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Minnesota Vikings Team Thread (7 Viewers)

Zimmer Explains Challenge of Defending Against Wilson, Improving the Team's Pass Defense Post-Bye, More

Zimmer isn't specific about what they are changing with the coverage and the defense, but he says they have been focused on that the last two days and what do they need to do to improve there for the rest of the season.

Arif Hasan brought up an idea interesting to me on his most recent podcast talking about how across the league cover 3 is the most common defense and that the Vikings have been using this coverage a lot as well. He suggests that they shift to a cover two with man coverage underneath as a way that the Vikings could tighten up their coverage that we haven't seen the Vikings use very much.

Whatever it is they need to get better, I hope they do.

 
Seattle’s defense vs. Vikings’ offense will have old school flavor

I have heard talk this week about the Vikings perhaps being able to get an advantage by using more 3 WR sets and that idea is supported by the data in the article which shows Seattle as being more vulnerable to 3 WR sets because of how frequently they play 3 LB.

5 Vikings Questionable for ‘MNF’ Game | Final Vikings-Seahawks Injury Report

Dalvin Cook had two full practices so he should be good to go. Harrison Smith and Anthony Harris are questionable as is Linval Joseph and Shamar Stephen. I have been impressed with how Jaleel Johnson has played with Joseph out but it would be great to have him back, I don't think Stephen is very good and I wish someone else could take his job anyways.

What do you guys think about the personnel match ups and the idea of the Vikings spreading them out with 3 and 4 WR looks?

 
Biabreakable said:
Seattle’s defense vs. Vikings’ offense will have old school flavor

I have heard talk this week about the Vikings perhaps being able to get an advantage by using more 3 WR sets and that idea is supported by the data in the article which shows Seattle as being more vulnerable to 3 WR sets because of how frequently they play 3 LB.

5 Vikings Questionable for ‘MNF’ Game | Final Vikings-Seahawks Injury Report

Dalvin Cook had two full practices so he should be good to go. Harrison Smith and Anthony Harris are questionable as is Linval Joseph and Shamar Stephen. I have been impressed with how Jaleel Johnson has played with Joseph out but it would be great to have him back, I don't think Stephen is very good and I wish someone else could take his job anyways.

What do you guys think about the personnel match ups and the idea of the Vikings spreading them out with 3 and 4 WR looks?
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Do the Vikes even have 3 or 4 WR's that would worry the Seahawks?  Irv Smith is probably or WR2 with Thielen out.  Diggs, Smith, Rudolph, Bisi, Treadwell?  I don't think we have the personnel to pull it off.

 
Gally said:
Do the Vikes even have 3 or 4 WR's that would worry the Seahawks?  Irv Smith is probably or WR2 with Thielen out.  Diggs, Smith, Rudolph, Bisi, Treadwell?  I don't think we have the personnel to pull it off.
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They would need Theilen as one of those 3 to do it obviously. At the time it seemed that he would play.

Bisi had one reception in the game where I thought he could have got yards after the catch but he ran into the defense instead of using his block to the outside.

 
Rhodes.. stop blaming everyone else and look in the mirror.. unnecessary penalty, getting burned game after game .. time to move him to safety and get a CB who can cover like he use to.. down 10 going into the 4th, but feels like down by 20 :(

 
agree with Zimmer that 8-4 and the upcoming schedule means it "isn't the end of the road" ....but....

They now need to win out and hope that one of the bad teams that the Packers play, (Redskins, Bears or Lions) beat them.. And with 2 of those 3 at home it does not look good.

6th seed if they win out and Green bay doesn't lose one of the other games, and if the playoffs started today they'd be playing at Green Bay on Wildcard weekend.. :mellow:  

 
snogger said:
agree with Zimmer that 8-4 and the upcoming schedule means it "isn't the end of the road" ....but....

They now need to win out and hope that one of the bad teams that the Packers play, (Redskins, Bears or Lions) beat them.. And with 2 of those 3 at home it does not look good.

