What am I missing on the VJax / AJ Smith situation? (1 Viewer)

[Touchdown There]

Not the first definition of petition, the second.

1. a formally drawn request, often bearing the names of a number of those making the request

2. a request made for something desired

AJ Smith will petition the NFL representatives who bargain the specifics of the CBA. He will want to structure the terms so that Vincent Jackson will be an RFA. Are you saying he will not put his 2 cents worth in the negotiations process? That would seem more "ridiculous".

 

[Touchdown There]

Just change the word "petition" to "lobby" so I do not confuse you guys.

 

[Tau837]

Not the first definition of petition, the second.1. a formally drawn request, often bearing the names of a number of those making the request2. a request made for something desiredAJ Smith will petition the NFL representatives who bargain the specifics of the CBA. He will want to structure the terms so that Vincent Jackson will be an RFA. Are you saying he will not put his 2 cents worth in the negotiations process? That would seem more "ridiculous".

No, I don't think he will. Do you think every team's GM is going to be contributing to the negotiation process?Like I said, ridiculous.

 

[Gr00vus]

AJ Smith will petition lobby the NFL representatives who bargain the specifics of the CBA. He will want to structure the terms so that Vincent Jackson will be an RFA. Are you saying he will not put his 2 cents worth in the negotiations process? That would seem more "ridiculous".

No I don't think he will. A.J. might franchise him, if that's still an available tool, but honestly unless none of the current Charger receivers are capable of being even average I think he'll let Jackson walk and spend his money elsewhere. Very unlikely that he spends any time worrying/lobbying about how the new CBA will affect his ability to retain Jackson.

 

[Touchdown There]

I think he'll let Jackson walk and spend his money elsewhere. Very unlikely that he spends any time worrying/lobbying about how the new CBA will affect his ability to retain Jackson.

From what I have heard, AJ Smith does not like to lose these contractual tiffs. You would think that if he was going to let Vincent Jackson go next year for nothing, that he would let him go this year for maximum compensation the open market would bring in.I am not going to speculate as to AJ Smith's plan to retain Vincent Jackson. I am just saying it seems likely to get ugly. I doubt AJ Smith and the Chargers throw their hands in the air let the chips fall as they may. Franchise tag is the only option? McNeill is still in the same boat and this is a list of Chargers 2011 free agentsos Player Name FA Status Previous Team QB Billy Volek UFA San Diego Chargers WR Legedu Naanee UFA San Diego Chargers TE Randy McMichaelUFA San Diego Chargers OT Jeromey Clary UFA San Diego Chargers DL Ryon Bingham UFA San Diego Chargers DL Jacques Cesaire UFA San Diego Chargers DL Travis Johnson UFA San Diego Chargers LB Kevin Burnett UFA San Diego Chargers LB Stephen Cooper UFA San Diego Chargers LB Brandon Siler UFA San Diego Chargers FS Paul Oliver UFA San Diego Chargers FS Eric Weddle UFA San Diego Chargers

 

[Touchdown There]

Do you think every team's GM is going to be contributing to the negotiation process? Like I said, ridiculous.

That would be ridiculous. With 32 teams full of GMs, owners, and attorneys all sitting in one room on one side of the table, nothing would get done. It is a good thing that is not what I said above. I am suggesting that the Chargers will have their input with the negotiating representatives BEFORE the CBA meeting to ensure their specific issue is addressed in their favor.

 

[Tau837]

Do you think every team's GM is going to be contributing to the negotiation process? Like I said, ridiculous.

That would be ridiculous. With 32 teams full of GMs, owners, and attorneys all sitting in one room on one side of the table, nothing would get done. It is a good thing that is not what I said above. I am suggesting that the Chargers will have their input with the negotiating representatives BEFORE the CBA meeting to ensure their specific issue is addressed in their favor.

You are wrong.

 

[Touchdown There]

Are you AJ Smith in disguise?

 

[Tau837]

I think he'll let Jackson walk and spend his money elsewhere. Very unlikely that he spends any time worrying/lobbying about how the new CBA will affect his ability to retain Jackson.

