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The Trent Richardson Thread (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter False Start
- Start date
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
I'm am a huge Trent backer but he's looked awful this year.
Almost ready to admit the mistake and move on from him.
Makes no sense, he was explosive in college and is a plodding oaf now
Almost ready to admit the mistake and move on from him.
Makes no sense, he was explosive in college and is a plodding oaf now
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
Now I know why Cleveland gave up on him so easily. He makes everything look soo difficult. He makes a one yard run look like he's navigating his way through a mine field.
just_want_2_win
Footballguy
I heard Irsay say, "But I tried to take him back to Walmart and they said they would never sell anything of such poor quality."
All kidding aside, with Richardson putting up klunker after klunker, is it time to start considering cutting him for guys that might be on the wire, like Ivory? How much opportunity cost are we talking about holding him, waiting for a turnaround that may never come?
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
EBF
Footballguy
Had the opportunity last week to trade him for Jordan Cameron in 1.5 PPR TE dynasty and did not take it. That could wind up being a massive blunder, but I went back and did my homework on him again before I made any kind of decision. Looked at several of his college games. Read a bunch of scouting reports. Ultimately just got the feeling that if I shipped him out now, it would come back to haunt me. Maybe not this year, but eventually I would regret it.
For redraft purposes, he's an unmitigated disaster. Just isn't getting enough carries and they're not throwing him any passes, which was key to his value last season in Cleveland. For dynasty purposes, I'm going down with the ship. Just can't buy the idea that 100% healthy Trent Richardson won't be a very good NFL starter. Too much talent for it to play out like that. The guy on the other team (Knowshon) has a fraction of the ability, lived through some much darker days, and lived to tell the tale. I think what we're witnessing right now is basically rock bottom.
Long term, they need to beef up that OL. Apart from maybe getting one more great WR for Luck, that has to be their top offensive priority in the draft.
For redraft purposes, he's an unmitigated disaster. Just isn't getting enough carries and they're not throwing him any passes, which was key to his value last season in Cleveland. For dynasty purposes, I'm going down with the ship. Just can't buy the idea that 100% healthy Trent Richardson won't be a very good NFL starter. Too much talent for it to play out like that. The guy on the other team (Knowshon) has a fraction of the ability, lived through some much darker days, and lived to tell the tale. I think what we're witnessing right now is basically rock bottom.
Long term, they need to beef up that OL. Apart from maybe getting one more great WR for Luck, that has to be their top offensive priority in the draft.
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MoveToSkypager
Footballguy
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Dizzy
Footballguy
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
I'm surprised irsay hasn't already posted in this thread about how he jacked some guy up in a trade
EBF
Footballguy
You never know. I think it's totally fair to say that his NFL career to date has been a big disappointment, but I actually don't agree with that line of reasoning. Production hinges on many factors and I think a mistake that FF owners make every year is drawing premature long-term conclusions based on short-term results. Regardless of whether Trent ultimately succeeds or fails, one thing I know for certain is that FF players (and people in general) are extremely fickle and jittery. The result is that you have a pattern of players like Thomas Jones, Cedric Benson, Marshawn Lynch, Knowshon Moreno, Reggie Bush, and Ryan Mathews who are treated like absolute dog meat by FF owners after they endure a rough patch, but who ultimately bounce back to reward patience.
Is Trent's college career irrelevant now? No, actually. Assuming that he's 100% healthy, he's still the same guy that he was at Alabama. All of the qualities that made him a unanimous elite prospect are still there. It might be the case that those qualities don't translate to the NFL and that he'll ultimately go down as a huge bust. That's one possibility. The other possibility is that he's a legitimate talent whose true ability has been obscured by a variety of muddy situational factors.
I have been around these boards for a LONG time now. Trust me, I remember what the mood was like about Benson, Jones, Lynch, Moreno, and Bush at times. Total negativity. Total backlash. When a player who comes into the league with certain fanfare and is hyped up to deliver huge numbers in redraft hits a brick wall, people go off the deep end with the massive negativity and hyperbole. What I'm trying to say is that, putting Trent aside, it is really not unprecedented (or even uncommon) to see this sort of thing happen. I try to stay away from the knee jerk lynch mob mentality stuff to make my own assessments. Maybe I've gotten this one wrong, but I can guarantee you that whether it's Trent, Ingram, JStew, Wilson, or some other current whipping boy, we haven't seen the last resurrection story from a guy that the FF community buried prematurely.
I'm just trying to provide an alternative viewpoint in what's sure to be an avalanche of negativity over the next week and possibly the entire season.
