Why KC Should Go After Vick and Reid...... (2 Viewers)

[Donnybrook]

I'm thinking Heckert will be the GM, Shurmer the OC, Juan the OL Coach, Culley WR coach, Peterson as QB coach and Jauron as the DC?McNabb as the "starter" and Smith (Geno) will take over by week 5.

How can I best descibe this supposed plan? Absolute disaster.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

I'm thinking Heckert will be the GM, Shurmer the OC, Juan the OL Coach, Culley WR coach, Peterson as QB coach and Jauron as the DC?McNabb as the "starter" and Smith (Geno) will take over by week 5.

The "love" Andy had for McNabb in the media as he was letting him go in Philly, was all a smoke screen. No way the guy who Reid was glad to stick Washington with is going to be QB on an AR coached team. I don't know how much you followed the Eagles, but no one who followed what was up in that Eagles locker room could think that Donovan will ever be playing for Reid.But I do like your Heckert call.

Thanks for spoiling the fantasy, G-King...that would have been fun to watch! Donny out of moth balls to join with Andy one last time. Ah well, McNabb probably didn't want to restart his HOF clock anyway.

I can't take the credit for that..I heard it on 97.5 last night.

 

[Shutout]

With all the talk about reid's QB plans, I'm surprised nobody has talked this one through:

Cardinals release Kolb (whom we find out Bidwell isn't as intent on keeping now that Reid isn't there) and Reid snatches him up and drafts a QB somewhere. The Chiefs spend next season with Kolb and a kid in the wings.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I think this is a big mistake for the Chiefs in the long term. What Reid did was the equivalent of getting a divorce from an ugly girl whose Daddy owns a big company to instantly remarrying an even uglier girl whose Daddy owns a smaller company, but at least you can say you were in charge. Soft rumors in Philly were that Reid was very interested in Ryan Nassib of Syracuse as a sleeper QB1 candidate. Unfortunately the extra burn that Doug Marrone got from his former Saints days upped the profile some. Nassib is probably grading out now into the 2nd. Internal scuttlebutt is one of the things that Pioli did this offseason to put himself more on the line is to say his direction was either trading the overall #1 or Geno Smith ( same thing really) and try to grab a franchise QB1 in round 2 while grabbing a blue chip defensive lineman in Round 1. Apparently Reid was actually able to sell KC on the idea with his past QB1 development pedigree while Pioli was not. Very quietly look for Tampa Bay, looking to disembark from the Freeman Express, and KC to talk about a Geno Smith + something for Josh Freeman + 13th overall + some other things potential trade, with Reid gunning for Nassib in round 2. The thirteenth overall, inside Reid's camp, the prospect he can't stop apparently raving about to his confidants is Zeke Ansah of BYU. Typical Andy Reid. Considering dumping a younger passer with a 70 percent completion rating this year with a rough floor of 67/68 on a cost controlled four year rookie contract for a more costly square peg/round hole Reid blue plate special of a more costly guy historically at a 58 percent completion percentage but is another black guy who can throw a deep ball and has some mobility with his legs. For the bonus of reaching for another high ceiling raw D lineman when there are more stable options with a higher floor. This of course doesn't account for the nightmare scenario, where EJ Manuel instead of Mike Glennon becomes this years sleeper QB1 riser and slots around 13. Never mind he's a Jimbo Fisher sell high prodigy. Let's see if whomever ends up the GM can talk him out of being classic Andy Reid. "Keep Firing" has landed in KC, bend over KC fans, here it comes.

Don't know anything about Ansah, but based on Reid's past drafts, without looking I would guess: "Undersized but has a high motor".

 

[MAC_32]

Ansash is not under sized, most will give a lazy analysis - he is raw - but he really isn't, just not experienced. All the physical tools and has succeeded in several different roles. Matchup nightmare with a variety of moves. Stock is going to sore over the next few months, rightfully so, just not sure how high...especially with such a strong DE class.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

@Gil_Brandt: Reid got everything he wanted in KC, complete control. Biggest factor for Reid was Chiefs prez Mark Donovan. Reid loved what he heard.

--complete control. THAT is where you're doomed.

 

[MAC_32]

@Gil_Brandt: Reid got everything he wanted in KC, complete control. Biggest factor for Reid was Chiefs prez Mark Donovan. Reid loved what he heard.--complete control. THAT is where you're doomed.