From what I have heard, AJ Smith does not like to lose these contractual tiffs. You would think that if he was going to let Vincent Jackson go next year for nothing, that he would let him go this year for maximum compensation the open market would bring in.I am not going to speculate as to AJ Smith's plan to retain Vincent Jackson. I am just saying it seems likely to get ugly. I doubt AJ Smith and the Chargers throw their hands in the air let the chips fall as they may. Franchise tag is the only option? McNeill is still in the same boat and this is a list of Chargers 2011 free agentsos Player Name FA Status Previous Team QB Billy Volek UFA San Diego Chargers WR Legedu Naanee UFA San Diego Chargers TE Randy McMichaelUFA San Diego Chargers OT Jeromey Clary UFA San Diego Chargers DL Ryon Bingham UFA San Diego Chargers DL Jacques Cesaire UFA San Diego Chargers DL Travis Johnson UFA San Diego Chargers LB Kevin Burnett UFA San Diego Chargers LB Stephen Cooper UFA San Diego Chargers LB Brandon Siler UFA San Diego Chargers FS Paul Oliver UFA San Diego Chargers FS Eric Weddle UFA San Diego Chargers

Why would you think A.J. loses if Jackson sits out the year and becomes a UFA and walks afterwards? He only loses if he caves and brings Jackson back with a big dollar contract this year, which he isn't likely to do.That list of UFAs is probably an excellent illustration of why A.J. isn't inclined to give Jackson a big contract. He probably feels he is better off using those dollars on multiple other free agents.

 

[Touchdown There]

A friend's friend told me that AJ Smith had a tramp stamp that looks just like this on his lower back:



** Edit Update: Image function not working on forum. Insert Just Win's Superman icon above. Joke killed by technical difficulties.

 

[Tau837]

Are you AJ Smith in disguise?

No, I'm Philip Rivers.

 

[Touchdown There]

Philip, you are going to be the last to know then. AJ Smith will want you to like him.

 

[finfansteve]

aj and vincent are both idiots.

Agreed.Basically what it boils down to is both parties need each other to maximize each others success and when one succeeds the other will succeed also. Whats so difficult about paying him and getting him into camp? Both AJ and VJ owe it to the other 50 some odd players on the Chargers to get VJ into camp and give the team the best chance to succeed. If I was a player on the Chargers I would be pissed about AJ and VJ's stubborness and wonder about my own future with this team.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Whats so difficult about paying him and getting him into camp?

He reportedly wants more money than Brandon Marshall got. I don't know if the Chargers have an extra $50 million laying around.

 

[finfansteve]

Whats so difficult about paying him and getting him into camp?

He reportedly wants more money than Brandon Marshall got. I don't know if the Chargers have an extra $50 million laying around.

but we don't know if thats really what he's asking for. The window of opportunity closes very fast to win a superbowl and I would imagine that without all of your best players available on the field (mcneill included) that it would close even faster.

 

[craxie]

5. Also, there is a provision in the current CBA which says that a player cannot go from restricted free agency to unrestricted free agency by sitting out the whole year — regardless of the number of accrued seasons he has.

which will certainly be challenged and likely overturned in arbitration if it's applied

An arbitrator doesn't have the authority to overturn a provision of the CBA.

they have the authority to determine what it means and how it applies, which is the same thing

 

[Gr00vus]

You would think that if he was going to let Vincent Jackson go next year for nothing, that he would let him go this year for maximum compensation the open market would bring in.

The ceiling in compensation seems to be a 2nd round pick or so. I don't think anyone's going to pull a Deion Branch any time soon. As it stands now they'd probably get a 3rd rounder in compensation if he leaves as a UFA, which, while not a 2nd rounder, isn't nothing either.

I am just saying it seems likely to get ugly.

It already is.

I doubt AJ Smith and the Chargers throw their hands in the air let the chips fall as they may. Franchise tag is the only option?

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that it's probably the only option that results in Jackson staying with the team beyond this season. It's clear they're not in the ballpark of what Jackson and his agent want in terms of a long term deal, and A.J. doesn't deviate from his plans when it comes to that.

