anyone, especially after this last game try and defend what we all saw Sunday. That was awful. The sad part for Ravens fans is it's a trend of underperforming when it matters the most.

BAL@TEN (W): 17/24/179/0/1 (70.83%), 16/136/1
BALvs.HOU (W): 16/22/152/2/0 (72.73%), 11/100/2

 

[Ghost Rider]

Which two games were over 70% completions?

I'm going to have to step out if you think that playoff resume is a good stretch.

I haven't seen anyone, especially after this last game try and defend what we all saw Sunday. That was awful. The sad part for Ravens fans is it's a trend of underperforming when it matters the most.

Why Lamar Jackson deserves the Dak Prescott treatment after AFC Championship loss | What's Wright?

The Baltimore Ravens fell short 17-10 to the Kansas City Chiefs in the AFC Championship Game. While the Ravens defense shut down Patrick Mahomes and company ...

www.youtube.com

Ignore the sensational name of the video and focus on what Wright says. Wright is generally a fan of Lamar, but he spits out some facts about his play in the regular season vs the playoffs that are glaring.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Which two games were over 70% completions?

I'm going to have to step out if you think that playoff resume is a good stretch.

I haven't seen anyone, especially after this last game try and defend what we all saw Sunday. That was awful. The sad part for Ravens fans is it's a trend of underperforming when it matters the most.

BAL@TEN (W): 17/24/179/0/1 (70.83%), 16/136/1
BALvs.HOU (W): 16/22/152/2/0 (72.73%), 11/100/2

Thanks. One game samples can be fun.

Followed the TEN game with 14 of 24 for 58.3 % and 162 yards. 0 TD and 1 Interception. For sizzling 61.5 passer rating. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/player...ame-log?seasonYear=2020&seasonType=postseason

Followed the HOU game with 20 of 37 for 54.1% and 272 yards. 1 TD and 1 Interception. Passing rating of 75.5. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/player...ame-log?seasonYear=2023&seasonType=postseason

His 6 game sample of playoff games is rough. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/lamar-jackson-playoff-stats

Has yet to crack 65% completion in any year.

2018 (1 game) 48.3%
2019 (1 game) 52.5%
2020 (2 games) 64.6%
2023 (2 games) 61.0%

6 TDs and 6 Interceptions.

He obviously puts up great in-season stats. He's got one MVP and is expected to win another this year.

But the playoffs have been brutal.

Especially Sunday. They made a hard to imagine coaching mistake and changed the game plan from a rushing attack and put the game on his shoulders.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Which two games were over 70% completions?

I'm going to have to step out if you think that playoff resume is a good stretch.

I haven't seen anyone, especially after this last game try and defend what we all saw Sunday. That was awful. The sad part for Ravens fans is it's a trend of underperforming when it matters the most.

Why Lamar Jackson deserves the Dak Prescott treatment after AFC Championship loss | What's Wright?

The Baltimore Ravens fell short 17-10 to the Kansas City Chiefs in the AFC Championship Game. While the Ravens defense shut down Patrick Mahomes and company ...

www.youtube.com

Ignore the sensational name of the video and focus on what Wright says. Wright is generally a fan of Lamar, but he spits out some facts about his play in the regular season vs the playoffs that are glaring.

Spot on. The performance speaks for itself there.

How Prescott is destroyed and Jackson gets mostly a pass is super interesting.

 

[Hu-Tang Clan]

Which two games were over 70% completions?

I'm going to have to step out if you think that playoff resume is a good stretch.

I haven't seen anyone, especially after this last game try and defend what we all saw Sunday. That was awful. The sad part for Ravens fans is it's a trend of underperforming when it matters the most.

Why Lamar Jackson deserves the Dak Prescott treatment after AFC Championship loss | What's Wright?

The Baltimore Ravens fell short 17-10 to the Kansas City Chiefs in the AFC Championship Game. While the Ravens defense shut down Patrick Mahomes and company ...

www.youtube.com

Ignore the sensational name of the video and focus on what Wright says. Wright is generally a fan of Lamar, but he spits out some facts about his play in the regular season vs the playoffs that are glaring.

Spot on. The performance speaks for itself there.

How Prescott is destroyed and Jackson gets mostly a pass is super interesting.

I'm guessing a large part of the difference between how much is said about Dak vs Lamar is the vast difference in markets and fan bases. Every single media outlet that discusses football talks about the Cowboys and therefore Dak is going to be in a much larger spotlight. Both are solid in the regular season and both are flops in the post season.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Expectations are a tricky thing as well.