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just_want_2_win
Footballguy
EBF
Footballguy
No doubt about that. I have him in my redraft league and he's poison. I'm just praying they start throwing him the ball.
As terrible as he's looked, I think Indy have used him pretty 'poorly' in regards to trying to get a lot of production out of him. They don't give him a chance to get into any rhythm whatsoever. They're a passing team, so obviously form their perspective it makes sense, but from a fantasy POV, you can't expect much until they show they're committed to actually using him. Part of that, of course, is him demanding to be used.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
He's no Lacy
FUBAR
Footballguy
Agreed.
I only watched on and off yesterday, but when I saw Trent carry the ball he didn't seem to be in the same page as the line. He's been in Indy for over a month now, but he seems to still be learning their blocking scheme.
Redraft I'm cutting bait. Buying in dynasty if his owners are selling low. I have him in one dynasty, almost traded him for a wrong 10-15 overall range but thinking I would regret that.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
If it softens the blow any, he's going into his bye week. Dump him now and rationalize that you need the roster spot. I don't believe he'll be able to overtake Brown for significant carries or be in on important late game drives anymore. Does not have the coaches trust. After that fumble, he had the same lost look on his face as David WIlson earlier this year in his first game against the Cowboys.
Time to write off losses and move on.
Time to write off losses and move on.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
If your waivers are so tight, throwing him into the pool will at least stir the pot. Maybe someone drops to the wire that shouldn't be there if not for your charitable donation.
habsfan
Footballguy
A few may be starting but many more holding on their benches. At this point in the season I think he is essentially "out of runway" to take off and actually help most teams. I need the roster spot (as I assume many others do as well).
need2know
Footballguy
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
I'm baffled watching RB Trent Richardson. I'm trying to fiugure out exactly what the issue or issues are.J Perusse said:
Obviously he was selected high in the draft based on many scouting reports.
The Colts obviously thought high of him to the degree that they surrendered a first round draft pick to acquire him.
He had to pass a medical examination before any trade was executed so even if he had some issues they were not deal killing type injuries.
The Browns have kept the company line that he simply did not fit, whatever that means, but its possible they knew or know something.
I'm honestly baffled as to why this guy isn't producing and can't put my finger on any one-thing.
Before the draft I did not see the break-away speed or explosion but saw short-area explosion and change of direction and he's still one of the highest rated players in the league for missed tackles so he is making guys miss with that short-area explosiion and change of direction but he's got some big piece missing in his game.
jurb26
Footballguy
At this point you have to count you're losses with Richardson. At least in redraft. He's been consistently out played by Brown. Maybe des still got a future in dynasty if the team builds the offense up or he just gets it. I still think he's got the talent to succeed in the NFL. Just not right now.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I still want to beleive in Richardson - but are you trying to claim those guys didn't show any speed or explosion when they ran? Turner in his later years did not, but early on he had speed - and Lewis and Williams had more than enough speed and showed tremdendous burst through the holes and to the outside.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
At this point all his runs look like he needs 3 linemen to push him forward, like a rugby match. That or he jump cuts right into an arm tackle. Looks like molassas compared to Brown.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
voiceofunreason
Footballguy
On one hand you say you try and follow the odds. But I see a huge flaw in that you never change your mind on players and you cherry pick your stats badly. You'll look for any facts at all to support whatever preconceived idea you have (cough Mendenhall, Mathews). But the fact is, It doesn't matter what he looked like running through huge holes at Bama, what the scouts said or where he was picked. What matters is how he has played against real competition in the NFL. The rest is all irrelevant.
I do agree that things can only get better (not saying much). But quoting the guys in bold, they are bad comparisons. Bush and Lynch flashed a lot of talent in their first 2 years, they just had a lot of injuries and people turned on them. Richardson has shown nothing. He's a rumbling guy that can run people over if he's got a big hole to run through and can gain some steam. That's it. Sure he'll be better but it's starting to look realistic that his ceiling is a mid to high RB2. Benson and Jones are the only real comparisons, they showed no talent at all early. Benson was a plodder who barely cracked 4 ypc and was a below average player. So that leaves Jones, one guy.
You say play the odds but you cherry pick a handful of guys out of hundreds of guys who looked like busts after their first 2 years in the NFL. Jones looks like the only real comparison that was successful (all others showed a lot more ability than Richardson, even Mathews). You talk about odds with Stacy but the odds don't apply here for some reason.
