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Trump tax reform! Latest CBO update shows increase in deficit projections of 1T (3 Viewers)

timschochet said:
So what did this tax cut do for us? Same growth as under Obama, and way more deficit and debt. And it's Trump's main achievement right? What was the point?
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We're a trillion dollars further into deficit spending than projected.  That has to account for "something" right?

 
GoBirds said:
...and a clear down trend on Obama’s way out the door. Don’t waste your time, it’s groundhogs day with this crew. Same untrue complaints....different day. 
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I really don't understand this.  I thought this thread had to do with the tax cut. Why do you keep bringing up Obama?

Question: if the tax cut hasn't increased growth, what was the point? I'll keep asking until I get an answer.

 
timschochet said:
I really don't understand this.  I thought this thread had to do with the tax cut. Why do you keep bringing up Obama?

Question: if the tax cut hasn't increased growth, what was the point? I'll keep asking until I get an answer.
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It has increased growth.  Why aren't you listening?

 
The Commish said:
:confused:   He's talking about the promise which Trump has been making well before he was even elected.  I was being generous and ignoring all the time prior to him taking office.  For someone who's always telling others to "try and keep up" you should take your own advice.
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That is not what he is talking about.  I started the conversation with him on how the trade war is hurting growth.  Are you telling me you think Trump's promise of a possible trade war hurt growth in 2017?   Wowzers.

 
timschochet said:
Because 2.1% doesn't seem to demonstrate that.
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It is one quarter.  

If you are watching the Lakers and they score 40 points in the 1st quarter and then 25 points in the 2nd quarter.  Are you going to complain that they only have 65 points at halftime despite them beating the Clippers 65-48?

 
Don't Noonan said:
That is not what he is talking about.  I started the conversation with him on how the trade war is hurting growth.  Are you telling me you think Trump's promise of a possible trade war hurt growth in 2017?   Wowzers.
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No...I'm telling you he's talking about the promise...as he says:

You're talking about the China deal? I sure hope so. What makes you think it will be done anytime soon? We've been promised this for several months. I thought it would be done last month.
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I corrected him by pointing out we've been promised this for 2.5 years PLUS....you keep contorting yourself into those infamous GOP knots though.  :thumbup:  

 
Don't Noonan said:
2016 was 1.6%.   :lol:

Try again
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Yes it was.  But you acted like the 2.9% from Trump far overshadowed anything Obama hit.

As usual just blatant lying and intellectual dishonesty.  Par for the course for people that have to defend the indefensible. 

 
Back from December 2017.  Gee Donnie lying once again.  SHOCKING!!

PRESIDENT TRUMP: This is going to be one of the great gifts to the middle-income people that they've ever gotten for Chrismas...

Years from now they can make it even more generous if we can get the economy like it should be. The economy now is at 3%. Nobody thought it would be anywhere close. I think it could go to 4, 5, and maybe even 6%, ultimately. Each percentage point is $2.5 trillion. We are back. We are really going to start to rock. We need this as our final push and you're going to see some numbers that are really great. You're going to see great jobs numbers. Jobs are going to come pouring back into this country, which we need very much.

 
Don't Noonan said:
It is one quarter.  

If you are watching the Lakers and they score 40 points in the 1st quarter and then 25 points in the 2nd quarter.  Are you going to complain that they only have 65 points at halftime despite them beating the Clippers 65-48?
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We're in game 3 and Trump is down 0-2 if 3% GDP was the goal to reach his budget projections.

I don't blame Trump for trying to immitate a black man🏀. But when he promised 4, 5 and 6% growth, he was following the Westbrook playbook. LeBron had Wade, Bosh and Battier, while Trump's team has Putin, Kim and MBS, and Team America is paying the luxury tax.

 
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The Commish said:
Trump set the standard expectation at 3+...probably more like 4-5....that's what was used in the CBO predictions for the future.  I like how holding him to his own standard that he himself set is "hate" :lmao:  
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2017 Trump supporter = The economy is booming. It's great. Trump is doing an awesome job.

2019 Trump supporter = Trump doesn't control every aspect of the economy. Quit hating.

 
Mile High said:
Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump

11m

Q2 GDP Up 2.1% Not bad considering we have the very heavy weight of the Federal Reserve anchor wrapped around our neck. Almost no inflation. USA is set to Zoom!
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https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2016/09/06/trump_the_fed_keeping_interest_rates_artificially_low_so_the_economy_doesnt_go_down.html

September 6, 2016

Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump told reporters Monday that the Federal Reserve is keeping interests rates at record lows to help President Obama and to keep the economy from going down.

"They’re keeping the rates artificially low so the economy doesn’t go down," Trump said in response to a question about a potential rate hike by the Federal Reserve this month. "So that Obama can say he did a good job. That's the only reason that the rates are so low. They're keeping the rates artificially low so that Obama can go out and play golf after January and say that he did a good job. But it is a very, a very false economy. So [Obama] can leave office and say: See I told you."

“We have a very false economy," he repeated.

"So far, I think she's done a political job," he said about Fed chair Janet Yellen.

"At some point the rates are going to have to change," Trump added. "The only thing that is strong is the artificial stock market."