If someone had said in August, "Lamar will have a really good season, and the Ravens will get to the AFCCG and lose to Mahomes and the Chiefs," I think most people would have thought, "Okay, that will be a successful season all things considered," but what happened is that he is the likely MVP, they had the number 1 defense, they got the number 1 seed, and because they could only score 10 points, they lost to the Chiefs despite holding Mahomes to only 17 points.

What I find interesting as well are the people who have said for years that they need to get the Ravens more weapons for Lamar and let him throw him more, so they got him more weapons and he threw more last week, and look how that turned out.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Expectations are a tricky thing as well.

If someone had said in August, "Lamar will have a really good season, and the Ravens will get to the AFCCG and lose to Mahomes and the Chiefs," I think most people would have thought, "Okay, that will be a successful season all things considered," but what happened is that he is the likely MVP, they had the number 1 defense, they got the number 1 seed, and because they could only score 10 points, they lost to the Chiefs despite holding Mahomes to only 17 points.

What I find interesting as well are the people who have said for years that they need to get the Ravens more weapons for Lamar and let him throw him more, so they got him more weapons and he threw more last week, and look how that turned out.

Absolutely. Holding the Chiefs to 17 points and losing is rough.

And also agree completely on the weapons thing. Mark Andrews, Zay Flowers, Isaiah LIkely, Odell Beckham Jr. The "no weapons" excuse is gone.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Which two games were over 70% completions?

I'm going to have to step out if you think that playoff resume is a good stretch.

I haven't seen anyone, especially after this last game try and defend what we all saw Sunday. That was awful. The sad part for Ravens fans is it's a trend of underperforming when it matters the most.

Why Lamar Jackson deserves the Dak Prescott treatment after AFC Championship loss | What's Wright?

The Baltimore Ravens fell short 17-10 to the Kansas City Chiefs in the AFC Championship Game. While the Ravens defense shut down Patrick Mahomes and company ...

www.youtube.com

Ignore the sensational name of the video and focus on what Wright says. Wright is generally a fan of Lamar, but he spits out some facts about his play in the regular season vs the playoffs that are glaring.

Spot on. The performance speaks for itself there.

How Prescott is destroyed and Jackson gets mostly a pass is super interesting.

I'm guessing a large part of the difference between how much is said about Dak vs Lamar is the vast difference in markets and fan bases. Every single media outlet that discusses football talks about the Cowboys and therefore Dak is going to be in a much larger spotlight. Both are solid in the regular season and both are flops in the post season.

That's probably fair. And there are a ton of people who hate the Cowboys. So that's a factor.

Baltimore feels pretty meh from a passion perspective.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Expectations are a tricky thing as well.

If someone had said in August, "Lamar will have a really good season, and the Ravens will get to the AFCCG and lose to Mahomes and the Chiefs," I think most people would have thought, "Okay, that will be a successful season all things considered," but what happened is that he is the likely MVP, they had the number 1 defense, they got the number 1 seed, and because they could only score 10 points, they lost to the Chiefs despite holding Mahomes to only 17 points.

What I find interesting as well are the people who have said for years that they need to get the Ravens more weapons for Lamar and let him throw him more, so they got him more weapons and he threw more last week, and look how that turned out.

Absolutely. Holding the Chiefs to 17 points and losing is rough.

And also agree completely on the weapons thing. Mark Andrews, Zay Flowers, Isaiah LIkely, Odell Beckham Jr. The "no weapons" excuse is gone.

What's wild too is that Lamar is like the Bizarro Flacco. Lamar has been way better in the regular season than Flacco ever hoped to be, but Flacco in the postseason destroys him.

Look at their playoff numbers for their first six seasons when either started:

Flacco - Ravens were 9-4 with a Super Bowl championship (and Super Bowl MVP award for Flacco) - 20 total touchdowns, 11 total turnovers
Lamar - Ravens were 2-4 - 9 total touchdowns, 9 total turnovers

 

[Joe Bryant]

Expectations are a tricky thing as well.

If someone had said in August, "Lamar will have a really good season, and the Ravens will get to the AFCCG and lose to Mahomes and the Chiefs," I think most people would have thought, "Okay, that will be a successful season all things considered," but what happened is that he is the likely MVP, they had the number 1 defense, they got the number 1 seed, and because they could only score 10 points, they lost to the Chiefs despite holding Mahomes to only 17 points.

What I find interesting as well are the people who have said for years that they need to get the Ravens more weapons for Lamar and let him throw him more, so they got him more weapons and he threw more last week, and look how that turned out.

Absolutely. Holding the Chiefs to 17 points and losing is rough.

And also agree completely on the weapons thing. Mark Andrews, Zay Flowers, Isaiah LIkely, Odell Beckham Jr. The "no weapons" excuse is gone.

