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Democratic leaders call for Omar to apologize for 'anti-Semitic tropes' (1 Viewer)

ren hoek said:
https://twitter.com/imraansiddiqi/status/1095374110559858688

This is waaaay more rabid and bigoted than anything that has ever come from the woman these folks have so happily tossed under the bus.
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One of my Iron Laws of online debates is that I never get into the Arab-Israeli conflict. So I'm not going to start parsing that quote. But I will post the entire quote in context: https://twitter.com/_saeen_/status/971277911201378304?s=21

It seems pretty clear to me that Schumer is NOT saying the Arabs' non-belief in the Torah is what is preventing peace, but rather their refusal to countenance a Jewish state. You can disagree with my interpretation, or say that it's still bigoted, or whatever you want. I just wanted to provide the full quote.

 
mcintyre1 said:
Very much disagree on this, Tim. The future of the Democratic Party and America is that young part of the party. If you want 4 more years of Trump, you'll push for the Pelosi's and Klobuchar's of the center. This is not an era of centrism, for better or worse. 
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You don’t need to disagree with me because I’m not making that argument. I’m saying that the Republicans are making that argument. Do I think it will work? Probably not. 

Now as it happens, I am pushing for the centrists. Not because I think they will win but because I am a centrist. But I agree that the energy of the party is on the left. Of course against Trump I’ll support whoever is left standing. 

 
After Dem leadership joined hands with Republicans to toss Omar under the bus, Trump steps on the pedal.  Now Chelsea is on the defensive against the barrel-scraping smears she gave credence to.  

Chelsea Clinton @ChelseaClinton

Mr. President, Congresswoman @IlhanMN apologized for using an anti-Semitic trope & demonstrated leadership. When have you ever apologized for your embrace of white nationalism & your exploitation & amplification of anti-Semitic, Islamophobic, racist, xenophobic, anti-LGBTQ hate?

 
Democrat darling AOC 'both sides' it, reinforcing the notion that Ilhan actually had something to apologize for.  (She didn't.)  "Sensitivity to communities," what a load.  Complete tripe.  

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez‏ @AOC

Unlike this President, Rep. @IlhanMN demonstrated a capacity to acknowledge pain & apologize, use the opportunity to learn abt history of antisemitism,+grow from it while clarifying her stance. I’m also inspired by Jewish leadership who brought her in, not push her out, to heal.

Lots of people here proclaiming to be “woke” trying to police communities on what they are/aren’t allowed to be upset by. I’m proud @IlhanMN raised the issue of lobbyist in politics & equally proud of her sensitivity to communities. Both are possible.

 
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Courtjester said:
Well as long as they both keep making these rookie mistakes, they sure aren’t helping themselves. 

Omar’s statements last week regarding full time, 40 hour a week McDonald’s employees makjng just $7,000 a year is kinda of real easy to disprove. 

Both her and AOC need to take a few plays off and get their feet under them if they want to have any staying power. 
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I think this is right. Omar said a foolish thing (surprise, in Congress you will be flayed by your opponents) and Cortez rolled out an unready product (Same). Write it off, take the hits, come back smarter. 

 
ren hoek said:
Democrat darling AOC 'both sides' it, reinforcing the notion that Ilhan actually had something to apologize for.  (She didn't.)  "Sensitivity to communities," what a load.  Complete tripe.  

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez‏ @AOC

Unlike this President, Rep. @IlhanMN demonstrated a capacity to acknowledge pain & apologize, use the opportunity to learn abt history of antisemitism,+grow from it while clarifying her stance. I’m also inspired by Jewish leadership who brought her in, not push her out, to heal.

Lots of people here proclaiming to be “woke” trying to police communities on what they are/aren’t allowed to be upset by. I’m proud @IlhanMN raised the issue of lobbyist in politics & equally proud of her sensitivity to communities. Both are possible.
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The tragedy of the true believer: Everyone disappoints you eventually.

 
zftcg said:
The tragedy of the true believer: Everyone disappoints you eventually.
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Palestine is a good proxy into a politician’s integrity on other issues.  There’s zero political capital in it for congresspeople in DC.  There’s the threat of being at odds with one of the most powerful lobby in the world, which goes out of its way to primary people for not demonstrating the appropriate level of fealty to Israel.  Most people would rather just take the money and have their position on Israel spoonfed by AIPAC.