"That's only strong because it's free money because the rates are so low. It's an artificial market. It's a bubble. So the only thing that's strong is the artificial market that they're created until January. It's so artificial because they have free money... It's all free money. When rates are low like this it's hard not to have a good stock market," he also said.
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FWIW I think a rate cut is very defensible, but this U-turn from Trump and the GOP in general is so transparent. When a Democrat is in office, expansionary economic policy is bad, and when a Republican is in office, expansionary economic policy is good. Understand this and you understand the modern GOP's entire philosophy on money printing and deficit spending. 

 
Mario Kart said:
2017 Trump supporter = The economy is booming. It's great. Trump is doing an awesome job.

2019 Trump supporter = Trump doesn't control every aspect of the economy. Quit hating.
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The best part will be when we hit recession (maybe 2021-22ish?) after he's long gone all the guys saying "recessions are inevitable" now, will be saying "look at turd X democratic president, they really screwed things up" :lmao:  

 
The Commish said:
The best part will be when we hit recession (maybe 2021-22ish?) after he's long gone all the guys saying "recessions are inevitable" now, will be saying "look at turd X democratic president, they really screwed things up" :lmao:  
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Will they go back to saying unemployment is fake and gdp<3% is terrible?

Will they continue to lie or actually post with a modicum of truth?  Lol, of course they’ll continue to lie like Dear Leader.

 
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Sheriff Bart said:
I remember something about "only losers have less than 3% growth" so I'm sure it will be higher than that. 
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Donald Trump’s Entire Story About the Economy Fell Apart This Week

Friday’s report also robbed the White House of a favorite talking point. Previously, the government believed that the economy grew by more than 3 percent in 2018, a mark it hadn’t hit in more than a decade. This milestone led Trump (or, really, his press shop) to boast that he had “accomplished an economic turnaround of historic proportions.” He was particularly jazzed that growth hit 4.1 percent for one quarter that year.. In its annual data revisions, which also dropped Friday, the Commerce 

It turns out we didn’t reach 3 percent growth after all. In its annual data revisions, which also dropped Friday, the Commerce Department reported that the economy grew by just 2.5 percent or 2.9 percent in 2018, depending on exactly how you measure it. It also turns out that growth never actually hit 4 percent in the second quarter of 2018, which—despite being sort of meaningless—had been a point of pride for Trump. In short, goodbye, bragging rights.
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Sheriff Bart said:
Sheriff Bart said:
I remember something about "only losers have less than 3% growth" so I'm sure it will be higher than that. 
Click to expand...
Donald Trump’s Entire Story About the Economy Fell Apart This Week

Friday’s report also robbed the White House of a favorite talking point. Previously, the government believed that the economy grew by more than 3 percent in 2018, a mark it hadn’t hit in more than a decade. This milestone led Trump (or, really, his press shop) to boast that he had “accomplished an economic turnaround of historic proportions.” He was particularly jazzed that growth hit 4.1 percent for one quarter that year.. In its annual data revisions, which also dropped Friday, the Commerce 

It turns out we didn’t reach 3 percent growth after all. In its annual data revisions, which also dropped Friday, the Commerce Department reported that the economy grew by just 2.5 percent or 2.9 percent in 2018, depending on exactly how you measure it. It also turns out that growth never actually hit 4 percent in the second quarter of 2018, which—despite being sort of meaningless—had been a point of pride for Trump. In short, goodbye, bragging rights.
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The larger problem with this is that the debt and deficits that were projected from the tax cuts depended on large GDP numbers.  The claim was that the economy would pay for it.  Well, that's not happening, so those numbers are going to be larger.  Debt and deficits will continue to increase by large amounts in one of the best economic climates we've seen in a while.

 
caustic said:
FWIW I think a rate cut is very defensible, but this U-turn from Trump and the GOP in general is so transparent. When a Democrat is in office, expansionary economic policy is bad, and when a Republican is in office, expansionary economic policy is good. Understand this and you understand the modern GOP's entire philosophy on money printing and deficit spending. 
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The GOP has long only cared about their power.  It's so transparent that you cannot take their views seriously.

Rates should also be lower.

 
tommyGunZ said:
Bumping this for the deficit hawks.  What do you think of this policy proposal?  
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They are hibernating until the Dems are in power again. Although there were a couple of Rs in DC that suggested starting cutting back on social programmes to pay for the tax cuts IIRC

 
The Commish said:
The best part will be when we hit recession (maybe 2021-22ish?) after he's long gone all the guys saying "recessions are inevitable" now, will be saying "look at turd X democratic president, they really screwed things up" :lmao:  
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If it hits i would imagine it will be late this year or next year. 

 
Sahil Kapur

@sahilkapur

The U.S. budget deficit grew to $866.8 billion in the first 10 months of the new fiscal year, a 27% increase from the same period one year earlier.

 
Might as well dust this thing off again.  To refresh everyone's memory we were promised tax cuts that were going to go to the middle class, free up funds for companies to invest and grow, and that they'd all pay for themselves by growing the economy by 6%.

What we have received is a tax cut directly to the most rich in this country, funds freed up for companies (but they have decided to dump those back into their own companies) and a GDP that isn't even a third of what was promised (1.9% last quarter).  That all translates into the largest deficit spending this country has ever seen in a non-recession economy.  We will be well over $1T in deficit spending this year simply to maintain the status quo and stock market hitting all time highs on occasion (that only approx 50% of the country is even participating in).

I wish those who pushed against Obama and his $2500 would nut up and push back against this travesty of a bill as well.  After all, this bill is just getting going and things are guaranteed to get worse every quarter we don't hit 4-5% GDP that they used in their estimate to sell this as "paying for itself".

 
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