What's wild too is that Lamar is like the Bizarro Flacco. Lamar has been way better in the regular season than Flacco ever hoped to be, but Flacco in the postseason destroys him.

Look at their playoff numbers for their first six seasons when either started:

Flacco - Ravens were 9-4 with a Super Bowl championship (and Super Bowl MVP award for Flacco) - 20 total touchdowns, 11 total turnovers
Lamar - Ravens were 2-4 - 9 total touchdowns, 9 total turnovers

Wow. That is wild.

 

[Anarchy99]

Expectations are a tricky thing as well.

If someone had said in August, "Lamar will have a really good season, and the Ravens will get to the AFCCG and lose to Mahomes and the Chiefs," I think most people would have thought, "Okay, that will be a successful season all things considered," but what happened is that he is the likely MVP, they had the number 1 defense, they got the number 1 seed, and because they could only score 10 points, they lost to the Chiefs despite holding Mahomes to only 17 points.

What I find interesting as well are the people who have said for years that they need to get the Ravens more weapons for Lamar and let him throw him more, so they got him more weapons and he threw more last week, and look how that turned out.

Absolutely. Holding the Chiefs to 17 points and losing is rough.

And also agree completely on the weapons thing. Mark Andrews, Zay Flowers, Isaiah LIkely, Odell Beckham Jr. The "no weapons" excuse is gone.

What's wild too is that Lamar is like the Bizarro Flacco. Lamar has been way better in the regular season than Flacco ever hoped to be, but Flacco in the postseason destroys him.

Look at their playoff numbers for their first six seasons when either started:

Flacco - Ravens were 9-4 with a Super Bowl championship (and Super Bowl MVP award for Flacco) - 20 total touchdowns, 11 total turnovers
Lamar - Ravens were 2-4 - 9 total touchdowns, 9 total turnovers

Flacco's post season numbers are very misleading. The year BAL won the SB he was insane (11 TD, 0 INT). But earlier in his career, his playoff numbers were terrible . . . regardless of whether the Ravens won or lost.

In his first 7 post season games, Flacco had passer ratings of: 59, 89, 18, 10, 48, 115, and 61 . . . plus he lost 2 fumbles in those games (which don't show up in his passer rating stats). He played much better in subsequent seasons. But somehow the Ravens went 4-3 in those early games IN SPITE OF Flacco. He had a 61 passer rating.

No, Lamar hasn't been great . . . but through the same number of playoff games (7), his numbers were actually better than Flacco's. Put another way, substitute those early playoff losses when Flacco had ratings of 18, 48, and 61 with some of Lamar's games and maybe the Ravens would have won another title instead. Football is still a team game, and winning requires multiple players to pick up the slack when other guys have off games. That pass into triple coverage killed the Ravens against the Chiefs, but there were still plenty of other plays that other guys could have stepped up. Lamar is still only 26. Not all QBs have HOF post season performances by that age.

IMO, it's too soon to write off Lamar as a regular season stat compiler and a post season choker. That narrative would change if someday the Ravens make a deeper run . . . even if his numbers aren't great that post season. As I 've said many times, QBs get too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses.

 

[Joe Bryant]

IMO, it's too soon to write off Lamar as a regular season stat compiler and a post season choker. That narrative would change if someday the Ravens make a deeper run . . . even if his numbers aren't great that post season. As I 've said many times, QBs get too much credit for wins and too much blame for losses.

For sure. I don't think anyone is saying that's all he'll ever be. He is most definitely that now, after a 6 game sample. But I'm sure there's lots of playoff football to be played for Jackson.

 

[massraider]

How Prescott is destroyed and Jackson gets mostly a pass is super interesting.

If this was true, Jackson's player thread wouldn't be 100+ pages.

 

[Joe Bryant]

No, Lamar hasn't been great . . .

He's been much worse than "not great" in the playoffs.

This is bad. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/lamar-jackson-playoff-stats

2-4 record.
6 TDs and 6 Interceptions
Ugly completion percentages and passer rating.

He absolutely has a chance to change the narrative. But right now, playoff narrative is bad.

 

[Joe Bryant]

How Prescott is destroyed and Jackson gets mostly a pass is super interesting.

If this was true, Jackson's player thread wouldn't be 100+ pages.

Jackson's thread started in 2016. I'd be shocked if it wasn't 100+ pages. That seems about right for a top fantasy player on a fantasy forum and a two time MVP. McCaffery has 99 pages. But bigger than that, pages of discussion don't equal criticism.

The talk after Dallas lost to Green Bay (who gave San Francisco all they wanted) was some folks claiming the team needed to move off Prescott. I don't hear that type of criticism for Jackson anywhere.