It’s a good window into how a politician will or will not capitulate on other issues.  To the extent that AOC does this fairweather bothsides crap, it really shortchanges Omar and hangs her out to dry.  This was the time to double down, not go out weak.  This is not the last time we’ll see bogus antisemitism policing to bring down dissent.  

 
ren hoek said:
There’s the threat of being at odds with one of the most powerful lobby in the world
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FTR- one of the unique features of anti-semitism, which doesn’t really apply to other forms of bigotry, is the depiction of Jews as a shadowy force with almost unlimited power, able to shape events behind the scenes and willing to take down anyone who opposes them.  The above is an excellent example of this aspect of anti-Jewish bigotry. 

 
timschochet said:
FTR- one of the unique features of anti-semitism, which doesn’t really apply to other forms of bigotry, is the depiction of Jews as a shadowy force with almost unlimited power, able to shape events behind the scenes and willing to take down anyone who opposes them.  The above is an excellent example of this aspect of anti-Jewish bigotry. 
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I don’t think ren’s post implied this

 
timschochet said:
FTR- one of the unique features of anti-semitism, which doesn’t really apply to other forms of bigotry, is the depiction of Jews as a shadowy force with almost unlimited power, able to shape events behind the scenes and willing to take down anyone who opposes them.  The above is an excellent example of this aspect of anti-Jewish bigotry. 
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Nah

 
timschochet said:
Well, the line I quoted was pretty explicit. He went on to claim that AIPAC primaries anyone who “doesn’t show fealty to Israel”. 
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You don’t think they would attempt to primary someone who doesn’t show loyalty to Israel?  Fealty may be a bit strong, but I don’t disagree with his point.  Our politicians’ obsession with Israel has always struck me as curious  

i don’t think what Omar said was worthy of any apology and I’ve heard some despicable things being said about her on conservative radio today. 

 
Dickies said:
You don’t think they would attempt to primary someone who doesn’t show loyalty to Israel?  Fealty may be a bit strong, but I don’t disagree with his point.  Our politicians’ obsession with Israel has always struck me as curious  

i don’t think what Omar said was worthy of any apology and I’ve heard some despicable things being said about her on conservative radio today. 
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1. Not really. At least I haven’t seen them do this. Oppose candidates yes, primary them no. 

2. We’re not obsessed with Israel. We support Israel (not necessarily the current government) because of shared values. That being said, there should be room for pro-Palestinian voices as well. 

3. She should have apologized. She did and now it’s over. I don’t think conservatives need to demonize her. They’ve gone overboard, and there may be some anti-Muslim sentiment there as well. 

 
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Again, the most important thing that Omar said is that pro-Palestinian positions don’t have a voice in our Congress. This is true. She blames AIPAC, and I don’t agree with that, but her overall point is valid: Palestinians need to be heard. Some of their complaints are very justified. We can’t just continue to ignore them. 

 
timschochet said:
Again, the most important thing that Omar said is that pro-Palestinian positions don’t have a voice in our Congress. This is true. She blames AIPAC, and I don’t agree with that, but her overall point is valid: Palestinians need to be heard. Some of their complaints are very justified. We can’t just continue to ignore them. 
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I think AIPAC deserves sone blame, but I don’t think there is some Jewish cabal running our lives for us. 

The right has definitely gone full anti-Muslim against her and like I said were saying things today that was making my skin crawl

 
timschochet said:
FTR- one of the unique features of anti-semitism, which doesn’t really apply to other forms of bigotry, is the depiction of Jews as a shadowy force with almost unlimited power, able to shape events behind the scenes and willing to take down anyone who opposes them.  The above is an excellent example of this aspect of anti-Jewish bigotry. 
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Your first mistake was assuming that the Israel lobby = a Jewish lobby.  Secondly Tim, there's an Israel lobby just like there's a Saudi Arabia lobby, and a weapons industry lobby, and pharmaceutical lobby, and it's extremely powerful.  If you infer the 'shadowy Jewish cabal' trope from frank criticism of AIPAC and the Israel lobby, that's on you.  

 
ren hoek said:
Your first mistake was assuming that the Israel lobby = a Jewish lobby.  Secondly Tim, there's an Israel lobby just like there's a Saudi Arabia lobby, and a weapons industry lobby, and pharmaceutical lobby, and it's extremely powerful.  If you infer the 'shadowy Jewish cabal' trope from frank criticism of AIPAC and the Israel lobby, that's on you.  
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I’ve considered your point. But I’ll stand by what I wrote. 

 
ren hoek said:
The Democrats need to double down on centrism and avoid bold ideas.  I bet it’d work really well in 2020.  If only there was some kind of experiment we could run, where Donald Trump ran against a centrist.  We could run this experiment in Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania.  I wonder what would happen?  Oh well, I’m sure it’s a winning strategy.  
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A centrist Joe Biden would have walked away with that election.  I'd put it at 95% that if he gets the D nomination that he's the next POTUS.  