6th seed if they win out and Green bay doesn't lose one of the other games, and if the playoffs started today they'd be playing at Green Bay on Wildcard weekend.. :mellow:  
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6th seeded Vikings so much better than the 4th seeded Cowboys.  (If things remain the same)

 
I was shocked the Vikes were able to make a game of it with Thielen out, and with Cook/Reiff going down during the game.  There were a couple plays that bothered me

* the Rhodes late hit was just inexplicable and a key to a Seahawks TD drive

* Irv Smith trying out a Diggs move on a ball Cousins perfectly led him toward a certain 1st down, where he stopped, paused, and turned himself into a trailing tackler. It was near midfield with a 7-7 score, and the Vikes ended up punting when they failed on 3rd/2.

There's not much point in fixating on plays here/there though when an opponent is able to make 6-8 yards on 1st down runs, and complete passes at will against a confused secondary. Seahawks use of an additional tackle (at exclusion of a receiving TE target) was something we did not have the bodies to defend on runs, and did not seem to aid our pass defense vs. fewer receivers, who successfully ran quick slants. It just looked like there was no effort to adapt.

I'm a big Zimmer guy but whatever he's tried to install into our 2019 secondary is a massive failure. There is just no way the Vikes can logically go from a ball hawking top 5 defense to a defense that can't stop anybody at anything, including giving career days to journeymen backups vs. Chicago, KC, Denver. The only explanation is guys are too confused about assignments to do their jobs as they've always done them.

 
snogger said:
agree with Zimmer that 8-4 and the upcoming schedule means it "isn't the end of the road" ....but....

They now need to win out and hope that one of the bad teams that the Packers play, (Redskins, Bears or Lions) beat them.. And with 2 of those 3 at home it does not look good.

6th seed if they win out and Green bay doesn't lose one of the other games, and if the playoffs started today they'd be playing at Green Bay on Wildcard weekend.. :mellow:  
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If the Redskins beat them it would result in a tie for the division but the Vikes lose the tie break.   They actually need the Bears or Lions to be that second loss.  If not then the Packers still hold the tie break with division record (would only have one loss to the Vikes two). 

ETA:  I think I miscounted the records.  If the Vikes win out and the Packers lose 2 (including the Vikings game) there will not be a tie so any loss works.  You were correct.

 
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I thought the game was over after the pick.  I was pleasantly surprised that they had a chance to win with just over two minutes to go.  I thought the play calling on that drive (down 4 - before turning it over on downs) was terrible.  They got the nice chunk play out of the gate to Rudolph but then never went down the field again.  Everything was short passes to guys that were stopped and then had to make a move.  No quick slants or moving pockets to get Cousins outside (he seems to throw better from there). 

Bottom line is that if they give up 4-6 yds on first down dive plays all game they aren't going to beat anybody.  Also, Rhodes can't cover anybody.  Every throw is completed it's just a matter of for how many yards.  He did make a good recovery to force the fumble on Metcalf but on third and 6 to be 10 yds off him at the time of the catch is unacceptable.   Defense has to play better for the Vikes to have any chance to make some noise. 

 
snogger said:
agree with Zimmer that 8-4 and the upcoming schedule means it "isn't the end of the road" ....but....

They now need to win out and hope that one of the bad teams that the Packers play, (Redskins, Bears or Lions) beat them.. And with 2 of those 3 at home it does not look good.

6th seed if they win out and Green bay doesn't lose one of the other games, and if the playoffs started today they'd be playing at Green Bay on Wildcard weekend.. :mellow:  
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I would be more than happy to go to GB in the first round. IMO, they are very beatable. 

 
It’s hard to see them going anywhere with this defense. Kendricks, Hunter, Griffin and good safety play have kept them afloat, but it’s not enough. Rhodes is DONE and Barr hasn’t done much either. The CB position is a mess. Rhodes has zero trade value. I’m thinking they either need to restructure his contract or cut him and use the savings to try to resign Waynes. I’m not a big fan of Waynes, but he’s at least a serviceable starter. Hughes and Hill both seem quality players. Give one or both of them more playing time for the remainder of the season so that we can better determine what we have in them. Playing Rhodes is not accomplishing anything. Let’s give someone else a shot

 
Although this loss hurt for me it was somewhat expected. I am actually happy with the offense making a game of it. The defense was too bad for them to win the game.

As Russell Wilson said after the game, the Vikings were mostly playing cover two and because of that they chose to run the ball. The safeties are not coming up and helping against the run when they are playing deep coverage.