McNeill is still in the same boat and this is a list of Chargers 2011 free agentsos Player Name FA Status Previous Team QB Billy Volek UFA San Diego Chargers WR Legedu Naanee UFA San Diego Chargers TE Randy McMichaelUFA San Diego Chargers OT Jeromey Clary UFA San Diego Chargers DL Ryon Bingham UFA San Diego Chargers DL Jacques Cesaire UFA San Diego Chargers DL Travis Johnson UFA San Diego Chargers LB Kevin Burnett UFA San Diego Chargers LB Stephen Cooper UFA San Diego Chargers LB Brandon Siler UFA San Diego Chargers FS Paul Oliver UFA San Diego Chargers FS Eric Weddle UFA San Diego Chargers

As mentioned, this perfectly illustrates why the Chargers aren't in a position to give Jackson the long term deal he's asking for. They've got more important places to allocate that money - I think Cooper and Weddle will top the priority list there, possibly Naanee next depending on how he does this year. The rest are take or leaves, but I don't see any that are going to command huge deals if the Chargers wish to keep them. Even so there's only so much $$ to go around.

 

[Gr00vus]

aj and vincent are both idiots.

Agreed.Basically what it boils down to is both parties need each other to maximize each others success and when one succeeds the other will succeed also. Whats so difficult about paying him and getting him into camp? Both AJ and VJ owe it to the other 50 some odd players on the Chargers to get VJ into camp and give the team the best chance to succeed. If I was a player on the Chargers I would be pissed about AJ and VJ's stubborness and wonder about my own future with this team.

The actual players on the Chargers don't seem to have that problem. A.J. has been pretty clear on letting people know where they stand with the team. I think FF players are overestimating the real football value of Jackson to the Chargers.

 

[Gr00vus]

Whats so difficult about paying him and getting him into camp?

He reportedly wants more money than Brandon Marshall got. I don't know if the Chargers have an extra $50 million laying around.

but we don't know if thats really what he's asking for. The window of opportunity closes very fast to win a superbowl and I would imagine that without all of your best players available on the field (mcneill included) that it would close even faster.

If you've read A.J.'s quotes you'd know he doesn't agree with this sentiment, and he's not working under that assumption.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Whats so difficult about paying him and getting him into camp?

He reportedly wants more money than Brandon Marshall got. I don't know if the Chargers have an extra $50 million laying around.

but we don't know if thats really what he's asking for. The window of opportunity closes very fast to win a superbowl and I would imagine that without all of your best players available on the field (mcneill included) that it would close even faster.

If you've read A.J.'s quotes you'd know he doesn't agree with this sentiment, and he's not working under that assumption.

The window closes fast on teams that impatiently overpay for players "before the window closes."Under AJ Smith, the Chargers haven't done that. People have talked about the fast-closing window since 2006, but it's open as wide now as it ever has been.

 

[Jolly Swagman]

Whats so difficult about paying him and getting him into camp?

He reportedly wants more money than Brandon Marshall got. I don't know if the Chargers have an extra $50 million laying around.

but we don't know if thats really what he's asking for. The window of opportunity closes very fast to win a superbowl and I would imagine that without all of your best players available on the field (mcneill included) that it would close even faster.

If you've read A.J.'s quotes you'd know he doesn't agree with this sentiment, and he's not working under that assumption.

The window closes fast on teams that impatiently overpay for players "before the window closes."Under AJ Smith, the Chargers haven't done that. People have talked about the fast-closing window since 2006, but it's open as wide now as it ever has been.

oddly though, they have not been able to do anything with that window.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

oddly though, they have not been able to do anything with that window.

Yeah, it's been disappointing. But I think the best way to eventually win the Super Bowl is to keep making the playoffs every year.

 

[shader]

I think the whole "2-3 year super bowl window" is a huge myth.

The NFL comes down to having a great QB. If you have a great QB, your team has a chance at a Super Bowl.

The Chargers have a great QB. Sure, there will be years that they'll be up and years they'll be down...But their super bowl window will probably be open as long as Philip Rivers performs at a high level.