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Matt Waldman

Josh Gordon Everything Thread

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2 hours ago, greyhorse said:

Is this based on some credible source, or just pure speculation to keep us all in suspense?

How do you not recognize the schtick all these donkeys pull?

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2 hours ago, greyhorse said:

Is this based on some credible source, or just pure speculation to keep us all in suspense?

You know all the people around here calling themselves Sharks?  @Otisis the Hawk.  The one and only.

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32 minutes ago, Hankmoody said:

How do you not recognize the schtick all these donkeys pull?

I never got it either. I play it straight, though. I don't see the joy in trolling the SP.  

No lie. The SP wins me championships with its threads. I don't troll it and appreciate it for what it is.  

Gordon isn't coming back -- maybe ever. I think it's wrong. 

Edited by rockaction

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4 hours ago, rockaction said:

I never got it either. I play it straight, though. I don't see the joy in trolling the SP.  

No lie. The SP wins me championships with its threads. I don't troll it and appreciate it for what it is.  

Gordon isn't coming back -- maybe ever. I think it's wrong. 

I'm not familiar with this board enough to know what is or what is not a joke.

The other site has mods that would take down any of the rumors and wasted bandwidth.

Guess I was just hoping there would be actual news.

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2 minutes ago, greyhorse said:

I'm not familiar with this board enough to know what is or what is not a joke.

The other site has mods that would take down any of the rumors and wasted bandwidth.

Guess I was just hoping there would be actual news.

There was actual news with his Uninterrupted video on LeBron James's network and the news of his subsequent inpatient rehab. 

That's it. No actual NFL news yet.  Which is a shame. I wouldn't advise picking him up unless you're lodging a protest vote against the NFL.  

Edited by rockaction

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6 minutes ago, rockaction said:

There was actual news with his Uninterrupted video on LeBron James's network and the news of his subsequent inpatient rehab. 

That's it. No actual NFL news yet.  Which is a shame. I wouldn't advise picking him up unless you're lodging a protest vote against the NFL.  

Yes, of course.  Then there is the "semi" snapchat news of Gordon in Chicago and then perhaps flying to NY, leading to speculation of filing for reinstatement.  I think this actually may have happened?  But then there's the trolls who just make up crap.

There's very little to be found on Google searches... because I guess there's very little news about this guy.  Sad.

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2 hours ago, greyhorse said:

I'm not familiar with this board enough to know what is or what is not a joke.

The other site has mods that would take down any of the rumors and wasted bandwidth.

Guess I was just hoping there would be actual news.

It may be that this place just isn’t for you. The other site sounds like a great place. We can’t be all things to all people, but we try our best here to do what we do, and do it well. We don’t always hit the mark, but I like to think we get pretty close. 

O

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Trading for him in all my leagues. Likely the last few days I’ll have that chance. 

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4 hours ago, Otis said:

It may be that this place just isn’t for you. The other site sounds like a great place. We can’t be all things to all people, but we try our best here to do what we do, and do it well. We don’t always hit the mark, but I like to think we get pretty close. 

O

Did you guys re-engage? I couldn’t find anything about an LOI on Bloomberg.

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14 hours ago, greyhorse said:

Is this based on some credible source, or just pure speculation to keep us all in suspense?

Do ya really think some anonymous person on any of these sites actually would have a "source"?

c'mon now...think a little bit more

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12 hours ago, rockaction said:

Gordon isn't coming back -- maybe ever. I think it's wrong. 

You're dead wrong.

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12 hours ago, Hankmoody said:

How do you not recognize the schtick all these donkeys pull?

My take:

Otis is schtick.

Soulfly is delusional.

Everyone else realizes this isn't happening (at least not in 2017).

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Watching that documentary I was wondering if it’s possible there’s a recreational drug Gordon hasn’t tried. The 2014 rehab was “a publicity stunt”, but this time is different. Listen, guys, this is an addict making promises - how can you not be a believer?

Dropped Parker this morning to make room on the shelf for the 2017 FF Championship known as Joshua Caleb Gordon.

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3 minutes ago, davearm said:

My take:

Otis is schtick.

Soulfly is delusional.

Everyone else realizes this isn't happening (at least not in 2017).

