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Warning - Novel Length - A Forum Manifesto (1 Viewer)

Capella said:
I don't know what you're referring to. I don't read that forum. You said the latest thing so I assumed you meant Charlottesville. What exactly would the other opinion be that doesn't come off racist? 
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The faux outrage over Trump's reaction. 

 Condemning the events was unanimous. 

 
Slapdash said:
This is one of the worst shticks ever.
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Not shtick. He's obsessed, twists things around, and then attacks when he doesn't get his way.  Even when I correct myself he still calls me names.  And been doing it for months too.  He's been the expert on pretty much every topic for over a decade but even so it's weird behavior for a guy that was so concerned about pigeon avatars. 

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
Not shtick. He's obsessed, twists things around, and then attacks when he doesn't get his way.  Even when I correct myself he still calls me names.  And been doing it for months too.  He's been the expert on pretty much every topic for over a decade but even so it's weird behavior for a guy that was so concerned about pigeon avatars. 
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Dickinson?  Guy knows his Disney and Costco I'll give him that. 

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
Slapdash said:
This is one of the worst shticks ever.
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Not shtick. He's obsessed, twists things around, and then attacks when he doesn't get his way.  Even when I correct myself he still calls me names.  And been doing it for months too.  He's been the expert on pretty much every topic for over a decade but even so it's weird behavior for a guy that was so concerned about pigeon avatars. 
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To be fair....in that latest thread, you corrected yourself and then literally just a few posts later said pretty much the same thing again that you had to correct yourself on previously.  Reading that exchange I felt like I was watching my kids when my son pushes his sister, apologizes then pushes her again.

 
The Commish said:
To be fair....in that latest thread, you corrected yourself and then literally just a few posts later said pretty much the same thing again that you had to correct yourself on previously.  Reading that exchange I felt like I was watching my kids when my son pushes his sister, apologizes then pushes her again.
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I did?  I make the initial mistake that I've admitted because I was on my phone typing too quickly.  I don't see where I said TF was rooting for anything beyond that admission though.  If I did, link me and I will gladly go edit it and fix my mistake.

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
I did?  I make the initial mistake that I've admitted because I was on my phone typing too quickly.  I don't see where I said TF was rooting for anything beyond that admission though.  If I did, link me and I will gladly go edit it and fix my mistake.
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Sorry....it was a remark about conspiracy theories "like" the president hoping there was a terrorist attack.  It wasn't an assertion that TF was rooting for one.  I'm sure there's a significant difference there to you that I am not seeing but the comment did leave TF out of it.

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
Not shtick. He's obsessed, twists things around, and then attacks when he doesn't get his way.  Even when I correct myself he still calls me names.  And been doing it for months too.  He's been the expert on pretty much every topic for over a decade but even so it's weird behavior for a guy that was so concerned about pigeon avatars. 
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Not shtick?  You seriously think FBGs is paying someone to stalk you?  Come on man, that is hacking into old accounts level of silly 

 
Slapdash said:
Not shtick?  You seriously think FBGs is paying someone to stalk you?  Come on man, that is hacking into old accounts level of silly 
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Paid?  Of course not that part was a joke.  But Is Dickinson obsessed?  Yeah but it's not the first time either.  I'm just his latest obsession.   That's not shtick. 

 
sort of seems like you are obsessed with the idea that others are obsessed with you look all i am sayin is do not pull some fatal attraction rabbit thing take that to the bank brohan 

 
I think some positive steps have been taken to clean the place up a little but FBGs remains a cesspool of Trumpism. Good luck with that, Joe.

 
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roadkill1292 said:
I think some positive steps have been taken to clean the place up a little but FBGs remains a cesspool of Trumpism. Good luck with that, Joe.
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If you say so.  I rarely wander into the PSF, but when I do, it seems like I can't read 5 posts in any thread without seeing the current President mocked, blamed for all the world's ills, and accused of destroying the country.

Could be a small sample size issue I suppose...

 
roadkill1292 said:
I think some positive steps have been taken to clean the place up a little but FBGs remains a cesspool of Trumpism. Good luck with that, Joe.
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In all fairness, how can it not be, to a degree?

30% of the country still supports this guy.  That means out of every three people, ONE of them is going to.  And let's also be honest, it's a new outlet for a lot of antiquated ideas that we thought had their light of day.  Not saying one side is right or wrong, as that's not the point of this thread, but that one person likely thinks they are right, as do the other two.