The reason the Vikings are playing so much cover two is because Rhodes cannot be trusted to hang with his assignment one on one anymore. He needs help, on every play now. It is hurting the entire defense.

I'm not saying that Hughes or Alexander or Hill are better than Rhodes right now, but given how poorly he has played it would be hard for them to be worse.

The other problem is that the Vikings are not getting any pressure from their defensive tackles. In this game vs the Seahawks they did a really poor job against the run as well. Linval Joseph is not playing as well as he used to and he shouldn't be in there in passing situations anyways (although he may be better than their other options).

No pass rush up the middle, QBs can just step up in the pocket and throw the ball.

I think they need to bench Rhodes. It is la delicate  situation in the locker room for the coaches to make the change, but if they want to win some more games I think they have to make a change.

The reality is the likely don't have the personnel to make the changes they need to make to improve on defense. I have more hope of the corners perhaps leading to an improvement, I don't see the inside pass rush being resolved with the players they have right now. Best option is still likely Griffen if they would play him inside more and let the back up ends play his spot when he does.

I have listened to some talk of Kirk Cousins contract being somehow partially at fault for the Vikings not being able to pay their defensive players. Looking at sportrac Cousins represents 155% of the Vikings total cap in 2019.

Xavier Rhodes represents 7% of the Vikings salary cap, he is their 3rd highest paid player and he isn't just not playing up to his contract, he isn't playing well enough to start.

Linval Joseph represents 5.5% of the Vikings salary cap, he is their 7th highest paid player, this is too much for a NT who only plays on run downs. He isn't playing as well as he was when he got the contract extension.

The point is that it isn't just Kirk Cousins contract preventing them from getting better. Two of their top 10 highest paid players look like shadows of their former selves and those contracts have prevented the Vikings from freeing up cap space and addressing these positions they thought were well locked up.

If the Vikings do make the playoffs I do not see them making an extended run. Maybe they could win one playoff game, I don't see them being able to do much more than that with this defense.

The offense has really improved. The strength of the team has changed.

 
Biabreakable said:
Although this loss hurt for me it was somewhat expected. I am actually happy with the offense making a game of it. The defense was too bad for them to win the game.

As Russell Wilson said after the game, the Vikings were mostly playing cover two and because of that they chose to run the ball. The safeties are not coming up and helping against the run when they are playing deep coverage.

The reason the Vikings are playing so much cover two is because Rhodes cannot be trusted to hang with his assignment one on one anymore. He needs help, on every play now. It is hurting the entire defense.

I'm not saying that Hughes or Alexander or Hill are better than Rhodes right now, but given how poorly he has played it would be hard for them to be worse.

The other problem is that the Vikings are not getting any pressure from their defensive tackles. In this game vs the Seahawks they did a really poor job against the run as well. Linval Joseph is not playing as well as he used to and he shouldn't be in there in passing situations anyways (although he may be better than their other options).

No pass rush up the middle, QBs can just step up in the pocket and throw the ball.

I think they need to bench Rhodes. It is la delicate  situation in the locker room for the coaches to make the change, but if they want to win some more games I think they have to make a change.

The reality is the likely don't have the personnel to make the changes they need to make to improve on defense. I have more hope of the corners perhaps leading to an improvement, I don't see the inside pass rush being resolved with the players they have right now. Best option is still likely Griffen if they would play him inside more and let the back up ends play his spot when he does.

I have listened to some talk of Kirk Cousins contract being somehow partially at fault for the Vikings not being able to pay their defensive players. Looking at sportrac Cousins represents 155% of the Vikings total cap in 2019.

Xavier Rhodes represents 7% of the Vikings salary cap, he is their 3rd highest paid player and he isn't just not playing up to his contract, he isn't playing well enough to start.

Linval Joseph represents 5.5% of the Vikings salary cap, he is their 7th highest paid player, this is too much for a NT who only plays on run downs. He isn't playing as well as he was when he got the contract extension.

The point is that it isn't just Kirk Cousins contract preventing them from getting better. Two of their top 10 highest paid players look like shadows of their former selves and those contracts have prevented the Vikings from freeing up cap space and addressing these positions they thought were well locked up.