Starting to think I am delusional as well though....can't stop looking in this stupid thread. The big contributor to that is how he lead me to a championship during his one good year and I am genuinely rooting for him. I hope he announces he is never going to play again so I don't have to sift through the garbage to find any real news in this thread.

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3 minutes ago, King of the Jungle said:

Starting to think I am delusional as well though....can't stop looking in this stupid thread. The big contributor to that is how he lead me to a championship during his one good year and I am genuinely rooting for him. I hope he announces he is never going to play again so I don't have to sift through the garbage to find any real news in this thread.

When (or if) Gordon applies for reinstatement, Goodell will sit on it for months, possibly years -- upthread I mentioned that another guy has been waiting for three *years*.

2018 is the best case scenario.

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5 hours ago, Otis said:

Trading for him in all my leagues. Likely the last few days I’ll have that chance. 

Nothing wrong with that if all of Otis's leagues are Dynasty.  Nothing wrong with that at all...

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7 hours ago, Otis said:

It may be that this place just isn’t for you. The other site sounds like a great place. We can’t be all things to all people, but we try our best here to do what we do, and do it well. We don’t always hit the mark, but I like to think we get pretty close. 

O

You know that feeling when you walk into a new job and the senior partner gives you a big hug and takes you out to lunch?  Yeah, I didn't think so.

I really don't know what you are trying to say.  You ("We") try your best to provide misinformation to confuse others?  I realize this is the Josh Gordon thread, and 90% of the posts in this thread are baseless and conjecture, but some times any ray of positive news can be interpreted with hope and anticipation.  

2 hours ago, davearm said:

My take:

Otis is schtick.

Soulfly is delusional.

Everyone else realizes this isn't happening (at least not in 2017).

Yes, I've learned that.  Permanent ignore.

Back to some actual discussion.  This article about the video says he did indeed violate the substance abuse policy again which forced him back into rehab this past summer. When did he violate the policy?  Was it actually proven by drug tests?  Never heard of him testing positive, would that have been released to the public? Applied for reinstatement in March.  Denied in May.  And then went back to rehab this last time.

If we have to wait for Goodell to reinstate him (which could take 2 months), then find a team, and then a 4 game suspension?  Yeah, not looking good for any fantasy contribution this year.

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On 10/14/2017 at 9:31 AM, greyhorse said:

If we have to wait for Goodell to reinstate him (which could take 2 months), then find a team, and then a 4 game suspension?  Yeah, not looking good for any fantasy contribution this year.

You could have saved some typing and just quoted me estimating this timeline like 5 pages back. ;) 

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On 10/14/2017 at 0:31 PM, greyhorse said:

You know that feeling when you walk into a new job and the senior partner gives you a big hug and takes you out to lunch?  Yeah, I didn't think so.

I really don't know what you are trying to say.  You ("We") try your best to provide misinformation to confuse others?  I realize this is the Josh Gordon thread, and 90% of the posts in this thread are baseless and conjecture, but some times any ray of positive news can be interpreted with hope and anticipation.  

Yes, I've learned that.  Permanent ignore.

Back to some actual discussion.  This article about the video says he did indeed violate the substance abuse policy again which forced him back into rehab this past summer. When did he violate the policy?  Was it actually proven by drug tests?  Never heard of him testing positive, would that have been released to the public? Applied for reinstatement in March.  Denied in May.  And then went back to rehab this last time.

If we have to wait for Goodell to reinstate him (which could take 2 months), then find a team, and then a 4 game suspension?  Yeah, not looking good for any fantasy contribution this year.

Fantasy Business is, after all, Serious Business. (tm) 

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1 hour ago, Otis said:

Fantasy Business is, after all, Serious Business. (tm) 

 Oats, c'mon man. Back off. You're a good dude. I love ya. But no need to mess with the SP.   

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13 hours ago, Warhogs said:

It's been a slow week for Gordon news....

Goodell is to busy trying to stop Zeke Elliott from playing. He doesn't have the 60 seconds it takes to review and reinstate Gordon.

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1 hour ago, gbill2004 said:

Can I drop him in my re-draft league?

Yes.

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19 minutes ago, King of the Jungle said:

Hospice just arrived to take care of this thread for the little time it has left.