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Still don't know how you pick Richardson over Cameron in a dynasty 1.5 ppr for tight ends league at this point, unless you really think Cameron is a fluke. He's on pace for nearly 400 points in my 1.5 ppr league. Richardson doesn't have near the big play ability to even sniff those kind of point totals even if he does get his shat together.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
I actually think that he's a throwback power runner that's just not a good fit in today's NFL. You can see the potential when the hole opens up where it's supposed to and he can hit it with a head of steam -- the guy is a bull and can rip through tackles to pick up big chunks of yardage.
His limitations come out when he needs to move laterally or look for a cutback seam -- it's hard to tell if it's a vision issue or if he just lacks the initial burst to get moving forward again. IMO it's probably both, but whatever it is, it's been pretty clear IMO since he came into the league, and I'm not at all sure it's correctable.
At Alabama, his offensive line was so dominant that he could just hit the "x" hole hard and look great. In a straight forward power run system behind a dominant line (say 90s Dallas) I think he'd be fine. But finding that fit in today's NFL is going to be a problem. The athletes and schemes on the defensive side are too good for a steady diet of hat-on-hat power to be successful, for the most part. It's certainly not going to happen in Indy any time soon.
His limitations come out when he needs to move laterally or look for a cutback seam -- it's hard to tell if it's a vision issue or if he just lacks the initial burst to get moving forward again. IMO it's probably both, but whatever it is, it's been pretty clear IMO since he came into the league, and I'm not at all sure it's correctable.
At Alabama, his offensive line was so dominant that he could just hit the "x" hole hard and look great. In a straight forward power run system behind a dominant line (say 90s Dallas) I think he'd be fine. But finding that fit in today's NFL is going to be a problem. The athletes and schemes on the defensive side are too good for a steady diet of hat-on-hat power to be successful, for the most part. It's certainly not going to happen in Indy any time soon.
3nOut
Footballguy
I'm still holding on to the belief that Richardson will be a solid FF RB1, just not this year. The playcalling for TRich has been terrible. I'd like to see ONE screen to him, or ONE draw like Bradshaw and Brown have gotten. On the standard plays that were given to Brown, Brown hasn't fared any better, actually worse, than TRich. It seeed like the Denver linemen were constatntly pushing the OLine back and meeting Richardson in the backfield. He had nowhere to run. There were a couple of plays where TRich changed directions but had two guys already draped on him.
Then in the red zone, the Colts were first and goal and had to settle for a FG because they ran Brown then passed twice if i recall correctly. Later, they scored on a tick play with DHB. I don't think TRich was used once in the red zone which is confusing. Until the playcalling is changed, TRich won't produce and can't be fairly evaluated. In a keeper, he's a hold going into next season. Sadly, in the meantime, he's benchable.
Then in the red zone, the Colts were first and goal and had to settle for a FG because they ran Brown then passed twice if i recall correctly. Later, they scored on a tick play with DHB. I don't think TRich was used once in the red zone which is confusing. Until the playcalling is changed, TRich won't produce and can't be fairly evaluated. In a keeper, he's a hold going into next season. Sadly, in the meantime, he's benchable.
I tend to agree with the above. He gets 10 carries a game and half of them are in brutally obvious running situations. Minus the draws and such brown doesn't look any better. Trich looked good on some carries last night and then was getting stuffed behind the line. I have trouble believing anyone would have done better with those 10 carries. Fumble was bad though...
ebsteelers
Footballguy
i drafted this clown 3rd? ahh geez
would rather a stick of gum and movie tickets then this joker starting another week for me.
cant wait for him to put up a stat line of 20 carries for 40 yards next time they play jaguars..
hypetrainderailed
would rather a stick of gum and movie tickets then this joker starting another week for me.
cant wait for him to put up a stat line of 20 carries for 40 yards next time they play jaguars..
hypetrainderailed
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
Using a downhill power RB like Richardson on draw plays? That's where you guys are at? Not a whole lot of straws left to grasp at, I suppose.
Touchdown There
Footballguy
Agree with this. The guy can't seem to play off of his blockers and find a lane.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
After the Packers/Browns game where the Browns faced former Alabama RB Eddie Lacy a reporter asked Cleveland defenders to compare Lacy with their former teammate RB Trent Richardson.
Here are a few of those commments that primarily point out that Eddie Lacy has good VISION and HITS THE HOLE HARD. Also that Eddie Lacy is a SMART FOOTBALL PLAYER.
When comparing two players and teammates consistently point out those positive attributes to one player and not the other it suggest that T-Rich lacks, VISION, ability to HIT THE HOLE hard, and FOOTBALL SMARTS.