 

[Please See Mine]

Donovan was senior vice president/operations for the Eagles from 2003-2009.

 

[MAC_32]

Ansash is not under sized, most will give a lazy analysis - he is raw - but he really isn't, just not experienced.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/raw

Definition of RAW .....4a : lacking experience or understanding : green <a raw recruit>

Merriam Webster and I both apologize to you for our apparent laziness.

Pick a more appropriate word then. I associate raw with guys that have the physical skills, but haven't refined their technique. Ansah has the different techniques at multiple positions, he just doesn't use it at the right time sometimes because he's still getting the feel for the game down.I think that's an important distinction between him and most prospects we consider 'raw.'

 

[loose circuits]

Well this thread went from interesting discussion to worthless fairly fast

 

[MAC_32]

Well this thread went from interesting discussion to worthless fairly fast

I'm bowing out, I think it's clear what I'm trying to say. Gordon's just being a pompous ###. Unfortunately, not a funny one either.

 

[G-King]

If Reid signs with KC (or anybody for that matter) there is less than 1 percent chance that Vick goes anywhere with him. Unless one of them has a flat on the interstate going out of Philly and happens to catch a ride. AR knows that Vick was a one year, lightning in a bottle. He doesn't have the intelligence to QB a football team, and now his biggest assets (speed and arm strength) are diminishing. He was a great story for a guy turning his life around though.

G-King! We miss you over in the Eagles threads. How is your boy handling the turmoil in Arizona?

Thanks. He's disappointed that Andy choose KC over AZ, but still happy to see him where he wants to be. In my opinion, even though there is some turmoil now, its nothing like the dysfunction of the Wisenhunt days. There has got to be brighter days ahead for sure. (pray)

 

[G-King]

If Reid signs with KC (or anybody for that matter) there is less than 1 percent chance that Vick goes anywhere with him. Unless one of them has a flat on the interstate going out of Philly and happens to catch a ride.

AR knows that Vick was a one year, lightning in a bottle. He doesn't have the intelligence to QB a football team, and now his biggest assets (speed and arm strength) are diminishing.

He was a great story for a guy turning his life around though.

You have any insight on the whole power struggle (especially with the drafts)? Sorry if I've forgotten anything you've said in the past.

Any chance of Reid getting back KK?

Stay tuned.....

 

[Steed]

If Andy loved him so much, why did he trade him away? Was he completely fooled by Vick at the time?

 

[G-King]

With all the talk about reid's QB plans, I'm surprised nobody has talked this one through:Cardinals release Kolb (whom we find out Bidwell isn't as intent on keeping now that Reid isn't there) and Reid snatches him up and drafts a QB somewhere. The Chiefs spend next season with Kolb and a kid in the wings.

Let's hope so.

 

[G-King]

If Andy loved him so much, why did he trade him away? Was he completely fooled by Vick at the time?

And there is your answer.

 

[HULLOBUDMAN]

Ansash is not under sized, most will give a lazy analysis - he is raw - but he really isn't, just not experienced.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/raw

Definition of RAW ..... to post.Merriam Webster and I both apologize to you for our apparent laziness.

Pick a more appropriate word then. I associate raw with guys that have the physical skills, but haven't refined their technique. Ansah has the different techniques at multiple positions, he just doesn't use it at the right time sometimes because he's still getting the feel for the game down.I think that's an important distinction between him and most prospects we consider 'raw.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_the_goalposts

As logical fallacyMoving the goalposts, also known as raising the bar, is an informal logically fallacious argument in which evidence presented in response to a specific claim is dismissed and some other (often greater) evidence is demanded. In other words, after a goal has been scored, the goalposts are moved farther to discount the attempt. This attempts to leave the impression that an argument had a fair hearing while actually reaching a preordained conclusion

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychologist%27s_fallacy

The psychologist's fallacy is a fallacy that occurs when an observer presupposes the universality of his/her own perspective when analyzing a behavioral event

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking_%28fallacy%29

Cherry picking, suppressing evidence, or the fallacy of incomplete evidence is the act of pointing to individual cases or data that seem to confirm a particular position, while ignoring a significant portion of related cases or data that may contradict that position. It is a kind of fallacy of selective attention