If the Vikings do make the playoffs I do not see them making an extended run. Maybe they could win one playoff game, I don't see them being able to do much more than that with this defense.

The offense has really improved. The strength of the team has changed.
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I actually thought the pass rush was good against Wilson.  They stayed in their assignments and kept him in the pocket for the most part.  They didn't let him break contain which is what can really hurt you downfield.  Even though they didn't get stiff pressure up the middle they kept him in the pocket which I thought was well done.  

Not being able to stop a dive play for less than 5 yds was the real problem and it wasn't like the RB was breaking through clean.  They were hit maybe a yard down field then dragged players for another 4 or 5 yards.  That was the issue which is on the DT (Joseph being a big culprit as you already mentioned).  It's a shame that they have lost their biggest strength of defense and even when they do hold a team to a 3 and 6/7 yds then Rhodes gives up the easy completion and the drive continues.   Frustrating to watch.

 
Rhodes Apologizes For Sideline Actions on Monday, Vows To Improve His Play Moving Forward

Good for Rhodes taking responsibility for his behavior and vowing to change that. I hope he is successful in doing that.

At the same time I think he is delusional to think that he can wait for to flip a switch and he will start playing well again. He talks about all the hard work he has put in but not getting the results he wants. To me this sounds more like a flip has switched and he can't play as well as he used to anymore, despite how much work he has been putting into that.

 
Biabreakable said:
Rhodes Apologizes For Sideline Actions on Monday, Vows To Improve His Play Moving Forward

Good for Rhodes taking responsibility for his behavior and vowing to change that. I hope he is successful in doing that.

At the same time I think he is delusional to think that he can wait for to flip a switch and he will start playing well again. He talks about all the hard work he has put in but not getting the results he wants. To me this sounds more like a flip has switched and he can't play as well as he used to anymore, despite how much work he has been putting into that.
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He will probably have a good game vs. a 3rd string QB and come out with "I'm back :bowtie: " LOL

 
Biabreakable said:
Rhodes Apologizes For Sideline Actions on Monday, Vows To Improve His Play Moving Forward

Good for Rhodes taking responsibility for his behavior and vowing to change that. I hope he is successful in doing that.

At the same time I think he is delusional to think that he can wait for to flip a switch and he will start playing well again. He talks about all the hard work he has put in but not getting the results he wants. To me this sounds more like a flip has switched and he can't play as well as he used to anymore, despite how much work he has been putting into that.
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I’m pretty sure he said something similar earlier this season and nothing changed afterwards. I think he just had a short and high peak, which is now over. I don’t know if it was the accumulation of minor injuries or something else, but he just doesn’t have the physical ability to do it anymore. Even if he “flips a switch”, it won’t change the fact that nothing is there. 

 
sports_fan said:
I’m pretty sure he said something similar earlier this season and nothing changed afterwards. I think he just had a short and high peak, which is now over. I don’t know if it was the accumulation of minor injuries or something else, but he just doesn’t have the physical ability to do it anymore. Even if he “flips a switch”, it won’t change the fact that nothing is there. 
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It's not that there isn't anything there when he flips the switch.  It's that the light bulb is burned out. 

 
Gally said:
It's not that there isn't anything there when he flips the switch.  It's that the light bulb is burned out. 
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What's amazing to me is that his coverage isn't that bad (not counting the blown coverage assignment in the Seahawk game)...he is usually right there and cannot make a play on the ball. Every time I watch him, I think back to Major League...when Lou Brown is telling Ricky Vaughn to look at Nolan Ryan and he can't see him...maybe Xavier needs glasses!!

 
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Well that was a pretty Ho-Hum win.. But a win is a win :thumbup:

4 things the vikings need.
1. Beat the Chargers
2. Bears Beat the Packers
3. Vikings beat the Packers
4. Vikings Beat the Bears

A lot needed, but the North is still there for the taking..

Saying that, I think right now it is 49ers/Saints.............................................................................. Seahawks/Vikings/Packers
I think the Vikings and the Packers can hang around and possibly beat the Seahawks... But I don't think either one has the offense to keep up with the 49ers or the Saints.

 
snogger said:
Well that was a pretty Ho-Hum win.. But a win is a win :thumbup:

4 things the vikings need.
1. Beat the Chargers
2. Bears Beat the Packers
3. Vikings beat the Packers
4. Vikings Beat the Bears

A lot needed, but the North is still there for the taking..