In that context, are we supposed to have a pro-trump poster free zone? It's impossible, and not representative of the world we live in.

All we can ask of the owners and admins is consistency and fairness. Not to let people purposefully call out and belittle other posters, not put accusations out there without backing, not look to incite and agitate as opposed to engage in some discussion (even if as a result there will be agitation).

I'd also suggest I do notice the tendency in some, and from my perspective mostly pro-trump folks but I am admittedly biased, so could be mistaken, is concerted efforts to pile on. While thank god we don't have the rolling smilie epidemic as it once was, that's a perfect example of how like 3-5 posters would just all pile one, then all like on others posts, none of which added anything but said agitation or calling out.  I will say that there has been a recent uptick in smilie traffic, let's hope that's just an anomoly.

 
Arodin said:
If you say so.  I rarely wander into the PSF, but when I do, it seems like I can't read 5 posts in any thread without seeing the current President mocked, blamed for all the world's ills, and accused of destroying the country.

Could be a small sample size issue I suppose...
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Join us.

 
Koya said:
In that context, are we supposed to have a pro-trump poster free zone? It's impossible, and not representative of the world we live in.

All we can ask of the owners and admins is consistency and fairness. Not to let people purposefully call out and belittle other posters, not put accusations out there without backing, not look to incite and agitate as opposed to engage in some discussion (even if as a result there will be agitation).

I'd also suggest I do notice the tendency in some, and from my perspective mostly pro-trump folks but I am admittedly biased, so could be mistaken, is concerted efforts to pile on. While thank god we don't have the rolling smilie epidemic as it once was, that's a perfect example of how like 3-5 posters would just all pile one, then all like on others posts, none of which added anything but said agitation or calling out.  I will say that there has been a recent uptick in smilie traffic, let's hope that's just an anomoly.
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While I agree with many of your points, I am not sure how you can not see the constant belittling and piling on done by the anti-Trump crowd.   I can not enter a political thread without being called a troll, my posts being twisted, and seeing blanket characterizations of how horrible trump supporters are.  And I don't even support him. 

 
jon_mx said:
While I agree with many of your points, I am not sure how you can not see the constant belittling and piling on done by the anti-Trump crowd.   I can not enter a political thread without being called a troll, my posts being twisted, and seeing blanket characterizations of how horrible trump supporters are.  And I don't even support him. 
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I hear you, but two points and I mean them genuinely.  Well, three.

First, maybe you are correct about the piling on, and I did mention that perhaps my natural bias has me not notice it.  

Second, I don't see the, well, this is a family site, so... circle jest... of people just agitating and not putting substance to their claims and all that, and just tossing smilies and likes to one another (again, a lot less now, thankfully). It's like a concerted effort and parrots.  I do see that you could feel piled on.

Third and finally, and I'm trying to be blunt honest but thoughtful as well... sometimes your claims and approach does come off as trolling, other times not really at all.  Now, is that you, is it "us" or a combination, I don't know. But on certain issues it feels as if (feels, again, maybe I'm wrong) you are putting out accusations or claims without real backing, not looking to listen, using efforts to not answer direct questions, to avoid, or deflect and those types of tactics.  I will say I and I can probably say many/most others don't believe you are a troll... there are a number of folks whereby that's the default. They rarely add any substance, nuance, rarely if EVER answer questions and some just look to incite or purposefully conflate etc.  Most of us recognize that's not you, but it's all the more frustrating then when we feel that you engage in those behaviors.

Again, correct or not.  

Hope that did not offend in any way, and again, maybe I'm off point.  Just my honest assessment, which may not be worth much. FWIW, there have been times here where others have pointed out to me approaches that I may not have been proud of, or that I honestly didn't see as wrong, but realized they were counterproductive regardless. I've not learned all my lessons, but have tried to absorb from the comments of others on this board when it did/does resonate.

 
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roadkill1292 said:
Join us.
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I'd love to, but Im too busy working to earn more than the government takes to be able to keep up with the hundreds of pages of post volume you guys manage...much of it repetitive back and forth and inside jokes,

Honestly, I could start a thread called "Trump eats a cheeseburger for lunch" before leaving and it would probably reach 30 pages and have gotten two posters suspended by the time I got home.