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasty_generalization

Hasty generalization is an informal fallacy of faulty generalization by reaching an inductive generalization based on insufficient evidence— essentially making a hasty conclusion without considering all of the variables. In statistics, it may involve basing broad conclusions regarding the statistics of a survey from a small sample group that fails to sufficiently represent an entire population

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mind_projection_fallacy

The mind projection fallacy is a logical fallacy first described by physicist and Bayesian philosopher E.T. Jaynes. It occurs when someone thinks that the way they see the world reflects the way the world really is, going as far as assuming the real existence of imagined objects.[1] That is, someone's subjective judgements are "projected" to be inherent properties of an object, rather than being related to personal perception. One consequence is that others may be assumed to share the same perception, or that they are irrational or misinformed if they do not.

4a : lacking experience or understanding : green <a raw recruit>

Googled "pissing in the Shark pool" and "ruining a perfectly good thread trying to prove you are an internet tough guy" but sadly couldn't find any links to post.

 

[Two Deep]

Matt Flynn

The National Football Post hears Matt Flynn "could be on the move for the second time in as many seasons, this time via the trade market."ESPN's John Clayton recently offered a similar opinion. Due $5.25 million (only $2 million guaranteed), Flynn is expensive for a backup quarterback. Best suited to a West Coast offense, Flynn could be attractive to Andy Reid's Chiefs.Source: National Football Post

 

[Jason Wood]

was really kinda just referring to a top 5 fantasy type season in recent years....not just "passing yards"....rushing and TD's etc....but your point is noted....even so, it's been awhile since the Trent Green era and KC really hasn't been known as a QB haven...lot of retreads including Green...

Ref, Trent Green was the 4th best fantasy QB in back-to-back years (2003-2004)...and he was 8th the year before that.

 

[Da Guru]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

They honestly have nothing to lose by bringing him in. He'll be able to teach Reid's system, mentor the young guy they draft or the guy they sign and he'd more then likely be on a low paying, incentive based deal.The only issue would be how things ended in Philly with McNabb

 

[money.never.sleeps]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

Not happening nor should it. McNabb is done.

 

[BeTheMatch]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

They honestly have nothing to lose by bringing him in. He'll be able to teach Reid's system, mentor the young guy they draft or the guy they sign and he'd more then likely be on a low paying, incentive based deal.The only issue would be how things ended in Philly with McNabb

Teach them what? How to throw fastballs into WRs' ankles? And not work out in the offseason?

 

[Jason Wood]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

They honestly have nothing to lose by bringing him in. He'll be able to teach Reid's system, mentor the young guy they draft or the guy they sign and he'd more then likely be on a low paying, incentive based deal.The only issue would be how things ended in Philly with McNabb

Teach them what? How to throw fastballs into WRs' ankles? And not work out in the offseason?

How good someone was at the position is by no means indicative of how good they would be as a coach.Doug Pederson is the odds on favorite to be the new OC, he was a TERRIBLE NFL quarterback. And jokes aside, McNabb was an insanely intense offseason conditioning guy for most of his career, he pretty much established the tradition of going to Arizona and training (something Larry Fitz has kept going). And FWIW, that's the strength and conditioning coach's job anyway. It's not like Rex Ryan or Bill Belichick or Andy Reid or Tom Coughlin or Mike McCarthy or any number of other coaches are pillars of physical conditioning.

 

[BeTheMatch]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

They honestly have nothing to lose by bringing him in. He'll be able to teach Reid's system, mentor the young guy they draft or the guy they sign and he'd more then likely be on a low paying, incentive based deal.The only issue would be how things ended in Philly with McNabb

Teach them what? How to throw fastballs into WRs' ankles? And not work out in the offseason?

How good someone was at the position is by no means indicative of how good they would be as a coach.Doug Pederson is the odds on favorite to be the new OC, he was a TERRIBLE NFL quarterback. And jokes aside, McNabb was an insanely intense offseason conditioning guy for most of his career, he pretty much established the tradition of going to Arizona and training (something Larry Fitz has kept going). And FWIW, that's the strength and conditioning coach's job anyway. It's not like Rex Ryan or Bill Belichick or Andy Reid or Tom Coughlin or Mike McCarthy or any number of other coaches are pillars of physical conditioning.