Saying that, I think right now it is 49ers/Saints.............................................................................. Seahawks/Vikings/Packers
I think the Vikings and the Packers can hang around and possibly beat the Seahawks... But I don't think either one has the offense to keep up with the 49ers or the Saints.
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Packer fan here with a pretty similar assessment.  I see the 49ers, Saints and Ravens as a tier above the Packers, Vikings, Seahawks, and maybe Chiefs, and that tier a bit above the Bills, Patriots Titans, Texans and Bears, and that tier above the Cowboys who are going to suck their way in.  The Packers are sporadic though, and oftentimes this year play like a tier or two below where their record has them, though not always. I try to hope that the Packers can find the switch to put it all together, but thus far I have little evidence of that. They communicate very poorly on their defensive back end and their offense appears and disappears randomly.  They may well not be as good as their record indicates.  Any team that gets blown out against the Chargers has to question how good they truly are and the Packers did just that.  

I do note that your Ho-hum win was more convincing than ours this week.  I am hopeful your team is looking past the Chargers to the showdown in Minneapolis the following week making it a classic trap game.  I have no reason to believe that, just a hope.  Regardless of what happens this week for either teams the game in two weeks ought to be interesting. 

 
Ditkaless Wonders said:
snogger said:
Well that was a pretty Ho-Hum win.. But a win is a win :thumbup:

4 things the vikings need.
1. Beat the Chargers
2. Bears Beat the Packers
3. Vikings beat the Packers
4. Vikings Beat the Bears

A lot needed, but the North is still there for the taking..

Saying that, I think right now it is 49ers/Saints.............................................................................. Seahawks/Vikings/Packers
I think the Vikings and the Packers can hang around and possibly beat the Seahawks... But I don't think either one has the offense to keep up with the 49ers or the Saints.
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Packer fan here with a pretty similar assessment.  I see the 49ers, Saints and Ravens as a tier above the Packers, Vikings, Seahawks, and maybe Chiefs, and that tier a bit above the Bills, Patriots Titans, Texans and Bears, and that tier above the Cowboys who are going to suck their way in.  The Packers are sporadic though, and oftentimes this year play like a tier or two below where their record has them, though not always. I try to hope that the Packers can find the switch to put it all together, but thus far I have little evidence of that. They communicate very poorly on their defensive back end and their offense appears and disappears randomly.  They may well not be as good as their record indicates.  Any team that gets blown out against the Chargers has to question how good they truly are and the Packers did just that.  

I do note that your Ho-hum win was more convincing than ours this week.  I am hopeful your team is looking past the Chargers to the showdown in Minneapolis the following week making it a classic trap game.  I have no reason to believe that, just a hope.  Regardless of what happens this week for either teams the game in two weeks ought to be interesting. 
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Chargers are a tricky team.. One week they look like bottom tier, then the next they put up 40+.... Have to think the Vikings won't look past them, ala the Texans vs. Bronco's.. 

The Packers are  strange this year.. Living in Wisconsin and being a Viking fan I normally hear lots of "Packers are kicking bleep".. this year it's been very quiet.... The Offense in particular is hard to figure.. They can go out for a quarter or two and light it up, and then have 2 quarters of dud and that seems to be every game... 

Hate that the game vs. the Packers is the night before Christmas eve since that is with the Wisconsin side of the family..
So either it will be me :bowtie:   or them.. and if it is them it will be 6 vs. 1 ...

 
Rhodes, Hill and Hughes all played about an equal number of snaps. I don’t think Hill or Hughes did enough to earn the starting role, but it’s nice to see them get an opportunity to eat into Rhodes playing time.  I think we see something similar next week. 

 
After watching the Rams last night, it's pretty clear the Vikes are going to need to earn their way into the playoffs by staying ahead of the Rams, which IMHO is how it should be even if they wind up SOL at 11-5. If they can't beat a struggling Chargers team on the road (scary game with our secondary), or get swept by either the Packers/Bears via losing at home, that's how the cookie crumbles. As others have mentioned, Vikes are a step below the NFC elite even if they do make it. Whether in FA/Draft, this team needs help at DB/DT/OL to take the next step. 