The issue with your centrist was how amazingly unlikeable she was.  The centrist part is correlation without causation.

 
Sand said:
A centrist Joe Biden would have walked away with that election.  I'd put it at 95% that if he gets the D nomination that he's the next POTUS.  

The issue with your centrist was how amazingly unlikeable she was.  The centrist part is correlation without causation.
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Probably.  Biden's strategists wouldn't have actively promoted Trump to their media contacts and gotten him billions of dollars in free network airtime.  

 
This controversy is past it’s expiration date, but I think we’ll be hearing from Rep. Omar again, I don’t think she is really ready for this job. It’s not all about being right or speaking truth to power or whatever, addressing the public and responding to the press is part of the job.

 
squistion said:
Jake Tapper‏ @jaketapper 9h9 hours ago

Trump & Pence outraged at ‘anti-Semitic tropes’ -- let's go to the video tape,

https://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2019/02/13/lead-jake-tapper-trump-omar-hyprocrisy-live-jake-tapper.cnn
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This sort of argument might make you feel better but it doesn’t work with the public. As I’ve pointed out to conservatives numerous times here, nobody cares about hypocrisy or double standards. The public agrees with Trump about Omar, amd it’s part of the reason Trump’s popularity has gone up in the last few days. 

 
timschochet said:
The public does not. She’s helping Trump. 
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That's like, your public opinion, man.

WGAF? If we want more decades of mediocrity, then sure, let's keep espousing "play it safe & manage by focus groups."

Here's the thing about consensus / conventional wisdom: you will never, ever see change. Remember, objective #1 is to hold onto power.

#FTN I want leadership.

 
BobbyLayne said:
That's like, your public opinion, man.

WGAF? If we want more decades of mediocrity, then sure, let's keep espousing "play it safe & manage by focus groups."

Here's the thing about consensus / conventional wisdom: you will never, ever see change. Remember, objective #1 is to hold onto power.

#FTN I want leadership.
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Well this is at least a better rebuttal than “nope.” 

But at least so far, I don’t think this is the woman to give you leadership. 

 
BobbyLayne said:
TBH I don't think you understand leadership.
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Well then the feeling’s mutual. True leaders and extreme ideologues don’t usually have too much in common, and history hasn’t made me very fond of those few who manage to combine both qualities. Though I don’t think Omar applies. 

 
timschochet said:
This sort of argument might make you feel better but it doesn’t work with the public. As I’ve pointed out to conservatives numerous times here, nobody cares about hypocrisy or double standards. The public agrees with Trump about Omar, amd it’s part of the reason Trump’s popularity has gone up in the last few days. 
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No, the public doesn't agree with Trump about Omar. 35% of the public does. The same 35% that thinks the wall is already being built and that a few cold days means that global warming is a hoax.  The truth is, because of Twitter and Trump's long history of racism and bigotry, neither he or any of his supporters have an ounce of credibility when they pretend to be offended by something a Democrat says.  This 35% of the country not only refuses to speak out against Trump's racist statements, they cheer and applaud like he's their new messiah.

 
JuniorNB said:
No, the public doesn't agree with Trump about Omar. 35% of the public does. The same 35% that thinks the wall is already being built and that a few cold days means that global warming is a hoax.  The truth is, because of Twitter and Trump's long history of racism and bigotry, neither he or any of his supporters have an ounce of credibility when they pretend to be offended by something a Democrat says.  This 35% of the country not only refuses to speak out against Trump's racist statements, they cheer and applaud like he's their new messiah.
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Junior, you really think that the criticism of Omar’s remarks is limited to the Trump base? That simply isn’t true. 

 
timschochet said:
Nope. 

Well OK

https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/429748-trump-job-approval-up-7-points-after-shutdown-gallup%3famp
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Ohhhh ha! I'm silly. I thought you were going to link me to a pool that says people like Trump more because of Ms Omar's statements. Because that would make sense. There have been afroementined events that also contribute to these poll, I would suppose. I mean we aren't talking about some political simulator with the only actors being Omar and Trump.

 
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