 
Arodin said:
I'd love to, but Im too busy working to earn more than the government takes to be able to keep up with the hundreds of pages of post volume you guys manage...much of it repetitive back and forth and inside jokes,

Honestly, I could start a thread called "Trump eats a cheeseburger for lunch" before leaving and it would probably reach 30 pages and have gotten two posters suspended by the time I got home.
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We had some new tuba trolling and Bollywood memes the last 24 hours. Can't please everyone, I guess. 

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
Not shtick. He's obsessed, twists things around, and then attacks when he doesn't get his way.  Even when I correct myself he still calls me names.  And been doing it for months too.  He's been the expert on pretty much every topic for over a decade but even so it's weird behavior for a guy that was so concerned about pigeon avatars. 
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If you look back at the users who have gotten into prolonged battles with me, it happened because the other felt entitled to their own set of rules and/or their own set of facts.  

You routinely say things about other users that are not true.  You routinely accuse others of behaviors you routinely practice yourself.  

Show your work on the accusations you have made against me in this post.  I'm curious what qualifies in your mind as "obsessed" that doesn't also fit your behavior here.  I'm curious what you think is an example of "twists things around".  When was the last time I called you a name, and how does it compare to the timing and frequency of you calling me names?     

I'm not an expert on many topics.  It seems that way because I try to share my expertise when folks ask about topics I'm knowledgeable about, and when I'm out of depth I ask questions or just shut up and listen.  I suspect my reputation is beyond the bounds of my expertise because I try to be quick to acknowledge my mistakes and errors; they don't linger too much when I meet them head-on instead of doubling down or pretending not to make them.
   
FWIW, I consider the pigeon avatar matter closed.  I wasn't concerned about the avatars themselves all that much; it just seemed weird how much you complain about how users treat each others here when for months you were posting with an avatar designed specifically to mock a user here (see above comment about "own set of rules").  But you've retired it and seem to have stopped congratulating yourself for retiring it, so that's good and I won't bring it up again.  We'll see if you can do the same. 

IMO you have such a warped perspective of me because you rarely actually participate in discussion of topics.  Since most of your posts in threads I participate in are about other users and not the topic at hand, you don't give us much opportunity to actually exchange ideas related to topics at hand.  I've tried in the past by asking you open-ended questions about the topic to divert you from talking trash about others, but those questions rarely go answered.

I'm not trying to be mean.  I'm trying to be honest.  I'd much rather discuss actual topics with you than go through this bull#### with you every few months.  What would you rather do? 

 
Arodin said:
If you say so.  I rarely wander into the PSF, but when I do, it seems like I can't read 5 posts in any thread without seeing the current President mocked, blamed for all the world's ills, and accused of destroying the country.

Could be a small sample size issue I suppose...
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Nope you nailed it, it's essentially a venting thread/forum for liberals. 

 
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Koya said:
I hear you, but two points and I mean them genuinely.  Well, three.

First, maybe you are correct about the piling on, and I did mention that perhaps my natural bias has me not notice it.  

Second, I don't see the, well, this is a family site, so... circle jest... of people just agitating and not putting substance to their claims and all that, and just tossing smilies and likes to one another (again, a lot less now, thankfully). It's like a concerted effort and parrots.  I do see that you could feel piled on.

Third and finally, and I'm trying to be blunt honest but thoughtful as well... sometimes your claims and approach does come off as trolling, other times not really at all.  Now, is that you, is it "us" or a combination, I don't know. But on certain issues it feels as if (feels, again, maybe I'm wrong) you are putting out accusations or claims without real backing, not looking to listen, using efforts to not answer direct questions, to avoid, or deflect and those types of tactics.  I will say I and I can probably say many/most others don't believe you are a troll... there are a number of folks whereby that's the default. They rarely add any substance, nuance, rarely if EVER answer questions and some just look to incite or purposefully conflate etc.  Most of us recognize that's not you, but it's all the more frustrating then when we feel that you engage in those behaviors.

Again, correct or not.  