Total aside, it brought a tear to my eye seeing CB Breeland knocking the ball away to save the KC victory over the Pats yesterday, made possible only because he knew where the ball was. What an underappreciated skill-set. I envisioned any Viking defender having his back turned completely on that play. 

 
sports_fan said:
Rhodes, Hill and Hughes all played about an equal number of snaps. I don’t think Hill or Hughes did enough to earn the starting role, but it’s nice to see them get an opportunity to eat into Rhodes playing time.  I think we see something similar next week. 
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Something had to change.

Overall I thought the Vikings played tighter coverage than we have been seeing recently. Of course it is hard to tell because of the QB they faced as well, but just looking at how the Vikings covered, I think it was an improvement.

Here are the snap counts for the CBs in the most recent game:

M Alexander CB 57 80%
T Waynes CB 54 76%
M Hughes CB 29 41% 
X Rhodes CB 29 41%
H Hill CB 27 38% 

I am not sure if Rhodes returned to the line up after his injury? He got his ankle rolled up with Harrison Smith on that interception. I don't recall seeing him after that, but maybe he came back in.

Somewhat surprising to see Alexander playing the most snaps. I don't think he played outside.

I noticed Hughes came in early and was playing Rhodes spot for a few plays, then after the injury I was seeing Hill playing  Rhodes spot at LCB.

I am glad they are doing something. Even if it is rearranging chairs on the titanic at least they recognize there has been a problem and are doing something about it now. 

 
BigJim® said:
After watching the Rams last night, it's pretty clear the Vikes are going to need to earn their way into the playoffs by staying ahead of the Rams, which IMHO is how it should be even if they wind up SOL at 11-5. If they can't beat a struggling Chargers team on the road (scary game with our secondary), or get swept by either the Packers/Bears via losing at home, that's how the cookie crumbles. As others have mentioned, Vikes are a step below the NFC elite even if they do make it. Whether in FA/Draft, this team needs help at DB/DT/OL to take the next step. 

Total aside, it brought a tear to my eye seeing CB Breeland knocking the ball away to save the KC victory over the Pats yesterday, made possible only because he knew where the ball was. What an underappreciated skill-set. I envisioned any Viking defender having his back turned completely on that play. 
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I hear what you are saying. Anthony Harris is the main guy the Vikings have who always plays the ball.

I haven't seen enough of Hughes yet to have an opinion about him.

 
Biabreakable said:
I hear what you are saying. Anthony Harris is the main guy the Vikings have who always plays the ball.

I haven't seen enough of Hughes yet to have an opinion about him.
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Well, Breeland is a CB. A guy like Harris who plays safety should routinely be watching the QB to know where to slide his coverage, and should know where the ball is. What I like is seeing the CBs who play the ball. Another example by Breeland yesterday is he intercepted a different Brady pass - coming off his WR assignment when he saw Brady throwing to a different receiver. Something like that is not even possible to happen in the Vikes' secondary because guys are blind to where the QB is throwing.

My sense is it's not a player capability thing... that it is a coached technique anytime we play man coverage of "don't lose your guy, watch his eyes, and when you can tell the ball is coming put your arms up in the air to obstruct." I'm just not a fan of the approach because (a) you won't get INTs out of man coverage and (b) as we've seen we're way more likely to give up a reception or get a pass interference. Our CBs (rightfully) get zero credit in the close PI calls when not playing the ball. 

 
BigJim® said:
Well, Breeland is a CB. A guy like Harris who plays safety should routinely be watching the QB to know where to slide his coverage, and should know where the ball is. What I like is seeing the CBs who play the ball. Another example by Breeland yesterday is he intercepted a different Brady pass - coming off his WR assignment when he saw Brady throwing to a different receiver. Something like that is not even possible to happen in the Vikes' secondary because guys are blind to where the QB is throwing.