Oh, really? Then how come they had to burn a time-out every time he scrambled for more than 10 yards because it would take him so long to stagger back to the huddle? I've never seen a more out-of-shape player in my life that wasn't on either the offensive or defensive line. He was like the Big Bad Wolf with all that huffing and puffing.

 

[Please See Mine]

I, too, found the value of his offseason conditioning and workouts to be somewhat dubious. He got bigger and perhaps stronger, but at the expense of his agility and I think that it hurt him. I also don't know when McNabb has ever shown himself to be a good mentor, so I am skeptical of that claim as well. He always was insecure and had a chip on his shoulder.

 

[Da Guru]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

Not happening nor should it. McNabb is done.

Ackers will be looking for a job, TO is still job hunting. The Boys are back in town...

 

[Amused to Death]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

Not happening nor should it. McNabb is done.

Ackers will be looking for a job, TO is still job hunting. The Boys are back in town...

I know you're joking, but there's no way David Akers would work for Reid again. Reid threw Akers under the bus big time following a playoff loss - when DA was waiting word if his daughter had cancer. Missed 2 kicks and Reid laid the blame on him. I doubt Akers bothers to send Andy Christmas cards anymore.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

They honestly have nothing to lose by bringing him in. He'll be able to teach Reid's system, mentor the young guy they draft or the guy they sign and he'd more then likely be on a low paying, incentive based deal.The only issue would be how things ended in Philly with McNabb

Teach them what? How to throw fastballs into WRs' ankles? And not work out in the offseason?

How good someone was at the position is by no means indicative of how good they would be as a coach.Doug Pederson is the odds on favorite to be the new OC, he was a TERRIBLE NFL quarterback. And jokes aside, McNabb was an insanely intense offseason conditioning guy for most of his career, he pretty much established the tradition of going to Arizona and training (something Larry Fitz has kept going). And FWIW, that's the strength and conditioning coach's job anyway. It's not like Rex Ryan or Bill Belichick or Andy Reid or Tom Coughlin or Mike McCarthy or any number of other coaches are pillars of physical conditioning.

Oh, really? Then how come they had to burn a time-out every time he scrambled for more than 10 yards because it would take him so long to stagger back to the huddle? I've never seen a more out-of-shape player in my life that wasn't on either the offensive or defensive line. He was like the Big Bad Wolf with all that huffing and puffing.

Looking back at his rushing stats it doesnt appears as if we would have enough time outs in a game to accommodate his needs.Google "McNabb trains in arizona"--that should help.

Anyway, as Jason already explained...your status as a player is not indication of how you would be as a coach. McNabb knows the Reid offense better then anyone KC has or will have next season.

 

[BeTheMatch]

McNabb still wants to play. Get the band back together in KC.

They honestly have nothing to lose by bringing him in. He'll be able to teach Reid's system, mentor the young guy they draft or the guy they sign and he'd more then likely be on a low paying, incentive based deal.The only issue would be how things ended in Philly with McNabb

Teach them what? How to throw fastballs into WRs' ankles? And not work out in the offseason?

How good someone was at the position is by no means indicative of how good they would be as a coach.Doug Pederson is the odds on favorite to be the new OC, he was a TERRIBLE NFL quarterback. And jokes aside, McNabb was an insanely intense offseason conditioning guy for most of his career, he pretty much established the tradition of going to Arizona and training (something Larry Fitz has kept going). And FWIW, that's the strength and conditioning coach's job anyway. It's not like Rex Ryan or Bill Belichick or Andy Reid or Tom Coughlin or Mike McCarthy or any number of other coaches are pillars of physical conditioning.

Oh, really? Then how come they had to burn a time-out every time he scrambled for more than 10 yards because it would take him so long to stagger back to the huddle? I've never seen a more out-of-shape player in my life that wasn't on either the offensive or defensive line. He was like the Big Bad Wolf with all that huffing and puffing.

Looking back at his rushing stats it doesnt appears as if we would have enough time outs in a game to accommodate his needs.Google "McNabb trains in arizona"--that should help.

Anyway, as Jason already explained...your status as a player is not indication of how you would be as a coach. McNabb knows the Reid offense better then anyone KC has or will have next season.

That's where the delay-of-game penalties came in.