Hope that did not offend in any way, and again, maybe I'm off point.  Just my honest assessment, which may not be worth much. FWIW, there have been times here where others have pointed out to me approaches that I may not have been proud of, or that I honestly didn't see as wrong, but realized they were counterproductive regardless. I've not learned all my lessons, but have tried to absorb from the comments of others on this board when it did/does resonate.
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I appreciate feedback when not done is a spiteful way.  I try to back things up with a factual basis.  Bu there are times I just question the consensus of opinion without much basis in fact. Not to troll, that is just how my mind approaches things.  I don't quickly accept conclusions no matter how factually based they at first appear.  I look at things from different angles and stress test those conclusions to see how they hold up.  Sometimes I hit on things that bring into questions those conclusions and sometimes the conclusions hold up.  Often times the conclusions are based on selective facts and have serious holes when you really examine them. 

 
jon_mx said:
While I agree with many of your points, I am not sure how you can not see the constant belittling and piling on done by the anti-Trump crowd.   I can not enter a political thread without being called a troll, my posts being twisted, and seeing blanket characterizations of how horrible trump supporters are.  And I don't even support him. 
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:yes:

 
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Bruce Dickinson said:
If you look back at the users who have gotten into prolonged battles with me, it happened because the other felt entitled to their own set of rules and/or their own set of facts.  

You routinely say things about other users that are not true.  You routinely accuse others of behaviors you routinely practice yourself.  

Show your work on the accusations you have made against me in this post.  I'm curious what qualifies in your mind as "obsessed" that doesn't also fit your behavior here.  I'm curious what you think is an example of "twists things around".  When was the last time I called you a name, and how does it compare to the timing and frequency of you calling me names?     

I'm not an expert on many topics.  It seems that way because I try to share my expertise when folks ask about topics I'm knowledgeable about, and when I'm out of depth I ask questions or just shut up and listen.  I suspect my reputation is beyond the bounds of my expertise because I try to be quick to acknowledge my mistakes and errors; they don't linger too much when I meet them head-on instead of doubling down or pretending not to make them.
   
FWIW, I consider the pigeon avatar matter closed.  I wasn't concerned about the avatars themselves all that much; it just seemed weird how much you complain about how users treat each others here when for months you were posting with an avatar designed specifically to mock a user here (see above comment about "own set of rules").  But you've retired it and seem to have stopped congratulating yourself for retiring it, so that's good and I won't bring it up again.  We'll see if you can do the same. 

IMO you have such a warped perspective of me because you rarely actually participate in discussion of topics.  Since most of your posts in threads I participate in are about other users and not the topic at hand, you don't give us much opportunity to actually exchange ideas related to topics at hand.  I've tried in the past by asking you open-ended questions about the topic to divert you from talking trash about others, but those questions rarely go answered.

I'm not trying to be mean.  I'm trying to be honest.  I'd much rather discuss actual topics with you than go through this bull#### with you every few months.  What would you rather do? 
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I have a question...how do so many of your worst, over the top insults get deleted so often and quickly?  Is that you doing that or is that a mod?  Just curious. 

 
RBM said:
I have a question...how do so many of your worst, over the top insults get deleted so often and quickly?  Is that you doing that or is that a mod?  Just curious. 
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Isn't he the guy that told the owner of this site to Go **** Himself a while back?

 
jon_mx said:
While I agree with many of your points, I am not sure how you can not see the constant belittling and piling on done by the anti-Trump crowd.   I can not enter a political thread without being called a troll, my posts being twisted, and seeing blanket characterizations of how horrible trump supporters are.  And I don't even support him. 
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There are many different groups that get lumped into this generic label, which is sort of funny given your opposition to others using a broad brush.  We aren't all cut from the same cloth.  I've tried to engage you in a meaningful way several times by explaining why you were undergoing the "attack" dejour.  I've never gotten personal with you beyond telling you how you were coming across.  I've encouraged you to be the change you want to see, yet nothing changes.  I get the above is how you see things.  What I can tell you is you don't come across the way you think you do.  There's give and take in every presentation/communication.  You don't seem interested in giving so I'm puzzled why you'd expect treatment different than what you're getting from a lot of people here.  It's a two way street.

 
The Commish said:
There are many different groups that get lumped into this generic label, which is sort of funny given your opposition to others using a broad brush.  We aren't all cut from the same cloth.  I've tried to engage you in a meaningful way several times by explaining why you were undergoing the "attack" dejour.  I've never gotten personal with you beyond telling you how you were coming across.  I've encouraged you to be the change you want to see, yet nothing changes.  I get the above is how you see things.  What I can tell you is you don't come across the way you think you do.  There's give and take in every presentation/communication.  You don't seem interested in giving so I'm puzzled why you'd expect treatment different than what you're getting from a lot of people here.  It's a two way street.
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All I expect is it not to become personal.  Is that really too much to ask? I was not painting individuals with a broad brush.  I was describing how the group behaves.  I could easily find a hundred plus posts which are personal and have nothing to do with the facts or the topic.  Instead of finding common ground there are always several who try to find something to pick a part about my post and turn it into something personal.  It is just crap stirrers and then even the posters who I consider good will sometimes pile on.  Really disappoints me that people won't stand up to these tactics. 