My sense is it's not a player capability thing... that it is a coached technique anytime we play man coverage of "don't lose your guy, watch his eyes, and when you can tell the ball is coming put your arms up in the air to obstruct." I'm just not a fan of the approach because (a) you won't get INTs out of man coverage and (b) as we've seen we're way more likely to give up a reception or get a pass interference. Our CBs (rightfully) get zero credit in the close PI calls when not playing the ball. 
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I agree there may be something to how the corners are coached, and the players they identify for those roles that does not have them playing the ball so much as playing the receiver who is their assignment. This may be why the Vikings defensive backs have always been somewhat low on interceptions as well.

That is totally fair that Harris is a safety and so he can be watching the QB while these corners have to turn and run with their guy.

Just an overall observation of each player though where I see Harris consistently playing the ball, not the receiver while almost everyone else in the Vikings coverage is the opposite.

I do think the Vikings have played more zone in recent games which should enable corners to play the ball more but it hasn't really happened in that situation much either.

I guess a extreme example of ZImmers priorities when it comes to corners is that he selected Trey Waynes over Marcus Peters. Now there are likely off the field issues involved with this decision as well, but Peters plays the ball and is more likely to cause interceptions than Waynes or a lot of CBs. He also gives up more big plays than Waynes and doesn't help as much against the run or against screens.

Alexander never had an interception in college.

Mike Hughes is perhaps the exception here but I still haven't really seen him play enoughn yet to have a opinion.

I think Zimmers defense keeps changing, but I think you have a point about what his priorities are. I have heard him say basically what I am talking about when he has talked about Waynes before.

I can see both sides of the story. I like what Baltimore is doing with Peters, he has also worn out his welcome with teams.

 
snogger said:
Chargers are a tricky team.. One week they look like bottom tier, then the next they put up 40+.... Have to think the Vikings won't look past them, ala the Texans vs. Bronco's.. 

The Packers are  strange this year.. Living in Wisconsin and being a Viking fan I normally hear lots of "Packers are kicking bleep".. this year it's been very quiet.... The Offense in particular is hard to figure.. They can go out for a quarter or two and light it up, and then have 2 quarters of dud and that seems to be every game... 

Hate that the game vs. the Packers is the night before Christmas eve since that is with the Wisconsin side of the family..
So either it will be me :bowtie:   or them.. and if it is them it will be 6 vs. 1 ...
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Its not easy living behind enemy lines. I spent 3 years in the twin Cities and another two out in Marshall MN and the Packers were well into their second decade of sucking.    Locals had fun with my misery, as was only right.  In the end they were good folks merely disadvantaged by the location of their birth.  God punished them by visiting Les Steckel upon them.

Best of luck to your guys this week.  I expect to see nothing but purple in the stands.  A home away game.  

 
Enjoyable win... Certainly was nice of the Chargers to be so giving this holiday season ;)

NFL has to be thrilled on the stars lining up for Monday night.. Packers trying to win the north and stay at least a 2 seed.. Vikings looking to win out and pray the Lions learn how to win week 17... I'd say we should have a drinking game of taking a shot each time they bring up Cousin's record on Monday nights, but I'd like to make it past half time without looking like :suds:  

 
I agree the Chargers need a thank you note or something for all the balls they gave us.

The Vikings got really good pass rush for most of the game. That was really good to see.

I wasn't so sure about the game plan that seemed to be running a lot more 3 WR sets than usual, and running out of that wasn't so good. I suppose that is some growing pains working Theilen back in the lineup.

Sucks to lose Cook, but Boone had some decent runs.

Hughes got beat several times but he was able to get revenge in the end with the interception. Defensive adjustment that had the safety help to clean up the tackle if Hughes misses the ball. Seems like a coverage adjustment the Vikings made for when Rivers went back to that play.

It is great to have the defense and special teams step up and play as well as they did in this game.

The Vikings haven't lost at home yet. Hopefully they can keep that streak going.

 
Judge Smails said:
How did Thielen look? Any setbacks? They should have to throw a lot next week
Click to expand...
He looked fine.

Made a key catch on 3rd down. He had a jet sweep off motion.

The Vikings ran a lot of 3 WR sets in this game which is a departure from the personnel they have been using without Theilen. I am not sure about that match up against the Chargers who have some good defensive backs. In my view it was partially trying to get that package going in the offense now that Theilen is back. 

Will check the snap counts later, but I think he played most of the game. The Vikings did pull starters on defense at the end but not really on offense.