So you're saying it's time for some medicinal marijuana for the thread?

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On 10/19/2017 at 4:45 PM, JamieMurphy said:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/josh-gordon-is-on-the-clock/

Interesting quick read on JG timeline for this year if he is to accrue a season towards his rookie contract and the pending four game suspension he may still serve

Is Gordon being paid through all this?

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2 hours ago, Sup_Yo said:

Yes.

No.

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1 hour ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Is Gordon being paid through all this?

No, what that article is doing is discussing his contract structure.  He's got a shot to be a Restricted Free Agent after this year, but only if he gets back soon enough.

There are 3 stages of Free Agency, defined by how many "accrued seasons" the player has played.

ERFA - exclusive rights free agent - fewer than 3 accrued seasons.  Player may not negotiate with other teams and basically takes whatever the team offers.
RFA - restricted free agent - 3 accrued seasons.  Player may negotiate with other teams but original team maintains right of first refusal to match all terms.  If original team does not match the offer they may be subject to draft pick compensation from the new team.  The threat of this compensation can put a real damper on the offers the player may get
UFA - unrestricted free agent - 4 or more accrued seasons.  Player is full free to negotiate and sign with any team with no compensation to the original team (aside from Franchise Tag system).

An accrued season is one in which the player has been on full pay status for at least 6 games.  Gordon accomplished this in 2012 and 2013, but in 2014 he was suspended for the first 10 games for drug policy violations and then after playing 5 games the team suspended him for week 17 for behavior - missed meeting, missed flight, I forget what.  So 2014 was a lost chance at an accrued season even though the contract year was completed.   In each of 2015 and 2016 he was suspended for the entire year so his "last year" tolled - was pushed back - and 2017 should be his "last year" of his contract.  If he doesn't get reinstated, the contract will toll yet again:

2012 - accrued season
2013 - accrued season
2014 - non-accrued season
2015 - suspended, no season (contract tolls)
2016 - suspended, no season (contract tolls)
2017 - suspended, no season (contract tolls)
2018 - "final" contract season

If he doesn't play in 2017, his contract will toll again, and 2018 will be his "last year" of his contract.  Even if he does play in 2017 though, if he is not full pay status for at least 6 games, he won't get an accrued year out of it.  So even if his contract does complete, he'll be just an ERFA and have zero contract leverage so he'll get screwed. 

2012 - accrued season
2013 - accrued season
2014 - non-accrued season
2017 - non-accrued season
2018 - ERFA

If he can reinstated in time, he can at least get enough games in on full pay status to accrue the year and push himself to RFA status.  At least in that case there will be some heat on the team

2012 - accrued season
2013 - accrued season
2014 - non-accrued season
2017 - accrued season
2018 - RFA

Cleveland (or whoever has his rights) would have to offer him a 1 year guaranteed deal for about $2M to retain matching/compensation rights and he would also be able to go negotiate with teams to try to get a better offer,  If he's an ERFA they can offer him veteran minimum of about $600K and he can't do squat about it.

Note: full pay status is pretty much anything that he's getting paid for.  IR, PUP, inactive on game day, playing - whatever.   NFI is the only one I'm not sure about, because the team is not required to pay players on NFI status (although they usually do for the sake of a positive relationship).  Practice squad is the most common non-full pay status.

Very rarely there will be "partial pay" status when a guy is on IR or something, but that's something that would have to be negotiated into the contract and Gordon's rookie deal has no such provision - no rookie deal can, according to the CBA.  It's generally done with veterans with injury history that the team is willing to take a small risk on - "OK Harvin, we'll sign you, but if you go on IR we're only paying you 1/2 salary for those games".

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Quote

 

Gordon must play in six games this season to accrue a season towards his contract. The 26 year old is currently playing out a four year deal worth $5,341,648 that he signed as a rookie in 2012. He is scheduled to be a restricted free agent after the conclusion of the current season. However, if he does not return and play in six games this season, then he would not become a restricted free agent until after next season - if he plays in six games.

...Last time the Baylor product was reinstated, he was suspended an additional four games. If history repeats itself, even if he were reinstated today, he would basically be unavailable until Week 11 which means he would not get credit for the current season.