And Prescott getting way more scrutiny than Jackson is hardly a hot take. That was the point of the Nick Wright video above. As others have said, I'm sure a lot of that Dallas and the much higher profile compared to Baltimore.

 

[Anarchy99]

No, Lamar hasn't been great . . .

He's been much worse than "not great" in the playoffs.

This is bad. https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/lamar-jackson-playoff-stats

2-4 record.
6 TDs and 6 Interceptions
Ugly completion percentages and passer rating.

He absolutely has a chance to change the narrative. But right now, playoff narrative is bad.

As I mentioned, Flacco's early post season number were worse . . . and he went on to win a SB 2 years after being essentially terrible for 2 post seasons.

The last two post seasons Lamar played in, he won a game and then lost to Allen or Mahomes. You know who's lost to Allen or Mahomes? A lot of teams and quarterbacks. How many AFC QBs have beaten Mahomes in the post-season? That would only be Brady once and Burrow once. There's no way around it . . . the Chiefs have been and will continue to be a tough out. Things are shaping up to be Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, and Burrow down the stretch over the next few years. Similar to the Brady-Peyton-Roethlisberger period over many years with the Ravens sprinkled in.

 

[Joe Bryant]

The last two post seasons Lamar played in, he won a game and then lost to Allen or Mahomes. The last two post seasons Lamar played in, he won a game and then lost to Allen or Mahomes. You know who's lost to Allen or Mahomes? A lot of teams and quarterbacks.

Yes. But Mahomes and Kansas City also put up 17 points.

Watching that game Sunday, as much as everyone wants to put it on something else, I put the blame on Jackson. He didn't happen to run into a buzz saw of Patrick Mahomes posting 45 points.

 

[ghostguy123]

Expectations are a tricky thing as well.

If someone had said in August, "Lamar will have a really good season, and the Ravens will get to the AFCCG and lose to Mahomes and the Chiefs," I think most people would have thought, "Okay, that will be a successful season all things considered," but what happened is that he is the likely MVP, they had the number 1 defense, they got the number 1 seed, and because they could only score 10 points, they lost to the Chiefs despite holding Mahomes to only 17 points.

What I find interesting as well are the people who have said for years that they need to get the Ravens more weapons for Lamar and let him throw him more, so they got him more weapons and he threw more last week, and look how that turned out.

Absolutely. Holding the Chiefs to 17 points and losing is rough.

And also agree completely on the weapons thing. Mark Andrews, Zay Flowers, Isaiah LIkely, Odell Beckham Jr. The "no weapons" excuse is gone.

Andrews first game back. Flowers a rookie who cost them a TD being stupid, Likely????? He's ok but come on, and OBJ???? For real???

Where do we rank their receiving weapons in the NFL?

That said, Lamar does seem to suck in the playoffs for some reason.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Expectations are a tricky thing as well.

If someone had said in August, "Lamar will have a really good season, and the Ravens will get to the AFCCG and lose to Mahomes and the Chiefs," I think most people would have thought, "Okay, that will be a successful season all things considered," but what happened is that he is the likely MVP, they had the number 1 defense, they got the number 1 seed, and because they could only score 10 points, they lost to the Chiefs despite holding Mahomes to only 17 points.

What I find interesting as well are the people who have said for years that they need to get the Ravens more weapons for Lamar and let him throw him more, so they got him more weapons and he threw more last week, and look how that turned out.

Absolutely. Holding the Chiefs to 17 points and losing is rough.

And also agree completely on the weapons thing. Mark Andrews, Zay Flowers, Isaiah LIkely, Odell Beckham Jr. The "no weapons" excuse is gone.

Andrews first game back. Flowers a rookie who cost them a TD being stupid, Likely????? He's ok but come on, and OBJ???? For real???

Where do we rank their receiving weapons in the NFL?

That said, Lamar does seem to suck in the playoffs for some reason.

I'd have to think a bit more to rank the Raven receiving corps. But they're really good and much better this year.

This was all the talk this summer. https://www.si.com/nfl/ravens/news/...ffensive-weapons-odell-beckham-jr-zay-flowers

 

[Hot Diggity Dog]

The last two post seasons Lamar played in, he won a game and then lost to Allen or Mahomes. The last two post seasons Lamar played in, he won a game and then lost to Allen or Mahomes. You know who's lost to Allen or Mahomes? A lot of teams and quarterbacks.

Yes. But Mahomes and Kansas City also put up 17 points.

Watching that game Sunday, as much as everyone wants to put it on something else, I put the blame on Jackson. He didn't happen to run into a buzz saw of Patrick Mahomes posting 45 points.

It is a sour pill for Baltimore to swallow.