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/browns-saw-alabama-rbs-richardson-lacy-close-up-b99124132z1-228570381.html
,,, Browns saw Alabama RBs Richardson, Lacy close-up
Green Bay — Nobody is better equipped to compare former University of Alabama running backs Eddie Lacy and Trent Richardson better than the Cleveland Browns.
Lacy, the 61st pick in the 2013 draft, rushed 22 times for 82 yards against them Sunday in their 31-13 loss to the Green Bay Packers at Lambeau Field.
The Browns used the third choice of the 2012 draft to select Richardson, a player they traded to Indianapolis a month ago for a first-round draft choice.
Of the six players and one front-office man asked to compare the two backs, only outside linebacker Jabaal Sheard offered a strong opinion on who's better.
,,, "Similar running style, but Lacy is more hit-the-hole downhill," nose tackle Phil Taylor said. "Trent is a shiftier back. Trent is power, too, but he can make those cuts.
... "There's some similarity in that they're both very powerful guys that are a little bit bigger," Browns chief executive Joe Banner said. "I don't really know Lacy that well. Trent is very good in the passing game. I don't know if Lacy is or not.
"Richardson has better burst than he's shown so far."
Banner and GM Michael Lombardi weren't in Cleveland when the Browns drafted Richardson.
If the two players were being drafted now, would they be of comparable value?
"I'm not going there," said Banner. "I don't want it to sound like I'm dumping on anybody."
... (Browns SS TJ Ward) "Lacy reads the hole very well. You can see it a little bit on film, but he finds and picks his seams. I just think Lacy's a smart running back."
(Browns OT Joe Thomas) Thomas found himself taking the time to watch Lacy from the sidelines.
"I'm really impressed with him," said Thomas. "He's got really good vision. He's not a guy with super elite speed, but the way they use him on third down is just a perfect fit for him.
"He can hit a hole hard and he's very difficult to tackle. And, if he gets 2 yards (past) the line, he's going to fall forward for 4 yards.
"You give it to him on first down, you know he's going to get a positive gain. He's going to put you in second and 6, which gives you your whole
Here are a few of those commments that primarily point out that Eddie Lacy has good VISION and HITS THE HOLE HARD. Also that Eddie Lacy is a SMART FOOTBALL PLAYER.
When comparing two players and teammates consistently point out those positive attributes to one player and not the other it suggest that T-Rich lacks, VISION, ability to HIT THE HOLE hard, and FOOTBALL SMARTS.
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/browns-saw-alabama-rbs-richardson-lacy-close-up-b99124132z1-228570381.html
,,, Browns saw Alabama RBs Richardson, Lacy close-up
Green Bay — Nobody is better equipped to compare former University of Alabama running backs Eddie Lacy and Trent Richardson better than the Cleveland Browns.
Lacy, the 61st pick in the 2013 draft, rushed 22 times for 82 yards against them Sunday in their 31-13 loss to the Green Bay Packers at Lambeau Field.
The Browns used the third choice of the 2012 draft to select Richardson, a player they traded to Indianapolis a month ago for a first-round draft choice.
Of the six players and one front-office man asked to compare the two backs, only outside linebacker Jabaal Sheard offered a strong opinion on who's better.
,,, "Similar running style, but Lacy is more hit-the-hole downhill," nose tackle Phil Taylor said. "Trent is a shiftier back. Trent is power, too, but he can make those cuts.
... "There's some similarity in that they're both very powerful guys that are a little bit bigger," Browns chief executive Joe Banner said. "I don't really know Lacy that well. Trent is very good in the passing game. I don't know if Lacy is or not.
"Richardson has better burst than he's shown so far."
Banner and GM Michael Lombardi weren't in Cleveland when the Browns drafted Richardson.
If the two players were being drafted now, would they be of comparable value?
"I'm not going there," said Banner. "I don't want it to sound like I'm dumping on anybody."
... (Browns SS TJ Ward) "Lacy reads the hole very well. You can see it a little bit on film, but he finds and picks his seams. I just think Lacy's a smart running back."
(Browns OT Joe Thomas) Thomas found himself taking the time to watch Lacy from the sidelines.
"I'm really impressed with him," said Thomas. "He's got really good vision. He's not a guy with super elite speed, but the way they use him on third down is just a perfect fit for him.
"He can hit a hole hard and he's very difficult to tackle. And, if he gets 2 yards (past) the line, he's going to fall forward for 4 yards.
"You give it to him on first down, you know he's going to get a positive gain. He's going to put you in second and 6, which gives you your whole