 
jon_mx said:
The Commish said:
There are many different groups that get lumped into this generic label, which is sort of funny given your opposition to others using a broad brush.  We aren't all cut from the same cloth.  I've tried to engage you in a meaningful way several times by explaining why you were undergoing the "attack" dejour.  I've never gotten personal with you beyond telling you how you were coming across.  I've encouraged you to be the change you want to see, yet nothing changes.  I get the above is how you see things.  What I can tell you is you don't come across the way you think you do.  There's give and take in every presentation/communication.  You don't seem interested in giving so I'm puzzled why you'd expect treatment different than what you're getting from a lot of people here.  It's a two way street.
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All I expect is it not to become personal.  Is that really too much to ask? I was not painting individuals with a broad brush.  I was describing how the group behaves.  I could easily find a hundred plus posts which are personal and have nothing to do with the facts or the topic.  Instead of finding common ground there are always several who try to find something to pick a part about my post and turn it into something personal.  It is just crap stirrers and then even the posters who I consider good will sometimes pile on.  Really disappoints me that people won't stand up to these tactics. 
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Pretty good example of what I was talking about...good luck with it :shrug:  

 
Ramblin Wreck said:
Not shtick. He's obsessed, twists things around, and then attacks when he doesn't get his way.  Even when I correct myself he still calls me names.  And been doing it for months too.  He's been the expert on pretty much every topic for over a decade but even so it's weird behavior for a guy that was so concerned about pigeon avatars. 
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You definitely seem to be handling it well and presenting yourself in a great light despite things.  :thumbup:

 
And if there are draft dominators I can only assume there are also draft submissives.  Guys who go in and draft all defenses and kickers in the early rounds.  And they LOVE it.

 
RBM said:
I have a question...how do so many of your worst, over the top insults get deleted so often and quickly?  Is that you doing that or is that a mod?  Just curious. 
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This has definitely happened at least once that I know of recently, as some make it well known they are very anti Trump I guess they cover for him? 

 
Zaxxon said:
You definitely seem to be handling it well and presenting yourself in a great light despite things.  :thumbup:
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Well said.
BTW, did you know the way the military prepared for the drone era was with ghost riding?
Props to those ghost riders in tactical gear - they're moving faster than I do carrying groceries in from the garage.

 
Bruce Dickinson said:
Well said.
BTW, did you know the way the military prepared for the drone era was with ghost riding?
Props to those ghost riders in tactical gear - they're moving faster than I do carrying groceries in from the garage.
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I can only imagine how much more difficult it must be to hit a moving target with those kinds of moves. Strategic benefit.  :thumbup:

 
RBM said:
Politics forum is as hostile as the FFA ever was. Absolutely no room for dissenting opinion. And with this latest thing it's not even ok if you're in somewhat agreement with them. You've got to be 100% on board or you're just completely deplorable. 
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It's an embarrassing place for sure.  Several posters openly calling out Trump voters this morning crossing several lines outlined in the rules.  At least it's not in the FFA though, right?

 
jon_mx said:
The Commish said:
Pretty good example of what I was talking about...good luck with it :shrug:  
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Yes it is. You see nothing wrong with making personal attacks instead of discussing issues as adults.  Why would I give in to that?  
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You attack this straw man with an intensity unknown to mankind jon_mx!!!!!  I mean really beat the crap out of it!!!  Show it who's boss!!!!

You should see by my approach towards you what I feel about personal attacks, but for whatever reason you want to create an alternate reality.  Just a few posts above this you were whining about people twisting your words, then I read this.....funny how that works.

 
The Commish said:
You attack this straw man with an intensity unknown to mankind jon_mx!!!!!  I mean really beat the crap out of it!!!  Show it who's boss!!!!

You should see by my approach towards you what I feel about personal attacks, but for whatever reason you want to create an alternate reality.  Just a few posts above this you were whining about people twisting your words, then I read this.....funny how that works.
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My issue was making arguments personal.  I am not sure what you are talking about or why you are disagreeing then.  It is not about just me, it is about any posters who enter into one of the anti-Trump threads. 

 
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