 

Thanks for the explainer, Hank.

I guess what I'm just wondering is what is the cost to the Browns? I'm not good at the salary stuff and I'm not sure I understand why they continue to hold him, especially if they are paying him. The Browns seem to have zero interest in restoring him to their locker room. Are they paying him now? Since he is likely missing the accrual goal, which means he will stay with the Browns if they do not cut him, will they pay him next year for his suspended games?

Edited by SaintsInDome2006

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48 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Thanks for the explainer, Hank.

I guess what I'm just wondering is what is the cost to the Browns? I'm not good at the salary stuff and I'm not sure I understand why they continue to hold him, especially if they are paying him. The Browns seem to have zero interest in restoring him to their locker room. Are they paying him now? Since he is likely missing the accrual goal, which means he will stay with the Browns if they do not cut him, will they pay him next year for his suspended games?

I would not expect any player to be paid during either team- or league-mandated suspensions. I assume the last time the Browns paid him was for the 5 games he played in 2014.

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13 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Thanks for the explainer, Hank.

I guess what I'm just wondering is what is the cost to the Browns? I'm not good at the salary stuff and I'm not sure I understand why they continue to hold him, especially if they are paying him. The Browns seem to have zero interest in restoring him to their locker room. Are they paying him now? Since he is likely missing the accrual goal, which means he will stay with the Browns if they do not cut him, will they pay him next year for his suspended games?

He's not paid while he's suspended - none ever are.  All players are paid per-game, they get a check for 1/16th of their annual salary on every game day.  Gordon's 2017 salary is $1,068,406,so if he does play, he'll earn $66,775.38 for each game.  If he's not reinstated that salary tolls to 2018.  If he's reinstated for even one game the 2017 season is in the books and he'd be ERFA or RFA next year, depending.

They continue to hold him because it costs them nothing to.  You don't make a decision until you have to.  Once he's reinstated they can make that decision.  Maybe someone will trade for him at that point.  Maybe they cut him.  Maybe it never happens and they don't have to look like the bad guy, or the one making the mistake, or any other negative that could come up.

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So reading into this, it's actually in the Brown's best interest in a sense to only have him play five games a season if he isn't going to play a complete season?

That makes the suspension of the last game in 2014 pretty significant.

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On 10/19/2017 at 8:40 AM, Tommy Collins said:

I like the kid, but what is there left to debate/discuss that you guys haven't already beaten to death by now? This thread won't leave the front page, which makes me (and probably others) keep thinking there is legitimate news in here.

 

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1 hour ago, JamieMurphy said:

So reading into this, it's actually in the Brown's best interest in a sense to only have him play five games a season if he isn't going to play a complete season?

That makes the suspension of the last game in 2014 pretty significant.

If he ever gets reinstated, it will be extremely significant.

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I think if he's suspended, his contract tolls. If he's reinstated, but for fewer than 6 games, his contract doesn't toll. It might be in his best interest to wait until the season is over to apply for reinstatement.

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1 minute ago, Soulfly3 said:

Someone is in NYC right now.... 

Heads up, kids. 

Cool. Are you there to see a show, business, other?

Have fun.

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Here we go again....

Adam Schefter‏Verified account @AdamSchefter  2m2 minutes ago

More

Browns WR Josh Gordon spotted in NYC today and league source confirmed he will meet with NFL on Tues. Browns could look to trade his rights.

 

Adam Schefter‏Verified account @AdamSchefter  1m1 minute ago

More

With Josh Gordon’s possible reinstatement near, it’s possible Browns could look to trade his right’s by today’s 4 pm deadline, per source.

Edited by kneeshooter

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11 minutes ago, kneeshooter said:

Here we go again....

Adam Schefter‏Verified account @AdamSchefter  2m2 minutes ago

More

Browns WR Josh Gordon spotted in NYC today and league source confirmed he will meet with NFL on Tues. Browns could look to trade his rights.

 

Adam Schefter‏Verified account @AdamSchefter  1m1 minute ago

More

With Josh Gordon’s possible reinstatement near, it’s possible Browns could look to trade his right’s by today’s 4 pm deadline, per source.

:popcorn:

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