I expect Theilen to be a big part of the game plan against the Packers next week. Especially if Cook isn't able to play.

It would be nice to get all these skill players clicking at the same time. That hasn't really happened this year.

 
kodycutter said:
I hope Cook is back, he's fun to watch.   If he isn't - is Mattison expected back?
Click to expand...
I don't know.

Mattison has an ankle injury. Could mean he is back next week, could be that he needs more time to recover.

I would be a bit nervous about the Vikings if they have to use Boone and Abdullah if neither Cook or Mattison can play.

Boone did look pretty good though. I worry about fumbles with Abdullah.

 
Biabreakable said:
I agree the Chargers need a thank you note or something for all the balls they gave us.

The Vikings got really good pass rush for most of the game. That was really good to see.

I wasn't so sure about the game plan that seemed to be running a lot more 3 WR sets than usual, and running out of that wasn't so good. I suppose that is some growing pains working Theilen back in the lineup.

Sucks to lose Cook, but Boone had some decent runs.

Hughes got beat several times but he was able to get revenge in the end with the interception. Defensive adjustment that had the safety help to clean up the tackle if Hughes misses the ball. Seems like a coverage adjustment the Vikings made for when Rivers went back to that play.

It is great to have the defense and special teams step up and play as well as they did in this game.

The Vikings haven't lost at home yet. Hopefully they can keep that streak going.
Click to expand...
After Half-time the sideline reporter stated that Zimmer wasn't happy with the CB play and they were going to work on helping them out.. Seems to have worked... Hopefully they carry that over to next Monday as they can't afford to have the CB's make the mistakes against Rodgers that they made in the first half..  :mellow:

 
So, since Seattle is currently the #1, and Packers are #2..

If the Saints win tonight, since they beat Seattle, I assume they jump to #1, Seattle drops to #2 and the Packers would drop to #3.. Correct :confused:  

 
snogger said:
So, since Seattle is currently the #1, and Packers are #2..

If the Saints win tonight, since they beat Seattle, I assume they jump to #1, Seattle drops to #2 and the Packers would drop to #3.. Correct :confused:  
Click to expand...
No.

If the Vikings beat the Packers next Monday then the two teams will be tied but the Packers did not lose to the Bears so they win the tiebreaker of having a better conference record.

Basically the only way the Vikings win the division is if they win out and the Packers lose to the Lions week 17.

One thing at a time. They need to beat the Packers next week.

 
snogger said:
So, since Seattle is currently the #1, and Packers are #2..

If the Saints win tonight, since they beat Seattle, I assume they jump to #1, Seattle drops to #2 and the Packers would drop to #3.. Correct :confused:  
Click to expand...
From an article on The Athletic about playoff seeding: “The Seahawks would lose the head-to-head tiebreak against the Saints based on their head-to-head loss. But if it’s a three-team tiebreak, Seattle and Green Bay get the byes over New Orleans based on conference record...

[Packers] clinch the NFC North with one win or one Vikings loss in the last two weeks.”

So Saints would remain #3 if they win tonight as they lose in a three way tiebreak.

 
Biabreakable said:
No.

If the Vikings beat the Packers next Monday then the two teams will be tied but the Packers did not lose to the Bears so they win the tiebreaker of having a better conference record.

Basically the only way the Vikings win the division is if they win out and the Packers lose to the Lions week 17.

One thing at a time. They need to beat the Packers next week.
Click to expand...
Yea, I know the Vikings have to win out and have the Lions figure out a way to win come week 17... Was trying to figure out the seeding, which was answered above this post... :football:  

 
sports_fan said:
From an article on The Athletic about playoff seeding: “The Seahawks would lose the head-to-head tiebreak against the Saints based on their head-to-head loss. But if it’s a three-team tiebreak, Seattle and Green Bay get the byes over New Orleans based on conference record...

[Packers] clinch the NFC North with one win or one Vikings loss in the last two weeks.”

So Saints would remain #3 if they win tonight as they lose in a three way tiebreak.
Click to expand...
Very strange.. Win the head to head, but lose due to a different tie breaker :loco:  

 
The Vikings need to win on Monday. I am not even really thinking about things past that.

Winning on the road will be difficult no matter the opponent.

 
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