Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
I'd be interested in seeing that quote. I'm not aware of it. It is inconsistent with the evidence I am aware of.
I'm not worried about Kraft in particular. But if the women we know about weren't trafficked, I don't think it is right to just assume the unknowns were. My view is we don't know yet. If they were, I hope they get enough to bust the whole thing up all the way to the top. If they weren't trafficked, then I think the whole thing is a disaster on the part of the police and the DA. It ultimately hinges on that unanswered question.
We do not know that this was a human trafficking establishment.
I don't think I caught the question you're asking.
That's actually not yet clear. The last article I saw about connections listed 3 counties (including the one where Jupiter is located) and specifically said the other two were unrelated. But didn't explain whether Jupiter was. I would assume they do not have unity of ownership or management, but hey may be related.
I saw them in separate places. The DA quote was in his video press conference yesterday or the day before. It was like 15 minutes long and just a video.
It's not racist to believe that a strip mall prostitution massage parlor caught up in a human trafficking investigation in which several people have been arrested is involved in human trafficking.
Here's the transcript. Just let me know where it is.
Yes. I'm talking specifically about Orchids of Asia. Your link (just read it) said that there are no known links between the trafficker w/ 10 Orlando spas and the Jupiter spa Kraft was busted at. Jupiter Spa had the video surveillance, and had a decent percentage of customers not receiving any illegal services.
From the article you linked last page:
It's racist of the PD and DA to assume all Asian Massage Parlors that happen to be prostitution fronts are involved in human trafficking. How is that NOT racist? It's clear stereotyping.
Yes. It is. And of society in general for failing to put teeth into human trafficking laws and investigatory procedures.
It was. Maybe I was unclear. My comments about filming innocent wives getting massages and using questionable tactics to plant cameras are specific to Orchids of Asia in Jupiter.
I didn't discuss your comments about filming innocent wives, I expressed that you had indicated you were about to ask a question and then didn't, so I didn't know what you were asking.
To which I said:
Thanks! I was looking for this yesterday and couldn't find it!
Yes.
Jesus.
I think, part of the problem is that not many people have a strong issue with regular prostitution, as long as it isn't on their doorstep. I think people have a strong reaction to sexual slavery and to the exploitation of minors. They're very different things and they're often conflated. This story is national news because Robert Kraft engaged in consensual prostitution with sex workers who were "probably not trafficked", and every damn headline has said sex trafficking, and the police and DA in Jupiter can't stop using those words. If you want to sway public opinion, conflating separate issues isn't a good way to go. It confuses people.
This is the quote I thought you were looking for:
If we don't get news of trafficking, I'm chalking this up to typical overreach by overweening authorities who have no business being in any position of authority because they clearly don't know how to use the power entrusted to them on behalf of the public.
I see what you mean.
This investigation began when city inspectors indicated to the sheriff that it appeared women working at several spas were being trafficked and perhaps engaging in prostitution.
What's ironic is that we do NEED to be having this conversation more. But we don't need to be using it as an umbrella to facilitate police tactics that are highly questionable to bust up a regular prostitution front.
I think I was arguing along the same lines as (HULK) regarding the difference between both the result and techniques used in Orlando and Jupiter, actually.
Was there actually sex trafficking happening at Orchids of Asia.
The woman arrested lives in Orlando, but her spa was in Vero Beach. It was also under the same kind of surveillance.https://www.850wftl.com/two-more-florida-spas-shut-down-after-sex-trafficking-investigation/
How are they supposed to change their tactics based on what they find out with the tactics?
They have inside the spa video surveillance too? I thought only Jupiter did?
The bolded sentence does not in any way sway my thinking. And it is not uncommon, strange, or mystifying in people who have been or are being trafficked.
No. Honestly they shouldn't have used those tactics at all. Whether or not I forgive that is based upon the results. Probably not fair, but it's how i think.
I'm not saying it is relevant to whether or not they were trafficked.
Yes, that's the quote I was asking you to find. I haven't seen that. I saw it in context of the Vero Beach place.
Alright, so the naked guy who got filmed getting a massage but not breaking the law, too bad for him? #feminism #doesn'tmattercauseequality
Oh man, have to go back to d1 press, going to be tougher to find. I'll try later, gotta get back to the grindstone.
It was listed earlier in the thread but I forget the exact scenario but in general the police were able to cause a fake scenario that required all people leave the building for a certain time period and then they installed the cameras once everyone left.
I've always gotten massages without any clothes on. I've gotten massages from someone working in their own home as well as a spa in a strip mall. I've never been offered sexual services, done anything inappropriate, or had any issues whatsoever. The massage therapists are trained to work with people that are nude.
Something I'm not clear on is how long were the surveillance cameras in place? Some of the early reporting I heard on it made it sound like it was quite awhile. Maybe that was erroneous. I just had this vision of an unmarked white van outside somewhere with tv's in the back and sound with guys getting their jollies on watching. I'm not sure if that's standard procedure or how long if it is they'd typically leave those in place. I wouldn't think they'd need a long time period to collect footage.
